Transcripts For CSPAN2 Hearing On Airline Passenger Experience 20240713

Ththe chair bethe chair be autho declare recess during todays hearing without objection, so ordered. I also ask nms can send members not on the subcommittee be permitted to sit with subcommittee at todays hearing and ask questions without objection, so ordered. Good morning and i want to thank the witnesses for joining the subcommittee today for the discussion on the air travel experience. According to the u. S. The bureau of transportation statistics in 2018 u. S. Airlines. 925 million passengers to destinations in the u. S. And abroad, the highest total is 2003. The federal aviation or the faa current forecast predicts it will increase roughly 2 per year over the next 20 years and the number of passenger is expected to grow from 24 million to 56 million by 2050. So while increased passenger demand for its new Economic Opportunities and enhances the nations aviation network, longstanding challenges can enter. Over the last few years coming u. S. Airlines invested i interen their products including it solutions such as smartphone apps to be stressed the travel experience. Todays hearing is an opportunity to examine the u. S. Airline Passenger Experience in here from stakeholders on ways to improve this experience and consider how congress and the Airline Industry can foster innovation. Todays witnesses were present stakeholders with unique insight on the Passenger Experience and the Government Accountability office to airlines to consumer advocates. While we will discuss numerous aspects of the everyday experience on u. S. Airlines there are few at the top of my mind today. First is accessibility issues. According to the last census but estimates they have a disability and more than half have mobility issues. Last november the subCommittee Held a roundtable to better understand this including challenges with boarding aircraft, laboratory appropriate techniques and damaged wheelchairs and mobility aid. As the 2016 and 2018 reauthorization act the department of transportation initiated several rulemaking strength of the accessibility of the laboratories and regulations for emotional support and Service Animals and joining on behalf of the paralyzed veterans of america mr. Paige, thank you and i look forward to hearing more about these roles and how congress can work with industry and stakeholders to fill in the gaps on airplanes and airport accessibility discrimination. Throughout the countrys history discrimination has been a pervasive and persistent issue. Far too often by rove that he does report anecdotes uncover unlawful practices across the transportation sector on the basis of race, color, origin, religion anreligion,religion and according to the gao passenger discrimination went from an average of 83 over the past decade to 96 complaints in 2019 and most were related to Racial Discrimination. Sadly the startling statistic doesnt reflect the numerous other cases the dod is reporting that hasnt captured. One of the priorities i have iss to break down the barriers to participate in the economy and society. The 2018 reauthorization act directed the gao to assist the tom nondiscrimination and contractors. Mr. Andrew von ah works on this study and mr. Klein i look forward to hearing the efforts on this nondiscrimination. I want to touch on the future of the airline Passenger Experience as well. At the 116 congress there was an agenda that prioritizes enhancing experience for passengers. To do so congress, the dot and industry must work to ensure transparency can prevent unfair practices and promote Reliable Care services for all americans. The last reauthorization act included numerous provisions to enhance the experience of passengers including establishing seats in the commercial aircraft and establishing consumer advocates to help resolve trouble complains and requiring carriers to disclose trans currency accommodations they provide in a widespread among other things so i look forward to hearing todays testimony of how this will improve the experience from the airline Passenger Experience association on the voluntary efforts for the equipment and general practices to better serve consumers. On the Consumer Protections in nearly three years to explore the important issues facing air travelers today. The past several years the federal government and carriers have made progress in improving the experience and we should recognize that. We should recognize there is more work ahead is so my thanks again to todays witnesses and i look forward to identifying ways congress can ensure all passengers of the safe, comfortable experience. With that i understand sitting Ranking Member of the subcommittee doesnt have a statement so i will turn to the trip. Fullstop they representative defazio of oregon. Before we get to the subject matter at hand i just want to address briefly the covid19 and air travel. Five years ago the gao recommended in response to the 2014 Ebola Outbreak but the dot would work with relevant agencies and stakeholders to develop a National Aviation Preparedness Plan for Communicable Disease outbreaks. That has not happened through two administrations it hasnt happened and now it is a little late. They try to deal directly with airlines to give passenger information and there is an ongoing conflict over that, so last week the chair and i wrote the secretary asked that she implement the recommendations and put together a task force and become more involved in these issues as the cdc should deal with individual airlines and the policy should be developed from knowledgeable people that the faa or the dot so we can begin to better track passengers. Thats obviously not the subject of the hearing today. The state of air travel, you know, my first term in congress i introduced a bill called the equity act into some of the things that were in nashville and had been enacted and are still out there. Kudos to get in touch with the dot. I didnt do that for a while i havent often a mandate in one or another of the bills that they had to post something with an 800 number of the Airline Ticket counter and today how does anybody know to contact the dot with a complaint . We need more transparency so we get a better handle on how many there really are. A big part of the profitability is the ancillary fees. We have walls. I study economics, graduate school and undergraduate, the law of supply and demand. The airlines somehow when it comes to ancillary fees by sky is the limit. Whether it is a passenger looking at the faa bill in 18 within a month they raise the back fees by 5 might have raised fares again, 5. Either the planet is going to drop off drastically but they say if an airport to enhance the experience the terminals and the lack of brigades. If that went up by one or two or 5 no one would ever fly again. It would be totally the truth is if they make the case to the airline, somebodys got to pay for this and they tend to be airport to do aairports do an eb this last year. We have to do the projects. Here is a project. If we could increase the facility charge and they show you cu that the interest cost in half who is going to pay that interest. Why not raise money in the most efficient way possible and make the improvements we need to system . Weve been stuck on that for quite some time. We had a hearing last fall. One mishandled mobility or one dropped passenger is a tragedy. Repairing, replacing critical essential on a timely basis i think many of you have seen the photograph taped to the the aisle chair. This is unacceptable. To specify the training procedures they are out there replacing and handling and i have yet to see the results of the. Maybe we will hear a little bit about that today and emotional support animals. I am pleased to see the dot is taking some action. They shouldnt be penalized because other people are abusing the system and then finally the serious thing they are conducting some inadequate testing. Dealing with seat spacing and issues like that before i get to congress we had the manchester crash and people are piled up trying to get out of that plane. They died in a survivable crash. It took another six years to get that seat removed because the airlines didnt want to lose the revenue. They came back with a study that said it takes longer if you take out a row of seats. We have to deal with the behavior of people in the chicago crash where it took well over two and a half minutes. Fighting with the Flight Attendants are taking the luggage we have to figure out how to deal with the problem and the dot has to evaluate whether we can meet the standards. We will now turn to the witnesses. We wanted to leave to finish with this testimony and then go to the Ranking Member. The senior associate director for the paralyzed veterans of america and the Passenger Experience association and mr. Matt klein executive Vice President and chief commercial officer of Spirit Airlines is accompanied by the senior Vice President general counsel and i understand mr. Klein will be giving the Opening Statement and they were present for possible questions as well. Thank you all for being today. Since that is the case of written testimony has been a part of the record you limit your testimony to five minutes. With that we will proceed with the gao. You are recognized for five minutes. Mr. Chairman, members of the subcommittee, thank you for the opportunity to discuss the recent body of work on the airline Consumer Protections. My remarks are based on the reports issued over the past three years on a variety of Airline Consumer issues and what is known about the passenger complaints and airline practices on accessibility discrimination issues. Our work found the quality of airlines Operational Performance is generally improved over the past decade and they denie denied boardingsd mishandled baggage dropped precipitously to remain steady with modest improvements. The airlines have reduced involuntary by investing in technology to increase the compensation to the volunteers to give up their seats when needed and reducing or eliminating overbooking altogether. The baggage tracking technology at the institute tracking flights at risk of being chronically delayed, improving relationships with text messaging updates and voluntary compensating passengers to be in extended flight delays. Nonetheless it can be costly and convenient for airlines and passengers. They are required to compensate those that are denied boarding and provide refunds for canceled flights. Beyond those requirements the officials told us airlines are not obligated though they may choose to provide accommodations for the flight disruptions address cancellations and delays. In our work looking at the impact showed variation in data provided into the circumstances they will be provided. This can lead to confusion and frustration will you hold the microphone a little closer may feel they havent been fully compensated. While operational improvements have been a positive the complaints felt a bit of a different story related to the passenger boarding by 10 , flight problems and back issues are consistently the top categories of complaints and those related to accessibility discrimination through fewer complaints to the airlines have steadily increased this decade from about 19,000 to about 30,000 theres been an uptick of discrimination related complaints to the dot in the last few years. The experience of passengers for example of the recent work examining the accessibility of the aircraft laboratories without complaint data is inherently limited because of the substantial portion of the individuals never complained and are therefore not represented in the data. Though they had been reticent to provide the details to us with respect to the training in particular we found that Airline Training. And our work found it to be on such training. Looking forward to the reauthorization bill contained a number of provisions for dot with respect to the Consumer Protections including provisions to develop Airline Training and to establish an Airline Passenger with disabilities these efforts are ongoing. The dot is recently taking initial steps to establish rules related to the accessibility aircraft laboratories and regulating Service Animals we have recommendations to the dot to improve its ability to target the measure of the Consumer Protection compliance activiti activities. Chairman larsen, Ranking Member, this concludes my statement and i would be happy to address any questions you may have. Thank you. Three years ago i appeared before the committee is the infamous doctor tao incident which a plane passenger was literally dragged off the United Airlines flight. We heard from us is that today y the conditions havent improved much since then. The mergers since 2001 left just three Major Network Airlines American delta and united plus major lowcost. Resulting in worse service thats what has come to pass in many markets. The cabins are fully packed straining the system to capacity the revenue reached 75. 6 billion worldwide last year advocating any passengers and the question was never addressed. They determine who will be permitted to board and who will not or worse, dragged off. This is an industry in transparency. Consider searching through multitudes of the flights can be mindnumbing due to extraordinarily complex pricing. This is especially hard because most travelers fly less than once a year. Year. Airlines dont think it easy to comparison shop. They can be even more opaque and sometimes inspire changing flights or even carrying on a bag. Its common to block out leaving fewer available for the collection and scaring customers into paying more. In the basic economy is designed to attract shoppers and pressure them by up selling. When i flight is delayed, who will be revoked and who will not, who will get a room and sleep on the floor. If you are not in the premium class, watch out. Even safety itself is opaque. Theres no transparencthere is e critical maintenance of the outsourced to el salvador brazil and china and far less oversight. The contracts provide a few rights and guarantees that why y we still advocate for the comprehensive bill of rights which guarantee the accommodations during the flight delays and cancellations, transparency and safe healthy aircraft seating. Because the deregulation act plays a particularly a central role the limited Public Benefit and the rule makings while new w rule makings of dwindled. For two years the Consumer Protection Committee Held no meetings. Then they appointed someone from the American Enterprise institute with no history of consumer advocacy as the consumer representative. Enforcement authority is falling short as the dot issues record low fines. Last year they find american roughly 77,000 for tarmac deeply instilled to roughly 68,000 corporations that generate 44 billion each in revenues in 2018 that is in 2016 congress led by this committee e predicted the gop to review and establish a policy to ensure families with kids 13 and under sit together without paying extra fees. For years dot was virtually silensilent so we vital filed af information act request and they forwarded 13 136 complaints abot stating publicly was unnecessary to act based on the low number. We analyzed the complaints and were horrified to find cases of children as young as one, two and three assigned seats away from family. Other children were autistic, suffered seizures or a lifethreatening allergy. Such guaranteed chaos during emergency evacuations and put children at risk for inflight Sexual Assault which the fbi says is rising. We created an online portal and forwarded over six complaints more than four times the original total. They should fulfill the committee mandate and they are urging Major Airlines to fix this themselves joined by more than 125,000 individuals who signed the petition. We also support the flight to get their act. Other issues that havent been effectively addressed include the troubling oversight sourcing to the repair stations echoing its field oversight of the 737 thats why we support the standards act. The emergency testing failed to account for the seismic changes and tighter seats, both passengers, carryon baggage destructing electronics, oversight, and the children seated apart from families. A 67yearold loophole that requires children to be properly restrained on commercial flights. Recent media reports highlight you need to wrap up. Dates with the interest of airlines of the public. Congress should enact protections to provide safety oversighoversight and we applaue subcommittee for its continuing efforts. Id be happy to answer any questions. Thank you very much. I now want to recognize mr. Page. Youre recognized for five minutes. Chairman larsen, Ranking Member, members of the Committee Just want to be sure we can hear you. Pull the microphone or the whole box forward. Can you hear me now. Chairman larsen, Ranking Member, members of the subcommittee, thank you for the opportunity to testify regarding air travel experience of passengers with disabilities. Its been more than 30 years since Congress Passed the act and it protects passengers for disabilities and travel although it improved at times it is even unsafe. They report being physically harmed in boarding and planning aircraft and wheelchairs particularly power wheelchairs are damaged while being stored. We also often encounter personnel and contractors. Commercial air travel is the only mode of Public Transportation in which a wheelchair or scooter user must surrender the device in order to travel. Passengers must rely on the air personnel or contractors properly storing these devices and help them board the aircraft. Wheelchair users, this is where the problems of safely accessing air travel truly begins. A small wheelchair that cannot be pushed by its passenger. Our chairs are often poorly designed and in disrepair. In some cases it can harm the passenger as it does not have the proper planning which can lead to skin abrasions and furthermore the Airline Assistance are typically not properly trained and have a transfer from a wheelchair to an aisle chair. They are also too often unfamiliar with the straps. I had a problem with the bil chair and the people that came to assist me. The chair that was used to didnt meet my needs. The feet rest was too small and i kept falling off the aisle chair as i was being brought in and out of the plane and the seat straps were not sufficient to keep me in a secure position. As a result my hip and lower back that every armrest all the way back from my seat. The personnel tried to lift me up into my seat but they were not Strong Enough as i slid into the seat. Passengers with limited mobility must worry about the storage of their assistive devices. The damage to wheelchairs can be a trip altering event as well as concerns for passengers who depend on it for mobility and customized wheelchairs are not easily replaced the damaged. Although they are typically returned without significant damage, this isnt always the case for solar numbers particularly those that use power wheelchairs. Damage to the device is typically result in improper loading within the cargo area of the aircraft. Damage ranges from minor to the fabric of all street to the power breakdown rendering it useless to operators and repair takes time leading to passengers stranded until it can be fixed. This access is almost nonexistent on most commercial aircraft. The idealistically smaller than that of the individual begin transport on the ideal chair to be thithat this means the passes were bumped and scraped from road to row to row. Lack of accessibility means a vast majority of aircraft and january 2020 report on the accessibility of u. S. Aircraft laboratories with mobilities found that although accessible laboratories are available, they do not often choose to acquire them. They administrative remedies available to the department of transportation are quite limited in response to the complaint i filed calling my most recent trip i received 10,000 bonus miles from the carrier. Systematic change is what is needed and most more bonus miles. This provisions include access in the reauthorization act to represent an important step forward and effort in efforts te air travel experience. However these positions alone will not address the fundamental access problems to the safe air travel for disabilities. Thus we strongly support the bipartisan air carrier access Amendment Act hr 1549 which was introduced in march 2019 by the representative. This legislation would greatly improve the accessibility and strengthen enforcement of the air carrier access. The population ages and the need of accessibility and aircraft will only continue to grow. The training of the Airline Personnel and contracts increase the accessibility and improve the enforcement options will lead to safer travel experiences for the members and all passengers with disabilities. We thank you for the opportunity to express our view and i would be happy to answer any questions at this time. We will now turn to mr. Joe leader. Youre recognized for five minutes. Thank you, chairman larsen, chairman of co and members of the subcommittee. My name is doctor joe leader and ive served since 2015 the chief executive officer of the experience association, apex one of the Airline Associations in the world during my tenure for the Flight Service Association Giving us a combine history of 96 years of probably advancing every Major Airline and value as a player worldwide. I am for you today because i believe deeply in the advancement of airline Passenger Experience. Like each of you i began my journey as an Airline Passenger 20 years ago. The most frequent flyer they shared a page long list of ideas on of airlines could better serve the customers being implemented nearly every idea with that introduction please allow me to address the subject of airline Passenger Experience, what it is and what it can be. Apex verifies that certifies the rating for over 1 million flights per year across approximately 600 airlines globally for the official Airline Ratings and the leading travel management worldwide. Another one makes it to the apex fourstar status. The United States reach an incredible milestone last year as alaska, american, delta, hawaiian, jetblue, southwest, spirit and united raised four or five stars is independently rated by the passengers. Spirit airlines has probably joined me to share how they invest in improving their independently verified passenger ratings thereby advancing themselves to a apex airline. In good news. Even after including all revenue fees from a Dynamic Market perspective, competition has driven u. S. Airlines off more variety than the experience of her before. Innovation has enabled u. S. Airlines to offer Better Options to customers including the disabled. To that end, thi they served a leading role in the is department of transportation Access Advisory Committee theyve been placing these vents across new inflight systems both in feedback screens and bring your own device option for better accessibility, manufacturers are creating Better Options for the improved ease of access for the wheelchair bound passengers. This resonates personally with a paralyzed veterans of america testifying here today is my wife, first served a quadriplegic before she became a medical doctor and surgeon and my father probably served in the u. S. Army and flies frequently with my family using his wheelchair. What does the future bring for u. S. Airline passengers, customers enjoy the flight more than ever with entertainment and connectivity options. The number of aircraft with screens worldwide would continue to increase while doing your own Device Options would serve nearly all commercial aircraft in a decade. Its less than the predecessor with millions of gallons of fuel despite more screen size per passenger. New technologies for will make future seatback screens nearly hard plastic. In the existing space as i indicated in my written testimony. U. S. Airline ticket prices continue to go lower than the rate of inflation as the airlines now burn 53. 7 less fuel per passenger than the 1990s the airlines and the world wit with a carbon Emission Reduction averaging 2. 3 less each and every year. It is without any transfer of photos and other technologies being deployed by airlines are to complete the management including ground transportation, automated tracking all on the journey and remembering your personal preferences. This is only the beginning i will be wrapping up. Thank you very much. Now i want to recognize mr. Klein for five minutes. Good morning chairman larsen, Ranking Member, chairman defazio and members of the subcommittee on aviation thank you for the opportunity to testify today. Im the chief commercial officer of Spirit Airlines. Spirit airlines is the lowest carrier in the u. S. They serve over 50 u. S. Domestic airports and 25 international destinations. Our total prices including all on average with more affluent consumers they have many choices in todays markets. Spirit product is designed for highly price sensitive travelers mainly ordinary individual consumers, families and small and medium businesses who pay for their own tickets and faced narrow options. This continues to be an underserved segment in todays market and we are proud to field the need. For the past one, three, five and ten years consistently running high load factors it seems American Consumers are responding very favorably to the choice we provide in the market for air travelers. We may be a less widely known in the past few years to become one of the most Reliable Airlines in the country. We ranked fourth nationally in performance in 2018 and based on unofficial statistics in 2019 as well with three out of the four big airlines and al airlines anr lowcost carriers. We also ranked strongly on the completion factor. With redundancy and inherently greater challenges for the unforeseen events the combination of the low priced and Reliable Service adds up to terrific value for our guests and we see a positive reaction from consumers both in our satisfaction surveys as well as in our increasing customer repeat rate. Over the past three years, spirit had a broadbased initiative that we call invest in the guest. That would help speed up the guests through the checkin process at the airport. We also recently announced the complete refresh of the interior cabins featuring all new seating that provides significantly greater comfort, personal space and usable web from. Later this year we will begin installing nextgeneration wifi across the fleet. The first to do so. Spirit operates one of the newest most fuelefficient fleet in the americas breaking consistently. Its also noise efficiency. We are proud to have one the award for two years in a row. In the u. S. The large distances that do families across the countrcountry show and the meanf the interconnected Business Environment make air travel essential we recognize our product may not be for everyone. Yet we are very proud to offer low priced, Reliable Service for those that may have no other option. With the strongest economy observe on the pieces charged by other airlines we are also pleased to help drive savings for travelerfor the travelers we players were not. As noted earlier the Ranking Member is here and we wont recognize them for five minutes for his Opening Statement. Its truly revolutionized the planet giving us access to areas that never were previously accessible given the exposure and cultures to people to people that it wouldnt have had access to. Weve been abl debate couldto dd lifesaving medicines to folks in need. Weve been able to let folks out of poverty and weve been able to introduce technology and innovation improving lives around the world as a result of Aviation Technology and commercial air travel. It really is amazing to sit and go through the exercise is thinking about potentially not having that amazing technology. As i recall in 2017 we had 841 million Airline Passengers that is projected by 2038 is projected to reach 1. 28 billion passengers. The whole experience doesnt start when you get on the plane. It actually starts well before the. Going to a remote parking spot in getting to the airport to find the right gate checking in the bag to get checked in at the end of the plane, seated into that whole experience when you have three kids i know im supposed to say in tow but usually following it is pretty intimidating and pretty overwhelming, so i do think that its 2020. You talk about some of the technology thats out there and it really is amazing. They actually allow us to check bags at the parking lot and parking garage which is fantastic not having to take them on the shuttle and Everything Else we have to do. But there are other areas where we can improve or use technology to help improve that experience because the big experience i hear from constituent constituee does need improvement and looking at the statistics the upward trend in the passenger travel is going to become more challenging and its going to get worse in terms of the volume and we need to ensure that they are using technology that has a system that it can actually facilitate and allow it to be a pleasurable experience. In the United States is now theyve gone through major carriers before. Its interesting if i remember the numbers correctly if you are member of the complaints about Airline Travel as i recall over half of them are complaints concerning International Carriers, not the domestic carriers. I havent done the math or looked at the statistics but im going to guess they have multiple times folks flying on domestic carriers than international and as we have seen in the committees across the issues theres a difference of International Carriers versus domestic and certainly something we need to continue to focus on. I also want to make note that in the deleted in 2018 we make over 40 different positions related to the consumer issues and Passenger Experience as the chairman noted perhaps there are a few that we need to continue focusing on networking together with everyone in this room to continue to improve the experience the best we can but i want to note everything from seed sizes to strollers and standards and involuntary bumping, oxygen masks and i believe it does in different positions related to passengers with disabilities so certainly progress has been made if they are working to implement those oiwill say it again we certainly need to ensure that we continue to revisit this as an area of process and continue to improve the experience as much as they can. Last, right now obviously one of the things on peoples minds is the coronavirus and we need to make sure we continue to focus on this. But outbreaks that can happen and we need to ensure we focus on this particular issue. Aviation air travel and ensure that we are making this they ars experience as safe as possible. With that i will yield back and appreciate the opportunity for an Opening Statement. Now i want to move on to member questions recognized for five minutes and we will start by recognizing myself an into start with mr. Page last following the subcommittee on the recent role to improve Laboratory Access can you give us your thoughts on the proposed rule and where we are on its development . As i work with Airlines Across the us as a central area of concern, one of which i am very proud of what we have done as a Market Leader in the space and one that i think you will see as they do cabin redesign like airbus and boeing there are more options than before. There is a big requirement that there are two laboratories for use for most of the passengers because we want to serve all passengers but when it comes to serving disabled passengers that is for a greater ease of access. Mr. Klein you did note where spirit is what level of investment was necessary to make that happen . We did go through a retrofit half of the fleet went through a retrofit to put those excessive through so as it comes in so on our aircraft we have the widest aisles you could have on an aircraft is important to us we put in certain types of seats with more lift to address the issues mentioned earlier. So with the issue of wheelchairs in the aisle and the design that they use, i have never seen a wheelchair used that isnt metal pipes with cushions and so on. And then looking into redesigning and using different materials and to help out with the folks. You have the aisle chair which is what airlines and the airports used to get on the plane and then the onboard wheelchair which will take you back to the restroom if needed. Access boards just put out for the on board chair and with those recent standards and basically and with that 14inch aisle seat. So your question of standards columbia is the most wide use across the industry. And in your testimony that they have decrease the 2018 so do you have any idea. In 2019 those numbers have gone up with about 11000 at 21000 in 2019. We looked at that data more carefully and found out and with those two specific airlines that were responsible for all of those involuntarily. I might add that part of that that some of the Airlines Warned us because of the max issues there could be an uptick. And those that have the largest investment there was a direct correlation. What about the statistics those that spirit has accommodated . You lower the bar in terms of access. Its great question and to say this is the first time you have ever flown ever but if we go into certain new cities like katie a lot of people from south florida flying for the first time and we know for example from new orleans to honduras we know there will be people that will take the first flight. When we go into new routes we attract new gas that are in frequent travelers as well and we grow markets and on average with the whole industry as we get competed with we will grow the markets by 30 percent and fairs come down by 22 percent following our entry so we do that to drive new growth and those are industry numbers and they choose to compete with us on price that can happen to large roots as well with the new york metro area. And the market grew even though there was a lot of service. We seek out those to create the travel opportunities. Thank you and every time in the spirit area of the airport and for tourism but clearly it appears it is opening up and it is comparable in some cases. And it is fantastic to see anecdotally for those that previously would not have chosen that option. I mentioned we had changes to address passenger issues. One of the key provisions that we view as a comfort or value issue but as a health issue and with that evacuation issue the testing in Oklahoma City right now is not sufficien sufficient. There is ample evidence they do not have the scenarios. And what they could be and my understanding is not just those states went from my perspective for total Available Space for passenger comfort and what i really like of the new seats the airlines are doing as a flotation device now has greater comfort in fleet one in flight now the space is an area of focus. The chairman of the full committee is recognize. I just want to confirm this and of those of the single aisle have labs that are accessible to those in wheelchairs . Those on the Assembly Line are sitting on the ground. I am not aware they are doing that. None of the boeing planes and when we looked at it. But mr. Klein how much more expensive is it . You may not want to give that figure to have an accessible lab i dont know the exact answer to the question. And with that Seating Capacity is not law. Thats one smart for me to strike they would other airlines are choosing for their products. So we lose that opportunity and those that are going into the new planes with the dod dragging its feet. Have you ever flown spirit or experienced. Truthfully i have not flown spirit before but i did see it and 2016 during early access. It works very well for a person on the aisle chair with the assistance of the Flight Attendant and as the doctor described to sidebyside they split that foldable wall so you actually have two sinks and two laboratories. Its big enough to close the door and begin their. You referenced emergency evacuation why is that test an adequate . From the experts we have talking to it hasnt been done in the effective way in 20 years due to modeling. So as you noted in your remarks that involves a truncated section it doesnt reflect they are up 20 points on average since the late nineties. More disabled on board. And electronics and the support animals in some cases are oversized are not trained combined this together then the issue that we raised earlier about families traveling together where children are separated from parents then you have the emergency evacuation and we cannot stress enough that American Airlines survey 87 Percent People flying on american flu less than once a year so its not something is just a bad recipe all around. What could we do about the issue . So to have that Flight Attendant so what do we do about that . It is an issue that has not been stressed enough. And the realworld accidents. Should it be of a size or a penalty to be mentioned. It is worth considering. What about walking on approach and take off the overhead bin it doesnt seem that would be too difficult with the electronic locking system. They have expressed concerns of emergency equipment. You can leave that off. It is a workaround. My time is expired. Thank you for being here today. My question is for mr. Klein we had a hearing on the aviation and Maintenance Workforce and the industries are facing a major labor shortage industry for cash show that north america will need over 200,000 civilian pilots with the Maintenance Technicians over the last 20 years and United Airlines announced the Pilot Program and signed a Purchase Agreement to be the first flight so can you discuss these actions from Spirit Airlines to invest in education and workforce development. And with those regional carriers. And then they become Spirit Airlines after period of time and additionally on behalf of the Spirit Foundation which is a nonprofit, we are investing in Education Centers and facility to do Pilot Training and mechanics and Technician Training one is to make sure the pipeline continues to grow and its extremely important to have a more diverse workforce. With both minority and female training and with the. So with our work for storage was addressed whether with air Traffic Controllers and engineers or pilots the consequences that we see . Its important to have highly skilled professionals as part of the workforce. Its hard to speculate with the issue were not having issues with recruitment or retention its hard to speculate about the future i will just assume we have these issues you will see the free market where it would become more important for those individuals for more people entering the workforce. When anybody else like to add . And to advocate much of it is outside the country and as a safety issue from a consumer perspective and to submit that entire generation this is something you cant get back overnight. And then they are not even finding that now. So from my perspective we are seeing the right balance of occur when the faa mandated hours for pilots thinking it would drive more pilots to get more experience in Smaller Airlines and now actively seeking to move up to the airline. And the very sought after and the economics that is primarily based in the United States but i think he will see a strong and growing base here in the us and airlines that invested independently and from apex and then to given out the educational scholarships. What we would like to mention is doing some else one dash some outsourcing a decision we made to support the territory so im using a highly skilled organization so we do have aircraft to go through puerto rico. The gentleman from tennessee. Thank you madam chair. The discontent among Airline Travelers and then to experience record profitability those salaries are getting larger and larger and to charge unreasonable amounts of money and as competition decreases as the unreasonable fees and in 2018 with those restoration changes and with 6 million and for checked baggage and two. 74 changes some have increased these fees the public is exasperated and so are many members of the committee and as they continue to grow in the years ahead to ensure the policies and practices down the route with the Consumer Protection. You discuss the proliferation in your testimony so those of fees that weve gotten used to like baggage or take it changes how does that factor into the Consumer Experience . It is a negative impact for many. And Consumer Reports we have the advantage tens of thousands of readers that we ask every year and the list of complaints are the fees like the baggage fees not that that they are existing but they are increasing. Just like jetblue raise their fees. And senator marquis is introducing a bill in the house and with the transportation colleagues with a fair fees act prohibits cancellation or bag fees that they have to be reasonable or proportionate they can still charge them if they could be reasonable and proportionate. Spirit airlines is quite up front that a lot of ancillary fees is the Business Model with that being said it is confounding the recent bag fee was more than double depending on time and place of purchase what is the rationale depending on when they travel . And then with that revenue we are not shy talking about that with our Business Model is we make sure we reduce the base fair other airlines do not do that but we bring the fair down so the customers that dont need to check bags or have a specific seat assignment otherwise may not be able to fly. I appreciate that but why do you charge more depending on when they buy the ticket you have the same luggage space why do you charge more if they buy it at a different time . We want to encourage people to think about with their purchase decision. And then assigned the bag fee to the record. The standard price if you add the bag to the record whenever you want to then we give a discount for adding the bag to the record at time of purchase. We have a certain space for baggage is will not increase or decrease. Shouldnt that be the same fee . So the answer is no. We think its better to give them a discount for adding up front then they can think about overall but to the point we want people to get the best upfront price that they can. I have limited time do you agree. No we believe that fee situation that is why we supported your legislation but you cannot always determine the fee until you enter a specific flight information and beyond transparency and many fees are arbitrary as pointed out in 2017 where the chairman asked united and american where is the cost internally to change a ticket and the executives were dear the headlights and could not answer that. Thank you madam chair on the peoples minds are the opening comments on sunday the first two cases of coronavirus were diagnosed in florida. And those that represent to span the area between tampa and orlando. So the constituents will fly out of those two airports. And then to take several steps to prevent so that includes sanitation and of high attached areas and Hand Sanitizer a few questions related to the specific issue. Have you seen any similar actions at airports across the country and if so what are they . Apex provided guidance worldwide on nine key steps into members of the public it is completely safe to fly right now we have gone through this and for those to fly on aircraft there is no transmission to this day we believe that will continue to be the case and through those hepa filters 99. Seven through 99. Nine and with that said it is clearly communicating to passengers and then to take broader waivers for changes and cancellations. Several airlines and the traceabilitys and then to have had on board. Flight crew awareness on how to act in this instance and with those more significant aircraft and the aircraft decontamination procedures and to have those in place on doorhandles of restrooms and then most importantly to your point to see what tampa has done on a cleaner environment. Some of the challenges e noted in executing the plans related to the coordination and communication in terms of what they should be doing, with the threat was and the issue was and communication among the contractors and others in the area to make sure Everybody Knows what they should be doing so i would mention the we dont really have a National Plan for the aviation system. Its a recommendation wif the rl have open. What can we do to support the airport and that goes to that question any other suggestion on what they might be able to do in our purview to help. Weve been looking at the websites of most of the major carriers and to their credit most of them have large notices particularly on International Routes where theyve canceled flights that w but we have seens with other events that communication could increase for those that are not directly affected get in other words if youre planning a trip or uncertain the communications could be much better. Anyone else want to speak to that . What we should do to further enhance safety is working to make sure that we have a Hand Sanitizer available for passengers at the stations, y. Salsa that the fact my phone is placed where peoples shoes though and it would be wonderful to have during this time in particular additional steps taken by the us government. Thinthank you and i will yied back. A gentle man from arizona is recognized. Thank you. As it has been discussed by several witnesses to a air travel for those with a disability poses a number of unique challenges more often than not it could be a very stressful experience and in some instances, those with disabilities choose not to fight rather than deal with obstacles that exist from the curb to the aircraft and beyond. However for some avoiding air travel altogether isnt a viable option and we must do more to improve accessibility for those with disabilities. Mr. Page come in your testimony you discuss many of the challenges from inaccessible restrooms to injuries in the boarding process to lost or damaged mobility aids and you discuss the need for proper training for those assisting passengers with disabilities particularly when boarding and planing and aircraft. One area that hasnt been discussed and i would like to explore is what happens to passengers with disabilities in the event of an emerging . For those come exitin exiting an aircraft in the best of circumstances is a challenge that in an emergency if they be virtually impossible especially considering her and aircraft design and airplane training procedures. Currently regulations require all passengers be able to evacuate the aircraft within 90 seconds, with half of the exits blocked. Yet, when they ran Events Division tests between novembe november 2019 and january of this year to evaluate the relationship between seat spacing and evacuation times, the tests didnt include people with disabilities. This raises questions about the accuracy of the tests and how reflective they are in the flying public. I understand passengers with disabilities should receive a safety briefing from the flight crew the goal was to provide greater awareness of accessibility needs. And i am concerned that this briefing rarely happens. In the case of playing outstanding director she indicates to me the briefing has never happened when she flies. Additionally it isnt clear what procedures are in place to assist those that are not able to evacuate on their own in an emergency so can you share your thoughts on their choice to not include people with disabilities in its evacuation tests . Thank you. Thats disappointing that they are not included in the tests. Its a kind of echo your thoughts, for me being a person with a permanent disability, when it comes to boarding, im first on and blast off. Ive had the briefing from attendance on occasion but not on a fulltime regular basis. But in that briefing, the emergency evacuation process was explained to me as basically i would be dragged out of the plane sitting on the floor and taken out the best they can. The definition of time escape isnt really designed to me by the Flight Attendant. Im disappointed that the required training procedures for professional staff in the Airline Industry needs to be improved. I want to turn to our friends at Spirit Airlines. You talked about improvements and i appreciate those however according to the dot for airline ranked 13th out of 17 carriers for mishandled wheelchairs and scooters last year so i want to hear from you what steps you are taking to improve the ranking on this important regard. Its something that we know we have to improve upon. Im happy to say although there is a lot of work we can still do for the first two months of this year our complaints are down 45 year over year as it relates to disability complaints overall. As it relates to the security bringing assisted devices back to the guest we are down 29 on that number as well so we do agree there is work to do and this is a topic thats extremely important to us and one that we feel passionate about. We are doing it for better training quite frankly and making sure that we are saying the right things and making sure that training is being followed through. Maybe we can work with your staff is a necessary security particles or followed especially passengers that happened to have a disability because obviously lacking is based on my analysis and its an area that needs improvement. Its disappointing to hear this information. And i cant speak specifically. But we will definitely take that away and make sure it isnt something we are lacking. Thank you. I will yield back. The gentleman from new york is recognized. Thank you madam chair and all of you for being here today. As i was sitting here listening to some of the testimony and reflecting about my many years of traveling i cant help but think that from the time i started traveling, flying until today it is a different experience and its nowhere near as pleasant and nowhere near as comfortable. I am not the tallest. 6foot 3 inches and its hard to sit in the seat of a lot of airlines. You cant even move in them and theres no headrest you can put your head back to. Theres nothing there. Its not a pleasant experience for me so im curious if i have time i will drill down on some of those is. I want to ask quickly consumer complaints between 2008 and 2017 increased. Is that because Airline Services deteriorated or consumers are more aware of their ability to file complaints with the dot . To pinpoint exactly why, congressman, i think there are a number of factors that play into why and how a consumer will complain. What we have noticed as they did increase the 10 over that period relative to the number of boardings but they stay relatively static. They get the same kind of complaints and categories from here to hear. What we noted in our testimony and found from some of our work ias we have seen notable increases were complaints related to disabilities as well as some spikes and discrimination complaint. Thank you. Some reports first of all him on the organization they do a great job for the public and i dont think [inaudible] especially having teenage boys now im always trying to make sure i get a car that keeps them safe so thank you for that. Theres a disparity between your complaint and members of the dot. Can you explain why that may be or what is your take on that . Certainly. I think that this microcosm for that is the issue i raised earlier of struggling together. When we submitted a freedom of information act we requested the dot find of complaints about families whod separated from Young Children on flights. They forwarded us 146 complaints over about two or three years. We then put a portal on Consumer Reports. Org and we put forward those complaints to the dot and received more than 400, up to 600 now. So for us that clearly underscores thbut clearlyunderst system. Most consumers dont get off the flight after that experience and say we need to contact the dot. In the European Union for example, there is a financial throughout european airport letting you know how and when you can complain both to the eu and to the airlines and we strongly suggest the dot to do more to let people know that these complaints are there. Lets talk about that for a minute and i want to give you an opportunity to talk about that. I dont know if it is the dot or not, but can we help the industry to do better, and i know a lot of times i fly american and they do a good job asking questions and i have those little certificates when someone does a good job i turn one in for them. But how can we do something along the european model and what should it look like because im not sure it should come from the dot but if it does but would it look like and what would you suggest . Before i get to that i want to mention the dot will tell consumers to go to the Airlines First with complaints because that the way a consumer is going to get more media resolution of the complaint. When they are looking at complaints they are looking at something pervasive, something thats very repetitive happening over and over again that has a broad Consumer Impact so that is just one notice why they wouldnt see as many Consumer Reports for example or the airlines themselves as we pointed out we think Something Like or the dot reported airlines get maybe 50 complaints for every one complaints the dot. In terms of the dot publicizing or making it known that theyve had a complaint theyve made some improvements to their website, so consumers have a better idea how and what rights they have available and how to o complaints that on their website you have to go there to see it. Thats not something that is available i don i dont think people would know if you are flying im going to the dot website and voice my complaint. What do you think that would look like if we try to set something up for what you suggest we do that and i dont think its a bad thing because i think they want to provide a good service and they generally do. I understand the competitiveness might have to have smaller feet of space and all the other stuff but what can we do to help them to be more conscious of the complaints about their . That point is a good one and that the dot does suggest consumers go to the airline to fix things and not in the european model where they will step in to try to address grievances. But the more serious problem from our perspective is that the dot has stated to us repeatedly they work on issues based on complaints when we said we had 136 complaints from families of autistic children and children with allergies and all kind of serious problems, who in their right mind would say those 136 complaints are less than 10,000 complaints about scuffed baggage to the need to have a perspective on complaints. Some of the serious ones are low in numbers an and they said specifically they wouldnt act on the families traveling together issue because, quote, the numbers are too low. May be in a separate submission if you have ideas that i would look like maybe we can figure out something. I think having a healthy discussion on the concern and maybe people saying they have nowhere to go if there is a concern now airlines can say with a concern for i think it might be better to have transparency. Thank you and i will yield back. The chair now recognizes the gentleman from california. Thank you madam chair. In your written testimony you discussed the growing number of complaints from passengers alleging Racial Discrimination. Can you elaborate on this topic and to your knowledge what are some of the steps the airlines are taking to address this . Thank you for the question, congressman. Those complaints when we looked at them they are typically discrimination based complaints and typically about Racial Discrimination. Some of the things we have noted in the reports are things where it may be a misunderstanding or theres always a push and pull between the pilots ability to remove a passenger for safety reasons but they are not allowed to discriminate and so there may be misunderstandings about whats going on with the fact te didnt really get into the sort of cause of some of those complaints so its hard to comment exactly on what the airlines are doing. Thats a little disconcerting if we dont know if theyre a way tthere is away to step up oo dive into that a little bit further . The dot does follow up on each of these complaints in particular discrimination is one of the categories they do pay close attention to and forwarded to the airlines so that is one way that they are addressing the issue. Thank you. You also touched on the increased barriers to passengers with disabilities face. I found it notable that you mentioned the number of complaints filed by people in wheelchairs may not fully reflect the inconvenience experienced by these passengers. Why do you believe there is an underreporting from this particular group . Thank you for that. Theres a number of reasons why. First and foremost, theres no requirement that we looked at the laboratories specifically there is no requirement that they be accessible to persons with disabilities from the dot said they may not have an expectation that they can complain because it is not a requirement for thats one reason why. Some of thsome other things we d our people take extreme measures to not have to use the laboratory in the first place so if they are not using it they are not necessarily going to complain about the lack of accessibility and laboratory. Then as it was noted i think in some previous discussions, People Choose not to fly. Mr. Page, im turning to you. Would you have anything else to add . Did you have anything else to add . I was getting ready to echo what he said. In reference to a love of our members, they dehydrate themselves the day before when it comes to flying that way we know there is no access to the laboratory on the plane currently because it just isnt accessible and in reference to complaints that the dot, i would echo what mr. Mcgee said. They started to pile on the complaints and so weve got some action from dot on a lot of different issues, but it was a road that we built trying to get some response from the department on a lot of different issues. So definitely theres a lot of work left to be done. Thank you. Adam chair i will yield back. The gentleman yields back. The gentleman from the district of columbia is recognized for five minutes. Thank you very much. Mr. Mcgee, i noted in your testimony that you raised an issue that had been a special interest to me and to this committee itself. You reference on page six of your testimony 2018 fbi report that stated, and here i am quoting inflight Sexual Assault is on the rise with children particularly vulnerable. You go on to say that they were shocked and i must tell you we were as well by the dot refusal to act so you did it yourself and within weeks you said you had in excess of come and im quoting, 600 complaints and more than four times the dot original proposal. I have a bill called the aware act as a republican cosponsor that would require the Justice Department to report this data and i will note that a similar bill has passed this committee its the chair and though that would require Sexual Assaults the measure on the airlines have been made public. That bill passed this committee in november so my question to you particularly given your testimony, mr. Mcgee, how many of the 600 complaints that you quoted in your testimony that you handled dealt with Sexual Assault in particular . Many of them raised the issue. We didnt have an actual case cited to us but repeatedly we heard from parents and caregivers that they were concerned about it. In some cases, they got off the plane. They said if my child isnt going to be sitting near me we are not going to take his flight and conversely, we havent thought about this but we heard from the Business Travel community and we heard many corporate travelers dont want the responsibility of sitting next to a young child we are talking five, six, seven or eight but is not their own, they dont want that responsibility. They dont want a responsibility to havtheresponse the childs welfare with oxygen masks and evacuations so the fbi reviewed this chilling report and when we had that in mind and went through these complaints we saw parent after parent is a what are they thinking, how could you possibly, you might as well be an unaccompanied minor. They have very strict policies for unaccompanied minors they dont allow children under a certain age to be traveling, they give them special attention. For all intensive purposes, if i am a paradigm row 12 and my sixyearold is in really team that child is an unaccompanied minor so that is why we were shocked at the dot doesnt take this more seriously enough to act. Again not all complaints are created equal. You cant compare the threat of a child being assaulted two damaged luggage. On the one hand we are talking about children who are completely defenseless and dont know what to do if we dont knot know how many our adult as well and as i say if shocked this committee so its a bill that should be going to the floor soon. Could i ask you as well, mr. Mcgee, have you found any difference in the quality of Customer Service between the Regional Airlines and Legacy Airlines . We have found that when we talk about the Legacy Airlines, many of their flights up to 50 of departures on any given day are in fact operated their subsurface they are outsourced to regional carriers so we have written about this and advocated about this at length over the years. There are two sets of rules, safety issues that in some measure have been addressed after the crash in buffalo but theres also Customer Service issues. There are different standards to the bottom line is you buy a ticket on American Delta that you are flying on an aircraft is and operated by united american and so from the faa perspective there could be different standards in terms of safety, maintenance, Pilot Training and Customer Service standard there could be differences. Is there legislation needed . Absolutely weve advocated there needs to be tighter control operating on behalf of major carriers and we find repeatedly that many passengers have no idea they bought a ticket on airline aid that are flying on airlines. So simply knowing that help who is actually flying you. I will look into that. We would be happy to assist. Thank you. The gentleman from georgia is now recognized for five minutes. Thank you mr. Mcgee, when the Trump Administration came to power, there was a department of transportations aviation Consumer Protection Advisory Committee that was in place that dialogue was to meet quarterly. Did that quarterly meeting schedule change once the Trump Administration came to power . Yes it did. For the first two years there were no meetings they were finally reinstated in 2019. I participated in one on behalf of the report last year its continued that its been in frequent since then. So it hasnt been holding the quarterly meetings. It hasnt been quarterly, no. And the department of transportation appointed someone as its consumer representative i think you testified earlier someone from the American Enterprise institute. Yes. That individual has no career record of ever having advocated on behalf of consumers so we were shocked by that. This is a committee with several members and under other administrations that role was filled by someone with a robust history of advocating for consumers. How has disappointment impacted consumer access to a satisfactory Passenger Experience on airlines . It has many effects and we as consumer advocates work with colleagues outside of the Consumer Reports with many other consumer organizations that advocate on behalf of Airline Passengers and we treat them very seriously. We look forward to them and have robust agendas and they go in if you we are not being heard in the same way. We dont have someone on the inside advocating for passengers believe that we believe they should be. Gao testimony today describes the growing number of complaints each year from passengers alleging Racial Discrimination. Can you describe what airlines are doing to address discrimination, Racial Discrimination and air travel . Thank you for that question, congressman. Our work looked at the Training Airlines have provided for nondiscrimination. I would mention that we didnt get specific information about the Airline Trainings. I would note that training was hard to understand exactly who got the training, how often they got it and we did note that in some of the leading practices we developed in terms of nondiscrimination training. Some didnt include a number of the things we would consider to be best practices like input supply is training, ensuring a robust discussion among the people and interactive training environment. Have you seen the department of transportation make any efforts to address Racial Discrimination in air travel . They do take that issue very seriously and they do follow up on those complaints. However, the kind of training i mentioned is not required by the dot although airlines to have that kind of training that they dont require it. Thank you. Mr. Klein your company uses arbitration clauses in their contracts with consumers, correct . Yes, thats correct, sir. And thats because it is more efficient and Cost Effective for the company to force people into arbitration then it would be to allow them to File Lawsuits in court against the company. Is that correct . We do get lawsuits in court over time. But its more cost efficient for the airline when you can divert cases into the arbitration process, correct . In our case we have many more court cases that take place that isnt my question. My question is its more cost efficient for the airline to divert cases to arbitration van is to allow cases to proceed to litigation in court isnt that correct . That may be accurate. I cant speak to the full accuracy. Otherwise they wouldnt do it. Your Ultra Low Cost Airline you are looking to cut corners as much as you can and people are taking you to court. Its just more expensive than arbitration. I mean thats a simple equation, isnt it . I know you know the answer to the question. We do provide some context for arbitration many consumer businesses do. Its an attempt to achieve better consistency of results. Its cheaper for the airline. Its cheaper for the airline to divert customers into arbitration then it is to allow them to proceed with litigation. Thats the question. Is that true or is the false . I really cant say because i dont have enough arbitration to make a statement one way or the other. Airport infrastructure and expanding Flight Operations however theres always room for improvement especially regarding safety. I think the past Years Experience includes even the unexpected unscheduled an unfortunate series of events that occurred. November 2019 this Committee Held a roundtable for a person with disabilities highlighting safety concerns with passenger evacuation federal aviation regulations require the design of the airliner must permit all passengers to evacuate the aircraft within 90 seconds with half of the exits blocked reason accidents have raise concerns whether all passengers can evacuate in 90 seconds and the chairman alluded that with an engine failure fire that occurred in 2016. Im concerned it does not take into account aircraft manufacturers like boeing and airbus to demonstrate to the faa that meets the bar and into not be updated and 20 years to make it extremely difficult for passengers with disabilities to evacuate. And there is no indication. And to ensure the faa considers all groups of people and to assume experience thank you madam chair for the opportunity and i yield back the balance of my time. Thank you for holding this hearing so members of congress frequent flyers i had a flight on monday down here. With the 6 00 oclock shuttle that half the plane was empty but because of the seating assignment protocol i am thinking about the coronavirus the first does in rows are all jampacked with people. And the back of the plane was completely empty. Even those assurances you have given, with a hepa filter and all of that certainly having everybody gm did with each other while the rest of the plane is empty probably is a pragmatic. You run an airline would it take an act of congress to change the seating protocols. We dont frequently deal with half empty planes. But them i have a halfempty plane quick. You bring up the excellent point. Because planes continue to run full and its hard for me to comment on that. I want to waste of my time like this this is indicative of the problem is very heavily regulated industry. It should be simple. There are some. There is loading issue as well. And what we are dealing with is the cdc is asking for information from the Airlines Passengers on the flight flying to the destination and three or four days later they test positive for the coronavirus with the passenger name record usually has a phone number so they can tell the passenger sitting next to the person that you have been in direct contact with someone who has tested positive recently with the coronavirus. So what is the airlines position on this . And we may be in a position the information that has been requested is extremely importan important. The name contact and email . Passengers that book directly with the airline with the name record if you book through the third party say through expedia. We dont get information through that transmission. Some customers you do. That we have the ability it is very inefficient but we do to collect information as the directive comes in and then we address that. Information like email address of each individual passenger so you have to go get that information upon checkin it is inefficient and hard to get we had the ability to do that in our reservation system. And then i dont want to talk about other airlines. From the Global Distribution systems when airlines collect information directly email and phone number they are happy to provide that to the cdc and the instances where historically expedia or other agencies can help with that information you will see a wall breakdown the cdc requested behind the reservation will offer that to the airliner historically they have not. For that passenger and family they can take those precautions i yield back to the chair recognizes the gentle man from indiana. My colleagues mentioned discrimination much of the Aviation Industry has comprehensive reporting requirements regarding airplanes for good reason. However there is very little requirement for airlines to report when they remove someone from the airplane dot only reports on discriminatory removals when passengers complain. But most recently the dot is entered into a Consent Decree so what can be done to require full reporting and removal and those were causing africanamericans and others to be stereotyped such as speaking arabic or wearing a hijab. So i can tell you two different things. Number one is a level of sensitivity and training done page airline is Getting Better and better each year like at starbucks where there was insensitivity airlines learned from that but in terms of reporting anytime there is a confrontation with a passenger or an incident that leads to removal from an aircraft they are a much better in terms of serving their customers as what has happened it is an area of great improvement but my area of concern and the unseen bias to continue to focus on training and awareness to not impact the decision. I have greatly improved the antidiscrimination training so its not just the aircraft and its important to us. And something we take seriously and the improvement rate large the related to what you raised most of the time. Maybe from having too much fun at the destination or on the aircraft also that causes Law Enforcement officials. And then to call in Law Enforcement if necessary. The key issue some Airline Executives have referred to their team members. That many frontline employees are outsourced. So the levels of training and competition is a reflection and those to the regional carriers. But that they interface those in the frontlines and event Airline Uniforms but not airline employees. So unless you address issues. That does raise a good point. And then come to the exact same training as the team members with that payroll so they have that same exact training we spend time and our colleagues spent time to take time out of our day with the three plus weeks so we agree it is extremely important outsourced employees. Thank you gentlemen. Are there any questions for the subcommittee . Thank you for each of your testimony with contribution has been informative and helpful. But as a witnesses have provided answers to any questions and unanimous consent the record remain open 15 days for any additional comments submitted by members are witnesses to be included in the record. Without objection so ordered. If other members of anything to add we are adjourned