Transcripts For CSPAN3 Gabrielle 20240704

In september 2018, coinciding with the Supreme Court confirmation hearings for Justice Brett kavanaugh, Gabrielle Blair tweeted the following im a mother of six and a mormon. I have a good understanding of arguments surrounding abortion, religion and otherwise. Ive been listening to men grandstand about womens reproductive rights, and im convinced men actually have zero interest in stopping abortion. Heres why. Her 63 tweet thread quickly went viral and formed the basis for ejaculate responsibly, which became an instant New York Times bestseller when it was published last year. Up until that time, gabrielle was best known as the creator of the Award Winning blog design mom, which has been named a website of the year by time and led to her first bestselling book design mom how to live with kids. As an unexpected and vital new voice in the conversation around reprint active rights, we are thrilled to have Gabrielle Blair here tonight to continue the conversation sparked by ejaculate responsibly, which makes the case for shifting the burden of pregnancy prevention from women who are fertile for just 24 hours each month to men who are fertile 24 hours a day every day of their lives. Exploring power dynamics, presenting new research, and unearthing the sexism at the center of Birth Control. The book offers a fresh perspective on preventing unwanted pregnancies and a powerful paradigm shift in the way we think about abortion. At a time when many women feel powerless and voiceless over their reproductive rights. Tonight, Gabrielle Blair will be in conversation with Charlotte Clymer, a Writer Communications Consultant elgie tcu, activist and author of the charlottes web. Thoughts substack newsletter, which was a 2023 nominee for a glad media award for outstanding blog in 2020. Charlotte was named to fortune magazines 40 under 40 list of the most influential people in politics and government. Later in the program, we would love to hear your questions and youll be invited to line up at the standing microphones in either aisle following the event. Signed books will be for sale in the main lobby and will also have a signing line for anyone who purchased a book who would like to have their name added to it. Thank you all again. Both here and at home for being with us tonight. Please join me in giving Gabrielle Blair and Charlotte Clymer a warm welcome to sixth. And i. My goodness, i got to pinch myself. I feel the same. This is the first time were meeting. Weve been internet friends for a long time. Yes. First of all, i just want to say i love sex. And i. I describe this place to friends outside of d. C. As the premier book event venue. Ive been here, i dont know, a few hundred times over the last ten years. And the staff here is amazing. And what a seamless process for having this event. Its been incredible for every little detail. Yes. So, yes, please give it up for sex. And i. Before we began, gabrielle included a fantastic page about inclusive language. And i do encourage you to read it. Its page three, but i want to be clear about something. When we say men and women, were not going to attach 15 different modifiers to the term, men or women. Tonight, this book is not about the definitive, definitive experience of women. Its not about the definitive experience of men. Its specifically about the cultural dynamic that conditions. I would say most men in believing that cis women are primarily responsible for unwanted pregnancies. Were tackling that aspect. So its not about all men, its not about all women. Its specifically about this man who, quite frankly, need to hear this. So were going to move forward saying men and women tonight, were not going to attach a lot of modifiers and conditions to those two words, just for clarity and avoid clunkiness. All right. I love this book. I love this book so, so much. It it feels like when youre reading it, theres no fluff, theres no spin. It is just direct, hardcore logic over and over again. You have 28 different points that you lay out. And i almost imagine you just nailing them to a church door. So a manifesto. Thats right. To let folks know whats going on. But lets start from the beginning of september 18th, 2018. Its the early evening youre about to write what i would describe. And i think what many people would describe as the most influential twitter thread ever written. Hands down. I dont know. For those who are not on twitter, i congratulate you and stay off of it. If you can. There are twitter threads that go viral. There are things that go viral, and then there are things that are part of twitter and really part of the online discourse that just kind of stay up here permanently. This is one of those things this thread over the past four and a half years, i see it go viral at least twice a month. Every single month. Just say i just last night i retweeted the same thread and again it went viral on its own strands. So take us back to that moment. Youre about to write this great twitter thread. What was going through your mind . Well, so at that moment, what was going through my mind was that kavanaugh hearings. But really, i had written down these thoughts months before and had not kind of not known where to put them. Ive been writing online for a long time. I write as design. Mom is my handle everywhere and. What i had written down was such a different tone than what i usually did, which is like house tours and diy projects and and also current events. Ive always written about current events, but very much through a lets explore this. This is a friendly thing. Everyone, you know, share your thoughts, talk about how you discuss this with your children. And then id written this and it was just so different. It was much angrier and anyway, and so i was just sat on it. I didnt know where to put it. And then the cabinet hearings were happening and they were just making me. Reggie it was politician after politician and typically man standing up. And i mean, in this case it was always men standing up and talking about abortion. And it was so clear to me they did not care. They didnt care if there are a million abortions. They didnt care if there is zero. They truly do not care about this. They hadnt thought about it. They hadnt put themselves in the place of women who are having to make these decisions. They just knew that if they say these magic words, they get a vote like this is all that was happening. And i anyway, i was just furious about it. I so i, mike, i think, i think i want to share a twitter thread and it was my very first thread and obviously i did. Its a very bad form to write a 63 tweet thread which it has, which i did not know. Ive heard the critiques believe me, like, oh, its like embarrassing to think about it, but, but actually tough. You can read it like its, its not its not the end of the world to read 63 tweets, but anyway, so shared it and it went viral immediately. And i have had viral things before. This is ive been online a long time, but nothing has been like this thread every day for four and a half years. If i check my notifications and this is not any exaggeration, there will be comments likes retweet is on this thread literally every day for four and a half years. New people discovering it. I mean, at this point im like everyones seen it by now on twitter, right . No new people discover it every day. Its just i havent had anything like it. Im im so taken by. I would say, your ability to condense the language in something that is accessible for everybody. But you also anticipate arguments so. Well, its like you youve written out all the possible responses and youve probably gotten all the possible responses at this point, right . And you know exactly what to say, which is how this result at a New York Times bestselling book that says, what is the main premise of the book that men cause all unwanted pregnancies . Men cause all unwanted pregnancies. There are a lot of different routes we can take right now. And i have about 20,000 questions i want to ask you, but i know i have to focus by now. We understand that i would say most men dont understand womens bodies. Sure. But you point out something that i dont hear often, if ever. Is that honestly, most men dont understand their own bodies. Right. Could you expand on that . Well, not assuming youre talking about fertility and mens fertility. Fertility viagra, all of that. Right. Okay. So so mens fertility, we just dont talk about it whenever were thinking about fertility, were talking about womens fertility. And as was mentioned and introduction, which was lovely by the way. Thank you. Womens eggs are fertile for 12 to 24 hours a month. Thats it. But we have to manage pregnancy prevention every day of the month. Like whether thats taking a pill every day or whether thats dealing with the side effects of an implant or the shot or an iud or whatever it might be, and really what were managing is mens fertility because theyre fertile all the time. Most of the time when i have sex, i cannot get pregnant. Its physically impossible. But every time a man has sex, he can potentially cause a pregnancy. And we just do not ever talk about mens fertility that way. And i dont think men ever think about their fertility that way. Like if we asked them, well, when, you know, are you fertile today . Theyre going, oh, yeah, i guess i am. I mean, yes, you know, like we just dont ever talk about that. Okay. So i thought was really important to talk about that. But then theres all sorts of things that that i learned in these like twitter really was the Research Center for me as over these last years where i refined every argument, figured out better metaphors, you know, kind of saw where people were getting stuck, but also did a ton of research when people would bring up questions and one of the things i learned about was that by that this is a story in the book about that when viagra was being research aged, well, they didnt know it was viagra. There was the drug was being research and there was like they discovered, oh, this works really well for. For helping men get when theyre getting older. But they also discovered it was really good for helping with period pain for for cramps. And it was really effective for that. And i mean, theres a world somewhere where both of those paths could have been pursued and men could have been helped with this drug, and women could have been helpful to this drug. But this panel of decision makers, all men, decided that period cramps, that the pain from periods wasnt pressing issue was it isnt something that needed attention. And so didnt research that at all shut that down and just focus on viagra for erectile dysfunction and im certain the average man using viagra has no idea about that. I dont think most women know about that unless theyve picked up the book. But i just i dont know that men understand how much theyre bodies are prioritized in any kind of medical context. And theres this theres this insulting prevailing view. Im sorry, prevailing view thats insulting toward men that they cant control. Irresponsible ejaculations. Right. And you talked at length about this. I do. I mean, the reality is thats part of our culture, right . Were like, are they they theyre in the heat of the moment. They cant control it. And i dont know. I cant speak to the biological urges of a man. I, i understand that. But i can speak to biological urges. We all have them. We all have to eat. We all have to use the bathroom. Like these are biological urges that cannot ever be denied. You can control biological urges. Weve taught ourselves that we use the bathroom in a bathroom. We dont just use the bathroom on the stage like we. Weve taught our bodies to control these. And certainly you can you can control an ejaculation. And the more i talk to men about this and really say, okay, whats the reality . The more that its really clear that that they can that the messages that they can are just a cultural myth and that, you know, youll see memes about this if youre on twitter, youll see memes where, you know, some will say therell be a conversation between man and woman where she he says, oh, i dont have a condom. So i guess, you know, well have to have sex without a condom. And she goes, great. Ive been really looking forward to being a mother. And then he magically finds a condom like like they have more control than maybe theyre taught to admit it. You remember early in the pandemic when there were stories everywhere of cis men who were refusing to wear masks. And it feels like in retrospect, that shouldnt have been a surprise to any of us, given that they wont even wear a condom for 45 seconds or whatever the hell it, you know, right, right, right. For sure. So this like this is certainly something i think about a lot is these myths about condoms and how harmful they are. I mean, the more i worked on this book, the more pro condom i became. Because not only are they very effective for preventing pregnancy, they are only option for for not passing along stds like this is it. This is there is no hormonal Birth Control that is stopping sexually transmitted infections like that. Thats just not and youve got condoms. Thats it. So we should be so excited about condoms and how easy to use, how accessible they are. All these and how much theyve improved. And that was something i also didnt know. But im again in this research, ive talked to so many men who said, look, if you are willing to learn how to use them, that means trying a lot of different kinds, finding the right brand, the right size, the right lubrication, troubleshooting, basically that they could confidently say sex with a condom, sex without a condom, not enough of a difference to even ever hesitate using a condom and i know if thats that feels like a lot to ask to say, hey, get out there and learn how to use condoms. But women have to learn to use Birth Control, too. Like these are these are this. Its not a big ask and it should be something that we can talk about freely. And if if theres if you have a partner that does like condoms, then like, well, lets go buy a box of every kind and figure out how to make that happen. You know how to make it work for you. I, im certainly not out here wanting people to have crummy sex. That is not my goal at all. But i, i think ejaculating responsibly is how you respect your own body and your partners body like that is just that is not a lot to ask. Absolutely. Absolutely. You talked about specifically the, i would say lack of Awareness Among a lot of men in negotiate in how to use condoms because, in fact, most men dont know how to use condoms. They dont know how to properly use them. Like you have to like, you know, try different ones or, you know, try different lubrication techniques. But i think most men honestly believe that if they if one condom doesnt work, none of the others will work because we lack Sex Education in this country. Do comprehensive site education. So yes, everything is it is exactly right. So there are 11 states that dont require any sex ed at all. Some of the states that do allow sex ed only allow you to talk about abstinence to teach abstinence, which is been proven over and over again, to have no effect on lowering the incidence of unwanted pregnancies. So its just kind of abysmal. I mean, and and beyond are poor sex ed. I mean, i got like one maturation clinic in fifth grade. I think that was my that was my sex. And but beyond that, we have all this other education happening, too. Thats, again, this cultural myth. I grew up in a very conservative religion, conservative town. I didnt know almost anything about sex. Even as a teenager. I was very naive. But somehow i knew that men dont like condoms. Like, its just that pervasive. How. Why would i know that . But if i dont know if its in our music, our movies are where it is. But i certainly understood that. And i and anyway, so our education as a as a huge issue. And the thing is, if if you are talking to someone that is interested in reducing abortions, one of the only proven ways that we have for reducing unwanted pregnancies, which is what leads to these abortions, is is free and accessible Birth Control, like and sex ed, those are sorry. Those are the two things that work. So anyone who is trying to tell you they want to get rid of abortion that really the the only thing to say is. So then whats your plan for sex ed . Whats your plan for free and accessible Birth Control . Because these are the only things that work. And they do work. They work really well. Its not magic. We know how to make this happen, if thats what youre interested in doing. We in the book, i talk about the netherlands. They do agitprop really sex ed at every every grade. And i want to emphasize age appropriate and it works. And they have a very low incidence of unwanted pregnancies and we just need to do this. I mean, were were really prudes in our country like we we dont dare talk about this this stuff. And we just have to talk about we have to talk about it openly. And thats part of why i really love the title. It kind of jars people or they feel like its provocative, but really its just this clinical term. Its this so unsexy, like you can talk, you know, theres just you can talk about ejaculation with your kids and no ones getting turned on. Theyll want, you know, its just so unsexy and its, its its exactly right for that. And because you have to be able to talk about this stuff openly as a parent, but just also in communities, i can talk about condoms all day long, but i dont have authority to tell someone this is this is how to use a condom or this is what it should feel like. They need to hear that from other condom users. You know, they need to hear that from men that can that they trust and we have to be able to talk about this stuff openly. You point out that were prudes, which is correct. But but also there are i would describe then and, you know, im going to be very direct here. I would describe social conservatives as hypocritical prudes, because in sunday morning, like you and i are religious, we go to church on sunday morning, we go to church with people who will be firmly against any premarital sex, any public displays of, you know, sexual or whatever. And then theyll go watch an nfl game where there are cheerleaders. So i fully support do whatever they want. But, you know, theyre just, you know, fully expressing their sexuality. They have no problem with that at all. None whatsoever. Because if its to appeal to primarily cis men, no one should care about it. Right . Well, its the same conversations were having about this this total moral panic about kids transition to early, but no issues with 5000 breast in augmentations for teenage teenage girls like thats no ones worried about that no ones hesitating about that because well that appeals to sussman. So, yeah, breast augmentation, totally fine. Totally fine. Child getting your hormones, taking hormones are pretty blockers, by the way, in more cis children annually take more puberty blockers and trans children. I just want to point that out real quick. Take that back to your thanksgiving tables and let people know. You point out that the pregnancy prevention industry is 8 billion. How much of that is spent by women . 90 , 90 . And that includes 30 of condoms, women by over 30 , 7. 2 billion spent by women annually. Yeah. On pregnancy prevention and and. Right. And i mean, women are in fact, preventing millions of pregnancies a year. There are millions and millions of women that use these Birth Control products and are preventing millions of pregnancies a year, which is fantastic. Im just asking for a little help with with the rest of them. This is not even that big of a number because there are issues for with Birth Control, for lots of women, its very difficult to get. And and the more complicated your life is, the more complicated is they get Birth Control. Do you have insurance . Can you get a doctors appointment . Can you take off work to go to the appointment . Can you do you have time to set up a shipping account or stand at the pharmacy and keep that renewed each year and go up back for follow up visits . If the Birth Control youre using has side effects that you cant bear and its just on and on and im speaking from experience here, which i mean, i have six kids, so it seemed like i would know nothing about Birth Control. But i actually have tried all of the Birth Controls and i know how complicated and and that for me, i was so grateful for Birth Control. I loved being able to choose when i got to have my children that is i mean, for me, its just a blessing. I was it was wonderful. But i also hated being on Birth Control. I did not like what it did to my body. I did not like how i felt. Some women dont really film any side effects. Hallelujah. But other women do. And and the idea that we just are all expected to use that for decades, starting from age 12 for some for some well girls not even women yet. I mean, its just insanity that this is just never questioned when we could, you know, like even in couples where youre done having kids, that phase of your life is over. It should just be a given that the man gets a vasectomy. That should just be a given that. But instead i hear from women every day that i felt like they until they read the book, they couldnt even suggest a vasectomy to their husband, who they love and who loves them because well, you know, its just feels like too much to ask. And then, of course, they read the book and they sort of like have pointed out the realities of pregnancy, realities of childbirth, the realities of dealing with Birth Control and then theyre comparing that to this 15 minute procedure. And theyre going, huh, okay. Well, maybe i will ask him. And and and somebody needs some convincing. And i and i hope theres a lot of convincing in the book as well. But i just this idea, its just so ingrained. I had had all these kids done so many years of Birth Control. I didnt write this till my youngest was already nine years old. And it just really never occurred to me how much of the burden i was carrying of Birth Control. Its just is such a given and its really a heavy thing on womens shoulders. Every time we have sex, having to go through this thought process with my Birth Control work, will there be a pregnancy . What will i do if there is a pregnancy . Do i want to have a baby . Can i afford to have a baby . Does my state allow abortions . This this whole checklist that you have to go through and maybe only takes a second, but like what a burden that is. And then the instant your partner gets a vasectomy, its just gone. And so if youre in a couple and that hasnt happened yet, im just telling you, improves your sex life so much to have that burden gone, its amazing. And i highly reversible, by the way. Highly reversible and getting better. 99. 9, 9. 5 . Thats so you do have to have a good doctor go find a good a good one. But but honestly that any clinics are getting that consistently. All i hear from that is great and lets teach all the other clinics like how do we get the best techniques into the medical schools . Because that would be amazing to be able to just confidently go get a vasectomy knowing you have a 99. 5 chance of getting reversed should you ever need to. So lets recap vasectomies. 15 minutes almost with very little pain, if any. Then theres pain medication they administer athletic. Five times less expensive than articular location and far less severe than getting your tubes tied. Yeah. Can you talk about that, by the way, for anyone who doesnt know just. Yeah, i mean, so its really disturbing when you look at the stats because there are far more tubal ligation that happen in our country than than vasectomies. And thats actually true in lots of countries. And its a far more risky, a far more risky procedure. I mean, you have to cut through. Well, i should have a doctor describe, but you have to cut through your skin, through organs to get to the right place. And it just presents risk. Its much more. Pain medication. Its just far more complicated. Its minor surgery, isnt its a minor. Yeah, its a minor surgery. And and i just like its compared to all surgery. Its not the most major, but compared to a vasectomy, its much more difficult and much more risky. And that healing time is harder. Its just a more difficult thing. And we just have such a instinct to protect men from pain that we favor tubal ligation over vasectomies. You know, i say in the book, like we just do not hesitate to put women at risk to ignore their pain if it makes things more convenient for men. And thats an example of it for sure. Like any any time, a couple is thinking about tubal ligation, the doctor should be saying, whoa, whoa, have you considered a vasectomy like, its a much safer procedure. Its much easier healing times, better, less expensive, all of the things thats not happening. But it should be. Lets go back to, i dont know, two weeks before the 2016 election, because there was a news story that made international news. And i think while we were all, you know, focused on the election, it was kind of like a a weird discourse break. So the World Health Organization did a study on male Birth Control. What happened . Yeah. So so they found this the very effective male Birth Control. But there were some side effects and i dont want to downplay them. There were some serious side effects. There was some depression. One of the the participants in the trial was suicidal, just super serious. And so they cut this trial off and just shut it down. What doesnt get reported and what i tried to point out is that womens Birth Control causes far more side effects. In fact, the list, if you compare the list of the male Birth Control side effects to womens Birth Control side effects is was about a third as long. I mean, so the womens is two thirds. Im saying my math wrong. Oh, youre right. Well, this is a lot longer. Yeah. Anyway, ive and that and the side effects for womens Birth Control include depression and women failing, suicidal and far more serious things. Kidney failure and liver failure and strokes and all sorts of awful things. And yet we subscribe it, prescribe it to millions of women without hesitation. Im sure there are plenty of women in the room right now on hormonal Birth Control and have been on for decades. As i mentioned, like like this is something we dont ever really question that the we shut down the Johnson Johnson trial for the Covid Vaccine there was it because of the risks of stroke and the risk of stroke for hormonal Birth Control are far higher than they were from the Johnson Johnson vaccine. And again, we just dont ever hesitate, but also points to how important Birth Control is that women are willing to take these risks so that we have control of our reproductive lives, but also how maddening that were not willing to let men suffer. Even a tiny bit. And right. And i shouldnt say tiny, but i know, i know depression is serious. I know suicide is serious and suicidal tendencies are serious. But can we cut down that study . We do not cut it. We dont shut down womens Birth Control options because of the same side effects or try to improve them or try to improve them. We just keep giving more hormonal Birth Control options. The discourse that went back and forth when that news story broke online was just it was a mess because there were a lot of men who said, see, this is wrong. See what youre trying to do to men. And the women are like, what are you talking about . Yeah, look at everything women experience across the board from, you know, allocation to Birth Control to iuds, for gods sake. And theres really no pain medication when youre having an iud inserted or removed. And it is incredibly painful. I think it is. What is most misunderstood about womens fertility . Sorry, ovulation issues. Well, this was and this was something that was definitely new to me. As i was researching the book, i had been taught as i went off to get my first Birth Control prescription that my egg was fertile. 14 days after the first day of my last period. Thats sort of the general rule. So your period starts and 14 days later, thats your kind of ovulation date. That was that was the guideline. And if you have a regular period every four weeks, every 28 days, great. Then, then you kind of know exactly when youre populating. Except thats not true at all. And i didnt understand how untrue it was. Not only are cycles totally different for different women like, you know, some have 28 day cycles and have 30, some have totally irregular. But even for those who were like clockwork every 28 days, theyre all elation. It isnt clockwork. All elation can happen any time in a ten day window again, even if their period starts every 28 days, their ovulation is not consistent and so essentially were trying to control and predict the entire Birth Control industry is trying to control and predict this totally unpredictable thing that you cannot control. We have no is totally involuntary. We have no control over when our obligation happens and our fertility occurs and then again, you contrast that with the absolute knowledge we have of mens fertility and where and when theyre fertile and how controllable that is, which is 24 seven, 24 seven. Its always predictable if and its the while ovulation is always involuntary ejaculation is always voluntary like they they get to choose if they share, theyre very fertile material. You use a hilarious analogy to describe the difference between predictability and unpredictability and what were. So yeah, are we talking about the porch. I dont even know what the egg bag. Yeah. So i was, i use the book as a, a story. Right. I say, okay. So theres a vandal and and the vandal is leaving a bag of dog poop on your porch every day. And its just so disgusting. You wake up and some she forgets there and you step in and its so gross and stinky and you want to throw it away. You dont have to even deal with it. And theres another vandal that leaves a bag of rotten food on your porch. Once a month. Also, gross also, you dont want to deal with that. Also, stinky, but we spend all our time trying to stop the vandal. Thats happening once a month. They would try and like do everything we can to prevent this bag of of rotten food and totally ignore the daily bag of dog. Sorry. Im on the porch and its just bizarre like were just laser focused on the wrong thing. I would love for you to read the process for getting Birth Control, because that was one of the most compelling passages in the entire book. Do you remember what page that was . No, let me see if i can find it. Okay. Its so well written. Birth control for women is hard to access and hard to use. Thats on starts on page 20. So its going to be in there. Okay, lets see. Its the next page. Youre okay, got it. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you okay . Female contraception pill patch ring shot iud requires a prescription for women. This means access to any form of Birth Control starts with a doctors appointment and a physical exam. No big deal, right . Its just a doctors appointment. All you have to do is find a Health Care Provider whos taking new patients, have health insurance. Double check with the doctor. Take your insurance. Wait six weeks for the next available appointment. Come up with money for the copay. Take off work, missed school or find childcare to attend the appointment and then lay on the exam table with your legs and stirrups. While the doctor explores your most sensitive parts with cold metal medical tools. After that, youll need to find a pharmacy and stand in line for 45 minutes to fill your prescription. Or if youre lucky enough to have a fixed address, you could set up an account with an Online Pharmacy and have the Birth Control delivered. But be sure to monitor your account to make sure deliveries are happening on time and the prescription is up to date. If the Birth Control the doctor prescribed isnt working for you, youll need to make additional appointments to discuss other options or work out the kinks. And depending on what type of Birth Control method you decide on, there could be follow up appointments to have an iud inserted or to get a quarterly shot. If a Birth Control method is working well for you, you still need to repeat this doctor appointment process. At least once a year in order to keep the prescription current. And if youre on the pill, the patch or the ring, youll need to monitor your Online Pharmacy account and update it with your new prescription or go to the pharmacy regularly to fill your prescription. Oh, dont forget, if you move to a new city at any point, youll have to begin the process all over again, starting with a search for a new doctor. Versus a 15 minute outpatient appointment. Right. Or a condom for a couple of minutes, like its just the contrast is so insane. And i do want to be really clear. I dont want you to stop using Birth Control. Its just Birth Control. I mean, i really do. And i try i try to make this clear in the book, too. Im asking people to be responsible for their own bodies. Women are really trying hard to take responsibility for their own bodies. Thats why we have an 8 billion, you know, Birth Control industry that women are funding. And im asking men to also take care and responsibility for their own bodies instead of assuming women will do the work for them. And any time a man assumes that woman will provide a condom or bring up the condom, he is expecting her to take responsibility for her body and for his body. Yes. Whats dove more into that dealt more into that, because, you know, you did make a really great point like the women are not only expected to take care of their own body, its expected to take care of mens bodies. 30 , the condom spot in this country are bought by says women. Yeah, right. Yeah. So clearly there is a complete asymmetric, you know, framework of responsibility here. And yet men who what pride themselves in person, responsible loyalty and being the man of the house and allows and taking care of things. Yeah. Cant even buy a condom at the 7eleven down the street right. And you can store them i think are the last four years like you how you can be prepared. It is bizarre so of course i have a sort of quiz for men in the book. And theres no you know, theres no answer guide. Its that you im not going to grade im not going to. Great your score our grade, your results. But the idea is really just to point out this imbalance that happens this and its a really a power imbalance where women feel pressured. Thank you. Women feel pressured to not bring up a condom, to not ask for a condom. There is always some worry if its the first time with this, you know, depending on how well they know this partner, what kind of reaction theyre going to get if they bring up a condom, will there be anger or even violence like it can be pretty scary to bring this stuff up. And then, of course, for men, the attitude seems to be, well, im not going to bring it up if she doesnt, if she doesnt bring it up, im going to assume shes doing something. Shes shes taking care of the pregnancy prevention in some other way. And i dont need to worry about it. And thats just super, super backwards. Its and its something we teach men. Im not even really angry at men about it because we teach women to do it with each man to do like we teach the culture, teaches everyone. This is how it works. And in fact, theres almost seems be like a culture of conquest that if a man can talk a woman into having sex without a condom, hes accomplish something that somehow hes more manly by doing so. And its just so backwards. Of course. And the idea should be he would you know, he would never put his partner at risk. He would never put his own body at risk. Hes safer by using a condom anyway. So the quiz is really just to give this sense of and i can read you a couple of questions. Please do. Theyre great. Theyre great questions. Before sex, have you ever avoided bringing up condoms or Birth Control and waited for your partner to Say Something . Have you ever hinted to your partner or outright told her that sex feels better without a condom . Have you ever assumed your partner will have condoms or will otherwise be taking care of Birth Control . Have you ever thought, well, if she just if she gets pregnant, she can just get an abortion or go buy the morning after pill . Have you ever bargained with your partner that you wont wear a condom but you promise to pull out . Have you ever promise to pull out and didnt be aware . Thats assault anyway. It goes on. Thank you for having that and in its great you know and these arent condemnatory theyre just really good questions that every man who has sex with someone with a uterus should be asking themselves. Personal responsibility. Can you talk about the relationship of the Catholic Church to Birth Control . Yeah, its its typically the pope. Yeah. This was new to me as well in the research for the book. So when the pill was being developed, i dont know if youve ever seen a pill pack and if everyone in the audience has, but its got four little rows of seven pills and three of the rows have an active drug. And the fourth row is just placebos. Its just sugar pills. And the reason theyre there is because when they were developing the drug, they were hoping to convince the pope that it really wasnt Birth Control. It was just like the women were still having a period because sorry, im skipping over parts. Basically that those sugar pills, they induce bleeding are really what happens. You stop taking the drug and that induces bleeding. It seems like a period its not a period. Your uterine lining. Your uterine lining isnt building up and doesnt need to shed. Its just this breakthrough bleeding from stopping, taking the medication. But they purposely introduce those sugar pills so that it would look like a period so they could go to the pope and say, no, look, its this isnt really a Birth Control. Shes still having a period. This is this is her body is still doing what is usually doing. And it did not convince the pope, but we still do this thing. Women still have this period while using the pill that they dont have to have. And it actually causes a lot of problems because if it just causes more mistakes to be made in taking the pill, and if youre not taking the pill consistently, then it can be ineffective. So its just this one more layer of. Man making this more complicated for women and having influence over this thing that they really shouldnt have influence over. Anyway, its fascinating to me how pervasive this is. So like, i didnt know that ive taken the pill, how many, how many years of my life and. So and those placebo pills are there for the pope . They werent there for me. This is the 23rd point at a 28 sorry. There are zero consequences for men who ejaculate irresponsibly. There are zero consequences for men who ejaculate irresponsibly, expand, please. Its a good point. So theyre just weve really dont we have no policies in place for irresponsible ejaculation. We have no procedures. We have no we just we dont theres nothing that happens to a man if he decides not to use a condom when he has when he has sex, if he causes a pregnancy and the woman decides to have the baby and she decides to take him, the court for child support, perhaps hell decide to pay it, although lots of men dont. But the actual irresponsible ejaculation, theres, theres just nothing in there. Theres no consequence. We have nothing in place that waiting for that man from who like to ejaculate responsibly from continuing to do so. We dont teach them not to we dont teach them why its important and we dont teach women. Its either and we have again, theres consequences. And i dont know what the consequences should be. And that would be something wed all have to come together and discuss and figure out whats, at the minimum, stepping on a ton of legos, what guy goes barefoot that feels good, that feels appropriate. I dont know what that should be, but the reality that there really is nothing. We just have to like hope for the goodwill of men is really kind of insanity that this is this is how weve set up the system. We have a few minutes left. Someone asks one more question, then id take an audience question that we got from someone online. And folks, if you want to start gathering at the mic to ask your question, were about to open that here pretty soon. Mikes right there and right there, well take three or four questions. Theres a really, really good point that you talk about, and i do feel we need to spend some time on it. The issue of violence and the expectation of women to hold men accountable or to cover for mens irresponsibility at the risk of violence, to themselves. Could you talk about that . I mean, its not very fun to talk about. Yeah. Like its this conversation where you might suggest a whats a better way to say it . A lots of people that want to argue with me about about this, usually on twitter, usually they get to the second tweet and it says, men cause all pregnancies and they cant get past that. They start arguing and theyll say, why isnt she just a to use a condom and refuse to have sex otherwise . And of course, thats an example of her being responsible for her own body and has but beyond that, that is really easy to say and much harder to to do in practice. It depends on how well she knows this person. It depends on does she have condoms stocked . Are they condoms that he would wear that would fit him that he likes, you know, like this. So theres all that kind of, you know, just the practicalities of it, but also, is he going to respond with violence if she suggests this little thing and we dont know. There is no list of men who are like these are the good guys and these are not the good guys. And lots of people will suggest that, well, women just need to be more discerning in who theyre having sex with and like, thats just like, what are you supposed to say to that . Like, with what rubric . Right. Like, theres no way to know the when the violence is going to appear or the reaction that someones going to have or whats going to trigger them. Theres really no way to know. And and it can be really scary. And so then youre in this place like, okay, am i going to get where am i sleeping tonight . Am i safe here . Like, if i if i say no, i mean, if i say, hey, i wont have sex without a condom, am i actually safe in this space to say that . And you dont know. So youre taking this risk and it can be really scary. And i mean, i was at the apple store yesterday in new york. I had to get a screen cover and i had my jacket. They responsibly tote representing and the said the woman helping me was asking me about it. I said, oh, im on a book tour. It was all happy and positive and i was talking about whats it about . Like men . Cause all my pregnancies and she gets it immediately and. And then she proceeds to tell me how the night before that her partner had refused to use a condom and. Then shed spent the morning at the hospital and the Police Station because she had not consented to sex without a condom and thing. Yeah, its just the reality for so many people. I mean, anyway, its terrific. And she wasnt getting beat up, but this is still violence. Yes, she he she did not consent to to sex without condom. And he forced that on her. And thats thats a rape. Its right there. Yes. Theres no other word for it and. Absolutely. And its happens all the time. Absolutely. But the expectation of using a sex without a card or expectation of sex with a condom and then the man doesnt use a condom and doesnt say anything about it. Its called style thing. For those who dont know. And thats pretty, pretty horrific. Okay. One question that is way better than i was going to phrase that comes from brandy of chantilly, virginia, who submitted the sex. And i she shes shes also a mormon, the mother. She has five kids. And she essentially asks how do you navigate these conversations with your kids . Do you ask them to read the book . Do you talked about the book . I mean, yeah, we do. So we have totally read the book as a family. I have teenagers, so that works for us. I mean, the youngest is 12. Shes not quite there, but when youre the youngest of six, you end up in lots of older kid conversations. But it really is written in a way that you can read it with your kids, that its again, not sexy. Its very approachable and not academic. I really i would have my has been read the chapters aloud and id be this is as i was writing it and id be listening for anything that start getting to. Word your academic. If i got to cut that got to simplify i really try to make it accessible and teens really do respond well to it. I had this amazing story happened last week where i heard from a teacher in new jersey and she said, youve got to see this video of our School Board Meeting where these students are fighting for your book. And apparently they had organized Reading Group for students, student led, student organized, and they wanted to discuss this book. And then parents had donated books for the group, but the school board wouldnt accept the donation. Just saw the title, assumed that they did not want to approve it. So these teens go to the School Board Meeting and fight for this book and theyre im its on youtube. Its amazing. I put it in my newsletter for want to see it but its theyre so eloquent. Theyre so passionate. They get it. Theyre not threatened by the language they understand it and they get the approval, which was amazing. But just to say the teens are they understand it and theyre not bothered by the title at all. That is not stressful to them. The other thing i would say is as a parent, one thing thats worked really well in our family is use the headlines that are happening to start whatever conversations you need to have, meaning, whatever youre seeing, wherever you get your news on on the news app or on twitter or on you know, facebook or wherever you like to get your news, whatever youre seeing, your kids are also seeing and theyre seeing it maybe on tiktok, but theyre seeing the same headlines. This stuff goes viral everywhere. And so theres basically its just a great excuse and youre at the dinner table or youre hanging out and youre saying you can say, oh, did you see this story or do you see this headline, this athlete that did something or this maybe it was a School Shooting or whatever it was. They know about it too. And you can use this use it to have these conversations. It can feel uncomfortable to be like sit them down, like were going to talk about sex that can make everyone stressed out. But if youre talking about it in the context of like, this is just whats happening in the world, this just a news story, its much less threatening. And they i, i think its also just this good reminder that yeah, we know as parents we also know whats going on. Like, you know, were seeing the same news stories theyre saying. And its also a chance to maybe correct anything theyre saying because maybe theyre getting their education from someone who is spouting misinformation on on twitch or on tik tok or whatever might be. And so it gives you a chance to say actually that isnt true. Lets read this other article. But any way as a parent using whats in the news to talk about stuff is great because it doesnt feel like your forcing a lecture. Its just like, this is what everyones talking about because this is whats gone viral today. Were in a war on disinformation right now affects every facet. I have a really good friend here. Her name is allie langford, and she cowrote a book with at least hope. The former president of all prochoice america, about the history of disinformation and how its been weaponized by the far right on social issues, specifically on reproductive access. And ive been thinking about this because i love this generation. I mean, gen z and younger are just theyre theyre better informed, theyre smarter. The more empathetic, all the things. But every now and then, you know, ill Say Something that really concerns me. And there was that there was a tiktok video that went viral, i think, last year of this young man who was under the impression that women dont actually have a hole peeing. Oh, and yeah, its like these are things that are very easily solved by just talking to your kids and offering some context or just just basic sex ed, right. You know. Right. Okay. Well, what about to end on . Lets do q a. Please come up and offer some questions starting over here. God. Thank you so much for being here and for your book and for injecting really great new arguments into this discourse. We keep having to have. You know, im interested to hear, you know, the question kind of came up about kids but really talking through with, you know, these religious communities and others where, you know, even more prevalently, women have been taught to prioritize mens feelings and needs over their own. And i know youre really adept at tackling these arguments, but, you know, how do we keep that message out there . How do we reach those types of folks to, you know, get this health care message and this prioritization of everyones responsible for themselves out there . Right. Of course. I want to see things happening at at a systematic level where were seeing politicians talk about it and legislation happening related to it and that were seeing nationwide sex ed. And of course, i want to see that. And we can organize to make that happen and we can lobby to make that happen. Thats how these changes are made. In the meantime, person to person, individual conversations really works. Im ive used this example before, but its so illustrative. I for me at least, i grew up without seatbelts. No one wore seatbelts. I was from a big family. We drove a volkswagen bus and it was just like tumble around. I dont know. It was just like free for all. And then when i was 16, getting my drivers license, my state started to introduce seatbelt laws. And this was happening, you know, state by state. And i remember distinctly going like, whos going to ever wear a seatbelt . Like, no way. Of course, of course. Thats so dumb. And, i dont know, nerdy. I dont know what i thought it was. But then some kids, like some cool kids, came from the big city for spring break and we had this like spring break town and you would go drive the boulevard that was like what you did and so were going to go joyriding with these cool from the big city and they would not start the car till we all put our seatbelts and i have an instant, you know, 180 shift where im like, oh, seatbelts are cool. Oc i didnt, i didnt know, i didnt get the memo and obviously just total teen peer pressure but thats how i think a lot of seatbelt wearers became seatbelt wearers is someone that they respected back. In 1990 or whenever i was, i was getting my drivers license, wore a seatbelt and told them like, of course im going to wear a seatbelt. Like, thats ridiculous. Not to wear a seatbelt. And now i get my car. I never have to think about am i going to wear a seatbelt and we want responsible ejaculation to be the same thing we wanted to be like. I would never even consider ejaculating irresponsibly. Like what . What like who would ever do that. So some of these conversations can just happen person to person and that is so effective and again, i really need men to help with these conversations. But thats not as satisfying. I know. Doing it one, one, one on one and then beyond that, like i really feel this book is a tool. It, it really is helpful. I havent had anyone thats actually read the book and then is like mad and angry about it. Wants to argue because like, where are you going to go . Men should ejaculate irresponsibly, like, you know, like theres theres theres nothing to say. So i, i really do think, like getting this book out there and these are the ideas in the book as much as possible. You would be shocked how often i am sent a tick tock from people sharing these ideas. Maybe they dont even that came from the book or the thread. They just get starting to get passed around. You see them in posters, at marches. Youre starting to see this get disseminated. We just need more of it. I want this book in every orientation package for every college freshman, you know. Yes. If you pledge a frat, you have to read this book right. I want, you know, High School Coaches making sure that their students are reading it. And i really just want. Yeah. As many people talking about it. And when a politician wants to grandstand at abortion, like the first question is, whats your plan for irresponsible ejaculations like it was . Just tell me, show me your legislative plan. There and you know, make them shift the conversation away from womens bodies and to mens responsibility. Hello. Hi. My name is rose and i have a husband and two teenage sons and i will be. They dont know it yet. Well be discussing this this weekend. And i really just want to thank you for your book and for this discussion. My question is around the Condom Companies and condom manufacturers. It seems like have we tried to partner with them in this message at all . Because you would think itd be very lucrative for them. Right. Right. We did as we my my publicity team, my book team did send out awesome ejaculate responsibly condoms to, a lot of influencers, but no, but some of them. You know what i want to see from Condom Companies is like a starter pack put in every type of condom, put in every type of of of lube. And maybe its not even i mean, you need condoms from lots of different companies. So maybe this is like walgreens is selling the starter pack and it has all the different brands. But like that should just be a known thing so you dont have to buy a box of, of 30 of every kind of condom and you really can just try them all and. That becomes a very normal thing. Like, oh, are you starting to have sex . You need a condom starter pack, you got to figure out what kind you like to use and so i think i think pairing with condom partners would be amazing. Im all for it if you know any, let me know. Hi, gabrielle. So glad youre here. My name is alex. Im a fellow byu alum. You trained in the design department, also practicing member of the church of jesus christ of latter day saints, mormon church. I am so passionate about this topic, but of course, as you know, the word a ejaculate and or abortion can be a trigger word within conservative religious communities. Im curious as to how youve educated people about this within, you know, conservative christian communities, not just christian, but those that prohibit premarital sex. One, how thats going and how you would suggest going about educating in a way thats not going to turn people off. Right . Right. So i love the i think the most effective conversations ive had and im often having them online. So im saying, you know, more than one on one, im often having like these internet discussions on instagram or on twitter or on my blog. Its the most effective things i showed some data that abortions go down under democrats, under democratic leadership, and that blew their minds for a minute. And then i said, well, lets talk about why that is. And we started talking about free and easily accessible Birth Control and what that looks like and programs that have worked. Colorado had a really, really successful one. When i say if youre if your concern is abortion and you dont want to see abortions, then you really need to focus on preventing unwanted pregnancies. By the time the woman is walking into the abortion clinic, its too late, like you missed your window. There. You if you want it, if you want to stop an abortion, you need to not ever have the pregnancy happen in the first place. And and say thats good news. Thats good news because we know how prevent pregnancy like this we we know this one like we got the answer and be able to show them the data on that are as you know mormons are fine with Birth Control. We have no issues with like thats not a thing for us. I know some religions do, but luckily it is one of the only non weird things about mormons and and so so when youre thinking of like people in your congregation, you can talk about Birth Control and how having easily accessible Birth Control is as a huge factor. And that really helped and so then youre saying, hey, when youre thinking about this politically, if you are interested in stopping abortion again, focus on Birth Control programs, focus on easily accessible, easily and free. Sorry, easily accessible and free Birth Control programs. And i had a lot of great reaction from that because they felt like it was something they could do and put energy toward. That wasnt just like yelling at women, which they know isnt effective, you know, like isnt was wasnt helping anyone. And so that has been really good. Its just really walking them through what works. And sex ed is a little harder and they dont want to talk about sex ed. But again, if you can say, hey, this is were talking about age appropriate sex ed, were not trying to talk about to kids about things they dont even know about yet like that they but also kids arent embarrassed of the stuff they dont know to be. Its they can see their parents are embarrassed and then theyre like, whats happening here is their parents are like blushing non stop trying to talk about this with them. So thats a parents issue. Like you got to get over that and and i think some of that is like, hey, if you want to be a good parent, you need to do this. I have had really sweet, kind of heartbreaking letters from teens, mormon teens heading off to byu saying, i didnt really get sex ed. What do i need to know . And ill write a blog post like, here we go. And theyre people that like love their parents are like, my parents are great, theyre like, cool, but they just didnt talk to me about this. And, and parents, we need to really talk to other parents that are hesitant, say, hey, this is part of being a good parent. Its really irresponsible to let your kids go off without giving them proper knowledge and whether theyre going to have sex before marriage or after, they need to know this information. And this is its not a again, its theres no Everyone Needs to know how to prevent pregnancy and whatever stage of of Sexual Activity theyre in a anyway so if you can position in a this is you being a responsible parent they want to be good parents and so sometimes its easier for them to get on board with like, oh, i got to do better sex ed, thank you so much. Appreciate it. And lets thank you for being here and being in washington, d. C. And i have a washington, d. C. Related question. Has your publisher sent your book to every member of sort of every aisle to frame for yes or no . My publisher has not, but i did. Its a really campaigns and theyre still ongoing. You can go look at them. I am selecting the numbers where i asked my Instagram Community and my Blogging Community to send books to that Supreme Court justices to every governor and to every senator. And i have maps tracking. I have google docs where i can go in a report. I send it to this governor. I send it to the senator. And then i have maps where i fill in the states when theyve been sent. And i also have a little tracker with illustrations, all the Supreme Court justices and how many books theyve been sent. Amy Coney Barrett has been sent 25 copies. Its amazing. Do you think do you think she uses Birth Control . Say again. Do you think she uses Birth Control . I mean, yeah, thats a good question. Like like like who knows . Yeah. Yeah, maybe natural family planning. I dont know. Because you put you put it in your book about, what, 90 of religious affiliated women use birth. Yeah. I mean, most women do practice Birth Control, even even people you assume that dont. Yeah, i think it question to that is you are in washington and there are hearings all the time. Yeah. Have you ever been invited or can we try to get you invited to a hearing . I would love to hearing. I want to. Yeah. I mean, would love to. I would love to like read my thread into the congressional record. I mean, like, yes, yes, please. Okay. Yeah, we can all work on that. There must be somebody here who works in congress. I can just one of the prochoice elected officials i was at event last night in new york. This is my first stop on this whole tour. And a woman from washington d. C. Was there. She works here, but she happened to be in new york anyway. But she said, i want you to get it in front of aoc and charles booker. She feels like they would really get the arguments and be willing to talk about them. Im like, hook me up. Yes im im in favor. So, yeah, i, i am very in favor of any of that. And i have readers who have volunteered or you know, instagrammed the entry and said i want to send them to all of congress. You know, people are willing to do this. I dont know how to facilitate that, but i would love help. I would love that. I would love help with that, too. It and we have time for one more question. My name is tara and i have kind of a comment sasha, not really totally formulated questions. So first of all, i have a 17 year old daughter and when i who has a boyfriend and when i got this book and this is just and im anecdote i said on on our island and she came and she started perusing it and it made a difference he the conversation automatically to wait what you had to take the pill every day. Wait wait what like all of these things that i know that i was taught in sex ed, who knows what the boys were taught . You know . And so it makes a you are making a difference. And i am i am so grateful for that. And if my kids didnt have lacrosse, they would have here. And so theres theres that. But also a junior in high school, a daughter who were looking at colleges and the comment that you made about putting this in in orientation pack nation the thought came to me of how how related this is with Sexual Assault and and what can we do i mean its the same entitlement that drives both of them. And so, like i, i feel powerless as a mom whos going to i feel like im sending my kid out to the wolves and who knows what could happen to her and. I just i want i think all of us here want that systemic change. But how can we and this is completely not having anything to do directly with your book. But im if you have any thoughts of how we can integrate this message, how we can how we can help people and and our daughters, our sons think of others when it comes to reproductive rights and and just the rights that women have to go somewhere and to be safe. Right . Yeah. I mean its so scary sending them out there and i, i, ive done this with three of my kids so far and its a lot. Ive got a senior in high school as well. And so i feel it. I mean, i dont have i of course i would have like this is what you do and then your kids will be safe. I dont have that. I do know like in the same way that this boyfriend was impacted by the book, that these conversations really do work. I, i theres a section in the book that where i say are dangerous and. I, i know thats a little hyperbole, but also not like cause pregnancy, pregnancy can cause all sorts of complications and death. Its dangerous and if once people internalize that and i specifically think you have young men here, they seem to get it . Oh, i have this i dont want to hurt this. They love your daughter. Know, they they dont want to hurt this person. And theyre going to be much more careful with their and and thats what we want. Thats great. I think we had to go with this baseline because i cant get through the world otherwise of people are good and want to be good like, were going to try that for the baseline and and again, i have had no one that reads the book and then tries to say no, this is wrong. I mean, they get it. And so its really teaching them because theyve been taught something else. Theyve been taught to the conquest. Theyve been taught they shouldnt have to use condoms. And even if no one outright taught them again, i was taught i knew nothing about sex, but i knew men dont like condoms. So theyve been taught the same things. So weve got to reteach. Teach your daughters, teach your sons. They all need to learn it. And we hope theyre educating each other, too. As they head off to school. Theyre educating their roommates theyre talking about this with everyone. But make it. No, mike is dangerous. And if youre out throwing your around, youre at a you know, like youre a menace. And people are going to like youre going to get you know, people are going to avoid you, you know, the bad rap or whatever. Like, i mean, i dont know if we need to put in a little social shaming, like, oh, no, no, no, hes irresponsible ejaculate or like steer clear. Yeah. But i mean like and also, i think you can again make it as i mean, be so straightforward about it. They it becomes humorous, but like in a good way where theyre like, okay, we get it. But i do think they theyre affected by it. They they im thinking of these men. They dont want to be jerks. They dont want to be bad guys. If someone points to them, hey, you could really hurt this person with your , hes going to think twice about what hes doing with his. Obviously, there are exceptions. Theyre jerks in the world. I know this, but in general, thats not going be true. And we hope that we hope that the more people think about this and the more, again, it becomes socially unacceptable to ejaculate irresponsibly, that while all of our lives improve improve. Ladies and gentlemen, nonbinary pals Gabrielle Blair, who