between the trump campaign and manafort and possibly trump himself. why did he lie about it? was it because he was involved in a cover-up that potentially was encouraged by others involved, whether it was roger stone or others who are trump associates. >> i still don't understand, if there was nothing untoward about the contacts between russia and all of these people around the president, why does -- why are so many of them lying about their interactions if everything is on the up and up? why not just tell the truth? >> well, that is sort of the question of the moment. after every one of these meetings or contacts there was deception about them. take for example, the trump tower meeting involving manafort and kushner and the others involved in the trump campaign, trump junior. the meeting was then followed by