Transcripts For CSPAN2 Confirmation Hearing For Director Of National Counterterrorism Center 20240712

Experiencing ongoing protests. [silence] the goal for this hearing is to enable this committee to have a thoughtful and deliberate consideration of your qualifications to the position that you respectively have been nominated to fill. The witnesses have provided written response from the committee and its members which you all will have in this morning the members will be able to ask any additional questions and hear directly from the nominees. Mr. Miller graduated from George Washington university in commission as an infantry officer in 1987, he has a masters in National Security studies from the Naval War College and also graduated at the Community Staff and army war college. His military career as an enlisted infantryman in the army reserve in 1983 and served in the district of Columbia National guard. In 1993 christopher transferred to special forces and served for the fifth special forces group and participated in combat operations and iraq and retiring from the army in 2014 he worked as a defense contractor before serving as a special assistant to the president and senior director counterterrorism and transnational threats at the National Security council, he currently serves as the Deputy Defense for special operations and for combating terrorism. He graduated and received his degree from stanford in 2010, hes the United States court of appeals for the 11th circuit, then he entered private practice for several years before joining the u. S. Department of justice for assistant u. S. Attorney for the seventh district of california. During this time patrick served multiple roles here in washington to include the time with d. O. J. , he served in multiple rolls in washington to include the Department Director of counter transnational organized crime, he currently served as the associate deputy general of jeffrey rosen. You have been asked to lead the odeon eyes office of general counsel respectively at a time when we are engaged in a debate in a robust debate about the Intelligence Community and our collection tools and authority, at the same time the nation continues to confront a growing array of threats from state and nonstate actors this will require judgment, wisdom, integrity and i expect they will both provide counsel and advice to the director of National Intelligence as he takes on these complex and divisive challenges. The satisfaction of this Committee Oversight mandate will require transparency and responsiveness from your respective offices should be confirmed. With both of them prior to the hearing. Congratulations on your respective nominations to serve as director of the National Counterterrorism cente center ad general counsel for the office of the dni. Both these positions are important in the Intelligence Committee. During the time of unprecedented National Challenge and peril. The National Counterterrorism center [inaudible] i apologize. The Counterterrorism Center was created to prevent these kind of efforts into the meetings which created in the wake of 9 11 to connect the dots and ensure they never enter our soil. The odni general counsel is critical to ensure that the laws but the Intelligence Community abide by the laws of this country including protecting American Civil Liberties and privacy interests. The job of americas Intelligence Committee is to uncover and anticipate the right and to provide more to the nation. The community is first and foremost in americas eyes and ears and you just as all of the professional men and women are mandated to be nonpolitical and speak truth to power making those difficult calls based not on what those in power wish to hear, but on the facts. Unfortunately, under this president , the men and women of the Intelligence Committee have increasingly come under attack not only from abroad but without justification. From within the leadership of our very own government. Those whove had to do with all americans expected of them, simply to tell the truth, similarly dismissed, disparaged on twitter. Because this president is often finds the truth on welcome, hes fired the acting dni, the deputy, deputy dni, nic Inspector General, acting director, a 40 year intelligence dismissed as the acting jeni. In terms of british also volunteered to do dangerous jobs including those every day around the world countrys leaders have their backs. Instead, theyve been subject to disrespect. For a significant pure go of this here, there wasnt a single Senate Confirmed senior official at the office of the dni. This alarms me and it should alarm the american public. The leadership roles youve agreed to undertake are challenging under the best of circumstances. Mr. Miller, the adversaries have not simply disappeared, though we know plots continue every day. American men and women deployed in syria, iraq, afghanistan and elsewhere and some never made it back to their families. I look forward to hearing from you today about your thoughts on how to confront the evil thing and increasingly sophisticated threats from isis and other organizations. But you will take on in this world and how you will define success. Id like to hear what you think about the role of the ncp seat in confronting these threats and how you plan to make sure the center is sufficiently resourced to carry out its job. The general counsel advises the dni on the letter and spirit of the law including the legal mandate to keep Intelligence Committees fully and currently informed and to ensure that Civil Liberties. But as we saw with ukraine whistleblowers come of those who complied with obligations to inform congress have consequences. I expect to engage with you today on your perspective of what whistleblowers and in particular, your perspective on the involvement of the office of Legal Counsel at the department of justice. Unfortunately, because of how this administration has approached the already difficult responsibilities will be even more challenging. In addition to asking how you will undertake these responsibilities today, i also wish to hear how you will stand up to political pressure, how you will ensure that it is a political and fear or favor, how you were reassured for workforce that you will not face the consequences for simply doing the job and how you will make sure that this committee is fully and currently informed. Former dni dan coats, former member of this committee set a high bar for telling truth to power. Even in public for which he was eventually fired. I want to understand how you plan to live up to this example. Thank you again for agreeing to take up these positions and i look forward to todays hearing. Thank you mr. Chairman. I understand the Senate Senator grassley is here to speak. Senator grassley, please proceed. Thank you very much, mr. Chairman and mr. Vice chairman for the opportunity to introduce to the committee in native of my home state of iowa, mr. Christopher weller. I congratulate both of the nominees for their appointment. It is not everyday that an ilm with such a distinguished Service Record comes before the senate for consideration. So it is a special privilege for me to give this introduction. Chriss parents and much of his family still live in iowa city and or eastern iowa. Im sure his family is very proud you will be testifying before this committee today into the recognized a process of publishing the surface to the country. Chris was raised in iowa city after graduating from City High School he attended North Washington university, where he majored in history and enrolled in the rotc program. He graduated from George Washington in 1987, and then immediately accepted a commission in the u. S. Army as an infantry officer. In the army, chris had an impressive and distinguished career. He served in afghanistan in 2001 and iraq in 2003, and in the following years like a lot of other military people, he served on the numerous additional deployments to both of those countries. On behalf of the people of iowa, we thank you in other people for your service to the country particularly in those difficult times. Following his time in the army, chris went on to become Deputy Assistant secretary defense for special operations and combating terror to some, where he is currently performing the duties of the assistant secretary of defense for special operations. Whether as a member of the armed forces or Public Service, chris has given the best of himself for the American People in defense of the country. Of course, that it should be no surprise to. After all, hes got iowa roots. Im certain that this committee will find him a proper give him a proper review of his record in the service and how that fits into his new position. I believe he is fully qualified being nominated now to be the director of the National Counterintelligence Counterterrorism Center and also the director of National Intelligence. So, now it is again my pleasure to introduce to this committee mr. Christopher miller. Congratulations. Thank you, mr. Chairman. Before we begin, would you please stand and raise your right hand . To do solemnly swear to give the committee the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth, so help you god . Think you. Please be seated. Gentlemen, before we move to your statements, i want to ask you to answer the five standard questions that we ask of every nominee that appears before us. They generally require a simple yes or no answer. We need to hear it so it can be transcribed. First question to you appear to agree to appear here and many other venues when invited . Yes. Is confirmed, youve agreed to send officials from your office to appear before the committee and designated staff when invited. Yes. Do you agree to provide documents or other materials in order for it to carry out with oversight and legislative responsibilities . Yes. Will you ensure your office and staff provide such materials for the staff when requested . Yes. Do you agree in full extent possible all members of the committee of intelligence activities and covert actions to the chairman and vice chairman . Yes. Thank you. We will now proceed to the Opening Statements after which i will recognize members. I believe we will go by order of seniority today. I understand you are going to go first, to the floor is yours. Thank you, senator. Thank you, senator. I want to highlight what a thrill it was for senator grassley to make those opening comments. I got my folks have cspan2 up. I was a little bit worried that im sure my sister helped them out. My uncle floyd and by aunt arlene i know are spiraling down as they were supporters of senator grassley. When i was 14yearsold, i went to an event at their farm and i will admit that i did not hear his remarks on the defensive line with my bb gun but this obviously special. Senator warner, with highest regards when people ask me where im from, i proudly say that im from iowa. Words cant describe how honored i am an overworked senator grassley has done distinguished members of the committee, thank you for taking the time to consider my nomination to be the director of the National Counterterrorism center. I appreciate the opportunity to appear before you. It is both humbling and surreal to see before you today as the president s nominee for this position. I am grateful to have the support and confidence of the president of trump and the director of National Intelligence radcliffe. Along with the overwhelming privilege to lead and commanded americas sons and daughters in combat as an Army Special Forces officer and considered for this position it is in honor of my professional life. When al qaeda declared war in the United States 1997 september the 11th, 2001 i like many of my generations answer the call to fight. It wasnt a war that we thought that the defense of this nation as we sacrificed our youth. Many dear friends and comrades also sacrificed their health, their marriages and in some cases their lives. We have no regrets. The war has been long. Our efforts have been remarkably successful. The commitment of tens of thousands of professionals has taken the fight to the enemy, protected the United States and developed a Global Network of partnerships that prevented another cataclysmic attack. When we set out on this journey, we envisioned the campaign against violent extremist organizations and the generational war. It would be in my view at the height of the responsibility to lead this conflict for our children to fight. It is my lifes goal whether confirmed for this position or another capacity to defeat al qaeda and its affiliates, to transition the war to a sustainable effort where it is focus on monitoring the terrorist threats in the United States, attacking those with the ability to. And expanding relationships with likeminded partners around the world who are committed to the scourge to peaceful coexistence. I still see myself in the kids of iowa who wants nothing more than to serve the country and think their parents proud. My father believed strongly in the mobility o of public servic, and i try everyday to follow in his footsteps. In addition to my mothers wisdom, an example of citizenship, that is what my sister and i aspire to emulate in our lives. Most importantly, i want to recognize my wife and our three children were here with me today. Kate stood with me through this 32 year odyssey and raised over three children into magnificent apple put. Their character optimistic to the future and motivation to tht give me hope and continue greatness in this United States of america. If confirmed by the lead of the patriotic men and women of the National Counterterrorism center with honor and integrity, advocate for the requirements of the counterterrorism enterprise and provide frank, honest opinions and advice to the president of the dni, this committee and other policy makers and leaders in order to guarantee that we never again experience the indescribable loss of september 11, 2001. Mr. Chairman, members of the committee, thank you for your leadership in protecting the United States. I look forward to responding to the questions. Thank you. Acting chairman rubio, vice chairman warner and distinguished members of the committee, thank you for taking the time this morning to consider my nomination to serve as the general counsel for the office of the director of National Intelligence. I am honored to appear before today. I also extend my thanks to the president for the opportunity to serve in the director radford for his confidence in me to my current pulses, attorney general this room isnt great. Could we turn your volume up a little bit . And maybe you can bring your microphone of a closer. Thank you so much. We are all kind of getting used to this. At my currenas my current boy general tovar and Deputy Attorney general jeff rosen for their support throughout the nomination process. Acting chairman rubio and vice chairman warner, i am a first generation american and a proud civil servant. My background and experiences that shape who i am today and have compelled me to put my hand up when called upon to serve. This great country of ours has given me everything. My parents hovakimiam came to this area and built a life and raised two boys and instilled in me a deep appreciation of the freedom and rights the country provides. And in equally strong need to serve. Without their love and support, i simply wouldnt be here today. I think my mom who is watching from home, my dad, who i know is watching from above, my entire extended family and the many Close Friends from back home in california and those from later in life who have supported me and left beside me through the years. Ive been fortunate in my career. After graduation from law school at the International Law firm where he worked alongside and learned from the highest layers in the world. After a few years in the firm working for a judge on the 11th circuit, i have i thought couldt could be the best job i ever had. In san diego i worked alongside agents and prosecutors probing cases from the ground up. I handled matters and diverse contexts across the criminal code. The last couple of years i served as a prosecutor and i worked primarily on the cases involving a former foreign defense contractor and the u. S. Navy. Investigating and mitigating the National Defense procurement fraud and bribery cases was rewarding work to say the least he could get implicated the National Security interests and those of the military. Working handinhand with Law Enforcement agents and military personnel that felt like we were standing up for the interests of the United States. It felt righteous because it was. I will tackle those days, and i carry the experience is with me. They motivate me to continue to serve. Just as i have Great Respect for the dedicated professionals and federal Law Enforcement agencies, i have tremendous respect for the members of the icy. They do do righteous work and work every day on behalf of the United States. I am here because i want to support them and their mission. I am here because i want to do what i can particularly in this consequential time to ensure that women and men get the support they need to help keep the country safe and secure. I seem to work in action serving as the director of counter transnational crime rises in consumer and participated in the fbi and cia briefings on counter narcotics efforts, terrorism finance, country specific and region specific threats into various interconnection between the nationstates and organized crime around the globe. And they worked to implement the briefings and interaction i experienced firsthand the value they provide in the critical nature of the work that they do. Ive also seen firsthand the way it interacts in the activity as a deputy general i regularly participate in the counterintelligence and briefings in the operational matters in the investigation and litigation in the National Security cases. Senators, the general counsel position that ive been nominated for is a legal job. In addition to the tasks that any would perform, i regard the overarching duties to be in principle threefold. First, they must speak truth to the decisionmakers. Everything else flows from that basic proposition. The only legal advice i will ever give is that which comports entirely with the constitution of the United States and the law of the United States even when n the results and outcomes or advice others may not want to hear. I will only ever deliver what i consider to be lawful, objective, clear and complete advice and counsel. My oath to the constitution will require it, and my professional judgment and moral compass demands it. Second, the general counsel must promote transparency because the icy must Keep Congress fully and currently informed of this intelligence activities. Funny guy cultivating a relationship with the congressional Intelligence Committees as of this amount importance. Oversight providing the American People through their elected representatives to channel through which to receive and evaluate, specifically with regards to the intelligence of the duties of the ic robust and thorough congressional oversight that is vitally important. The ic engages in activities critical to the National Security of the country and the implications of many other values we like the prius like Civil Liberties and privacy. If confirmed, i will work with the director and other leaders to facilitate and maintain cooperative process. The general counsel uniquely situated for the collaboration across the office and to do so they should take a leading role in promoting collaboration and ensure activities are conducted lawfully and the panoply of the statutory rights are protected for the employees. I will close by saying Public Service is a high privilege. I remember standing in court and saying good morning, your honor. Im here on behalf of the United States. That feeling never got old. If i am confirmed, i will have a different but similarly significant opportunity to serve. I look forward to working with a talented professionals of the ic. Ic. So acting chairman rubio, vice chairman warner and members of the committee, i look forward to your questions i will defer my opening questions until the rest of the hearing and they will recognize you to begin a. Thank you, mr. Chairman. Mr. Miller, mr. Hovakimiam. I have a question for both of you, but i want to make a statement if i can at the beginning. Most of this committee were involved in creating, not just in ctc, but the dni area so, they have their own vision of what the responsibility and the mission of both were. Ive had an opportunity to sit down with mr. Miller, and ive talked to patricks background and his resume. Im not sure that we could have more qualified people to fill the role that theyve been nominated for dan these two individuals. And given that many of the committee crafted these agencies and legislations, it is absolutely crucial that we have people that can fulfill the mission that we thought in ctc was there to do and we could have somebody interpret the correct call in an agency that is in the infancy stage. So, i encourage the members if there were a time i would like to see us expedite these nominees and get away from acting and have permanent, it would be before we leave for the next break. Mr. Miller, how do you plan to ensure the Intelligence Communitys Counterterrorism Mission is operated as efficiently as possible given the limited resources and a growing focus of the hard target countries . Thank you, senator come up with the question. I hope everyone can hear me. Its so important as rightfully weve had enormous success against counter and violent extremist organizations and i feel we are having these conversations on resourcing the prioritization from the counterterrorism at this time. It is a testament to the success that we have had. But the war isnt over yet. Al qaeda and its affiliates are still committed to attacking us. The first 30 days, get in there, look under the hood, see whats going on, determine the resources and then take action after that. I feel right now we are in a pretty good place. I look at the macro perspective of the budget in my last job. However, we cannot overcorrect. Let me ask you a followup if i can. How do you plan to reduce any analytic duplication thats going on currently . Senator, as you know, the intelligence organizations within the enterprise presents challenges, and i think i have some of the same concerns when i see products that are written and kind of contradicts another one. Thats kind of one of the challenges but that is the beauty of the enterprise. The question is how much. And i know that we currently within the counterterrorism business every day we have a meeting where we make sure we are not doing that. Im going to take that very seriously because the duplication is okay to a point, but to use the tax dollars correctly, we dont need much, and that is the challenge im going to take on. The intelligence communities are faced with cutting Edge Technologies in the novel situations. Without a lot of precedent for us to draw, what experience do you have in crafting Legal Solutions for the cuttingedge Technology Problems that have no legal precedent . Is a great question and one that in many ways as youve rightfully pointed out well define the process of providing the legal judgments in the future. Working at the doj, ive had the opportunity to consult and work with the fbi and the National Security position on matters related to our Artificial Intelligence and other cuttingEdge Technologies like that. Crosscutting legal issues that apply, luckily at the ic is comprised of a number of talented officers. I would draw upon their experience and expertise. I would work with this committee and their professional staff who would engage as appropriate with other stakeholders, and i would do my best to render complete, thorough and accurate legal advice, no matter how novel the context. And annexing cuba. Mr. Chairman, i will yield back. Thank you mr. Chair. Let me again say that ive really enjoyed the opportunity to meet with those gentlemen before the hearing. And i would echo what senator byrd said in the difficult time line of personal fear that its up for constant assault not complying but you wouldnt, but i want to get these for the record. Will you commit to report to congress any evidence of political pressure on the socalled warren ttests within your respective areas. What will it you do to reassure the workforce or for that matter not just the general counsels office that the intelligence professionals will not face repercussions if they do their job and to tell the truth . Senator, i am a proud civil servant. I have worked alongside the servants for the majority of my career now and i consider myself to be among them if some confirmed for the job i will engage with them daily. I will tell them that i am a leader of the office, but that doesnt mean i am there appeared they can come to me and talk to me. And they would have my full support. Vice chairman warner, really important question joined to the counterterrorism enterprise in this apolitical nonpartisan, we used to have a statement as many of us will recall politics ended up th the waters edge and its e same thing with counterterrorism but maybe the mission focused group of professionals i would absolutely leave with integrity as i have throughout my career and be very conscious to be too cautious of that and that the example as i can. I have a couple of questions for you coming and we talked a little bit of this in the meeting. In your answers to the committees questions, you noted the specific intelligence. To have access to this information, it appears that there are some within the Attorney Generals Office trying to undermine this committee and of the ica. Do you have any outsid doubts tt russia interfered and continues to interfere in our 2020 elections . I do not. As director ratcliffe said durindirector radcliffe saiddurn hearings, it is clear that the russian interfered in 2016, its clear that the interfered in 2018, and its clear that they are or they are attempting to this year. Some of the things they did were extensive social media disinformation campaigns. Some forms of hacking and other efforts aimed at selling general discord and undermining our democracy. So i think that its clear. Do you have any questions about the assessment of the unanimous consent of the assessment of the Intelligence Community and the committees report that in 2016 they had a favorite candidate . Senator, as i noted in the remarks in th of the questions,i havent had a chance to look at that intelligence. I dont know what it says or what their interests and their. What i can say is i have no reason to doubt that of january 2017, nor this committees confirmation of it. I think that is a careful answer. I know you are applying to be a lawyer but i am concerned and i think my colleagues will press you on that. One of the things i found out our most outrageous was when the Inspector Generals efforts were undermined by the olcs opinion that basically said the odni had the ability to stop the icig whistleblower concern to congress, which i believe is the opposite to the plain letter intent of the law. Have you had the chance to review any of those activities coming up with you see Going Forward if an Inspector General is pursuing the matter in the role for the odni would you try to stop any general effort . I have Great Respect for all acts of congress and among those is the enactment of the whistleblower protection act and the one that applies to the ic. I would ensure that they receive all protection for which they are entitled. To ensure that the whistleblowers are affordable Legal Protections that they are entitled to a. Thank you mr. Chairman. Thank you, mr. Chairman. Mr. Miller, as you know from our conversations on the phone, i have a very special interest in the nec nctc because of the terrorism act of 2004, which i drafted with senator lieberman come if we consider to nctc as welthe nctc aswell as the condii as the chief component of the wideranging bill. I am therefore concerned about the recent comments in which he outlined his concerns that the nctc doesnt have the resources that are required to fulfill its mandate under the irtpa. He has communicated similar concerns to my staff and to the committee. Ive also noted in recent years that it seems agencies are no longer sending their very experienced analysts to the National Counterterrorism center and so in some ways weve gone back to the pre nctc days when president bush first set up to try to do this kind of inter Agency Analysis to ensure that we connect the dots. Do you believe that the nctc has sufficient resources to fulfill its legal mandate . Senator, first off, thank you for your leadership with senator lieberman and establishing a National Counterterrorism center which responded prior to september the 11th, 2001. Hes a dear friend and mentor and fundamentally i very much agree. I understand he might have done a complaint or however you would determine that. They dont want to return to the 2001 stovepipes. The other thing is between the centralization and decentralization. That is a really important question that we have to get right. And of course the last thing, lets have a public discussion about that which we are having today. I dont want to speak for him. I need to go in there and look. I know the general budget lines and analytical capacity is something that is important, and i know that there is stress on polling analysts out of the counterterrorism and moving them to other accounts that are higher priority. I havent seen that at the macro level against. I kind of look at the growth numbers. Its a huge concern. We cant return to the problems that we had in the past, but i dont have a level of detail and i look forward to talking with him again as soon as i can to give more specificity. And of course i will talk to all of the former protectors. Thank you. I think that is really important. We intend to do for the connection after reading the 9 11 commission report, which suggested that the 20 some Intelligence Agency had some information that perhaps had one of us to be able to thwart the 9 11 attack. And as we shift towards the focus on china and russia, we cannot forget that the trigger was the threat is still very real. So, i appreciate your commitme commitment. Mr. Hovakimiam, last year they received a complaint that the Intelligence Community Inspector General was credible and an urgent concern. Despite the legal requirement to transmit the complaint to this committee within seven days, the odni did not do so. Under what circumstance senator, generally speaking, all whistleblower complaints should be forwarded to congress. If confirmed, i decided in other contexts and i will say it again, i will do everything i can to ensure the whistleblowers are affordable to statutory rights to which they are entitled, and i will do everything i can to work with the professionals both in the inspector Generals Office of the general counsels office to ensure that the whistleblower protection act is applied fairly and consistently. Thank you. Thanks mr. Chairman. Thank you. Senator feinstein. Thanks mr. Chairman. You are very young. Back in 2014 which one . Not you, sir. [laughter] sorry. I couldnt resist that. Back in 2014, the committee put out a study on the cia detention and interrogation program. That was important to me. I was the chairman of the committee at the time. Do you believe that any of the cia former enhanced interrogation techniques are consistent with the detainee treatment act . I reviewed the executive summary that was released while the chairman. It was a very detailed and thorough report and from where i saisit it is a want of congressional oversight. Senator today its clear the Defense Authorization act of 2016 those in the field manual or illegal and i support that fully in this conference i would ensure that its complied with. Good. Youve done your homework. Let me ask about the detainee treatment act which is a set of conditions and take the best can be used. I have reviewed it, senator, yes. That is the standard that is used is my understanding so as the chief Legal Counsel for most importantly intelligence offices im very interested in your position would be. Torture is wrong and i would confirm and make sure that its complied with. Ive read of the executive summary of the report of the committee put together when they were chairman. I found it to be illuminating and terrifying at the same time. If government as the general counsel in the odni how would you approach questions of the intelligence of august Domestic League as the part of Law Enforcement operations . Senator, the bedrock principle of our country is no t americans that are engaging in activities protected in First Amendment or other parts of the constitution are not to be targeted or surveilled on the basis of that activity so although in the executive there is a section that allows certain coordination, technical assistance, things like that between the domestic Law Enforcement. That kind of stuff happening here is very serious and to answer the question directly, i would review it soberly and looked out activities with a skeptical eye and work with career professionals. Are you aware of the presidency firings of recent Inspector Generals to include Inspector General Michael Atkinson . I am aware of that, yes. Do you see any issues in the firing that would undermine the confidence confidence finds another year. I dont know all the facts but what i do know is there is a dedicated committed core of Civil Servants across the United States government. Im proud and honored to be among them and my experience has been nothing shakes the spokes because on behalf of the United States i anticipate that if confirmed, i will go back and help them do just that. Do you see any issues with the recent firing of Michael Atkinson that would undermine the confidence in the whistleblower protections . Whistleblower protections are of paramount importance. Its important that the rights of all whistleblowers are protected. I was a prosecutor and worked with informants. They are like whistleblowers in many ways. They put everything on the line. They tell what they believe to be the truth and to disclose what they see as wrongdoing. Across the government they work to do just that and if confirmed, i look forward to helping them do that. Hispanic mr. Hovakimiam. Im surprised nobodys asked you about what i considered to be one of the greatest scandals that the Intelligence Community including the fbi. And in American History where the resources of the fbi and the Intelligence Community were directed against a candidate for president of the United States and in the lengthy narrative about russian collusion, ultimately resulting in the appointment of a special counsel into the report from mr. Muell mr. Mueller. Now we are learning as a result of the classifications of of of of previously classified materials about the nature of the fraud being committed on the fisa court in securing fisa warrants, eddie was of the fbis authority to conduct counterintelligence investigations, which are very important, and frankly this regard that the highest levels of the fbi gettin during the prs administration for the procedures governing fair and impartial investigations from. I wonder if you could characterize your reaction to the revelations weve seen, recognizing of course there are some ongoing investigations by mr. Jerome and we anticipate thihisreport. But it strikes me that this is one of the greatest scandals in American History. Senator, all i can say is i was shocked as word Many Americans when i read the Inspector Generals report on the fisa situation. As a lawyer in a public servant, the idea that just for example an office of general counsel lawyer would alter an email and then alter an email that would serve as a base and partly for the fisa application. Its deeply, deeply troubling. In terms of the attorney general place called abuse. I would say over the course of my career as a prosecutor and as an employee i have had the pleasure and honor of working with any number of fbi agents and Law Enforcement person now. They seek to do the right thing and help protect this country. I am honored to work with them. I know the director and the fbi leadership are implementing reforms and changes to address the situation as described in the report. And in the ongoing and important conversation. Thank you for the question. Senator feinstein raised the issue of intubation and the investigation that was made. The report ended up being minority and majority report on partisan lines, and indeed there wasnt a full investigation in terms of talking or interviewing witnesses as opposed to paper and reports. But this was a legal challenge for the department of defense and for the Intelligence Community. The cia and other aspects of the Intelligence Community had to adopt to the novel situation and try to get actual intelligence to save american lives and hopefully preempt the future terrorist attacks. Could you describe for us how you ask the chief lawyer for the director of National Intelligence approach these sort of novel legal questions because we know exactly what happened one the officials were respectful for protecting the American People consistent with the legal advice provided at the time. There was a second guessing. And to then hanged those very people out to dry when they tried to do the best they can in the novel circumstance to understand what the law is. Can you address how they would approach the sort of novel legal questions . As i said in my opening, i want to do my job because in the mission of those deployed, overseas who are fighting on behalf of the country every day if confirmed, i would talk to, consult and work with personnel and people sort of been there, done that because i believe that legal advice is informed and the best they occurred when it takes into account facts on the grou ground. There are facts that can guide the analysis and situations. I would try to be a lawyer and i will turn to a fully informed basis and to talk to those that have a skin in the game and to those that have signed their backs up against the wall. I do believe the facts inform the legal judgment if confirmed i will work every day to ensure that i get the best legal advice i can. Thank you, mr. Chairman. Mr. Hovakimiam, my hometown of portland has just been invaded by a militarized federal Law Enforcement. These federal forces are teargas in and detaining neighbors. On monday, donald trump promised to expand this invitation to other cities. If the line is and drawn in the sand right now, america may be staring down the barrel of martial law in the middle of a president ial election. Now mr. Hovakimiam, you are a Senior Justice Department official and in a position to know what is going on. And as you know, i informed you in advance that i would be asking questions this morning about the legality of what is happening in my hometown. My first question is do you believe the federal forces can control of American Cities over the objections of the state and local officials away from federal buildings . Senator, i understand portland is your hometown and i extendeextend my best wishes tor friends and family. Those that are engaged in activity protected by the First Amendment is a bedrock principle of democracy and one that i stand by. A peaceful protest is one thing iif violence is another and from where i sit, Law Enforcement my time is short. Nobody condone violence, and ive repeatedly said that. That isnt the issue it is a smokescreen for the federal takeover. I believe the country needs government lawyers that are not going to use the law as a smokescreen to justify a this unconstitutional invasion over the objection of local officials. Senator, as i begin my remarks, i do extend my best wishes to your constituents there. In your best wishes what they want and no in the Constitutional Rights of all people upon this issue specifically there is no way that he would have allowed the federal government to do what is going on in my city. I would like to hear that youre going to. Do you believe unidentified sources in unmarked cars could drive around seizing and detaining american citizens . It is a yes or no question. Seizing and detaining american citizens, yes or no. Generally speaking, senator, it is a great idea to identify oneself as a federal lawenforcement officer. They take the Constitutional Rights of americans very seriously. As you know, the state in oregon has sued the federal government, and as it is common, the federal Programs Branch of the Civil Division and the department of state and in the lawsuit. So at this point, there is ongoing litigation. Some of the matter is you were asking about cuts to the heart of the litigation. That again is ducking the question. These are practices that are going on now over the objection of local officials. And you have a good located. I consider these practices they massive invasion of Constitutional Rights of my constituents. I think that these practices are essentially fascist practices that until recently would have been unthinkable in america. And your refusal to condemn what is going on in my hometown, and people know all about it, the first secretary of Homeland Security was very clear about it. These positions are not sufficient with the position to be nominated and i intend to oppose the nomination. Senator heinrich. Mr. Hovakimiam come in your current capacity and the Justice Department, i have a few questions i would like for you to take for the record. You dont have to answer them today, but i would appreciate a quick response. The u. S. Attorney for new mexico told me yesterday that the federal Law Enforcement agents will be sent to albuquerque as a result of the expansion of the occupation. The Justice Department states on its website that this initiative is intended to, quite, quite the sudden surge of violent crimes, but if the Albuquerque Police chief had pointed out homicides are down this year and protests in the city have been mostly peaceful. If it is not intended to monitor protest and how these horses be utilized . Now i like to get to some questions i would appreciate your answers to today. On june 26 the president issued an executive order on protecting american monuments, memorials and statues to combat recent criminal violence. According to the public reports on which i have requested to have the office of analysis with intelligence gathering among ordinary american citizens who participate in local protest. If you believe the threats of Property Damage specifically is a significantly enough Homeland Security threat and then to warrant intelligence analysis and collection by federal agent agents. Senator with respect i cannot necessarily speak to at the department of Homeland Security is or is not doing. And then including 3 feet freeze each and expression. With that monuments are statues. That comes at an opportunity cost if we are gathering information and non protesters over White Supremacy groups or other groups that have threatened violence. Senator i understand the question my goal in my current job and in my future job is legal judgments and to do that i need all the facts on the ground. It is different to opine on hypotheticals. That you answered pretty straightforward about the authorities and this is the next logical step this is the title 50 authorities in action. So why is it hard to connect the dots for you . There was a lot of facts on the ground and specifically about vandalism. And about gathering intelligence about protesters. So generally speaking intelligence should not be gathered against those to be entirely protected by the First Amendment. Thank you mr. Chairman. Have questions that i will reserve them for close session they are not for public. Thank you mr. Chairman. In your current role as the department of justice have you supervised Law Enforcement officers . The deployment of federal Law Enforcement officers . If you send officers to these locations . Im a current doj official theres a lot happening right now. Simple yes or no would be helpful. Senator with the attorney general and Deputy Attorney general on any number of topics. Lets focus on the subject matter. Yes. Ive sidelined into a great number of things this does not happen to be one of them. You were not involved in any decision . Like any major Big Organization there is a division of labor. This is a very specific question were you involved in any way and the decision to deploy federal Law Enforcement officers to the cities we have been discussing during the protest . My understanding doj involvement has been limited. Answer the question. Were you involved or not . Senator there are ongoing Law Enforcement operations around the country. Youre not going to answer the question. I can move on. Am attempting to answer the question. Are you involved . Senator i advised the attorney general and Deputy Attorney general everything under the sun i always bring to the table of respect for Constitutional Rights and First Amendment i turned to that frequently when advising them. We advised in the decision to remove peaceful protest at Lafayette Square quick. I dont know made that decision or when that was done. We were involved in that decision . Senator i think i had a question for the record prehearing on that topic and i answered no. Press reports indicate in june were you involved in granting these authorities . Im not entirely sure. Youre not sure if you were involved . Im not sure exactly what it is you are referring to. Dea and with the United States code there are delegations available to be made. Have sidelined into a great number of things. We were involved in any manner to fire jeff . No. Jeff was the us attorney in new york and to make statements on that. But with the department of justice with the whistleblower complaint fired with the Intelligence Community Inspector General do you have any awareness of this whistleblower complaint and if it should be shared with congress . Senator you are referring to the whistleblower complaint from late summer or early fall last year of all the proceedings . We were involved in that decision in any way . Senator, that was something that occurred when the nation watched it. Were you involved in that decision in any way . The decision not to share the whistleblower complaint with congress. The whistleblower complaint was shared with congress. At some point but also there was a decision not to you. Where you involved in that decision . I guess my point to bring that up senator is im not exactly sure which decision you are referring to because i dont know who made it. I dont know if there was a decision made not to share with congress because it was in fact shared with congress. Where you involved in any way and 80 decisions made around the department of justices decision in the Michael Flynn case . The matter involving general flynn is in active litigation before the dc circuit. We were involved in the decision in any way . As a lawyer and official that doj is difficult for me to comment on the ongoing matter. Roger stone that matter was litigated over the course of years and court filings. The attorney general has made public statements about that case i will of those to speak for themselves. My time is up. I deferred my questions to the end. There is an arrangement where the workload is taken up by other agencies and increasingly foreignpolicy and therefore intelligence work and in multiple areas of us policy and geopolitics are increasingly focused on china and russia and iran and north korea. The concern is even as a focus on these things that could somehow detract from the role for the importance of counterterrorism remaining inactive threat. What is your view of this arrangement that the mandate relies heavily on those from other agencies whose increased workload could potentially place a strain on our ability to focus on the Counterterror Mission quick. Thank you acting chair rubio. Great question. I really think the model works when and resources are bountiful and everyone has committed to the mission. The beauty of that model constantly rotating in new folks and you kept a degree of energy an individual thinking going. My get instinct is we need to look at that because im concerned as resources get further constrained door other priorities come forward we need to think if thats the right model. Have done this before and it works great with labor and tell it doesnt. And we might be kind of getting to that point, sir. Is not the aspect of having new people come into the role but the workload of an agency we need more work and focus on north korea, they may not be able to partner on the same scale. Thats a bigger concern its the new people rotating in. Yes senator. National Counterterrorism Center is doing cuttingedge work using Artificial Intelligence and Machine Learning we have baby steps right now a large way on one way to explore those and i hope they continue to be best of class of those efficiencies can be gained but right now i completely hear what youre saying and we will look at that closely of confirmed and concerned as well. Were in the unprecedented situation where fisa authorities expired in march leaving the department of justice with those surveillance authorities. The question is for both of you what do you have what the current expired status . Thank you acting chairman rubio for an important question. I will say from an operation standpoint this is one of the things we learned one typically speaking once again im not an expert on fisa but i understand the broad outlines more tools are better generally speaking as long as it comports with our laws and ag guidelines. The question isnt so much about the legal argument surrounding it but to our counterterrorism current status. Your answer is obviously the more tools the better but how critical are those tools historically in your view . Senator, National Security agency has some thoughts on tha that. Of course support those operational elements. However, once again i cannot speak specifically right now to the impacts in regards to counterterrorism. Certainly more is better and i will look at that if confirmed. Senator yes the provisions that expired march 152020 have been very important and useful to the National Security community. Its always better to have more tools if you dont need to use them one of those provisions that has never been used in history but that doesnt mean they are not a set of circumstances for which would be useful. If confirmed i look forward to collaborating with this committee and the legislative Affairs Professionals to reauthorize. Were to follow up with others you have questions. Yes. Im pretty disappointed how you answered my colleagues questions or failed to answer. But the one that bothered me the most, because we talked about it before senator harris came in, we had a discussion with my questions about the opinion totally inappropriately that they could intervene and stop the ag for making a report to congress. We talked about that you thought it was very important for the igs report and that you thought that was an appropriate and yet you would even respond to senator harris if you were involved at all and acted like he didnt know what she was talking about. Senator sorry for any misunderstanding what i was referring to was when the decision was made not to send the report over. That did not compute for me but the complaint did eventually make its way over. But not to the appropriate channels and was stopped and then they stop from continuing the investigation by law. I was not that decision was made by the Legal Counsel. And then having sightlines of all things attorney general. Im not quite sure what you mean. If you dont understand what i mean that i believe youre dealing with us in the appropriate and straight manner. You are a bright young man, but would like to get a written response from you. I am committed to assuring the rates under the statue. I believe in it i believe whistleblower serve the important role. Working with confidential informants many ways they are like whistleblowers. And those with statutory rights and if confirmed i will do my very best to respect those rights as i always have in every position including doj seems there is confusion on the question of what they are asking is you understand things are going on in different places maybe want to respond to this in writing but as i understand it whatever the decision was made by the legal Concept Office were you giving legal advice to what the outcome should be . No. Yes i think that is right that this is may why you want to take this for the record, my understanding that i believe you had some consultation with the attorney general to reach that conclusion and then was referred to the ic im sorry the ig was then stopped from performing his duties that we thought was a clear contradiction of the law and i do recall the gentle man before coming in to defend that and i thought and successfully so the clarity is not whether you were not inside the dojs office but you have left me with the impression you are avoiding answering directly senator harris is question and if you were involved especially after i pose questions about whistleblowers in this manner you have left me with a very unsettled sense you have to answer here in writing is better because its complex but as the department of justice is involved to reach that conclusion and determination was that a process you were involved in to help reach. Ill be happy to take the question for the record and do the best i can i will say there is an opinion that is out there im not an attorney that works in the office of Legal Counsel. I did not inject myself into their deliberations steer things one way or another or to give legal advice of what that should look like happy to take the question for the record. And to address if you were involved in in these deliberations with doj. Senator do you have a followup . Thank you for everyone being here today. For planning purposes anyone wishing to submit questions for the record please do so by the close of business tomorrow thank you to everybody for being here and this meeting is adjourned thank you to everybody for being here and this meeting is adjourned. [inaudible conversations]speakeo representatives. This is an hour and a half