Live. Im bob costa, National Political reporter at the post. Im joined by senator Bernie Sanders independent, of vermont. The former democratic president ial candidate. He joins us from burlington, vermont. Thank you for being here. Sen. Sanders good to be with you. Lets cover a lot of ground. We have 30 minutes to get into some issues. First up, the pandemic. The death toll continues to rise. Aliens of americans are out of work. As a u. S. Senator, what do you want to see as the priority in the next round of legislation . Sen. Sanders the first thing we have to appreciate is how unbelievably severe and horrific the current moment is. I think you can argue we are experiencing that is unprecedented in the modern history of this country. When you look at 80,000 people already having died from the virus, and you look at 30 Million People having lost their jobs. The first thing we have to to do as a nation and a congress is say, in the midst of this terrible crisis, nobody in america is going to go hungry. Everybody in america is going to have the health care they need. We are going to do what many of the European Countries are doing and that is guaranteeing every American Worker continues to ,eceive his or her paycheck they have to make sure we get money into the pockets of the American People at this time when so many people are hurting. That is number one. Number two, i would hope that we use this moment to take a hard look at how we got to where we are today. How does that happen . The wealthiest country in the history of the world. We have a Health Care System in which your health care is tied to your employment. 30 Million People lose their jobs. Any millions of those people are also losing many millions of those people are also losing their health care. Does that make sense to anybody . Whether you are working, whether you are young, rich or poor, health care is a human right. Not an employee benefit. When we talk about how we got to where we are and the desperation that so many people are seeing in this country, we have to ask ourselves, what kind of an economy do we have when even in good times of a couple months ago, unemployment, three or 4 , half the people are living paychecktopaycheck. Once those paycheck stop, they find themselves in desperation and actual hunger. What kind of an economy is that . For now, senator sanders, we have a republican president in the white house. What is your assessment of his response . Sen. Sanders i think it has been atrocious. I think it has cost thousands of lives. Australia, new zealand and countries around the world have responded. Trump from day one underplayed the dangers the coronavirus he did not use the defense production act to make sure our doctors and nurses were given the protective equipment they needed. He is coming up with one . Theory after one theory after another. What we have got to be doing now is making sure we have a massive amount of testing to determine what people have the virus. Who does not. Who is immune, having had the virus. Figure out how we protect to the one third of americans who are older or have preexisting conditions, who are very vulnerable to either dying or becoming seriously ill because of the pandemic. Matter whether the waitress or the waiter may have the virus. Dont have to worry about that. We have to figure out how in a sensible and scientific way we make sure workplaces all over this country are safe. An enormous amount of work to be done. Unfortunately, we have a president who lies all the time. A president who does not believe in science. Congress is going to have to pick up the slack for the responsibility of this president. To that point, would you advise democrats against cutting a deal on liability with leader mcconnell . Sen. Sanders the issue right now is not liability. The reissue the issue right now is to make sure people in america do not go hungry. The issue right now is to make sure people are not evicted from their apartments, whether they lose their homes, whether their Credit Scores are destroyed. We are in the worst economic moment right now. Since the great depression. Congress has got to say, how do we move immediately, tomorrow, to make sure every person in two has thes Financial Resources they need. Massivee when we have income and wealth inequality, low income and workingclass people are forced to put their lives on the line to get a paycheck to feed their families, i find it grossly immoral. For my republican colleagues and the president to say, what we have to do is we have to we do not have to worry about those people. If we have any sense of morality as a nation, we have to worry about the 20 of children in this country who face hunger. The older people who are isolated. That has to be our set of priorities. Ck used the phase qua theories, are you frustrated at all with the Coronavirus Task for . Are they doing enough to provide a full scope of this pandemic and also challenging President Trump . Sen. Sanders people like found she i think are doing a great job like dr. Fauci are doing a great job. You have other people who are intimidated by a president based on some recent remarks, i do not think he understands what the functioning of testing is about. I would hope that all of those around the president who understand science have the courage to speak up and do the right thing. He clearly, he has an intimidating effect not only on the task force but the entire United States senate and the Republican Leadership there. What we need now is a call for morality and a call for science. How do you open up the economy in a way that is safe . That is the question we have to be abating. What should the role of billionaires be in this crisis . Sen. Sanders i think as a nation, we have got to ask ourselves, whether we are satisfied with an economy in which we have seen in recent years the billionaire class become much richer while we have a half a Million People today who are homeless, who are sleeping in shelters. Dysfunctionala childcare system. We have in many parts of this country, Public Education that is failing the children. The issue is not just the billionaires. An issue is the nature of economy in which three people own more wealth in the bottom half of american society. Almost half of all new income goes to the top 1 . I would hope in the midst of crisis, withented so few having so much and so many having so little, that we are comfortable being the only major country on earth not to guarantee health care to all people as a human right. That we are comfortable with our educational system that fails little children in child care programs but also causes massive debt to people who do nothing more then go to college and graduate school and go to and get a decent education. Now is the time in the midst of this crisis if there is any sober lining to be thinking about what kind of medical we want in our future, what kind of signs of society we went to live in. You are talking about a rethinking on a domestic front. What about on fours on foreign pot that on Foreign Policy . Should this pandemic have us rethinking policy toward china . Sen. Sanders we should be rethinking our relationship to the entire world. Donald trump blames everybody for every problem other than himself. He has been a very divisive force in american society. He blames the undocumented, the africanamericans, the muslims. You name it, he will blame somebody. Now he is blaming china. On chinas record in terms of the coronavirus, undermining the reality of what has happened is very problematic. Very wrong. Right now, what we have got to do as a world is understand that if this plandemic cash pandemic if the virus has taught us anything, we have to end the blame game. We have to figure out how we work with countries all over the world. Not only in coming up with a vaccine and treatment for this pandemic and that is what the world should be cooperating about and it is unbelievable to me we have a president who cut funding for the world health organization, cut funding or is part of an effort to create an International Program to develop a vaccine. Unbelievable that he would do that. But it goes beyond that. It goes to the foot that at the fact that as a world right now, we are spending trillions of dollars on weapons of destruction. President who deprives when 70 people are suffering, and weight want to think it is important people all over the world have health care and education and decent housing rather than more weapons of destruction. That is the lesson i would learn from this moment. I am struck by your framing of the future you want to see. Societal change, fundamental change. Think ahead to january 2021. If Vice President biden is in the oval office, if you are seeing that kind of change, will you pressure him if he has president on health care to pursue more than a public option . Sen. Sanders absolutely. I am supporting joe budden. Joe biden. We have very serious this agreement on policy. His worst day, he will be 1000 times better then trump on his best day. That it is hard for me to imagine how anybody could defend the current structure of our Health Care System. Pandemic, 87 Million People uninsured or underinsured. By far the highest prices in the world for prescription drugs. We have a primary Health Care System which is way behind other countries and clearly, we had an Inadequate Public Health system in which our doctors and nurses did not even have the masks and gloves and gowns they needed to do their jobs. For all of that, we had the privilege of spending twice as much per person as any other country on earth. Now when millions of people are losing their health care, because it is attached to their jobs, it is hard to imagine anybody defending this Current System except the health care industry, which made 100 billion in profits last year. Anyone else should say this system is so dysfunctional. We need to move in a new direction. Alllieve that medicare for is a direction we have got to go. Health care is a human right. Not an employee benefit. Im going to do my best to move joe in that direction. One way we can move in that is ion the age of medicare eligibility to 55. Make sure every kid in america under 18 has health care in a simple, costeffective program. That is a popular idea. I hope joe will move in that direction. The cabin is going to matter. Who he picks matters. Who would you like to see at hhs and treasury . These positions matter when it comes to policymaking. Sen. Sanders you are absolutely right. Talkedne thing i have to joe on a couple of occasions. Trying to move in a more progressive direction. We will see the process continuing. It is not like, he has come up with some radical idea. The last poll eyes saw, the overwhelming jodey of overwhelming majority of people support health care as a human right. The majority of American People believe you have got to rebuild our cut our crumbling infrastructure. You have to make it easier for workers to join unions. These are not radical ideas. These ideas are popular and are good public policy. All i would say is i hope very much that joe will take a hard look at some of the leading progressives in this country. We all know their names. Familiarr, i am not with who you see as those names. Sen. Sanders i think you do. Im going to get an email saying, why didnt you mention me . Preview ofa little what is on your mind. Sen. Sanders the house progressive caucus, youre going to find john paul is one of the chairs. You have a whole lot of strong progressives. We have aggressives and a dented states the United States senate. What you need to bring into the cabinet is not only people who want the progressive ideology but people who have the experience of interacting with workingclass people who understand that now is the time to tell the billionaire class, to tell the 1 that this economy is going to change. That it cannot be based on greed and selfishness. That we need to create a cooperative economy were all of our people do well. Not just the people on top shade have you given him the same kind of advice on a running mate . Sen. Sanders i really have not. That is an issue i have stayed away from. Why . Sen. Sanders that is an issue he is going to have to make. Somebody he trusts. When you are picking a running make, that is a personal decision. It is not just an ideological decision. He is who he is. He will have to make a decision picking somebody who he is comparable with. What i have been talking to him about very strongly is the need not to thevigorously moment we are in. We are hearing the pain that is out there. We are prepared to take the bold actions that are necessary right now. Unprecedented action because we are living in unprecedented moment. That is what i think joe has got to be doing. As we look to the future, we have to challenge many of the fundamental tenets that have challenged us. The basic worldview of donald trump is, the function of human life is to become a billionaire. If you have to rob, cheat, steal, lie, that is what life is about. Maybe you can make it. You will have 50 billion. Lucky you. Maybe that is one way to look at the world. The other way is to look more like what scandinavia looks like. How do we guarantee Health Care Care to all people . Do we make sure every worker in america has paid family and medical leave . How do we love our children and give them the best childcare we know we can give them, the best education we know we can give them . How do we lead the world in combating Climate Change . Sorry. I did not mean to interrupt. For one second. We are not going to get into a name game. We have got a lot of emails about biden and warren. How would you see that . A lot of liberals and progressives have written about that. Sen. Sanders i think she would be a great choice. If that is somebody that biden feels comfortable about. Said, it is a very personal decision. Married, like getting but it is somebody youre going to have to feel very comfortable with. A lot of that is personal chemistry. A couple other things on the campaign. Vice President Biden has worried the president will try to delay the election. You share that concern . Sen. Sanders when it comes to trump, it is impossible to relate anything. I do not believe that donald trump is a very strong believer in democracy. I think he is guided by his own personal that is in this case, to get reelected or to enrich his own family. I trust him not at all. Rememberant to do is you remember this as well. A month ago over so, we had an election in wisconsin. Some of us said, this is not a good idea. Other states were postponing their elections. Republicans in wisconsin were hellbent on holding the election. Last i heard, dozens of people were made ill. What we are trying to do in the congress is locate the necessary money that is needed to help states provide paper ballots that will be needed for november. Nobody knows what the country is going to look like healthwise. At the very least, everybody in this country should have the right to vote by paper ballot. That is what we have to move toward. Sanders, a former Senate Staffer tara reid has accused Vice President biden of sexual assault. What is your view of the Vice President s response . Sen. Sanders look, we have fought for many years to try to create a climate where every woman in this country who believes she was harassed or assaulted to speak up with impunity. Tara reid has that absolute right. As you know, joe biden has vigorously denied that charge. People have to listen to his statement as well. Sense. It makes common the media have to do its job as in an independent way of investigating her claims. That is about all i can say. Should the Vice President provide full access to his papers at the university of delaware or elsewhere . Sen. Sanders i just think the media have to do its job. I know the Washington Post has looked into it. The New York Times has looked into it. American people have to make their decisions. The media is always looking for more information. Sen. Sanders i do not know enough about it kid with about it. What the pluses and minuses are. Are you saying . We are on skype. We are doing our best. Sen. Sanders i know. Usually i am always confronting you in the hallways and you are running toward the train. Lets final few minutes, talk about your campaign. Any supporters of yours still feel demoralized by her defeat in the primary and they are skeptical of Vice President biden. You say you are a supporter but many remain skeptical. What is your message to them . Sen. Sanders let me just tell you this. I will do everything i can to defeat donald trump. Dangeroushe most president in the modern history of this country. Strongen and i have political disagreements. Everybody knows that. We competed against each other for the primary. Variety ofvote for a reasons and i did not. He has the delegates. He will in every likelihood become the nominee. Say towant to progressives and workingclass people all over this country, understand that we have come a very long way in recent years. Now mainstream ideas. Whether it is health care as a human right, guaranteeing every american a job at a decent wage. We are raising that wage to 15 an hour. Giving student debt forgiving student debt. Understanding what a major exam shall threat Climate Changes to our planet. At the end of the day, what is most important is changing political consciousness because when the American People at the Grassroots Level one something, politicians will follow. Somebody like joe biden right now. Hourelieves in a 15 an minimum wage. Joe believes in creating millions of jobs, rebuilding the infrastructure. Joe believes in making it easier for workers to join unions. I think you are going to see him coming out strongly with fairly progressive ideas on Climate Change. We have come a long way. What we should be proud of is the young people of this country and i am talking about 20yearold. Im talking about 35, 50 or under. Consistent with what we have been fighting for. During the campaign for whatever reason, i did not do well with older people. That is a fact. Even in most states where we lost, we did well with young people. I think the future is with our ideas about a more just society. About not having the income and wealth inequality we have. That health care and education and housing and Retirement Security are human rights. To the have to stand up dispossessed, to the undocumented and the. And the minorities. I am lost. I am disappointed. I want people to know that because of the grassroots activists, the millions of doors we knocked on and the phone because we made, we are changing america in a fundamental way and we have got to continue going. What i said when i suspended my we certainly do not suspend the movement. The Grassroots Movement must continue. It will continue. We will transform this country. You have said you have come a long way. Withaid you struggled older voters. Go so struggled with africanamerican voters. Do you believe older voters and africanamerican voters were rejecting your ideas or where ing your view of your own electability . Sen. Sanders i do not know the answer to that. One of the things that our opponents as you know, many millions of dollars in super pac money was spent against us. One of the arguments against us was that bernie cannot defeat trump, which i think was false to be honest with you. But i think older people, the word democratic socialism makes them a little bit nervous. In terms of the africanamerican community, among younger africanamericans, we did very well. Think we can argue about why whatat is the left in does the left in this nation need to do to build a Better Coalition with africanamerican voters . Sen. Sanders i do not know the answer to that. I found something very interesting. If my memory is correct, there was an exit poll in mississippi. I did very badly in mississippi. The exit poll showed a majority of the people in mississippi support medicare for all. Their Health Care System is a disaster. What we have got to do is connect candidates not just candidates running for president. Actively supporting a number of candidates running for state congress and state legislator. What we have to do is connect aviews, our ideology about government that works for all with good articulate candidates. Want to thing, do you run for president again . Sen. Sanders i think the likelihood is very slim. I think next time around, you are going to see another candidate carrying the progressive banner. So there is a chance you could run . You did not fully close the door. Sanders lets not stop lets stop worrying about what is going to have been four years from now. I think it is very unlikely i will be running for president again. Right now, the focus not only of progressives not only of democrats but independents, moderate republicans has got to be how we come together to defeat this very dangerous president who is in the office right now. Senator sanders, thank you for speaking with me. We appreciate your time this morning. Sen