you mix the military and diplomat theic in a step by step process trying to get north korea to first halt and then reverse its nuclear missile developments. that's the path to go. >> is north korea a worse situation than when you were there or are we seeing a different type of dialogue in the exchange of a president who likes to exchange hot talk. >> i first worked with north korea in 1994. i did the strike plan, designed it for the then plutonium program. there have been ups and downs. some have worked for a few years. and that gives you some hope that it would work again. but generally it's gotten steadily worse. it was 2006 when they tested their first underground nuclear explosion. and they marched forward consistently since. and it's very risky. because you can't imagine, chris, and i know some people do but i don't.