Transcripts For CSPAN2 Author 20240703

Andrew wiest sitting in the middle is University Distinguished professor of history in school of humanities at the university of southern mississippi where he is alsoe te founding director of the dale center for the study of war and society. He has several major publications, including vietnams forgotten army heroism and the trail, for which he won the society for military histories distinguished book award. So, i know im mispronounce part of that, but take it away. [applause] good afternoon. I have the honor to date of hosting the america war panel here at the mississippi book festival and up like to thank the festivals organizers especially alan Rogers Daniels who is earlier. Shes when disputable dress with butterflies on it. Dont think or if you see her. Of course would like to thank the audience members will fear and in person andus on cspan fr joining us today. Yall are in a treat come in for treatment we get to talk about four books to cover the entire span of u. S. Military history all thehe way from how the crees were set up as a nation all the way up to Operation Iraqi freedom, and beyond in 2003. First i would like like to introduce our panelists. In the order that they appear in your program which will also be ordered in which i though some questions away. Our first today to my far right is emily let can do what is a family physician the Navajo Nation for many years and then taught science and math in rural colorado pixies author oa portrait collection manifold portrait mathematics. I dont understand poetry or mathematics so i would be impressed to be that at some point. And her poems have appeared in journals and anthologies. Today she shouldve it discussed aa book titled 1000 paces left behind can one soldiers account of jungle warfare in world war ii burma. Next is dr. Heather marie stur come , a colleague of my Energy Department of university of southern mississippi and a senior fellow in southern mississippi. Also study for foreign society. Shes author of many books. I will make into mccue, saigon at work in South Vietnam in a global 60s, and beyond combat, women and gender in the vietnam war era. Today she is here to discuss her new book titled 21 days to baghdad, general buford blunt and the Third Infantry Division in the iraq war. Next up to my far left is Peter Cozzens who is the author or editor of 18 books on American Civil War and indian wars of the American West and hes also a member of the Advisory Council for the lincoln prize pick in 2002 he was awarded American Foreign Service Association hi sans, the william r risk an award given annually to one of the the one Foreign Service officer for their exemplary moral coleridge, integrity. Today peter said to discuss his newest book titled a brutal reckoning and jackson the creek indians at the door for the american south. Our final posted a right to my immediate left is chris wimmer who is the creator compost and lead writer of legends of the old west, long form and derrida podcast that tells true stories of the American West. He has a masters degree in journalism from the Walter Cronkite school of journalism ao Arizona State university and has won numerous local state and National Awards for his writing. Today, chris is here to discuss his first book titled the summer of 1876. Now lets begin our discussion, and i propose to do with the books in order that the authors were just introduced, which means i will throw a couple questionsav to emily first. For those he had not had a a chance to read a book, her book is a sort of detachment 101 of the u. S. Army that operated behind japanese lines in the burma theater of world war ii. I do to and which her served. The japanese had rolled the pictures against both us and a bridge in Southeast Asia ever since pearl harborn leaving us and the military roaster one of our first local counter attacks was to the of special operators who have the daunting task of penetrating behind the japanese lines and then sowing chaos in the nearly trackless jungles of burma. An the story of 1000 paces left behind is one of great success, operating against all odds in fearful terrain alongside and local Indigenous Group called that people. I kneww was going to get that wrong. In my first question for emily today is whitey think your file this unit was so successful against such a long odds . What do they do right . So as you mention this is sort of a memoir that was a long time coming, but dictated into a tape recorder six years after the fact. He was the majority of the time in burma, which is now called myanmar, but for the purposes of the book we say burma because thats what all the literature referred to at the time period the americans were inhe the northern part of burma which is the oss and the other intelligence gathering services, oss stands for officer Strategic Services for anybody who doesnt, might not know. Sort of the military Intelligence Group but they also later in the war had a mandate to cause trouble in addition to just getting information. They were very successful in that and i think the underlying thread through his book that he mentions a lotpo is the most important thing he did there was born the language of the local people, ask for their advice, and he and others in the os as 101 for very respectful of the culture of the people, and he as a 21yearold figured out that the way to survive was to the village or town thatk he went o he would ask elders if they would consider going with him as advisors. So in all of his adventures there, i was at a group of elder advisors who went with him. I think thisis is really key to the extraordinary success they had wheree they had, i think the oss has a whole pub had less than 1000 casualties and the there i think 15,000 japanese casualties in that conflict. Part of it was because most of it was probably because the kachin people and help they gave us and a lot of us dont know about that thats part of the reason we wanted to get the book out. The next question i want to ask is that china burma india theater as it is not is probably the least research especially in the u. S. Theater of world war ii. And i teach class in world war ii and the kachin people are even more underresearched. Id never even heard of, which i hate to admit somebody who gives final exams on world war ii. Who were they . Why are they so understated as well . Well, there are a lot of ethnic groups in myanmar which people probably know. Theres many different people. Even in northern burma. This group is the Largest Group in the area where the americans were, which is a very north of burma to the british were a little to the south. So they were a good group to affiliate with because they didnt want anyone invading, their country, the japanese had already started to his and him already fighting atg that time period when we arrived. They were a natural ally and they did a lot for us. Surreal so real undersf that war. Now, your dad actually had this wonderful chance to go back to burma to reconnect with somee of these people. How long ago after the war, held long out of what was said and what was likelyy dead to go bac . Did he meet anybody he answered with . Which would be so fascinating. F yes. So all of the oss 101 veterans wanted to do something for the kachin for a long time and the most were able to for lots of Different Reasons political reasons and things going on in myanmar. But when all reached retirement age, and most of the family obligations were out of the way, they started and at the time there was a little window in what was happening in burma also. So they started some projects to help the kachins. About three different projects that one was brickandmortar schools, when was a translated the book with her so doctor into kachin which is a david what a book which is been around for a while committed should thosen e but the main project to do so the cult project old soldier which was a farm promoting thing. They got seeds and they got expertise from agricultural people in the United States, and it went over, so this was in about an the mid90s, from the mid, from 96 i think until the last oss 101 veterans was involved died in 2017. They kept this Program Going and they met a lot of people who were in his italian, but most of the ones that had been in positions he knew it already died. There were a lot of people which served with him that he got to visit. It was a really wonderful experience. Now, if you have the chance to read the book you will understand that the genesisof of it dates all the way back to your father telling you stories when you were young. Whats it like to write a book about your father . And what kind of process did geu have to goe through to collect those stories . Because no doubt your memory of some of thosese campfire stories had to be a little perishable, so how did you go back and get them all . So when you became apparent that my dadt was not going to write his book, we, my youngest brother saddened and with a tape recorder and a map of burma that was very detailed andnd we just went through and looked at what he went, and he told all his stories. And then we had that, those 17 tapes transcribed, and with about 800 pages of stories. While he was still alive, we sat down with him and started working on editing it. For a couple of years edited, and then add even after he died we continue to edit in fact, check so yes, some of the stories we didnt include any secondhand stories really. Anything that it does that happen to somebody else ween jut talked to what had happened to him. And then we tried the best we could to fact check but then most of the people by the time had gone, so its hard to do that. There are some books we refer to pick the visible by ray peers who wasll his Commanding Officer behind the burma road and then theres some of the books that there was a historian of oss 101 who wrote thean book and we used those to kind of to touch base, but it was difficult and we just tried to do the best we could. So if you read it you will know that its what it is. Its an oral history told by an old guy who had a lot of great war stories, but some really good insight i think into war on foreign soil and what we can do when we do that. Sadly for each one of the great books i will have about ten minutes with the question before have to move onto the next one. So this is what has to be the last for this one, what if you read the book it is a Great Stories in it. Ri two of myge favorite week or dad getting shot in the butt by a bullet ricochet and a tiger attacking people of all things. Do you have a favorite little story that are stuck with you . I do. My favorite story is the story in the book called guide for general merrill. And its, my dad was, send a message by stilwell that he neededgu to provide a guide acrs this thick track of flat jungle. So realt briefly, he went to hs elders and asked can you give me a guide . They all said no, we cant. Know what has been across there. They said there was one guy who hunted in there, but hes dead. And then one of them said, but he had a son, maybe he could guide you. So they bring his son and his son is maybe 12. And since i went over there, average iq to be about 54foot back hes also very tiny. We used to love through the story when we were kids because this little boy 54. Yes, yes i can do this, and so my dad i takes in two general merrill and mayor look sediment, but he says okay. And so this child leads them through 40 miles of jungle, and its really kind of great and very sort of interesting story because it tells you a little about the people there, how responsible they are at such an early age and how they know so much about the jungle. Its my favorite. Of course the general she refers to is a famous mayor of minerals marauders. Its a big thingyearold to do. Its now time for Heather Sterk to get in the hot seat. Osman to say no but here had a chance to read her book because it isnt out yet, its wonderful thing when you first get a hold your book in your hand and i got to see her holder book for the first time in her head today picked that book is 21 days to baghdad, which focuses on operation of iraqi freedom through the career and eyes of general buford blunt who led the u. S. Forces of the Third Infantry Division into baghdad in 2003. Its ara book that is part biography apart battle history. And how does the character buford blunt hopent that togeth . Ir a Family History. One of his sisters did genealogy of the family, and she was able to trace their ancestry back to a couple of brothers who fought at the battle of hastings in 1066. So they have a long military tradition in their family. They have had and have had ancestors who fought in almost u. S. War since, the american revolution. And so that Family History made him fascinating to me as i got to know him and and learn that he also has deep roots in mississippi they were blood relatives that were in mississippi as early as the beginning of the 19th century and settle in the backfield. His father lived in germany, have the best food life himself after world war ii cold war so i was interested in him and he got to talk to him about invasion directed to became clear how central he was too wet on the ground on the way into baghdad. One, he made thely decision eary on to split two roads, one taking highway and the vehicles going through the western desert. His thought was we have 10000 vehicles from kuwait to baghdad more than 300 kilometers. That would take a long time or we could split off vehicles could handle and meet up outside of baghdad before the invasion. The reason he came up with that idea was he spent several years serving the u. S. Army and saudi arabia, an advisor to the modernization to the national guardg and he talked about beig in his office imagining desert warfare so he realized he do this and get all of our vehicles to baghdad quickly. He sold it and the division did that. Another example of something that was very significant to have the invasion played out was he pushed for speed in terms of getting to baghdad and allows the enemy to figure out what they are doing to make a plan and always pushed even when others might question, we are not sure about going to the area, as you made it to baghdad 21 days, a drive that might be six months we did in three weeks. The third example shows how significant itt was the third idea was not supposed to go into baghdad, they were supposed to get by the city realized the u. S. Forces anti aircraft they were shooting down helicopters getting American Power in the way they expected the general went to his peers and said there also iraqis will have chance to get an way of us being so flexible will division and was the first into became clear as i was getting to know him and talking to him that as division and he was significant invasion of iraq entered into. The conflict of baghdad quickly and effectively and was able to pull off but although the war did not end there, it evolved into long frustrating urgency. Y. Did he think of that transformation and what did you think it meant for this, was it a success or failure . Perhaps you could weigh in little more. When it arrived in baghdad, they completed their mission. It was to baghdad secures the city and that is the mission, that was the mission the division or trainer more and the division executed but once the division was in baghdad it became clear there wasnt a plas for what happened next and part of the reason was how quickly the division arrived in baghdad and the pentagon was still trying to figure out the next phase because they didnt expect baghdad to follow as it did so the wasnt a plan in place what happened or a sense of who would take over in baghdad was the third entry for the other elements there and other elements there, who would come in and take over so as conversations are being b had or what will happen b next, general decided the third idea is here and we know iraqi citizens have so we will try to figure out how we can meet the needs so we are here so you go ond his own and see if there were people he could talk to find outee what people need some people needed electricity turned back on. They have a policy where electrified the present baghdad where he knew he hadt Political Support and did not wear he had political opposition are believed needed so general blood what i did but areas where electricity needed to be turned back on and send engineers to make that happen sometimes it involved finding a person who had the key to the apartment in the neighborhood to do the work that needed to be done and he was on the ground doing that, another thing he was around to do with sequel is needed in hospitals, if theres anything the division could provide to hospitals for future people have cooking stoves and thats the way they operated so his mindset was people of baghdad we want them to believe was good for them so are still here, lets try to make the basic needs met. One of the issues, the soldiers and families back home understood the divisions mission to secure once thats done, someone could take care of the postwar activity. They achieved that but they were coming home so soldiers began to decline, families back home in the headquarters began to get restless, there were newspapers and they wrote letters, why arent our family members coming home . They should be home by now and because of those conversations, concerns about soldiers morale, the division began to be withdrawn back to the u. S. General plan sent my soldiers home, keep me with the team, the second brigade went and general plan about what happened was an example of success that could continue in iraq that could be a u. S. Presence there. Anti american sentiment but the commander of the second brigade and o staff met with the mayor d other leaders like general had done in baghdad figured out what they could do to help in falluja and from generals perspective, thee underlying anti americanim so he holdsuj up falluja in the summer of 2003 as an example of what could have been with that local engagement continuing. Another issue was the administration of george w. Bush did more to have a large heavy division by the Armored Division meaning in iraq. They had done the job they were given so they needed to come home and it would be diplomats and others to handle what would happen in iraq and those things so the Third Infantry Division was the beginning of the fall of 2003 and i talked to commanders under him one conversational hub the Public Affairs officer Mike Birmingham said as he was leaving, as no sense amongg anyone that anything good is going to come once they are gone, they are already over undresses happening and there is a long drawn out war that continued into 2011 so they think youd be honest in a he is proud of what the division accomplished and the way they achieved the mission but its disappointing to see what came after and i think you might say it was unnecessary. Sadly our ten minutes are up. I will move over to my left in his book, a brutal reckoning, a fascinating setting and a monumental one so hard to encapsulate this in a couple questions but greek words that and alongside the u. S. Through the eyes of the u. S. Malicious that is the most in u. S. History opening still in mississippi. I am guilty myself because this is the final trilogy on the western expansion of the United States and associated it with the americanth west the epic sty American West. Then i realized conflict made it possible and they fought east of the Mississippi River in northwest and it was three areas but neither the war was fought in the midwest or your comes the American West militia and in alabama something about the american who was in the midwest and became legendary american communist and european where things happened east of the mississippi were overtaken by the civil war and never received what they deserved or recognition of how central and caused the United States. In such a context very, a fascinating book. Interjection doesnt show up for the first third of the book, hes more of a character for the last part of the book so much of the beginning of the book investigating culture going back to the first, how did you get there . What kind of sources and how were they able to capture their story . Stratus computer. Difficult to obtain primary accounts or those who interacted wit them. Have the time in 1812 it was divided up between the cherokees and the occupied most of mississippi and an idea of how significant they work control all georgia. They also made it possible in florida. There were about 26000 and over the course of time there was a lot of intermarriage and later americans. The majority of leaders in the greek war claims like weatherford, francis, mixed however you want to put in some work literate and wrote letters and recollections how to rely on europeans who lived later on delved into spanish sources then others told their stories and a lot of that had to and i was able to draw that also. More research is modern and when i read about the battles between red states on one side and various militia on the other, what i was done by was they go down the wrong road and everybody runs our chef and the go the wrong way, for these functions of the weaknesses of society or commanders are a bit both . And the civil war between one faction of the greek and the upper portion of the creek and they essentially wanted to revitalize traditional culture and oppose american president on the country. Fully integrated into American Economy so it started civil war became iraqi awe workn the United States thing that made it difficult was the nature of society, charity and they were confederacy, a grouping of independent villagers throughout the came together for this purpose and its difficult for the workweek to act in a unified fashion plan and one can strategy the principal on that side and for them they initiated the work and troops to the gold coast it would have one. The administration was so busy fighting the british that is important as it was it maintained control over self and left the state of tennessee in the mississippi territory and they were separated by question georgia nate among themselves and they had a bad system so it was a mess. Time for one more questions that might artist one. Military commanders. We have controversial ones. As jackson said in there . Im not sure, i really tried to get into him is a good not onlyly him but the relationship with his wife and fellow officers jackson was a real mature figure. One was he was not going in a person courage and he started when he was a kid, a young teen andon moved by an officer person courage and a real sense of perseverance americans, militia commanders and volunteer commanders and governors lacked and by the time Andrew Jackson achieved victory for the United States, everyone else had pretty much given up. Volunteers had gone home and said we are not going to be invading the south and even the governor said why dont you come home . Almost all of his troops remained with him and the rest went home but he sat there and said came for a purpose, not because h he hated the remember that when he was a kid and his mother died american prisoners in the work, its not the work of the british would come in with their agreement take over self. The u. S. Government had a regiment of troops volunteers and huge cherokee indian if you read the book, who will be surprised they won the battle and it was gone g for the greek. Courage and perseverance, he realized that soldiers were cool, they dont buy itll. He did not understand and he wasnt the best because it tends to be, he had a hard time adapting to changes. The panel is rounded outth today, the summer of 1876 and i was scanning the audience and i think there are a couple of people out there who are my age and i grew up on the famous stories of cowboys and robbers and lawmen of the old west. Little did i know until i read this book nearly all the stories happened in the transformative summer of 1876. The james gang got shot at the northfieldtl, little big horn, everything seemed to come together this summer and they are covered in this book summer of 1876 so what got you interested in this civic year . How did you figure out this happened and make you want to write a book about it . I figured out and researched, probably five main drain lines in the book so i researched each onely individually and produce d realize i had never seen a book that puts all of them together. They were having the same time and mid june to mid september so many of these huge events that featured these people in theri American West, this happened in this 900 days it would be an interesting book, i would love to write a book that focuses more on the overlap of the stories and not so much a deep dive into any one of those because you can read wonderful biographies and endless books about crazy horse and the campaign on the northern plains. The earth is leaving which you mentioned earlier you can read all of the books individual. You mentioned a popular long podcast, ive never done a podcast, you are a broadcaster and into writing how is the transition . Was the difference between written words spoken word . Oh my gosh, the difference. Luckily you dont have to think about music when youre right. When i wrote the podcast, they are essentially relatively short audiobooks with music and sometimes sound effects. Hybrids between the old style radio trials and moderate audiobooks so i promptly have to think about how to write the podcast script to the music orvi envision a play under the section level is involved so a little reading something to write the book and not worry about how i i will have to readt and take my own voice while doing that choose the music and figure out how to get it edited the drug editor. [laughter] one of the things that would have been daunting to me as a writer of the book you read it, i hope you get a chance to read it you got plate spinning off the time in each chapter, there is on masterson and you will jump to the background of little big horn and sunday we are in the east, how do you keep it all together . His own starting to me. It is, it was daunting. Ri i started to write the book and i thought what am i doing . This is absurd, five storylines and each have a list of characters in each one of them trying to sprinkle in some storylines beneath those. I thought this is a great concept and a huge difference between concept and practicality and doing it in theory or the hundred and in practice, internet there were some early birdsug became a balancing act f time management and how much timeou spent researching each oe becomes vitally important to put in the book, which things are absolutely most important letter seems to be two or three bar owners that seemed to own a bar a return to got in a fight, that surprising there were the clerks about which everything done . Some the individual and thompson when you divide that question they were being forced to, is in the right place Little Village in texas called sweetwater where he owned the saloon and hes helped save his life after he was severely so the short time slots provided the lines popping up. Once to do this there are so many characters in stories. The one with the most visible, is there one that fascinated you the most the six major stories and characters . I will probably only partial, people who dont know the story i will is in her biography but he died from his 39 typically when you see a portrayal in the movie is played by an actor whose significantly older than 39 settles how much of the choice goes into that, just find a good name actor to play a role in hopefully you get people to watch the movie but he did seem he lived a life of ten. By the time he was 39, your move cant believe a singlesi person was all of those places and did all of thosewh things and thats why i keep getting drawn to him. The trucking about the element of the west and sinema fixating on the American West in the bank robbers will most people might not know it is the greatest in the first recorded gunfight in the American West so if you remember those movies when they walk out into the streets square off and the faster guy lives in the slower guide, that almost never happens in there west happens was in a gunfight in missouri is of purely the winner of the gunfight. One last question, custer, was he a good command or not. I think strict military sense to qualify this, im not a military expert but in military sense he seemed you could devise a strategy but i dont know if ill call him a good commander. The research ivee done and petr has done more research than i have but he seems to be all the stereotypes he seemed to be true, a lot of arrogance and he would do what he would want to do regardless of what military circumstance he was in and a cory seeger on that helped lead to his and informed his decisionmaking when he got roughly 600 soldiers toward the village of about 8000, 1000 or 2000 of which were warriors so when he realized what he was potentially up against and had a chance to do it different, he chose not to just go for it could make it work like he had in the past. Is the time for audience questions are not . Having heard this great conversation and wonderful books and important commanders, do we have any questions from the audience for any of our panelists . S . Your book about Andrew Jackson but for all of them, what role does the terrain these people in history are planning on, how does it impact their campaign . Thats an excellent question, americas wars against indians, they had an advantage in knowing o the terrain and how to make te best use of it in 1791 and st. Clair stumbled against all the way to fighting the apaches and the west. The indians had terrain in many cases compensated for the numbers they had. It was relevant in the creek war, to because it was incognito and they were going along blindly. It was a huge part of the battle. If you have a couple never been there, series and you can set up where the bottles happens you can trace the movement of the soldier by the tombstone where n they died they moved through e hills and they did a pretty good job marching roughly where they found the bodies and the monumentnt is a key position whe you can walk around the perimeter where hundreds of soldiers were tracked and you could down where the warriors would swarm up and you look at the hills and imagine what it would be like to have bodies piling up and how terrible it would be. Standing up and if you look off the horizon not too far one of the sites, that is a big one line of mountains and there was beautiful mountains and i found years later there were so many of us that we didnt even need weapons, we could have just tripled of all the best, thats how onesided it was. Definitely something that affected it both in terms of the desert and the terrain of was a major storm that hit in late march and ground of the division to a halt and visibility was a few feet and they stopped there two weeks until the storm and. Urban terrain was a major concern especially thinking about sending Armored Division to the city. One of the issues that came up in this idea that we dont want baghdad in which u. S. Troops get trapped in a city and in turn, and they are killed to a lot of concern things are impenetrable but they are a reliability turning corners. In general is a difference an important consideration that people know it was there because everything is sort of hidden and this was great advantage on these tactics being used at the timeme and they wouldnt even kw it so thats why intelligence was i important but it is different talking about this, it was his friend, particularly in the use it tod their advantage. While we are waiting for the next question, theres really no way to understand the battle without going to the battlefield. We loved investigating. My question is related to that. All of you are writing stories about things you are not seeing, youre putting it out and youre describing some thing that happened in the past and how much of this is real history . All the stories in the book, not me, else why this was the middle of it and you can read with that in mind. I have not been to iraq but the research of the Third Infantry Division part of the Tank Division spent time with cruz and talk to levels of command about running the brigade, Armored Division i mean and i got inside a tank and got to observe battle stimulation and those sorts of things so that helped me understand what the soldiers were doing as part of his Technical Skills to do the job. I had the opportunity to feel, but what helped. Just being able to what it feels like and smells like it helped in the way that i didnt have the benefit and what iraq feels like an sounds like. What i did find the division of their headquarters took me understand the job and the training. I see myself it from a Creative Process was important writing instrument and what occurred decipher the and carries the reader along and that said there are certain licenses didnt know will work ranged and they would build on thekn getting ready to say perhs or just saying i stabbed myself, i dont go there. I tried to remain within the confines of primary sources the best i can in look at try to decipher the ones that appear most credible and that, lawyers theer evidence put together the most likely came again never going primary space and just post on the back as we know them, it is especially in their one side or another, you do your best to the event in and it becomes a persons individual style and how much they want to project emotion and thoughts and things likent that and i can ben individual twice and i try not to do any of that. I learned during the podcast writing listen to my podcast or a fun, fast story, they dont want to bog down, thats how i write the book. As rely on the amount of action and things and is in a book with a different storyline, theres never a dull moment so iab a dot have to worry about flowery language and descriptive whatever, my own events of the whole thing. You hit on a simple question we are supposed to be neutral arbiters of the past and you bias yourself so it becomes a balancing act like im interested in the cultural context of the fact that it happens in the wild west were they are post civil war, a collective cultural area that was maybe finding different expressions of the same would be true in baghdad and all places. The questions with the short amount of time for response, i wonder what action there is from the broader cultural however you might characterize it. A lot of directions probably the easy one is the storyline in my book and anybody is then in the native americans and that culture really trying to remove hethose people from the tribes where they live and force them on the reservation and removed her culture from the and assimilate into european civilization that has expanded was a huge part of it and a campaign of 1876 designed for lathe last roman people of the northernns plains and it contins to have so they can open the door in the west so that is a difficult aspect and come to terms with the fact that most times when you deal with native americans, anytime you did something, there was never a good reason for it, never a broader reason, almost always constructive and difficult to have to live with that and know it is part of the story. I have no idea if the answer to your question but closeno enoug. I would just add as far as one ofpr the primary cultural attitudes i think the is this idea the United States can build after the war despite such evidence to the contrary a lot of examples to do that, the vietnam war we write about it and teach about it and struck by the push about discussion of what about vietnam . There continues to be notion for americans but the u. S. Can build a political nation, stable political fighting a war and we dontny have this is of success with that remains part of cultural policymaking. The policymakers, iraq and afghanistan looking at germany not realizing how fundamental it was in japan and germany in this society and japanese and they were allowed to remain. Iraq was far from it will especially indian wars in the west, the republican factor is that there was never, despite he wanted indian land would get and broken, among the west, it was never the sense of this is not a single time in the. Last those unified in terms of resisting and doing actions of every five United States and the west. An so the west, it was much more confident. The two and they consider them in white tissue became of them closee. Thank you guys for being a wonderful audience. This year marks five years of signing is not like nonfiction authors and their books. 18000. Book to be provided you with the hours on the latest literary discussion on history. Politics biographies. Tv every sunday on cspan2 or online at booktv. Org. Tv, 25 years of 25 years of serious readers. Nonfiction book this season has a number of podcasts for you. Best years on the populace caucus and q and a wideranging conversation with nonfiction authors and others making things. Weekly hourlong conversation and fascinating, wide variety of topics. In the industry is no over every you get podcasts and on, cspan. One , new series, you what american. Tears that William Faulkner kill a mockingbird. 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