Transcripts For CSPAN3 Homeland 20240702

Order. I welcome ranking number inferred, members of the committee and our witnesses. We are expanding the departed of Homeland Security process for managing hydrant arrivals at the southwest border and how this process has changed after title 42 ended. For march 2020 to may 2023, dhs used title 42 Public Health authorities to expel more than 2. 9 million migrants from the noted states. When it ended on may 11, 2023, they sorted processing all migrants under regular immigration authorities. This process is complex and things like demographics and expression of fear all influence how a migrants process. Because the border is so dynamic, programs and protocols change frequently. Each of the components are presented here today, Border Control patrol, the enforcement and removal operations and citizenship and Immigration Services plate pivotal roles in this complex process. The patrol are on the front lines and they are was possible for apprehension and unusual processing on the border. Yaro is was possible for tracking migrants during dependency and removal proceedings, including detention an alternative to Detention Programs. And another Organization Managers more. Any delay can have impacts on our Border Management systems. Delays can cause overcrowding at facilities which lead to unsheltered releases, also known as street releases in order communities. This is currently one of the busiest sectors in the country for migrant encounters and the border communities are at high risk for street releases. As the subcommittee has explored in previous hearings, street releases caused serious harms to migrants and border communities. Congress needs to understand this process in order to modernized our Border Management system and keep arizona families safe and secure. My immigration proposal with the senator included important improvements to this process to ensure that our border is secure and migrants are treated fairly and he mainly. Todays hearing gives us the opportunity to learn how this has changed since the end of title 42 and how the changes affect our management system. I hope this will motivate others to join us in advocating for Commonsense Solutions to our border policies. I look forward to hearing from our witnesses and i would like to recognize the Ranking Member for his opening statement. Thank you for holding this hearing. When it says, thank you for being here. All of your perforation for today, written statements, the orals to consider coming, thank you for your service to the country. It is important to everyone. I have someone who always stops and asks me hows it going on the border, what is happening with the system . People are concerned and there are 6 Million People that have been encountered coming across our border in just the last 2. 5 years. People are concerned about that and want to know what is happening and where things are going. Theres some committee has had several hearings dealing with immigration, the management of the ports, social media and illicit activities happening to recruit individuals coming across the border. This one in particular im excited about, actually. If not have the opportunity to sit down and talk about where is the process since the end of title 42. There been promises that have been made, but we dont understand people breath of the process and what actually happens to each individual as they come across the border. We know some of the terms are new and some of them, there has been a lot of working out on the presumption, which is a new term out there, everybodys trying to figure out how does this work . There were promises there would be a dramatic drop in the number of individuals crossing the border illegally. There were for about six weeks or so and then as was reported by the Washington Post, we have the highest numbers of family crossings in the history of the country in august. So the networks have shot back up dramatically. All of these questions about what is happening, how it is happening, most of our questions will focus on what is the process, what actually happens if an individual crosses at eight port of entry, there treated one way and then they are treated a different way. There treated different than a person who just shows up without an app. There is parole, what is happening with resumptions, a lot of confusion on the process and at the terrell end, are tells refusing the confusion to be able to push additional people across the border. Weve got to know what is happening, what is the process for those individuals and what actually happens in a Court Setting in the days ahead for these in the visuals. Todays hearing we will have the opportunity to walk through those different scenarios and determine where do things go. A report from the uscis highlighted some of the backlog issues and they will be able to raise questions about how individuals can be vetted. There have been different numbers that are, and we would like to be able to talk but the quantity of individuals and how many we can track and how many we cannot. Those that are detained and those that are on the nondetained docket and what happens to those individuals. I appreciate everyone coming prepared because we have a lot to talk through today and we will try to get to as many practical things as we can as we walk through this. I appreciate the input from everyone of you and i look forward to your questions. Going to go ahead and promise you i will flood you with questions for the record as well to follow up and gather data. Thank you, senator sinema. Thank you, Ranking Member langford. It is the practice to swear in witnesses so please stand and raise your right hand. You swear to the testimony will give before this committee will be the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth so help you god . Thank you. I will ask each of our witnesses to keep their remarks to seven minutes or less and your full written statements will be entered into the hearing record. I would like to first introduce our witnesses reppo venting customs and Border Protection components, chief miller and mr. Matthew davies, who will be jointly to liberating the testimony. The chief serves as the chief of Law Enforcement operations for the Border Patrol in washington, d. C. He is responsible for the oversight of daytoday Border Patrol operations throughout the United States and in international engagements. He serves as the principal advisor for the chief of the order patrol on enforcement operations, personnel, infrastructure and technology requirements. Mr. Davies is the executive director for admin stability and passenger programs within the office of Field Operations. He receives he oversees multiple programs related to traveler facilitation in addition to serving as a primary point of contact for engagement between the travel industry and the office of Field Operations. Welcome, you are recognized for seven minutes. Good afternoon chair cinema, ranking number langford entity which murmurs of the subcommittee. It is an honor to testify and discuss u. S. Customs and Border Protection operations at our nations port of entry ports of entry since the title but it dost title 42 Public Health order. Im proud to recordrepresent an office that remained on the front line throughout the pandemic and work tirelessly every day across 328 ports of entry to protect our border, our homeland and our communities. There were multiple complex mission sets, including the facilitation of lawful trade and travel critical to our economy and protecting our communities from the intersections of transnational organizations. I would like to highlight our efforts. The current process is for an admissible persons at the southwest ports of entry, the department of Homeland Security began incrementing this last year to manage the increased in irregular migration. And to ensure performance of our primary security Facilitation Mission objectives. Starting in october 2022, dhs incremented a process allowing certain venezuelan nationals to travel to the United States by air which is granted on a casebycase basis up to two years. This was expanded in january for nationals of cuba, nicaragua and haiti, along with an application feature enabling applicants to request advanced travel authorization via the app. To receive this authorization must meet specified criteria to include having u. S. Based financial sponsors and clearing the biometric and graphic screening. As of july 31, more than 181,000 cubans, patients, nicaraguans and venezuelans have arrived this process. Building on this approach on may 11 when the title 42 border order ended and they applied a full range of immigration is already set or title viii, the department of justice incremented a circumvention of lawful part level pathways rule, establishing parameters for asylum eligibility. It was intimated in conjunction with a new feature that allows noncitizens seeking to enter the United States to submit advanced biographic and i metric information and schedule and appointed with an officer at one of eight designated ports of entry for appropriate processing disposition under title viii as determined on a casebycase basis considering the totality of circumstances. This is just one example of how they are using Innovative Technologies to enhance the security and efficiency of processes at our ports of entry. We also continue to expand electronic functionality across our operational footprint. This initiative aroused ice and uscis to share and maintain a single immigration case file an additional environment replacing the paperbased process. Prior to may 11, oh if a implement it electronic processing for notice to appear and other dispositions through out the field offices, including at the ports of entry that inspect noncitizens with points. In august, 80 of the inadmissible population encountered at the southwest border was processed using an electronic file. The transition to integrate it digital processing plat form as part of comprehensive order management operations enable them to create efficiencies for our officers, modernize our processes, manage our available operational resources and pursue other mission priorities. While also can 10 ewing to address ration challenges, we retain focus on national and economic security. We continue to, the threat of illicit synthetic drugs, especially fentanyl, being trafficked into the United States. We have seized a parks medley 4000 pounds of fentanyl, most of it sees at points of it sees it ports of entry. We are pursuing objectives to address the issue, including expanded partnerships and information manageable intelligence, advancement, data integration, efforts and disrupting and dismantling efforts networks. They are drawing lines of International Travel across all operational environments. July, the number of travelers moving by air were increased to 18 compared to last year. At the ports of entry, increased by 12 and 11 per respectively. We also enforce hundreds of trade laws that protect american businesses and consumers. Part of our planning for the end of title 42, we urged resources to safely and efficiently manage challenges at the ports of entry, while maintaining a persistent focus on other missions, including but not later to intercepting illicit drugs and facilitate the flow of which admit trade and travel to insured to ensure continued national and a comic secured he. I appreciate the support of our mission and i look forward to your questions. Good afternoon. Charwoman cinema, Ranking Member langford and a distinguished members i want to make sure the megaphone is working. There it is. Thanks. An honor to testify today on behalf of the u. S. Border patrol to discuss the operations along the southwest border, which since the termination of title 42 book health order. This past may, u. S. Border patrol celebrated its 99th anniversary. As we approach 100 years to this country, much has changed in the agency and throughout the world. However, during my 25 years of service with the u. S. Border patrol, at least two aspects have remained unchanged. First, the Border Patrol mission has always been complex, demanding and very dangerous. Second, the ability of our workforce to persevere even during the most challenging times. It is remarkable at a reflection of the agents cando attitude. There are three areas i would like to focus on. First, summarizing the current immigration and enforcement processes. Second, discuss how ongoing Security Operations and initiatives, and third how we are addressing anticipated operational challenges. First, our Immigration Enforcement processes. While title 42 was in place, it was part of a National Effort to prevent the spread of covid19. Knowing that time, the board patrol expelled certain migrants encounter between the ports of entry. While this aided in streamlining, the return of certain individuals, he also led to a higher level of repeat encounters. Since title 42 ended, all migrants intercepted between the ports of entry are transferred between Border Patrol facilities, processed in accordance with title viii authorities and appropriate consequences are applied. This may include expedited removal and transfer to immigration and customs enforcement. As part of our process and intake for seizures, the Border Patrol is committed to ensuring the health and safety of those in our custody, including providing onsite medical care and referrals to local medical services when necessary. The board patrol faces that each sector faces its own unique challenge, regardless of the circumstance or environment in which encounters occur. Agents will continue to adapt to the everchanging threats. Which brings me to my second point. Ongoing Security Operations and initiatives. In addition to our Immigration Enforcement duties, the Border Patrol maintains a persistent focus on our Mission Objectives aimed at countering sophisticated and ruthless transnational criminal organizations. When it comes to combating job trafficking that should Drug Trafficking such as fentanyl, they target and sees illicit drugs between the ports of entry. During a twomonth Intelligence Driven operation recently, Border Patrol seized nearly 25 hundred pounds affectional, along with thousands of other pounds of dangerous narcotics and weapons. These efforts are in direct are directed to protect the citizens in the communities of the United States. Additionally, coordination with International Partners informed information sharing on migration flows and Drug Trafficking activities. This increases our domain awareness and influences how the Border Patrol plans and rep leverages its resources. Board patrol also collaborates with many local, state and federal lawenforcement officers to counter illicit activities that prey on vulnerable migrants. All too often, smugglers abandon them in dangerous and lifethreatening situations. To that end, the Border Patrol agents regularly connect conduct and provide Emergency Medical Care to those in distress. Our agents rescued 30,000 migrants this fiscal year, including nearly 3000 in august alone. This brings me to my third and final point. As we reflect on the past 99 years of the Border Patrols history and rise to the current operational demands, there are several complexities and challenges that i must address as we look forward. We must continue to invest in our workforce. Provide them with the tools to face these extraordinary challenges head on. We also cant overlook the importance of our Critical Infrastructure and the significant role our facilities play in our Law Enforcement mission. While Quick Solutions are unlikely, our facilities, including our checkpoints, must be modernized to face the evolving threats without impacting trade and travel. Lastly, the most significant operational challenge facing the Border Patrol is that our agency is increasingly performing detention and processing related duties that are outside the scope of Border Patrol in their front line mission. While we should be focusing efforts to combat the flow of illicit drugs and disruption of tco posh gas, much of the time is spent transporting, tossing and detaining migrants. This substantially increases the risk of traffic including narcotics, terrorists and other contraband. Border security is National Security. In closing, the u. S. Border patrol will not waver from our Critical Mission and we will continue to serve and protect the nation with honor. Im grateful for the continued support of congress and appreciate the opportunity to appear today and i look forward to your questions. Thank you. Next is mr. Daniel eitel. Daniel bible. He is the executive associate director for enforcement of customs and removal operations. He leads them to protect the homeland through arrest and removal of noncitizens who undermined the safety of our communities and our immigration laws. Responsible for a budget of approximate 4. 4 billion, heat directs operations of more than 8600 employees in 25 2500 field offices in over 200 to messick locations and 25 overseas locations. Your recognized for seven minutes. Chairwoman, Ranking Member langford and distinct numbers of the sub committee, thank you for your support for the dedicated and heartwarming hardworking women and men of the Border Patrol and customs operations. Our mission is to protect the homeland through the arrest and removal of citizens who noncitizens who undermine the safety of the communities. While we primarily focus on the interior of the unit states, we have stretch resources. We must carefully balance resources to continue to uphold this vision in the face of change operational conditions and new demands, including significant shifts in the post title 42 environment. During implementation of the title 42 publichealth order, we worked closely with u. S. Customs and Border Protection support enforcement operations at the southwest border. Title 42 expulsions were conducted at the border and we conducted expulsion flights while continuing to remove amenable noncitizens under an aggression authority. Until may 11, 20 23, i have assisted in more than 184,000 title 42 expulsions. We also provided sustained support for dhs efforts to decompress border facilities. That is why in 22, proximally 1000 employees were sent to apprehend by cdp, alternate to detention locations, ice facilities as appropriate. It is constrained by the increase of detention facility closures, pending litigation and court decisions. And the use of contractors police. However, they have taken several steps to align the capacity with the operation leads and the environment, including increasing resources to release noncitizens with possible leveraging alternatives to detention and focusing resources on noncitizens who are subject to mandatory detention, pose risk to Public Safety or National Security. And maybe flight risks. In the post vital in the post title 42 environ, dhs has increased use of expedited removal under the title viii authority. Once apprehended at the border or excellent arrested by the interior of the United States, noncitizens are subject to removal and they may be detained by ice. If the removal indicates the attempt to seek asylum, they are afforded an interview with officers while in custody. If they determined noncitizens have failed to establish credible fear, they continue to prepare for expedited removal. If they determine the credible fear has been established, the noncitizens are released from custody. Nevertheless, by expediting the review of asylum claims of noncitizens in expedited removal proceedings, no matter if positive and credible findings exist or not, theyre able to provide relief to those noncitizens who are eligible and quickly remove those who are not. Over the past fiscal year, i have operated programs geared toward the fair, humane and expedited processes of family units. I announced an initiative in may 2020, a process for expedited removal and expressed fear of persecution or torture. Certain Family Member units and householdsthey are supervised we family always interviews. It is in 40 cities nationwide. Over the past 18 months, the bureau increased its removable flights pathway. It has reported fourfold. Removal via commercial airlines have also increased in the post title 42 environment. As late as 2023, ice completed 4200 83 commercial levels, an 85 increase from the same. In fy 2022. The are committed to the arrest and removal of snobs to this and to undermine the safety of u. S. Community and the integrity of u. S. Immigration laws. In preparation for the changes in title 42, they took several steps to ensure the agency would continue managing all aspects of the Immigration Enforcement process including providing support at the southwest border, increasing the transportation capacities in developing programs geared toward expedited processing of family units, increasing use of expedited removal under isis title eight and reinstituting civil priority. To allow civil inhumane systems while securing national and Public Safety. Thank you for inviting me to testify and alec forward your questions. Our final witnesses Andrew Davidson, the acting dave deputy for the United States citizen ship services. He serves as a counselor for humanitarian programs in the office of the director. He previously served as the acting deputy associate director of the International Associations director and is the chief of the Asylum Division of the directorate. You are recognized for seven minutes. Davidson members of the subcommittee, thank you to for the opportunity to appear with my colleagues from u. S. Customs and Border Protection of u. S. And immigration customs informent. My name is Andrew Davidson and i am the acting Deputy Director of u. S. Citizenship and Immigration Services. My testimony will describe the role of the u. S. At the south border, particularly how we process noncitizens in operation of law to the familys role. We are a minister of the nations lawful association including adjudication of asylum claims that applications for refugee status. Employees work shoulder to shoulder with our colleagues in conducting things to coordinate on public see issues. Uscs has a proud history of providing things to individuals all over the world. These benefits supports of the mental values of our nations supports supplemental values of our nation. Uscs is only able to accomplish these complex missions through the efforts of thousands of dedicated Public Services and admitted great for more than a decade, the steady rise of micros across the border has resulted in increasing apprehensive i know you the number of individuals. We screen incredible things that play an Important Role so the victims of torture are not improperly returned to their home countries, while those found in eligible are expeditiously removed. Our specially trained asylum officers conduct screening interviews for noncitizens stress a fear of return noncitizens who express a fear of return or fear of torture. Screening interview is conducted to determine whether or not a citizen has a fear of torture. Persecution. They must meet uscis for an asylum interview to adjudicate asylum application or face removal in Immigration Court where they can apply for other protection. Individuals not to have a credible fear of persecution or torture may request a hearing by an immigration judge. Over the last 10 years, the number of asylums to our border has increased in the number of referrals as well. Approximately 35,000 credible cases were referred to uscis in 2013. That number has more than tripled to approximately 107,000 so far. About 51,000 of these cases have been received since may 12, 2000 23 after the expiration of the center for the cdc title 42 Public Health order and return to processing of all noncitizens under longstanding title immigration authorities. The uscis is pursuing a number of strategies to address increased caseload including significantly expanding authorized officer positions, deploying employees who have been freely protection trained across the uscis to assist with the caseload, and maintaining remote capability for interviews. Our process is timely with resources that enable the removal process to operate more efficiently. Uscis remains strongly committed to supporting the government response on the southwest border, including making sure protection provide opportunity to have these heard. At the same time, we remain committed to testing and turning fraud detection. The fraud detection within uscis has embedded teams within these offices which conduct three interview screenings, provide consultations to asylum officers, interview applicants, and analyze trends for largescale fraud scheme. Uscis continues to lead an asylum Fraud Working Group enter agency. After recent years, the uscis supported multiple successful criminal prosecutions involving silent fraud, former making the commitment determined to enforce the immigration system. We have humanity manage the southwest border by forcing our laws and immigration pathways. One of the important measures implemented is the use of quick removal to ensure expedited removal including the credible fear policy is. Out efficient fear policies carried out efficiently. To reallocate Staffing Resources 200 of additional personnel and interviews. Additionally noncitizens populations are now process for expedited removal within days or weeks after they arrive. This provides relief more quickly to those eligible and moves those who are not. On may 11, 2023, the circumvent role took effect which will encourage micros to use lawful, safe pathways to enter the u. S. Encourage migrants to use lawful, safe pathways to enter the u. S. And penalize those who fail to do so. It allows citizens to rebut eligibility. When a noncitizens shows credible fear, an interview with an asylum officer will happen. They will rule whether an exception applies or presumption of the eligibility can be given. We will continue to respond to rising numbers of referrals by ensuring the dhs follows laws written by congress, swiftly processing noncitizens to bake and a judge noncitizens to seek release from a judge. Thank you. I will now begin the question part of the hearing. Each member of the committee will have seven minutes and i recognize myself. My first question is for chief miller. Now that title 42 engine, Border Patrol is back to regular processing. Can you walk us through what happens after a migrant is apprehended as to what elements are covered in processing . Miller from the time of apprehension, the group is identified to be in a variety of different categories. One is single adults, to his unaccompanied children, and three is family. Their initial intake for the field is identified and they are taken to appropriate locations to be processed. Once at facilities, they receive an initial intake, ethical screening, and if they require additional medical attention, they are referred to a local hospital for further care. Their materials and items they have with them are inventoried and put into safekeeping until they are transferred out of the facility. Then they enter the processing portion where they are screened and records are checked and then the determination of what is going of what the immigration pathway will be from there. They are asked that if they claim fear, they will go through one of the credible fear screening processes and be turned over to ero for further review. Then, anybody that withdraws will be returned back to one of their contiguous nations that we have, mexico or canada. Thank you. My second question is for mr. Davies. While operating under title 42 authorities from march 2020 two may 11 of 2023, very few micros were processed. Whereas the south was border processed over 2000 micros a day, most were processed on a app while others waited in line to be processed for a walk in appointment. Has this helps speed up processing time . What is the average amount of time it takes to process a migrant who schedules an appointment through the app compared to someone who gets a walkin appointment . Davies the app is used as a scheduling tool. We do intake from the International Boundary line with a variety of different individuals for legitimate travel in addition to migrants. The use of the afro an appointment house identify of the act for an appointment helps us identify them. The process varies at different ports. Some appointments are sent where the use of cdp one helps to plea populate some data that has been exhibited as of the app in the primary inspection and from there are referred to primary and secondary. At other points of entry, we established a process where they are sent directly to secondary from the line. The benefits of using cbp one in terms of timesaving are fairly minimal in the second circumstance where we really see the savings of time is the use of the electronic file where we managed to save up to 30 minutes per case using the electronic file. The total average processing time is four hours for a notice to ask your case. If there are different case positions, they may take slightly different amounts of time. To what extent do they coordinate with local ngos to prioritize walking appointments . Davies we have the ability to coordinate locally with ngos and governments us ashley when we talk about releases of individuals into the community. We have that ability and perform to and preferred to recognize individuals that registered with cbp one. We focus on individuals that are cleared to be invulnerable. We focus on emergency clearing, medical emergency, to prioritize in addition to individuals who are clearly recognizable with unaccompanied children. Thank you. Mr. Bible, i am given a number of ero detention data that most vipers are released rather than held in detention most migrants are released rather than held in detention. Can you describe the process between ero and other federal agencies to determine if a migrant should be held in detention or released . Bible all our detention cases are determined on a casebycase basis. We look at risk of flight, potential for being a Public Safety threat or National Security threat, and mitigating factors of longevity or time within the United States, advanced age, medical conditions that might go toward releasing an individual rather than them to detention. We look at everything on a casebycase basis and for Public Safety of National Security threats. What happens when there are no open threat open beds and ice may decide how to handle a situation with a migrant who has no criminal history . Bible if criminal history rises to be a Public Safety threat, i have not seen in 25 years we cannot find a bed for a an individual that has no criminality. You make room. Uscis is conducting credible fear interviews and side Border Patrol facilities. As a result, micros end up staying in Border Patrol custody longer to await these interviews. How long do migrants wait for uscis to conduct an interview after a migrant has expressed fear and how does this compare to average wait time for migrants released on the alternative Detention Program . It is two days from referral to interview and an additional two days from interview to the decision. Four days overall. That is a record time for uscis. The second question would be related to our firm program. It is for families and they are referred to between six to 12 days aftercbp sends them to destination cities so that is the only comparison i have. But what we are processing, prioritizing in cbp custody is record time. I now recognize Ranking Member lankford for his questions. Lankford i appreciate all of you. We understand you are the ones actually carrying out the policy and we appreciate the help of knowing what is happening on the ground and what is the process. The concern i have and a lot of other folks have is, if i take the previous 12 years, both in terms of the obama administration, all four years of the trump administration, the number of people that cross the border during the previous 12 years equals the number of people that illegally cross the border in less than three years under the Biden Administration. If people feel this is structurally different, it is structurally different. There is something changing in policy and with the movement of people. This is not me placing blame. We are trying to figure out, now what . How did we figure out the process and what happens from here . I do know there are probably members of the dhs watching this. Enqueue for that and all of you you who are here. For the dhs folks tracking this hearing, you make very specific requests about numbers in the past. We have yet to get them in a timely manner. We have made a request for special interests alien briefings to get details. We have yet to get that briefing. Senator murphy and i have asked for Additional Information about those who appeared in the delegation of authority. We have yet to get that. He asked for a specific briefing on circumvention of lawful pathways because that is new as a process and have yet to get that. Again, none of you are responsible but i do want to put out that this is been an ongoing frustration that we have literally seen as many people cross in less than three years that we have 12 but we ask questions process over how is this working, what is happening, how to we get numbers, we are not getting them. I am grateful that you are able to walk through the process. I want to skip to one question we have, Kyrsten Sinema and i. For individuals crossing the border right now, which is by the thousands, what criminal history, Background Information and data do we have on those individuals coming into the country . Do we have any Background Information on those individuals or a cooperative agreement to get background criminal data . Do we have that data . I dont know if any. I am asking you all. I am seeing the same expression i have. Do you know any criminal history we are getting from individuals from vartanian from mauritania . No. Earlier this year, we have had 10,000 individuals come from mauritania. The vast majority are in the country and we dont know anything about them. We also had a 63 increase of syrians coming into the country. We have had almost 15,000 people from china that have come across the border. We do not have a criminal History Exchange with china. With pakistan, one thousand folks. Over 2000 folks from somalia. We are trying to figure out information on them and us far as is being told, they are being processed and led into the country, awaiting a hearing later, and we do not have a daytoday supervision of those individuals. Is that accurate . Bible it is accurate that we are not tracking them on a daily basis. Not the totality. Some probably are on a special thing where we have tracking. Lankford for those, how long are they on a program. If that month, days, up until the hearing . We have escalated and deescalated depending on several factors like criminality, compliance with the program, and other factors. Alternate detention is approximately 547 days. Lankford is that 547 until theyre hearing time or what does that trigger . It depends on the compliance rate and community ties. We can continue the alternate Detention Program if detentions are meant or can stop it. Lankford it is our understanding a vast majority of individuals are there three or four much or less. Is that accurate or not accurate . You are saying it is a year and a half. Bible we had an increase of individuals put on alternate detention after their made it to the southwest border until they reach their destination city where they tech checked in and we start to monitor them. Lankford the last numbers we had from dhs was tracking around 130 days that people were on alternative detention and after, it is significantly longer before their hearing. If they do an assignment an asylum request, for new york, the next open days are somewhere in 2033. We have a big gap of individuals that have claimed credible fear and gone through the initial screening, have alternative detention for a year and half. Most likely, more like 130 days because those are the last numbers we had. Then the next eight years, they are awaiting that hearing. It is shorter in other areas but in new york and florida, it could be seven to 10 years. Is that accurate or not . Bible right now, we are scheduled out approximately 10 years in new york city but we are working on Technological Solutions where a noncitizen can update their address on our website, and request something to allow us to spread the workload throughout the country and our workforce where we will not have to rely on chickens directly on checkins directed to the new york city office. Lankford i want to come back for a round of questions after everyone has gone and talk about the difference between an individual at prevention rate for a time schedule. Someone that does not have that, so when that comes between ports of entry, what happens to them in the process, and once they leave the border, what is actually occurring. Then i want to walk through that process so we can get the differences for that individual because there are serious concerns. It was not that long ago after the border. One of the Border Patrol agents that two nights ago he picked up two guys that looked like they were military in their 20s. What happened . The response was, they were cut loose. That dialogue happening makes a lot of questions happen but we are trying to figure out decisions made when there are three guys clearly military age trying to figure out what happens to them. It is a casebycase basis but we are trying to figure out what is happening there. Thank you for being here. And thank you for your service. Cheese bemille chief bemiller and mr. Davidson, i am curious about your research into fentanyl which seems fairly successful. As i read, the number here, the rate of interdiction is roughly double or more with 4781 pounds of fentanyl in just two months, compared to the 14,700 pounds in fiscal year 2022. You talk about nii technology and the sharing of collaborations and information because the vast majority of fentanyl coming in is at points of entry where technology can be employed. Can you talk about the potentials for greater use of technology, information sharing . I know you are in the middle of our front middle of operation barnabas right now. In relation, how these new forms of interdiction can be potentially important . The operation was a huge success in terms of increasing the amount of interdiction for fentanyl in a short amount of time. To your point, we know we are scanning somewhere around 90 of the indifferent somewhere around 90 of the interdictions we see shows a small percentage of vehicles are crossing our border. We do not have the existing infrastructure to scan much higher rates. We are receiving funding from congress and working on a plan to recover more nonintrusive Inspection Technology throughout the southwest border to focus on this. Operation bartimus is the next level of the fentanyl fight and focusing on not just the interdiction of fentanyl but the presses working with our International Partners and sharing information that credible organizations work to start the shipment and movement of fentanyl into the United States. How good is the information sharing with other Law Enforcement . Davies it is very good and we have a robust process. We are working to link sharing across our international network. There are some International Partners that have far better information sharing capabilities with us than others, but we are continuing to work to improve those. Who is the good and who is the bad . I would rather not. Ok. I understand. Mr. Davidson, how important is counsel that is some kind of legal advice in the interviews inductive for the credible fear and fear interviews . Davidson it provides due process. The staff allows for a noncitizen to choose anyone a person wants to consult with. An attorney or religious person, or anything. Maybe i was not clear in my question. In your experience, and they open the question to others as well, a person arriving at the border and claiming credible fear may not speak english, may have no idea what credible fear is. May have no experience with any sort of objective in the partial Justice System before. How important is an advocate in explaining the process to that individual asylumseekers and implementing the standard to give important facts . Davidson it is reasonably important. But the caveat is certainly that my colleagues at cbp have a process where they orient an individual siloed for the credible fear interview itself. An attorney can help supplement this as well, and if an individual wants to seek counsel, then we provide access and ensure the individual who has counsel. It is an integral part of the process. Do you think the numbers in your testimony i am not sure i understand all of them but you went through numbers at the end of your testimony about different adages. You think they would change if more asylumseekers had counsel . Davidson i think that is a fair point to make. There is certainly a tendency to have different outcomes when there. Not in every instance but in certain instances. Not every individual who has counsel has seen a positive outcome. The general consensus seems to be we do not have enough counsel or judges in effect our immigration Justice System is lacking resources to fairly and effectively process those asylumseekers. Am i wrong . Davidson i do not think that is a wrong statement as a general route he in terms of Immigration Courts being under sort a ge nerality in terms of our Immigration Courts being under resourced. There are attorneys for non bono work and we continue to advocate with stakeholders to ensure there is low cost attorneys provided if someone chooses to take that option. Thank you. My time is expired. Sinema you are recognized. I had a chance to say hello to these men before i ran to another meeting. [indiscernible] a couple of you served in the military. Anyone in the navy . Good to see you. Anyone ever served in the army . Thank you. I think maybe one or both of you saw time overseas . One spent a lot of time in the navy. I think you for your service i thank you for your service. There is a couple questions. I dont think they have been answered. I want to ask about deals with u. S. Border patrol asians in the field. U. S. Border patrol agents in the field. Mr. Bemiller, two people call you that . Bemiller the ones that like me. That is a good name. The insight you shared with us is critical to me and others as we work to support the department of Homeland Security. To maintain a secure southwest border. I have been privileged to serve on the senate for 22 years and have been on the committee since it was first founded and created to deal with government operations. I have great affection for the department and men and women who serve. It was around two years ago, in 2021, that the department of Homeland Security announced customs for Border Protection. That is the Border Patrol processing coordinators. I dont know if this has already been discussed. If it has, forgive me but i wanted to go through it again. These coordinators assist the cbp with the care and processing of migrants and allow Border Patrol agent to focus on Law Enforcement duties in the field. Chief bemiller, can you expand on the effectiveness of these new Processing Court news . It presently presently, is there a sufficient number of Border Patrol agent is to allow them to resume duties in the field . Bemiller thank you for the question. They are absolutely necessary, as are many of our partnerships we work with. The Border Patrol processing coordinators we have almost 1200 of them today. The Border Patrol agent is well received. While we have 1200 Border Patrol processing coordinators, we are still far from returning all our Border Patrol agents back to the line. They are conducting duties as i mentioned in my opening it meant. Opening statement. They have an Important Mission and Important Role. Thank you. Let me follow up with the question again of you chief bem iller and also director davies. Throughout the time i have spent on the senate, i have focused on root causes in this committee and other committees. Not just symptoms and challenges but what are the root causes . What can and should we do about them . We have seen time and time again that there is coordination between the role of law, corruption and Economic Opportunity in central and south american countries and south american flows at the u. S. Border. Chief and director, given the migration flow in recent years and the number of migrants crossing at different ports across the border, can both of you speak as to how your components respond to these changes . Next, how do you strategically manage resources to ensure efficacy is maintained at various ports of entry. Chief, would you go first and then director davies . Bemiller thank you for the question. We work with our Foreign Operations Branch every Intelligence Branch and department of home land security to coordinate with our Strategic Partners and monitor the flow through the western atmosphere and around the world. This information gives us the opportunity to leverage our resources and wave them to the optimal locations where we predict traffic would be coming between the ports of entries. It is an extremely Important Partnership and it is just beneficial. Davidson we coordinate with our International Partners. We have several programs not just in the western hemisphere but across the globe with our Immigration Advisor Program and joint security program. We are focused on working with International Partners to identify flows, reason, and to come up with solutions that can be implemented to limit the ability for people to move through other countries solely for the purpose of exploiting laws, while maintaining ability for people seeking protection to come to the United States. Last question, if i could. In your testimony, chief b miller, and director davies, you highlight the importance of coordination and collaboration with your federal partners. Chief and director davies, as we see highs and lows in migration flows along our southwestern border, to what extent do you receive regular updates on the primary reasons behind and flexes in migration and how does this information gets shared amongst dhs components and help agents do their work on the ground . Director davies. Davies thank you for the question. We receive regular updates. I would say maybe not daily but every week about flows and reasons. We share a lot of information with our officers on the front line. The reasons do not always make a difference in terms of what kind of processing is going to happen or the point where they are at the point of entry. In cbp processing, it is to affect change of people leaving. We are trying to work with our foreign partners to address those causes. From an operational perspective, the reason people are coming has little impact on what we are doing operationally. Bemiller same question, very similar answer. We monitor the push factors but the intention of migrating to the u. S. Does not have an effect on the way we respond. Regardless of their intentions for coming here and reasons for fleeing their countries, economic or otherwise, our operations are still planned based on the movement of individuals crossing through the hemisphere. In just one minute to say another closing thought. In Central America and latin america, people have come for a number of times. Or is a reason because their lives are in many cases very miserable. A lot of folks who used to use other commodities are not able to do that anymore to make a living. One of the other things i notice is for too long period of time too long periods of time, we do not have a Senate Confirmed a basilar in them. Right now, we do not have a Senate Confirmed ambassador in columbia to make sure the folks leading those countries are behaving and we are in a good partner to them. Two points. Good candidates have been nominated to serve in these investor position so we need to take them up and get them to work. The second is a source of drought. We have a good idea what is causing this. Climate change. The are doing a lot about it and need to continue to do that. Senator johnson. Johnson thank you madam chair. Chief b miller, you said you worked with u. S. Border patrol for 25 years . Bemiller that is right. Johnson so you used to be with Border Patrol when they called them apprehensions, right . Bemiller yes. Johnson you are probably there in 2014 when jeh johnson 7000 apprehensions a day was a bad day for Border Patrol. Is that true . Bemiller it is true he said that. Johnson i think President Biden called that a humanitarian crisis. You were there. Did you feel like that was a humanitarian crisis . Bemiller it was a challenge. Johnson when did we shift from calling it apprehensions to encounters . Bemiller thank you. The difference between an apprehension and encounter came up during title 42. Because the individuals were not formally brought into Border Patrol custody. We were screened and returned immediately. That is the difference. Johnson last time i was at the border, there were some screened and returned. I think over a million from figures i saw. But an awful lot were processed and dispersed. The last time i was at the border, i was told by Border Patrol agents the goal given to them was to encounter processes in the first eight hours. Is that basically the goal now . Is that what we are doing . Bemiller as the chief of Law Enforcement for Border Patrol, that is not the guidance or purpose that i would johnson cove how long are you Holding People when you encounter them before they are processed, this first, or sent on a plane or bus to their final destination . Bemiller that is part of the complexity of the environment we are operating in. We have people, as i mentioned in my opening statement, in our custody for far too long. The processing, depending on the pathway that is appropriate for them we have a number of bottlenecks. Definitely, the bottleneck occurs after processing. Johnson do you know the average number of encounters during the advent per day . Bemiller i dont have that on me. Wait the average per day . Right now around 6500. Johnson over 6000 per day. It was a humanitarian crisis when we were apprehending 2000 per day. It was a bad day per jeh johnson when we were apprehending 1000 People Per Day. Now we are seeing 6000 People Per Day and cannot get secretary mayorkas to call this a crisis. He calls it a challenge. In your testimony, you kept talking about efficiency. Sitting in this sedate hearing setting, it almost seems like we have this under control. This is completely out of control, isnt it . What data do you keep . They do not share it readily with us in terms of the number of people who have been encountered, processed, and dispersed. How many people do we know are known gotaways . Do you know of the unknown gotaways . Would it surprise you to say around 5 Million People . Either they are encountered, processed, and dispersed or known and unknown gotaways. The population of half the states are 5 million or less. Do you believe that is a crisis . Do you believe that is under control . Bemiller not getting too tight up into the semantics of the situation, we are in a situation that is pressing our resources. Johnson you talk about how most of the Border Patrol agents spend most of their time in processing, which means we have wide open gaps for known and unknown gotaways for Drug Trafficking. I went down and they said we interdicted most drugs. We talked about having all these fentanyl apprehensions, but we are getting a mere fraction. In manufacturing, 10 is called scrap. This is completely out of control. We need to say it is out of control. We need to recognize reality. Senator blumenthal said, do you lack resources in terms of processing these claims . Yes, you lack resources because illegal immigration is completely out of control. 5 Million People. Bemiller what problems are you having recruiting people . How many people are retiring even more they are eligible for retirement . I go down to the border and see morale at incredibly low levels. The Border Patrol want to enforce their laws are not being able to do that. They are processing and dispersing. It is not satisfying. Can you speak to the level of morale knowledge in Border Patrol . Bemiller thank you for that again. Absolutely. I have been around the country and spoken to thousands of Border Patrol agents. The pride they have in the work that they do, they ask only for tools to be able to go do that job. They asked for freedom to do that job. They are processing far too much. Recently, we have attending a muster with the agents, they need better vehicles. Johnson they need control of the border and administration dedicated to controlling the border. The movie the sound of freedom talked about the sex trafficking of children. I have written letters to the Senate Committee to hold hearings on that. This open border policy is facilitating, and you know this, the multibilliondollar is this model of human traffickers, sex traffickers, and drug traffickers. Correct . Bemiller yes. It is dangerous johnson and youre Border Patrol, senator langford said, encountered men in military camouflage of military age. They were let go. It is not your fault. It is frustrating for me having shared this committee with three dozen hearings on the border, understanding the problem. I am pca this hearing. But then to be speaking in such sedate terms. Telling people, we have this under control. Only 10 years. We cannot say only. 10 years until the first immigration hearing in new york city . 10 years . It is a completely open border and out of control and call it what it is. This is an open border. This has to stop. This is not way asylum country can sustain. Thank you, madam chair. Thank you senator johnson. Thank you chairwoman and senator langford to bring us together. We have the immigration system functioning post title 42. I do want to say that i labs have the opportunity because witnesses from the cbp and more. I am not the only one disappointed that we do not have the ability to state with someone from dhs headquarters. Some of the concerns regarding the allegations under the cbp program are concerned that the chairwoman our concerns the chairwoman also shares. The immigration review is immigration parts, without which we do not have the picture of how immigrants are processed at the border. I applaud the work of the Biden Administration to attempt to view building broken immigration system and will continue to express my serious concerns about some more recent policies it is undertaken. Particularly that of credible fear interviews while migrants are in cbp custody. My concern is compounded by the lack of responsiveness to oversight requests we have made. With the focus of todays hearing and the concerning lack of responsiveness, i want to reiterate my expectation that dhs provides documents and answers outstanding questions in a timely manner. I believe i speak for all people in that regard as to consider Additional Border funding and to be supplemental in the very near future. As far as questions for today, i will begin by noting the cdp has proactive engagement in operational planning ngos that provide shelter and services to migrant and asylum speakers in southern california. This is vital to ensure ngos can efficiently and safely provide services for migrant families and adults who are released by cbp to continue immigration cases. This marvel of cooperation and collaboration should be considered a best practice and expectation moving forward. However, consider the coordination and information sharing practices between cbp and ngos can still be improved somewhat, particularly in terms of sharing demographic information in the quick stick need of individuals being transferred to ngos. Mr. Davies, can you please explain how cbp coordinates with ngos and local jurisdictions of individuals release from custody . Davies thank you for the question. We do engage with local ngos. You are right that we have a Good Relationship with southern california. I wish the level of engagement from some other locations would be as good and robust. We are kind of, i want to say, fed up with the hands we are adults sometimes from partners. From a perspective, it is our want to remove people so as not to create a safety issue at the point of entry. Coordinate with them. We dont always have the ability to share individual information on people coming through and being moved forward to the ngos. Some of that is from a privacy perspective, as i understand it. Your point of sharing demographics and with six, we know there are challenges that we face when we talk about things available for some of the nationalities we handle and i understand why that is important for ngos to have. That is not personally identifiable information, it seems to me. It is helpful for indio to try to assist your enclaves supportive role. You use the role the term working with the hands we are dealt. Is it a policy restriction or policy of ngo challenge . Why cant this be and in and replicated in other areas . Davies thank you, again. I do think some has to do with capacity of the ngos. We have attempted at all our locations across the southwest border to engage with ngo partners. They are under a large strain because of the amount of the cross. Their capacity is strangely far before cbps capacity estrangement grace logistical challenges them and us. I understand getting this on the record is hopeful because we have tried to advocate for more funding for them. They are playing a supportive role to your function in a much more costeffective way than if we try to do this with federal employees from one agency or department. To be specific here, i know my time is running, the impact of shelter providers on cbps ability to process individuals . Can you take 30 seconds on that . Davies the ngos are receiving some of these folks if theyre unable to proceed and do not have capacity, this means individuals being released from the port of entry may not have somewhere to go or have transportation or services available, which creates a strain on local communities in proximity to the poor country the port country. In the area of criminal prosecution of asylumseekers, under existing immigration laws, people have right to seek asylum in our country a respective of their manner of entry. That does not mean it is guaranteed but they can see it. But someone going across the border in deserts to circumvent Border Patrol has just of a right to do so as someone who walks up to the port of entry to present themselves to claim fear. At the same time, this administration has been clear it intends to impose consequences for unlawful entry including potential prosecutions for unlawful entry and reentry. I have been trying for a wild to get a clear answer on where the ration on where the Administration Stands for people who have claimed fear. What is the Border Patrol policy when regarding referral of asylumseekers for process and under usc 1325 or 1326 . Bemiller i would like to reverse this a bit. Anyone can claim asylum. Even if they are being prosecuted. I think this is an Important Note to make. Regardless whether they are being pursued for criminal charges, they still have the right and can retain the right claim asylum. For walk me through that process and among the clarity that i am seeking. Is the referral for prosecution before or after cbp determines whether the determination is made at the time they make the claims. Senator and the criteria for referral . Witness the same as any asylum claim, which is fear of returning to their country, fear of being injured. Senator the referral for prosecution, what is the criteria to refer somebody for prosecution . Witness the crime that they committed, whether they have a past criminal record. It depends on the circumstances. If you are trying to get at the individuals targeted for claiming asylum, absolutely not. Not accurate. Senator i am just wondering what guidance field agents have for making the determination of referring for prosecution are not. Witness in certain locations, for targeted efforts depending on the circumstances, to try to apply a consequence to a location that is being exploited by the transnational criminal organizations, we may apply a targeted prosecution effort in a specific location in order to try to minimize that the risk to the migrants crossing to that area and trying to push back the tcos taking advantage of the vulnerable populations crossing a specific area. One additional thing, and to get back to the beginning of it is, regardless of that, when we take them into custody, he still have the same right as anybody else to claim. Senator i will have some followup questions after. Thank you very much. I will grant myself time for questions. I will pick up where i left off. My next question is for the entire panel. As we have heard, this is an extremely complex process and a small breakdown can have large effects on the overall operation. Where do bottlenecks typically occur in the process for each of your organizations . Well start with mr. Davies and then move across the piano. Witness thank you. At the ports of entry, the biggest bottleneck we encounter is when it comes to release. That is whether the individual is being referred for detention with ero or being released with the ngos, making sure there is a smooth transition and minimal amount of time once we have completed Case Processing to move those individuals out of of a port of entry is imperative. That is the biggest bottleneck. Witness as far as Border Patrol agent concerned, there is a number of bottlenecks that occur throughout the entire Immigration Enforcement continuum, starting with at encounter. When large groups enter, 400, 500, sometimes even 1000, it can create a significant drain on our resources and personnel to extract those individuals out of the field, so that is probably the first. To the back end of that, our turning over to other agencies, also postprocessing, waiting for available space, waiting for available acceptance, is probably our biggest bottlenecks. Witness thank you for the question. For ero, our biggest bottleneck is obtaining travel documents and actually affecting the removal. For countries other than the northern triangle countries. Witness for uscis, one of our biggest bottlenecks is that removal process remains a very paperbased process. The three components have their own ways, their own parts of their credible fear process. We have made Great Strides in being able to digitize our so that process and making it an electronic environment. I think people would a lot of those bottlenecks to that end and that is an accomplishment. Chairman sinema thank you. I would like to continue the discussion on credible fear interviews import a partial custody. How many sectors are currently participating in the program, and are there any plans to expand into other sectors . How does the policy affect operations in sectors that currently conduct those interviews . Witness we have five sectors that are currently conducting immigration sorry, conducting credible fear interviews. And we have tried to sample those in del rio as well. I would say that there is a significant backlog in the time of custody and our tick times, gracing the overall times in Border Patrol or custody. It averages between nine and 16 days in custody to completely process them all the way through the cfi process while in Border Patrol custody. Chairman sinema mr. Davies, now that ofo has increased the number of ports across the southwest border, it can take even longer for migrants to get a walkin appointment. That can come to productively incentivize migrants to cross between ports. What is the current total number of daily cbp appointments across the southwest border and how many walkin appointments are you able to accommodate each day . Witness across the eight ports of entry where we are processing c. P. B. Appointments, we schedule on a daily basis 1450 appointments. In addition to those, both at those same eight locations and at the other locations that dont accept c. P. B. 1 appointments, we generally take about 200 other individuals in a day. The way that happens will vary from port to port in some cases when they have completed their appointments for the day, they will bring others in from the line. In some cases it is throughout the day as capacity allows, they will bring in individuals who dont have appointments. Chairman sinema most migrants being processed are making appointments to the south, but there are issues with the app, limited number of luggages which makes it difficult for some groups to access the scheduling system. So when processing walkin appointments, does ofo ask migrants why they werent able to make a cbp one appointment, and if so, what are the responses you most, only our hearing . Witness we dont in a systematic way require officers to ask that question or record it in our system of record. And acted only because some of our officers ask that question, typically the answers we get back are that they either didnt have access to the phone, they may say that they were unaware of the process, or as you pointed out, issues with language availability in the app. We are aware of the shortcomings. We are working to address them with constant updates to the app. Thank you. Chairman sinema mr. Davidson, from an operational perspective, how has a circumvention of lawful pathways affected usciss work with migrants apprehended at the southwest border, and hasnt had any significant reduction in the number of credible fear interviews at the agency is conducting . Witness there has been an increasing the amount of interviews referred to uscis since may 12, and certainly the process to analyze a credible fear case, i know the cfp has more complexities involved. So that part has added more time to the credible fear process, certainly. Chairwoman sinema my last question is for the panel. With the end of the fiscal year rapidly approaching, we are hearing more conversations about what happens if congress cant complete its work of keeping the government funded. How would a Government Shutdown affect each of your components abilities to make sure that the management of the border systems are functioning . We will start with mr. Davies and will request a panel. Witness i think the biggest impact that the Government Shutdown would have on the office of Field Operations would be the morale of the workforce. Lymph we know through previous Government Shutdowns, we would continue, to work and securing our border and our ports of entry but, over a long period of time, not having a paycheck to go home to is extremely demoralizing and debilitating for our officers. Many of them merely paychecktopaycheck and in places where there are high costs of living. So that to be the biggest concern. We had during the last Government Shutdown to go through this process of allowing many of our officers to seek outside employment. I think that is a dangerous precedent to set, having officers working a second job somewhere else just to try to make money where they should be focused on the process. Chairwoman sinema thank you. I recognize senator lankford for continued questions. Senator thank you. I want to walk to the process, trying to get a handle on it, because the complexities are definitely there. What we have tried to pursue is how are the decisions made, and what are the documents that dhs has provided to each entity on what the greater is to be able to make a decision on this. So i will just run through this briefly here. So, the cbp one app, they fill up the app, they enter the port, they are screened for parole or an asylum claim. We were trying to figure out some of that process on the screening for parole and the asylum claim. Then after vetting they get an appointment. They could be turned around and paroled into the United States and eligible for Work Authorization. We understand that if they come through the cbp one app, they can get parole and get Work Authorization within one month. Let me start there on the initial one. Some of them came into the port of entry, filled up the cbp one app that is at most, for that individual to get parole at that point . Witness to clarify, approximately 90 of the individuals who show up for the cbp one appointment are given a notice to appear before an immigration judge. But ultimately it is a custody disposition, they are paroled out of custody. So yes. Senator they are paroled out of custody, about 90 . The best we can tell it is those individuals are also seeking an asylum claim and they get a oneyear term period to seek asylum claim, or are they just on parole . Witness if they apply with cbp one, they are generally given a two year parole is a custody determination while they are in removal proceedings and you are correct, they have the ability to pursue asylum while pending those proceedings, but we are not accepting their claim per se at the port of entry. Senator so where would they make a asylum claim . The clock is ticking for them to make the claim. Witness i would defer to my colleague from uscis. Witness if they are in defense of a solar proceedings under sector 240, they would make their claim with the immigration judge. It depends on the pathway. But if they are under immigration proceedings, they would certainly make it with the courts so they have a two year parole. Senator . Senator after filling out the cbp one up at that point, get the two year parole, at what point are they having a decision made on their parole . Are they transition onto their visas or their status . What happens next . Them district figure out how it is operating. Witness i can state that if they were in parole status, but not in an immigration proceeding, they would have the ability to file for asylum with uscis. Senator what happens to them . They have been given documentation at the border that they are in april proceeding, what is happening . Witness the parole document at that point is to document the custody determination that they have been released. Their actual status is that in there it would to removal proceedings. The fact that their parole has run out, at least from an ofo perspective, it is largely irrelevant because their status in the United States is that they are pending removal proceedings. Senator but that removal proceeding hearing would be when . Witness it could be several years down the road. Witness it is determined by the court. Uir sets the calendar for the removal hearing. Senator so we have an individual that is on a two year parole but could be six years before they actually get a hearing. Those last four years, what is their status, other than pending removal . Does somebody know . This is helpful for us because we are asking the same questions, just trying to figure out what is the status of the individual. It is my understanding that if they do the cbp one app, regardless where they are from, anywhere in the world, about 90 are actually being paroled, my understanding is within a month they are getting a Work Authorization. Is that correct or not correct . Witness they are eligible for work with readily after they are paroled into the United States. Senator so it doesnt necessarily take a month, at that point, it could be days . Witness we aspire them to complete surgery in 30 days. We are working steadfast to make sure that happens. It would just require us to be able to analyze that application and issue them the employment authorization document. Senator so if they come to the port without going through the app, they just arrived and said dont understand the language, or i just got in line, or at the port, they didnt do the app at all . What is different about their process . Witness largely the process is very similar, they have to wait until there is capacity. Senator it may be a couple of days. Witness right, roughly about half of the people who, without an appointment are given an ta a and paroled as a result. Senator so what is the difference . Witness we didnt have their information. Sometimes it is about the individual circumstances that they have. There may be a reason why they didnt want to submit to the cbp one app. As a result of the casebycase determination, the Officers Determined that they may be put into removal proceedings. Senator how many of those are told will fill go and fill out the app and come back another day . Is that happening . Witness i dont think it is a significant portions of the individuals processing without appointments. Senator the half that are turned around, they are turned around and told you are not eligible to come to at all, they head back to mexico, correct . Witness a subpopulation, yes. Senator and then the other half that are accepted through, they would go through the same process, get a Work Authorization and in 30 days or less. They could be said for approval for two years but it could be years before they get an actual hearing, correct . Witness our policy states that if somewhat without a cbp one appointment is process for removal proceedings rather than having a two year parole, their parole is issued for a period of only one year. Senator but there will still be a gap, even approximately given two years will have several years of a gap. There is just a bigger gap. Is there a consequence . Is i. C. E. Pursuing these individuals whose parole has expired, for instance . Witness once the individual shows up at an immigration office, they should have reporting requirements. They could be placed on alternative detention or just monitored on an undertaking docket at that point on the order of reconnaissance. Senator that would be starting on the first days they are there, not a year down the road that you would pursue those individuals and put them on alternative detention . Witness the change in their position could be at any point when they are brought into our offices. Senator when does the rebuttable presumption kick in . If they havent filled out the cbp one up, they arrived at a port of entry . Where does that apply . Witness it applies during the asylum interview. Senator but that would only be if they actually request asylum at that point. For 50 , they are getting paroled and not necessarily requesting asylum and they could request it later at their hearing . Witness the rebuttable presumption would affect those who filed a credible fear claim. Senator three years from now when they actually have their hearing, the rebuttable presumption would apply then . Witness no, senator, the rebuttable presumption is an alert during the credible fear process itself. Once cbp refers the case with the credible fear screening, with analyzing the exemption. Senator if they ever ever the port of entry, they did not fill out the app, there in the 50 that was given parole and they didnt ask for asylum at that point, they are released into the country, they are just awaiting a hearing at that point. They may challenge for asylum at their hearing, then they would bring it up then. Would the rebuttable presumption apply at that point . Witness that is correct. The rebuttal presumption would not apply before the Immigration Court. Immigration judges would be analyzing their asylum claim. Senator ok, theyre coming between the ports of entry. Out on the open desert here. They actually enter at that point. Border patrol is able to encounter them and take them to the stations to begin processing , they process them, do the processing and medical checks and everything else, what happens to that individual then, at that point . Witness very similar, again, they would be referred to uscis once processed. If space is available, they would be turned over to tro. Senator that is if they request asylum . Uscis is engaged, or are they all requesting asylum . Witness uscis would engage in every case of a set. Senator but are all of them requesting asylum, that you are encountering between the ports of entry . Witness no. Senator those not requesting asylum, what is their supposition . Witness they are either withdrawn or some of them are prosecuted. It just depends on the circumstances. Senator when you say withdrawn, help me understand . Witness so they would actually be processed to return back to mexico from the country that they came, voluntary departure. Senator our understanding is, and this is something senator sinema and i have tried to track for a while, expedited removal. Expedited removal of like you are removed quickly. Over understanding is expedited removal doesnt actually mean you are removed quickly. What is the current expedited removal percentage of people actually removed from the country. Does anyone know . Witness i dont have that information. Senator i understand it is a very small number, of those who are actually removed from the country. We have been trying to get that data and every number we have had has been a pretty low percentage. The vast majority of people under expedited removal are actually still currently in the country and have some some have been for years under expedited removal, but they are not actually removed. So if that person requests asylum between ports of entry, they have been processed in the Border Patrol stations, subsite or hurt side of the facility, whatever it may be, the request asylum, uscis does interview and you are doing that in stations now . Witness we do those interviews virtually with the assistance of our colleagues at cbp, but you are correct, there would be done after those locations. Senator if those individuals are deemed to have potable fear, what happens . Witness they are issued a notice to appear and put under section 240 of removal proceedings. Senator that is the notice to appear. Then they are released to the country. They have a notice to appear with i. C. E. At some location, right, than a setting and a date is set after that for a court hearing. Right or not right on that . Witness i. C. E. Would assess the release ability of that information, but that is correct, they would have a date set by the court for them to appear for hearing. Senator after they had checked in with ice for a notice to appear . Witness correct are not correct . Im trying to track the dates . Witness that i defer. Witness typically when a notice to appear is issued, we get a court date and a time for those individuals. Senator how long is that typically, before they would get that hearing . Currently, where are we on the notice to appear . Witness not sure. Witness the hearings could take years with oir. Senator when do they get a Work Authorization, they have requested an asylum request, they came between ports of entry, requested asylum, given a notice to appear, released into the country, when can they get a Work Authorization . Witness they are eligible for a Work Authorization if they file a defense of asylum claim before the courts. They are eligible for a Work Authorization. Senator how quickly . Witness as quickly as they filed the application and we can process it. We are averaging less than 60 days for defense of asylum employment authorization documents. Senator ok. What i am trying to figure out is, if somebody fills out the cbp one app, goes through that process, comes through the port of entry, they are processed through into the country and within 30 days, they will have a Work Authorization. Or they can come between ports of entry, request asylum and within 60 days they will have a Work Authorization. Either one of them, it will be years before they actually have a hearing. Correct or not correct on that . Witness in the 19 setting, correct. Senator yes. Your nondetainment docket at this point, uscis has about a 40,000 person backlog in just the interview process for the nondetainer docket. Yes. Senator there are other groups of folks in the nondetain docket, their paperwork has not been processed yet to be able to get into that backlog of 40,000. I witness think at this point we are relatively caught up in terms of processing cases into the system, so i think those numbers are pretty static, the 40,000. Senator 40,000 is a number at this point. How long will it take to do those interviews . Those are individuals who i assume came through ports of entry mr. Bemiller said if 500 people, once, there wasnt space to hold these folks, they were released and there wasnt an opportunity to do the interviews at that point. So we have 40,000ish people in the group, how long would it take to identify, find them and do those interviews . We know where they are because we coordinate with our colleagues at i. C. E. , and we coordinate interviews with our colleagues at i. C. E. On the nondetained docket. That is a matter of being able to divert resources to be able to address the nondetain workload. Along with our credible fear work that just increase. Senator give me a guess, how long will that take . Witness i would have to get back to you on an average time to process in nondetain docket. Senator i would make a request from our committee as well that any guidance documents you have received on how to make decisions on who to parole, what the decision is for the 90 of folks that are paroled in, the 10 that are not paroled, there has to be some document that is a guidance to be able to make that decision. We have asked for those documents over and over again, how are those decisions made, more often we get an answer back from dhs that says the officer on the field will make that decision. I would say, i know our structure in the federal government enough and there is some guidance. Its not just what the officer had for breakfast that morning and how are they feeling today. There is some guidance but we have received nothing as far as guidance on how the information is made. It would be helpful for us to see that process permitted the same thing for uscis, it would be helpful for us to see how those decisions are actually made and what the criteria is for making that decision. I appreciate all four of you being here in the time you took in preparing for this. We just had the opportunity to scratch the surface. But just tell us how decisions are made and how the process is because this is a very new process and we are seeing record numbers of people. The numbers dropped off dramatically right after title 42 changed and then they accelerated again to numbers, as Washington Post listed, that literally our country has never seen the numbers coming in for family units in august. So we have seen this skyrocket and we are trying to understand how the decision is being made and what that looks like on the ground. Chairwoman sinema thank you, senator lankford. I neglected to have the other three members of a panel answer the question on the Government Shutdown. So before we conclude today, i would like to pick up on river where we left off. If you could all answer. Enter refresher on the question, how would a Government Shutdown affect each of your components abilities to make sure the Border Patrol system continues to function . Witness thank you again for the question. I would have to echo almost everything that mr. Davies mentioned. Morale certainly is a problem. We have faced this for many, many years, over and over again. There is a wariness with the workforce. Our operators are committed to the mission and they will report to duty. I would say one of the biggest aside from the morale and the unknown of when their next paycheck is coming, our partnerships are affected, both anybody that has federal contracts, those are all points of concern for us. When we are already stretched thin and at risk of compromise contracts and other things, it is definitely an issue for us. Chairwoman sinema thank you. Witness thank you for the question. I, too, would like to echo both of their statements, but to add one more part to that, the loss of our support staff during that time. They are instrumental in us processing individuals through the immigration pathways and doing our job, and typically, those folks are not reporting to work if the government shuts down, which will impact us greatly. Thank you. Witness recognizing that uscis is a fee funded agency, 96 of the agencies funded by fees. It has an impact on us because our everify program is appropriated, but also that the same consensus from my colleagues, it has a morale issue on our staff. Experiencing a Government Shutdown. Chairwoman sinema thank you all. With that, we have reached the conclusion of todays hearing. I appreciate each of our witnesses for your time and for your testimony. I want to thank all my colleagues in the panel for their participation. This was a very important and timely hearing and no there are a lot of questions we didnt have an opportunity to ask, so i will submit more questions to continue to answer to this critical need. The hearing record will remain open for 15 days, until 5 p. M. On september 21 for the submission of statements and questions for the record. With that, our hearing is adjourned. [gavel] [chatter] [captions Copyright National cable satellite corp. 2023] [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy, visit ncicap. Org] [chatter] billingtons cybersecurity summit in washington d. C