are wired based on experience so there's an interesting kind of feedback loop where the brain creates mind and then the mind can exert power on the brain and physically change the structure of the brain. >> larry: can a poor learning brain have a good mind? >> probably. >> thomas edison did terrible in school. got beaten in school. and obviously we would say he had an amazing mind. >> larry: how do we separate them? let's say on obesity. >> mind body dualism goes back. how do we deal with something like obesity where we've been evolutionary. millions of years went into our brain development. we developed in such a way maybe to the age of 20 and take advantage of what the environment had in temperature of surviving. things that were high in calorie and things in fat and sugar and things we craved that we were well rewarded in our brain system. i don't want to get too heady on