Transcripts For CSPAN2 House Rules Hearing On Creating Coronavirus Committee 20240713

The meeting will come to order. First of all i think when the first actions of the committee is we are going to take over the roles and Means Committee to make this a rules committee but first let me say that i appreciate, wanted to say this from the beginning i appreciate the flexibility of our Ranking Member mr. Cole. Im incredibly proud of how we have worked together here in this congress. We have examined a lot of things in the committee and no matter how politically alike we are doing things in the constructive when and i look forward to working with you mr. Cole in a bipartisan effort that was announced today and we will examine how congress can better adapt to the emergencies of the coronavirus pandemic pandemic. I know we both care deeply about this institution in one way or another congress is going to have to adapt to whatever the future may bring. The cdc said this fall could be worse than what we are going to right now. And we need to be prepared and that may mean working remotely. Changes when we operate should be done whenever possible in a bipartisan collaborative way and i know we can get there together but i really believe that maintaining the status quo is not an option. Let me turn to matter at hand. Today we are considering the measure to stand up to House Select Committee of the Coronavirus Crisis. In the u. S. Alone thereve been 840,000 confirmed cases and as we speak more than 45,000 lives lost. And more than 22 million initial unemployment claims in just the past four weeks. Some have lost as many jobs in last month as they did during the worst year of the great recession. These arent just numbers on a page for this virus has touched every community in the nation affecting her neighbors, our families and their friends. Congress has responses with lamb provided over 2 trillion of emergency relief. We need to make sure these dollars are being well spent and that means saving lives rooting out fraud fighting for all our Small Businesses and that is just what the select committee will do. Before i turn to our Ranking Member i want to ask congresswoman and our good friend mark decided continues his recovery. We hear from his staff for these anxious to get back pretty look forward to welcoming him back here just as soon as he is able. As all of you may know congressman matsui has served on the committee previously including the opening days of this congress and her insight and leadership will be viable as we continue our work. Having said that im happy to turn to our Ranking Member mr. Cole for his remarks. With me start with a couple of remarks and i first joined you obviously been in sending our best wishes to our good friend and we hope he is back. We are pleased with their placement that was chosen of course but we all want mark back and working with us. Hes a valuable member and a very good friend to everybody here. I want to also thank you mr. Chairman for your kind words. We dont always agree on every issue or the nature of this business but youve been forthright and i appreciate the manner in which you have worked with us and included us at a very difficult time with changing decisions of having to adjust this committee. I appreciate your leadership and i appreciate your friendship. Without mr. Chairman todays hearing is on speaker pelosis proposed select committee on the coronavirus pandemic. Earlier this months bigger pelosi announced she would create such a select committee conveniently ignored that and committee has to be established to the rules committee predicted the rules committee is being asked to essentially retroactively rubberstamp the actions for this is particularly egregious considering up until an hour ago we had absolutely no details but the speaker gave our side though not as if the plans and no indication of rationale or vision ends frankly radio silence since the announcement except for the occasional media mention. This is not the way to operate on something they want to do in a bipartisan fashion. I will also say mr. Chairman im not sure what the goal of such the committee will be paid the speaker claims the select committee will examine all aspects of the federal response of the coronavirus pandemic and will prove provide oversight for federal dollars being spent on the spot that congress has significant oversight tools at our disposal. The cares act established a fivemember Congressional Oversight Commission specifically for this purpose. They note my good friend from florida representative shillelagh is the house majoritys designee on that commission. This commission is in addition to congress as other oversight tools which include the House Committee on oversight and reform and the oversight subcommittee that exists on most other permanent House Committees. Off already have a separate Oversight Commission specifically for the cares act and we are to have a separate oversight and Reform Committee and we have separate Oversight Committees and what is the actual purpose of the proposed committee . My fear mr. Chairman is this new select committee will simply turn into another partisan witch hunt under the Trump Administration but i hope im wrong. Either way i can think of better uses of our time and our resources given how my choker site already exists over funds appropriated appropriate in the care sector there may be a time in the futura make sense to establish a Commission Like the 9 11 commission and review the covid19 pandemic and the government response. It needs to be bipartisan and devoted to what happened when it happened and what we can learn from it to improve government response in the future. The partisan select committee does not meet that test and without mr. Chairman i yield back trace. Thank you very much and i neglected in the inning to mention dr. Monahan the attending physician is present in the audience today. There he is. And father conroy is here as well. We feel where a specially protected here. I wanted to read the instructions on following the guidance but i was using face governor speaking in stage 616 of partys Hand Sanitizer dont shake hands or brace folks and respect social distancing guidelines. I point that out because we all have to get used to the new instructions here and its important not just for the safety of members but also the staff and the sonographers and others who are here supporting us. I want to thank the Ranking Member for his comment and are there any other members wishing to testify . I see one. You may take your seat. This is new to me. Mr. Jordan we are delighted you are here and anything in writing will be entered into the record and we now recognize the gentleman from ohio mr. Jordan for any remarks he wishes to make. I want to thank you and the Ranking Member and your entire committee for being here. I think it sends a good signal to the mac and people that congress is back doing their business. We have all kinds of Task Force Meetings around the country in various states but it seems to me the task force that is supposed to look at the big issues that confront our issues is the United States congress so its good to see the Committee Process back and functioning this evening. I am strongly opposed to the select committee mr. Chairman. There are currently to pick up where the Ranking Member just was eight different oversight processes in place as we speak. First is the Ranking Member mentioned you have the Oversight Committee. Who has the broadest jurisdiction of any committee in congress and in fact the legislation which we just got to read 50 minutes ago creates a select committee within the jurisdiction of the Oversight Committee. Second is the Ranking Member mentioned you have committees of jurisdiction and the various subcommittees to oversight on those committees the energy and Commerce Committee the Small Business committee of the Financial Services committee. Third, the Ranking Member mentioned the cares act itself creates an Oversight Commission and two of her colleagues have been made to that congressman shall a lot shalala and congressman hill. You have the Accountability Committee within the Inspector General. And we have a fourth oversight process currently in place and fifth Inspector Generals developed an agency of jurisdiction here. We are to know they are operating Inspector General health and Human Services and health and Human Services have released reports about the Pandemic Response effort and sixth the cares act establishes a special Inspector General. Seventh, 20 million was appropriated in the cares act, the gao for hiring experts to look at how the money is being spent and finally you have the ftc, the department of justice who are already looking at the potential. They have already found people trying to fraudulently get access to taxpayer money designed to help families and Small Business owners. A different oversight processes in place as we speak that the democrat said nope, thats not enough. We need a ninth could we need a ninth. Why . The first eight are good enough for me tonight and the answers will exactly what the Ranking Member said. The first eight are designed to protect taxpayer dollars in a ninth is political. The ninth is going to look out for the democrats candidate for President Joe Biden because who the speaker announces going to be the chairman . The guy who won the nomination for joe biden in South Carolina or colleague mr. Clyburn. That is what this is about and is the Ranking Member and this is just one more attempt by the democrats to go after the president , one more chance for them to attack the president in an Election Year and the biggest supporter of the democrat nominee as the chairman of this direct committee where we already have a different oversight russ is in place doing the work of the american taxpayer. Remember their first big hearing was Michael Cohen and that we have the whole trump fresh investigation and we have them all investigation and then the impeachment of here we go in an Election Year in the summer could we know what these hearings will look like this fall could help the big hearings seem to take place in this room. They will be calling in all kinds of people for defense so i strongly oppose Ranking Member i strongly oppose this legislation and i hope it doesnt go to the for tomorrow to help it doesnt pass. If thank you for giving me the opportunity to speak today and i yield back. You mentioned the Inspector General is a way for us to keep account of what is going on here. The president signing statement basically said he wasnt going to allow allow the Inspector Generals report to congress but let me just say this. We are talking about 2 trillion, 2 trillion, and i think we are already getting questions from our constituents as to whether or not its being issued properly as to whether or not its going were supposed to go. I mean i dont think that there are people out there whether they are democrats or republicans who have a hard time understanding the importance of making sure we get this right. I think every member of this institution both democrats and republicans have an interest in making sure this critical lifesaving money that we have appropriated is being administered properly and being spent effectively and where it will do the most good so i thank the gentleman and i gild to my colleague from a home mr. Cole for any questions or comments that he has. C thank you very much. New technology. Thank you mr. Chairman. I agree frankly with what he has to say and for the life of me i cant understand why six existing committees and subcommittees cant do this task. That is their job. They do it well. My friends ask a control all of those committees so the need for this strikes me as extraordinarily superfluous and i see more opportunities for mischief here than i do for legitimate oversight. I have a hard time again understanding why we dont trust our colleagues whose responsibility this is to engage in it routinely on the whole friday of france. No questions for my friend pretty just want to express my appreciation for him showing up in making the points that he did and with that mr. Chairman and i yield back. Thank you very much. Mr. Torres. Thank you mr. Chairman. The only thing you have to fear is fear itself because if the fear is Strong Enough they can immobilize you. And it can leave you paralyzed. Some people say that fear is the strongest emotion and because of that fdr said this in 1933. He was talking about the economic depression. Depression scale worse such as the savings paradox. I think the fear of oversight here really means is that we dont care who has access to this money because we have seen it in a last bill. Who got access to the money . It was intended for the poor working business community, the poor working Small Businesses that were robbed of their opportunity to do right by their employees. They were robbed because of greed, tremendous greed. On behalf of banks who stood to benefit bigger bonuses if a fasttrack a bigger payout so they left the little guy behind. My personal interest is not necessarily oversight of how we direct the money or help banks choose to steal the money or how greed could impact the rich. I am also interested in seeing how local governments spend taxpayer dollars. We have all seen it. Public corruption, that corrupts every level of government. I am interested in seeing and having oversight on how some hotels like the hotel at the fairplex in my hometown of the mona the only hotel in my city to be turned into a covid hotel close to the most vulnerable people. This was five days after the state in the county were looking to spend send these poor Homeless People to a dilapidated building adjacent to the police and fire station near our courthouses. I am interested in oversight on every single penny that we spend. Unlike many of you i sent my irs payment prior to april 15 which by the way was cashed four days later. I only wish that my constituents who are hurting right now were able to get a return on their loan requests within four days. So i support this measure. I support people having more oversight. Oversight is good and you should not fear oversight and with that i will yield back trades to make thank you very much. Mr. Woodall. Thank you mr. Chairman. I want to say how good it is to see folks here in the hearing room and thank you for continuing to convene us and engage on those issues such as the continuity of Congress Even as the doors may have been close. Our minds are still focused on the problem at hand that i want to tell you how much i appreciate it. I actually missed you believe it or not rate. To mr. Jordans point i do think we perform better together. Think everybody has something to add and you see mr. Morelli because he is a top dais member in ms. Shalala and outside of this larger room. This is a matter of rules Committee Jurisdiction in mr. Chairman i do want to put you on the spot because we just saw this an hour ago and you saw this an hour ago but you are the best that we have in terms of the Oversight Committee expert. I have only served one term on the Oversight Committee. How many years did you serve on the Oversight Committee . I have served six terms. Actually longer. To ms. Torres point i do think fraudulent actors go to where the money is and this is where the money is right now so i absolutely think we have to redouble our efforts to make sure that these dollars are wasted. I am looking at one of the select subcommittees authorized to do but i could not find anything or any list of mandates that i did not think the Oversight Committee already had the ability to do and i wanted to ask you about a couple of those. The committee is authorized to investigate the efficiency effectiveness and the equity and transparency of the taxerpayer funds use and relief programs to address the coronavirus. Would that be the Oversight Committees jurisdiction already . Isherwood with the in the seven other entities that i reference in my opening statement. If its authorized to investigate reports of waste fraud abuse pricegouging and other abusive practices related to the coronavirus would that be under the Oversight Committees jurisdiction also . Yes i would. The implementation of any federal law implied applied or inactive in the Coronavirus Crisis . Same answer. In full response to the Coronavirus Crisis including the planning for an implementation of testing containment mitigation and surveillance . Amen. I can go on. There are four, five or six more items here including any other issues related to the Coronavirus Crisis given your five terms on the committee to can you and sir an Extraordinary Program in the programs that we have set up in response of the coronavirus as we have never seen it in our lifetime. Do you see gaps in the Oversight Committees jurisdiction that do need to be plugged and does his this is language not plug them . We have complete authority on the broadest jurisdiction of any committee in Congress Really should look into all these concerns as they come up. That is our job and is well as the other entities i talk about the eight entities doing the work of the taxpayer but somehow democrats think we need a night. It seems the night is the work of joe biden. Thats the big decision. Section 3c says the select subcommittee may not hold a markup of legislation. I dont serve on any committees or subcommittees that dont mark up legislation. Where the legislators of the legislative and is that something that is common in the Oversight Committee that folks investigate but have no ability to legislate . No. I dont know who the author about languages and again we are the committee of original jurisdiction and youre the only committee we have had come to testify so i dont mean to put you on the spot. It says here in section 2b each member appointed to a select subcommittee shall be treated as though they are a member of the committee on oversight and reform for purposes of the select subcommittee. Will the subcommittee be comprised of members of the Oversight Committee or is there some sort of special status member that serves on the subcommittee but doesnt serve on the Oversight Committee . Well, the short answer is i dont know. I dont know that any of us know but the answer is probably not read there probably will be people of the select committee and the Oversight Committee because i think the speaker of the house has announced the chairman is and our colleague mr. Clyburn a couple of times. We all know for sure that he hasnt been appointed yet but they some of the speaker said it looks like you will be someone who is not currently on the Oversight Committee and will they be on the Oversight Committee when their name by the speaker . I guess but i dont know how that actually functions. Thinking about the breadth of oversight and an extraordinary amount of money going out the door, it references here in the bill that members of this committee will not have committee against them for purposes of the cat on how many committees they conserve on. Youve been on the Oversight Committee for five terms and it strikes me the job of this magnitude doesnt need to be somebodys parttime job. Needs to be a fulltime responsibility. This is in the resolution itself and it will not be a fulltime responsibility and the fact youll keep all the responsibilities you have in congress and this will be an addon. Rep. Jim is been said by you and Ranking Member, we are talking about 3 trillion here already. We do need oversight. As one of your colleagues said earlier, the vast majority of what i spend my time doing on behalf of the citizens of the district of ohio and the taxpayers of ohios oversight. I know we have eight different entities working on oversight. We can do this, but for some reason the democrats, and theyve already made this before the cares active in past which created a subcommittee and select and put the democrats nominate in the presence or likely nominee the presence, and his supporter of that chair committee. That strikes me is political. I dont think it takes a genius to see that printed so that is my concern. Let these other eight entities lets let them do their job because we need oversight. A package this big, after this bill passes, and the president signs it, were talking 3 trillion of americans hard earned tax money. I definitely want oversight. But i dont want political. Rep. Rob it is not fair to answer for this language but i do think and getting those answers, is this better to have this is a subcommittee, as opposed to a full one. I dont know why that decision has been made but i think it is worth talking about. If its important enough to create an act on legislation, it is been specifically prohibited. I am not sure why this is an add on for members so they keep all of their other assignments and then do this as a hard time evening job. But why have not we taken folks, as we have an opportunity to do and focus them on something again to this. This gargantuan undertaking to contract these dollars and make sure that they are accountable in the way that we would like for them to be. I think of this effort, this oversight effort, that is mr. Jordan is here to oppose subcommittee the demand that oversight be vigorous and aggressive if and it strikes me as my friend would say, as strange. That this bipartisan goal that we have to do this oversight we cannot have moved forward in a bipartisan way. Given that this may be the only hearing, the only conversation the members have at the committee level, i put that to you for your consideration. Mr. Jordan, again i thank you for coming and being in our sole jurisdictional experts here. I yelled back. Business or to the gentlemens question the way we are approaching the speechs, we give this up and running more quickly and efficiently and fast. One thing, as to why we need all of the oversight necessary. I would ask unanimous consent an article from nbc news that trump pushes back against congressional oversight for 500 billion bailout fund. And from a political, trump removes independent watchdog for coronavirus, oversight panel. Also unanimous consent but in the record, trump said he will not comply with key transparent measures in the coronavirus bill. And just so that my friends dont say this is the president s statements for out of context, they also want to assure that the record of the statement by the president , on the cares act which he makes it explicitly clear, that he wants to undermine the key component oversight. This is an interesting conversation on the Oversight Committee or what committee. It is all fine and nice but i will say to the average person who is watching or following this what they care about is the fact that trillions of dollars hardearned dollars that have been appropriated to help alleviate the suffering that this pandemic is caused to deal with our economy they will make sure that it isnt is going to wear is supposed to be going and spent properly this what this is all about making of these other arguments but i think thats what we need to focus on. Can i as my friend from colorado to yield for just one moment. I just want that be the final world mr. Chairman. I dont believe there will be a personal, or someone who opposes to this vigorous oversight. If you just listed all of those articles that you are asked to enter into the record. It is the question why is it so controversial. Rep. Jim your goal is to be efficient and effective in my question is, why set up a brandnew subcommittee more efficient than using the one we already have. Why, setting up a brandnew one. I appreciate the gentlemens question. I will refrain my time. I want to address a couple of three things. First i want to address the fact that the chairman is wearing a mask, with the new England Patriots on it and really kind of gets the problem. Rep. Rob not serious been to kind of serious pretty first one, is the need for some kind of proxy voting here. In a moment when the country is in the midst of a pandemic, which requires quarantine many individuals, places a couple of the members of this committee at risk for us to be here today. And it is disappointing that we are not addressing that today. With the salt air and so i would urge my chairman and might Ranking Members who act on this as quickly as possible. To address it in a way that covers the con current pandemic and future pandemics. Not to just limited to this moment today. So that some future congress can continue to operate in a setting that were in. It is an important issue and i know our leadership is looking at it. I asked them to look at it asap. Another point i want to address, mr. Jordan and i were elected at the same time. Within friends for a long time. We disagree on a lot of things we do agree on some things. I couldnt disagree with you more today my friend. Because, in this instance, the facts are just so overwhelming, i dont care if you have 100 Oversight Committees, they are not going to be able to match what we face today. We are looking at tens of thousands of people dead. From this virus and multiples of that hospitalized and hundreds of thousands of people today infected. We cannot even and we have not gotten our arms around how much the losses are. And worse estat sustaining every and will for some time in the different kinds of things that will be needed to address it. Weve invested big sums of money which in my opinion are nothing compared to the losses we have sustained as a nation and across the globe. We need to have oversight that look at our Health Healthcare systems, and businesses and people who get the assistance, when they get it, where they get it, why they get it, how they get it. I was going to talk about benghazi in the Oversight Committee and the length of time and all of the that you all went into that i thought were misguided. Im not going there. I want to, this mask is difficult because i must not wear it properly but, to take issue with the leader of this, the chair, and estate only that it is political, i would just disagree to the a degree with my friend jordan jim has been a leader in this congress for decades. Somebody we all respect, somebody who we all trust as intellect and his ability to articulate. And to the degree hands of taking a position in some fashion or another in the Oversight Committee. I would say that only helps your Oversight Committee did so this committee is going to be essential just as all of the others are. This is also big. I wish it were so big. But its bigger than anything for you and i have had her had to contend with. So i appreciate the gentlemans response on that. And certainly the mayor. I respect him as well in a service over the years but i also respect the woman who has been picked by the speaker for commission that is designed already in the we act that week voted on. To look at this issue. Ive said several times now. We have eight different entities looking on this. [inaudible]. Rep. Ed perlmutter i said we can have 100, all of them working well in a coordinated fashion. They still dont match what we are facing today mr. Jordan. That is the difference i think you have this committee with the talents, of a former hhs secretary, the child of a leader like jim. Who all of us recognize as a leader is the least that we can do as members of congress for the people we represent and with that i yelled back. Thank you and welcome. When a different location ive never been on oh Committee Like this. I can see why they like this room so much. It is really very well appointed. Did you want to finish a thought that you were trying to articulate the gentleman from colorado read. No. Rep. Ed perlmutter i think it is obvious that we have an identity to look through it. I think the seven Different Committees that we are looking at it. Its not the oversight that we desperately need every agency, as part of our government. We need it for. That is why we have the Oversight Committee. We have people, agencies look at all of these things print everything. I think people see it for what it is. Ive made that point several times. We do have an oversight subcommittee. I think of the phenomenal opportunity that we have in real time. To look at while we just passed big bill, with finally got it across the finish line this one. The president signed it, it was in june of june 2019 precinct must be for this crisis. So is this thing started to evolve. I could not get anyone of our subcommittee interested to have a hearing, realtime oversight hearing. We just had a big bill that had a lot of money in it. If we get it right. And now have a realtime test going on. It wouldve been a perfect opportunity to look at things like this National Stockpile but a perfect time to look at the role of the things and coordinating the response and we did not do it. It wouldve been a perfect time to talk about the test issues because by the middle of february, there were some problems that were emerging and is february were on and got into march, it looked more and more apparent. Why not do an oversight hearing. Why not because the cdc delivered via your committee, they did. You had two days of hearing but the congressman, and dino waited. We had a ticket or hearing on tobacco printed been hearing on horse racing. We do not see the necessity of this thing that was hearing or staring us in the face. The least you and your oversight, you had the foresight to have todays of what i saw in the right place on cspan later in the evening, work pretty intense and involved hearings. Rep. Michael burgess so certainly we think your committee for doing that work. Our subcommittee done lorna which we head. I dont think that history will look kindly on the fact that number one, technology and Health Committee in the United States congress could see its way to do any realtime oversight of a problem that was current. The thing that bothers me about this more than anything else, if i understand you carthy mr. Jordan the makeup of this committee will not be, it will be 12 members and it will be in at 55 division on a 66 division. The above sized power for the committee. I remember this happening in 2009 and theres a lot a discussion about, we noted the commission to investigate. The great recession. Just like in the 1930s when they investigated the banking the font down the economy, the south a new commission. It was a seven five division. Nobody remembers what that select committee came up with because it was partially partisan divide as a consequence, it really did not accomplish anything read if this were as serious efforts, they could assist for the proposition, and that the chairmanship be chaired by the Top Republican in the top to prevent and if you are serious about getting to the bottom of it, i think that is what you would do. If your idea was to have a political theater, then you do exactly what is happening today. I cant really add much more than the gripping crossexamination from the gentleman in georgia, mr. Lavelle usually did a magical job but again, this committee does not have anything with the volume of oversight that is already available to us as members of the United States house representatives. Youve articulated for a well. We have the capability already. We had another committee to come up to the conclusion that will be good for the news cycle been bonded to be helpful. For anyone who wants to go back and historically look at this and learn the lessons because it certainly, we didnt seem interested at the time to make that judgment. I will be happy to yield as well. Rep. Jim i wish that the subcommittees of the various Standing Committees energy and commerce, Financial Services, Small Business committee, i wish those Oversight Committees were here meeting now along with the full Oversight Committee doing the oversight we are supposed to do in exercising the appropriate social distancing and doing our job. For goodness sake, theyre all kinds kinds of people have been working the entire weeks at six weeks during the first responders, the truckers hauling the food, everyone else doing their jobs. We are doing it right here right now. So those Oversight Committees should be right here looking at these. We had hearings before we took this long break. That was is what we should be doing but thats not what this is. We know that is not what this is. Different committees nothing at this already but no we need a grade because the knife is going to be focus on and we will know is going to focus on. I think the American People know it as well. I appreciate your testimony. I just want to say for the record, i hate to break it to them but less so i checked there were more democrats in the house than republicans. And i think there republican colleagues on the subcommittee will be happy the ratio is not like ours in the rules committee. But either way, have that they work as well as we do working together to try to advance the Critical Role of the select committee. Rep. Jim jordan and im interested and if you want to create a select committee that is not a political theater that has to be equally divided. Was that political theater. Remember there was a seven five split printed in favor of the republicans. So just point that out for the record. I would be happy to yield with the gentleman from georgia. Though more recently, when the last republican speaker of the house. The select committee on the budget, and on labor, it was in fact, and equally divided Republican Democratic Committee Even though republicans had a vast majority and when speaker pelosi, came to work and decided that this congress to created a select committee on the modernization on the commerce g2 constituted that committee equal republican and democrats print e very much do divided on an equal basis. Actually a Different Committee actually did that. And i just point out is defined this commentary just a little bit surprising. I do have a point of order that you want to raise with you. I have not read the textual girls or guidance from the capital physician but interested you that he was recommending that all members wear a mask. It is it just members of the committee or does it include witnesses who attend printed. I think he remands that everyone wear a mask, we are not required to. But we are recommended to do so for the safety of those around us. But its not a requirement. If im wrong doctor, raise your hand. I have seen the folks from center of Disease Control as well as the presence and advisors saying that mass were recommended at public meetings. I heard a nurse emphasize this so is obviously not a sign of bravery thats where mask rated as a sign of your responsibility towards other people because when we where a mass, we are protecting others printed and when they dont wear a mask they are not protecting us. I will just leave it at that. Mr. Chairman, we need an extraordinary moment in the history of the United States of america. Today there are now 846,982 diagnosed cases of covid19. We have lost 46609 of our people. Although that number is almost certainly the undercount because in so many states, people are not counted if they died at home and were not tested. Thats around 15 times the number of people we lost on 911. It is getting up to the number of people that we lost in the entire vietnam war. President of course, promised that this is one guy from china, the hoax, coming from another party. Thank news, democratic plot. And so on. All of the nonsense that cost us precious weeks and months and trying to organize and mobilize the country to deal with this pandemic. So now here we are a couple trillion dollars later. That we are paying for the fallen and the recklessness of people at the highest levels of government. In order to throw an economic lifeline to our people made millions of him had been thrown out of work, millions of new businesses are teetering on the edge of collapse. And were spinning trillions of dollars to try to rescue the countries Public Health system in the hospitals. So the common sense suggestion counselor and said the set up a committees is used as a moneymaking operation. By the administration is trying to stall every form of our site this congress has tried to exercise from the very beginning of these administration. Will call not long ago that the president the 96 ordered the administration categorically, not to cooperate with investigative request of the committees of congress rated. Rep. Jamie raskin categorically, on to participate in subpoenas, categorically to reject congressional oversight. And i would so love to hear how my friends would have reacted if president obama had brought our country to its knees economically in Public Health and constitutionally, the way that presence has pretty can you imagine, they would be saying if we were Wearing Masks appear under president obama. Mr. Chairman, i cannot accept the counterfeit range of people upset about the fact the work creating a committee to conduct oversight of the trillions of dollars of the taxpayers money is going out the door to try to clean up after the messes created by the government. I can accept that outrage. Its counterfeit. Do you know how many investigations were launched in congress into the 2012 benghazi attack. I serve in the select committee. Annotate what rated trent 18. To have years after. Jody rep. Jamie raskin im telling you i am following the rules. Jody i walk this way because of the court reporter. [inaudible]. Rep. Jamie raskin fullys sake of our stenographer, we cannot be talking over each other. Rep. Jamie raskin how many investigations were there. There may be eight into the money that we are spending to deal with the pandemic. Not many there are eight. Rep. Jamie raskin born on the Benghazi Committee right now. The chairmans right over there. There were ten investigations conducted. Ten conducted in the 2012 benghazi attack, six of them by republicancontrolled House Committees. For interference. Oversight and government report. Jody any served on the Benghazi Committee, cost more than 6 million over two and half years because the expanded hundred 14 congress and guess what, they found that Hillary Clinton, they could not find anything wrong that Hillary Clinton done. No prosecution at all pretty millions of dollars later. But in any event, let me ask you, where we get the counterfeit operations there might be a god forbid, on committees they could do investigations into the trillions of dollars we are spending to clean up the mess of the government. Rep. Jamie raskin and the work ten investigations of benghazi. So think about that. Mr. Chairman, this president doesnt want any oversight at all. To set up the Unemployment Insurance system. I am so proud, that we are getting an extra 600 a week to are people who have been thrown out of work. Through no fault of their own. And we extended by 13 weeks and Unemployment Benefits despite the fact that they thought has never way. Every step along the way. We got that done. And we got the hundreds of billions of dollars for Small Businesses and im proud of that. We got all of that done. There was a signing ceremony. And the president signed into law and he took that occasion to try to reject the principle that there would be an Inspector General put in the Treasury Department to oversee the money given away to the Big Industries because they regarded that as their personal flesh fund. They wanted hundreds of billions of dollars that they could give away in the present actually offered that he would do his own oversight. He said he would do the oversight of that money. That was the argument he made. And he rejects the idea that we have a congressional oversight that the Inspector General has got to report to. Come on. Get serious. Get be real. This is not a money making operation to see a much money you can get away with for you and your friends. Thats not what this is. This is money to rescue the American Economy and rescue the market people, and a court we should have oversight. We should be having a lot of oversight over it. So why would they politicize this. It is most basic thing and the world that we would have oversight. I dont know. In my mind, a distraction from the fact that the president has no plan to get the country out of this. No plan at all. I waited with baited breath last thursday, he said he was coming out with his plan to reopen america. I said hello louis, i cant wait to see it. But the president s plan. It was a bunch of flabby recommendations sent out to the states. Check these out, nothing in that plan about the role of the federal government. Nothing that plan how to mobilize in district of the united to build the ppes, that were sorely lacking. Nothing about billing ventilators that american citizens need to live. Nothing about mobilizing the greatest scientists in the world to create a plan to get out of this. Nothing about National Guidelines that we can use to organize the states he would have some state governor saying theres nothing wrong, no problem, but only to have a social distancing role in the meantime the state equipping together like articles of the confederation in the northeast and the midwest and calvary sink the federal government is not doing anything else. So we will have to try to create our own coalition. We need a plan and asked the government to get us out of this nightmare. We plan. The presence offered us no plan for an state governors, was a republican, and a capable leader, has been offering by governor cuomo, in new york, and the governor of california, genoa, they say they cant do it without the federal government. So thats what we should be focused on. Instead of whining about the fact they were going to have an Oversight Committee to detect fraud and abuse and corruption in the distribution of trillions of dollars of our money. I yelled back. For sure is been crazy year can tell you that sprayed i sat in this committee, along with jim jordan and several of you in the opposite side of the aisle. We were doing impeachment. It was the last crazy thing that happened. In this Committee Room and geez, i wonder mr. Jordan, do you think that this select subcommittee is going to investigate when democrats were doing while President Trump was banning flights from china. Maybe it was impeachment for you think. I doubt they look into that. Rep. Jim jordan my guess is that committee, the democrat committees will be talking a lot like this raskin did, raving and writing and going after the the president of the united to as you pointed out, when he did suspend travel from china, the democrats and te press all complained about it. Criticizing him for the heinz senate, was a great move. Three democrats not mentioned in benghazi, which i was on the committee, they were two and half years, after the tragic took place at night. September 11th, 2012. After, the secretary of state refused to even nominate someone for the Inspector Generals position that the state department. They didnt have one. After the secretary of state told the American People that it was a video the closet and when the day after the egyptian Prime Minister when she said that we know that phil had nothing to do with it, is a plan to attack, not a protest. Two and half years after we learned the secretary of state destroyed 30000 emails. Rep. Jim jordan and you guys want to bring it up as a comparison. You have got to be kidding me. Two half years of the attorney general then nothing to look into it. Unlike mr. Bart was doing it. We learned in this committee. And you guys want to bring of benghazi. I didnt bring it up you guys did. I was going to say anything until mr. Raskin and mr. Chairman and you guys brought it up. So weve got eight and looking at this right now. But we gotta have a ninth because the nights going to do just what are calling mr. Raskin did pretty criticize the president. We know its going to happen for you pointed be hearing in Election Year, this Election Year, where we have speeches just like our good colleague and friend just gave. That is what we want to have. And we all know its. We can pretend thats not what is going to be but the iraqi people know what is happening here. Will mr. Jordan, i think you are right. And mr. Raskin here, allegation of counterfeit outrage and the rhetoric that you gave, just proves the point. It improves what we think is going to happen about this committee and the only purpose that i believe this extra Oversight Committee is another way, another venue to criticize the president of the United States. Ever since, january of 2019, i serve on three Different Committees. Homeland Security Committee and Judiciary Committee and Rural Committee and all of the committees, the rules that i have to say, has been the most civil. It seems like there is a concerted effort by my democratic colleagues, must be coming down from the leadership is my guess. That the whole purpose of this all of 2019 and into 2020 of the impeachment, was to criticize the president of the United States. It starts well with every, the people that they bring forward in the committees, and the accused customs and Border Protection officers, the childabuse and negligent homicide, enemy, it is just over the top. And some people at home, including my husband state how can you sit through this. How can you sit through this and listen to this rhetoric over and over again. And you know sometimes its truly hard. It have to admit it. And you may think im doing rhetoric but i am not being are saying outlandish things like i just heard. Mr. Raskin, i hope you see him if you dont that what you just dead, all of this rhetoric and complaining and criticizing the president , is exactly what we believe the whole purpose of this subcommittee is. Rep. Debbie lesko and you just proven the point. Mr. Jordan, do you have anything else that you would like to add. Rep. Jim jordan my guess is, the special counsel investigation which came back and said no conspiracy, no coordination, 30 million, 19 lawyers, all kinds of subpoenas, all kinds of taxpayer resources, that is a comparison that is worth noting as well. Well, lets do the oversight were supposed to do. I wish every single committee would meet, just like we are here, this room should be booked everyday. Mnes coming in and doing the oversight. I am fine with that. I have been on the Oversight Committee for a long time. I am fine with that. We should do it. Why is the Oversight Committee not meeting at right now looking at the world health organization. For goodness sake, given the american taxpayer dollars and they lied to us, my colleague from texas said it best. You have to give organizations money to lie to us. They will probably do it for free. So why not have them in here we can bring people in, we have to bring them and to have this kind of hearings, those subcommittees and Small Businesses and Financial Services, have them do the oversight. I want all of that. I think its important. Everyone does. Rep. Jim jordan but what we dont want is another Political Committee using taxpayer dollars to attack the person is 60 3m americans voted for in the democrats try to impeach just a few months ago. And that effort probably impeded our effort to deal with this virus. Rep. Debbie lesko i have one last question mr. Jordan, it looks like or authoring another 2 million in expenses for the subcommittee when we already have other things. I dont know how much is costing. If you think about it is possible that theyre going to hire outside attorneys like they did with the Judiciary Committee. Is that a normal amounts of money. I dont know. If you been on government meetings. Rep. Jim jordan we got it 15 minutes before we were walking in. So im looking for it. There were sections that stand out to me, and executive branch and external Communications Related to the Different Things is that in here. Who knows, what i know is what has happened the past three and half years. But i know is what happened prior to the president even being elected when the behind, spun into peoples foot associated with this campaign and we know is been misled because we had these Inspector General issue a report that told us that took place. Confirmed everything was suspected. The only thing that we had wrong, those who had been looking at this, based on what the Inspector General horowitz has now informed the congress and the American People. Rep. Debbie lesko thank you mr. Chair and i yelled back. To put this in perspective, due to the percentages,. 0001 percent 1 million equals 11 a half days and 1 trillion seconds equal 32000 years and thus the difference we were talking about between 1 quintillion and we are spending 2 million to oversee 2 trillion i dont think thats an extreme proposal i dont get of the topic here but i would like to eat. I first want to thank our colleagues and the staff who have heated recommendations of the scientists and the doctors that we socially distance, that we wear masks. It is the responsible thing to do. Since i appreciate everyone including our spiritual and medical leaders. I think what we are trying to do here, again by setting up the select committee is to supervise spending 3 trillion is also the responsible thing to do. It just seems insane to me, that we would not do that. And guess what, seems insane to my constituents too. Because just today, donna said, it would be nice to see through the money going to Small Businesses this time. We need real oversight. They want to know why large banks have billions in fees from the Small Business loans that we try to set up here. Packard must know why millions have gone to large corporations instead of small local businesses who can even get an appointment with their local banks printed our Disability Community what snow why parents of children with disabilities were given 36 hours to make down the fact that their children exist and if they dont get this information in, they didnt get it into the irs today, they have to wait for the stimulus check until 2021. So our constituents have a lot of questions about where the this 3 billion is going and why it is not coming into the markets. I live in pennsylvania, and the three counties that i represent, have over 16000 confirmed cases of coronavirus. We have lost 719 lives. That we know of. In the three counties that i represent. I do know what mr. Joined jordan has been doing but i sure have been sitting around. Sue and i havent either. Rep. Roive been meeting regulah our states and local officials. In the hospitals in my communities and Small Businesses and mike can community so this nonsense about not being able to rope remotely is despising i share with my frustrations that we are not addressing the need to have some kind of emergency remotes voting possibility so that we can beat responsible and can take care of our families so that we can take care of our members who cannot be here because they have preexisting conditions. Rep. Mary gay scanlon so i dont have to come from a state that is shut down because of the spy can coronavirus printed to a city that is shut down for the same reasons. That is not responsible. So i do think the select committee is that committee is the responsible thing to do. Thank you mr. Chair. Ill be very brief. I will certainly support this resolution. One of the things that i find incredibly frustrating watching from my home office in new york is continued practice of the administration which i hope will be an Anonymous Administration the course of Human History or american history. An administration that essentially feels as though it has no one to answer to. It is not believe in the oversight of the congressional article one of the constitution and the powers of oversight which have been the hallmark of this Congress Since its conception. What frustrates me is the complete desire to ignore the proper role of congress the oversight of dollars that american taxpayers pay for. I wish i could say that there were a hundred subcommittees could do the job. Or one. And my fear is that no matter what we do the administration will continue to block any desire for the market public to make sure that there is an accounting of what we do. Using this on a daily basis. I think we are all very frustrated with it. So i will continue to support this. When that respected the rule of law, respect to the constitution, in respect to the things that we have all agreed for centuries, if the providence of the United States house of representatives and the senate and when that goes away, we essentially have nothing. I often say to people that when i take a 5dollar bill out of my pocket i havent have one. There is an agreement among all of us as to what that 5 can purchase. Five dollars with of goods and services. Rep. Joseph morelle the truth is that its a piece of paper. We all agreed that is a common agreement printed that is how the world works. We have to have rules and laws to abide by or else there is nothing. And the decision by the president to continue to undermine the role of the congress in oversight and the role of the congress and doing his constitutional obligations and its responsibility, is very frustrating. I appreciate the witness, i appreciate his intentions which i assume are good. I appreciate his passion about this but what i failed to see working as people concerned not with whether it is republican or democrat or whether or not is somebody you agree with or disagree with but an agreement by all of us, that the article one obligations and responsibilities and duties to the Congress Must be upheld. Because the next president , mr. Jordan, may not agree with. That is the next president thinks the same that this president does not is above the law does not have to respond to the congress does not have to respond to Inspector Generals in his own administration, or have to give anybody confirmed by the United States senate because everyone in the administration is acting. Then the next president they take that view, we will all have to answer for it. The American Public will have to answer for it. And we will be left with nothing. Is simply a piece of paper and if we although it agreed to support it and all agree that article one powers have real meaning and have and are there to protect the interest of the emergent people i will support this. I pray that somehow somewhere, on the other end of pennsylvania avenue, there will be a glimmer of understanding of what the framers meant when they put these powers oversight responsibilities in the hands of the United States congress. Summa quick comment. This administration and this president , is white House Counsel testified over 30, his white House Counsel, has over 30 hours in front of the special counsel. His son testified for over 20 hours in front of the Senate Intelligence committee. This idea that theyre not cooperating. Not allowing, we had the whole Mueller Investigation is where this took place. And if good, heres an image money and everything else, is over 30 million, 22 months. He was 19 lawyers. So i just, i appreciate the general months, and the need for the congress to do oversight. 100 percent in favor of that. Disagree with his assessment of this administration. Thank you. I didnt want to get into the smaller stuff right now because work focusing on Something Else that i would just remind you that there are number of people who have been convicted and some of them are going to jail for their crimes. I also point out to people who denied russias involvement in the 2016 election. But point to bipartisan report that just came out in the senate of Intelligence Committee which i think is pretty powerful. Last but not least, to our newest member but shes been here, our returning member. Congresswoman of california. I am honored to be here tonight in this new temporary role. My hope is that mccauley, will makeup full recovery on this committee. Very soon. On a bipartisan basis, congress has provided more than 2 trillion in emergency relief. We also part of this. Listening funding will help keep families safe this money is only effective it the administrative quickly in line with congressional intent. That is why we are here today to establish the select of the subcommittee on the Coronavirus Crisis. I do know about you but ive been getting calls constantly. Conference calls, singular calls, questions from people every single day. Some hospital people, house centers, all workers. They want to know why theyre not getting their share of this relief money. They are asking constantly about as they understand because they have been getting relief. A lot of our hospitals are saying that theyre not having the ppe spring the Committee Health centers are constantly calling me also. They want to know how to protect their loved ones. As i go to the hospital and try to come back to their homes. That is why this is very necessary. Like the Truman Committee commission which was created to oversee in world war ii the select committee will help us better understand her federal response to this pandemic and will save guard taxpayer dollars against waste fraud and abuse. Ms. Matsui edible help us identify how we can best support our next effort as we move forward to our community. This is not at all seem to me that this is controversial. I think everybody here has asked questions. So think there are no other questions for this witness, is there anything you want i things in the committee, provide that in writing. Are there any other witnesses. Saying none, this closes the hearing. I will now recognize the gentleman from california. Promotion. Thank you mr. Chairman. Im of the committee be rolled that provides for the adoption of a trust by 35. Establishing a select committee on the Coronavirus Crisis as a select investigative subcommittee of the committee on oversight. Even the motion, is there any amendment or discussion. Hearing then, the gentle lady from california. All those in favor say i. Opposed say no. The eyes have it. I role call vote is requested. Roll call vote. Roll call vote. Roll call vote. Seven yeas. I think everybody for being here printed in your flexibility i think the staff are being here printed in the hearing is an journey. [background sounds]. [background sounds]. [background sounds]. [background sounds]. [background sounds]. [background sounds]. [background sounds]. [background sounds]. [background sounds]. [background sounds]. Television has changed since cspan began 41 years ago. Our mission continues, to provide an unfiltered view of governments. Already this year we brought you primary election coverage, residential impeachment process in the federal response to the coronavirus printed u. S. Policy spans Public Affairs programming on television, online, or listen our free radio app. And be part of the National Conversation through cspan daily washington journal program. Or for social media scene. Cspan created by private industry. American state Cable Television company is a public service, and brought to you today by your television provider. Hi good evening, im from the carter president ial library. Im really glad youre here. This is really a special night for us because the book itself is perfect for the kind of authors and invoked topics to be like to have here in the carter president ial library because it talks about congress and the president and how they work together. Even when they dont necessarily agree on things. In fact it was funny, i was looking up a talk in