Transcripts For CSPAN2 Alicia Garza The Purpose Of Power 20240712

Television company as a Public Service and brought to you today by your television provider. Thank you for joining us all tonight, for ideas and actions, lisa and jackson im a communication director for the countrys Largest Online Racial Justice organization. And im here to introduce tonights event. We are partnering with oneworld tonight to make a virtual space for critical conversation between editorinchief and one of our most powerful, organizes and visionaries leave the guards that, alecia wrote a book a Facebook Post through created a movement and said black people i love you, i love that our lives matter, black lives matter. That Movement Continues today and tonight they will discuss the importance of resistance and resilience and how they ground the work in the vision for collective humanity. The color of change and we believe the everyday people are powerful enough to in that are Holding Black people back and harming our country. We champion solution that move us all forward. In the last two weeks we have helped 6. 5 Million People take action for Racial Justice in our country and were thrilled to be partnering today with one through this important conversation, without further ado here is chris jackson, oneworld editorinchief to kickoff. Thank you so much for being here with us tonight, i cannot imagine somebody else id rather be talking to tonight then alecia garza, one of our countrys most powerful influential actress and i think and speak critically well to this moment, before we start to want to think color change for working with us again on this project tonight and all the people who have been so active in getting this all organized. Lets maybe take a short moment of silence for the many tens of thousands of people who we have lost in this pandemic that we are undergoing, people have been disproportionately black, brown, native, disabled, elderly and poor and also all those that we lost two racially motivated violence vertically racially motivated violence in the name of the state and ill call out three names tonight, amid aubrey, Breonna Taylor and george floyd. I hope you join me for a short moment of silence to begin. Now i would like to invite our virtual stage alicia garza. It is so good to see you. Its so good to see you and great to be seen. I want to start the conversation out by going back a little bit, i think a moment like this is being very upsetting and jarring to us but also for a lot of people its awakening and i think about my own life growing up in new york and harlem in the 70s and 80s how they probably develop most rapidly around the most dramatic moments of the of comingofage and were doing with proximities of death and so many people who were murdered during that period in my neighborhood but also so many people who they lost the Police Violence and the first time i was out on the street and protest those deaths, can you tell us a little bit about center been working on this book together for some time now and i know so much about your own story but one of the interesting things that youve always been somebody whos driven toward activism from childhood but there was inflection points like the murder of oscar grant and oakland that really drove in accelerated. Definitely. For me i actually came up in the Reproductive Justice Movement and got really politicized around the idea that young people could not make good decisions about what to do with our bodies. This was a time when bush number one and others were really pushing the narrative in the country around not only the focus on the family narrative but it was very much about controlling womens bodies and for me, my mother had me and she did not expect to have me alone and the thing that gave her options is that she had them. So she used to talk to me coming up as a young kid and she would tell me makes babies and babies are expensive, i did not get any of the birds and bees talk and i did not get any of that. It was really when i was in college to be frank that i got politicized around Racial Justice. At that time in the late 1990s, early 2000, there was a lot happening in terms of the aftermath of uprising that had shaped our entire country. We all watched as rodney king was brutally beaten on video cameras which were not actually popular at that time and then of course if you fastforward to oscar grant and my community which is a few blocks from my home and i remember coming home after a new year celebration and turning on the television after midnight and seen three blocks from my house, oscar grant had been shot in front of a train full of observers and it just so happened that a young person who is interning at the organization that i worked at was one of the people who caught the entire thing on camera and actually became a part of the movie station and so there are these inflection points where we start to understand that our lives are bigger than us but we also understand that our lives are being shaped by people other than us. We have an opportunity to decide if we think that is right and if that is fair and if we think the ways that our life are being shaped lead us toward wellness and dignity, humanity and wholeness and whether the way that our lives are being shaped and leading us towards punishment and criminalization and injustice. If each one of those inflection points we get to make a choice about who were going to be. For me at a very young age at 12 years old i decided im going to be somebody who not only tells different stories about when people are doing, no teenagers are not running around having like crazy but there are those of us who are in intimate relationships who are trying to figure out what is best for us and were being denied the information and the resources that we need to make decisions that work for us. We are being denied access that we deserve to desire and pleasure and intimacy by somebody who frankly has a whole different agenda about our bodies and our lives, do we think that is right or do we think that is wrong and if we think that is wrong, what are we going to do about it. For me i got politicized and active in the movement and for others they might shake their head and say its a shame that some people dont have access to what they need and they move on with their lives but then of course we come into moments like this where you cannot move on with your life, your everyday normal is interrupted by people who have decided to take action. Even in those moments you get to make a choice about who youre going to be and what youre going to contribute. That is really interesting, the question comes to me particular in this moment and listening to your story and think about your story that ive been doing for some time is that we seem to go in these moments where there are erections of visible Movement Activity and you talk about what happened with oscar grant and the bay area and black lives matter which formed around a series of events going back to Trayvon Martin and ferguson and so forth. And now here we are again, are we just going in a loop or do you feel like each one of these things we are getting closer to something. That is such a good question. I can say in writing the book, are we going in a loop or are we moving forward . We assess our strategies. And require us to frankly keep pushing forward. I know there is a lot. [inaudible] black lives matter, people are saying all lives matter. Keating on one second period, can you hear me, one second, can you hold on, we are having a little bit of a technical difficulty with your repeat that last thing you said please. Sure totally. I sang in 2013 and 2014, we were pariahs in terms of politics. We would say black lives matter and people would say all lives matter. That was the most common response. We were not seen as a legitimate political force. We were not seen as a movement. We were seen as people who were radical. Even in our own communities, right . We were seen for people example who were trying to move a yea agenda and interrupt a black agenda. There are lots of ways and we are in such a different place than we were then. Host im sorry, im sorry. Guest there is still work to be done. I dont have paint a rosy picture here. Frankly we are still watching the extrajudicial murders of black people on television. Because we capture them on cell phone cameras. And it is only when there is an outcry that there is any semblance of political will to address it. We are going in a circular pattern and how we conceive of how we solve this problem once and for all. I do worry, just like in 2014 where we got body cameras as a result of, you know protest, that ferguson led in relationship to the murder of mike brown, maybe today what we get is better training. Or nicer police. But fundamentally there is still a big challenge we are facing. Which is, what do we do about the role of Law Enforcement in our communities . Is it enough to have better training . Or to restrict their practices . Or do we actually need to narrow the focus of Law Enforcement in the first place . It is an important conversation for america to have right now. For some it is an uncomfortable one. But seven years ago black lives matter to me people uncomfortable. And being uncomfortable is actually good for this country. People were uncomfortable and black people were fighting for the right to be enfranchised. People were uncomfortable when women were being the womens right to be franchise prayed look for we have come. Now it is not uncomfortable to believe that women should have the right to vote. It is not uncomfortable for us to believe that black people should have the right to vote. It doesnt mean that those rights arent still under a tax. Absolutely not. But it means that we are in a different place because we have those rights and we are defending them. As opposed to needing to create those rights. And so, history is not circular and that way. It is a spiral. And i believe, really deeply and profoundly that we are closer than we have been before. And that gives me hope. That is actually an encouraging socks. You have this thing in the book where you talk about, you reference a lot the theory about changing common sense and things like that. Change the basic premise. And you can grow something new. You can say about the Minneapolis Police department or the city council you talk about eliminating and rebuilding in its place. Which is unimaginable that a major city would be talking about that. Is that kind of thing give you a sense of possibility as what might come . Absolutely. I woke up and saw that article pretty was the first thing i read when i open my eyes this morning. And all i keep saying to myself is what a time to be live, right . The fact that Minneapolis City Council is not only considering redistribute in funds so that we dont address needs that communities have with police who arent equipped to address those needs is incredible. It is a conversation that organizers and advocates have been pushing for the better part of 20 years. So i can tell you, what a time to be live. I can also say, i keep seeing things at the School District in minneapolis saying they are ending their contracts with police and what that means for a decade of having police in schools announcing were not going to do that theyre moving some of the same proposals. So we should remember that when we see things like this, it is the result of organizing. It is the result of the pressure on people to have the political will and courage to examine new ways of operating and that is fundamentally what movements can accomplish. And you know, we should not expect that every movement has a strategy on a blueprint that they hand to you and you can plug into. So much of what movements do is respond to changing conditions. Takes the pulse of what communities long for. But also, what communities are scared of, right . And push the envelope to get closer to what it is we deserve. So we are watching this in real time. And it is fundamentally incredible. We must, must, must, give most credit to the bad organizers in that city who have really create the tradition to make this happen. And then have engaged us to work with them to help amplify it. That is just really a blessing. Host that is a lot i feel like is wet, what you have to offer people in your book. In the model of your life. The question, how do you the original title for your book was Something Like how did become a movement. But how can you take something from the point of being a germ of an idea as it wasnt 2014, of course like you said 20 years before that people have been working towards this kind of reform. How do you keep the pressure on . How do you build it from being a kind of moment to being a movement . Guest while there is a science and an art. [laughter] from the time when opal and i created the black lives Matter Network which started from a series of social media platforms and grew into a network with chapters all over the world. We did not have a roadmap. We really relight out instincts, and we relied on relationships. We paid attention to what was going on and moving in the world. And i hope that does not feel or sound amorphous. But thats the secret sauce, who you are in relationship to. What they are working on what you are working on. Also, frankly, what time it is in the country. Right . And your willingness to keep pushing things forward. We tried so many things. We held Conference Calls, National Conference calls for people to talk about issues that were of interest for that momen moment. Our first gathering, frankly, was a Conference Call that we pulled together after the killer of mcbride was convicted of murder. And we know the cases a vigilante murder and Police Murder that often times the aggressors are not held accountable. And in this particular case, he was held accountable and currently sits in jail. That was a victory that was the result of organizing. I have a dream is going to maddy for saying it from going to sit anyway, hansen is not only bad organizers were bad writer. Shes also bad organizer. She works with people in michigan to make sure that mcbrides death would not go unaccounted for. And after that, we held a conversation because frankly, so many of us believe that justice comes from people going to jail. And while that might make us feel better, make us feel like they are feeling what we are feeling, the fact of the matter is, prisons and jails are terrible places to be. Prisons and jails do not have rehabilitate people they do not bring the lives back they do not address harm. So we held a National Conference call as black lives matter about whether or not him being convicted was justice. We had people in all different sides of the spectrum giving their feedback and input. Those were the types of spaces we really try to create. And from that, right, we started to build a reputation of creating spaces or people to connect. Not only online, but then moving into 2014 when mike brown was killed, patrice darnell had a great idea to organize a freedom ride to ferguson. Another way for people to connect directly to what is happening on the ground. Not only was it intended for people to be able to connect and offer support, but there is also a strategic aspect to it frankly, one of the things we heard a lot with that main stream media was telling their own story of what was happening in ferguson. They were telling stories of looters and rioters and unrest all of the images you would see on tv with tanks rubber bullets and tear gas, we organize a black media to go to ferguson and to be able to tell that story from a black perspective. Which made a difference in terms of how the story began to be told from that point forward. And i think that without getting too far into ferguson conversation, because ferguson leaders needed to tell that story. I am winking and nodding at you that might be the next book. [laughter] i will say that we left ferguson and did not think we were going to go back. But the people who came said we want to keep organizing. They actually forced us to form chapters. We were like we are not prepared for this. [laughter] but they said we are. So you have already run your mouth, you created this umbrella. So lets go. And so i just walked that story out today to say there is no recipe here. It is really about instincts, it is about network, it is about timing. And frankly it is about being able to move when you just know it is right. One of the things it so beautiful about the way you talk about movements in the book come not to plug the book again, but in the book you do talk about. [laughter] how, for you it was fundamentally a way to connect to other people. Which i thought was like a beautiful way to write it and begin the story. Its not about like some big abstract political goal necessarily it is about how we connect. We can start to share a vision for the world we want to bring into b. In that connection cant just happen online. Although we are obviously doing a lot online right now. The interesting thing is that it is not online that the movement is happening. Even under the cloud of this pandemic people feel like they need to go in and see each other. And meet with each other. And marched together. Portier thoughts of connection. That includes things like in your life knock on doors, go in peoples homes. Hear them, sit with them, listen to them. How does that make a big difference is the poster not just what we can do online or what we can do through social media, what is a human component wise is important . You know, everybody longs for connection. Thats what makes us human, literally. We cant live in isolation. In fact we put people in isolation you actually see folks deteriorate. When you hear stories of people who are in solitary confinement, they tell you that literally they start to deteriorate because we as human beings depend on connections to surviv survive. It is how we read the world. It is how we read one another. And you know kind of making sense of this moment, organizing is fundamentally rooted in connection. And when i was being trained as an organizer, i was always told organizing wasnt about getting somebody to get involved in your campaign. It wasnt about getting somebody to use your slogan. It was fundamentally about relationships. And everything moves at the speed of relationships. I will give you an example. You know, when i was coming up and organizing, the only way i could get people to do something that was outside of their comfort zone, was to spend many hours on their front porch, at their kids recitals, meeting their friends at their Kitchen Table while they were making dinner after a long day of work. People need to know they can trust you. And frankly, you know we look at all great movements throughout history we notice a similar response. We look at the last period of civil rights, people move at the speed of relationships. That was both for connection but for safety. Right . In certain environments. If people didnt know who your people were, they did not mess with you. [laughter] i can say my southern relatives are still the same way. There but who are your people . Where you come from . It is a way for us to make sense of who you are. Also what your motives are. And i think moving into this moment, i think you saw people rush out of their homes in the midst of a global pandemic. Someone who looks like you being brutally murdered by the officer looks into the camera while he is doing it. It makes you feel so incredibly alone and fearful. And hopeless. And so why people pour into the streets is to be connected to the energy of other people who are sharing a similar experience. Every one of us who have experienced injustice in the world wonder if its only us or for other people of had that experience too. And movements, fundamentally bring together people who long for, not feeling gas lit laugh mark around the experience that they have every day. That they know are wrong. But cant quite place why or who is responsible. And movements also give us an opportunity, a way to challenge and channel the anger, the isolation, the fear and the rage into something productive. Sometimes it becomes, a law or a policy. Other times it becomes an ecosystem of organizations that are fighting back against the injustices and ways in which our communities are disenfranchised. So when you look at organizations like the movement for black lives, you will see, right, its a beautiful rich ecosystem of black organizations that are working together and independently to impact the lives of black people. And in that coalition, we suddenly, again feel less alone, less helpless, and more powerful. When we feel powerful we take risks that we would not necessarily take alone. But the very nucleus of being able to go from why is this happening to me, too im willing to be somebody who changes that, fundamentally requires connections and relationship. Stu and that is so interesting. And it feels so true. Yesterday was watching what was going on from a distance. Very different than being in the middle of it. And feeling that energy. Even the people who would hang out over their stupid and clean their pots, its like you are not alone. I think that is the beginning of that sense of what you said feeling like there is some real power, its not just my feelings. Its a feeling. And you can do something with this feeling, it is powerful. And i guess that brings me to it my next question. How do we do something with that feeling . How do we first back to your initial story, you all had to consider what does justice look like . What does accountability look like right now . For the people who were immediately responsible for these deaths. And in some of these cases, that first level of accountability. But in a larger sense, the larger structures that we need to make accountable. How do we go from this moment to that level, to that reckoning with the people who have the power . Guest im going to give a deeply unsigned intent unsatisfying answer. Stay in the fight. We are in this moment where we have so much anguish, right, that we want the pain to stop now. And the fact of the matter is, these systems that we are fighting are as old as this country. And they will take a wild to undo. There are times when we can speed up the progress of that project. And there are times when the progress of that project really requires a methodical approach to changing what is possible politically. I could sit here right now and tell you, there are policies we can enact right now. That will stop bullies from being able to use choke holds, or make it illegal for police to put their knee on somebodys neck as a way to restrain them. I could tell you there are things we can do to train police to be nicer police. But i would not be being honest with you if i didnt say that many places already have those policies in place. But they have no one to enforce them. And we get again into the cyclical pattern of what i think as sometimes trying to find the shortest distance between a to b. Rather than or in addition to let me say part i dont think they are contradiction. We should do stuff now to stop the bleeding for sure. But if i am trying to stop the bleeding and ive also broken several bones, i can put a cast on. But it does not mean that the bone has it doesnt mean the bone has healed. And it is going to take a while for the bone to heal. And i might need to take a different approach for the bone to heal versus dealing with the cut on my finger. So in this case when it comes to policing, i just have to be honest. The reason that things are so bad in policing, it is because we ask police to do things they should not be doing. We are asking police to be Domestic Violence counselors for it we are asking police to be therapist. We are asking police to deal with people who are in crisis in terms of their Mental Health. And police are not trained to do that. And in fact, sure we can spend a bunch of Time Training people with badges and guns to be able to respond differently to that and maybe we should. But we also have peoples whose actual profession it is to do that work. And the reason we dont have enough of those people in our community is not because we dont have enough trained people. It is actually because we have had government that has whittled away that safety net. We have had government that has whittled away that infrastructure in our communities. And they have replaced it, with control and surveillance. Which actually ends up exacerbating the problem. So if you actually limit what police do in our communities, and how often they come into contact with our people, and for what, that is actually the key to saving more lives. As long as you also invest on the other side in making sure that there is a robust set of resources that people can access. That they will be criminalized for accessing. But also where you dont have the option for a mistake of trying to deal with a Mental Health crisis and you shoot someone. Therapist dont carry guns, right . They have other tools that they use. And so we need to make sure that infrastructure is really robust in our communities. We need to make sure that we could be calling police for things like petty shoplifting. Or we could also be dealing with what is underneath that. Which is some 70 is something they dont need. For perm me when i hear people say we cant just get rid of police, sure, sure, i get where you are struggling. And there are places where i struggle around this too. But i want changes much as you do. And i want us to believe that we deserve better. You know, we did body cameras right . Weve done commissions and task forces and blueribbon panels. And at the end of the day we have the answers, but do we have the courage, right . Do we have the courage as they actually are going to restore the role of government and our communities. We are going to enfranchise communities to be a part of the solution. And we are also going to limit the ways in which we punish people for not having the things that they need because we have created a society were not everyone can have the things they need to live well. Select thats one of the things we can be doing in this moment. And think one of the really interesting things that has been popping up in the news over the last few days as people start to think about, what are the polic police . I think its odd because weve obviously had police forever. I think for the first time people are starting to wonder, what is this institution . And theyre also looking at the budget for police. And they are astonishing. Like a billion dollar budgets in los angeles and new york even a place like minneapolis they have millions and millions of dollars devoted to policing the white population correct . Spamming makes me wonder what we are paying for. Perhaps an Occupying Army in a neighborhood. Were going to do a q a in a minute if you have questions there is a q a button down there. You can ask them. But i want to go back, if you like you were talking a lot about kind of the second person you can do about some of these things. That brings me to the question you are hard to remember everything thats happening in 2020, correct . Its too much. But we have an election coming up in 2020. I was reading what Stacey Abrams wrote in the times this morning where she started saying boating feels inadequate in our darkest moments. And ends it by saying boating will not save us but from harm but silence will surely damn us all. What role do you think electoral politics have in the matrix of what it will take to get to that point of accountability . Speak to you know, i am somebody who believes that electoral politics is harm reduction. And i came up as an organizer really hating politics and hating elections and feeling like, you know, all of this stuff is deeply rigged and not for us. And ive come to think about it differently. Mostly because i have had people, older than me, wiser than me, kind of tweaked my ear. And said hey hey this out. Elections do matter. And, i believe that elections help us choose the terrain that we want to fight on. And they help us choose the people we went to fights. And i never expect that a candidate that i support, and very few cases is a candidate that i support, someone who i want to have over for dinner, right . Or build a deeper relationship with. But i do need them to do things for me and for my community. And i believe that the process of making elected officials accountable to the people that they represent is fundamentally important for the future of democracy. And that is how i spend my time these days, at least as of a few weeks ago, i spend the majority of my time thinking about how to make wet communities powerful and politics through my work with the black futures lab in the black for the future fund. We have spent a lot of time over the last two years, listening deeply to black communities across the nation. We did the Largest Survey of black people in america and 155 years. Literally since slavery was abolished in this country. And we spent our time listening to the experiences that black people are having in our economy, in our democracy, and our country. Really getting ourselves clearer about what are the needs that need to be addressed from the mouth of our own people . And how do we translate that into a fight for power in the electoral arena . Because the fact of the matter is, black people what what everybody wants. We want safety. We went dignity. We want to be treated as fully human. Only want to have our needs met. There are so Many Americans who want the same thing. And for various reasons, cannot access that. That in order for us to be the kind of force that changes the balance of power in this country, we have to be able to see ourselves as connected. And elections and electoral politics is when we can do that. I also know that, you know when it comes to elections in black communities, so often we are used as symbol rather than substance. Whether its politicians showing up on our doorsteps in october when the election is in november whether its the rather than townhouse to discuss policies for the rules that are rigged in our communities. Whether its the Fried Chicken that mysteriously show up every time black folks need to get engaged. There are all of these ways in which, frankly, racism is deeply entrenched in our electoral system as well. So our work with the lab in the action fund is really not just centered around collecting data, but using that data in the service and building power. For example, we have a programmer running called black for the ballot. But we essentially created a black agenda from the results cross gender across ideology that black people cross the nature can agree on in terms of solution. And we are using that to motivate our communities to register to vote and to turn out. And we have a hunch that if we dont focus so much on candidates but instead focus on what we need in forcing candidates to adjust the things we need, that may be, maybe participation will be greater and larger and more robust because we are united around not just talking points like rebuild the middle class or lift every voice or whatever, and yes i said it. But instead we are united around the rules that we want shifted. And how we want to change those rules. And, we have a way to determine who is with us and who is against us. Its the people who we elect dont choose to move our agenda forward, that we find elected officials who will. Or we will become them ourselves. So that is the way i look at politics. And that is how he looked at electoral organizing. Host i think that is important for its one thing that excites you about your work in your book. It talks about politics is universal, as a form of connection between people. Which i think is inarguably something we all want. He said its fundamental to our species. To connect with people. Its also work that can be joyful and creative and imaginative. Thinking about a new world. I think one of the people to get away from politics is they feel like its just the grim work of reinforcing status quo. And again these moments of awakening are potentially fill that gap with imagination were the things important to them to get closer, not just forestalling disaster, thats also part of it. But it is also to start to bring into being the world that you want. Do you think we need to get a Different Group of people running for office and at that level i have been so energized by some of the folks that we have elected, that really engage in politics and very transformative way. Whether it is aoc, or ion of presley, or people like Elizabeth Warren who probably never saw themselves but who work to make inequality go away realize there are people who are defending rigged rules every single day. They throw rocks at the castle as much as we want or we can invade it. People like mike congresswoman, barbara lee has been in politics for i dont when to ager like that. But forever. And got her start actually she was mentored by Shirley Chisholm who Everybody Knows says bring your folding chair to the table. I dont people to take away from this that the only path to power is to become an elected official not all of us is cut out for every role think its important we want to change the way that democracy functions we actually put people in that democracy that can model what that looks like. Can model Accountable Leadership with integrity. To have a radical vision and know how to get things done. And they need many more aocs, many more presleys. Many more squads, many more people are not afraid to say the way that this country is set up is rigged. Do that we have courage and do we have the will. I think that, ive been asked a million times to run, i gently think that is my jam. I think im better in this role. We also encourage think they can be powerful insight of congress in city hall across the nation pretty also think that our people can be powerful in our communities. Those are mutually exclusive. Think thats a beautiful thought to take some questions from our audience of quite a few flowing in. So, one of the things i think is really special is there is kind of discipline of inclusiveness. Target movements, political chains, you talk a lot about the necessity of movements, you also talk about how at the heart of them, needs to be particular concern so black people can Work Together for that purpose. But also places or we can all come together. With Domestic Workers for so long true Multiracial Group that is come together to create real change and black people serve tensions between racial movements, also centering the needs for black liberation. Why do you think those two things can go together . That such a good question. Gives me opportunity if we understand anti blackness, is the fulcrum around which White Supremacy operates, then we have a better understanding of why we need Multiracial Movement. Why those movements seem to be in relationships they also need to be resourced and invested in. Domestic work is rooted in the legacy of slavery. This used to be work it was predominantly done by black women. And black women who were enslaved. So when you look at the conditions of Domestic Work, Domestic Work is sometimes a term people dont understand. So Domestic Work is literally inside the home. Helping to take care of our families. Helping to take care of children, helping to maintain a household, and care for aging loved ones. For helping to support the independence of people with disabilities. These are people capacity, to a family. And that work used to be black womens work. The conditions of the industry today are very much shaped by the conditions that shape the industry under slavery, right . Low pay, low wages, no contract or agreement, no benefits or agreements no sick days off, no time with your family. Very loose rules or any rules at all. I will say that we see those same conditions today, right . And if we werent investing in , undoing the vestiges of dynamics that come out under slavery and were directed towards black people, right, and we dont actually have a shot at changing the conditions that exist in the industry today. I can say that most Domestic Workers, are not covered under many federal Labor Protections , same things with agricultural workers. Theres that racist compromise it excluded Domestic Workers who were largely black and brown from access to the things that most workers have access to now. Those exclusions, the racist six illusions continued today. So if we are dealing with the unique conditions under which our communities are attacked, the unique conditions which our committees are disenfranchised, and we dont give ourselves enough leeway around the potential of what we can build. And having been an organizer Multiracial Movements for a long time, i can tell you i often feel alone and isolated in this movement. Because black folks will there may be smattering of us, there arent really lesions of us in Multiracial Movements. And i always ask myself why is that . When the answers ive come to is sometimes what we do in an attempt to build Multiracial Coalition or alliance as we try to flatten everybodys experiences as the same. They are not the same pay we can walk around to wear blue in the face and say we are all human. But the fact of the matter is some of us are able to access humanity better than others but in a firm movements cant address that, we can expect to bring to them. We have to be honest about that. Also i believe we need racial movements in this country and what im saying across the nation is making my heart lift and sing every single day. Its not just black folks out there. There are a lot of white folks there a lot of folks were latin expert of identify from the asian, it is on and on, right . I want us to strengthen that. And then i remembered to, the part of what it means to strengthen Multiracial Movements is to make sure all of us have the infrastructure that we need to be able to fight back. One of the consequences after the last period of civil rights certainly did. Of black power is that our Community Power infrastructure was intentionally decimated. In part by a government who was really intense on dismantling a very successful black Power Movement that was also Getting Energy and excitement and participation, multiracial he. They will tell you i was a part of the panthers. There were white folks at chai im was down the panthers. We have governmentsponsored programs that were intentionally designed to dismantle that level of unity. And while they didnt they also dismantled the infrastructure that black communities had built to be powerful. So we cant, as black folks actually contribute to a Multiracial Movement if we ourselves are not organized. If we ourselves have not built the kind of infrastructure that we need, not just for ourselves but to contribute to the larger project structural change. So for me, i fundamentally believe there is a science to building Multiracial Movements. Some of it is about understanding how anti blackness functions within those movements. Some of it is about being careful about trying to flatten everyone into sameness rather than examining differences in how those differences are actually strategic for the project we are trying to dismantle. And really, how those movements can create a new bottle gem model for how we see each other. Multiracial movements cannot be colorblind. [laughter] we cannot do that thing or say youre blue, green, purple, white, black, there are no purple people as far as i know. No green people. Also i want you to see all of me. I want you to see me, and see me the way i want to be seen. And the way i want to be seen as as a beautiful, courageous black person who loves the skin i am in. And his son a lot of work to get there. Rather than saying im standing with your comment by standing with you im not seeing with you and help you be seen thats the most fundamental component thats beautiful. Spent thats a great answer to that question by the way. I was in a march yesterday. It was a mix of people. And it was a very exciting. I found myself excited to see it was a mix of people all chanting together, black lives matter. I think what you are describing about, understanding it. So made impressions of what we are dealing within this country are rooted in anti blackness. If you dont deal with anti blackness, it is hard to deal any of these radiating issues. You identify that you have a chance. And to see people, understanding that finally, sort of, is exciting. Okay. Here are some questions. Lets see here. This is an interesting one. What advice may have. You may not have any. Some of these are not necessarily, you know, fine,. [laughter] i think this is an interesting question. Two people who have police in their family, or even police themselves. Is there something you say now, another listener talked about the annealing that some police are doing at events and some people finding that to be almost like a strange reenactment of the thing that we are protesting. And of course happening with the very small number of policeman anyway. But what do you think about, is there a Redemptive Movement that a policeman or policewoman can, you know. [laughter] yes i know. [laughter] chriss you are asking that question, i was actually thinking about, you know, how lots of black people have police in our families. The experience of policing and being in relationship to police, i think is, really fascinating. I see, hear this from white folks a lot. What if i my uncle is a police officer. My dad, generations of my family have been police officers. And like yeah i get it. Im hearkened back to the notion lack folks of actually dealt with this tension for a long time. Law enforcement in our families. And even they know. Their members of Law Enforcement black families know yes there is a problem here. Different people have different ways of making sense of it. But i dont think this is such a contradiction. And i think that when it rises to the level of being a contradiction, is when we defend the profession and the role that it plays because our relationship is so deep to the person in the profession. We need to be very clear. We say defund police, we dont mean your dad doesnt matter, right . To say that policing is a profession, it is a profession. When i hear things like blue lives matter, i do, i might cringe. If that is something you choose to do, right . Being black is the way we are born. They are already starting from very different fundamental places. But let me also say this. And people might be surprised to say this. But again, i have been in this game for a long time. And i will tell you, when you talk to Law Enforcement, and you really have a conversation. And not a conversation thats like do you hate the police, do you love the police, a conversation about what its like to do the job. Lots of people will tell you, i got into this profession because i wanted to help people. I have met very few people who are in Law Enforcement that say i got into the profession because i really want to mess people up. [laughter] people come into it because we have learned that police are protagonists in our communities. And we have Learned Police are way to solve problems. And people come to the profession because they want to be a part of solving problems that they see in their communities. They want to be a part of protecting people. And making people feel safe against threats that they may perceive in their community. But here is something that happens. Most of the time when i talk to people in Law Enforcement they say i got into the profession because i wanted to help. And then i quickly began to get frustrated at my of ability to do so. Actually getting called to a Domestic Violence situation and you know, knowing that as i take away one person im also impacting a family that has no resources to rebuild. And it actually doesnt make me feel like a hero. When i see 70 on the street thats having a Mental Health crisis and knowing there is no shelter to bring them to, there is no program to bring them to, the only place i can take them is jail. But thats probably the worst possible place for them. It really erodes that sense of effectiveness. And kind of entrenches a sense of battle. I am fighting a war. And that is just peoples perception of the role they are playing in a community. Most Law Enforcement officers that i have talked to will tell you, i wish those things were not my role. I wish that, you know we were able to address the needs that the people actually have. And frankly i dont think police should do that. And, people will talk about law and they will talk about order. And it is very complicated. But i wonder, if there is also a place for connection there . Now i am somebody who fundamentally believes that policing is not the way to solve problems. And that doesnt mean i dont like your grandpa, or your uncle, or your mama. And ive got Law Enforcement members and my family too, like many black people do. And even my family members, understand as well what i am saying and what we are doing across this country. They also want to see the profession get better. And i dont know if theres ever going to be in alignment there. Because there is such a deep hurt and pain. I note lots of people who do the work to bring that alignment together. And they are gods people, honestly it is hard to do systems change work. With that being said, you know with the solidarity shows that you talk about, i want something more. I want something more. I think that we deserve more than Police Taking a knee. I really do. And i heard that in some cities yesterday there were Police Taking a knee and then an hour later they were arresting peopl people. [laughter] and shooting people with rubber bullets. This constant dissonance is part of why the trauma continues. And it is not that the people behind the shields are good people or bad people. That is not the point. The point is that their job is to control and to contain. And now we are giving them the responsibility of solving problems that they cannot solve. That is always going to create the kind of situation where there is a powder keg and a match that is waiting to be lit. And so, i am for symbolism. But im also for substance. I would just compare folks taking a knee to, you know, the thing that the police union had said two days ago in minneapolis where they set ive been involved in three murders. And i never lost sleep over any of them, right . I think one really important way to get involved is Law Enforcement. To curtail the scope of the unions. I know in my city, our police union and the leader of the police union in particular, is a constant source of racist diatribe and dialogue in response to deep grief hurt, loss, pain. As long as we have that dynamic, it will only land symbolic when police take a knee. I got asked literally last weekend. Because theres all this hoopla about who is joining a protest and the chaos of the protest prayed and said man being asked are we be telling protesters to work with police to identify bad protesters . I might hate, hate, hate, have lost focus here. No. No. What we need to be talking about is how do we keep from getting to a place where people have to take the streets in a Global Public health pandemic, just to assert that our lives matter. That is the most important thing for us to address in this moment. All of the other symbols and shows are just going to remain those unless we get to the deep core of what is putting america in so much anguish right now. Thats a good answer. I think its a rare one. These are all people who are part of the community. But, yes im sorry. Thats not a problem i hear now. Okay. Good. Part one last question. I think this is not something were going to talk a lot about tonight, but he thanks a very relevant thing prayed we are in the middle of a Global Health pandemic. And also, this period of isolation which is going to cause lots of depression and economic dislocation near depression conditions in job loss. And now this. How are you, for instance taking care of yourself within this . Ill tell you my selfcare this week is not been great. That is how this goes. In terms of the pandemic, from the beginning of march although be up until a week ago i was riding my bike for times a week, 45 minutes a day religiously. And that was my way of moving through the stress and anxiety of what it means to be told not only do you need to stay home, but you need to limit or not be in contact with people outside of your home. Which takes a toll on you. Because again remember, connection is at the heart of everything. And then a week ago, you know, all kinds of stuff broke loose. And frankly my days over the last week have been 13 hours straight on the telephone, in meetings, trying to get people to do things. Or trying to get people to stop doing things. In giving advice to people about what they can do right now even though, there is so much stuff out there. [laughter] and, trying to make sure im Drinking Water and that ie more than one thing a day. So on monday i was doing awful. I was crispy as i say, meaning i was like dont mess with me today. And then i watch the president tear gas people to take a photo with a bible, upside down in a church he has never attended. And the symbolism in the substance of the symbol literally broke me. As if its not enough to be dealing with a Public Health crisis. And the ongoing slaughter of black people, this country is now sliding into fascism in a way that terrifies me. And i dont use that word or phrase lightly. But then i started to see people who continue to resist. And for that resistance to growth. And that makes me feel like we really are the majority. We really are the majority. Our valley retention values are majoritarian values. And we can win. We can win. And that is where i am at now. That is what is actually taking care of me. Is seeing the progress, allowing myself to see what is changing. What victories are happening prayed and also letting people take care of me and so my partner make sure i stick food in my mouth in between sentences on Conference Calls. And that my water glass is always filled. And that i get to rant and rave for a good hour after i shut everything down. [laughter] then i just get to be quiet in his glorious parade that is how i am caring for myself right now. Thats a wonderful way to end. Take care of yourself by watching this maybe win a little bit. Thank you everyone for coming. I thank you so much i couldve talked to for another two hours. Barely got to my questions. Its okay purdue will do this again sometime. But thank you so much. And get some water. Thanks. Alright, take care everyone. provider. Weeknights is meant for future book tv programs as a preview of whats available every weekend on cspan2 wednesday beginning at 8 00 oclock eastern several programs with the late author and columnist William S Buckley junior. Hillary clintons book it takes a village is featured thursday in a lineup of books written by former first lady and finishing out the week friday, books authored by american president s including jimmy carter. My name is Gavin Kleespies and im the director and the partnership for the massachusetts six oracle society. Our program this evening is very seasonal and its a look at the tradition of summer reviews, we are joined by professor donna harringtonlueker, the 19th century publishing and a rise of summer reading. Ms. Harringtonlueker is a professor the department of english communication at the university in Newport Rhode island and shes undergraduate degree from Merrimack College in her masters and phd from the university of illinois. As a former magazine writer and other Research Interest include 19th century culture, womens magazines of any. In the radical alterna