stopped their contingency plans if the contingency plans did not include use of dispersants, there would be no oil spill contingency plan. oil development would not be allowed to happen. the oil companies have just -- have not come up with really any effective tool. you're seeing what is going on with the booms. and the booms just stop slicks on the surface. everywhere you see oil on the surface, there is a huge underwater cloud of oil. >> so it is still getting through. so also in your view then, this chemical dispersants, something is going to be sacrificed in this oil spill, whether it is the livelihood on the shores, the marsh lands, or it is going to be the shrimp eggs, other wildlife, marine life living in the depths of the gulf. you cannot save both. one will have to be -- one body will have to be sacrificed in