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>> especially bad experiences. >> especially -- well, the bad is relative. right? was my prison experience bad? yep. was it good? yep. i mean, you're here only because i went to prison. i wouldn't have met you otherwise. >> it feels a little bit like you're picking, choosing, which experiences we're talking about here in terms of the struggles you went through. it wasn't just about prison. it was about -- >> let me ask you, and i appreciate this question, what determines bad? >> what happened in the sweat lodge seems bad to people. >> so you're saying that death is objectively bad. >> and death definitely when you don't think you're going to die would be -- >> but you are. >> this rationale, honestly, that kind of thinking, i'm just saying, i feel like a base line can be established that you can

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