>> larry: it is. hold it, ben, do you see a solution here? if they have to do better on the tests, as cheryl points it out, then they teach to the test. >> i think that is exactly what's happening. but it may be that teaching to the test is a way of teaching. for years and years and years, children learned by rote memorization, yet it turns out we generated some of the best scholars and thinkers of all time by rote memorization as the basic building block of school. so it may be that teaching to the test is one way of teaching period. obviously, nobody, and i'm sure especially miss weingarten wants to have bad teachers in school. nobody wants to have kids who aren't learning. we all want to do something about this crisis in the african-american community and get the incredible potential of these kids realized. we all want to do that. i think that is america's really giant crisis. we have got to get the minority members of this country and get them educated and get them up to the standards that they are capable of. that is our big crisis in america right now. >> larry: and we'll pick right