again, they're inexperienced, i understand this, but common sense would say, there is something about this that isn't right, and this is not a meeting we should have. >> hold on one second. bring bob baer into this. former cia operative. bob, in the e-mail chain, it clearly identifies the russian attorney as "the" russian government attorney. she was -- interviewed. she de nigh denies this. she's a russian attorney. talk about cutouts if you will, because in a situation, a sensitive situation, issue like this, the russian government, the russian intelligence community, would not necessarily employ a specific russian operative, but they would have what they call cutouts. >> exactly, wolf. this lady you should look at, the lawyer, as an access agent. that's what the russians would call her. she was sent to the trumps to probe their willingness to cooperate.