lamar alexander: this is a book about a shy boy in alabama who was inspired by henry clay to be a senator and he did and then he set out to be a centered needed. here's what i thought when i was asked to do this. how can anyone get mitch mcconnell to talk for an hour. because in your own book, as you point out, only speak to the press when it is to your advantage. and talk about a time when bill gates came in to see you, the two of you just sat there and people were uncomfortable waiting for what he viewed to speak and you recount that someone once told president george w bush, that you are excited over a certain vote and he said really, how can you tell. so why so few words. mitch mcconnell: i am not afraid of talking but i found i learned a lot more by listening. so frequently a start out listening and i think about what i want to say before i do it. so i think it is fair to say i'm in the era of trump, probably very different approach to commenting on public affairs. lamar alexander: we are not the first one. artist interview he had or ever have made the process was with senator mike mansfield because he would ask him a question and he was a yelp. they would ask him another one and he was a dope. then he would run out of questions. the easiest one was hubert humphrey. one question he would talk for 30 minutes. mitch mcconnell: you don't get in trouble for what you don't say. and i don't think there is anything wrong with being cautious about your comments. i certainly don't mind talking but i usually like to know what i am talking about. before i ventured in the path. lamar alexander: you're not so cautious in your book. there's a lot of unexpected material. and polio, we'll talk about that. your vote for lynden johnson in 1964. over civil rights and then when it gets to professor obama, and senator harry reid, your democratic counterpart, and the senate conservative side, you did hold back there. and then i think most people would be surprised to learn they are non-american tailgater at the university of louisville. when we start with polio. 9044, your two years old, living with her mom in alabama. and the doctor, your dad is overseas and the work and the doctor said, mitch has polio. it is hard today to imagine how terrifying those words must have been for parents then. mitch mcconnell: i subsequently learned that there was a serious epidemic all over the country. the disease is very unpredictable and the first you have flow for a fight have the flu and a couple of weeks later, some people would be completely normal and a couple of weeks later something would be deal. in my case, it affected my left quadricep, the muscle between your knee and thigh. in one of the great good fortunes of my life this little crossroads, in alabama, 90 minutes out but there where my mother as you indicated, was living with her sister while my dad was overseas fighting the germans. having to be 60 miles from us. and roosevelt, having gone there himself in the 20s, a joke because he had polio. mitch mcconnell: yes, he had an age 39 completely paralyzed below the waist. lamar alexander: mother had no idea if you would be completely paralyzed. mitch mcconnell: when they predicted was the worst carries certain aerial for me would be a brace on my left leg. and so i did have a survey of cases president roosevelt had. imagine, i am two years old. you know what to euro kids are like. and my mother took me over to warm springs. they taught her a physical therapy regimen and told her to administer it four times a day and keep me off of my feet. so she literally watched me like a hawk for two years. every waking moment. and try to convey to meet the subtle message they did want me to think that i couldn't walk with that i shouldn't walk. it was a very subtle message. lamar alexander: honey keep it to -year-old contained. mitch mcconnell: she prevented me from prematurely walking. obviously she told me that years later. my first memory in life, but the last visit to warm springs. were they told my mother i was going to be okay. that i would be able to walk without a live and we stopped in a shoe store in lagrange fort georgia annoyed back to alabama to get a pair of low top shoes. which kinda give me the sense of having a normal childhood. and i did have. i was four years old. suffered to hear she wants me like a hawk. lamar alexander: what an amazing time. you have a chapter in your book called resilience. i guess resilience much must come from that and some extent. he won if impressions being made on us at that early age or significant as some people think, insured had to have one on me which was if you stick to something, you keep working at it and give you rest. you may actually overcome whatever problem you are currently having. lamar alexander: do have any impediment today. mitch mcconnell: some. the quadricep is more important going downstairs and up. so not really going downstairs. i had a perfectly normal life. when i was a kid i wasn't good at running long distances but i could play baseball, a sport that doesn't have the kind of back-and-forth like basketball does. lamar alexander: your weather encouraged you to have a fist fight with dickie mcgrew. what was that about pretty. mitch mcconnell: and encourage me. i had no choice. this was a situation, i was about seven. when it in alabama. and i had a friend across the street named dickie mcgrew who was a year older than i was in considerably different. he was also a bully and kept kinda pushing me around. my dad was out working in the yard one day and he saw all of that. any incident before. he called me over. he said, son i have been watching the way he has been pushing you around and i want you to go over there and beat him up. and i said dad is over and bigger than i am. and he said i'm older than he is a bigger than he is. so given this choice, i chose dickie. i went across the street and started swinging. and beat them up. it was an incredible lesson. in standing up to bullies. i thought about that throughout my life. at critical moments when people are trying to push you around. lamar alexander: see of a chapter standing your ground. let's jump ahead to kentucky, the university of louisville. people looking at cspan2 might wonder what people or senators are talking about on the floor. the odds are you're talking about sports and before i get to that though, your henry clay senator henry clay, he inspired you to want to be the united states senator. mitch mcconnell: led gotten interested in politics is cool. i run for president student body of high school. very contentious race. lamar alexander: you said you were hooked. mitch mcconnell: i want. so i began to follow politics and i remember at age 14, when the conventions were really the coverage they were really dull. it would focus on the podium and listen to all of the speeches on tv. lamar alexander: there is a big radio and we would listen to the whole thing. mitch mcconnell: pretty boring. you may have been doing this too. lamar alexander: i might've been too. [laughter]. mitch mcconnell: i thought maybe you were watching too. watching those things from gavel to gavel. so i began to try to practice this to see if i could get good at it. i ran for president and student counseling college to an in law school. clay, was the most famous politician in kentucky. lamar alexander: what about clay inspired you most. mitch mcconnell: the fact that in a not significant state have become a major face and voice. in the kentucky people focus on clay. i wanted to learn more about him. lamar alexander: he was known about crafting compromises. that's a dirty word today with some people. mitch mcconnell: it is. but it is aptitude late abstinent absolutely essential. you and i do everything at night. in order to make the senate function. so i did my senior thesis on henry clay. in the compromise of 1850. i continue to follow him and a lot of kentucky politicians two. lamar alexander: athletic programs, describe your tailgating schedule. mitch mcconnell: football is an important part of life. i take it seriously. about 12 season tickets every year. i have some regulars. one of them goes back to college and we go to every home game. and an occasional awaken. i would a day of it. we go out early in one of my friends has an rv. in the parking lot and we talk about what will happen in the game and then we go to the game and then we talk about what did happen in the game. it's a lengthy exercise. it is one of the great joys of life. lamar alexander: plus jump ahead a little bit. talking about the early 1960s when you are the university of louisville. you and i both drove to washington. we just eat realized in a green mustang. you work for center from kennedy and i worked for senator howard baker and i can remember in 1969, senator baker saying to me, you need to go over and meet that smart young legislature made mitch mcconnell. but let's go back to louisville, he led a march on the capital about civil rights. you are in washington as i was. to hear martin luther king news speech in august of 1963. i have a dream. you'd had coldwater come speak to the university of louisville because you but you voted for lynden johnson in 1954 credit what happened. mitch mcconnell: in our generation i think the civil rights was a defining moment in our generation. in 1962, i had when i was a college republican president, i had accepted invitation and then in 63, the summer of 63, people like you and myself pepsi the i have a dream speech and then and 64 i was an intern. two important things happen and 64. senator was in the middle of breaking - i was mad as hell about it. i was so irritated about goldwater voting against the civil rights bill, and kinda defining the republican party in a way that i felt would be fortunate that i voted for lynden johnson. which in retrospect was a huge mistake. but it was a protest. as a protest vote. lamar alexander: for the feeling carried over into your senate days. you voted, when president reagan vetoed the sanction on south africa, you voted not to override art, i mean, you did vote to override his veto. most republicans did not do. it. mitch mcconnell: i just felt like reagan who is bothered by people like you and me something wrong about whether or not south african sanctions could work. when other people think that sanctions never work and occasionally they do. they work in south africa and in burbank, a number of years later. i thought reagan was wrong. i did vote to override his veto. lamar alexander: how did you get interested in an extraordinary thing that lasted over 20 years. i remember watching you stand up and make speeches on the senate floor. i really wondered what you're doing. mitch mcconnell: i started following her, after she won the nobel peace prize and 91. and for the listeners who are not familiar with her, her weather was sort of the founder of modern but he did live very long. he got assassinated. she went off to europe and went to school and lived in the united states for a while and married a guy from britain and two sons and england and going back to burma in 1988. to care for her sick mother. this movement started at that time. and she was sort of thrust into the leadership. military which around the country since the early 60s decided to have a free and fair election in the got creamed. the reaction to getting creamed in the frame fair election was tourist all of the people who got elected. i put her under house arrest in her own house which are made most of the time for 21 years. so we would footnotes to each other over the years. i offered along with some others burma sanction bills, that actually ultimately mayday difference. lamar alexander: you visited her not long ago. did you not. mitch mcconnell: amazingly enough, the regime beginning to crumble. in 2011. so then we were able to talk on the phone. and i actually went to burma in january of 2012, and got to see her in person and invited her to come to the university to the mcconnell center and she did come in september of 2012. and now she's tobacco elected leadership later of the country. even though the constitution prohibits anyone who is married to a foreigner who has been married to a foreigner to be president. putting into the constitution exactly to keep referring bring president. she's a de facto president. she put in a president who's a close ally. lamar alexander: you mentioned them a call center at the university of louisville. what is it. mitch mcconnell: is basically a scholarship program for the best and brightest kids. it started about 25 years ago pretty have to be from kentucky and there are ten interpreted ten freshman and ten sophomore and 1010 years. so it's designed to compete with ivy league schools. they get sharper skills to stay in kentucky. if they stay there, they're more likely to stay there after school. 79 percent of the graduates have chosen to stay in kentucky. in most of the chart kids go off to the east and never come back. what i do is bring in speakers, and we've had some great ones over the years. hillary clinton was there and she is secretary of state. joe biden was there white he was vice president and get to meet probably with who are the speakers. all 40 of them do. and they get to address a larger audience while they are there. lamar alexander: let's switch to politics. you'll 16 races and kentucky and 12 really. counting primaries. let's talk about the first one. bloodhound commercial. i think all of us, our political activist, not all of us will admit it but we all are. and you surely were. your 30 points behind. in july the election year. so the bloodhound at what was up. mitch mcconnell: it was a desperate situation. roger mills was now pretty well known. lamar alexander: had a trying him. mitch mcconnell: in those days, he was doing political consulting. during commercials. lamar alexander: it so he was wiling to take somebody on it was 30 points behind in a democratic state. mitch mcconnell: i appreciated the fact that he was going to take me on. this is a tough competitor. you can see how he started cnbc for nbc and started talks for murdoch. here's the situation. it was july of the election year. 1984. i was down 34 points. when a meeting in louisville. i said roger, is this race over. and here's what he said. i've never known anybody coming from this far behind this late in the game but, i don't think it's over. a very competitive guy. i was running against a pretty smart democratic incumbent who did have a lot of obvious abilities we were looking for something of issue that the needle in the haystack if you will print it turned out, back in the honorary days, women have holes making speeches for money and he was doing this. he was missing wilson center four. suture that in two couple of ads featuring a kentucky type person with bloodhound out looking for him to get him back to work and it electrified the campaign. he got the people interested in it. that got people talking about it then there was a sequel later. we looked like an actor who is being chased by the docks who literally ended up in a tree. in the key line there was we got to know. it's not exactly a landslide. for tens of 1 percent. even though reagan carried 49 of the 50 states. we lost two seats in the senate. he was the only democrat event, senator normal country that year. lamar alexander: i would say the defined your method of campaigning. it is to smash them in the mouth before they get started. probably, i'm just guessing your toughest campaign, other than that was the last 2014. because you have the senate conservatives fund coming at you from the right and harry reid coming from the left and it was a pretty big role that you started right out by an ad that culture republican opponent, now the governor of kentucky, bailout. mitch mcconnell: you and i witnessed the results in 2010 and 2012. lamar alexander: i was glad all of the attention was on you. mitch mcconnell: the senate conservatives and sallies, and basically cost us five races. that was in ten and in 2012. nominating people who couldn't win. and so at the beginning of 2014 i said not only this race but other races were not going to allow it to happen anymore. and so what we did not only in my race but other racing around the country, we get the most electable people nominated. basically we took them on. because if you are dealing a group of people who have been compromising and always want to make appointment never want to make a difference. the only thing to do if you want to win the election is to be them and so we want every primary and fitting my own as you indicated my primary firm was a ready incredible guy. he actually carried to out of hundred 20 counts. lamar alexander: is a to came on, this is like your fistfight with dickie. this is a concern of his funds have been wondering around the country. destroying the republican party like a drug who tears up every bar they walk in. the difference this cycle is that they stroll into mr. coelho news barn, he's not going to throw you out, is going to lock the door. does a pretty fighting words. mitch mcconnell: not only my race but several others. which of the senate back. when the most electable candidates on the november ballot everywhere. lamar alexander: let's talk about the senate democratic leader. repeat. you and i were at the funeral a few days ago. and you and senator reid both spoke and he said what i have often heard both of you safe for people think the mitch mcconnell and i don't like you print and we are good friends print and piercing in your book, difference with harry reid. but then you say is going to jekyll and hyde personality. and when hears that he says you classless and you like donald trump think women are dogs and pigs. you say, that in your book but i think you said another places the maybe the worst majority leader. so the senate is a place in relationships, what about this relationship between democratic and republicans. are you friends. mitch mcconnell: i have been very public about a couple of things. number one and it like the way he shut the senate down and prevented people from voting. and the way he ran the senate. and i think is public rhetoric is frequently very inappropria inappropriate. lamar alexander: like what. mitch mcconnell: the example you've just mentioned just a few weeks before we were taping this, he took all of donald trump's most outrageous comments and attributed them to me or did i don't do that to him. it so i don't think there's an equivalence here. when the nevertheless here i think a lot of people say we are disputing all of the time. we aren't feuding all of the time. we talk on a daily basis. i do object to the way you run the senate. and michael and this court majority is be as different in every way from harry and the weight that he ran the previous majority. in other words i am trying to do everything totally different. so i do object in a way here in the senate. and i do object to the rhetoric. like calling alan greenspan a political hack. alan greenspan may be many things but political pack he certainly isn't. and george w bush calling him at others are saying the iraq war is lost. by the middle of a major military exercise there. i can't fail to express my objection to that kind of rhetoric which is frequently flat-out wrong. lamar alexander: plus take one of the person. you talk with the senate conservative funds and you write about senator reid and you have a chapter titled professor obama. why did you choose those words. mitch mcconnell: the president is a very smart guy. i think he knows a lot about a lot of things. i think he would do a better job of dealing with others if he was or spend less time trying to appoint whoever he is talking to in the moment his brilliance and more time listening. just drop in contrast. i've been in a number of major fuel to the vice president. he doesn't spend any time trying to convince me of things he knows i don't believe. i don't spend any time trying to convince him of things. in other words, you don't waste any time on all of that. get down to trying to figure out what we can do together because he knows how far i can go and i know far how far he can go pretty think the president would be better off, he's a brilliant guy, successful, and his political career and rising quickly to the top in american politics. but i don't think the sort of incessant lectures very helpful in getting an outcome if you're in some kind of negotiations. let's talk about divided government. ever to talk about that a lot. you express your disappointment. they you and president haven't been able to accomplish more together because i've heard you say the divided government is the time we do hard things. because use for the responsibility around. now the democrats say about you, that you said early on, intermingle was make president obama in one term president. i heard you say that you mayday speech early on that it is time to go to work on entitlements and offer a hand to do that and you never heard back from anybody. his fault is it that we haven't taken advantage of this seven years of divided government to do more. mitch mcconnell: obviously have a point of view of that. on the obama one term president, i do admire a major reporter in town who reported the rest of what i said. right after that which was that in the meantime, we had plenty of work to do. and we to look for ways to work together. and it was conveniently stepped off by almost everyone. i think divided government is probably the only time you can do big transformative things. for an example, reagan and tip o'neill, raise the age for social security. reagan and tip o'neill to the last comprehensive tax reform. bill clinton republican congress balanced-budget three years in a row. big stuff. arguably none of that could've been done in a unified government. week to give you an example of unified government can not produce a big outcome. george w. bush has just been reelected in 20 oh four and he asked all of us to tackle social security. i was number two inner conference of the time i spent a year trying to get any democrat, even joe most reasonable democrat to join with us in their attitude was of the white house, and you have the house. at the senate. you want to do something on social security, you do it. and what that means is we'll see you at the next election. it's my disappointment with barack obama is two things that have to be done to save america. from the path that we are headed. entitlement eligibility changes. you have to change the eligibility in a very popular thing like medicare and social security, to the demographics of america tomorrow. not american in the 30s on the 60s, social security in the 30s and medicare's in the 60s, the president knows that. he is a very smart guy. he doesn't want to do it. comprehensive tax reform, it's been 30 years and you need to do it again. it is not for the purpose of getting more revenue for the government is for the purpose of making america more competitive the president want to cover his of tax reform. in any other way other than to try to get additional revenue for the government. so these two big transformative issues, we have been unable to address because the nation news ceo simply doesn't want to do it. lamar alexander: maybe the best example of one way to do that, was in the civil rights in the 60s and we both saw that and i remember when i first came up your for the senator baker, dixon was a republican leader. and he is the office you know half and four days, are the big table there, senators came in and out as democrats and republicans work together to see if they could get enough votes 67 which is what it then took. and they did that and johnson and dixon did that together because of their very special relationship and you have in your book story of senator john sherman cooper took you as a youngster to the voting rights act in 1965 for signing. you had a conversation with the daughter. mitch mcconnell: yeah, i saw lucy in 2008. i never met her, and i said this, we've never met, but i was in this very room when your dad signed the voting rights act in 1865. and she said i was too. anna said i'm sure everybody knew you were there and nobody knew i was. i was in the back of the room. and she said i will tell you why was there. my daddy said to me given the car, i'm going to take you down with something important. explain to me on the way down to the hill, why he was going to be featured in his remarks. and the reason she said why would you ever republican. and she said the president johnson said to her, not only do most of the republicans vote for him, the nation will be more likely to accept it if they think we have been this together. alyssa johnson at 2008 explain why she was there in 1965. lamar alexander: to do that, they had relationships and their bakeries to tell me about the time he heard his father-in-law dixon take those phone call in his office and he heard him say no mr. president i can't come down and have a drink with you tonight. did that last night. in the well is met a man about 30 minutes later there's russell outside and two beagles came and followed by a president of the united states. lynden johnson said, everett if you will come down to have a drink with me, i am here to have one with you and they disappeared in the back room. this was the same office and civil rights bill. and that relationship precedes probably the divided government let's talk about the senate. in the institutional little bit and you alluded to earlier. use intermingle is to restore the senate. as an institution. and there is something of a story and he thought about getting your phd in history or time. anyone onto the floor before you were majority leader and said you wanted to run the senate the way senator mike ran it. he is the majority leader 16 years of the time. and you and i were there. mitch mcconnell: what i meant by that we were talking about this earlier in my critique of harry's. as majority leader. first of all, you have to open the senate up. last year of the previous majority, there were only 15 roll call votes on amendments. the entire year. the first year of the new majority in 2015, with over 200. see open the senate up and you let people vote. number two, when we talk about regular order which most people don't know what that means. lamar alexander: pfizer glazing. mitch mcconnell: means the bills actually work on together comes out to the floor with bipartisan support has a better chance of success. the best example i can think of. in a have to be your bill to completely rewrite the so-called no child left behind bill passed in the early bush 43 years which proved to be unworkable and unpopular. and by the time he brought it out of committee you had to democrats in the republicans lined up to get to the floor which relatively opened amendments. nothing a ready god every thing they wanted but it did pass with the majority. and we have done that time after time after time on the majority. it could be a five-year highway bill. most people think women and then 20 years. comprehensive energy bills, cybersecurity, permanent internet tax moratorium, age or opioid and heroin opioid bill. we are hoping to achieve something really important again coming out of your committee, related to some of the incredible cures the same to be just around the corner for our country. what is all of this have in common. in a time of divided government, where focusing on the things that we can agree on. and we do those. because when people elect divided a government think what they're saying is i know you have big differences but why don't you look to the things you agree on and do those. and that is how this majority is totally different from previous months. speech of is important to say that for you say it but what you have to do is give the other side credit. in my case, no child left behind that would never would've happened if senator patty murray of washington, leading democrat had been is interested in the result as i had. and i've done my medical research. it is not a bad thing to give somebody else credit. usually, it helps you get you to where you want to go. you've been here 50 years. working for and actually little more than that working for senator cooper. what is the most difference about the senate today and what is something that is the same. mitch mcconnell: i think what is different, is into party labels really sort of mean something today. when you and i first came to washington, there were liberal republicans and conservative democrats. i think into party labels today, are more descriptive of america's two party system. the republicans are mostly all right to center and the democrats are mostly all left of center. so think the labels mean more today than they did then. that is different. what i think isn't different, is there isn't as much animosity or unwillingness to work together as it is pretrade. in the media. and the internet and the 24 hour cable television going on, people get hammered with what they teach them in journalism school that only bad news conflict is news and the people are way more upset about the process than they ought to be. they are legitimately upset about where they are in their lives. it's a fact that the average american history 4000 year were soft today than they were for example when president obama came to office. so that is a legitimate complaint. the senate used to be essential. where my great frustrations is so many people know that. lamar alexander: i remember when i came to the senate as a senator having worked in it before, thought he knew what i was getting into but i did realize what it was like to work in a body that operates by unanimous consent. most people don't realize that you're the majority leader but if you look the listen carefully and c-span, you will stand up at the end of the end of the day and say i asked consent that the senate open tomorrow at 930 and then we have a prayer and a ♪ ♪ in. and if one senator objects, you have to start over. how would you, if you had to suggest to someone a book to read, about understanding the senate do one or two come to mind? mitch mcconnell: it would probably put people to sleep because the senate is ironically working out pretty much the way george washington predicted. according to legend he was asked when he presided over the constitutional convention, what you think the senate will be like and he said he thought it would be like a saucer in the teacup entity would wash out of the cup and cool off. why did he say that. sinners hundred years ago were not elected they were elected by the legislature. i think on purpose, the founders wanted the senate to be a place where the bricks can be applied pretty easily the brakes. and then over the years, as you suggest the notion of unlimited debate, empowered every single senator to have an impact. if the house was like a triangle with a speaker at the top, where all on a level playing field. but after that, it's pretty much jump off. so stepping back from all of the inertia, what should people take away but the senate, the senate is the place where things are slowed down and rarely done on a strictly partisan bases unless you have a huge number of your party. >> i think the first chapter about lynden johnson, his master of the senate and maybe veterans c2 but is called the desk of the senate and that struck me when after the election, the engineers come in and in the democrats and one more than the rate public tents, they unbolt the republican desk and move them over to the other side to even it out. to me it's a wonderful way to begin to think about the way the place works. and let me switch gears completely. you were married and had three daughters, divorced while you are there jefferson county which is louisville. you're a bachelor for 13 years. and then at the suggestion of a friend, you've had your assistant telephone the assistant for the chairman of the federal maritime commission and that's how you met elaine we have now married. it was a very romantic beginning. mitch mcconnell: you know, i befriended a couple of people when i was a staffer. and kept up with them over the years. i had my own career. i had as you indicated been single for quite a while and single when it came to the senate. i wanted to meet so many no. so i called up this spring from a long time ago and i said you know anybody knew when she said i've got the woman you want to meet. and that was elaine chao. her family is a class example of why we never want to totally curtail immigration in this country. lamar alexander: tell me something about her family story. it's remarkable. mitch mcconnell: her mom and dad born in maine lynn china, when they were young they were dodging the japanese invasion of china. and then when they got to be a little bit older, there was the communist revolution. they separately managed to get out of mainland china and go to taiwan. and they had met briefly on the mainland and my father-in-law taken a liking to her so research in taiwan for two years to find her. and they got married and had three daughters of their and my wife elaine is the oldest. but he was an ambitious young man. he wanted to do better. so came to america for three years by himself and worked multiple jobs trying to get a start and shipping business pretty had it been a ship news captain. in taiwan and he wanted to be more than that. so for three years, he worked multiple jobs to get a start and he called for my late mother-in-law and the three daughters to come over. they did have enough money for an airline ticket. the came over in the freighter. they were the only people other than the crew and the vote commodity. finally ended up in small apartment in queens. he kept working. i kept having kids. they ended up with six daughters, four of them went to harvard business school. and one is a lawyer, he built a very successful shipping business. it is the kind of story that you see all across america which is another reason why even in moments where we are frustrated about attitudes about illegal immigration to remember that we were all virtually all of us, unless your african-americans are who were brought here against their will, sons and daughters of risktakers. as of this constant renewal process we have people come here legally with ambition and want to accomplish and intend to be there most best americans. i think elaine and her family are a classic example of that predispute want to ask you about senators. one is living in the rest of them are deceased. the living one is john mccain. you and he had a big brawl over the first amendment. most people may not know they are first amendment view had to do with basically no limits on campaign finance disclosure. then you voted against the constitutional amendment that would've been dissipation of the american flag. you pretty far out there in the first movement. john mccain disagreed with you. you fought in supreme court and you lost. that was what is your relationship with john mccain today. mitch mcconnell: that's a good example of being able to have something like a drag out fight over issues. we are very close. whatever about ten years. pretty stressful twin is. i called them up and after he won and it was actually one of the worst days of my life actually was walking a republican house and a republican senate and republican past the bill that was supposed to deeply opposed to it and i lost in supreme court. and i call them up and said you what i lost. and we found that a lot of other things we can work on things together. we become best friends and allies on a whole variety of different things that's the way the senate ought to work. it frequently does. i'm not sure people in the public know that. lamar alexander: to consider him an american hero. mitch mcconnell: absolutely. lamar alexander: i would like you to give me one or two sentences about each of the following united states senators. all of them deceased. the first thing that comes your mind and replay. mitch mcconnell: another great compromise or. lamar alexander: lynden johnson. mitch mcconnell: as a senator, overrated. i think mike mansfield. lamar alexander: while mike mansfield. mitch mcconnell: pastor of the senate. lamar alexander: everett dirks. mitch mcconnell: indispensable player who knew when to oppose and when to join others in an unsettling held hero. lamar alexander: senator cooper of kentucky. mitch mcconnell: role model, young man. great conviction. very smart. she took ted kennedy. mitch mcconnell: he was one of the many books about him, he roared and you and i both knew when he was passionate almost about everything. in many ways, i think the most accomplish kennedy, he never meant to be president. never was attorney general. but i think in almost every way, the most accomplish kennedy certainly most accomplish senator as a kennedy. lamar alexander: we slept with bump up going to lincoln day dinners and all you do is mention the kennedy name. when i made my first speech on the senate floor about the market history, he came over unsolicited and took my bill without god 20 democratic cosponsors within a day. he knew exactly how to make the senate work. senator robert byrd. mitch mcconnell: could well have been a historian. lamar alexander: during the presidential campaign, this year, governor christie got over senator rubio for repeating himself during intimate. in your book, you say, when i start boring myself to tears and no i am beginning to drive the message home. in other words, you think redundancy is a good thing. mitch mcconnell: i'm probably one of the few people without rubio was doing the right thing. i think in politics is repetitious. and if trying to drive a message, you to repeat it a lot. to make the point. i tried to do that. in meetings we have with our colleagues. lamar alexander: i noticed. mitch mcconnell: you can always count on about three force not paying any attention the first time. so if you really trying to make a point, repetition is a good thing. lamar alexander: want to ask you about a period of time and emotions during the time. after three terms you are finally elected with the number two position. that was november 13, 2002. then a month later, trent went to the birthday party and said something about thurman and suddenly he had to resign as leader, a position you had always wanted. and you would seem to be the logical person to move up and senator bill frisch, took the position. and then at the end of january, you had triple bypass surgery. so what was your range of emotions during that to influence about all of those things. mitch mcconnell: my feeling was that probably i would not have the opportunity to be the leader the party of the senate. he 17 years older. unfortunately the health problem i had worked out fine. i had doubts during that period and i had just been bypassed by somebody was ten years into the night and has significant health problems so i've wondered if i would've ever had an opportunity. to have the job that i had really had been hoping to have for quite a while. so is a challenging. like other challenges, and i want to make story seem all of that unique. if you just don't quite and just keep plugging, chances are you will get where you're headed. always tell students i spent a lot of time, the only way to fill in america is to quit her diet will have speed bumps. we all have setbacks. are we defeated by them are doing just shake it off and keep on going. so i got my second chance. bill decided to leave the senate and i had to be leader party that i wanted to be. but then there was another disappointment. it wasn't the majority leader. it was a minority leader. lamar alexander: and he gave some of that regarding republican violence. you talk quite a bit about that in your book. the politics of futile gesture. when he mean by that. mitch mcconnell: it would be something like when we shut down the government and defund obama care. that is a futile gesture. obama news in the white house obviously obama is not going to sign such a bill. the politics of gesture is describing futile gesture tactical move maneuvers and no chance of success. that only by the party. that has been a challenge. it's been a bigger check challenge in the house of representatives that it has been in the senate. there's only a couple of people in the senate who have that kind of approach. but it has been a challenge. but on the outside side with the actions of the senate. now the way we weep it without on the outside is to beat them. just simply beat them in the primaries. many go to menominee who considered senate who first ball winds and sickening comes into the senate without that kind of mentality thinking that her job is only to throw stones everyday. and ever achieve anything. lamar alexander: one of the disadvantages of it is that the message that you would like to deliver which is that the republican majority is accomplishing a lot. it is silly because you have some republicans going around saying it's not an image presidential candidate saying it is not. that makes it harder to elect a republican president and keep a republican. mitch mcconnell: is not just about messaging. we all want to do things for our country. no matter what our backgrounds are, i think virtually, not everybody but virtually everybody comes here actually wants to accomplish things for our country. i need to deal with it. barack obama whether i like it or not, got elected. and he's been there for eight years. and to suggest where to spend hundred percent of her time simply fighting with him, rather than trying to look for some of the things that we can agree on that would make progress of the country always struck me as absurd. lamar alexander: why did you decide to write a book now. mitch mcconnell: i think it was becoming majority leader after all of these years. i called in the long game. it did happen overnight. certainly not overnight sensation. and i thought it was a time in which senate needed to be operated differently. susan vivid point for the senate. i think it is the reason i chose this particular time. lamar alexander: if you were the came in in the world one law that you could pass, what would be. mitch mcconnell: i think i would fix the entitlement eligibility problem. i think the one issue is the unsustainable current, the way medicare and social security are currently crafted is unsustainable. it's the one thing that could completely take our country. it speaketh centers have a weekly prayer breakfast on wednesdays. the former majority leader said something that stuck in my mind. he often thinks that if he wishes he had price even more than he did, the power he had when he had it read in other words, he was saying take advantage of this incredible accidental power that you have. did you ever think about that. mitch mcconnell: i do. all majorities are fleeting. depending upon what the american people decide this november, i could be the minority leader next year. in the majority leader position does present a real opportunity even in a body like the senate. it's very difficult to make function. and there are advantages to setting the agenda and what we call the first recognition to move the country in the direction you like to go. as i just don't know how long that will last. he don't miss any opportunity to try to make the country better. and you have to deal with the government issue that you have. i wish obama was not present but he is. lamar alexander: we have about three or four minutes left alone to give you a chance to answer a question that i get asked about that speech that i made the senator news unity got blue sponsors for. it was about encouraging the teaching of american history in our schools so our children can grow up learning what it means to be an american. and i take those teachers, when they come in the senate floor early in the end of the day when senator can do that, they go to the desk and find webster's desk. and invariably one question which is my last question. what message would you like for us to take back to our students about the united states senate and the future of our country. mitch mcconnell: i think the senate has been indispensable legislative body. because that is a place where things are sorted out. the place were only rarely does the majority get things exactly their own way. the place where stability can occur. most people obviously don't think that. in an era which everybody wants instant gratification, if you are looking for instant gratification or perfection, the senate would not be a good place for you. lamar alexander: and at a time when many americans are not optimistic about our country news future, what would you want those teachers to tell their students about their future in this country. mitch mcconnell: i think because of our ignorance of american history, we always think the crime. we are in is tougher than others. we've had nothing like the civil war. and we have not had a single instance where the congressman almost beat to death. in america had plenty of tough challenges. world wars, depressions, this is a great country. we are going to deal with whatever our current problems are and move on. to another level and i am just as optimistic as i ever was that this generation is going to leave behind a better america and her parents left behind for us. speaketh that is not optimistic message from the kid who had polio and overcame it, send sites to be in the united states senate, made it, and became a majority leader after about 50 years of keeping his eye and the ball. in this life and we have to be careful really because you are likely to get there and senator mitch mcconnell did. thank you very much for talking with us. >> this program with senate majority leader mitch mcconnell is available to watch online at booktv.org. this in the impeachment trial resumes on monday. live on "c-span2". cspan2, your unfiltered view of government. created by cable in 1979 brought to you today by your television provider. >> book tv covers book fairs and festivals around the country. here's what's coming up. our 2020-decibel season will kick off next wednesday with the rancho mirage writers festival in california. blood by our live coverage of the savannah book festival in georgia in february. then we will be life from arizona for the tucson festival of books followed by the another book festival. for more information about upcoming book fairs and festivals, and watch our previous festival coverage, click the book fair tab on our website book tv .org. .-ellipsis . . >>