75 billion dollars right now -- >> laura: 72. >> anthony: i don't see statehood. i don't see congress or senate ever, ever taking on a 72 billion dollar debt load. >> laura: exactly. >> anthony: especially for a lot of people who speak spanish. what's the way out of this? >> hermes: oh my god. [ laughter ] >> anthony: what about tourism? >> hermes: it's an industry of services to service the wealthy. and at the same time you take 450 million out of the university for example so you're going to have less educated people willing to do any type of work to survive. >> laura: you are not really producing an economy that a person can survive in. this is a country where people live. where we do things, where we have culture and literature and music and produced intellectual important work. they are selling us as only a good resort to have pina colada in the beach and that's it.