from the mine. we believe it could be anywhere from 12 to 16 to 17 minutes for him to get up here, maybe as little as ten, because it took about ten for the rescuer, manuel gonzalez, to go down. karl penhaul is standing by at camp hope where the miners' families have been. there's two family members, maybe a third, of this first miner. they've been brought in in anticipation of him coming. karl, do you have a sense of how far away the phoenix capsule is? >> reporter: i believe it is -- i believe the capsule is now no more than two, 2 1/2 minutes away, judging by the time that the rescuer took to get down, this capsule is really moving quite fast, it seems to be going