off gop incumbents and eventually mcconnell himself. >> someone last night on one of the panels, i can't remember who it was, maybe it was someone here, who said that when you get early into politics and you have to work on a campaign where the person wins, you start to think that you're the candidate that you know, kind of that you have tapped into something and you feel that way until you get slapped down the next time and lose. >> i think that's part of it. i do think that -- carl and i got pretty famous off of bill clinton, we never spoke at rallies. we stayed back behind the scenes and behind the stage. and bannon, not only did he come out, he came out against the president. that is unprecedented. i never saw my friend carl rove do that do george w. bush, axe never did that to president obama, carl and i never did that to clinton. this is without precedent that he's taking on the president. even insulted the president's daughter at a rally. it's extraordinary and it's noteworthy. and maggie understands why -- >> and the president didn't respond to that. that was one of the few times. >> this is the thing.