Transcripts For CSPAN2 Commissioner 20240704

The center for auto ownership at American University. My name is caroline and im attack professor and managing director of the Kogod Tax Policy Center here in the kogod schoolt to introduce you to the time of Tax Policy Center forli those of you who dont know us. We are a nonpartisan Research Center housed in the kogod school of business and we put out research on issues ranging from Small Business tax literacy and education to tax cpliancecht workforce and gig workers, access to capital challenges of Business Owners and partlyor today Tax Administration modernization challenges. Add kogod as though more broadly we are experts on ai, analytics and Digital Transformation. And we built this expertise into research and curriculum. For example, our Research Center earlier this year together witha government urges research on how tax agencies can effectively adopt and administration. This research reflect opportunities and challenges of agencies using ai, and we were able wn, some commissioner werfel, other irish folks and tax Agency Administration folks from aroun■ the world to talk about how ai has went into to improve taxpayer education and outreach how happy i can facilitate exoplanets enforcement activities, and api needs to be rolled out alongside Risk Mitigation strategies and government structures. What whatt it is the irs Digital Transformation plan which will be p introduced by commissioner Daniel Werfel who was marking his oneyear anniversary wit we. And he will be presenting a presentation or 20 minutes and then be in conversation with our very own being david. They worked together on the 2020 president ial transition so will be great to hear them recaps of alltime french had some delight. So thank you so much for joining us. Oneyear anniversary of being irs commissioner, it is anry hor to be here at this historic university. The irs is an agency that affects all americans. And the university is a fitting place to talk about the future irs because you are at thetare e filing your taxes with the irs for many, many yearso right now, the irs stands at a historic crossroads. There is an opportunity we have note had before, and once in the generation opportunity. Of course you may be wondering what opportunity . Same questiond when i was home one friday afternoon in the fall of 2022 when i received a phone call from the Biden Administration asking if i would be willing to serve as irs commissioner. Now once i could get my jaw off the floor, because this was a surprise and a great honor, my first question to the white house and Treasury Department leadership was, what are you hoping that i or any irsld achin this role at this time . And the answer they gave me encapsulates the once in a generation opportunity. They told me the next commissioner will lead the irs through the most important tech enabled transformation of a Government Agency in u. S. History herey jaw dropped to the floor. And i will be honest with you. Part of a suspected that this might be a bit of hyperbole, so to throw my hat in the ring. So the job did it i will show is noonsidered the world that you live in and what you have come to expect to do digitally, ony your phone and tablets, withou paper,■rom wherever you are in the world, i have come to realize that the modernization of the irs is a generational imperative. But ensuring the irs states pace with an everincreasing Digital World is just part of the imperative. Our race to catch with the modern economy if we completed will unlock three critical results. First, it unlocks our ability to ensure access, engaging communities and make Administration Work better. Se increase accountability for those that seek to inappropriate export theax sysm. Ability toir restore trust and increase fairness in the irs and the tax system. So lets dive in. And explore why done to transform the irs is so vital and actually quite i beneficial to you, your■y famil, and your community. Ill tell you about the momentum we have today and where that momentum can take us. Now, i actually remember t moment i realized that this was not height or an exaggeration. It was our morning staff meeting last fall the night before i ive been at the service for America Awards at the kennedy center, the biggest Award Ceremony for c federal employee, the oscars for government. I was excited and■; i challenge the irs team to win one of these big awards next year. They asked before an example of an award winner, and i immediately shared with them myt before. It was a team of nasa scientists who sent a rocket like an asterd 7 million miles away going 40,000 miles peroi hour. These nasa scientists hit the astroid dead center. And not only dedicated bullseye, they changed its trajectory. For the first time a group of nasa scientists and engineers proved that if an asteroid were ever headed forer earth, they could deflectt and save humanity. My team looked at me sheepishly and said, be tough to beat. And sent a shrewd member of my team chimed in and said, but where did nasa get the money for that rocket . Its collected by the irs. And that is a moment i fully appreciated how importantj4 the irs is andec how monumental this task an opportunity. And its not just ensuring we have thecientist can save the planet from asteroids that its ensuring the government has funds to keep our food t safe, our skies safe, roads safe. So if we are essential to fundingal so many of the things that make life in america possible, i am left with one burning question. Why does Homer Simpson not like well, theyre supposed to be a video here. Lets see if it pops on. All right. I dont think we will have the video. But in the video basically, it willll probably pop on one tellg destroyed, homer drives the irs. [booing] oh, boo your self. So why does Homer Simpson not like us . He thinks hes paying too much in taxes. It maybe he thinks his taxes are far too complicated these are ae of the irs control. We do not set the tax rate or write the tax code. But if homer and other taxpayer americans are upset that we are not answering the phone or we are taking too long to send a refund or otherwise increasing strend frustration as they navigate the tax responsibilities rather than decreasing it, then we can and should turn things around. But we have a large mountain to climb. These are snapshots of the irs just a few years ago. Paper returns piled up and always in cafeterias, shuttered Tax Assistance Centers so people couldnt get help. So i suppose i can understand why we may be booed by Homer Simpson or other noncartoon americans for being frustrated with the irs. But how did we get to this point . S overwhelmed by paper tax forms when the resthe of the world had moved the on paper, deteriorating customer service, and munich audit rates, stagnant chno result of two trends over the last couple of decades. The first trend, t■uhers far too long. From. From 20102021, the irs budget was slashed more than 22 . During this decade of budget cuts the American Population grew and annual returns increased by more than 15 million. Along with countless changes to tax laws and increasingly complicated financial environment, globalization, additional currencies, exponential growth in digital commerce, and other factors that increased t size and complexity of americas taxnc system. As her budget declined but our plate of responsibility grew, irs employees worked through it. Long hours and sweat equity would often get the job done, because Innovative Technologies were not available. Enter the pandemic. The irs workforce heroically managed to the pan tax system and successfully getting emergency payments to hundreds of millions of the country, but eventually the bottom fell out. Come out of the pandemic we were so bit rate in paper backlog, understaffed and hobbled by stagnant technology,le we literally no longer after thehe phones or keep our walkin centers open. Enter the Inflation Reduction Acthe in 2022, and finally we hd new funding to not only built the irs back to par performers, but also to build it for the future. And even though this new law provides you attain your runway for the irs to rebuild, it has been clear since day one that we needed to show results immediately. Well, this is our awesome cafeteria today. Funds from the new law allowed us to dig out of a deep hole, back to Better Service standards, and laid the foundation for the transformation to come. New funds arens catalyzing a new f the irs. The era of unprocessed returns in hallways in cafeterias has ended. Our phone center is back in operating with record efficiency. All of our walkin centers are open fully staffed and expanding around the country, and we have new tools irs. Gov and a scene record traffic to the site. We have launched mor last two yn we were able y to launch in the last 20. And sometimes its the little■< things, like this Filing Season we had a callback option on her main 1800 the air of taxpayers being required to stay on hold listening to elevator music. When you are funded, you can make these types of improvements. When you are not, you operations remain in the past. Now we have an opportunity to move on just days performers and built a 21st century tax agency to serve the American People in the manner they expect and the level they deserve. Our vio the future is an irs that is too effective in easingx tax law. Simple reforms, more intuitive processes, and a staff that is increasingly transparent areas of empathynd understanding who have the tools to help taxpayers meet the obligations easily and fairly. Even more real for you. My parents who are in their 80s have never used an atm. They go into the bank, talk to. My children on the other hand, or in their 20 have never set foot in bank. Not to open an account and certainly not to get cash. Think about how you interact with your bank. When you buy something with a debit card that transaction shows up on your online account before you even leave the store. But when you make a payment to■ the irs they can take days, even a week to show up on your online account. When your bank is concerned about fraud, it will text you and let yt sort it out instantly from your smartphone. When the irs answer may be fraught with your account, we send you a letter. We are working to change that. And to transform to be ready for the new digital economy. With histocing an irs where all taxpayers can meet all the responsibilities including all interactions with the irs from questions to paymentsnt to resolutions in a completely digital manner, if theyho transformation because a Digital First irs is a generational imperative. Its how most taxpayers want to interact with us in the 21st century. But the Digital Transformation is also the keystone that helps unlock the True Potential of the irs. Heres how. When financial retail and travel everything online, which accelerated during covid, the number of people calling their 1800 numbers dropped precipitously as did the number of people showing up for other locations. Our vision is not only where we can deliver everything for taxes online. Its one where we redeployed our capacities, our employees and will actually still need our employees will now have the time and tools to focus on helping the people that need it most, and increasing scrutiny on bad actors and purposeful tax if it is the entrance of unlocking capacity told the people that need our help the most, less time on phones means more time our employees can be victims of Identity Theft and less times correcting 1044 smear it was can spend more time engaging in communities supporting walkin sites and volunteer tax clinics that assist lowincome filers and helping taxpayers who cant afford to hire an accountant to get it rightht the first time. Less time processing paper returns meanset our employees cn spend more time helping every taxpayer, regardless of income, claim credits like the earned income tax economic lifeline for so many. Yet 7 million eligible low income taxpayers■ eachea credi. We can unlock our potential to do more to help them. At digital irs does not mean wep the people who need it the most. Our digital deformation to unlock these new capacities has already begun. For example, we made significant upgrades this year to witness my refund a tool . Also this Filing Season we joined, we launched direct file, a system where taxpayers in 12 pilot states can file their tax returns online directly with the irs for free. Direct file is almost teller madelormade for students and young people is simple tech situation. So if your home is in a state pilot, check it out, go to direct fileotot qualify. And heres an example of whats coming in the near future a clear way to communicate with the irs and help protect taxpayers from scams and schemes. Know if the irs is trying to contact you. Why is this important . We have too many bad actors calling and texting, pretending to be the irs tricking americans are pulling out their credit card and paying them a fake tax debt. In the future if you get such a call or text you will just teach about your online account. If it shows a green banner like this actual irs is not trying to reach you. It is not us. Hang up, ignore the text and if if you are willing, report this online so we can investigate and hold about actor accountable. There crackdown but also increase on those that intentionally evade responsibility. Illcantly down the employees to focus on the complex complex areas of noncompliance overwhelmingly occur on the highest well and largest taxpayers. Many wealthy large taxpayers are doing the right thing many are using it as a way to inappropriately shield theirap income. Less resources dedicated a return means more resources and Artificial Intelligence city and find hidden income. ■n in fact wee of ai the largest in the world for hiding income behin complexity that same ai helps with the precision partnerships playing by the rules and doing the right thing. Using the new ai modelsudits on 76 hyatt risk complex partnerships including hedge funds and publicly traded partnerships. Unlocks new capacity to broaden our reach scrutinize a lot more high risk complex filers that we previously could. At unlocks to focus our enforcement efforts on the high income groups that for too long have fallen under the radar. With new funding weve already served notices to 125,000 highho file a federal income tax return since 2017. Including 25000 people with incomes over 1 million. These nonviolence represent more than 100 billion in financial activity. We are cracking down on 1600 millionaires and billionaires ae individuals to fail, through their basic civic duty of filing a tax return and paying with ao. A more digital irs unlocks our ■oee ability to audit inappropriate writeoffs for personal use of corporate assets such as corporate jets. In my first year here the irs team has already collected nearly 500 million millionaires and billionaires to ensure fairness in our tax system. And we are just getting started. So, this is how our digital platform for taxpayers will unlock our employees capacity to scrutiny where it is needed most. Perhaps most critical new funding inner transformation to unlock our ability to ensure they are desperate for everyone who plays by the rules and helps restore trust in the system. No issue is more important than fairness. Just over a year ago, inacate confirmation hearing, researchers at several universities and the u. S. Treasury published a study that black taxpayers three times more likely to be audited than other taxpayers. Our processes were impacts on t. Not only committed to fixing this top priority confirmed but i became moreed to become the irs commissioner. I wanted to fix this. Any indication of racial bias in our work is unacceptable. I immediately met with the irs team setting the issue. Too quickly evaluate the extent to which art priorities or the processes in the data we contributed to the spit disparity paid since ive been commissioner ive been meeting with communities that were impacted, hearing their ncerns, sharing our regrets and outlining the actions we are taking on substantially reducing the number of audits or they were identified. Making changes to our algorithms specifically intended to address the disparities. We are now ready to invest new resources to help identify any di age, gender and geography. We are using that research toinr approaches across compliance efforts. Were trying to rebuild trust overhauling appliance and hold ourselves accountable for the taxpayers we serve. For one or 50 years dating back to president lincoln but more recently the evolved. Tax laws are increasingly playing a larger role addressing the most pressing challenges of our time. Irs employees are hard at work on programs to cut child poverty. Programs to expand Healthcare Access until age 26 the Affordable Care act. As to the irs and taxes. To address the threat of Climate Change because the hundreds of billions of dollars tax credits. With defendant we can support policies to improve the lives of all americans. Moment in tax collection and beyond. But to succeed and century we need you. We need to count lawyers and finance experts. We also need data scientists, engineers, experts and ai in human behavior. No matter what you are studying your expertise and most importantly your passion for change in service. The summer of 1963 john f. Kennedy came here to Americans University commencement where he called for the First Nuclear Test Ban Treaty with the soviet union. It was the start of a historic effort that led to greater stability and peace in the president kennedy enjoyed president. I pass a photo of his speec i d. President kennedy told graduates in 1963 no problem of human destiny is beyond human beings. Mans reason and spirit the seemingly unsolvable. We believe we can do it thankfully Tax Administration is a far cry from nuclear diplomacy. The decisions the action of the irs affect the lives of every american directly and those are in this effort to solve what has for too long been unsolvable. To undta transformation of a Government Agency in u. S. History. Catalyzedy guided we can transform the irs for the 21st century. Can meet taxpayers where they e paid support them to meet their obligations and make Tax Administration work better. To try to exploit tax system. Restore trust and increase fairness. We can better serve the country and you, our taxpayers in the years and decades to come. [applause] clicks my irs stress ball they are handing out over their i need one of quickly first think the irs team for putting this event together. Theyre working over the weekend let me say thats extraordinary speech. I have been for 33 years. Ive never seen a Government Official give a speech like that. Its usually looking at a net wood podium looking through notes with eight part plan and subparts. It was a metaphor for what youre tryin up the irs, be transformational i got the compliment you on that. Thank you. Quickly talk about your person ive known you for a while peeking at our at the boston consulting group. Running a big practice in making a lot of money. One of the hardest jobs in government. Why did you do that . It is a passionnd service. At the of the acting irs commissioner very challenging moment. The first few days is doing meed senators andmembers of congress. I met with senator john mccain. They were news and protests outside of the irs building. Senator mccains that you must be someone who likes to run gun. And i thought i aspire to be that. That such a big heavy complement to receive such a motivating thing to say and i reflected a lot. Especially from senator mccain. For me a sudden inspiration to be that type of person. From that moment dont know if i am but i want to be. If i get asked for the call to do something hard and challenging important i want to be the person senator mccain suggested i could be. This is an old ambitious audacious plan but how much is it going to cost . We have roughly 60 billion under the Inflation Reduction Act. Its been over 10 years. It is a big monumentalk with all the modernization that is required to achieve this vision. We are making progress as i said paid we have■i■< momentum. But this vision taxpayers around the nation online and get everything done. Theres a lot of data that needs to be clean, Technology Needs cleaned up, processes that need to be engineered behind the scenes the irs or technology is old. Its on old language. It is nn ot cloud enabled. We have a lot of investments to do the types of things i described in terms of reaching taxpayers where they are. We need people on the ground ine accountants to help us with the number of high income filers out there who are invading their taxes is more they could handle and scrutinize today. He of technology and ai to help you be more efficient. Youre going to spend the 60 billion for it how much you think youre goi to recover in the billiondollar investment and create an easier way to do your taxes. ■8 get things done and less times protect you from scams. But the work we do to recover from those who arent noncompliant generally runs about a six one ratio■h for every 1 dollar invested. The return is enormous. You into a centering use at you, you have a lot in your plates. The reality is and whats very important tohink its on the irs without the workforce. 90000 people . 90000 people have the unique opportunity to paint a vision of much more digital set of solutions. We are still hiring as i said in my remarks one of the biggest surprises that i had a pleasant surprise is this workforce is ready for change. They are passionate about building the capacity, gaining tools, taking on new trainin and new responsibilities to do more to serve taxpayers. Taxpayers. Spiring to me was cookson you are successful in achieving your goals the agency will be much more digital and mr employees if im employee of the irs should not be worried about my job . You should not be worried about your job. That was the not just all taxpayers can do all of their interactions with the irs digitally if they choose. The next part of that division is what is that a lot . But locks new capacity over time to be redeployed to do other things differently. We have 7 million taxpayers around the country who are low t apply for. We need workforce working within the community not all of these have access to computers and to go online. You can meet them where they are. Lester was served with called pop up to see go to one thats not close to existing el shop and work up with low income taxpayers. But you say it we could reach all of those areas, there are so many more areas with underserved taxpayers that wed to reach. To the size and complexity of the tax system and our taxpayers. Again we are not going to be able to be s if we lose the workforce and they capacity it would bring. Will start the tax their 250a Million Dollars in taxes. Who are these people who think they away with it plus willtechnology enable them to br find them and make sure they pay their fair share . Of the hundred 25000 taxpayers out there. 25000 in more than a million. Since 2017. We finally now have heres the thing about have thehe funds not the letter thats expensive its the followup. If we send a letter no followup none of our letters will have. We have to wait until we have the capacity rehire all of the people to hire up to the white staffing level. Now we can reach about these non filers. We are using technology the increasing our enforcement of high wealth and large taxpayers. Including high wealth and tax payers and here is why. We invest in these precise the ai data science and subject matter expertise is tech the gh the right thing we wont have to reach you. You will have the expense of the irs audit. You will know that others in your market your competitors will be held accountable to the right thing. ■ the due scrutiny on these complex situations actually benefits the complex filersed is talk about low income filers. You were nice enough to do a roundtable with some students and professor classes and also professor bruckner classes they go out in the community and help low income americans file taxes. One of the things that one of the students says the level of trust on the irs is extremely low. Some of the clients command including some that are not documented americans. They get an envelope and will irs. So what is behind that and what are you doing to improve the level of trust . That is why its an essential theme that we have to trust. We have to raise our game of how we are communicating with taxpayers. We have to relocate our forms, our engagement strategies so they are including more empathy. We need to do more partnerships that help us demystify the irs. Im explain in many cases were reaching out to them to make sure they understand what benefits and credits they may be eligible for. Part of it is announcing an ambition in order to route north is at the irs. Ndicating our true north is to help low income taxpayers gain access to the irs for help. To get the credits they deservem from these scams because low income and vulnerable populations tend to be more subject and they tend to be exploited more often. So it starts with setting the ambition. Communicating and obvious have to walk the walk and back that up. How do we back that up we get out into the community. We do these pop up walk and centers. We do things like this past weekend enforcing taxpayer experiences will be open our doors and focus on training and communities. But our partners are critical. Local Community Leaders and others can help demystify that the irs and you are at risk. What we want to for underserved populations this idea the irs is here to provides and to make sure and credits that will help. You mentioned your parents or their 80s and my dad turns 90 today. Let me tell you what happens with him. He files his taxes■ and he may call the irs every day. We are familiar with that profile. I have your cell phone i can give him . [laughter] how should Digital Transformation strategy help someone like my dad . First of all we already have tools online like where is my e are continuing to invest. Like for example we created this filing a virtual ct function we are texting back and forth in some cases and other cases the situation. Its enabling people to get quick, easy, from their smart us so they can have complete clarity. The idea around this individual account that has everything you. May beat your 90yearold dad does not feel as comfortable online but u. S. His son or grandkids can work with him to set up the online account and say grandpa if you get a phone call from someonela the irs and by the way these imposters they. Specifically on the elderly. Theyve studied different scripts they can used to trick the elderly into pulling up their credit card. What we need to do is get the word out and have puncements int how the irs website can be the source of truth to detmi really ever call you. And when we do, which is very rare we dont threaten with this Immediate Tax penalty. We do not make promises we do not threaten deportation. F ■ we are still sharing with irs and other agencies that could risk deportation. Is just not in the cards if something is g to happen with the irs that is significant is going to play out over many, many interactions. And again we very rarely call you. We need to get the word out increasingly through Public Service announcements. Through partners, through events like this to set the reality of what we are trying to get what we do on a daytoday basis. Is go to the other end of the my daughters 22 she felt her taxes for the first time last year end i helped her. It was challenging because is not that easy. If filing and she has a refund how much faster will she get a refund if she files electronically and gets her Bank Account Information versus what i do which is send in a piece of paper . At the irs we strongly encourage electronic filing. We strongly encourage you to select direct deposit for a track record right now as we get refunds to people and under 21 days if you file h■s electronicy and choose direct deposit just to clarify what we are trying to doith is building this digitally relevant platform for your children and their children and so on. As to give them option. So right now and over the past several years the way you file electronically and for free has both the commercial software provider. This year as i mentioned were piloting 12 states an option on the menu to file direct for free. You will get your refund if youre owed one allison 21 we did not do it electronically how much longer . And plus you are adding to the work load to manage all that paper. That means were not hping the people who need help the most. The more we get rid of paper the more we driveo our website and build a website that can do all these things you can do with your favorite online bank. The more our people can focus on veterans dire straits each year she comes out with a report was keeping you up at night report. A long time it takes for those too long. Victims if you are a victim of identity eft you can get resolution from the irs to get everything sorted quickly. When i say a fully digital irs unlocks ourull potential means to fully digital irs unlocks our potential speedily theyre not solving these problems more quickly. There are still problems to solve and that is why our employees are so critical. We have a table outside. We are hiring and working with our employees on making their journey at the irs as fruitful and rewarding as possible too. Encourage ask a couple more questions on the will take questions from studentss well. You are recruited you mentioned you were recruiting not just folks who are accountants but digital transportation experts, it experts, lawyers. Why should someone want to work at the irs . Why is it an attractive place for students to work . Its one word, impact. We touch every household in america. Every business. The decisions that we make Significant Impact we have a big plate of responsibility to make the attack system work better for the american peopl i mention this in my remarks, over the last several decades the tax laws have been increasingly leveraged to drive critically important policy issues some of the most important and equality things like childhood poverty, health care access, climatechan. All of those things are now implemented substantially through the tax system. Its people at the irs hard at work implementing the Energy Tax Credit under the Inflation Reduction Act. Many scholars and experts around the world feel the tax credits that are implemented may be the most powerful legislative mechanism ever to drive industries to go green and who is responsible for implementing legislation . It is a lot of pressure it is also rewarding. If you are sitting in class or you want to help americans with this fundamental civic responsibility, we have a lot of work for you. If you arer in working to implement tax laws that are driving things like helping low income, increasing health care access, addressing the we have. I think that is a powerful message for those interested in Public Service. There are some student going, that is normal here. My last question is lets assume you are successful and, as you have been pretty much everything you have done, how will the irs look differently and for five years and it does today . I want to stateha one of my philosophies of leadership is to recognize i have not always been successful. I have had failures and setbacks and triumphs. What i always try to do what i take one step back in two steps forward. What i have tried to do in this job is bring to the table experience not only my experien but expere from across industries and government agencies. What are the preconditions for success . One of the preconditions for failure . Lets build a strategy to maximize probability of success and minimizes probability of failure. L failures and draw inspiration. With the irs will look like is essentially what it will look like is a very high functioning website digital platform whatever you need to get done in the basics making a payment, understanding what toyota . What is my current status . I need a transcript and want to know it happened a couple years ago i need a pulpy historic record. All of it is at your fingertips. But then as a robust workforce we are building today still behind the scenes but deployed in two places were helping people but cannot afford to hire an accountant or a lawyer that are struggling to navigate a very complicated tax laws■n ande are there to meet them where they are and provide them world Class Customer service. Not just digitally but in person and walking through is increasingly effective finding where people are shielding large corporations creating our enforcement. That is what the Inflation Reduction Act is intended to buy and as i mentioned we are makin. But we are off to a great start. Lets open it up to a couple of students. How much time do we have are we good . Who is after the first question. We have some microphones identify yourself. Hi i am cameron johnson. Im a sophomore here at au and i am hopefully going to in my school and map masters degree in fonsccounting i very might well be working here at the irs. I had a prepared question but as you are speaking i came up with a better one. You really touched on the point of radical positivity. Just optimism kind of has a tricky way of clouding what is going on. But radical positivity more direct things to stay positive as we are talking about the American Public perception of the irs. Sue asked as young people with the outlook toward the irs and toward government enter generation how do we push forward was proposed here during this talk . Thank you. It is such good question. I start with myth busting. To understand what is at stake. In terms of the types of programs the irs is running. It. Not just about tax collection but also to the extent you are worr stressed an anxiety what you think you may owe. It is creating an where people increasingly see the irs as a source of help and a mechanism to potentially reduce stress because we can get your answer quickly. We we need to make we have to have the right number of people ready to help. We have to make and create rtne■rships. We have a very Important Program volunteer tax clinics around the country. It is so inspiring. These are people who volunteer their time to help low income people do their taxes. It reduces her stress and anxiety begets the acc■ to benefits. There is so much more that we can do to grow and strengthen our volunteer program run the■ country. I think as people see us out in the communities working to help low income, to help veterans which are often targeted by these types of scans andschemes. And start to see this ambition we are commuca are putting resod it and we are putting sweat equity behind it. It starts at home. It starts with our employees motivating them, having them understand what the mission is and what the ambition that we are taking. It also partners. We talk a lot directly to as the critical local groups that get involved through these volunteer tax clinics, the local groups involved withur taxpayer experience. With organizations like the united way. Those are the types of efforts that may not make it to the front page of the newspaper or the headlines. My sense is we went on the local level not the national level. That requires us to change the way we are communicating and■ engaging. We will continue to do so. National speeches and things like that but i also planr as commissioner increasingly out into local communities. I want our Leadership Team and staff to do that. Ground game that is needed to change the way people think, understand, and pursue the irs. Next question . Yes in the back. Ybe just introduce yourself. Nice presentation. I am student hear from uganda. With the authority. Im glad to hear some the thinge ensuring you not think of taxmif enforcing rules because we have a lot like a boat over the weekend book to an International Student like should not be used by us. For International Students and others people talk some told is for citizens is for us national students. It was very fun thank you. Thank you for the question. This is part of this expansion we have to do to make sure we are mee8jjting taxpayers where y are. Some taxpayers are u. S. Citizens and cities. Somewhere in rural locations. Some are international with homes overseas but they a workid earning income. They have a tax responsibility each of those uniqueua can create unique products or menu options that we have to provide. And unfortunately if we comprehensive certain taxpayer groups will fall through the crooks. Will sank onto your menu, theres something on here that question. Mentioned a few times to have this new pilot with thisec file solution you can file electronically with the irs. Right now we are in 12 states. One of the number one questions i get is to my state . The other thing is am i eligible . What i want to make sure were doing is looking across different taxpayer and making sure no taxpayers are slipping through the crooks. That need this type of solution and digital experienc ill take that question back make sure we are understanding there is a community of taxpayers out there that may not be u. S. Citizens for they may be here but have a tenth tax responsibility. What are our tools for that . He has come over here. My name is harrison i am a grad student in school of Public Affairs and political science. My question is to you, the irs branding marketing issue. I know you guys are not the one to come up with the tax code, you just enforce it. ■m yourselvs getting around that . My undergrad was in education. One of my favorite stories i told my students was one of thei got my first paycheck was really excited to get it and then half of it was gone because irs. I realize i have to pay taxes for the very first time. Just going through that. And i understand what this taxes goow now but 12 years removed from that experience as a teenager getting the first paycheck but whenealize that. Its like that money is gone forever and never going to get it back. Quickly still feel like that. Emotionally, yes, i do but logically i understand that monies going somewhere. And congress is never going to come out like we took that we told the irs you have to go get it so how do you deal that branding issue as the guy in charge of the irs . [laughter] boxes show the video of homer because i recognize that we are a chronically unpopular across america. A part of thatkay and heres what i mean by that. One of the analogies i thought about in terms of the irs like l referee. We get a call wrong 80000 people will boo us. You get the call right 80000 people will boo us. If we c replay the big up a call right, 80000 people will boo us and that is okay. That is part of it. But without the referee theres no game, it is chaos. At the end of the super bowl known as planning a parade for too. Referees and that is okay the referees can go home at night knowing they are a critical part of what made this special event hpe on the thing that entertains millions of americans each year and they should be proud. And we should be proud of what we do. The branding is not necessarily about popularity. The branding is more about what. I do think and i think the irs can certainly help, there needs to be a broader messaging and civics classes and across the u. S. About the positive impacts of the government c have. When you woke up this morning the government touched you positively five times before we have etched in the irs headquarters outside a quote from justin for Oliver Wendell holmes taxes are wha for civilized society. I mention safe roads, safe i think about the facts but im getting on an airplane and strapping myself and it looked down the aisle and see my kids strapping themselves in. I think about the fact air Traffic Controllers are busy ma florida, california or wherever we are going. I think about all of the inspections they have gone through. All of the Safety Standards that have made air travel and the in the u. S. And internationally. And for me i think taxes are sye have and the transportation or the fact i got to dinner tonight i dont have to worry about toxins in the food or getting sick. Thats what you get from your taxes. Hat is in education we owe it to ourselves to be more thankful think about more impact fully. I celebrate people like service for america words at the partlic service. They are celebrating these teams from nasa that are taking steps to sav■■ and i also want to make a comment the president of ntu our we have both unionized and non unionized workers. They are all coming to work every day to try to make a difference and make the whole system work better. I think they are part of our branding. I got a phone call from a friend who is helping his mom with an irs issue. His mom was failing it was not as good as she once was. He had to go get something and he held her online with the irs representative. When he got back the rs represent was reminding him of things he promises mom five minutes earlier to dupree pray dont get thisot bikes want to tell you how wonderful this woman was and how much she help my mom and me through the stressful situation. Thats actually thats what i intimidation. N a here but irs that is what i am proud of them we have to get that message out and people like doreen are fighting every day to make sure the the Government Employee is warranted and about what it meant and but the paper was piling up. You cant shut down the irs witt having significant Mission Critical issues, so our employees came back in, masked, social distance, they had to do processes to open up all paper in a much different environment and importantly and this is where i come back to impact when the government and america needed to distribute emergency payments to americans business across the country to keep our economy afloat so that people could keep food on the table and really create an ■eonomic lifeline, it was the irs that did it and why . Because the irs has the infrastructure because we touch every household. We logical choice to do all the organization and logistics that was necessary to make sure that every american payment. Again, we are the rest. No one will throw the parade for us and thats okay but i really do think its important that the stories are told maybe in education environments like like American University but also in High School Civics classes and what impact they have. Thank you for coming to for laying out our vision and most importantly thank you for your service to our country. Thank you, thank youyb all. [applause] deadline of fr midnight eastern to fund the government and start of partial shutdown. The house is back noon eastern along with doesnt allow plans to vote on the remaining spending bills for 2024. The deadline later this week later today the house will consider foreignpolicy bills including legislation to block y data brokers to foreign adversaries. The senate returned today 3 00 p. M. Easte. Lawmakers will vote on the confirmation of Service Employees International Union cil nicole to serve as u. S. Court of appeals judge 5 30 p. M. Eastern. If confirmed, she be the openly ltq judge to serven the court. Watch these on cspa senate on cspan2 and you can watch all congressional cov with our free video app, cspan now for online at cspan. Org. Today Senate Intelligence committee warner discusses Nation Security and cyber securi in washington d. C. Li coverage begins just after noon on cspan2. Cspan now, free mobile and online at cspan. Org. Cspan is your unfiltered view of government by these television compa her communicat. Carter is proud to be recognized as one of the best are just getting started