[indiscernible] two songs i wrote in the summer of 1965. Look up yonder in the sky, what is that i pray . A bird, a plane, a man insane, my president lbj. Hes flying high way up in the sky just like superman, i got a little piece of kryptonite, im gonna bring him back to land. I said, come out, lyndon, with your hands held high, drop your guns, baby, and reach for the sky. Got you surrounded and you aint got a chance. Gonna send you back to texas make you work on your ranch, yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah. He can call super woman and his super dogs. It sure wont do him no good i found out why from a russian spy he aint nothing but a comic book. Gonna pull him off the stands, clean up the land were gonna have us a brandnew day and what is more i got the fantastic four and spiderman to help him on his way i said come out, lyndon, with your hands held high drop your guns, baby, reach for the sky got you surrounded and you aint got a chance gonna send you back to texas, make you work on your ranch yeah, yeah. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah gonna make him an agricultural worker, part of his own poverty program. [applause] lordy, lordy, [laughter] give me an f. F. Thank you very much. I needed that. Well, come on all of you, big, strong men, uncle sam needs your help again. Got himself in a terrible jam way down yonder in vietnam. Put down your books pick up your gun were gonna have a whole lot of fun and its one, two, three, what are we fighting for . Dont ask me, i dont give a damn next up is vietnam and its five, six, seven, open up the pearly gates, aint no time to wonder why whoopee were all gonna die. Come on wall street, dont be slow, man, this is war augogo theres plenty good money to be made supplying the army with the tools of the trade just hope and pray that if they drop the bomb, they drop it on the viet cong. And its 1, 2, 3, what are we fighting for . Dont ask me, i dont give a damn next up is vietnam 5, 6, 7 open up the pearly gates aint no time to wonder why whoopee were all gonna die come on generals, lets move fast your big chance has come at last. Now you can go out and get those reds the only good commie is the one thats dead and you know that peace can only be won when weve blown them all to kingdom come. And its 1, 2, 3, what are we fighting for . Dont ask me, i dont give a damn next up is vietnam and its 5, 6, 7, open up the pearly gates aint no time to wonder why whoopee were all gonna die come on, mothers throughout the land pack your boys off to vietnam come on, fathers, dont hesitate send your daughters off before its too late. Be the first one on your block to have your kids come home in a box and its 1, 2, 3 next stop is vietnam. And its five, six, seven, open up the pearly gates. [applause] please welcome to the stage mr. Peter yarrow, singersongwriter and political activist, and mr. Bob santelli, executive director of the Grammy Museum at l. A. Live, joining mr. Country joe mcdonald for our next panel. [applause] well, joe, on behalf of everyone here i want to thank you for exercising your freedom of expression and freedom of speech. Thank you very much. [applause] 50 years. And, boy, for those of us who were alive back then and remember that song and remember those days, that was one song that could always get a call and response going and it did even here. Interesting, huh . Look, every generation has a soundtrack. Every historical era has a soundtrack. Every historical moment. Every movement. Music has played a vital part in americas history. Its been there from the revolutionary times and it goes right through our history even today. And almost always the music was creative, expressive, and sometimes controversial. And certainly in the 1960s the music was controversial because for the very first time american pop music embraced the idea that a song could act as an agent of social and political conquest. It could do something that allowed change in our world and in our time. It could do something to rally people to a particular point of view. And when in the 1960s this became something of import, many, many artists from country joe and peter, paul and mary on down took to the microphone, picked up guitars, and began to present a point of view. And sometimes that point of view was positive for some people and negative for others, and sometimes it was just different. However, what happens is by the late 1960s, its very clear that rock n roll, pop music, soul music, funk music all kinds of music have embraced the political point of view thanks in large measure to vietnam. So id like to discuss with my colleagues today and really begin with peter, if you will, since you go back to the early 1960s with this. We said on an earlier panel, i believe it was yesterday or the day before, that many of the ideas of the Antiwar Movement sprouted from the Civil Rights Movement. And you of course were very much involved in the Civil Rights Movement and the Antiwar Movement. Is that an accurate statement . And if so, how did it happen . Yes. That is the case. Im not sure that my microphone is on. Yes, there we are. Okay. Can you hear me . Yes. All right, good. The Civil Rights Movement was very important in terms of the Antiwar Movement in many ways. Number one, we were looking at what we, we who were a part of the Civil Rights Movement, peter, paul and mary sang at the march in washington in 1963 where Martin Luther king delivered his i have a dream speech and we sang two songs at that gathering. One of them was if i had a hammer and the other was blowing in the wind. If i had a hammer had become a very big hit. Everybody knew it. Blowing in the wind, it was the first exposure of america to the work of bob dylan. And that song peaked on the charts the week before the august 28 march on washington in 63. So we sang it, but we didnt sing it alone. We were not singing two people, just as you just sang with joe. The people held hands, and what they said together, with that expression of singing together, was our hearts are united. And we are united in doing something that is considered by many to be unamerican, by many to be unpatriotic. We were not following the rule of law. The rule of law supported at that time lynchings for which there was no possibility of some kind of legal recourse, no prosecutions. You go to washington, d. C. , if you were a person of color you could not use a bathroom or a public bathroom or a public water fountain unless it said for colored only. What we were supporting was the point of view that challenged the law. It challenged what doing you do your duty. You follow this law. No. For the first time, we said, as moral citizens, we have to do what is right for our country. Our country is not always right. Our country is but our job as citizens is to be engaged in that dialogue. So that set the stage for saying what our country if youre patriotic to us, you have to stop a war that we all felt was killing our young men. Peter, paul and mary sang in the v. A. Hospitals. We honored the troops. We prayed for the troops. We loved the troops. We loved that they did what they could and put their lives on the line for us. But we opposed the war and ultimately we did what we felt was a patriotic thing, which was to contravene a policy that was being pursued that was faulted extraordinarily on many levels. Number one, it was based on a tissue of lies. We know that from the pentagon papers. We know that now from mcnamaras, the westmoreland. But at the time we also knew it and we said, how can as john kerry said, and i worked with john kerry at Vietnam Veterans against the war, and i saw them suffer, suffer not only for what they experienced but for their being excoriated when they opposed the war. What we learned, what we could do was as americans love america by opposing what we felt was a war that as i said did not have a legitimate purpose. And today as i speak of this, now i am throwing it back to you, had we really fully embraced what youre trying to do here today at the center which is to form the basis of healing, is exactly what was said in the last Discussion Panel which was, we have to have a clear purpose, know that we are in jeopardy. We have to, we have to know that thats the case. Or we go on and do it, again, as we did, from my point of view, when we went into iraq. And if we can heal and hate the war, and not divide between those who say, you were unpatriotic. No, you were unpatriotic and say, we love those who put their lives, and there were people who resisted the war, went to jail, left their lives. We have to honor them. We have to honor those who put their lives on the line for the country in the service of trying to do what they could in their patriotic view. And if we can do that, there can be some healing. Thats what we need to do. [applause] bob santelli joe, one of your songs has become one of the signature songs of the Antiwar Movement. It is an interesting story how you wrote it, and then also its its incredible spontaneous role in the woodstock music festival. Can you tell us how first you came to write it and second how you came to perform it at woodstock . Country joe mcdonald well, i was in the navy during the civil rights pretty much, and i came back, went to college. They didnt tell me about the gi bill. I dropped out. My parents were radical leftists, so i grew up with communism. But i didnt like communism. They didnt help us in any way. But i didnt hate communists, my parents were communists. [laughter] and you know, i had a good time in the military. And because of the personal experience with my parents and my father losing his job, that is another thing. I didnt like i didnt trust the left wing. I didnt like civilians. I think that when youre in the military, god bless civilians, but really they dont know whats going on. [laughter] but i really, and that song just popped into my head because it was about the militaryindustrial complex, and the unique thing about that song is that it doesnt blame soldiers. And it traveled so many places. I mean, i could not believe where that song went. But i work with Vietnam Veterans against the war. I just love those guys, man. They were so good. I learned so much about the war. Coming here this summer freaked me out because i just opened up that wound, and man, it was just horrible, horrible stuff. But i was telling you earlier today, about 15 years ago, i attended of a viet veterans for peace conference in san francisco. I live in berkeley, california. And one of the speakers there was phil butler, who spent seven years in hanoi hilton. And he came up to me and he said, joe, when we were in hanoi hilton, and i had read the book called love and war is it . About when he was a prisoner and his wife struggled to communicate with him and everything. I knew all about hanoi hilton. And he came over to me and he said, when we were in the compound they used to play hanoi hilton hannah. They would play American Music to us to demoralize us, you know. And make us homesick and everything. But every time we heard that song, it boosted our morale. [laughter] and i thought, those goddam french educated vietnamese commanders could probably not understand american humor that, whoopee, we are all going to die would make them feel good. [laughter] so you know, but americans were unique people. So he said, i never dreamed that i would live long enough to hear you sing that song in person, and we just started crying and hugged each other. I mean, i get so emotional just thinking about it right now. Bob santelli and the song you sang at woodstock. Country joe mcdonald and i played it at woodstock, yeah. Wasnt supposed to play it at woodstock. I mean, it wasnt a big deal, but they wanted me to fill in time for the audience because santana band couldnt get there. And i hadnt been playing acoustic music. And they told me, youve got to save us. Youve got to do something. I told them, i dont want to do it. They said i said, i dont have a guitar. So they grabbed a cheap yamaha guitar and handed it to me. I said, i dont have a guitar strap, so they cut a strap and pushed me out there. I sang for about a half hour. Nobody knew who the hell i was. They were just talking. It was like, woodstock was like a giant family picnic really. People just talking, schmoozing and laughing and stuff. And i walked off stage, and i said to my partner, who was moonlighting there on the staff, i said, can i do the cheer . Because i mean, i was saving it for the band later on when the band played. And he said, nobody is paying any attention to you. What difference does it make what you do . [laughter] i said, ok, and i walked out and i yelled, give me an f. And they all stopped talking and looked at me and yelled f and i thought, oh, my god. Here we go. Got made into a movie and made my career, enabled me to pay the rent, ill tell you that. And maybe, made some people feel good. Im so glad. But you know, i had a guy tell me his buddy died in nam, bled to death in his arms, and the last word he said is, were going to die. I mean, this is serious stuff. When i first learned i was coming to this summit, i got so sad. Then i got angry. And here i am. [laughter] [applause] bob santelli one of the interesting things about the war is there were pop songs that were written that really didnt do say anything about the war itself that werent meant to be antiwar this or that or anything. And im thinking about a song like leaving on a jet plane, which then became a song which you and peter, paul and mary your number one hit song and i believe in 1970 and that was embraced by a lot of soldiers, simply because of the fact that it was leaving on a jet plane. When you heard that, that this was a popular song over in vietnam, what did you think . Peter yarrow well, let me respond in this way. Over the years with peter, paul and mary, when we would perform this song, it was not unusual for a vietnam vet, who at that point was significantly older, to come over to us, and said, you know, that song was my link to home. I know you opposed the war, but it meant so much to me. And then theyd break down in tears, and wed hold them and hug them and thank them for their service, because they put their lives on the line for us. And so the songs that was a link to their home, but when we sang at the v. A. Hospital, they wanted not only to hear that, they wanted to hear where have all the flowers gone, which is the [applause] calls not which further commitment to disagree with somebody with a different point of view, it calls for an the real people, which is the war itself. I would have fought in the second world war. Am not a bottomline pacifist Woody Guthrie fought in the second world war. But with the music. In the case of leaving on a jet certainly was a link, and when somebody would say i am leaving on a jet plane, i dont know when i will be back again it was very painful. That is. Singing but the songs that united the people who said, we have to stop the war. We are not we do not think this is a legitimate war, as john kerry said, how can you ask somebody who is the last person to die for a war nobody w ants . Mandela,ing the great an anthem of sorts, about a young man, and this is an interesting story, a young man who goes to jail rather than serve in war. He cannot serve in this war, and then he goes on a hunger strike, and then he dies. Who areide, the people opposing him say, ok, he is dead. We do not have to endure his accusations. We can kill now. We can hate now. Now we can and the world. It is caution, take your place on the prayer wheel of life as it moves through your brief moment of time. When or lose, now you must choose. If you lose, you are only losing your life. When i was at the washington, cathedral washington wehedral with pete seger, were appointed in different directions, acknowledging the individuals in the war. This was not a body count. Each human life was sacred. Indeed on both sides. When i did that, after i sang that song, they played taps. During taps, there was the sound of a woman wailing. And that juxtaposition was just overwhelming and painful beyond painful. We did not know what it was wast, but she said, my son serving in vietnam, and he said, if i am to die there, one to the words to that song engraved on my tombstone. And i did so. I engraved the words to that song. So you have to understand how songs permeated the culture then, unlike today, when the nature of music has become so superficial compared to that era, when that was the real heart and soul of our conscience that was being expressed in the way that you just experienced it when joe talked about it and when you sang. Bob joe, or certain the bay 1960s,ing the midlate at a time when america experiences a countercultural rise of the hippie. 50th anniversary is coming up of the summer of love. By and large, that Countercultural Movement with the social movement, and to even some degree of business a philosophical and musical movement, but not so much a Political Movement except for one band that stood out amongst the others, and that was country basically,ish, which i remember reading someone saying it provided the political aspects of what the countercultural should be doing and the way it should be acting. Yet, sometimes when i look back, it seems like country joe and the fish basically stood out all them,elf, the rest of grateful dead clearance clearwater revival, any of these great bands from that time, they did not get so involved politically like you did. How come . Joe i dont know, bob. [laughter] nobody knew what to do with the sand people did not know what to do with me. I have 22 songs about the vietnam war, from welcome home, to agent orange, to combat, just all kinds of songs, and i wanted to tell a story. Im changing the subject, but , a long time ago on the david frost show, we sang. And charles robb, Lyndon Johnson were on that show, also because they were engaged to be married. And people rode into the david frost show a lot of letter saying, those bearded, filthy creeps should be sent back to russia and stuff like that. None of us had beards though. [laughter] anyway, one letter said, dear mr. Frost, why did you have to have that horrible rock band on their singing a horrible song about vietnam when those lovely people, Lyndon Johnson and there . Robert, or on i dont think im ever going to watch your show again. And i save those letters all these years, and i thought, how am atlife is that here i the lbj library. Thanks to you, i hope i have not disappointed you. Answer myo not question, but that is ok. Aside, there were some other brands, like the mc5, in new york, doing some pretty radical things musically and politically. But in the end, i think too many cut the left and Antiwar Movement confused with the hippie when often times the occasionally overlapped. Peter, when you are in the midst 1967, there966, was, i am sure, across words in your career, where your folk star and pop stars, as well, and by committing to a political platform in your news 8, that you were certainly going to alienate a sizable number of your audience and people thinking less of you, not buying your records. How did you handle that in terms of your career . How did you endure and say, we are going to be above this and push on . In the Civil Rights Movement, as i said, that was the first time that we stepped out and became components of appointive view that was highly, highly controversial. Although, in the north, there was not a lot of controversy about it, but when we did sing at the selma, montgomery march, that was the end of our selling in the southern states, and we had been warned by warner bros. That would happen. But we were, as mary would have raiders. , segers children in a way. He had told us if you use your music to express your ethical perspective and you unite that, then you are giving a great gift to yourself. And following in the tradition of these songs, that many of them certainly came from the when union movement, but we were in the Antiwar Movement was a musician i on one hand, and youre quite right, there was the hippie point of view, which was about the spirit and love, caring, and then there were the consequences that we were dealing with. The other part of my life is as an organizer and the Antiwar Movement, and we kept a low profile because there was a nixon enemy list. I organized with a woman by the name of cora weiss, an march in washington. That march called the celebration of life was attended by half a million people, and that is generally credited as the moment where the public sentiment turned against the war. In that gathering, my job was to mobilize the performers, which , and a lotte seeger of the really diverse kind of music to express that sense, not antiwar, as much as let us bring peace, and we had john denver singing. Miller, and the cast of hair, and a String Quartet from the cleveland symphony orchestra, and earl scruggs from Country Music and peter, paul, and mary, and on and on. Music. T event was 90 another march,d where all night in a candlelight procession of people with their candles put the name of an american soldier who was killed into a coffin, and then those coffins were born to the pentagon. That was the march against death, followed by the celebration of life. True, that folk music, but other kinds of music in 1972, we organized something at chase stadium with janis steppenwolf,ence, and i called and mobilized by talking to them, and whether it was paul, and at Madison Square garden, i organized something with jimi hendrix and with blood, sweat and tears, so there was an involvement, but not in the sense of they are picking up the banner the way country joe did, and writing songs and walking the walk in that particular way. They simply got on stage, but cases,they did, in all as was true in the Civil Rights Movement, we got together, and i said, we are not here to knock people out with her songs and perform. We are here to make a statement that will help us to move society to a place where we will have rater equity and peace, so whatever you do, that has to be your attention, and you need to say some words to let people know that that is where you are standing, and when people have it in their hearts, i dont care if they are singing lemon tree or whatever, we are going to live in peace is the message and people feel that. That was true at all of these events. Truth andhe sake of the reality of it all, the Antiwar Movement certainly embraced popular music to get its message across, but truth be told, there was also many, many country artists, who were expressing the other side of the viewpoint of the war. Many of us remember the ballad of the green berets, princes, which came out in 1966, 1967, which told a different heroic story or song narrative, and many in the country had written songs. It is just that those songs in the late 1960s, Country Music is not what it is today. Texas,pretty much in south, southwest, et cetera. It did not infiltrate to the north into cities like new york like it does now, but there were other songs and artists taking other positions and using song as the vehicle to express those opinions. To underscore that that is the case, but it was the that,inute group that did or as categorically, you had the beatles, and all we are saying is give peace a chance. The massive rest of the music business embraced the Civil Rights Movement, embraced the peace movement. Not to say that there were not others who had a different point of view, but if we are going to be accurate, we have to know that the scale was minute in the country sound. Our time, ius of want to make sure that since we began with a song and joe, that i leave time for you to take us out in song, so i will end it here. Thank you for coming and thank to dor the opportunity this. I will turn it over to you. [applause] i am going to stand in front of these, but you can hear me from this microphone, too, if you would like. Song that i see now. My prayer, my hope. And i thank linda and lucy and chuck. All of you. Ok. Its good. Good. My prayer is that by gathering together and expressing what we feel we find that there are ways for us to love each other and embrace those who feel differently from the way we do. I left my capo over there. Chalk it up to the years, folks. [laughter] here it is. I went to vietnam three times, focused around the issue of agent orange and the damage that it did. And i have a lot of footage, and i hope to, i made an hour piece on it, but im going to extend it. The day that i arrived there i went to the Friendship House where half of the kids there were, we knew had the kind of thalidomide disabilities that were almost impossible to endure and see. You know, i dont want to describe it because its so terrible. And it gets in the blood, it gets in the genetic system. And its inherited. And so the, because after you cant identify if somebody got it, the disability, from agent orange or not because after eight years its no longer there. And i was singing with these kids and holding these kids with you know, not, with eyes that, i cant even say. And i went to the hanoi opera house where i was singing, its just like the paris opera house. I was singing a concert. And i was so troubled by what i saw. And realized what we had done, it didnt matter at that moment the kind of discussion about whether or not we, what, you know, president carter saying you can come back and, thats not the issue. We have to love each other and accept each other and let that pain, and not try and justify our pain by saying we were right or wrong. Because if we dont look at what weve done and accept what we did terrible things, notwithstanding whatever was done to us, notwithstanding the pain of our friends and comrades who died or lived in misery and as p. O. W. S. Yes. But how do we get beyond that . Well, one of the ways we can do it is by having this kind of symposium. And one of the ways is by singing a song together that affirms something thats important no matter what position you took. And this song, when i came to the point of singing this at the hanoi opera house, i said i want to sing this song but i cant. I cant do it until i tell you how i feel. I saw those kids. I saw those kids. I cant, i have to let you know as one american. Im not saying things werent done back and forth. As one american how deeply sorry i am for what we did to your country. 3 million dead. Yes, we lost 58,000 men. And more than that committed suicide because of the pain they endured after they came home. And my heart breaks for them. And afterwards, you know what the vietnamese said to me . And they would say this to anybody. They said, you dont have to apologize. We just want to have our country and live in peace. And now were their major ally and trading partner. How do we build peace . We build it by taking down those walls. Id like everybody to sing this song that was a great anthem. [guitar chords playing] and its not about the soldiers or the protesters. Its about properly putting our commitment into ending war. And particularly not going into war unless its a just war. And then with the heaviest of hearts. So id like you to please stand up. I know for some of you its difficult to stand up. For me too. It comes with the years. And just join our hands, put our arms around each other all day, and sing. For all of us. And for our childrens children. Where have all the flowers gone long time passing where have all the flowers gone ago time where have all tehe flowers gone young girls have picked them, everyone ever learnhey when will they ever learn young girlsll the gone . Where have all the young girls gone long time passing younghave all tehe girls gone ago time where have all the young girls gone for young men, everyone learnill they ever ever learn where have all the young men gone . Let me hear you now. Where have all the young men gone long time passing where have all the young men gone ago time where have all the young men gone they have gone for soldiers everyone ever learnhey learn they ever and very solemnly and prayerfully, for all those who were injured, killed, wounded and maimed, where have all the soldiers gone . Many not to the graveyards, but to lives of great, great despair and difficulty. Where have all the soldiers gone . Where have all the soldiers gone long time passing soldierse all the gone ago time gone have all the soldiers graveyards everyone they ever learn learnill they ever where have all the graveyards gone long time passing where have all the graveyards gone long time ago where have all the graveyards gone gone to flowers everyone when will they learn learnill they ever when will we ever learn . And we sing when will we ever learn ever, ever learn and then we sing where have all the flowers gone and the irony and the pain of the endless cycle, when will we ever learn . But we do know that when we can love each other and say we are sorry, and we forgive each other , we are taking the right step. I am so sorry for anything that has brought to war, any war, unjust war. Where have all the flowers gone together, softly. Where have all the flowers gone long time passing where have all the folwers gone long time ago gone have all the flowers young girls have picked them everyone when will they ever learn they ever learn when will we ever learn. Last time. When will we ever learn ever, ever learn [applause] joe mcdonald. [applause] announcer we will be live to mark the 50th anniversary of the 1969 woodstock testicle, a threeday rock concert that attracted nearly half billion people to a dairy farm in upstate new york. Our guests historian david farber, author of the age of great dreams, america in the 1960s. This is a coproduction with cspans washington journal. First, here is part of a 1969 abc news report about the impact the massive crowd had on a town close to the festival