>> or both. i feel badly for brett kavanaugh. i think the democrats could have avoided all of this just by coming forward earlier and asking dr. ford and/or judge kavanaugh in those private phone calls. this woman got a say because of the republican party and judge kavanaugh is right, they can vote him down, up or down ultimately, jake, sit on the supreme court or not but they're not going to force him to quit. let me just say this to you -- my liberal democratic friends, something i totally agree with and hadn't thought about. she feels so badly for the way she rolled her eyes and treated people like paula jones and juanita roderick. and these people had true claims a and they were dismissed again. >> i completely agree with you. but we are not now where we were then. >> two years ago? >> where we were then. and i interviewed juanita broderick two years ago. we are not, as a society or as a media where we were two years ago.