point. we have food deserts in detroit, philadelphia, chicago, and more. people have to go miles for fruits and vegetables. let's deal with that instead of beating up on the president or his wife. >> no, no, no. it's not beating up on anybody. when you inject yourself into one of the most contentious debates in the last 15 years, which is what this whole health and fitness initiative does for michelle obama, that's fine, if that's what you want to do. but when you do that, you better be prepared to have your ideas and viewpoints tested in the public arena. no teflon. no teflon in front of michelle obama. she has to answer critics just like any other pundit or any other policy advocate, and she is a policy advocate. >> let's get into -- let's get into some specifics. mark, the -- the governor -- mark, the governor is trying to