Transcripts For CSPAN3 Federal Bureau Of Prisons Director Testifies Before Senate Judiciary... 20240713

We will get started just in a second. Welcome, i have a brief Opening Statement and doctors lawyer thank you for coming. Well get you sworn in here in a moment. Its important that we have this oversight here and there is a couple of inquiry and everything is about Jeffrey Epstein and hopefully about the first steps act and where could we go from there and how could you build upon that and those of three areas i would like to talk about at all tonight over. Thank you very much mister chairman. I want to welcome you and its wonderful for me to say a woman in charge so we can celebrate for a few moments at least that you are responsible for the care and custody of over 180,000 federal inmates and one of the Justice Departments largest employers and approximately 35,500 employees as may of this year. As the chairman mentioned there are two issues i hope we can focus on. One is the First Step Act which you mentioned and the second is applaud blooms with staffing within your department. Im going to put most of this in the record. I think what ill do mister chairman in the interest of time is put the statement in the record. Without objection. Thank you mister chairman. Last Year Congress came together to pass what i considered one of the most important criminal Justice Reform laws and the nation. The first stepped hacked from overwhelming majority signed by President Trump and we now have an obligation to ensure that this law will probably be implemented and we think chairman gram for holding this and were disappointed that the department of justice refuse the bipartisan request to testify today. This is one of the many troubling signs that they are not on board with implementing the First Step Act. The act of 2010, which i coauthored with senator grassley and le were not just potter disparity from 18 to one. The department of justice is the fair sentencing act from individuals in some cases even working to put them behind bars. I wrote the provision of the first step to act for nonviolent defenders and take the position that the justice is just taking is plain wrong. It department of justice should be working to identify eligible individuals and not waste valuable resources to keep them behind bars. So far, at least 1600 people have been induce because of the application of their sentencing act. There should be more. Id like to recognize mister chairman to visitors who are here today. They have benefited and one has benefited from the First Step Act and i like to recognize my constituent Edward Douglas and his exceptional lawyer who are here today. Thank you for joining us. Could you raise your hands . Thank you. Edward douglas received a life sentence triggered by two minor nonviolent convictions. He served 16 years in prison, became one of the first people released under the First Step Act. Given a Second Chance, edward and others who are here today are making the criminal Justice System better and more just. Its worth all of our time and effort to pass the First Step Act. I hope it will inspire all of us to search for partisan solutions and the department of justice to change his mind and join us. Thank you. Thank you. Doctor soy are, a mere presence in 1976 as a psychologist at the federal collection in town and in 1983 she was named the chief of psychology of Psychological Services and had increasing responsibilities since then. She has previously served as director from 1992 to 2003. She is reappointed as director in august of this year would you please rise . Yes sir. Raise your hand. Do you testimony by this committee as the truth, the whole truth and nothing but to do so help you god . I do sir. Welcome and the floor is yours. Good morning. I appreciate the opportunity to discuss with you today the mission and operations of the bureau of prisons. I think for you for your work with the bureau for many years. If an integral for many years, including our years of the population growth, expense in an opening up new institutions. I thank you and your colleagues for a Ground Breaking work and that bipartisan work. I look forward to implementing our critical pieces of legislation. Returning inmates has always been a cornerstone of our mission. We have long held at an inmates reentry journey begins the day they arrive in our custody, with the first act, we look forward to further enriching the offering to help improve the lives of our inmates, thereby help keeping our communities safer. I was on a three months ago to be selected by attorney general barr to return to lead to bureau, and to work alongside the finance congressional officials in the world. I began as a psychology intern and one of our prisons, and held positions at increasingly a sociability, including warden, before my promotion. Much has changed in the 16 years that i was outside of the bureau, and since the last served as director. The foundation is still quite sound. We have been challenged significantly by the dramatic growth, they experienced commiserate with significant budget cuts that all the tragedy of 9 11, when this focus shift came from crime to terrorism. Our budget suffered severely after that period, our over 300,000 staff goes largely unseen by the general public. This inherently dangerous work, politically at our highest security institutions, where our most dangerous and waits serve, is responsibility we take very seriously. Unfortunately, we have experienced significant Staff Shortages that make our job even more difficult. In my first 12 weeks, i have placed great emphasis on filling our 3000 vacancies nationwide. Since returning as director, of mobilized the system live overview to identify areas of strength and witnesses, and ive identified three significant areas that need emphasis. One, staffing. One is training, and the third is an infamous on sound correctional practices. Our system is the largest in the nation, housing hundred 76,000 inmates, and this is critical to ensure our staff are following the policies and procedures that keep staff, and mates in the public safe. The bureau also continues to face dangerous threats from the introduction of contraband, synthetic drugs, narcotics and carbon cellphones are the threats. The use of drones is an ongoing problem that continues to evolve. We have employed technologies and continue to leverage new technologies and solutions to detect and enter day contraband. Some they do over 80 years old. To our earliest periods of corrections. Since they are continuously used, and this aging infrastructure sustained extensive where it here and premature deterioration. This is the first act, and i am pleased to report that we have made great progress. Weve implemented the many requirements of the act, and the independent review quality on the act that it requires. Weve listened too many advocacy groups, the statutory timelines in this act are very formidable, but im proud to say that we have met key deadlines. We continue to balance the force step act. I will be happy to answer any questions you might. Half as i indicated i want to talk about the death of mr. Epstein. Do you concur with the opinion that it was a suicide . That was the finding of the corner. If any evidence to suggest otherwise . How did this happen . The death and the whole situation is still under the investigation of the fbi, and the Inspector Generals Office. Im not at liberty to discuss the specifics of this case. I can discuss issues around and situational operations, but i cannot talk about that particular issue. With the case this high profile, there has to be a major malfunction and the system to allow this to happen, so are you looking at both, the fbi is looking at both . If the fbi is it off, the looking at a criminal enterprise. Do you have people in custody today of this high profile nature . Have we done anything to adjust since mr. Epsteins death . We take every and made life very seriously in the bureau of prisons. A highprofile invite isnt the more important or significant in terms of our operations than just the average and might that comes our. They high profile, so that is on the suicide watch. I would like to explain that system. I can talk about epstein, but we have different tiers of response, of an and made that has suicidal thinking. I came as a psychologist, i worked with very suicidal inmates, and i know how difficult it is that it is too protect was suicidal and who is not. Once we have identified a suicide watch operation, we place inmates in. Its a very difficult setting where everything instructs in the room, except a mattress. They get a course of gal to wear that cannot be trusted in any way they can hang themselves from it. They have one mattress and one blanket, and they are watched constantly, theres nothing else in that room. Was he on suicide . Watch yes. The average time on suicide watch is only about 24 hours, because it is such a stark and depressing situation. We then can move into another to europe observation, which is called psychological observation. That happened in this case . I cant speak specifically but im sharing his wishes original you can understand our procedure. There is another tier which is a psychological observation where they get their clothes back and there more a normalize setting at their scrutinized every moment of the day but that is a much more normal environment. Im sorry. Do they have roommates . Not on suicide watch cars are being watched continuously. Did mr. Epstein have a roommate when he committed suicide . He did not. This psychological observation is seen repeatedly and one of the storm and at the threat of suicide seems to have passed, then they can be returned back to the open population. Clearly, it didnt work here so we will wait for the report because everything on mr. Epstein had their heart ripped out because i never see them again. Parole. When did parole or what was paroled alleviated from the system . I became director and 92 and parole was already gone for a new cases it was old cases that it was gone so it was the late eighties early nineties. When was that role implemented in . You have to ask congress. There was people up here that made that decision. Do you have any recommendations on whether we should look at reinstitute in parole with the federal law . Im encouraged by the First Step Act sir, how would that be different and parole . It would be significantly different in what respect that i was going to comment on. Parole is an incentive and they want to get involved in programs and want to do positive things. Because they saw the benefit in that and they can earn earlier release. If they are hearing this commission is favorable. First step back it is offered some new incentives to want to perform well and engage in programs because a lot of programs out there for the past many years and none of them are as high as what were looking for because a lot of times the inmates if they were doing didnt seem to benefit for them. The First Step Act helps in that regard to want to improve themselves and to move forward. What system would give the most flexibility in terms of deciding who to release and someone has been there 25 to 30 years or 40 or 50 year sentence and parole about bit differently than the First Step Act . Is that correct . They parole act and the Parole Commission who were interviewing an inmate who would have different points in their career institutions would look at the progress on how they done how they benefited and how they repaired to be. Would there be a push or review that should be reinstated on the federal level . We havent thought about that what wed look to happy to step back. Let me know. Wed be happy to do that. Thank you very much mister chairman. On november 17th, the New York Times published a story of hazing, humiliation and terror and working well female in the federal prison. Now given the fact and i wrote this in a leather in a letter to mr. Oral wits last year. That the borough has been unnoticed since 2010. That it was clear at that time and sufficient steps were not taken to protect female guards. I requested that the department of justice ig investigate the boroughs failure to adequately address harassment of female guards. We ask that the ig look into the situation. What is the situation today and what has been done to address this issue . Senator, when you have women and obviously im a woman and i worked at the prison for 30 years. When you have women in prison with all male inmates, you have a lot of knuckleheads in that institution. As a woman on a metro car as to be careful here in d. C. That guys are going to move up against them and try to touch them or walk down the street and get catcalls from workers on his side. There are not jobs all over the place and youre going to find them in an institution ought also. There are going to be times when the in misbehave very inappropriately to our female staff. Our female staff need to stand up and address that. The problem with these Sexual Harassment issues that were raised that were made a gravely is when the female staff did not feel the male staff or male counterparts were coming to their insistence in aid. Thats where we drop the ball and we cant always control the behavior of inmates because what do they have to lose if you write the report, new have them in special housing for a while may come back. The part of this that angered me tremendously when the female staff went with the male staff were not stepping up to help them. That is where our attention is educating all of our staff out there and we all our colleagues and need to be treated professionally and its never okay to allow anyone to disrespect our other colleagues. So that is our action and weve had some reports with various inmates and held the staff accountable. Let me ask you this question. Today, do managers separate a female correctional staff officer from a senior officer who made sexual comments and propositions . Yes, whenever we are aware of his situation with a threat assessment and we determine whether or not those two individuals were investigated and whether they continue to Work Together in the same environment. If theres any concern and they are separated. What exactly has been done to remedy that situation . As i said, we increased have you separated and what to be done . I dont have the numbers with me i can get those for you but we have increased the penalties on inmates that behave that way and educated our staff in terms of that being Inappropriate Conduct to not support your colleagues and fines female or male Staff Members who will do the same thing and we will take action on those in investigating to take appropriate action. I would like to see the documentation on what you have done in that regard and so i requested now and in my past i served six years on the california womens term of parole and had sentences with parole and ran the womens prison. I know a little bit about prisons. And ive been in a large number and everyone in california as a matter of fact. So, i am concerned about this on a federal level. I think it is a vague and imprecise. I would like to know exactly what has happened and what has been done to remedy the situation. If you could buy that up to me i would be very grateful for it. I share your concern senator and ill get the information. Thank you very much. Youre very welcome. Before i ask questions, im not going to ask these groups to stand but i want to thank people that support the First Step Act for coming here for this hearing and due process against families against mandatory minimums and of local prison locals. Before i get to some questions about the First Step Act. I want to comment because some critics of the First Step Act will have the case of jewel francisco, a prisoner in new jersey who was lit released on a crack cocaine sentence which was calculated and making the sentences closer to those imposed for powdered cocaine and october, francisco was arrested for first degree murder. Question, francisco would have gotten out of prison even without the First Step Act. Is that a correct . Eventually, yes or. The First Step Act will help prevent the crimes like this in the future by steering more prisoners away from future criminal conduct . I would hope so sir. Now, in regards to the first stepped act enforcement. I want to complement the people at the prison or senator urban and i visited a couple of months ago for what i get from them as a real good faith effort to carry out. My question is, since the First Step Act seeks to reduce sentences among them offenders, Congress Passes this law with the presence that develop a risk and Assessment Tool to make sure prisoners risk of recidivism is a program that they should be and rolled into reduce citizens. Which was released in july of the Justice Department has knowledge that the job is only have done because the prisms toolss quote was not included successfully in this component. Question. When can we expect borough prisms to comply with the first effect with implementing these tools a segment tools . Senator, weve been working closely with the department of the development of the Risk Assessment and the pattern that is actually based on our own system thats rich citizen based and we improved its which is the Risk Assessment. We have a Needs Assessment that weve been using for years and it doesnt quite me the stringent for the first step to pack but were not required to have it completely finish until the end of next year with the timeframe thats laid out. We will be initiating the Risk Assessment come january 15th which is on the First Step Act and our Needs Assessment at the same time to assess those needs. We will continue to tweak our Assessment Program to make sure its very explicit and precise on evaluating the needs that is involved psychological evaluations in terms of needs, educational in terms of needs, health care needs, all of those are identified right now with our existing Needs Assessment. But we set a high bar with his First Step Act so we will continue to tweak and improve on these assessment processes throughout the implemented during his first year to get it as accurate and high standards that can possibly be served. In doing this evidence based program, it has a way of reducing risks it is system with the borough of making sure that it is opportunity for a bit of faith based groups and prison . Our programs are very critical to our operations editor. We have religious Services Programs that every institution with faith based groups represented. We rely on tremendous volunteers in the community from all the different faith groups that, provide the needs of our inmates and we have 11,000 volunteers in our institution right now in the vast majority of those are faithbased groups. Its hard to hard to say faith based groups who have a broader programs and were advising them on how you can enter dole program in this evaluation that stirred the department of justice outside evaluating which one truly has evidence and if they do receive received recidivism we would love to have a common institution and is very critical to the overall operation. I will have to submit a lot of questions because i have more questions on the subject. Thank you mister chairman. Thank you mister chairman. Id like to say that you are here and you came out of retirement to take on this was once ability and we look forward to working with you. I want to acknowledge the rule by our colleagues and senator white house and the First Step Act and they were leaders on this and i want to acknowledge that. The First Step Act aims to improve Public Safety and strengthen the presence to rehabilitate and to do this the first step that requires the department of justice to restoring system and risk of recidivism. We the program and the needs in the scoring system on where you start out makes all the difference in the world. If youre viewed as a high risk inmate, then you have many programs ahead of you before you can be considered released on a particular treatment when it comes to the issue of debris citizen. Well thats why the department of justice is here today and its critical that this system that theyre putting together be transparent, accurate and unbiased. But im concerned that the system of the department of justice has created falls well short. I have a posters i want to show you here. We talked about this in my office. At this moment in our nations history, when the clash of race and injustice graphic the confronts us every single day, the foundation of the scoring system is so stark, so sobering and so fundamentally unfair that we cannot stand without change. The department of justice itself forecasts that the Risk Assessment to result in stunning Racial Disparities in security classification, is a test run of the tool thats demonstrated here over half, 53 of the African American men in the senate were designated high risk compared to only 29 of white men. 30 of white men were classified as a minimum risk compared to only 7 of African American men. Part of the problem is the tool doesnt distinguish between a graphics traffic stop at a murder conviction. It has the risk that someone will be arrested or return to the federal system. Arrest is not a crime, it conviction is a new crime. Whether youre arrested as often as many times with skin color and youre predisposition to commit another crime. Doctor soy or, will you commit the department of justice assessment be revised to remove reviled recidivism or other changes with a stunning Racial Disparities . I want to clarify a point that is confusing and we talked the other day. We are not they are using arrest interesting Risk Assessment and apply for each inmate. We have this commission and that is only convictions and thats what you and i were talking about coming in with these arrests. With you and my staff are got really interested in is on the back end to evaluate recidivism. That is only used on the back and and went in and make gets out or returns to custody we are convicted and that adds to the validation of appraisal of the Risk Assessment. When you and i are concerned about was coming out on the front end and they wont be utilizing that. I understand this distinction but were backing the evaluation and arrest is not a conviction. Were talking about driving while black and while this and that. Lets be very honest and candid what we face in this country today at the notion that the African American man arrest under circumstances that we described is still too prevalent. We have a long way ago. Do you agree . We count an arrest as a recitizen of joe smith it wont affect joe smith. It affects the overall and its the research flaw in terms of the problem is most everyone in the country to finds recidivism but i assure you senator the Risk Assessment where we checked the validation every year and theres outside group thats coming in every five years at the validation and will do that the stark Racial Disparity and if you dont get that right nothing is right about the system. I just have a few seconds and part of bringing these inmates is less restate it is from at its putting the services in front and will make a difference. It department of justice reported that theres 222,000 former prisoners which is 49 of any kind of programming and 82 received no Technical Qualification and 92 was in unique or. Some completed no drug treatment and when senator grassley was in the my state and proud to have it thank you it was the second most restrictive federal resolutely in colorado. What do you have in place, they are still waiting and its very early in the game, i get it but theres nothing to indicate that the resources to make sure these inmates have a fighting chance to turn their lives around and to be released on their circumstances were citizen doesnt take place. You agree we need more resources. I would invite all the members of this committee to visit our institution and youll find every one of our institutions other than the ones light your new thompson, we have Education Programs and 86 residential drug free programs in the borough of prisms. We have vocational trading, educational training and the problem i mentioned earlier is the inmates choose not to get involved because it doesnt benefit them. We cannot force by court of law we cannot force an inmate into a treatment program. My hope with this new step act is that it will occur for the inmates to see some benefit and federal prism industry when i was here before as director, we had 28,000 inmates and we now have 11,000 because weve been cut so badly and terms of our authorities by the people on the hill in the house in the senate because there was so much concerned we might take a job away from the private citizen. I shared that concern and we made 80 different product lines and cant hurt any industry very much at all. Weve been cut from 20,000 to 11,000 inmates in this industry. I assure you senator, the only limitation a providing programs for these and mates will be the sources. As long of we have some resources we will have resources to provide all the programs from all the inmates. Im hoping that will change now since you all support the First Step Act and the resources will come along with that to ensure that we have these programs available. As you know, we have a difficult time in Training Staff we. Have so many requests and advertising for jobs as psychologist, Treatment Specialist that we need to run some of these programs and mr. Thompson or not getting takers. We will plug away and we will get them filled its just taken us a while. Doctor soy or, can you tell us about any incidents that has caused as much crisis from public trust as it has here . I can only speak since 1976, i dont know prior to that but i would say its gotten the most public attention. Lots of taxpayers and citizens never thought about being the hardworking foes and when were talking about the public trust in general in terms of your workforce this happened in the middle of august and it is thanksgiving and her to testify and youre not allowed to speak about this incident i think thats crazy. Can you distinguish among the types of investigations for us come aware that these epstein investigations have a whole bunch of women who were raped by this guy. This is a sex trafficking ring in the United States, this guy had evidence, hes not coconspirators and victims out there who want to know where the evidence has gone. Pin you tell us a little bit more about the different investigations. I know there is one that you are not told to speak about but there are three investigations in your path. There are two investigations that are ongoing. One is the fbi investigation and the others the Inspector General. But there is a third one outside which what epstein was in your institution to begin with. That is completely out of my theres a lot here that be open he has failed in this room and its in your job because you come here today and say he cant testify about it but the reason youre director is because alaska i got fired. I cant tell you what i dont know. I received no information from the fbi or no information from the Inspector General. Once those go into the reference we are forbidden from talking to anybody in the institution. We can send in the team and look at the security flaw, we are not allowed to talk to anybody in our institutions about anything that happen with epstein. With all due respect, you have an obligation to speak to the girls were raped by this guy today. You may not have to speak about every particular of the guards that were arrested last night. But the fact that there is an ongoing attempt by the United States government to find out if there is still any evidence about the coconspirators. You do have an obligation to speak to those girls were raped today. It may not speak about the specific charges against their specifics of the charges to those who guards this, morning that were taken into custody. But more broadly, you should be able to unpack if we change any prostheses about cases like this and is more than 90 days that youre quote was we treat amy every and made the same. In america any individual has every inmate as equal value for future criminal investigations. Jeffrey epstein was the testifying case. Someone whos already been convicted on suicide watch as lots of good reasons to not want that guy to kill himself this, is different. This isnt just about the individual inmate who wants to kill themselves. Its about that guy was unable to testify against his other coconspirators. It is wrong as a management matter for you to say we treat everyone the same. We should be treating people who are yet to testify against other felons or against other rapists who, have a lot more priority for your institution to, obey . Senator, all of our inmates under any in our jail facilities are pretrial. Theyre yet to testify, to be involved and share information on cases. I dont know what evidence are asking me. Was there any evidence in his room where his possession . That would be compensated. His brain and in the cameras and the tapes and the public well understands that it did not to beer up to be urgent enough. Its very urgent for the department of justice its all been confiscated by the fbi and the investigation. Thats why its not shared with the borough of prisons and the investigations are completed. Was there completed id be very happy to talk to anyone a view that want to hear everything about those investigations. But until they have that information theres nothing i can tell you. If i dont have the information i cannot share anything with you. How widespread is the problem of this on the job . There are lots of people in the public who thinks this is a very convenient excuse. Tell us, is that a systemwide problem . Do people fall sleep on the job winner sparse to be guarding federal inmates . We have a few. Weve been monitoring the cameras with everyone in our institutions that determine how well and how effective our Staff Members are during the rounds. The counts in the institutions but we have found that a couple of other instances where we referred those Inspector Generals Offices and if we people just chose not to do their job, were hoping the u. S. Attorneys office pick up those cases and prosecute them for us because we dont want those people here and there day just everybody. The inmates and the staff. We are zealously going around determining which employees are good employees and do their job and that is the vast majority of the prison staff. We do have some that i know out there who obviously choose not to follow the law and policy and do not to do their job and we want them gone. I do not want them in my institution and we have told that very carefully that we have determined them and if its a training problem and they didnt know what their is will to do than thats our problem and as management problem. We have to do a better job of training our staff. But if someone chooses not to do their job then we want them gone. I assure you of that. Amount of time so i just gave you a preview of something alaska for the record after the event. We made a really important statement about a few kinds of contraband and tear institutions and thats one problem thats a gets which we have to play defense but those who appear to do to see what your Long Term Strategy and i think something a lot of us would like to hear more about. Because epsteins hallway should have still been monitored by cameras if the guards were asleep in that information on whether there were adequate cameras and to understand where Technology Knowledge came from. Senator blumenthal is next. Would there be an ig report . There should be. Usually after the Inspector Generals Office investigated do offer a report. Any criminal charges were not there for your case but if theres an idea report we will get fully briefed by the committee here. Senator blumenthal. Thank you mister chairman. Thank you for your service i share the sense of outrage and urgency about this issue. Not because of any special caring about mr. Epstein but the source of evidence to hold accountable other criminals who are as coconspirators and exploiting in the suicide deprives them. And justice and accountability. Id like to suggest that we have an oversight hearing and specifically and this problem relating to mr. Epstein and more broadly about the problems of proper surveillance and proper oversight. I think it ought to be bipartisan and suggests that year is equally troubled about this this issue and i would like to ask for your cooperation and that you will cooperate with the oversight. Absolutely sir. When will the Inspector General report . We never know that. They keep telling us soon but we dont know that means. They take the amount of time we need to do an investigation and i never know. I am going to write a letter and i hope that others will join me and in encouraging the Inspector General to finish this report as expeditiously as possible. There is no more time to interview and review documents fee documents that were falsified which are not numerous with tons of written documents but i think that Inspector General report is due next week and im going to be writing the Inspector General and i hope my colleagues will join me in that letter. Have you reviewed the documents that were falsified . No. Ive not been allowed to see anything. Once the fbi and i steps in, we cant interview people or do anything. So we dont in any way have any bias in the investigation. I have not seen any of it. Were rates of suicide in prison higher than the general population . They are. But our system the really not. If you talk about jail facilities around the country the, average rate of suicide in a jail facility around the country is 50 per hundred thousand. If you look at our numbers and our facilities in the last year, we had to. Unfortunately one, of those was an extraordinary high profile case which makes everyone paint the bureau with a brush in the system. We have lost two inmates to suicide energy Oil Facilities where the norm is 100 inmates per 100,000 and 100,000 in our rate thats 13 per hundred thousand. If the state systems are there we have about 20 something. Theyre in specific changes in policy and practices as a result of the epstein suicide . Policy is minimal because our policies are sound and the problem is, when we grew so dramatically when i was director went from 50 to 60,000 inmates 280. Went from 50,000 staff to 30,000. That is tremendous and we were getting there but once i left we had to grow by 47,000 more inmates would only 7000 new staff. We only had only seven Staff Members for every 1000 inmates with the borough of prisons. And when youre alone, we were required ten new institutions and 3000 less than we had the year before. Thats a 6000 drop in coverage that we had across our borough. When we stretched so thin the staff at to make it work. We cant control our population. We dont control who comes into our institutions and when they leave. We have to keep taking them and taking them. And we grew so big, with so few staff that we stretch to our limits. Im going to interrupt to the policies were sound and staff dont always fall them cause a restrictions. Thank you. On a separate issue. A report by the department of Justice Office of Inspector General in office found that private prisons had Serious Problems and more frequent will ports of violence that could cause deaths of inmates that are reporting on 14 private prisons and public prisons between 2011, 2014 and found more safety and security per capita in the private facility and the borough of prisons and a memo in 2018 with the isis director indicated that the use would in fact be increasing. Do you have the plan of increasing private prisons . We dont have plans but your problems is exactly that we have these inmates in private prisons i will not put medium and high security inmates because they are not adequate in dealing with very serious offenders. It was in our private citizens because they do not pose the risk and the private prisons or a boon boom for us but they were doing it so dramatically and were asked to take the inmates coming our way. The private prisons gave us a buffer for those inmates. Were down to having 16,000 have 177,000 inmates and our private institutions. Those keep coming down down and i think there will be a phase with another huge increase in population where we will no longer bullied private citizens. I will stop here because my time is expired. I do have a few more questions but i put them in the record. One of them that you mentioned is a faithbased program with the denial of opportunities to muslim prisoners in the fc eye which is the subject of a lawsuit and id like to know the explanation to why. Thank you. Very good sir. Thank you Ranking Member. I appreciate the testimony today and i like to go back to talk a bit about the faith based programs that we discussed earlier. Can you talk a bit about those programs and are you a equaling of equal time with demand and a number of volunteers which are equally offering those programs. We are required by law to do that and the faithbased followers and different faith groups we have sweat lodges and institutions where we have folks from the religious groups that most of us ive never heard of and we are providing the witness an atheist and religious freedom act we are required to meet the demands of every inmate that comes our way and we try to make those and when you have huge numbers of one fate group and one or two another, i can tell you we get exactly the same number because of the volunteers because we can use multiple different groups to address kristen innovator example or jewish inmates. The number of volunteers you can bring in for your native americans or whatever it might be. Our goal is to be equitable. Thats good and thats the way its supposed to be and how supposed to run. Do we have a limit then on the volunteers that are coming in for those programs and its open ended. At one time how many come in at one time because our chaplains are the ones that oversee those programs and are careful for security and may use some extra officers to cover those. I would assume they have limits on how you can come in on a particular time but were open to new volunteers and programs all the time. As part of that volunteer process, what would a volunteer have to do . Are there any regulations with the volunteers or they supervised . How does that work . Security requirements that we have to go through with a minimal background check to make sure they are not going to pose any Security Threat. We also have them with a test in writing where they have no animosity with the pushing ideology that is counter to our country. And then we do have security in the institution that were not bringing in any contraband or any items that we should not be bringing in and theres always a staff member present in the area of whether thats a chaplain to guard and untoward is during that program. Thank you for that. Outside of those that are religiously affiliated there the First Step Act is expected that they would expand as an internal program. Can you talk a little bit about the partnerships that have been developed with non profits and various groups. And what theyre expected to contribute on the First Step Act . We have a number of mentors coming in and they talked about bringing in younger offenders and are preparing for reentry. They come into work with our government with the 11,000 inmates and veterans because we have a very good relationship. Number one, we help screen that they planned to be veterans and then we offer programs of three institutions with these Housing Units and they band together in a very strong way to support each other. Any Veterans Affairs program we have into those institutions and help them with free entry and those kinds of things. We have a lot of folks in education areas and groups will come in and work with their inmates and with the kinds of classes for him and offer support and guidance. We will take an anyone whos willing to meet the requirements to provide to the inmates. That helps us increase our staff levels. When you have nowhere near enough staff and all the things we try to provide the volunteers and outside groups of tremendous resources for us to do a whole lot more than we have available. I appreciate that. The First Step Act and the questioning is to dwell on the fact that the First Step Act we have a lot of different partners to make that transition much easier for these inmates and allow them to really thrive and do well and once they enter their civilian life. Thank you very much, appreciate it. Thank you. Dr. Sawyer before the committee you testified that they target all of our it made to go through a Residential Program because of the step back which is 75 of our inmates releasing go through the Halfway Houses. But on the chart that senator put up there was 75 which was a high percent were inmates going through the process. As that may, have way houses to suffice which are more important. We want to know why september 30th 2019, that the only Residential Reentry Center in the entire state of hawaii made up as you probably know, closed up providing services for 29 years. That meant that they made a huge impact with the facility like this closes because the person named robin has a non profit that trains people into programs who wanted to have a prison that would be eligible to go through and what even have a job lined up by a non profit that he ran and couldnt do it. Who thought that this particular one was a part of a lack of money but he did ask for bids. Clearly, once a facility like this closes its not easy to get another one up and running but these are really relevant to people. So will you commit to reopening them in a way . Senator, we are just as concerned as you are and as i know, you are aware our staff was there just recently and the building at the Halfway House ended up being sold. I understand the circumstances. They were pulled away from it. We advertised three times renew Halfway House and we got no takers. The provider has to be Cost Effective for them. We cannot commit more numbers of inmates that we have released into the state. Let me finish. We have this within a month that we believe were going to get acceptable better but weve added a couple of things on to the Halfway House, the home confinement oversight and the reporting center which is on steroids with the oversight. That will expand the workload that were asking for so it should be more costeffective cause more inmates will be paying for it. Are optimistic as we want the Halfway House and were very optimistic will get better on this. It sounds like a guest. Its as close as a as i can possibly provide. Your timeline is within the next month. It soon. Id like to have regular updates of as to how things are going so we can have one residential center. The thing that happened with this facility is congress in the appropriation of measure that they would notify us with these significant changes involving our closures. Matt beyond the closure of the facility from the residents and not but are you requiring those elements . In that case the provider is on us and we got the word a little bit late at all double checked that to make sure because its all responsibility to make sure that if we dropped the ball on that i do apologize. I think you noted that you work with nonprofits and one of my colleagues at the State Government work through the challenging issues that has zoning was trick shuns and this is where you take a position well. Its very difficult and we watched our inmates close to home in their communities so we dont want them to close. We dont want anyone to accept the Halfway House. You testified that you are very committed to implementing the first step of legislation and there was a recent article in the Washington Post that the Justice Department under attorney general barr undermined the implementation of the First Step Act by implementing the people eligible from earlier and with current officials have stated that barr has had concerns that it would drive up in crime numbers and that is this kind of a sentiment that the attorney general has expressed to you . Its not what i heard the attorney general say. Hes been very supportive and implementing this First Step Act. I have never heard those words coming out of his mouth. People who are currently on your staff when it with officials have heard that and so that would be a major concern. To me. You are asked questions about what happens to your female employees and im sure that there is a relatively small percentage of the employees that you have and i would encourage you to commit to making sure that the training you provide for male staff who do not come to the aid that new do everything you can to change the culture of this kind of behavior. I yield. Thank you senator. Senator kennedy. Thank you madam chairman. Chairwoman i thank you madam director and we have a federal correctional facility in oak day which is a familiar and we are having huge staffing problems which doesnt make sense on why those states have an unemployment wait. What do you mind if i contacted your staff to talk about that and see what we can get . The problem is bureaucracy . Sure. The staff is at 94 and 94. 8 and theyre down 30 positions eye of a thought to raise this and about half of that is Correctional Officers and the problem in the position is that one i indicated on our sizing. I want to stop you. I want to have a long meeting with you about it. Ill give you lots of information. I have a couple of other questions. What is in your opinion justice . Thats a heavy question. I would assume that people are treated fairly and fair and equitable consequences occur if one violates the rights and we should be able to anticipate that and expect that. When somebody to me, justice is when someone gets what they deserve. Though uyghurs in china deserve liberty and its not right to not give it to them. In terms of crime and punishment, a wrongful act. Do you think we should do that as a sickness that should be cured . Or a consequence or a wrongful act with the consequence of which deserves punishment . I think the latter is very true. In some situations the former statement in terms of pedophiles and sex offenders and some of those whose behavior has been deemed by the Psychiatric Association between at the root of that in a Mental Health issue which needs to be looked at is both. Either way, the consequences should match the offense. For tell me the best procedure it you judge boot and you have a lot of experience. You can tell from her testimony today. That you know what youre talking about. I think most people would agree that justice sometimes needs to be tempered with mercy. The federal prison system, how best do we do that . And who should do it senator, as i mentioned earlier we have no control over who comes in. The coming in and going out. Forget about the current law. In our institutions we all have a responsibility to treat our in meets with passion. Because as i said earlier, we believe that an inmates eerie and troll journey our time is so limited. Im talking in terms of determining what and somebody should get out early. We dont have control over that. Im asking you if you should based on your experience . The individuals that have been elected or appointed to the top ranks of our criminal justice and law in this country out the responsibility to make those decisions. Congress didnt with the First Step Act, we turn it over to folks then we turn it over to the Justice Department. You gave us authority, you gave us abilities but you exercised the judgment. Thats right but that judgment is very much driven by a specific parameter. Theyre very vague. Im not sure ill be able to answer this unacceptable manager banner senator. How can i put this. Christmas ornaments, dry wall in Jeffrey Epstein. Name three things that dont hang themselves. Thats what the American People think. Thats what the American People think and they deserve some answers. And i know, that you are not in charge of these investigations. But you talk to the people who are and i need you to take a very respectful message today. Tell the American People what happened. And dont rush it so that they dont do a third investigation. You and i both know that they can make this a top priority and get this done more quickly than they normally would. They need to do that and i want you to deliver that message. I agree but i can pass along the message but the Inspector Generals Office has a timeframe because i want the investigation completed. You have a feeling i that you know how to be frank. Thank you senator. Senator cohens. Thank you Ranking Member and sawyer with your vigorous eswatini today. I have five different questions ill try to get through. The First Step Act with the borough of prisons have eternal programs and senator durbin showed graphically how these prisoners do not have access to the scope but the First Step Act imagines. We had something called the law Maintenance Commission which out as services and partnerships that im hoping will be expanding which will deliver evidence with training or treatment are preparation for reentry to our community. Can you tell me something about what you think you really need in terms of flooding get what partnership you may have started with local nonprofits which might deliver those services and and im crossed effective way that can also help with the costs . You mentioned youre program in delaware but something thats always been very difficult for us is the Community Programs that you welcome these inmates back with jobs and housing that will allow them to live in their neighborhoods. Theres always a three legged stool and we have to provide opportunities and they have to embrace some. So a lot of our work is in the community where we get Halfway Houses and we try best where no one wants them in their neighborhood and in programs to assist that the those are a critical piece. Yesterday something called Second Chance farm opened and its very close to our nearby prison and its an opportunity to do urban farming for those who have just been released and a supervise setting which is an aspiring model. Initially, 75 Million Dollars was for congress of this program and now i think you testified recently that you are choir doubled that. Which is something closer than 400 million and i are with moen and shaheen who want your active feedback so we can fund and engage with you so that the First Step Act can be effective. The only thing thats going to impede and provide all the services are the resources. We are hoping for more than 75 million this coming year but i think what the mark of center there right now with the resolution, i think we will get about 75 million again and 75 last year did not come from congress. We had that from our own budget. If we look at the resources we need to make these things happen. At the end of the day you will be yelling at us but the reality is if we dont have the resources the reason we sent that letter to you is to ask for your clear input about how much more you may need. Let me move to solitary confinement. The criminal justice concluded that it causes longlasting harm and used as necessary and not as a default. The First Step Act and the leaves a solitary confinement and juvenile settings and given the demonstrate of harm, why do we still have 10,000 inmates and 7 in restricted housing giving there were more expensive in the last option . We are working very diligently to try to get those numbers down. Many of god and made center in there because theyre bad actors and are in their further punishment period and that is only about baby 3000. The remaining ones are their poor protective custody and are on the compound and are there because so many Security Threat groups are all going to kill each other for each other. Were working desperately to come with other alternatives. We have reintegration housing and we saw senator durbins new institution. We have ten for already operating and we have transitioned units and units are trying to break down gangs. I love more input on you for that senator. We have a solitary confinement that we love to hear more from you about that if i might mister chairman too quick concluding questions. On the cochair of the Law Enforcement caucus, you have significant base and sees vacancies and shopping Staffing Shortages which is being required with guards that have contributed. With something to what youve asked in great length here. How many of the facilities used augmentation which is the usurper pushing people that are officers in that role . Are they temporarily serving an expected to perform their regular jobs and whats the impact on Mental Health and suicide risk for those that are performing these corrections that are very stressful and demanding . A lot of interest has been raised and it in and of itself is a wonderful thing. We train all of our staff first. I was a psychologist and we had different derby groups and officers and teachers and we dont have officers in the kitchens cooking food. We are enough officers Walking Around with our plumbers as they teach inmates. Were all trained to be workers and we all have that responsibility. When we came from the system, we were all not that awarded. And we have that responsibility and numerous times and it is very bad worried enough to do it too much and thats been happening more recently. Hes been having to augment and what happens then, from the other posts they know how to do the job and are trained to do that job. But youre right, they work from the other job is limited in terms of what they can accomplish. We had such huge strains and with the dramatic growth which had Staffing Shortage and is incredible to me but the last few years that theyve been gone is most respects is the restrain on our system. It is a good thing and dont take it away from us and we have to get those filled so we dont have to augment. Weve concerned more Law Enforcement officers in the last few years and im concerned and we have appropriate support training and staffing because were pushing folks to come to really perform. Thank you. I thank you so much for being here and thank you for you serving in the part of government does not easy. The part of government that is so essential for the safety of our country. This is often taxing. Absolutely. I want to talk to you at a moment about the First Step Act and about what we can do to make sure that its helping to make american safe. I want to talk for a moment about the Jeffrey Epstein case. There are a lot of indications, there are a lot of people that expressed concern culminating in the phrase Jeffrey Epstein didnt kill himself. It was initially reported that he died by suicide but according to a whole lot of news reports, a psychologist or a private who look at the case said that mr. Epstein experienced a number of injuries that are extremely unusual and occurred much more commonly and are you familiar with that statement . Ive seen that yes. According to news reports, security cameras are in the hallway watching mr. Epstein cell, just happened to malfunction the night of his life ended. Can you tell me how frequently do Prison Guards to prison guarding security cameras malfunction like this . What are the protocols to check on them to make sure doesnt happen . Senator, we are very behind in terms of improvements throughout the restitutions. As i mentioned in the Opening Statements a lot of the existence are flunky and we have enough money to redo all the cameras systems but is not completed quite yet but we have the funding to replace all of our camera systems that we have from analog to a lot more cameras now in the is effusion that we had yourself a lot of blind spots but fcc in york is one of those which is part way through its camera reinstallation and so, by this Time Next Year we should have all of our institutions which should be completely upgraded. When theyre faulty they do breakdown sometimes. When a breakdown you cant see it. If youre looking at the security cameras are not functioning that night, how do we make sure he did kill himself . You can see some but the visibility on a analog camera is grainy and thats usually the problem that occurs. You can see whats going on its just grainy and hard to identify precisely what youre seeing. Some of us going on in this case . I dont know about this case but i wasnt allowed to see any of the cameras. Why . The Inspector General and the fbis office who are investigating and were not allowed to touch anything. Once the situation occurs, the fbi Inspector Generals Office is there in, a lot to talk to staff or any interaction whats whats going on in the investigation. Until its finished. Any idea how long that will be . We keep hearing soon but i dont know how long soon is. One of the concerns i have is that my understanding that his death was in a high security housing unit that was supposed to be checked every 30 minutes. From what im told, it appears that hours went by it must have been three hours or so without anyone checking on him. If that is true, with that have represented a lot of support to call . A lapse of a lot of things. Political, fallacy policy and lots of very negative things and there is just checks that theyre supposed to be doing. Is there a correlation between deaths in high security Housing Units and the timely checks along with inmates according to pure prisons protocol . As i indicated earlier, the average deaths in these high security pretrial facilities, the average in the country in jails across the country is 50 to hundred thousand inmates. We had two in a jail facility in the last year. Who is suggesting the vast majority of those institutions, we do things correct and in our special housing of other institutions, we have had a couple of instances where we look back at the cameras after something occurred and was not always clear that the officers had done specifically what were asking to do and each case when that occurs we call the Inspector Generals Office where we investigate and if it appears to be any type of criminal act then we call in the Attorney Office and the fbi and we will prosecute if theyre not doing their jobs. Mister chairman, my time expired i got one short question and can i ask that . Ill take that as he has. I have no objection. Thank you. The borough made to ensure that they are receiving incentives on the programming that we are currently participating . The credits that they will at two earlier release it is in the program. Its all identified in the First Step Act. If you have the next number of programs then you get a correlation of how many credit supposed to be getting. There are some inmates who are not going to be eligible. Your sex offenders and some of those were excluded by congress. We are trying to build incentives to those individuals to increase to behavior where you get extra phone time and you get extra benefit in the trust fund program and we tried to incentivize for us on one hand either makes it or better behavior but the main focus is trying to work their way out of the prison system as long as youre not getting involved in the programs then they are automatic. Makes your job easier in the public safer. Absolutely. If we can eliminate our numbers it would be make me very happy. Thank you very much and i was honored to be on the First Step Act and i look to honor that faithfully. Thank you. Director welcome. Senator cornyn and i were part of the entry i would be First Step Act and in the implementation when all relate to you with my experience which is that during the battle for that bill, your organization was something less than a champion for our piece of it. But, we ended up passing the bill with huge majorities and the reentry piece is stronger and more bipartisan and we sent a pretty bipartisan message of getting this done. There was a meeting afterwards that they were unable to attend what was able to send a staff person with mr. Kushner and the Deputy Attorney general and with senior people at the borough of prisms and at the white house who had been involved and working on this bill to send the message that we want to see this implemented. I hope we were in pretty good shape and your comments today show to seriousness about it but im worried that people within the borough or not champions of this bill and are trying to interfere with implementation and the most obvious one is to not ask for additional funding for not going forward. There is a recent survey done of 280,000 of your inmates as part of developing a new Assessment Tool. And they will port was that 49 of not complete they released 82 and have not participated and technical courses and 57 had treatment which have not received it. Theres obviously a huge opportunity here to improve on those numbers and you have said in your testimony today that the First Step Act provides us with the opportunity to add the programs with the assistant programs. Im all for that, a staff level briefing what told us that they currently have no plans to expand their program offerings. So, i dont know quite where we are here but the testimony said that we implement this new bill and with the whole survey but if you have no plans its a little heart to figure out whats going on here but s i have no way to increase the program so if i can get names on those people, thats not at all where we are and i know my staff well enough buts until we get the funding buts and senator durban has with programs which we have a lot of security inmates and we dont have time to get involved. They come into us very skew unsuccessful in the businesses and the legal route for a while and their inmates that are having life sentences and choose not because they dont have a job on the outside. The vast majority of inmates we have lots of programs out there with Vocational Training and therapeutic programs and we dont have enough buts and the only thing thats going to impede us if you offer enough programs the first regulation loss a lines and it doesnt help us when the administration comes in that does not support the initial resource. It is a setback and we do have appropriators will pay no attention to the recommendation and the bipartisan phenomenon which is really important and with respect to one particular piece of this and this treatment, its probably the National Leader right now in getting assisted ways to prisoners before it released and dramatically reduced death by overdose within that population. We have the whole array of approved medical interventions and we understand they offer the drug which is called vivid troll. Theyre trying to expand the program as you say and they additional Million Dollars to staff and the expansion of medication which is the kind of example to have you say and it improves peoples ways when theyre out. But when the rubber hits the rolled you undercut yourself with the budget request and you wish you achieve. Part of the limitations on the other drugs right now is that we dont have the authority and they have very strict restrictions and im sure you have these authorities and youre working diligently because a lot of time for us its a matter of moving beads across state lines because of our institutions and they come from everywhere. Were working very diligently to have the profit license youre and right now where ensuring the inmates get the medicine but we review their case what their doctors and we take them downtown when there is a prescribe or who can prescribe the medication for us. What we need to move forward on this is the agreement for our own staff. The inmates are still getting the drugs where we have to take the inmate out of town. Can Congress Help you in this regard . Right now i think we can we might have to come up for modification of the law but i think were very close to getting the final approval from hhs on the methadone. If that doesnt work that ill come and talk with you. Lets make sure that there is no Counter Insurgency going on in your administration. There is not an if there is and i find it then theyll be working somewhere else. Thanks. Senator blackburn. Thank you mister chairman. I want to introduce the director of council on prison locals 33 Western Region letter. Go ahead. Thank you. We appreciate that youre there and its really easy to see why they wanted you to come back out overtime it. Jeffrey epstein has come out of a lot and it concerns us because we do have victims and women, young girls that are never going to see just as fully. Its a cause of his death and you mentioned that all of your high profile inmates are treated the same. I want to pivot to the staff. Senator cohens has made some of this and lets look at policies and procedures first staff for handling these high profile or suicidal inmates. Do you have written protocols that are there to be followed of the Standard Operating Procedure even if youre augmenting staff . That Everybody Knows that this is how its done. Is that in existence . All of our special Housing Units are post stores at the front entry and every staff member is expected to read at every time and they do regular training and for those that are augmented, those orders ideally bases should remind them of what are on those posts. Staff would have full awareness of what the expectation is . Yes. Thank you. So, Staff Shortages and i understand you are facing those. How is that affecting your ability and the staff sort edges that what are you all doing to alleviate that. Have you changed recruiting purposes . Since ive been back for three months, thats of my highest priority is getting filled. We have acting is in the role and good people doing good things but acting directors dont have the power and the authority and the way the full director cant. We had extra authority by the department of justice and weve got the direct the hiring and the staff of institution where we dont have the authority right now and invested greatly. We have given authority in our staff in our staffing process and a lot of those are retirees because if you bring them back from retirement or bringing them back from a year until we need them and lead them back to retirement and we have experience with that. That will work real well and will have ten new staff because we have retirements coming in the next year and or advancing our recruitment strategy and will do a nationwide online Voting Program because thats where the young people go looking for jobs. Were not a splash she as we need to have it who will work with us. We will do everything we possibly figure out to try to speed up our review process and are hiring process. One of the things that is hurting us is that 15,000 employees in this time period which are all now retired. Many of them are retiring at the same time for hiring new staff. We have our new staff and we have for retired. Its hard for us to catch up and we hire 2500 employees this past year. Where it should be a lot when we have a fair number out the back and through retirement or whatever. Its been very difficult. As you were hiring new staff, what is the legs of trading that youre divided of the job . We have two weeks of institution familiarization when some is up to three weeks. Three weeks of training and our Law Enforcement center in georgia. So that is six weeks and whats ideal and usual to do is link a probationary employee to a season employee and if they can follow them and shadow them and learn the job but unfortunately with our Staffing Shortages were not able to do that but as we staff up we will be able to return to that. We also have annual training and every staff member has to go through. All the basics of corrections and we have incidental training throughout the year. Staffing is one of the biggest issues. Staffing and training. One of the first things to go is a training budgets. Where having trouble filling positions, a lot of new employees and if we cant train them adequately, wire suggesting earlier is they may not know everything they need to know and those are the areas that are stressing dramatically until we get caught up. I got a question on contraband and i will submit that to you for writing but i think the fact that people like el chapo who is still riding his business who is dropping cellphones this is something we need to help you solve and will help that from a written response. Senator cornyn. Ill join my colleagues for returning to a Public Service and the importance of faith based programs and it seems to me that youre engaged in a faithbased exercise here. Less like john mccain would provide us on earth. Maybe ten years ago now, with the number of passers and the African American pastors on what ceasing is a problem that we have in the congregation. Its young men who are convicted felons and after they leave prison they cant get a job and they cant find a place to live. It occurred to me if you cant get a job and you cant find a place to live, your choices are extraordinarily limited. So looking at some of the work thats been done at the state level by senator white house and i and other colleagues here and its almost unanimous will join together and of past a First Step Act. This is an aspirational goal to make sure that people who want to leave prison which everyone will which is another factoid that people overlook. People will leave prison but the fact is if there are better prepared. We can say and save some but the numbers are encouraging from the state experience. One of the things i want to ask you about is in my state in texas, for example, we have not only looked at what happens in prison but we look what happened after presume only big sure we dont drop the ball and are you responsibilities for once they leave your premises but we need to make sure there are Services Monitoring people who continue to need reinforcement and help because if we go back in the same neighborhood or subject to the same temptations and influence, they will end up back in eureka custody. Do you agree that its important for congress to not pat ourselves on the back and say we passed a First Step Act but we need to follow through and provide services for this population. Thats excellent senator as i mentioned earlier, you look at the three legged stool we could provide program for inmates to do better and if they choose to do that than the third stool is the communities are going back into. If there is not a community tear the deals with housing issues and job issues and all those kinds of things than the whole stool will fall over because the inmates cannot succeed if theyre going back in the same drug written area and i dont have a place to live and dont are not able to do this or that. They are coming back to us but they are left a very optimistic and education in hand and they come back because what they found outside was not they were hoping for. The run up the act that we heard from attorney general mike casey who made a very important point. Its easy to get confused by what the ultimate goal is. He encouraged us to keep the eye on the primary the crime rate was coming down then we were obviously making some progress. If it was going up and something obviously was going wrong. Do you agree with that focus . I think thats one of the things need to look at very closely yes. Finally, dr. Sawyer, senator white house as you heard is the odd couple on president reform like senator leahy and i and the freedom of information. Its really odd. laughs ill leave that to others to judge. We are addressing some infiltration of reintegration and debilitation in something we call the reenter act. Or trying to do is provide federal judges the authority and the discretion without requirement with the discretion to issue their own certificates and rehabilitation and acknowledge the eligible offenders and demonstrate their commitment to lawabiding future. We are looking at the state experience and about a third of the state as a Similar Program and im glad that just like the first step back we seem to enjoy bipartisan support which is lay he, crassly coons and so far who have joined us in the introduction of this bill. Do you see the usefulness of federal judges this discretion and additional indicator to the public that this individual has tried to turn their lives around and taking advantage of the program and is needing to be welcome back . Im not familiar with your bill i, look forward to looking at it and im still catching up with a lot of new stuff thats happened the last 16 years. Im happy to look at it but anything that proves the process and make us all Work Together and doing the right things for those who are looking to come back i applaud all of your efforts in all of our efforts. Thank you again. Senator tillis. Thank you mister chairman. Doctor sawyer thank you for being here on your service. How would you describe the morale of folks in beale p right now . Im trying to talk about our staff and talk about our management staff and its mixed. We have a mixture of staff who are tired because of having to work extra hours and work so hard and so long. But the staff that i interacted with are still they driven good quality people who want to do a good job. They know where any profession or we dont get any glory and they all get glory. The people want to get noticed when something bad goes wrong. We never read an article about us as positive and those are local papers. Doctor sawyer, would you rate the caliber of the people working there the vast majority . Vast majority is super. We had 5000 positions removed and then whats happened the last few years which is the result of 3000 vacancies is we have certain budget where were going to get significant cuts again where the leaders at the time were wary having too much cohesion when i have a rift of when the budget came out that would go up dramatically. Thats what we are having with staffers and we had 15,000 inmates and employees who where i was director from 90 to 2003 and a lot of those are going out the door and thats where we had it up today and since weve been here and prior is that we have lots of incentives and financial incentives. We have resourced staffing members at our office which screen for our new hires and we infused that by 20 former retirees and for a year or two or three we are caught up and they can start. We have ten new staff down there and recruitment activity going on as the senator mentioned of something very splash each and online group. We are approaching the contractors to help us with the staffing levels. Were doing everything we can possibly think of and one thing about bringing me in as director is the attorney general assured me that we have the full support of the department of justice to be back on solid ground and they have definitely delivered on that. We are doing everything we possibly can with our 2500 staff this past year. We have had some other staff where were hiring new ones and losing some other ones and its hard for us to catch up. We will get there and then the hiring process. The hiring process is extremely long and it takes six months to a year from the time you recruit someone edify someone to actually get them working when youre honoring and when youre training them you get them to work at even longer. Let me ask about the Springfield Missouri inventory. Can you speak tear progress there in staffing for mental and dental staff . I dont have the specific numbers on springfield with me today. I will tell you exactly but one is health service. Doctors, nurses and the medical profession is stretched pretty thin across the whole country and no one is able to find the rural ways that are losing their medical partners. Were competing and we dont pay as much as other paces play pay. We have a specific numbers on springfield. Let me go back to the numbers you mentioned a moment ago. It cost be opp to lose under house testimony that they are seeking to hire employees for 3000 vacancies and in 2017 staffing members on how you wolf staff programs in your facilities with augmentation . Before i thousand places we lost in and 3000 positions is the freeze and the Government Shutdown is uncertain budget and are afraid to staff up and thats what theyre have in the 3000 positions. They are able to meet plus the new positions were hoping for to meet the requirements and as i said we are doing as many things as we can possibly think of a but its going to be a reach for us to get this staff but the other things were looking to is a lot of online programs that our inmates can be involved that are novice staff intensive and use as other sources and a training and education that are solely on Staff Members but we are looking at everything to get our positions filled up and get the programs to the inmates and as i said earlier, the only thing where missing is resources and if we get those we will be fine. Thank you mister chair. Senator cruz. Thank you mister chairman. Welcome. You started a position nine days after the death of Jeffrey Epstein. What happened with Jeffrey Epstein was on enormous black i to the department of justice and it was disgraceful and Jeffrey Epstein was a pedophile, was a sexual predator who prayed on young girls and yet he died in federal custody. He died in federal custody before he had a chance to testify about his crimes and about his wrongdoings and about the other powerful men who were complicit in that sexual abuse. That was a moment that shocked this country. There were powerful men who want to Jeffrey Epstein silenced. As i see it, there are only two possibilities for what happened with Jeffrey Epstein. Number one, there was gross negligence and a total failure of the bop to do his job. With a prisoner on suicide watch, that led to epstein committing suicide or number two, something far worse happened. That it was not suicide and rather a homicide carried out by person or persons who wanted epstein silenced. Either one of those is completely insightful. Both of those are profound indictments of bop and our incarceration system. I understand that theres an Inspector General investigation and the department of justice is looking at this but you came out right after this happened and as far as im concerned, when you came in that was an agency crisis. Lets take the more damning of the scenarios. Based on the evidence of which you are aware, is there any indication that Jeffrey Epsteins death was a homicide . Based upon the evidence im aware, no. But as ive already told it is still being investigated by the fbi and Inspector Generals Office and once they initiate the investigation we are required to remove ourselves from it and we dont talk to any Staff Members involved. We dont look at the evidence involved so i am not aware regarding the epstein investigation till is completed. Theres no indication burn anything i know that there is anything other than a suicide. As i understand it, to Prison Guards were recently indicted. For falling asleep when theyre supposed to be on watch for failing to engage in the periodic every 30 with a check on suicide watch for Jeffrey Epstein and falsifying their records to claim that they had in fact done their job when the allegation is not. Is that right . Thats what i heard but ive no official reporting of that at all. Other than those two individuals. Has anybody at bop yet been disciplined or terminated further conduct that led to the Jeffrey Epstein case . We are still waiting for the conclusion senator. We cant act on any of that to we have that information. I assure you, if theres any misconduct or if these individuals are indicted, we dont want people to like that working at the prison. They do not represent the vast majority of the 35,000 employees across the borough of prisons. Most of our staff are very high quality and good people. You are right. This is a black eye on the entire prison but everyone takes his singular incident and paints a whole brush and assumes the entire organization is functional and incompetent and thats absolutely not the case. We have some bad staff we got rid of that bad staff we go to their job. We want them gone one way or another from prosecution or termination. But good staff are doing extraordinary work and we manage 177,000 inmates. You dont hear anything about those people cars are doing their job well. The only time we have noticed this when something bad happens. Doctor sawyer, what given what occurred here, there is reason for a great deal of concern. I understand the sentiments that we have the back of your team and in its entirety but we have to Prison Guards that have just been indicted for literally falling asleep on the job and lying about it. My question to you is what have you done in this organization to determine how many other Prison Guards have followed asleep on the job and have lied about it and how many other video cameras unsolved to ensure safety and security as i understand the video cameras what are you doing proactively . To make sure this doesnt happen again . Within a couple of weeks i did a Video Program of all of our employees saying clearly that we dont know for sure what happened with the epstein case because we dont have the information. But if any mess Staff Members are not doing the rounds effectively, if they are not doing their counts effectively, after signing documents a says they are doing things that they are not doing, not only is it a violation of a law but we will to supplant them and prosecute them. I made the position very clear with all the employees out there in terms of the camera issue, we are right in the midst to replace all of our cameras across all our institutions going from increasing the number of cameras but in the meantime, the cameras were faulty but they are picking up whats happening and its not very clear. Its a grainy analog view which is Never Acceptable so were replacing all of our cameras and all of our institutions. That should be completed by next year. We should make it very clear that the directors have been very clear on telling them specifically in response to the staff that they are telling the staff and reminding them that they are very clear and evident of what the responsibilities are. If we have a training issue that our staff doesnt know how to do something, thats managements fault. We have to train those people. If theres instances where people know and choose not to do their job, that i want them gone and out of our institution. We dont want to make these inmates unsafe and our employees unsafe which is completely unacceptable. Thank you. That you very much that will conclude and thank you for serving this country yet again and i think youre the right person. Thank you senator