Would have been next to impossible to but she created home wherever she was for the family, i guess. Susan swain as is the purview of army spouses i think over the years. Pamela sanfilippo right. Susan swain well, we have one more video of white haven, that beautiful green structure we showed you earlier, but youll have to go to our website to find it. Each week were putting a special feature on our website at cspan. Org first ladies. And we have a video there that will show you the grants life together at white haven. Youre looking at just a little glimpse of it now, and boy does it look green. [laughter] pamela sanfilippo its called paris green. Susan swain next is john, watching us all the way out in washington state, snohomish, you are snohomish, excuse me youre on the air. John my name is john grant, no relation to ulysses. But my greatgranduncle was one general grants staff. His name was cyrus blue comstock. And i have a copy of his diary. And in it, it mentions a number of times when he was in washington that he would have lunch with with general grants wife. And i was wondering if anybody could elaborate on that. You know, mostly you hear about general grant and his war escapades, but afterwards, you know, does anybody has anybody ever heard of that . Cyrus blue comstock, by the way, married elizabeth blair, of which her i think it was her grandfather was the secretary or postmaster general under lincoln. William seale well, they were very close to the grants. John yes. William seale the blairs. Susan swain do you know any more for him on that . Pamela sanfilippo well, julia entertained so much that quite possible. And i recognize the name comstock, both from the civil war years and julias memoirs in the white house. And frequently congressmen or people who were looking to get into see grant would try and do that through julia, or to gain favor from grant, they would frequently go through julia because she was so easy and accessible to them. Susan swain our next is a call from judy watching us in brooklyn. Hi, judy. Judy good evening. I had two questions. Since general grant smoked so many cigars, i was wondering if julia or the children have any respiratory problems. And my other question was since england had leaned so heavily toward the confederacy, what were the relations like during the Grant Administration with england . Susan swain thanks very much. Pamela sanfilippo good questions. None of the neither julia nor the children ended up with any respiratory problems. Of course, grant ended up with throat cancer from smoking those cigars, and so it did eventually kill him. Pamela sanfilippo as far as england was concerned, one of the first issues that grant had to deal with as president were the claims against england for their support of the confederacy William Seale confederacy. Pamela sanfilippo and he actually sets up the first ever international arbitration, and is credited with peacefully resolving the dispute with england. Susan swain well take another call. This is larry in mill hall pennsylvania. Hi, larry. Larry larry hello. I am watching all of your series susan swain great, thanks. Larry series and enjoyed them very much. My question is, ive recently read the generals wife by isabel ross. And one of the comments that she makes in her book is that julias father really did not care for ulysses at first. So, i was just wondering if you could comment on that. William seale well, he did say that she wouldnt he told grant that she would not like the military life. He was very dubious. And she had been raised with everything, and would would definitely have to do without. He didnt susan swain and and they also had disagreements about over slavery and William Seale slavery. Pamela sanfilippo yeah. But initially, he William Seale i think it was personal. I think he thought that grant was not going to amount to much financially, and would not be able to give her what she took for granted. Pamela sanfilippo right. William seale yes, hes absolutely right i mean, ross was absolutely right about that. Yeah. Pamela sanfilippo yeah. Yeah, julia was her fathers favorite child. The first daughter born after four sons. And according to julia, colonel dent actually offered when he he told ulysses that the life of the army wasnt what julia was set for, he offered her sister, nel, to William Seale oh. Pamela sanfilippo to grant which grant obviously turned down, and continued to try and convince colonel dent that no matter what it took, he would be the one to make julia happy. Susan swain but is it not fair to say, some of his concerns may have been valid . Because ulysses s. Grant was a great warrior, a great general. But most of the other ventures he got involved with, he had a pretty difficult time making it work. William seale yeah. Pamela sanfilippo well, of course, at that time you know, in 1843, 1844, nobody knew that grant would become the success. He was in the army. He was he actually didnt intend to stay in the army. He wanted to get out and be a math professor. So, i susan swain but lets but lets look at his postwhite house years. Even after he has all of this time in the white house and the experience, he then goes on to a career in wall street and loses lots of money. Pamela sanfilippo well William Seale no, fred did that. Pamela sanfilippo it was actually his son, ulysses junior William Seale fred, yeah. Pamela sanfilippo who is the no, it was ulysses junior. William seale didnt fred lose the first money . Pamela sanfilippo well, i know it was susan swain but it affected the family fortunes, didnt it . Pamela sanfilippo yes, it affected all of the family William Seale oh, yeah. Pamela sanfilippo fortunes. And basically, Ferdinand Ward had everyone fooled. He was basically a called a wall street wizard. He was making everybody money hand over fist. And that should have rung some bells, but just like today, it doesnt. He ended up grant lost just about everything. Susan swain well, this is a similar question on twitter. How is it that grant lost all his estates and money . Was it due to his drinking . Was he a gambler . Was he financially irresponsible . William seale no. Susan swain so, youd say no no, no to all that . Pamela sanfilippo correct. William seale he wasnt a man probably who concentrated on finance, like people who make money do. I dont think that was the first thing in his life ever. He would like to have had money a lot of money, but i think other things interested him. Susan swain was he bad judge of character . Pamela sanfilippo well, he talks about when this financial failure happens with Ferdinand Ward where ward comes to ulysses junior, and then to grant himself and says, you know, the bank is in a little bit of a financial strait. Can you borrow some money . And we just need to get through the next few days. And grant accepts that. Borrows 150,000 from william vanderbilt, and Ferdinand Ward absconds with the money to canada and the fortune is lost. Grant says that he doesnt know if hell be able to trust anyone ever again. Susan swain well, we have them already in their post white house years, and we havent talked about their leaving the white house. People watching should know this, but of course at the time there were no restrictions on running for a third term. William seale third term, yeah. Susan swain did the grants wish to seek a third term in office . William seale no, he didnt. But there were many people who wanted him to, and she did. And so when he declined it, he didnt tell her. He gave the letter to them without telling her, and shed begun to be suspicious. They were upstairs in the hall at the white house, and she said you cant do this. Why did you . He said, ive declined a third term. And she said, you cant do this to me, you cant do this to me. I want it. Susan swain she wanted to continue being first lady . William seale yes, and he said, its done. Thats it. And she seems to have held up fine until inaugural day, when they got on the palace car, as they called it, the train car, and then she says she went to a bedroom and fell on the bed and sobbed and cried and wept. She hated to leave the place so. Pamela sanfilippo she said she felt like a a waif with no home, because she wasnt sure exactly what was going to happen. William seale and surely shed felt that before. Pamela sanfilippo right. William seale isnt that a splendid situation. Susan swain she was loathe to leave. And in fact did they plot a comeback . William seale once he pamela sanfilippo in when they returned from the world tour, there were those who thought that he should run for office again, and especially with all of his Foreign Relations experience, and he was interested at that point feeling again that he could be of service to the country. Julia says they were in chicago when the convention met, and she tried to encourage him to go downstairs and meet at the convention and show his face knowing that that would put him over the top with the votes needed, but he absolutely refused to do that and lost the nomination. Susan swain a very specific question, because some of the properties that were looking at are near the anheuserbusch family property, and youre from that region of the world. Michael reagan wants to know were the grants tied in any way to anyone in the anheuserbusch family . Pamela sanfilippo no, not at all. The busch family purchased about 280 acres of the white haven estate in 1903. The only connection is that in the early years of the war Adolphus Busch served for a short time in the civil war. Susan swain marvin in cincinnati, youre on. Good evening. Marvin yes, i had always heard the story, and i know you had alluded to the enmity that mrs. Lincoln and mrs. Grant had between each other, that that they were originally the first couple that was offered an invitation to fords theater the night of the assassination, and that mrs. Grant sort of politely told mr. Grant not to accept and that was the only reason that they were not in the box that night. Is that true or not . William seale thats true, but they were going to philadelphia, and they had a house there. They were going to see the children in philadelphia, and thats where they were when they heard that the president had been shot. Susan swain now, was it as specific that the assassin made it to the train and the door was locked . William seale she talks about it. Pamela sanfilippo thats what she talks about in her memoirs and that even earlier during that day when she was at lunch that there had been a Suspicious Group at the other table. William seale and then when they were driving to the train a man came riding a horse along by the carriage, on the way to the station, and which was on the mall in those days, and looked in the window at grant, and grant remarked that he was sinister, and he did it twice. It may be just coincidences, who knows, but she was obviously scared to death. Everybody was scared to death. Susan swain and they believed that he was targeted as part of the assassination plot that brought down the lincoln administration. Well we learned that julia grant was much, very unhappy to leave the white house, and general grant assuaged that grief by taking her on a twoyear world tour. What should we know about that tour . Pamela sanfilippo well, it was actually his idea. He said he felt upon leaving the white house that he felt like a boy out of school, and he had always loved traveling, and so they embarked on this tour that was just originally supposed to be europe, and then extended all the way around the world. She enjoyed every minute of it mostly because of the praise and acclaim that she saw her husband receiving, and the the shopping that she did as well, of things that she wanted to to bring back home with her. But she just had a wonderful time on the world tour. Susan swain were going to return to the galena home and look at some of the world tour items that they have on display there. After his eight years in the white house, the grants came back here to galena for a little rest and relaxation for a couple months. And then they decided to go on a world tour. They were gone for over two years, visiting close to 40 countries on this tour. The grants were so popular at that time, they were like american celebrities, and they were treated like royalty, these countries that they went to. They received a lot of gifts on the tour. Were fortunate enough to have some of those still in the home. Two of them are here on the mantle. These red vases were a gift from the king of bulgaria. After the world tour, they came back here for another couple months, then they went to mexico and cuba. Now, the paintings on each side of the fireplace, the landscape paintings, were given to the grants on that trip by the government of mexico. Artist jose velasco, a very popular artist in mexico, did these landscape paintings for the grants. This is the dining room, and of course, this is where the family would have their meals. Julia maybe wouldve done a little light entertaining here. This is not, you know, anything too elaborate in the home. We have some of the gifts that were given to the grants on that world tour. This piece was actually given to julia. This was this is a bronze urn on a teak wood table given to her by the cama, japan. The little vase on the table was given to the grants by the emperor of japan. And back here on the mantle is probably one of the most personal pieces that julia probably liked the best. The frame, the leaves in here, she actually framed it. The leaves were given to her by general grant on their tour. It was leaves that he picked up from the holy city. She kept, had it framed, and wrote the whole story on there. Julia probably had the time of her life on this world tour. She devotes almost a third of her memoirs talking about it. She developed friendships with Queen Victoria and a very good friendship with the emperor of japan. They actually ended up staying in japan longer than they had expected because they developed such a nice, close relationship with him. After president grant passed away, julia was living in new york, and the emperor of japan actually came to visit julia while she was there. They still kept that friendship and had it for the rest of julias life. This was always a place that the children, the family could come back to. And this was always considered home and always was welcoming for them. Not just this house, but galena, too. She speaks in her memoirs of galena, and always refers to it as her dear, dear galena. End galena. Susan swain well, we have a a just a short while left and we have to talk about their years after the tour. They come back to the United States and weve theyve lost lots of money in this event we talked about with the family and the investments in new york city. Whats their financial situation, and whats the role of the memoirs in assuaging that . Pamela sanfilippo well, they are when word gets out that theyve lost this money, there are actually some veterans from the war who send grant money to help him to that they loan to him, but hes been offered to write some articles for century magazine about the war, and then encouraged from that to write his memoirs, something that he had never been interested in doing. And its samuel clemens, mark twains Publishing Company that ends up publishing those memoirs for grant, and although he completes them just a few short days before he passed away, he knows that they will bring financial comfort to julia. William seale well, the first royalty check was 200,000. Susan swain 200,000. William seale imagine in that day. The book made what, over around a million . Its a great book, a great classic. I recommend it to anyone. Susan swain is that right . Still readable today . Pamela sanfilippo oh, very much so. William seale absolutely. Its a beautiful work. Pamela sanfilippo even for those of us not military historians. Susan swain a question on twitter, were mark twain and the grants friends, since he offered to publish the president s memoirs . Pamela sanfilippo yes, they did become good friends and it was through twains efforts that, as i said, grant began diligently writing the memoirs, and there were some claims that twain had actually almost ghostwritten, but twain was very adamant that no, it was grant who had written those, word for word. Susan swain more specific question about mark twain on facebook. How close was mark twain to the grants . I know twain paid for a sculptor, gerhardt, to wait for mr. Grant to die so they could have a death mask made of him. Was twain a regular at the white house, and how did mrs. Grant relate to him . Pamela sanfilippo not at the white house. It was afterwards that they developed the the closer relationship. Apparently twain had initially years earlier, suggested to grant about writing his memoirs, but almost as an offhand remark, and so when grant says that century magazine is going to publish his memoirs, because they were the first to make the offer, twain reminds him that no, he had made the offer much earlier. Susan swain im going to ask my colleagues if we can bring that picture up, the photograph again of the president in his very final days. Its such a poignant picture. Weve all seen it, wrapped in his blanket, on the porch of the cabin in new york, working on these memoirs. William seale in horrible pain. Susan swain and it was throat cancer, and very painful. How how was he able to get these memoirs done . William seale he became impassioned to do it. Pamela sanfilippo sheer determination. William seale she became that way about writing later. It was the main thing in her life. But he did. He became impassioned. It was so important to secure a comfort for his wife. Susan swain and then he died so shortly afterwards. It seems as though, as somehow adrenaline was keeping him going until he could get these finished. Pamela sanfilippo yes, and julia even talks about that, and grant does too, that that was what was keeping him going, just just to be able to finish those. Susan swain now, i would like to take a call, but then id like to hear about her memoirs because she was the first first lady to write memoirs. I actually have a copy, but lets listen to a call, and then well come back to that. Kathleen in san francisco. Hi, kathleen. Kathleen thank you very much. I had a quick question. Julia had four brothers. And i think i remember that during the civil war, they fought on the south for the south. Is that true . And then did they finally reconcile . Pamela sanfilippo it was her brother fred who had been at west point with ulysses, did stay in the union army, and ends up serving on grants staff. Her brother, john, none of them actually joined the confederate army, but they certainly did go south and support the confederacy during the war. At one point, her brother john is captured and put in prison and seeks grants assistance in getting an exchange, a prisoner exchange, and grant refuses, basically, to teach john a lesson. But when theyre in the white house, the family is always there. William seale always close. Susan swain another question on twitter. With all these complexities during the civil war, asking were the grants friends with either robert e. Lee or Jefferson Davis . Pamela sanfilippo not friends. Certainly, grant respected robert e. Lee during the war and he had known him earlier in the mexican war. William seale this was afterward. Pamela sanfilippo but julia does become, after both Jefferson Davis and Ulysses Grant passed away, julia does become friends with varina davis. Susan swain well, heres the memoir, and it is available today. This is julia dent grants memoirs, and again, the first first lady to write her memoirs. It was not published until 1975. This edition was edited by the great john y. Simon, now deceased, but a great civil war and lincoln historian. Whats the story about how these became and the editor of the grant papers, i should say that most importantly, the editor of the grant papers, which was his lifes work. The how did these memoirs of the first lady come to be published, and why so long between her death and their writing . Pamela sanfilippo well, she says that it was her children who, after grants death, encouraged her to begin writing her memoirs of her wonderful life with her husband. And she says she just started it to satisfy their request, but then she realized that recalling all of these wonderful times kind of brought new life to her. And she did look at them, i think she was kind of ambivalent about having them published. Initially, she thought it was just something to record for her children. But then she did try to pursue getting them published several different times, and one publisher told her that they were so private that the people that were alive at that time, it was it was too much personal information. Another time, it was she was told that they would be sold through subscription and she was looking for kind of a lump sum deal. So they they remained in the family hands then, unpublished until john simon convinced the family that they should become public. Susan swain well, she lived for a good number of years after. Pamela sanfilippo 17 years. Susan swain was she an active first lady . Did she advise other first ladies, or did she basically become a private citizen again . Pamela sanfilippo she still did a little entertaining initially. William seale i think she was out there, yeah. Pamela sanfilippo her son fred, was appointed ambassador to austria, and she joins him over there. And then comes back to the United States. She wrote several articles for different magazines, harpers bazaar, after the spanishamerican war, she writes an article that talks about the governments and the nations responsibility to the widows and orphans of the war. Susan swain norma, in newcastle, indiana. Your question. Norma yes, i was wondering about whether or not there was a relationship between julia and ulysses and the confederate, general longstreet. Susan swain thank you. Pamela sanfilippo longstreet was a distant cousin of julias and so when grant was first courting julia at white haven, longstreet was also stationed at Jefferson Barracks and came out. Its theres a possibility, although the record is not quite clear, that longstreet actually served as one of grants groomsmen at the wedding. Susan swain how long after general grant, president grants death was the famous grants tomb built in new york city . Pamela sanfilippo that was dedicated april 22nd, 1897. Susan swain and at his passing, how did the country mourn him . Pamela sanfilippo i believe it was the largest funeral ever held in the country. Susan swain larger than lincolns . Pamela sanfilippo mmhmm. They brought his body from mount mcgregor, where he had passed away, into new york city and buried his body in a temporary tomb in Riverside Park in new york city, and then began the fundraising effort to build the the tomb that we know today. Susan swain and julia was alive for the dedication . Pamela sanfilippo yes, she attended that. Susan swain and what was her role in all of that . Was she pamela sanfilippo proud widow of and pleased to see the nation recognizing her husband in that way. Susan swain so, as we close here, weve looked at a long and distinguished military career. A life of many ups and downs for the grants over time. Eight years in the white house. A successful world tour, very celebrated. What is the legacy of julia dent grant, and how does she fit into the pantheon of first ladies were studying and learning about this year . William seale well, they are all women who basically support what their husband is trying to achieve. She did it with certain splendor in a very difficult time in American History, and really turned the knob on a period of a of a dark period that ended with the early reconstruction and brightened things for the rest of the century. I think her public popularity, her featuring of the general the way she did things, the personal way she was, that she was a very significant first lady in that way, a public kind of first lady. Susan swain and after coming from just after the sort of victorian fainting lady first ladies, is she a harbinger of the modern first lady in any way . William seale thats very difficult to answer. I think they all were opinionated, strong women. Most all of them. But perhaps in a way. She had public interests. Yes. I would say so. The next people, it would be moreso with mrs. Hayes, but i think julia grant attracted a lot of attention and public attention to the family that lived in the white house. Susan swain well, pam sanfilippo, youre working on a book to establish this thesis. What is your answer to that question . Pamela sanfilippo well, i think she wouldve said that her legacy was that she was a devoted and loving wife, mother to their their children, but i think more than that, she tried to represent what her husband was trying to achieve peace and reconciliation in the nation, and in her role as first lady, she was able to accomplish that. Susan swain many thanks to all the folks at the grant sites around the country who helped with us, bringing you video tonight, and to the good people at the White House Historical association who are our partners for this series. And that concludes our discussion of julia dent grant. Our thanks to our two guests for being with us tonight. William seale thank you, susan. [captions Copyright National cable satellite corp. 2015] [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy. Visit ncicap. Org] you are watching American History tv, all weekend, every weekend on cspan3. To join the conversation, like us on facebook. Three men and a woman believed to be members of the puerto rican nationalist gang that in november 1950 attempted the assassination of president truman opened fire from the visitors gallery of the house of representatives. Five congressmen were hit jensen of iowa, davis of tennessee, rabbits of alabama george helen of troy limited and bensley of michigan, who was seriously injured. The gun wielders, to the goes the evil distinct it was one of the most violent acts that ever occurred in the chamber. And there were debates right after that saying, we cant let this happen again. What we need to do is wall off the visitors gallery with bulletproof glass so that this could never happen again. And the more the members talked about that and thought about it, they said, no, that is a bad idea. This is the peoples house and the people cant be walled off from the floor in what is going on there. The Capitol Building is a simple and that makes it a target. They mentioned the british burned the building in 1814. There was a bombing during world war i by a professor who is opposed to american support for allies. There was the shooting in 1954. It happened in 19 71 was a bomb set up by the Weather Underground opposed to the vietnam war. In 1983, there was another bombing on the senate side by a Group Opposed to resident megans president reagans foreignpolicy. There have been those instances over time, and yet the capital has remained a remarkably open building. Don ritchie and former house historian ray smock on the history of the house and senate, its leaders, characters, and prominent events. Sunday night at 8 00 eastern and pacific on cspans q a. Up next on American History tv, u. S. Naval Warfare College professor maurer. He examines churchills changing attitude