Transcripts For CSPAN3 World War II Veterans Discussion 20170904

Thank you for your patient. We got a little bit of a late start. Were going to have a great session this morning. Im the morning anchor. At the cbs affiliate here in washington, d. C. Im honored to be back as a moderator of the teachers conference. We did it last year as well. This is a very special occasion. Had a chance to meet some of these gentlemen. Im meeting some new friends this morning as well. Before we get under way and we honor our greatest generation and well go over the goals on what wed like to try to get done this morning, i would like to call up, before we get started, chairman of the friends of the World War Ii National memorial Josiah Bunting iii to say a few things. [ applause ] our greatest ally and most famous ally during the Second World War was winston churchill. Who famously said succeeding generations must not be allowed to forget their sacrifice and their example. And to me the beauty and the urgency of assemblies like this was people like this. Is in fulfillment of what sir winston urged us to do. So it is a great honor for all of us gentlemen. We cant wait to hear what you have to say. Thank you. [ applause ] as we get under way, wed like to set a few goals to see what wed like to achieve by being together this morning. These gentlemen and another gentleman who ill introduce in a moment are valuable resources and we really need to soak up as much as we can because, boy, can they have a story to tell. Wed love to try to learn as much as we can from this panelist of heroes. What theyve experienced. How its impacted their family. And the lessons theyve learned so we can share them for generations to come. Second, of course we would love to because this is a teachers conferen conference, try to explore itth best way to teach. The statistics are all over the place. Maybe they can give us insight on how to share their stories effectively. Casualties, conflicts, all the things they were able to go through. We want to gain some appreciation and perspective as we continue to face challenges and war around the globe. These gentlemen have gone before us and they understand what we face as we look ahead. So lets introduce our distinguished panel. All the way over to my far left. 96 years young. As of this month. Colonel james riffe, purple heart. [ applause ] purple heart recipient. Went into the service as a private. Came out a colonel. 30 years of service. One step closer to the handsome gentlemen in the red jacket. Airman colonel mcgee. Proudly hes also an eagle scout. Round of applause. [ applause ] and im in scouting too. So thats sort of why i did that. And then next over mr. Harry miller, 22 years of service, world war ii, 740th tank battalion. He was also in the korean war. He was also in General Macarthurs headquarters in the Communications Department as well. Round of applause for mr. Miller. Thank you for coming. [ applause ] and closest to me, colonel frank cohn. Battle of the bulge. Legion of merit. Bronze star recipient. Thank you so much for joining us this morning. [ applause ] and these are very brief introductions because i want them to tell their own stories. They have a list, each one of them have a list of accomplishments and goals theyve achieved in their lives. And we have a surprise visitor who walked the rope line almost and worked the room when he came in. Youll see what i mean in just a second. Im going to make the announ announceme announcement. So theres a gentleman in the front row. His name is are garnet hammond. 95 years young. Help was in t he was in the army of the european theater. He is an absolute hoot. Hes a lot of fun. [ applause ] this is special for me. God bless you. [ applause ] one of the things that today can bring us is perspective. When you start looking at statistics they can be dizzying when you try to find how much casualties happen in each theater for each country and the statistics vary. One of the things we can gain by today is perspective. If you think about one of the more recent statistics weve had. The war in afghanistan. 13 years long. 25, nearly 2,500 we lost, Service Members we lost. That happened alone on omaha beach in one day. So these gentlemen have seen and experienced things to a far greater degree than pretty much every other generation. One of the things wed like to do is get them a chance to talk with themselves a little bit. Were going to open it up for questions. Where that discussion leads is up to you. We want you to leave here with some valuable tangible information that you can use to teach your fellow students, teachers and bring some of this information back. Why dont we start with colonel riffe, if youd like to say a few words and tell the audience about your experience, and what you would like them to take away from this conference. What would you like them to be able to impart to their students about world war ii thats maybe not being taught, maybe not being discussed the way you feel it should be . Well, what id like for you to take away is the fact that the those of us who served in world war ii are noted as the greatest generation, and ive always had some exceptions to that. Because i remember the millions and millions of americans who were on the home front. We definitely couldnt have won the war without the things that they produced. The task tank, the plane, the s. The millions of items that were necessary. When i hear that we are the special people from world war ii, i have to say that, what i believe is that the people who served in uniform on the war front and the people who served in the home front, that was the greatest generation. So i would like for you to take away that not only to honor those of us who served in the military, but those who also served on the home front. Thank you. [ applause ] colonel mcgee, if you would, can you discuss your experience . Its a varied experience considered when you entered service and how you progressed throughout your career, your distinguished career, several decades. Well, certainly, ill be glad to do that. I think we need to understand where the army stood at the time. Am i coming through . Wave, something, if im not coming through clearly. My experience begins with a 1925 army of War College Study that after world war i determined how this onetenth of our population would be used if america got involved in another war. Paragraph 3 of their fourpage report says facts bearing on the problem. The negro is physically qualified. Mentally inferior, morally inferior. Anything else you could name, inferi inferior, second class citizen. So if they got involved in another war, oh, we can cook food, dig ditch, build road, drive trucks. But do anything technical, impossible. They have studied the issue and know it would be a failure. That was sent to washington and become a part of Army Mobilization policy and washington bought it. So our country declared world war ii and provided what it took to win the war. The army didnt change the policy, but they give us an opportunity to serve. And we dispelled those biases and generalizations, in some cases, racist ideas, about the negro population. But the army never changed the policy. It took the air force in 1947, two years after the war was over, to determine America Needs to change and the air force led in that. I was just glad that i had the opportunity to serve and be among those who helped dispel those biases and generalizations that had become a part of mobilization policy. And, folks, i think we need to understand, as i said, world war ii, we declared war and provided what it took to win the war. Korea, still divided. Vietnam, not any better. Whats unfortunately when we use military power for political purposes, theres no win. Politics is a compromise. We need to understand that. Lives are lost. We need to recognize and remember those who give full measure. We need to understand where weve been, where we are and where were going. Thank you. [ applause ] mr. Miller if you would, 740th tank battalion, korean war. Your service, 22 years. Talk about what your personal experience was like on a day to day basis. When we talk from 30,000 feet so to speak about the larger picture, sometimes the things that can actually grip them are the perm stosonal stories. What your day to day was like. The emotions. Some of the jobs you had. Some of the people you met that had an impact on you. Those personal stories are what can really help teenager, college student, understand world war ii. Okay. Im probably the strange one of the bunch. I got into services when i was 15. My father had died when i was 12. My mother died when i was 3. And i always wanted to be a soldier. I dont know why. Except that we had a small army post near where i was born. And i always wanted to be a soldier. So i lied about my age. Went in. And my first assignment overseas was the 740th tank battalion. When i got there, i all i had actually was training in armor, which is all i really needed at the time. Except when i got there two months before the battle of the bulge started, all of a sudden, i realized i didnt know a heck of a lot. And the daytoday coverage for me, they assigned me to the assault gun platoon of headquarters company. The assault gun platoon, in case you dont know what this is, it was a standard sherman tank with 150, 155, millimeter main tube on it. Whereas most of the things had 75s and 76s. Well, our first real action with the assault gun platoon was a town of stumont, which is in belgium. What happened was at the beginning, the bulge started on december 16th. On december 19th, we went into action for the first time. On that very first day, we sent three tanks down to stop the first ss has dard division, which was one of hitlers favored outfits. Our c Company Managed to stop the three leading tanks of this 1st ss panzer and they turned around and left. Meanwhile, the rest of us were at a chateau there just outside of stumont. And our colonel, Lieutenant Colonel grubel was his name, he decided he wanted to flat the next town down. So the panzer wouldnt go back at us that way. He lined up all six of our assault guns. He also common teared a 155 that was heading down the road to get away from the germans. He stopped them and made them come over with us. He stood on the back porch. Well, it was kind of a veranda more than a porch. And with binoculars, he looked at the town of leglis, which was the next town over, and he decided we should flatten it. Because the ss panzer division, part of it, was in there already. So we opened fire and demolished the town. There was a chapel left there and the skeletons of other building, but not many. Because we had six, seven guns firing at them with 155s or bigger. And so that happened in one day. After that were civilians involved in that . Did you get have to have the unfortunately were civilians hurt . When you say you leveled the town . Yeah, the civilians were smart enough to get out. That was one thing about the belgians. They got out when they new trouble was coming. And they got out. Right after that of course we had to go back into the town of stumont and clean out a hospital that was there. It was one long building. There was a Catholic Priest that had taken 50 belgian kids into the basement of the hospital because he figured that was a safe place. Not knowing the germans apparently. He hid these kids in there. And meanwhile, on the first floor, part of the 30th infantry division, people were stuck on the first floor in the different rooms of the hospital. At the end, both ends of the building, there were open windows. And they had a german tank setting up there. A panther tank. And he was firing down the hall. And anybody that got near or naturally, they were hit. And we finally got three tanks up on to this land because it was steep. We had to build a corduroy road with logs, if you know what im talking about. We got three tanks up there at night. And managed to knock out that panther tank. After that, we cleaned up a lot of the germans that were in there. And then we freed the Catholic Priest and the 50 kids. They were mighty happy to see us, by the way. I can imagine. Yeah. Generally, the people would get out when they knew they knew when things were coming. They got out. And they went somewhere. I guess into the woods or some place. But one thing bad that the germans did, they were ride down the road and just for kicks i guess, they would see a group of people, for instance, if it was, say, a number of you people standing alongside the road looking at the tanks coming through, why, the germans would just automatically shoot you. No reason. Just they shoot you. Nobody could figure out why. Well, when we saw those kinds of things, we it made us mad. And later on, we heard about the normandy massacre. Which i if you dont know what that what it was when the germans captured a unit that was on the road. And they held them prisoner for a short while. And then all of a sudden somebody opened fire from one of the german tanks and so they all opened up. And they killed the whole bunch of americans that were there. When we found out about that, i really believe the attitude and i think maybe the gentlemen on the end here can agree with it. I think the attitude over there changed quite a bit. All of a sudden, it was a do or die thing. I dont think anybody wanted to take anything from the germans that they didnt have to. And i dont mean material things. Im talking about tricks. Everything everything was on guard from then on. Other than being scared as hell all the time, that was it. I can understand. Mr. Cohn, as you look back at your service what are some of the what are some of the emotions that you think about that hit you still today . After all these years of being back in civilian life . Whats the first thing that comes to your mind . Is it a person is it is it a place . Is it an event . Is it a smell . What are some of the things you recall first when you think about your service . Well, i sort of came in differently. I had been born in germany. I was jewish. We escaped from germany at age 13. And even this was a 1938. At that point, i knew about the germans. And it certainly was a different situation when i came back in 1943. Facing the germans in a different capacity. And that was a feeling that you just cant describe. It was different. When you say different i was in charge when, in fact in germany, i was the victim. So i turned from victim to being in charge. Thats called payback. Payback. It wasnt really payback. The one point we were making was were not going to be like them. That was very important. I understand. The other point i want to make is as you listen to us, each one of us really was in a different war. We only saw in certain segments. You cant generalize on any one of us. You really have to listen to everybody. And then you can make your generalizations. Now, as far as my service was concerned, i came into the battle of the bulge. Because i spoke german, they put me in intelligence. Can you hear him by the way . Just want to make sure. Okay, go ahead. As intelligence, we worked initially as counterintelligence officers. While i was only a pfc, i didnt show any rank. I was always u. S. , u. S. Because they were not to know who was what when we were in intelligence. Our mission during the battle of the bulge was to find germans who had penetrated four in a jeep in u. S. Uniforms. And they were hazard for us because they could do all sorts of damage in back of our lines. We did find this was a legitimate mission. They had wiped out four of those fellas with a ba zook ka. And we searched those people. They didnt have anything on it except u. S. Dog tags. Which we of course confiscated because we could tell that these people were either prisoners or they were dead. Our mission in germany was that we had to move into these big cities as they were as they were captured and we had personality and building targets. The personality targets were the people who were going to be tried in war crimes. The building targets were anything that could be useful to the forces afterwards. These were first of all government buildings and nazi party buildings for prosecutions. They were utilities that we could use. There were industrial complexes. There were military complexes. Those were all targets that we had and we the first city was cologne. And then we moved into vasar. We had dusseldorf. Then we moved into frankfurt. The last one we had was magnaburg. You never know whats important really. The cap needed a russian interpreter. He couldnt find one. He said, youre my interpreter, come with me. Im trying to get out of this thing because i dont speak russian. He said, nope, youll come and carry the map. So thats a flooding alert, by the way, im sure all your phones are going off. Apologize for that. When we went across the abbott, which was really a singular type of thing. Because eisenhower had indicated the u. S. Troops were not to cross the abbott. As well as soviet troops were not going to cross. So two armies would stay apart. The albo was the dividing line. Here we went across the albo because he had a top secret map to show where the occupation zones were. And the russians were, in fact, going to get magnaburg where we were sitting. But they werent going to do it until maybe six months later. And that was he didnt tell me what his mission was. Anyway, the reception, you cant imagine. And the reception was so great because we had not the need to fight all the way to the alba because the germans knew the war was over and they were giving up. As we moved on the auto bonn, they were coming from all sides, trying to get up to us because they were hungry. Of course we waved them away. So no fight. The russians on the other hand had to fight all the way up to the river. When they saw us, they saw, for them, the war was over. And they had survived. That was the reception that we received. So i want to open it up to questions in a couple minutes. Im going to ask the panel one more question. I would like you first, can i have a show of hands . How many of you are teachers . Okay, wow. How many of you are teachers at the elementary level . Middle school . High school . Beyond high school . Okay. So looks like middle and high school are the bulk. What i would like for you to do is ask some questions that could relate to how how your im going to ask the panel one more question. But start thinking about it. How it could relate to your job, teaching world war ii easier. Because we should look at individual conflicts in wars and its hard that a lot of these gentlemen never crossed paths. Im going to ask them one more question of the panel first. Water bottle . Oh, sure, because you cant see them . Give me a shout and i will all the way. All the way off the table, okay, got it. Check. As the teachers start thinking about their question, general, ill start with you. Colonel riffe. When you hear other people talk about world war ii and any of the various conflicts and theaters, what do you believe is maybe misunderstood or maybe often stated incorrectly . Because they probably could do more study before they start to talk at length . Are there misconceptions about world war ii . Well, think the experiences of each individual is so different. It is pretty difficult to come up with something that might be normal. However, i find that for example, if i can go back to the history, to answer that question, i have about probably 10 or 12 books on world war ii history. And you can read each one, and theres a lot of differences in what historians have to say about world war ii. So i would say that if you are interested in the history of world war ii, you can go to the library or get you a book about world war ii. And read it and youll find that perspective at least for individual whos the author of that particular book. But the one thing i dont like to talk about world war ii, its not very pleasant. I think this is about the third time in since ive turned in the 90s 96 as of july. About world war ii. Its not a pleasant experience. I came out alive, even though i was wounded. But when we landed on okinawa in april of 1945, i was the First Lieutenant leading an infantry rifle platoon of 29 men. Most of whom were 18 years old to 19 years old. I was the leader of that platoon for about a month before i was transferred to another job. But during that one month, seven of those Young Americans gave their life for our country and 14 others were seriously wounded. And evacuated. And i never saw again. A couple of them may not have survived because they were very seriously wounded. So i believe if you talk with each one of us up here, that youll get a different perspective of what they view as world war ii and how you should approach any study of it. Colonel mcgee, misconceptions, things you hear stated incorrectly about world war ii . Historian, and so im sure there have been lots that i hadnt heard about it. But i think its understandable that there are some people that do not like war. I dont think any of us do. Even though we sit here and have served our country. Still, the prayer is one day wars will cease. Whether that comes in our lifetime is the question. That you have to face. For your teaching young people is how do we, what do we give them and what do we get from our experiences that help Carry Forward the future of our country. There are things that we so much enjoy about america, even with its problems and areas and thats what we have to i think pass on to the young folks. They need to understand. As i said earlier, world war ii to me is different than any of the others because war was declared in the country coming out of ten years of depression behind the Job Opportunities in the service in the various elements of the military for our country. Brought about the change. It changed europe. It changed our country. We have to realize that. As i say, the key is what do we give our youngsters for whatever their future is. Some of us wont be here in their future. But certainly we need to be mentoring them in a way that preserves the freedoms we so much enjoy. Mr. Miller, for those of us in the room who have connections to world war ii through our family, oftentimes we learn and maybe you guys can say yes or no. The people in our lives have connections to world war ii very rarely will speak about it. I would ask my grandpa. He did not want to talk about it at all. Same with some other family members who have connections to world war ii. Do you believe that could lead to people maybe not understanding the war as well as they could . Are there misconceptions in your mind that maybe people could do better with . Its funny you ask me this. Because this morning i had the opportunity to wake up at 4 00 and i was laying there and i thought, gee, why cant i go back to sleep . I got to thinking just about what youre asking about. I have known i dont know how many people that ive talked to, ive gone to schools, talked to classes. Ive talked to teachers. Ive gone to history buffs who have programs. And they all say the same thing. I had a father or a grandfather, but he never wanted to talk about the war. Can you tell me why . Well, ive given that a lot of thought. The only thing i can come up with is you see so many things. I hope i dont break down, because i have. But you see so many things that you cant believe that are actually happening in front of you. And i think about them right now and i dont want to. I want to think about this. But i think the reason they dont want to talk about it is because they dont want you to know how terrible it can be. I think probably if any of you have fathers or grandfathers that wouldnt talk about it, ill bet you that they went maybe into the bathroom, locked the door and cried. Or ill bet they went down to the basement to their workshop and cried. They dont want to talk about. Thats the reason they dont want to talk about it. Its damn horrible. Continuing on here, at the end of the war, they allowed some of us to go see the concentration camps. And if you see one of those, you dont want to talk about it. Because everybody has a memory of that, what it was like. Kids have asked me, well, how did it smell . Could you smell it . I tell them, you think of everything that you can think of that smells and stinks and put it all together and you still dont have the smell. Its indescribable. But you think about the people that went through this. And this, this is terrible. I know, i went to doco and i can remember going through the i hope this doesnt get to you. I remember going through the cremitorium and there was bricks on the floor and there was gray matter of some kind, powder, it looked like, in between the bricks. I looked at it. I couldnt figure out what it was. As i went through the crematorium, i went to the rear, to the ovens, where the people had been burnt up, and there was a pile of ashes there. And i thought, my god, ive been walking on all these people. And it still gets to me. Hope it doesnt bother you. Thats why. Maybe having at least small versions of these conversations could help with misperceptions and hope we dont repeat these awful things . First of all. The end of the war is perhaps the big lesson in the whole thing. In germany, there was no question of how we won the war. But it was still going on in the far east. Japan had not really suffered much from the war, from us. There were some attempts made to get there and bomb and so forth, but we were going to have to invade japan and it was going to be rougher than the way we invaded europe. That was predictable. So when president truman dropped the atomic weapon, it was not a problem for us. Now it becomes a problem on debates as to whether this was the right thing to do, the wrong thing to do, whether it should have been avoided, maybe one bomb, not two bombs, there was no discussion. If he had the bomb, and he could end that war, that was it, thats what we wanted. There was just no question about it. That is something that develops in hindsight with history putting a different light on to the situation as it developed. Is that because the lives lost after dropping that bomb were much fewer than they would have been had the war continued . It saved a lot of japanese, because many more japanese would have been killed if we had to invade japan as they proclaimed they were going to resist until the last man or woman. I have some numbers on that also about japan. My unit was on okinawa when the war ended. And we were so happy that it did, because in november of 1945, the u. S. Army and the marine corps were scheduled to invade the southernmost island of japan. They were going to use 14 army and marine divisions and president truman was very interested in all of this, so he asked General Macarthur who was going to command all the forces, what are the casualties going to be. He said, well, that initial invasion which would be in november of 1945, macarthur said about 100,000 casualties. That was to be followed in the spring of 1946 by assaults on hansu where tokyo is located. And at that time president truman again inquired as to the casualti casualties. And the best estimates were, that the japanese would lose 10 Million People in our con squeft of japan. Americans we would lose 1 Million People. They also briefed president truman on the casualties of okinawa. The bloodiest battle in the pacific. Based upon those, president truman gave permission to start the atomic bombing, the sixth of august, nagasaki, if you remember. And then the ninth of the august i beg your pardon, they bombed hiroshima. And then the ninth of august, they bombed nagasaki. I contacted the theres been all kinds of questions about how many japanese were killed during those two bombings. Ive contacted the Japanese Embassy in washington, d. C. And the number of casualties they report on hiroshima, about 270,000. In nagasaki, it was about 140,000. Youre talking about less than a half Million People. If we had to invade japan and concur japan, the japanese would have lost 10 Million People. And we would have lost a million, so there is arguments today as has been mentioned the atomic bombing saved not only american lives, but probably saved at least 9 million japanese lives. The specific word casualties, is that killed, wounded and missing or killed being specific with casualties, is that killed, missing and wounded or is that when you say 10 million and 1 million, they believe that would have been everyone killed . Specifically. In japan, every man and woman had an oath to the emperor, that they would die for him. The japanese did expect we would invade the homeland, even the women were given bamboo 1350spe. They would have fought the last person. The only arent war ended is because hirohito was the commander of the military forces in japan, even at the dropping of the second atomic bomb, the imperial staff said they didnt want to surrender, but hirohito said no, the enemy has dropped a bomb on us, the likes of which weve never known before. On the 14th day of august 1945. Hirohito got words to the allies that japan would surrender. Its an amazing thing that on the 15th of august 1945 the emperor went on the radio and explained to the japanese people why they were surrendering that is the first time they had ever heard the voice of emperor hirohito. Even though he was aware of the raid on pearl harbor, he knew about a that, he could have stopped it, but he did not he did, in his authority, and he was considered to be a member of the sun god, he did stop the war and japan surrendered on the 14th of august, and the formal surrender took place on the second of september on the battleship missouri in tokyo bay. Thank you. I would like to open it up now to the floor if we could. Tryi trying to tell the stories of world war ii can be complex when laying out a curriculum for your students. Maybe we could help with organization to bring back to your classroom. I read about gis that lied about their age, so they write 18 and put it in the bottom of their shoe, so they can say im under 18 without lying. How are you able to join how did i pull it off . Well, my father had died when i was 13, and i wanted to go in right away. I almost went to canada, you could go to canada and they would take your word for anything up there, they needed people bad. My sister found out i was doing this. She said, wait until you can go in the american army. I said, okay. The arm his had the enlisted reserve core during world war ii the purpose of this was to get kids interested in the army, the navy had a reserve unit and marines had reserves, the army didnt worry about reserves, everyone was on active duty already or they were being drafted. I thought, okay ill join the army reserves, i wanted to go in the army, after i got into it, i found out i didnt have to this is another story about birth certificates, remind me of this. So i found out i could put in for active duty, which i did. And they accepted me and when i look at my pictures from those days, i 2k07b know hows anybody was fooled. I kept my mouth shut everywhere i went. I did what i was told, i stayed out of the way of officers, they were generally looking for people to do something, i didnt want to do anything i didnt have to do, i didnt want to get in any trouble, thats how i did it, i didnt need a birth certificate, i wanted to bring this out, because about 20 years ago, i put in for a passport so i could go back over to europe, and they said, you have to have a copy of your birth certificate. I said i dont have it, the army sent me all over the world, why did i need a birth certificate to go as a tourist . Well, theres no reason for it, its just our policy. Sounds like the army game to me. Anyway, i wrote off for a copy of my birth certificate, they had a copy of it, which they didnt have before, i think the reasoning, because they put it on all the information on computers and they could bring it up, which they didnt do during the war. So anyway, i got the birth certificate and had my mothers name, fathers name, where i was born, when i was born. My name was blank. So i was always sorry that i didnt tell them my name was clark gable or Something Like that. I could have made a little money off of it, you know. For our friends at cspan, are you okay audiowise . Yeokay, just wanted to make sure. I have a problem, when i teach about the world and General Macarthur. My grandfather served in the philippi philippines. He talked about macarthur as being an okay guy, he did what he had to do. He didnt think he was he stood outside and was getting shelled, watched the shells come in. The history books talk about the men not liking him. I wonder what your perspective ognjen macarthur was, since you served with him in the korean war. I served in his headquarters during the korean war. Thats the only things i can talk about with him there. I heard that in the pacific that the marines and the navy hated him, the army, some of them liked him, some of them didnt. But during the korean war, he was not liked at all by anybody, i dont think. I certainly never metz anybody, except people who had been with him in the philippines. And he still had a lot of his people that were with him from world war ii during that time. Colonel riffy, are you looking to add to this as well . He was talk about the philippines, which as he indicated there, that japan decried war on the United States on the eighth of december 1941. The same day, they started bombing the philippines. A major army of japanese soldiers invaded luzan. And at that time there was about 75,000 u. S. Army troops there. They were with 30,000 filipinos. Within several days the americans and philippines got pushed back into a place called corigador, part of the peninsula sticking out into the pacific ocean. And on the ninth of april, 1942, all of the fruit had been gone, the horses, whatever else they could get their hands on. 75,000 americans surrendered. That is the largest surrender in any battle in the history of our country. And also, about 30,000 filipinos surrendered. You probably heard about the death march. Its almost unbelievable to realize that on that death march, 7,000 americans died and 3,000 filipinos died. Starvation, disease, but mostly from the cruelty of the japanese guards. Macarthur did not stay in the philippines. President roosevelt ordered him to australia where the u. S. Army was gathering for its campaigns in the pacific. So macarthur and his wife and the president of the fiphilippis threw u boats and airplanes. Macarthur finally made it back to australia. He commanded the arms forces in the southwest portion of the pacific. And, of course, you can say what you want to about him, he was a very conceited individual. We all recognize that. But he was also a remember, he was a medal of honor winner in world war i. I think colonel mcgee also has a story. I have Great Respect for macarthur. One of the things about korea. You remember the americans were surprised the South Koreans were surprised when the japanese attacked on the 30th day of june of 1950. We had very few troops there. They got pushed to the southern end of korea. Macarthur was called the landing at inshot. It was a complete success and in that, of course, we went on to drive the kree answer north of the 38th parallel, i guess it was. Your stage. When you talk about like when you talk about like and dislike, is what happened. I flew several missions, and served with the army as air liaison 40 miles frat river. Macarthur wanted to keep the chinese out of the war. Washington said no. Thats why he was sent away. So likes and dislikes sometimes depend on what is your outlook on where were going and what were going to accomplish. We could have won that war. We didnt. We still have a divided korea, and look whats happening now. Were concerned about intercontinental missiles that can be rained on our country. Likes and dislikes come from different sources, i think we have to understand that. And people when you understand washington moved macarthur out. He wanted to do something they didnt want. And the only way to do it was moving further away from the action at the time. Did that answer your question zm. General macarthurs headquarters during the korean war, the daiichi building in tokyo he was not in physical danger because his office was in tokyo. Speaking of the korean war, can i indicate the casualties we suffered there . The korean war started june of 1950 and ended in july 53. During that period in korea, killed 33,629. Wounded 103,284. Missing korea, 5,178. Total casualties in korea, 142,091. It didnt come cheap. Im wondering if that answered this ladys question. Do we have another question from the audience . I had a bunch of hands up before. My name is nick, i teach in richmond, virginia one of the units we teach is duties and responsibilities. One of the things our conference has been talking about this morning, talking about the plants up in michigan is how well how the entire nation pitched in to this war effort which is something that today seems kind of foreign to us. The citizen army you guys had back then and the home front. And today we have a very professionalized army. Certainly no draft, we have contractors who do a lot of our work. And i was just wondering how we could square and were in the longest war that weve ever been in, and sometimes it didnt even seem like it. So when we have our students and we teach them duties and responsibilities, i was wondering if you guys had any advice for our students or any thoughts on how we should frame this for our students that we are in a major war continually right now. We have people everywhere, how should they think about that, what should they do, how should they pitch in . Mr. Cone hasnt spoken in a while. Go ahead. Well, i would think that it has to start at a different level, it has to start right at the beginning with what we used to call civics, you have to build up the identity of the student to kohless his thoughts with the country. So theres that term of patriot ism you have to develop. If you dont develop that in the beginning, its not going to come later on. Its got to come right from the start in the elementary schools, and we dont even have the elementary schoolteachers here. And the other point is. That politically, its a completely different situation. Because the army was drafted. Everybody had the ability or the threat to go into the army. And that is not true here. We have a volunteer army, which is something completely different. Because everybody here probably doesnt have anybody in that army. And youre divorced from it. And if you are reminded theres a war on. You suddenly say, oh, yeah, thats right. This is not something youre thinking of from one day to the next. World war ii it hit everybody. Everybody didnt have to be reminded any day, because they knew there was a war on. First of all, one of their loved ones was involved personally, secondly, there was rationing, for example. So the household was impacted by it. Everybody was impacted. This is not happening. It didnt happen in the korean war, it didnt happen in the vietnamese war. In the korean war, we still had the draft. In the beginning of the vietnamese war we still had the draft. This is completely different now. And as i indicated, if u. S. Want the kids to identify with usa, its got to be done right from the beginning. Patriotism, elementary school. Any other questions . I want to thank you for your service. We appreciate you and for protecting our freedoms. I know its really hard to talk about your experiences. Have any of you written a book, your memoirs or anything we could read to our classes . Im sorry, i didnt get that . Have any of you written a book about your experience . I did. Theres a few books here. I wrote one, but its not for anybody to read. The reason i did this, i found out my kids i have two sons. And i realized they didnt know anything about what i had done. They seemed to not care for the longest time. I guess one of them still doesnt the other one, they both went into the navy of all things. Which i couldnt excuse. They turned out pretty good, i guess. But yeah i wrote a book, and i sat both of them down, and they read it, and i noticed their faces got red a couple times many i dont think i did them any harm. Thats as far as it went. At least its on record. Folks keep saying, you need to write your story. Im not a writer. My oldest daughter has written my story. Well call Tuskegee Airmen, the bioof charles mcgee. I served segregation for some of my folks i loved flying. Commercial airlines werent hiring blacks or women. I stayed in the service, i couldnt have written a script for better opportunities. And lucky enough to actively fly 27 of my 30 years. That doesnt happen very ocften. What id like, if i may, give you four ps to pass on. Part of what is important is how we motivate the young people to face whatever their future is, and some of it we dont even know yet. Perceive, prepare, perform, persevere. Perceive. Dream your dreams, but find your talents. I hope you find what you like to do. I got into aviation and i loved it, thats when i stayed in. But prepare. Get a good education, learn to read, write and speak well and develop those talented that you discovered are important. Perform. Always doing your 3we69, but let skens be your goal in everything you do. And finally, perrer is career. We could have hung our heads i dont want to serve this country. Dont let circumstances be an excuse for not achieving. I think those principles would be a good guide for the future of our country. We dont know. Ill tell kids. Were planning to go to mars. I say, guess whos going to make the trip. When they get the planner, its going to be too old. Its going to be one of those middle school or High Schoolers who are going to make the trip. How are we preparing them. And then im often asked, how do you get through what you did . Well, i learned as a little kid, you treat other people like you wanted to be treated. I think all of you heard the old saying, sticks and stones will break my bones, but words wont hurt me. Fighting doesnt accomplish anything. You get bruised up, and youre still mad at each other. A little bit later being a scout. You know, folks, if everybody lived by the scout oath we would have a very different country. If you think about it, and what it means. And then fraternal precipes, i joined a fraternity, one thing i learned that if youre going to be first of all, you first must become a servant of all. Are you mentoring a youngster, whether in your family or neighborhood or down the street. That needs a pat on the bat and a direction to keep them going in the right direction . Thanks. Colonel kohn. I wrote down things because there were sao many massets you cant remember. Its the memorys like a sieve. Some of that nasty stuff just gets discarded. And thats the danger of going and telling about world war ii. What you cant put across is the emotional aspects of it, the fear that was involved. The horror that was involved, the physical discomfort that was involve involved the worst weather you can imagine, it was around freezing, but if you were in an open jeep and driving 25 miles an hour, and that wind hits you. How are you going to describe that, you really cant i want to plug a program that the Rocky Run Middle School does avenue year. They have world war ii day. They solicit in the Community Anyone who was in world war ii and invite them to come to world war ii day. They get the bioin advance, they give the bio divide students into lets say they have 50 world war ii veterans, they divide the students into that 50, so maybe 4 or 5 students will hit that particular world war ii veteran for one hour. There are five hours involved. They get a mix of other people. Because they have the bio, they can formulate the questions in advance. They know who theyre talking to, what theyre facing and what questions they want answered. Its a wonderful program. Do we have other questions . My name is scott, i Teach High School down the road in virginia. Thank you all for your service. Im humbled to be standing here. You said you left nazi germany in 1938 when you were 13. Can you talk about what that was like, and how you got to the United States at a time when that was a difficult thing to do . That part is amazing to me. Well, first of all, there was a different with the german and austrian jews. We had time really to prepare to get out. When it hits the polish and russian jews, they had no time. Thats where the great casuallies were inflicted on the jews, the polish, russian and baltic regions. On the german side the big problem was, nobody wanted you. You wanted to get out, but who was going to take you . The United States had a great obstacle put in for refugees, they did not want refugees. They were willing to take people on an affidavit and someone had guaranteed that they would not become a burden to the state, that was a trickle. So many more wanted to go. And they couldnt. You might have heard about the st. Louis, the ship that was going to cuba and they thought they were going to be received in cuba, cuba wouldnt let them off. And it sailed across, past the United States, and nobody would let them in. And they finally had to go back to europe. Anyway, with us, every misfortune that happened to us, ended up being a good thing in the end. In 1933 when hitler came to power, my father lost his store, because they were parading in front, do not buy from jews. So he got rid of it. And these were all what you might call salami tactics, it wasnt a big thing immediately, it was Little Things that happened to you, and it got worse and worse and worse. And you always said, where, okay, you cant get any worse. But it did. So it took my parents until 1938 to figure out they couldnt persist any more in germany. My father went to the states to find some distant relatives to get an affidavit, this thing was ridiculous, it would take five years before you could go on. And 1938 plus five, you can see where you end up. Of course, he didnt know the future was not visible. Another lucky thing happened to him, where he thought it was unlucky. He couldnt find any relative who had the capacity to give us an affidavit. The country was under the depression. And people didnt have the money. So he had to stay longer, when he stayed longer, the gestappo came to our door looking for him. My mother started to think, what should we do. He was on a visitors visa, there were no computers, she was able to go to the con sue late and get a visitors visa for herself. Had they known my father was there, she never would have gotten a visa. We ended up, my mother and i i was the only child. We ended up in new york 30th october 1938. With a visitors visa. And when we saw my father, we met him on the dock, he said, we have a problem. Were at the mercy of the Relief Organization organizations. And they said, you oath have a finite time to do something here, because we cant support you forever, youre going to have to go back. Well, november 9th, less than two weeks afterwards was crystal night, it was the program that the germans thrust upon the jews, it was a preplanned incident. The incident was the assassination of somebody in the paris German Embassy by a jewish student. That initiated that program. Now the catastrophe, our luck, president roosevelt issued an executive order, that anyone in country would not be forced to return. We could stay. Thats how we stayed. Now, thats a story. Wed like to hear from our guest 95 years old, in the european theater. Ive seen a lot and, of course, i started off as a boy scout. I took my scouting serious, i took my life serious. The army has to harden us up my first visit was to go to ft. E lee, maryland. Then i went to camp in virginia. I had some kind of training at Dunbar High School. I have a 1903 rifle that we used by the world war i veterans, as a part of my training. So i had some military background. The reserve corps, which was the corps they had for veterans who were getting an education at the same time. It was a threeyear course instead of a fouryear course. Which was pretty tough. Most of the work we had to do at home. Well, i was put on active duty from the reserve board in 1943 and went to ft. Meade and went to this training which hardens you, toughens you. And then they sent me from camp meade, where its cold and freezing, then they brought me all the way back to massachusetts. Im on active duty now and, of course, my appointment was to go to luxemborg, germany. Im in england first, france, lux exborg, germany. And i wented up after the war ended at nuremburg, germany. At first, im able to say cheeryo. The french say oohlala. I speak german. My experience was to get the company. I had to give the i was being earmarked for assistant Company Clerk thats important that you bring cannons. This guy was an n an accident, had a medical discharge, that ended my experience becoming a sergeant. Then i wrote a letter and said, im not set like they 3r078sed me i would be, im going to transfer out of the company. So later on i followed an artist and designer, i wrote my sister about my complaint. They made me and thats where i stayed in my career. The experience that i had as a trainer that i got. My heart what i want to do s is i was in the northern part of france during the invasion. I remember when george s. Patton brought his tanks up from italy to stem the german tide. The name of the general who was trying to split the english forces and the American Forces at the battle of the bulge was general kes linger, the supreme german commander at the time. Thats the information i got. I dont know how accurate it was, but i knew for two weeks those germans were raising sand. So im giving credit to general eisenhower, because after that two weeks when the sun came out, i now ordered every available airplane and general george s. Patton, i was assigned to the army, he brought his tanks up, and they stopped the germans at the battle of the bulge. It was the air force company that was not a company, but a brigade i guess you called it. They were the ones that stopped the first thrust of the battle of the bulge. I want to go to general mcgee, a famous tuskegee airman. And i want to also tell you that i happen to be at Dunbar High School washington, d. C. In 1939 when i entered Dunbar High School many my captain was captain roscoe brown who is a war hero. I want to tell you about roscoe brown. Roscoe brown has a stamp in his honor, truman gave roscoe brown two oak leaf clusters, he had 100 and some trips from england as far as hungary in in the balkan area. And he had low level striving of the war tanks in romania. Of course, roscoe brown did not i was in his company, his sister was in my class, she was in the Honor Society at dunbar. I want to honor roscoe brown today, and i want to honor hes the one that helped her children to integrate the army. Im here to testify to that. And all the other Tuskegee Airmen. I take my hat off to mcgee who is one of the Tuskegee Airmen. And, of course, i want to compliment churchill for standing up against the onslaught of england. Coventry was burned helplessly. And they were trying to surrender but churchill would not have that. Macarthur leap frogged in the japanese church, i want to thank him for the battle of midway where they sank three aircraft carriers of the japanese. That was the turning tide in the war, i wanted to thank those guys on iwo jima. The slaughter, a lot of those people killed, but take that and land in peace. The invasion of japan, these are strategic things. I want to thank macarthur. He was number one in his class, he was chief of staff in the war. He turned about and never got diplomas. He was a great general. I want to thank general mark clur in the italian campaign, i want to thank george s. Patton. Without patton, they may not have stemmed that tide, but patten, i was in france at the time patton went 90 miles in one day in france. And i was present at the time went patton went two forward. They closed in on them. And they thought they were trapped, general patton, but they did not. So we got out of that. All i had was a power bye. And it was only good for 250 yards many when i was at dunbar, i had a 1903 rifle. The bullet would travel three miles, and thats world war i p fp. The point is, i wanted to thank bradley, who was one of the outstanding people and, of course, the point is, that we have to thank montgomery who was a British Military officer. He and i now were colonels together in north africa, you see many im up on my history. Ive been there. You certainly are. The point is, that the Tuskegee Airmen did a remarkable job, and i want you to remember roscoe brown, mcgee and mcgee i have a question for you. You were supposed to be at the veterans Day Celebration this notch i mean, this september. And i was looking forward, because the letter i got in the mail said you would be one of the speakers. Why didnt you show up . Well, ill take the fifth amendment. Ladies and gentlemen, were running out of time. We have to get time for lunch and the next significance coming up, lets have a round of applause for our panel. And, of course, the irrepressable garnet hammond. [ applause ] interested in American History tv, visit our website. You can view our tv schedule, preview upcoming programs and watch college lectures, museum tours, archival films and more. American history tv at cspan. Org history. American history tv is on cspan three every weekend. Featuring museum tours, and programs on the presidency. The civil war and more. Heres a clip from a recent program. I happen to know the facts. Now, friends, im just an average american, but im an american american. And some of the things i see in this country of ours make my blood boy. I see people with foreign i see negroes holding jobs that belong to me and you. If we let this continue on, whats going to happen to us real americans. I have heard this talk before, i never expected to hear it in america. What are we real americans going to do about it . Youll find it right here in this pamphlet. The truth about negroes and foreigners, the truth about the catholic church. Are you believing that kind of talk . It makes pretty good sense to me. Well never be able to call this country our own until its a country without. Without what . Yeah, without what . Without negroes. Without alien foreigners. Without catholics. Without free masons. Whats wrong with the masons . Im a mason. Hey, that fellas talking about me. And that makes a difference, doesnt it . These are your enemies. These are the people who are trying to take hold of our country. Now you know them, you know what they stand for, and its up to you and me to fight them. I say destroy them before they destroy us. Thank you. Before he said masons, you were ready to agree with him . Yes, but he was talking about what about those other people. In this country we have no other people, we are american peop people. What about you, youre not an american, are you . I was born in hungary, and now i am an american citizen. I was a professor in hungary, i heard the same words we hear today. I thought nazis were stupid people, crazy fanatics, unfortunately, it wasnt so. You can watch this and other American History programs on our website, cspan. Org history. Tonight on the communicators. The Technology Fair for members of congress, looking at the latest in Drone Technology and new security fight tours for mobil phones. We want them to see innovation happening, thats happening in the u. S. , its happening clearer life changing innovation, whether its health care, car navigat n navigation, health and safety, its sao many other things, so they understand the decisions they make have real life consequences. Watch the communicators tonight at 8 00 eastern on cspan 2. All weekend. American history tv is featuring spokane, washington. Cspan city tours staff recently visited many sites, located in the eastern part of the state, about 280 miles from seattle, the city is home to