Chat box is a reminder that when we come together to learn with reason, we can indeed appeal to the better angels and Grow Together in wisdom. Im so grateful to all of you for having spread so much historical and constitutional light. On behalf of the National Constitution center, youthank y so much for a wonderful discussion. See you on june 30th for the battle of the constitution and the future of policing. Thanks to all. Have a good night. Thank you so much. Youre watching American History tv. Every weekend on cspan3, explore our nations past. Cspan3, created by americas Cable Television companies as a Public Service and brought to you today by your television provider. Were featuring American History tv programs as a preview of whats available every weekend on cspan3. Tonight a look at programs from the Kansas City Public Library in kansas city, missouri. We begin with a talk about the life of Millicent Patrick. Mali omeara will discuss her book life of hollywood artist Millicent Patrick and watch American History tv this weekend and every weekend on cspan3. Cspan has unfiltered coverage of congress, the white house, the Supreme Court and Public Policy events. You can watch all of cspans Public Affairs programming on television, online or listen on our free radio app and be part of the National Conversation through cspans daily Washington Journal Program or through our social media feeds. Cspan, created by americas Cable Television companies as a Public Service and brought to you today by your television provider. Welcome back to at home with the roosevelts. Im paul sparrow. Im joined today by the director of the Herbert Hoover president ial library and museum. Im tom schwartz. We are here today to talk about one of the most remarkable transitions in American History, the president ial election of 1932 and hoover and roosevelt, their long relationship of prior to and after their presidencies. This was a period of incredible trauma for the United States with the great depression. Of course the two of them had known each other for quite some time during world war i, Franklin Roosevelt was the assistant secretary of navy under woodrow wilson. And Herbert Hoover was the head of the u. S. Food administration, the Food Administration had to essentially provide food to the soldiers going to europe and hoover was able to provide the necessary food by getting americans to voluntary reduce consumption by 15 and he did this by appealing to american housewives to sign pledge cards where they would hooverize. Hooverize meant every day of the week, you gave up a certain essential component, meat, wheat, sugar, fats. And so you had meatless mondays and wheatless wednesdays. Hoover was able to use that as a stopgap before the farmers could increase their production and growing the necessary foodstuffs that the war required. Fdr was a big fan of hoover during this period. He was impressed with the work he had done. They were both in the same administration, Franklin Roosevelt was trying to convince Herbert Hoover to become a democrat and there was some sense of, maybe we can get him as part of our party. But Herbert Hoover had other ideas. Can you talk about why he decided to become a republican. He grew up in a Quaker Community which had supported lincoln because of their abolition sentiments. John brown visited west branch. And hoover actually had registered as a republican but because he had lived abroad for most of his adult life with his mining career, people didnt know his political affiliation. And so he had to write to roosevelt to indicate, you know, that he was his tribe was the republican tribe and he considered himself theodore roosevelt, a progressive republican. The 1920 president ial race, Franklin Roosevelt was the Vice President ial candidate on the democratic side and the democrats lots and harding became president. Hoover became an important part of both the harding and the coolidge administrations while fdr ended up getting polio and disappearing for many years. During that period, he was secretary of commerce and actually was quite big on government regulation. Talk about his role as commerce secretary and how it influenced his later political philosophies. He transformed kind of a sleepy Government Agency into a real powerhouse. Standardization was one of his main achievements and where he got industries to set industrial standards which he believed would lower the cost of goods to consumers. Many of the things we take for granted today, the size lumbar, the thread count on nuts and bolts, the size brick used in construction the size of tires. Thats right. Probably the greatest example, 42 different sized milk containers, and he got it down to pint, quart, half gallon and gallon. Hoover was a very aggressive secretary of commerce and he took that agency and really made it one that was very meaningful to a majority of americans. 1928 is the year where roosevelts political career and hoovers political career really come into parallel. In the 1928 president ial election hoover is the republican candidate, smith is the democratic candidate who is a friend of roosevelts. And roosevelt runs for governor of new york. His return to politics after his isolation as he tried to recover from polio. And of course were still in the roaring 20s now. The economy is doing great. And as soon as he becomes president he has a certain set of agendas in mind. What was it like during the Hoover Administration at that point where in october of 1929, eight months into the administration, stock market collapses. Hoover was very much aware that there were certain systemic problems with the economy, even before the market crashed. Agriculture produced too much which depressed prices. It had its own depression throughout the 20s. 25 of the banks failed before the crash. It was a condition of too many banks with too few capital assets. When the market crashed people need to realize, only 10 of americans actually owned stock. However, banks were heavily invested in the market, over 90 of the banks had stock. And so the crash really impacted already one of the main institutions for liquidity that made the loans that kept the economy alive. And so hoover immediately calls industrial heads and leaders together on november 19th and gets them to agree to voluntarily continue to maintain full staff levels, to keep pay at the same level in order to keep liquidity in the economy, the Federal Reserve helps out a little bit. It reduces the prime rate by, you know, half a point. But its still incredibly high for the needs. And so most economists claim that what took what should have been a normal kind of downturn in the economy, a depression into the great depression, was that, again, the fed did not early enough and at the level required, infuse the economy with enough liquidity and capital. However, by 1930 Economic Indicators started to point up and then of course there were other things that happened abroad. Take the depression into the great depression. The irony is that typically when we refer to economic downturns, they refer to as panic and hoover wanted to avoid that language. Hes the one who embraced the term depression. Some of the things that hoover did really exacerbated it. His implementation of the tariffs really created chaos and made the such much, much worse and the division between the way roosevelt responded in new york state, he believed that government should be directly involved in helping Unemployed People and hoover was opposed to that and roosevelt strongly believed that you had to have this massive Government Investment in creating jobs and creating opportunities and hoover was pretty insistent that the federal government not go down that path. The divergence that happens later on because clear later on. By 1931, its clear they had different ideas on how to approach the crisis. When they started the campaign, hoover and his advisers hoped that roosevelt would be the candidate that they would run against because they thought he was a weak candidate. Hoover even was not interested in campaigning. And it was only when he saw that there wasnt this ground swell of support for him that he reluctantly got out on the campaign trail. By the end, it almost did him in. The demands of the crises every day wore him physically, mentally. He did give, though, an important speech at Madison Square garden in late october right before the voting and this i think is what is significant. He indicated that the 1932 contest really wasnt about personalities but it was about two different philosophies of government. And hoover had always maintained he was the supporter of small government even though what weve been talking about, he wasnt afraid to use government to advance what he thought was important programs to protect the public interests. I think what hoover objected to was, he was a 19th century liberal and that he believed that protection of individual freedom and liberty was really the main function of government. And as he liked to quote, that the purpose of government to remove obstacles from the individual to provide an open and fair chance to everyone to be able to achieve whatever their talents and ambitions take them. This idea of the right to rise. Hoover wanted to use the power of government to help big business. He didnt want to use the power of the government to help the american people. That was the biggest difference. And i think when roosevelt comes out in the Democratic Convention in 1932 with his concept of a new deal for the american people, what he was really saying is he wants to shift that role that the federal government has and the federal government should have a role in helping individual people and of course he towards the end of the campaign laid out he did eight speeches laying out specific policies for Bank Regulations and farm mortgages and home mortgages. A specific set of ideas. But the new deal itself was a different framework, how do you approach solving these problems . Do you approach them that government can help or do you think that government needs to stay out of the way . And hoover got very, very hostile and very nasty on what he called fdr fascist, the socialist, he claimed it would be the end of america as we know it if roosevelt was elected. It became a very, very personal and nasty campaign. It did. I think its a mischaracterization to say that hoover was only a friend of big business. In the 20s he practiced where they worked to create the voluntary codes. And hoover wanted things done in a voluntary way. It wasnt that he wasnt interested in labor, he wasnt interested in the common man, he was. And i think clearly his humanitarian efforts are evidence of that. Hoover had to deal with kind of the logical extension of some of the ideas he began, the progressivism, and so he ends developing this conservative philosophy which is constantly warning against the dangers of big government. The election itself was pretty one sided. Fdr won with a large majority and then you into this one of the strangest periods in American History. Roosevelts first terms starts on march 4th. The congress, of course, changed over in january. You had this period where hoover is still president and hes trying to convince roosevelt to give up on his new deal plans and to stick with hoovers plans and roosevelt is trying to negotiate with him during this period and a number of Bank Closures continues to increase, the countries crisis gets worse and worse, congress is sort of paralyzed and hoover has no respect for roosevelt during this period. In their meetings, hoover treats him like an idiot. You may have a different take on that period, but its one of the most contentious transitions in American History. Yeah, i think hoover had Unrealistic Expectations about there being a cooperative and joint position on dealing with the crises. Roosevelt from strictly a political standpoint, even if he agreed with some of the things that hoover wanted to get done, no reason to expose himself and tie himself to someone who had just lost in a very big way, you know, and hoover sends a tenpage memo talking about the crisis to roosevelt, he writes 11 days before he even responds. I think people and he also misspelled roosevelts name on the envelope. It gets down into kind of these petty slights that get blown up and roosevelt, of course, when he becomes president its an incredible period of legislative accomplishment, the first 100 days. But, again, it was a unique period. He had this overwhelming majority in congress. He could get that legislation done. He never was given that same ability in any of his reelections. And so the 100 days really is a very unique, historic moment and i dont think that youll see any president soon to be able to match it. I dont think youll every see it again, partly, because they had this long, fourmonth period to prepare for the first 100 days and had these huge majorities in houses of congress and an American Public which was demanding action and action now which he says in his inaugural address. Theres a famous photograph of roosevelt and hoover in the back of the car in the way of the inauguration and it sums up everything that can be said about their relationship. The story is that they get in the car, roosevelt is trying to have small talk with hoover and roosevelt was, you know, famous for his charming personality and his ability to engage with people and hoover is equally famous for his nature and hoover doesnt respond at all. At a certain point, roosevelt turns his attention to the crowd and waves to the crowd and hoover sits there with that mug on his face. And its the last time they ever see each other. Its a great cover of the new yorker that was never ran which kind of sums it up perfectly. And hoover has this scowl and roosevelt has his usual smile. Their personalities were night and day. Hoover felt he didnt need to communicate what he was doing to the American Public that the results of what he was doing would speak volumes. Either be successful or he would not be. And whereas roosevelt was really understood. Youve got to communicate. He was a wonderful communicator in fireside chats. He had some great speech writers. He had a playwright Robert Sherwood and others to help him. But he also had a natural ability. He was a glad hander. And thats a difference. Roosevelt grew up understanding the levers of politics and the needs of the voting public. Hoover had always been outside of politics. When he became the president , that was the first time he had ever held elective office. He spent the rest of his life trying to convince people that he was right and roosevelt was wrong. Hoover, you know, wrote a book in 34 called the challenge to liberty. It was really a screed against the new deal. He wrote a major attack on fdrs Foreign Policy which was never established until maybe about five years ago edited by george nash called freedom betrayed. You can see theres a theme here of freedom, liberty. And its not that hoover hasnt made arguments that other historians have in criticizing roosevelts Foreign Policy. Its that no one can gain say roosevelts leadership during the second world war. I think the war had more than necessarily the new deal, which was kind of rocky and never really got america out of the depression, shows his leadership at its finest and saving democracy not only in america but in europe. Thats one of the things that i find most confusing about hoover when you read about him. His life is really very much that of based on a set of principles both in terms of his extraordinary intellect. Even though he saw the terrible suffering during world war i, in that period in the mid 1930s, he supports hitler. He is supporting the nazi regime and one of his criticisms of roosevelt was that roosevelt was so had antipathy towards them. Why did he take that point of view . This was the least free, the most repressive society in the world. Repressive society in the world. So hoover had been over in europe to visit poland. He was very important, and in feeding polls afters he won and asked by the American Ambassador if he would come to germany to have that audience with hitler. Hoover didnt seek it. In notes he made, in memorandum afterwards, he indicated that American Media which made hoover, or hitler out to be a clown, couldnt be more wrong. That hitler meant what he said and what he said was sheer evil. He thought that the germans and the russians would be involved in this very prolonged and kind of bloodletting which would protect western interests. Similar to what a long time happened in iraq and iran. It its a rather cynical view, but hoover thought that america should become fortress america, and you know, let them, the nazis and the soviets fight it out. It really isnt until pearl harbor hoover finally comes onboard supporting the American Military effort, and he is fairly supportive of roosevelt during the war, i think at that point. He didnt have too many options but i do think its interesting that, that americafirst group, lindbergh and taft and others who had this idea, William Randolph hearst and idea america could stay out of this war and fight it out over there, hoover was very much in that camp, whereas roosevelt was much more we need to support western democracy, need to be partners. The neutrality act, of course, handcuffs, roosevelt would have gone much further if he could have. Didnt break the law, came as close to breaking it as you can, the way he did this deal and all that sort of stuff. Most of which herbert opposed. An interesting post script to the war. After, of course, roosevelt dies, hoover had not visited the white house for whatever number of years it was, 12 years at that point but had a different role with fdrs successor. Want to talk about that . Throughout roosevelts administration a number of advisers, specifically some of the conservative democrats like gerard baruch, and roosevelt exploded im not jesus christ and not going to raise hoover from the grave. When he dies, harry truman reaches out to him and asks him for a meeting, and sends the 71yearold man on a factfinding mission, global factfinding mission, on postwar food and humanitarian needs. Its used by George Marshall in formulating the marshall plan. And so hoover under truman, i think, gets rehabilitated. Hes brought back into service and, you know, in fairness, the only person who had really dealt with feeding millions of people and dealing with that kind of relief effort was hoover. Plus he also still had a Network Within the leadership of europe that remembered him from world war i, and especially in germany. Really the only american that they trusted after world war ii was hoover, because at a time when the allies didnt want food to go into postworld war i germany, hoover fought to get it in. I feel one of roosevelts great failings that he did not brief frumin on anything, not on the bomb, on the administration and truman took over without knowing what was going on. 19 52 to 1953 hoover was the only surviving president. The only person who really understood what the job was. So im going to let you have the last note as we wrap this up, because i think its one of hoover the great quotes. He lived until the mid60s, saw a lot of different thing, but his philosophy essentially laid the groundwork for the conservative republican floss physical philosophy of goldwater and reagan and here at his time of death asked why he had overcome his critics. Do you want to talk about that story to end things . I think youre referring
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