American history at the university of texas at austin. One of the things we want to find out is how your career began. I know your father was the chief photographer for the philadelphia inquirer, but that does not mean that you would become a photographer. It started with the photographers at the philadelphia inquirer. I used to go back and harass them and then end up upside down. In the print barrel [laughter] i just was enamored with what they did in the business. Justther passed away before my 15th birthday. But i knew what i wanted to do the rest of my life. And i did not know how i was going to do it, but i was on a mission to try to have gone hook on to the news media somehow and become a part of photojournalism. And i was lucky enough to do that. I got out of the marine corps and i had applied at upi news pictures. As the boss said to me in new york, we got so tired of getting letters from you to have a job that we decided to stop the letters and hire you. I ended up coming to austin, texas. I worked on the americanstatesman here. It was the very beginning of my career. Upi had a unique setup, where we had a contract to be there staff as a group of photographers. Only the photographic and of it. Of course, i got to know austin and the people here. And i really grew very fond of austin. ,t the beginning, i thought what a great gig, as we used to hook on to a lucky break like that. So that was the start of my career here. But that was right at the beginning of june, july of 1963. I came on board. And of course, as we all know the kennedy assassination , happened in november. Of course, i got involved with it right away. Because i had walked into the office at noon time, and i was reading the awire when the first dispatch eight bells went off on the upi ticker, and the bulletin came across that president kennedy had been shot in dallas. I had been with the president the day before in san antonio, when he arrived here with jackie. They were going to send me up to dallas with him, but they decided to bring me back to austin, because they were going to have a big democratic dinner and with governor connally senator yarborough. That is why he came to texas. That was the beginning of my career. I spent the next and i was transferred to philadelphia. Before we get away from your here stint here in austin, you have and to be there at that fateful moment when Lee Harvey Oswald was being transferred from the police station, and jack ruby shot him there in front of everyone. You were there with a camera. But all sorts of stories came from that moment. Can you tell us about that . Frank yes. I relieved the overnight person, photographer, that sunday morning. We really thought there had been a transfer of oswald during the night. , ofthey did not do it course. They arraigned him sunday morning. I relieved the overnight guy. I was there from 5 00 in the morning at the base of that driveway. Across from the lockup area. Until they brought oswald to transfer him. They were going to transfer him in a car and put a blanket over him. They had a truck before that. They were going to use that as a decoy to take them to the courthouse to arrange him. When they brought oswald out, he was within three feet of me when jack ruby leaped out from behind me and went between bob jackson and i, fired the gun. We were all thrown to the floor. Because there must have been 100 police in that basement that sunday morning. It was the first time that they ever did videotape on a spot news story. Nbc was the pool there. That was why they could keep replaying it. They continued that for weeks on end. To illustrate the story. So that was the beginning of my career. But i remember being thrown to the ground. I was shooting with an sp nikon. The floor. Hrown to when i looked up, there was a dallas detective on the back truck of the car with a gun pointed at me, yelling, do not move. Because they did not know what happened. It happened so quickly. Even though there were tv lights, it was fairly dark down there. So much commotion, because jack ruby came from where we were standing, which were the still photographers. There were only three of us and , andie tone news cameraman then the tv people. It happened so quickly. It was as quick as you could snap your fingers. But when i photographed him when it happened, i looked up, and this Police Officer i am looking up from before, and he has a handgun on me and dont move. Steady untilhing they got the analyst ambulance down into the basement to transport oswald to the hospital. After that happened it seemed like an hour, but it probably was five minutes. Or less. I remember going up the driveway, because i did not know dallas at all. I had only been in the police in that hallway, and i had practically lived there for a week until the shooting did happen. So when i got to the end of the driveway, i remember looking for a telephone. There was a telephone booth down the end of the street. So i run down there and called the bureau, and they said, we saw you on tv, did you get any pictures . I said i shot some pictures. I do not know whether i got blocked or what happened. It happened so quickly, as quickly as you saw on tv. They said, where are you . Minute. Old on a i put the telephone down, and i look at the street sign to see where i was. I remember them and sending george holcombe, who was a lab guy from upi. Been there a long time. He pulled up in this pickup truck as i am standing on the corner, and he said give me all your film. It was one role, of course. I handed it to him. He looked at me and said, well because i was the youngest guy on the staff he says frank, baby, you really ran into it this morning, didnt you . He told me this story after. He said you know i have been with united press for 30 years, i have developed a lot of film in my day. But when i turned the lights out in the dark room to process your said, i froze. When i went to go to put the film on the real and develop it on the reel and develop it, he said it never happened to me before. He said i started to think about how important the image was that i was about to develop. And he said i never had a roll of film that important in my life. That really had a historical effect on everything we did in the business. He told me the story after. Oft was really the beginning my time. To testifyubpoenaed at the ruby trial. They called me the second week. The unique part of the story is and my used to kid me. He said every time we send you to dallas, something happens. I said, well, nothing is going to happen, because i am just going to court. [laughter] jackgoing to photograph ruby doing the walk in every day and the walkout, until they call me. Saying, well, the first week you did not get called. The second week, like wednesday, i got up. Everybody sat on the floor, because there was nowhere to sit in the hallway. All the tv guys and still guys have equipment on the floor. And we had a press room all the opposite end of the corridor. It dead ended. I said to a couple of my colleagues, look, i am going to go call the office and tell them i have not been called and it is pretty quiet. Of course, i had my cameras around me. I walked up the stairs, past the elevator, to the empty courtroom. And i did not realize one of my competitors was behind me. Ap photographers. He was going to do the same thing. I did not hear him when he said it. So i get down to the end of the hallway, and it is an lshape and would get and at that hallway. The courtroom was dead ahead. There were two doors to this courtroom. I go to walk towards the opening of the lshaped part of the hallway, and i heard a woman scream. I look to my left, and three feet ahead, there is a guy with a gun to a womans head. He goes im going to kill her, like that. Me, myphotographer tells god, this guy has a gun. The doorway,gh headfirst into the empty courtroom. Came in behind me. So i did not get any pictures, because it happened so quickly. So i went to the other doorway on the 90 degree turn and walked out in the hallway. And he had disappeared. And i did not realize he had two hostages in the next courtroom next door empty courtroom. ,so he came out with a different hostage, and he studied towards me. Strobe,ad to blow a because it was so dark. There was no light in the hallway. He makes a righthand turn and is headed towards all the people at the far end of the building. I am saying, oh my gosh, this guy has a gun. He will go and kill jack ruby in the middle of the court session. Nobody knows about it. Everybody is all at the far end of the building. So i am sliding down the wall going that way. And he is twoandahalf, three feet from me with a hostage. And he turns to me and he says to me, you take another step and im going to kill her. Like that. What i did not realize, there were two Texas Rangers on the opposite side, up against the wall. One had a. 45 tucked in his belt. As he was going by. There were some elevators. The other ranger, or detective, slammed the fire doors that were at the top of the stairs, which locked me behind. I went, oh,my gosh. I have to get out of the building somehow and get act up to that courtroom. Because there were people in line waiting to get injuring get in during the court session. All the way up the hallway and up the stairs on the far side of the building. Escape, wentfire down the fire escape, i have my cameras flopping and flying. Way around tothe the third side of the building, and who do i physically almost run into . Gotten down the stairs, paso courtroom, out onto the street. And i came around the corner and almost ran smack into him physically. Of course, he freaked out. He crosses the street with the hostage. He has a gun to her head. And on the far side, there was a parking lot, one level parking lot off the sidewalk. In diameter looking through the long lens of my camera, and i see this body jumping over the top of cars in the parking lot. It was a dallas detective, it turned out to be. He leapt off the top of the car and captured this fellow on the street. What it was was there was a jailbreak on the upper floor. This guy came down through the laundry chute, apparently, and took two hostages. And that is when i ran into them, going in to the press room to tell them everything was quiet during the session, that nothing was going on. [laughter] m, myen i shipped the fil boss called me, and said, remember what i told you . [laughter] what is with you . [laughter] ilwhat is that character, l abner. [laughter] always a cloud over his head. Frank my wife always kids me and says you are the forrest gump of photography. [laughter] right from the beginning. Well, you know, your life seems to go from adventure to one the next. Not the jump too much in time of course, you are an extreme an exmarine. Thefind yourself covering vietnam war in 1967. In the course of that you take a , picture of a wounded, beleaguered marine holed up in a chapel. Called the peace chapel, church. This was the dramatic picture of a soldier under the duress of combat. The enemies surrounding the place. It was a really dramatic couple of days for this squad. Acquired aotograph history all of its own. Can you trace the impact of that photograph . 37 yeart took on a history that i could never believe took place over any photograph that i have ever shot. May 15, 1967. I remember it like you and i are talking now. I had gotten dropped into a operation instroy that province. We were not on the ground 15 minutes. It was the First Battalion of marines. They had been hit pretty bad the day before. Taken on a lot of casualties. I was no sooner on the ground, walking over to link up with them, and all of a sudden, north the enemies north vietnamese had us surrounded. 30 feet, 40 feet away. They opened up on all of us. One of the marines to my left was looking through the tree line, the jungle, and there was a building on the other side. He was yelling, lets get to the building. Come on. Get the casualties, and we will get them over to the building. It turned out to be a catholic church, built during the french period. It was a big, big church. For that size, in that country, it was quite a large church itself. We made our way to the church. The enemy fought us up to the doors and windows of the church. A lot of things i did not know for many years, but we were being shelled by them. A movie cameraman with me. We were the only two camera people with the group at the time. Ed was shooting 35mm black and white film movies. So we get into the church, and there were a lot of wounded and a lot of dead, too, unfortunately. Shovels were coming in, and i really thought they were going to zero in on us very quickly. I am lining up on the floor of that church, and when i looked up and saw this marine sitting there with his m16. Dirty face. He had been out there for several days. And when i looked at him, he had the thousandyard stare. Called at the thousandyard stare in the marine corps. I had a light around my neck. The light was pretty low it was in the afternoon. I remember the light being so low, i was shaking so bad from being shelled, that i was afraid i was afraid i would blow the picture by the slow shutter speed. I shot one frame. Then i hit the floor again, because they hit us again. We were rescued the next day, out of their, by 2 26. Linee laid in the tree nine hours. Got all of the wounded out of there and all of the dead first. We were the last few of us out of there. Each chopper that came in got fired at. To come in and rescue us. And those marine pilots, i have to say, they were a godsend. They risked their lives to come get us. And they got us out of there, thank god. But the marine i photographed was in a was next to me. I could never get his name, because we were under fire. There was not a minute to talk. At all. Because we all feared for our lives. I was just shooting while this whole thing was going on. He got off the chopper, he went to the left, i went to the right, and i got on an airplane back to saigon. Flew the film back myself, took the film back, and dropped it on the photo desk in saigon. They processed it, and i went out on another operation back up north. 37 years, this picture got circulated, and there were stories done about a lot of things on vietnam. S picture scene to send a seemed to end up as sort of an icon for a lot of the written stories. Mine,re was a friend of who i work with, at the paper. Came in one day, and he had this photograph. He said i just saw this photograph and he had been in vietnam. Been in the army, and he worked for stars and stripes. And he said, who shot this, your dad . He was teasing me. I said, uncle phil, no. I called him uncle phil. He said, do you know what happened to this fellow . I said, i have no idea. But it is the only picture i have hanging in my house, in my den, from the war. My wife, nancy, used to dust it and say, i know he made it home. I bet he lives on the west coast and has a couple of kids and made it just find. I said i hope you are right. It is the one thing that has always haunted me. The Washington Post to do a story to try to find this man and his family and find out what happened. Which he did. It turned out his brother had he knew that i took the photograph of his brother years before, actually. And this is what i told phil. They lived in atlanta, georgia. And they had always had this picture hanging in their home. And it was always uncle richard, who served in the marine corps. His brother told me that on his 14th birthday, richard was killed by sniper. I never knew that for a long, many, many years. Until phil did this story, and we went down to see the family, and it was a three part series in the paper. Usa the third part, today was publicizing a four hour documentary on vietnam that they were doing. If they took this photograph, this black and white photograph, and they blew it up full page. And they colorized it. [laughter] the funny part of this story, if there is any humor to it, is the fact that when they did this, i was going over to the white house to cover something for the paper that way day. One of my tv colleagues said, did you see they used that marine picture you shot in usa today. They said he was a soldier. I said that is all right. And they colorized it. I said, they colorized it, really . In the meantime, a fellow by the name of mike in providence, rhode island calls pbs. , flippingn the office through usa today, and sees this photograph. He calls christie, the publicist her, i, and he said to just wonder i have never been able to get a print of this picture. She said, i do not understand. He said, well, i have never been able to get a ring of this picture, but it is a picture of me. She said, i beg your pardon. Because she knew the story in the post, but he didnt. It turned out kirsten says to mike, she says you should call the photographer, he lives in washington. He says, oh, no, he is dead. He is dead. I called upi back in 1970, to try to get in contact with me, said he was killed where richards brother was killed. There was dead silence. And she said, no, i am going to give you his telephone number. I know he will want to talk to you. So he calls me. Quite often when youre on a military operation, you all look alike. You are out in the bush a couple of days. It could have been a mistake. So when i called mike, i had him on the phone. The first five minutes of our phone conversation, i am saying to myself, oh my god, this is incredible. , not even seeing the man, this is the man in the church with me, who i photographed. So he says to me, well i said, i will make sure you get a print, mike, of course. I said, can you send me a picture of yourself back then. I just was not sure. Everything was spinning at the time. Even though i did believe him. I said would it be possible for me to fly up to barrington with phil mccombs, the writer. I would like to see you. He said, sure, come on up. One of those situations. So we flew up immediately. And i remember remember walking up the front walkway to mikes house. And his wife came out, and she said to me, frank, i cannot tell you how much we appreciate you coming up here. And she put her arms around me, and i gave her a hug. She did not know the story the , whole story. Because she had not seen the post. She said mike is out back. Come on in the living room. He will be right in. So i am sitting in the living room. And mike comes walking from the doorway in the kitchen from the backyard. And when he looked at me and i looked at him, that was the real marine that i photographed. 37 years before. It was really incredible. It was unbelievable. For ae, through talking couple of hours, he said i am going to church. I want you to meet my priest. He knows the story about us. All about us. We are sitting in the service, and tripper i call him tripper and i felt this, his elbow. He leans over to me and says in my ear, beats the last time we were sitting in church together, doesnt it . Then, i knew. But i had the hard thing to do ahead of me. Before i left to fly up there, i mans rob sutter, this brother. And i said i told him what had happened. I said, look, i do not know. I am going up to investigate this. But i will let you know as soon as i know. He said, call me tomorrow morning, meaning the next day. I was up all night with mike, and i go back to the hotel. It is 6 30 in the morning. I pick up the phone to call rob sutter. Rob had been a marine also. I am sitting there and saying to myself, i cannot do this. I cannot do this to this man. Not over the telephone. It is not fair. Another fellow marine i am having a hard time dealing with this. I really am. But i have to call him. And i do not know what i am going to say. I was scrambling upstairs. Via got rob on the phone the first thing out of his mouth was all right, j, what do you think . And they just came out of my mouth. Is not sou know, it important what i think. It is more important what you think. He says what are you talking about . I said, is it possible for me to bring mike tripp down to atlanta . I want you guys to meet. I want you to tell me. He says sure. Absolutely. So we flew to atlanta. We went to robs house. We went and had lunch. We are all talking, a reporter and mike and rob and i. That robf the things said was it is my sons High School Homecoming tomorrow night, and i would love you guys to join us. I told him what has happened here. It is not really his uncle richard in this photograph, who we thought. But it is another fellow marine. I explained this to my son. He was 15 years old 15 yearsold at the time. But he is over on the High School Football field, having lunch with his friends. I remember the four of us walking across the field. I could see his son spot us from this stand. He came down. And he crossed the field. And rob says to his son, i want you to meet mike tripp, the marine in the picture that we have had hanging in our home all these years. And this young fellow put his hand out and shook mikes hand, he said, sir, i am really glad to see you are alive. I still lose it to this day. Realizeow i did not how many lives it affected. Half ago,a year and a for the first time in all those years, i met with the same marines who were in that church with us 37 years more than that, 38 years ago at quantico. We all sat down and had dinner together at restaurant quantico. It was a great evening. It really was. Of course, we all got older and grayer and pudgier, all of us. Corpse spirit of the never left the room. I just felt fortunate enough to be alive to be able to see all these guys again. And they had saved my life. I know that. I would never have made it out of there alive if it had not been for all of them and the rest of the marines, including the pilots. I feel very fortunate. The picture had a neverending route for me and for mike tripp, too. I talk to mike tripp made a still to thishs day. He is the real brother i never had. Amazing story. There is a lot more to photography than aiming and shooting. Frank yes. It affected so Many American families, that war. Believe me, the men from the First Battalion ninth marines were really an Incredible Group of brave men. They really were. Later, i am, years doing a story for the post about louis goldstein, comptroller for it maryland. His bodyguard was a maryland state trooper. Sitting in the gettingwhen louis is the telephone call. I do not know how we got on this conversation, but he said he was going on vacation to southeast asia. I said i was just over there a few years ago. It is a great place to go back. He said i was there during the war. He said i was a marine. I said really, what outfit were you with . He said, i was with 19. I asked if he was at an hoa. He said yeah, i was a mortar man. Talk about a one in a million chance. I said to him, i was one of the guys with you. And i thank you for all your servers for saving my life, along with another friend of mine, and getting us out of there, really. So its a small world, in many ways. Photography takes an amazing circle, sometimes. I want to get you to talk just briefly about the moment you decided to put your photographic archives here at the briscoe center. How did you make that decision . Frank well i was approached by , don carleton, who is a man of vision. He really is. Because too many times in photography, and our professional careers, film gets lost or destroyed. And it never surfaces. And it never gets a chance to surfers ever because of that surface ever because of that kind of a situation. When don approached me and asked me, i thought it is really how did he find me, first of all. I did not know whether he had the right guy or not. I said to him, you sure you have the right fellow here . That. D yeah, i am sure of and i began to realize, when he started to tell me what he was about to put together, and he was in the process at the time, i thought, wow, thats amazing. And where is it happening . The university of texas. That is where i started out, in austin. I gotn incredible chills down my body when i started to think about it. And i thought what better home than the university of texas, could i ever put anything i ever did. And i really mean that sincerely. It is near and dear to my heart. I just feel very privileged that i am able to join a group of incredible photojournalists, who don has had the insight to go after and collect their material. A lot of people that i worked with in the field in vietnam, and other places. And to be included as part of that group. So that is really the way i felt about my whole journey here. It has been incredible. Of course, with allison back beck, she has been great. She has managed to hand carry me in here very well also. What a team. What a team. When i start to talk about them to my friends, i often think ended up it could have in a basement somewhere and being thrown into a trash, or, like a lot of peoples work. Overimes, that does occur the years. You die off, and they did not know what it is, and so they toss everything. But don got to us in the nick of time and managed to pull this off. As you say, a lauded important historical evidence would have been lost how this collection not turned up here. I want you to end with your experience photographing that tragedy at jonestown in the in guyana. I know you covered that. Frank i was the first guy in. Very quickly. One of our reporters was with congressman ryan, and they were at the runway five miles from johnstown when a group of men on a tractor drawn trailer with machine guns came in and shot everybody on the runway, including congressman ryan killed them. , charlie dove to the left of the front wheel of the aircraft, and everybody else does the other way. And they were all hit or killed. Most of them were killed. Charlie escaped into the jungle and got out of there and went into, like, a village that night. The army send up a transport the next morning. And he flew back to jonestown, guyana, where we all flew in originally. Twoove up on a charter with post people to collect charlie krauses belongings, because we thought he had been killed. We went up to the room in the hotel in jonestown. We opened the door, and their charlie was, filing a purse firstperson story. Talk about a great site sight to see. He was just covered in mud from head to toe. Charlie was filing this story from what happened to it in the meantime, he finishes filing, and the minister of information holds a press conference for the press. They got into a bit of a match between tv and the minister of information about getting in there. The minister of information decided no one was going to go. Well, it turned out they knew charlie was in the room, and all of the reporter said look, this man is one of the only survivors. Let him go up there along with a photographer, still photographer. Thee all drew straws, photographers in the room. And i drew the short straw. So charlie and i flew from georgetown up to court port kaituma. We get off the airplane, and there is a helicopter sitting to the side. There was a soldier in the chopper. I jumped into what would be the door gunners seat. The door was open. And as we took off we took off fairly low. We were maybe 500 feet off the ground. And flew over the compound. As we started to approach the compound, we saw all these people outside this pavilion. Bright colors on. Im shooting, and the closer i am getting to the scene overhead, i began to release realize there was no one moving. No one at all on the ground. So we sat down, we walked in, and i walked into the compound there were dead people outside all over the place. Came upon wasp i a group of about six people with a child between them. They were all face down, arm in arm. The child had sneakers on. They were dead. First people i photographed. And i got into the compound, and there was just a sea of bodies on the inside. And i look to my left, and there was a throne. And there was assigned over the throne where there was a sign over the phone throne where jones would sit, it said on a sign those who do not remember the past are doomed to repeat it. I looked down at the people, and i realized they all have nametags on. There was a big table, like a ofnic table, at the far end this pavilion. There must have been 100, 200 dixie cups. And that is how they dispensed the cyanide to all these people and killed them. Outside was probably another 800 or 900 people, all dead. I did not realize how many, because they covered them up and stacked them, apparently, after they killed them. I remember it got into late in the afternoon, like 2 00. They told us, they did not fly after 3 30. So i got out of the pavilion, and i heard this radio crackling to the right. There was a soldier in there with a backpack radio. I asked whether he spoke english. He nodded. I said, would you please call our helicopter pilot, because he took off after he dropped us off, and tell him that we need to get back to georgetown, guyana. Not 15 minutes later, this chopper comes over. And i thought, think god, i am not going to have to stand the night here. Because that is what would have happened for sure. And they had just captured the people who were instrumental in killing jones. Fleed into the jungle, and the army caught them. And i saw all these passports that he hid underneath the house from all the people who live there. And they pulled out a stack of treasury checks that belonged to the followers there that he was, i guess, caching and putting into private accounts. And he was dead right outside the doorway, next to the throne. So we jump in the chopper, 55 miles back to the runway at port kaituma. And it was only a single engine. Taxiing down to the runway, ready to take off. They were leaving us. So we jump out of the chopper and are waving our arms, so he would not take off. He had to fly back over our heads to do it. Charlie and i run for this aircraft. And the door comes open. Pilots the passenger door. And there was only one seat available. Of course, charlie jumps in, which i wanted him to. But i said to the pilot, you have to find room for me somewhere. I have to take of this film back. It is very important. So he goes like this, swing around to the back of the tail dragger aircraft part, go around to the rear. He pops this baggage door open. And i crawled in there, and i flew back to georgetown on my stomach in a baggage compartment with the film. [laughter] i remember it like it was five seconds ago. We finally commandeered a bus at the airport. It was the only transportation we could find. We get to the hotel, after there were chickens and kids and everything on this bus that he had picked up on the way. The reporters, of course, ran for charlie when he walked into the hotel. Jim boudier was the ap photographer, and he was a good, close friend. He said did you get pictures of jones . I said yes, i did. He said, i told new york you have pictures of him when you got out there. I said yes, i did. But i did not get into it. We are in the taxicab going to the newspaper to develop the film. I said jim, there are hundreds , of people dead up there. I have no idea how many. He said, what . I said yes. Nobody knew this. I said jones is dead. He is dead outside the compound. I said they dispensed some type of poison to everyone. There was nothing alive, including the animals. And he he looked at me like, where have you been . [laughter] no, jim, no, no, no. For real. We go into the dark room, and he processes the film. And on one of the rolls of the only humorous part of this thing was one of the rolls, on the first frame of this roll, i had photographed and anderson in washington, d. C. For a style story. It was one frame on it. And then it was the aerials of these dead people. Jim looks at this film in the light, and he goes what is ann landers doing there . [laughter] so ironic how that happened. And he started laughing. And then i hear him going, oh my god. He is looking at all these pictures that i had shot. So it never stopped from there. From that point on. I ended up newsweek did not have anybody down there. Newsweek commissioned me to do color for them. I had shot some color going in, because i did not know what to expect. Then i had to go back the second day for them, back of their, to do that for them. So i took the color back on panam to new york, to jfk. And there were about nine loads of people waiting to get through customs. Jim and i get there, he says i have to call the office. Tell them we are delayed. And i said i have to call newsweek, because they have the office open. The whole staff there and they it is a friday afternoon. I said i did not know how long it will take. They said, do not worry. The lab is open. All the editors are here. I remember walking down the hallway as jim was on the phone. It was like a dead end hallway. The door is open. I looked through the doorway, and i see this customs officer with a gold braid, sitting at his desk. And said i his door am really terribly sorry to disturb you, and i told him the story about just returning from jonestown. Getand i were trying to back to the office, and they are holding Newsweek Magazine open to do this. He said, oh my gosh. Go get your friend, get your suitcases, bring them to my office right away. Iran to i ran to jim. He is still on the phone. . I said jim, lets go. I said i do not have time to explain. We go to the customs Officers Office with our suitcases, and he opens to the door he opens the door to the side. And it is the crew headquarters for filing their flight plans for the pilots. We walked past all them, he opens another door, and we are out on the taxi stand. That is how ironic it was. Of course, this was before cell phones. I did not even have time to call newsweek. So i show up at their door with this film, and they are shocked. They wondered how i got through customs in that time. So the whole story was sort of ironic. The whole thing. So the post decided to do a book. Work that weekend. Finished up the last of the photographs and the copies. I got on the mentor like to take it up to new york, the publisher. I will never forget it. There was a woman who got on that train with the magazine. And she was in philadelphia, and she is talking about the jonestown story and how bizarre and how ironic. Sleep, really,ad in three days. I am sitting there listening. I did not say a word. Got off with me in new york. She went one way, and i went the other. I thought, if i had said anything, probably, she would have thought i was some sort of a nut. She never knew. I never said a word about it. In our business, it is many times, it is that way. In some far outweighs of describing whatever you do your dont get into it because it is you have given us some real insights into the work you have done and some of the iconic photographs that you are responsible into bringing to the public eye. Thank you for sharing your story with us. My pleasure. This weekend on American History tv on cspan3, tonight at 8 00 eastern on lectures and history, Temple University professor Andrew Eisenberg on the Environmental Movement in the 1970s. Argue that the noble savage environmentalist was a kind of product that was full to american can assume consumers like cars. Tonight father and daughter highlights highlights talked about their experiences during 9 11 into aad northeast serene and peaceful and silent sky. There. S no one we had out northwest and never find anything. We were not heroes that day. The passengers on the flight were heroes. Tubman the harriet visitors center. World. Pened up a new i think she got single low epilepsy, which i think gave her a connection to god. She had very vivid dreams. She had very vivid our seriest continues with eric draper. Is set image that shows the communion communication directors pointing to tv. Thats when we started seeing the replay of the second tower being hit. Cspan where history unfold staley. 1979 cspan was greeted as a Public Service by americas Cable Tv Companies and is brought to you today by your satellite or cable provider. American history tv is on 36. Cspan3 on every weekend, programs of the presidency, the civil war and more heres a clip from recent program. Im not even going to get into the bloodiest part, but trying to give voices to the dead, to bring about a live as people. How did they speak and think . Forward and some of the have white cross bands, some of them have you will see the white stripes. You knew you had to be shoulder to shoulder touching the guy next to you or things can spin out of control. They have pioneers and engineers ready to go forward. And shop their way through the. Nion and take fort steadman ,ake the surrounding batteries everything is supposed to go right. In war, not everything goes perfectly right. You can watch this and American History programs on our website are all our videos archived. Up next, the presidency with Edward Witmer and frederick loganville. The john f. Kennedy president ial Library Director moderates the discussion. And you this is about 90 you are you minutes. Host good evening. Did you know that john f. Kennedy was the most photographed leader of his day . This may not surprise you. He used photography strategically to share values and vision for america. It was also the golden age of photography in america and that is why this is of interest to us and, hopefully, you. 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