thank you so much for joining us, evan. always good to see you. >> thank you, jake. >> you were a cia officer. cnn's evan perez has reported the intelligence community, u.s. intelligence community russia's ambassador kislyak is not just an ambassador, he is a spy and also a spy recruiter. was that your understanding when you were at the agency? >> yes, that is my understanding. but why it's significant is that you have somebody with enormous access here in washington as an ambassador engaging with some of our senior-most officials in congress and elsewhere who all has the skills that a spy would have to extract important information and to help run covert operations. and, so, that's the kind of person we're dealing what here. it doesn't mean that all ambassador kislyak apartments activities are related to espionage, but it means he is a skilled practitioner of that -- of such operation. >> of spy craft. >> that's right. >> can you give me just kind of an understanding of what that means exactly?