Hi my name is Maria Teresa Kumar im so happy to be here with Zerlina Maxwell and im honored to discuss your book the end of white politics. This book challenges what we expect is a status quo for the Democratic Party and as we are trying to read into the tea leaves of 2020 it couldnt have come at a better time. This is a critique that is challenged in america right now but we also understand that it is imperative that people take your book too hard and look at it as an opportunity to change the game come this election. With that i would love to recognize the wonderful work you have done as a doctor and an activist and as a political operative yourself. You believe its going to come of the book video friedan provided the political politics. Welcome. Guest thank you so much. Im so happy to see you and i know all of this are and to see they are safe and healthy because this is a scary times im so happy to be here. Host i want to get started and i will begin with the work you are doing this so relevant. The worst part of the Hillary Clinton campaign you have your own progressive show and i think we both got to know each other because we both provide analysis on msnbc. In a campaign in the Mainstream Media sometimes we forget the narrative that are propelling this incredible action right now that we are seeing and hope will translate. Talk a little bit about what that means. I know in your book you touch on politics is embracing the idea of other than those that are white male and hetero normative. Based on these experiences of identity you share that the fundamental misunderstanding of what identity politics really are. I think after 2016 in particular identity politics got a bad rap. The term was originally coined by feminist in 1977 to lay out and articulate how people who have marginalized identities can build coalitions to attain political power appeared one of the things after 2015 we did it say Hillary Clinton played identity politics by talking about Racial Justice and White Privilege openly and directly and talking about groups of differing abilities and identities and had the ref about the friday of identities and how it intersects. What we didnt realize is that she was talking about identity politics but so is donald trump. Donald trump was talking about white identity and to often in politics white voters and white politics in every single last act of our political conversations in the message. My book basically shows the fact that we cant criticize identity politics just because finally black people a and latinx people are asserting their rights and political power and representation. Just because we are doing it doesnt make it a bad thing. Donald trump utilized it to his benefit and we are going to be the majority here. Host thats why wanted to say oftentimes only talk about identity politics is oftentimes divorced from economic inequities. Thats really a gender line so if i apply for a job and whether i get it is based on who i love if i do not get a promotion because of the color of my skin or have an accident or that actually is an economic injustice so talk about when trump talks about it he does it in a coded way where peabody feels like they have less economic opportunity. Guest i feel like it was a real economic anxiety in the country and we are seeing that unfold the cause people have lost their their jobs and their Health Insurance and any sense of security that maybe they only had a piece of but now they definitely know that was an illusion. One of the things in this moment and what donald trump did was it plays into the anxiety, the real anxiety because we were just coming out of the greatest depression before covid and that was impacting workingclass people and the majority of minimumwage minimum wage workers are people of color. Its impacting particular communities and their ability to actually take care of themselves and their families. Donald trump right into her real grievance i think and a feeling of insecurity that essentially. White voters against everyone else saying those people over there, those latinx people, those black people, those people are the reason why you feel less secure in your household and why you feel like you have less economic security. He. Different types of people in his 2610 campaign. What we miss is the reason why it works is because america does have to deal in every way and i think part of that is why theres a racial awakening in this moment in history that one race and racism and White Supremacy. Host and i would say its rooted in our situations. There are political operatives on both sides of the aisle. Being the only one of color oftentimes the only young person trying to change the democratic machine that oftentimes only brings in the midwest and its oftentimes there are periods. Ca could sometimes very frustrating but i do think hillarys campaign youll see in the book wasnt very diverse in terms of comparing it to other president ial campaigns. She had more black women than any campaign in history and shared many people from different communities. The problem with an organization of that size youre running a campaign against donald trump who is explicitly racist. Its important to have people from most backgrounds who understand racism and White Supremacy and White Privilege in particular and how it manifests in our world, how it impacts peoples lives how its infused in our policies and our messaging intermediate and how all of that works together. For me on the inside sometimes am i the only one thats doing this, sometimes. Host one of the challenges and this is why its so difficult because 40 of america are people of color and talking about 135 million strong. My children who are seven and eight represent the first majority Minority Community in this country but if you look at the fact that 40 of us are the ones that are people of color but when it comes to electing a democratic young white women disproportionally that ring in that president ial power. Those numbers, that parity is not reflected in those campaigns. Guest that is one of the points i write about in the book and i think it really focuses on highlights we dont need to win the majority of the white vote to win a president ial election. Depends upon the particular district in the state but for the most part you are bright on the democratic side in order to elect a democrat you need it coalition of diversity black, brown young people singles single women because for the most part married white women vote for republicans. We have to look at the data. Look at the history of who is voting for who and then we say well who is normally on our side . Host white males have not voted the majority. White males have not voted for a democratic president since lbj. So thats, when we keep talking about how do we bring these voters back what im hearing these days why focus on the decrease while you have the whole open market of unregistered disproportionately young people of color that would welcome and thats what they are protesting. Does we are seeing in a covid aired we have seen so you many young people going to a lot of these movements and protesting led by young women of color. Its like its so inspiring. Part of what i think the Democratic Party has an opportunity in this moment pretty good and as people directly. Ultimately i think they are shared goals. They might not agree on the medicare for all policies that help insurance for more people is something that everybody agrees on an equality and justice under the law are something that they can agree upon. I think whats missing is those people being represented within the campaign and one of the things that have on the book is no campaign when i wrote the book there were a few examples of Campaign Organizations like color pack and organizations and training people to run process. If you are at home and have graduated and you dont have an internship or youre a High School Student waiting to go back to school given boldin the campaign virtually because its that handson experience that allow people to impact the world around them. Sometimes people think that protesting in activism is a way to be engaged but im also working on a campaign we wouldnt be the only one if we had everyone going to campaigns and try to work there. Host what has your advice for diversification in the campaign because it gets to a certain point oftentimes its not the person that is wellversed. How did they break through and one of my critiques historically many campaigns as they bring in these bright young people of color to knock on doors into one work but then they dont put them in leadership roles that they see them in the roles that are not necessary the most passionate engaged. Guest thats a good point. Traditionally democratic campaigns put people in the field knocking on doors as he said and even the optics of that is all wrong. It was essentially to assert the fact that we need to be at the seat of power at the table. Part of it is hiring black and brown staff and putting them in all different aspects of the campaign. Even though i have certain critiques the presence of a black woman in the tech and digital departments at black women treated him with her and a black woman created the web site but understanding we need those people reflected in all aspects because then you have that diverse set of eyes and those blind spots that always come out when a campaign they put out messaging that it misses the mark or is tone deaf. Youll have people in their to make sure you dont have so many missteps as well. Host what would be your recommendation to the Joe Biden Campaign . What would you say is your recommendation . He dues need to do a hiring of young women of color that are either on summer break at home from high school. Maybe they are in a sorority. There needs to be a very concerted effort to engage young diverse voters so they feel like they are seen. We talk about identity politics being, or i see it as i dont see color and she puts it differently and she says icu and they see the full sum this of your experiences and who you are. I see you are a woman and i see that you are black and that matters. Thats an important thing so i think what joe biden needs to do is he makes he needs to make his constituencies that turnout in november he make needs to make them feel seen and heard. They need to be speaking on a regular basis. I hope they are present out some of them are but some of this i dont see it enough from the outside. We would be like we are doing it and theyd be like i didnt see it. This guy think the most traditional campaigns are using advertising and they dont recognize that oftentimes the end people and the voters that you want are not watching tv. Guest exactly. Host when people say what are you using to organize all you need to show us what happens during a trump rally work kpop mobilize worldwide to bring a ticket to the rally. His Campaign Manager was touting that 1 Million People were coming because the demand of less than 6000 showed up and they got trolled by the jens ears. I pointed that because one of the things you talk about very much is and what that means and when you see biden may not be connecting we know hes not connecting. 40 of young latinos are expected to participate. That is a code red for me because unlike in africanamerican and White Communities its the young latinos that force their parents to go and vote to talk about this and the power of her voice and how do we communicate to them . Guest i have a chapter about the younger millennial activism the black lives matter the parkland march for our lives and also daca. Kids who have been using social media to organize. They are natives. Posted they are native speakers. Guest they understand how to use it as a tool. They know its not the beall endall and there were a lot of critiques of activism which is why wanted to write this chapter. I love twitter is a space to organize with publications and create a place to have a dialogue. You could have sort of a backandforth about what may be uncomfortable to talk about in person. We seen this with black lives matter. Whats important about the is understanding the kids get they understand that identity matters and you respect peoples identity and they understand that people are different backgrounds be treated the same. And a fundamental way but a different way then maybe our parents or even my generation the kids i think they have grown up with income equality and they have grown up with the wars in iraq and afghanistan and they have grown up with systemic issues in their faces and they have the ability to go on tik tok and learn about what they are watching and they have videos to. They are learning about it all and be tik tok moment was important to highlight and im glad you brought it up. One of my favorite things is evidence the joe biden already has a so all he needs to do, i guess and list them isnt the word but engaged them where they are. I read a couple of things recently where they were debating whether or not there was the presence of tik tok because it seemed odd it was so much older but doesnt have to be him. He can engaged those influencers to speak in the message and they are speaking to their own people and actually its a validation that joe biden is the best choice right now. I think a lot of people, there is a debate on twitter this week. Host but i think this generation needs to have a different savvy and it is echoed from aoc. Its an understanding that we have to have a more pragmatic look at our candidates and this population is interested. I dont need to be in love and i dont think that is then initiated enough to them. Unpack that he could see is that everybody expects the barack obama moment. These kids have been, they have had the worst recession in recent memory and oftentimes they are of a different savvy and a less coddled generation. Its hard to make sense of the hardships they face especially black and brown communities disproportionally whether we are talking about black lives matter of family separation or daca. I think thats what your book is getting to, they have a different level of maturity and authenticity. Guest they think they dont want to hear platitudes. They understand that platitudes dont lead to action. Platitudes are you telling me what i want to hear. I want you to do the things that will help me that will help my family with security and safety and fundamentally because some of the crises we are facing and when i wrote the book it was all before covid. I didnt know there was going to be a pandemic. Those who i wish you had told me. You are the only one. Guest i had no idea but i was preparing. As soon as trump was elected and during the campaign let me go do my part and also believing that hillary i was afraid of donald trump so i was preparing for the end of the world. Literally and that was way before the thought of what even covid was. Guest . Host your thought was on people of color and what analysts were saying about donald trump and there was a general folks making decisions on the stories we covered that anxiety was founded but the moment he went down the elevator he told us who he was. I oftentimes and surprised at people being surprised at how terrible he is. He has always told us so i guess that goes back to the sensibility of these young lack of brown activists that are to your point looking for authenticity trying to get people to meet them where they are and meet their needs. How does that change in a pandemic where people are marching for george floyd and expecting change while the rest of the world is upturned. I say this because unlike the belief we just did a poll and found that 75 of latinos are in lockstep with black lives matter matter and one that hooked Younger Voters that we are talking about its even bigger. What do you read in the tea leaves . Guest i think the opportunity is its a coalition of voters but not just because they can potentially win elections but they can reshape legislatures and they can reshape congress and they can reshape the entire country. When you have voting power, when you have the numbers and youd can do the coalition that can elect Health Care Communities i mean that is fundamentally why Voter Suppression is a strategy and thats why they try to suppress the vote of black and brown people. They understand the power of the vote. I think about that all the time. I have family that marched in selma and i think about the fact that they had to survive for our ability to vote and help powerful that owed us be that people would threaten the lives on the Edmund Pettis bridge. It must be something worth fighting for. Host one of the most powerful posts in your book says basically when you are accustomed to privilege equality feels like oppression. As someone who has followed this extensively what is the most and how does that and flame, how does the president use that and how do we combat it . Guest i talk about this almost every day. We are both feminist so we have great conversations about just how we were raised differently. If you are a body and you have white skin you are raised differently. People treat you differently and you dont realize youre different. Just how it is and there a lot of messages. Host who they dont see people clutching their hearses and they are followed around in department stores. They are things that we are aware of . Guest exactly. I feel like at the end of the day it feels like its not microaggression. That person who ever followed you in the store forgets about you but you get in your car and you are still fuming about it. I understand. Guest i think its essentially about the fact that white children are raised whether its implicitly because of the culture and whats on tv and in magazines who are individuals of power that white people are better. They are better and thats what they are taught. They dont see a black president barack obama date dont see many the ceos as anything other than a white man. Its very few cases and so i think when your custom and you see yourself reflected back in the best possible into positions of authority and power and success. You see its negative or stereotyped or racist. That has an effect. Not everybody realizes they have these biases but i feel that everybody has implicit diocese because you have grown up in this country. We are consuming all of that pop culture and all those other things and we treat people differently, better or worse. When i was a little kid in school i was the only black child until ninth. That had an impact on one my ability to recognize those things because i was the only one who is different to it was eyeopening and i think it was third. When i was like okay when im excited and i know the answer and i get really aggressive about it i get told wait your turn. Literally, wait your turn but when the white boys usually do it they would give praise. I noticed that and then you have multiply that experience in perpetuity and not the experience of a person who is not wise of that has an effect on how you haven in fact on how you treat people around you. I think the debate we are concurrently about people not wearing mask is also a manifestation of the privilege of not having to be bothered to protect other people because you heard on the news that may be black and brown communities are being disproportionately impacted. Well thats not me. Thats not my community. Host and i have had the privilege of staying home. Its interesting we participated in the 21st century with president obama trying to change the culture and that seemed to be the most systemic change at that time. Whether things i was highlighted that sticks to your point of how people of color are portrayed makes an impact. As it turns out the majority of white ways officers were coming from very rural small towns and placed in the middle of urban centers. Having conversations in recognizing the only time they saw interaction of a black person or a latino are the images of law and order helped form that they were at dry attic or carry guns and in the case of latinos they were undocumented of breaking the law can imagine someone from those formative years in a rural area meeting a person of color in a place where they are trying to they have been conditioned to believe that person is going to hurt them no matter what you can imagine their reactions, right . Guest and you see that in so many of these videos. Unfortunately you see that moment where the reaction is harm in defense because they are quote unquote fearing for their lives but we have also seen videos where the police and how they treat white people there. Host they have different images of them and its part of the community. Something you pointed out was also very important because the tendency of having aggression and his racist rhetoric is always speaking about language coming from the right and its almost like we dont use it on the right. Can you talk this you have a whole chapter about the bernie burrows if i criticize bernie a minor Television Brand mentioned angry supporters harass me. Can you expand on why you thought that was important to highlight . This behavior coming from the left . Guest i think we are better than that. We are the party that cares about equality and justice in treating people fairly. You can see the efficacy of medicare for all because you care so much about the health and security and safety of others. You are for medicare for all of the people that dont support Bernie Sanders that tweet that i got all the time is you just want people to die. I literally do not. Host did people really say that to you . Guest yes and in addition i think when you are not lockstep over what they want then it was a silencing pack date. I think they were bombarding my social media profiles and calling me names. After a while you just mute it and it doesnt really exist. I cant let it get inside. I cant internalize the feedback of people i dont know. But i also its very toxic. I call it out as it exists and its a thing that is happening we need to do with it. One of the ways that we can deal with it is the fact that its happening and it was happening and there was a certain overlap between some of the impulses the misogyny and the racism that women of color are publicly attacked or trolled. It dehumanized eyes dehumanizes the person doing the harm but but i dont like trolls because i feel like it is not a person. Its bad to send a hateful comment to another person. I want Bernie Sanders himself to speak to how was incredibly in a pro. On the Progressive Side of the political spectrum to tolerate misogyny and racism even among his staff. The reckoning around that needs work but i do think its not its only a small group of what is a Diverse Group of bernies coalition. One of the other point to make in the book which is important is that there are young black people who support Bernie Sanders. These other voices with the ugly messaging are loud and angry so they are actually harming their larger goal and movement by not fully confronting those in their own movement that are perpetuating some the same behaviors. Guest that piece of it, how does that translate into the coalition that you and i discussed that is needed. You have a segment of bernie bros this day my way or the highway that leads into what we are constantly trying to combat and we have elevated discussions that we can provide solutions. What does that look like two that coalition that is needed to win in november . Guest i look at it like this. This is a small group of people on the Progressive Left that i feel either they will see the light and they can be like okay i was kind of a jerk about it but we all agreed that we all do Want Health Care and medicare for all would be ideal. Human know we may not get everything we want but that doesnt mean a person thats negotiating is a sellout or him is more negative for senate republicans. Again we have to be relative about it and fair about it. The coalition we are trying to build certainly includes why progress is fundamentally the core is people of color. For the folks that are like well the trump supporters, they have economic anxiety. Bernie sanders is something to that effect. Im tired of hearing that because he called mexicans racist and those are examples i would like to say that i dont have to wonder if these races. Post to your point is its not the rhetoric. Its the policy traded his policy. Guest hes actually harming those communities of the talking badly about to your point. Guest you mentioned it in oftentimes in the book you highlight black and brown voters. Talk a little bit about that. Unpack that because most people dont realize because theres so much alignment in these issues whether talking about black lives matter or we are talking about health care specifically around this young black and brown voters what is that potential . Talk about that. Guest texas and california are the two states in the country were a latinx are the majority and so that alone that white voter minority that dont like to say majority minority. Host i dont either. Guest in the book i think i say just say white voters are going to be a minority. Its okay. We try to avoid saying it like its going to hurt them but its like its okay. We are in a country where youre calling groups minorities and now you are the minority. Thats internalize that a little bit because that doesnt mean youll be treated like white people have treated minorities. This means the ability to have different power. The coalition we build can be around things Like Health Care income inequality and also the idea that there are specific needs that communities have. Black communities need to get investments in education and efforts from the Police Department to serve the actual community. These are classical things. Host they are the same within the latino community. I also oftentimes and we talk about this idea of Climate Change we get left out. Our communities are disproportionately impacted by climate and justice and its all compounded rate i think you often try to raise the flag is that the future is here and how were we preparing america for that inner richness to know how to provide the resources. To that. Guest part of what we have to snap out of this the fact that what is the use of oka singh on whiteness . I remember as a little girl and as i said i was the only black child until light walked into the stores and it would be all white faces and there was oprah. Representation is a piece of this also. People want to see themselves reflected out that the fact that there is no White Television show on tv, zero the fact that a lot of shows get tagged as a black show or a latinx show because of the majority makeup of the cast. I think it makes the point that we are lacking in representation, not a show that has latinx actors. Host but i think your point is so valid. We could actually say that if donald trump came into power the reason was because the country is changing so quick we and all of a sudden neighbors at sudden neighbors it doesnt said i dont recognize my neighbor and i dont feel secure instead of having a media that isnt talking about our story and bringing the country want to the reality that for the very first time there will be 12 million more voters than they be boomers that are twothirds people of color. Guest its almost like we woke up in 2020 and said oh my gosh we are browned. This is where because people say thats because they are but human to the hypocrisy of how black women who are running for office are treated and how white men are treated. Mayor pete did pete would a judge was able to have a campaign to what are the steps that democrats can take . Guest one of the things when to do as a party and im so glad to see quentin and Stephanie Jameson jessica birx in terms of the funding and financing of campaigns and supporting campaigns but there needs to be more infrastructure in place that not only embraces candidates. If you dont have diversity in terms of operatives and sorted that Training Ground for people who could run for office you are never going to have the reputation that you need that reflects the makeup of the electorate. I think fundamentally for me whats missing on our site is the infrastructure to build that political power through staffing campaigns, stepping legislative offices and having people run for office. Some of the organizers that do this work, they are new. They have just started so we are just at the beginning of this but thats where a lot of the investment needs to happen in terms of when you are already running like in the case of Kamala Harris to be honest about the ways in which black women are and women candidates. Host katie hill is a perfect example. Her exhusband leaked photos of her. Wheres that was not the case when anthony did the same thing. He got another go at it. Guest there were a few members of congress who went on a lot longer than you thought they could. First of all its so rare for a woman in politics and their elected office to have the scandal that even has any of the characteristics in terms of what katie hill dealt with in terms of the misogyny and the revenge nature of that particular issue. Host we actually have receipts for the other guy. Guest we are not honest about the double standard. For example p. But a judge is six basically my age. I know as is a woman of color i can show up at a town hall running for president tell everyone that i will get the details of my policies later. That would stop the conversation. Host as a woman of color even trying to get guest i wouldnt get any money is what im saying. And i think thats the point the Kamala Harris obviously had to enter president ial campaign because of low fundraising and that is too often what happens with women who for some reason people dont trust them with their money without them having proven they can do it. And. Host and even then theres a big question. He talked a little bit about the donor communities but i have always im always struck by individuals to say i really leave in a Latinx Community and funding the africanamerican community. To me its mindblowing. You are kind of like in politics or the campaign oftentimes do not reflect the people and is the same thing when it comes to this. Guest exactly. They dont give money to people who havent traditionally been given money or a been invested in. Thats a cycle that goes around and around and around. These are the people who are being hired to put elected officials and office and then it just keeps going. Then we keep doing it again. I think the point that a lot of people say is identity politics you just want to elect black people because they are black rate no, but it is helpful to have somebody who is black been a position of power. They are going to bring that to policy so thats why its so important. Not because i want to see a picture with diversity. Its nice but its about perspective. Host is about perspective and i point to the fact that for the first time in the 2018 election generation xyz voted for the most diverse blueprint. That would not have been the case had we not had this diverse body of should and to your point. One of the things as they come to it young people in this conversation they might he sang oh my goodness i thought this political career was for me but maybe i dont along and it has there are so many barriers. What advice do you give them because im of the mind that we need young leadership because to your point earlier being is okay and daca should be a right. They have grown up in a world where you dont have to convince them that is true that but they might have trepidation of jumping in. Guest i understand that it its not fair over time. We all know that but i also say your right to vote is powerful. If it werent they wouldnt be trying so hard to take it away. You have to participate in the process in order to get the change you want. Dont fall back on the cynicism of its too hard, it wont matter my vote wont matter it would even count. If we collectively vote and participate or one or both the cozy dont have to run. Host whats your advice. Person running . Aoc a thing she broke the mold and people say how did she do this and i say what young people have aged into her demographics and we see young people all the time now because generation z is the largest generation. What other positions can aim for . Guest run for school board, run for city council, who ran for the committed to board. In new york city they have Community Boards all around your city. You can run for congress or state legislature. Most are not fulltime positions so you could be a state legislator and work your job. I legislators in new york who were 28 when they were elected. The other thing i would remind people of his that if you are looking at running for office of any kind and you are worried that you dont have the qualifications i want you to remember that Louis Gohmert is thing congress and there are a lot of men. Host if you dont know who they are look them up. Guest there are people in congress who never worked questioned on whether they had the experience and clearly they dont and they are in office. Its important to say look if you think theres a problem in your immunity that need salt thing figure out what role it is and whether or not you can run for it. The majority of women who run for office have started with potholes and things like that. We have women are more willing to compromise once in office so it just makes for better government. If youre a young woman out there get on have to be able to be on the but try to be a leader within your community to improve the problems around you. And additionally you can virtually work on the Biden Campaign that i would recommend that the president of campaigns, you learn all the skills further job. Host in your book you talk very much about white hollow pics and the importance of focusing on people of color and he make the case. What is your advice for white allies . How can they present their best self and how can they ensure that there will be fundamental change . Guest i think part of the problem is the lack of the knowledge meant that White Privilege exists but also that they benefit from it. Oftentimes the come back when you are talking about white or of which is well im not privilege, im not rich and then they use a different example. Did you ever think about what you were wearing before you look for a job. Somebody may mistake you for a burglar and kill you in the second part that i have to add one then no one would get in trouble for it. Then also the system says no one is even going to be held accountable because there are so many parts to justice there. If youve never had that thought that his privilege. Its easy to acknowledge that thats a privilege and it doesnt make you a bad person. He you also have to help dismantle the systems that are making it impossible for black people. Valuing black lives is recognizing the ways in which we did not have to deal with those same harms because you benefit, you have the benefit of white skin but also raising kids that have the antiracist mindset quoting from the bestseller how to be an antiracist and treat people theres something to be said for the generation who doesnt see color. Dont raise your kids like that progress your kids to see and and validate and acknowledge and learn to embrace it because i think thats what makes america cool honestly and fundamentally. The Younger Generation their ability, when i go to tik tok terror tutorials about White Supremacy. Host they care about it in a deep way and when you say diversity in americas cool the only other person that i know that really understand that is russia. Thats for a whole different conversation but the reason they are trained to create animus among the tribes is because they believe that is our greatest strength. It is this diversity for future but we do have to be vocal. This book does that really sheds light on the fundamental pieces that oftentimes we take for granted because its a system that is rather than than what should it be especially if we recognize that we want to change the white house and congress and the state legislature we dont have the right people helping usher them into making the right decisions. With that we are an amazing chaos. We have a pandemic and we are on the eve of an economic depression and we also have the 1960 level riots in the streets. All of that together and my mom always said god doesnt give you what you cannot withstand. What is your hope at the end of the day because theres so much anxiety. Guest ive been thinking about the fact that this one big time out is the universe forcing us to reflect on some of our mistakes mainly voting donald trump and to the white house despite the evidence of the racism and misogyny and all of that. For me i wasnt afraid of the racism. I was afraid of the deportations and the deportation forces. That was a Big Conversation among staffers on the campaign and other things that communities would be directly impacted it was a state of fear constantly. In this moment of this pandemic it allows us time to reflect. I do think a lot of us are thinking about arm or taliban thinking about the ways in which we care about people around us having to be able to wear masks. Host the world is scratching their heads. Guest they dont see whats wrong with us. Host i just want to give you the last word in concluding that conversation. What do you think is the biggest opportunity that someone can take from the end of white politics . Guest understanding your part in a larger historical framework. America is going to be minority flights by 2045. That will happen so you are in this moment. This is the moment where we look outside but i also think everybody has a part to play in this. You are a voter but one of the stories i can tell from the Obama Campaign in 2007 before i actually joined in 2008 is i was registering voters in new jersey and the girl who was in charge was 17 and she wouldnt even be 18 by election day than i said why are you here question is that i have to live in the country. I was like, i am and then she said i am one vote but if i can register their people thats more votes per day was like, yes. So i feel like fundamentally understanding that everybody can participate thats the whole thing about this country. We can all participate. Paint about the election pain about joe biden and the elections. Everybody can participate. Host i think thats right. Some people ask what can i do and i say what is your talent . We need everyones talent. I want to thank you for your time Zerlina Maxwell. Thank you for writing the end of white politics and it couldnt be a better time. Folks please pick it up great people will see themselves in the story. Thank you everyone for getting us today. I am Maria Teresa Kumar and as Zerlina Maxwell said registered to vote and participate. Wear a mask and be healthy. Guest thank you. I think we had a multiParty Democracy in the u. S. For a long time. It became a two party system but i think what we had was much more can do two Party Democracy given the factions in different coalitions of the twoParty Democracy that we have now. The two Party Democracy of 2010 is the truly radical deviation from the american political norm. I also think if you look what the framers were writing and again they didnt like parties but what they really didnt like was the two party system i read madisons federalist number 10 which is the one about factions and are acting with factions saying look the key to a stable democracy is fluid coalition and you have different factions building different majorities on different issues that you want to have a democracy so that no group feels like its going to be in a permanent minority and therefore isnt legitimate and note group seems like it will be a permanent majority and sees it as an opportunity to impress the minority. That is fundamentally a vision of multiParty Democracy
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