Transcripts For CSPAN2 Federal Bureau Of Prisons Director Testifies Before Senate Judiciary... 20240713

We will get started just in a second. Welcome, i have a brief Opening Statement and doctors lawyer thank you for coming. Well get you sworn in here in a moment. Its important that we have this oversight here and there is a couple of inquiry and everything is about Jeffrey Epstein and hopefully about the first steps act and where could we go from there and how could you build upon that and those of three areas i would like to talk about at all tonight over. Thank you very much mister chairman. I want to welcome you and its wonderful for me to say a woman in charge so we can celebrate for a few moments at least that you are responsible for the care and custody of over 180,000 federal inmates and one of the Justice Departments largest employers and approximately 35,500 employees as may of this year. As the chairman mentioned there are two issues i hope we can focus on. One is the First Step Act which you mentioned and the second is applaud blooms with staffing within your department. Im going to put most of this in the record. I think what ill do mister chairman in the interest of time is put the statement in the record. Without objection. Thank you mister chairman. Last Year Congress came together to pass what i considered one of the most important criminal Justice Reform laws and the nation. The first stepped hacked from overwhelming majority signed by President Trump and we now have an obligation to ensure that this law will probably be implemented and we think chairman gram for holding this and were disappointed that the department of justice refuse the bipartisan request to testify today. This is one of the many troubling signs that they are not on board with implementing the First Step Act. The act of 2010, which i coauthored with senator grassley and le were not just potter disparity from 18 to one. The department of justice is the fair sentencing act from individuals in some cases even working to put them behind bars. I wrote the provision of the first step to act for nonviolent defenders and take the position that the justice is just taking is plain wrong. It department of justice should be working to identify eligible individuals and not waste valuable resources to keep them behind bars. So far, at least 1600 people have been induce because of the application of their sentencing act. There should be more. Id like to recognize mister chairman to visitors who are here today. They have benefited and one has benefited from the First Step Act and i like to recognize my constituent Edward Douglas and his exceptional lawyer who are here today. Thank you for joining us. Could you raise your hands . Thank you. Edward douglas received a life sentence triggered by two minor nonviolent convictions. He served 16 years in prison, became one of the first people released under the First Step Act. Given a Second Chance, edward and others who are here today are making the criminal Justice System better and more just. Its worth all of our time and effort to pass the First Step Act. I hope it will inspire all of us to search for partisan solutions and the department of justice to change his mind and join us. Thank you. Thank you. Doctor soy are, a mere presence in 1976 as a psychologist at the federal collection in town and in 1983 she was named the chief of psychology of Psychological Services and had increasing responsibilities since then. She has previously served as director from 1992 to 2003. She is reappointed as director in august of this year would you please rise . Yes sir. Raise your hand. Do you testimony by this committee as the truth, the whole truth and nothing but to do so help you god . I do sir. Welcome and the floor is yours. Good morning. I appreciate the opportunity to discuss with you today the mission and operations of the bureau of prisons. I think for you for your work with the bureau for many years. If an integral for many years, including our years of the population growth, expense in an opening up new institutions. I thank you and your colleagues for a Ground Breaking work and that bipartisan work. I look forward to implementing our critical pieces of legislation. Returning inmates has always been a cornerstone of our mission. We have long held at an inmates reentry journey begins the day they arrive in our custody, with the first act, we look forward to further enriching the offering to help improve the lives of our inmates, thereby help keeping our communities safer. I was on a three months ago to be selected by attorney general barr to return to lead to bureau, and to work alongside the finance congressional officials in the world. I began as a psychology intern and one of our prisons, and held positions at increasingly a sociability, including warden, before my promotion. Much has changed in the 16 years that i was outside of the bureau, and since the last served as director. The foundation is still quite sound. We have been challenged significantly by the dramatic growth, they experienced commiserate with significant budget cuts that all the tragedy of 9 11, when this focus shift came from crime to terrorism. Our budget suffered severely after that period, our over 300,000 staff goes largely unseen by the general public. This inherently dangerous work, politically at our highest security institutions, where our most dangerous and waits serve, is responsibility we take very seriously. Unfortunately, we have experienced significant Staff Shortages that make our job even more difficult. In my first 12 weeks, i have placed great emphasis on filling our 3000 vacancies nationwide. Since returning as director, of mobilized the system live overview to identify areas of strength and witnesses, and ive identified three significant areas that need emphasis. One, staffing. One is training, and the third is an infamous on sound correctional practices. Our system is the largest in the nation, housing hundred 76,000 inmates, and this is critical to ensure our staff are following the policies and procedures that keep staff, and mates in the public safe. The bureau also continues to face dangerous threats from the introduction of contraband, synthetic drugs, narcotics and carbon cellphones are the threats. The use of drones is an ongoing problem that continues to evolve. We have employed technologies and continue to leverage new technologies and solutions to detect and enter day contraband. Some they do over 80 years old. To our earliest periods of corrections. Since they are continuously used, and this aging infrastructure sustained extensive where it here and premature deterioration. This is the first act, and i am pleased to report that we have made great progress. Weve implemented the many requirements of the act, and the independent review quality on the act that it requires. Weve listened too many advocacy groups, the statutory timelines in this act are very formidable, but im proud to say that we have met key deadlines. We continue to balance the force step act. I will be happy to answer any questions you might. Half as i indicated i want to talk about the death of mr. Epstein. Do you concur with the opinion that it was a suicide . That was the finding of the corner. If any evidence to suggest otherwise . How did this happen . The death and the whole situation is still under the investigation of the fbi, and the Inspector Generals Office. Im not at liberty to discuss the specifics of this case. I can discuss issues around and situational operations, but i cannot talk about that particular issue. With the case this high profile, there has to be a major malfunction and the system to allow this to happen, so are you looking at both, the fbi is looking at both . If the fbi is it off, the looking at a criminal enterprise. Do you have people in custody today of this high profile nature . Have we done anything to adjust since mr. Epsteins death . We take every and made life very seriously in the bureau of prisons. A highprofile invite isnt the more important or significant in terms of our operations than just the average and might that comes our. They high profile, so that is on the suicide watch. I would like to explain that system. I can talk about epstein, but we have different tiers of response, of an and made that has suicidal thinking. I came as a psychologist, i worked with very suicidal inmates, and i know how difficult it is that it is too protect was suicidal and who is not. Once we have identified a suicide watch operation, we place inmates in. Its a very difficult setting where everything instructs in the room, except a mattress. They get a course of gal to wear that cannot be trusted in any way they can hang themselves from it. They have one mattress and one blanket, and they are watched constantly, theres nothing else in that room. Was he on suicide . Watch yes. The average time on suicide watch is only about 24 hours, because it is such a stark and depressing situation. We then can move into another to europe observation, which is called psychological observation. That happened in this case . I cant speak specifically but im sharing his wishes original you can understand our procedure. There is another tier which is a psychological observation where they get their clothes back and there more a normalize setting at their scrutinized every moment of the day but that is a much more normal environment. Im sorry. Do they have roommates . Not on suicide watch cars are being watched continuously. Did mr. Epstein have a roommate when he committed suicide . He did not. This psychological observation is seen repeatedly and one of the storm and at the threat of suicide seems to have passed, then they can be returned back to the open population. Clearly, it didnt work here so we will wait for the report because everything on mr. Epstein had their heart ripped out because i never see them again. Parole. When did parole or what was paroled alleviated from the system . I became director and 92 and parole was already gone for a new cases it was old cases that it was gone so it was the late eighties early nineties. When was that role implemented in . You have to ask congress. There was people up here that made that decision. Do you have any recommendations on whether we should look at reinstitute in parole with the federal law . Im encouraged by the First Step Act sir, how would that be different and parole . It would be significantly different in what respect that i was going to comment on. Parole is an incentive and they want to get involved in programs and want to do positive things. Because they saw the benefit in that and they can earn earlier release. If they are hearing this commission is favorable. First step back it is offered some new incentives to want to perform well and engage in programs because a lot of programs out there for the past many years and none of them are as high as what were looking for because a lot of times the inmates if they were doing didnt seem to benefit for them. The First Step Act helps in that regard to want to improve themselves and to move forward. What system would give the most flexibility in terms of deciding who to release and someone has been there 25 to 30 years or 40 or 50 year sentence and parole about bit differently than the First Step Act . Is that correct . They parole act and the Parole Commission who were interviewing an inmate who would have different points in their career institutions would look at the progress on how they done how they benefited and how they repaired to be. Would there be a push or review that should be reinstated on the federal level . We havent thought about that what wed look to happy to step back. Let me know. Wed be happy to do that. Thank you very much mister chairman. On november 17th, the New York Times published a story of hazing, humiliation and terror and working well female in the federal prison. Now given the fact and i wrote this in a leather in a letter to mr. Oral wits last year. That the borough has been unnoticed since 2010. That it was clear at that time and sufficient steps were not taken to protect female guards. I requested that the department of justice ig investigate the boroughs failure to adequately address harassment of female guards. We ask that the ig look into the situation. What is the situation today and what has been done to address this issue . Senator, when you have women and obviously im a woman and i worked at the prison for 30 years. When you have women in prison with all male inmates, you have a lot of knuckleheads in that institution. As a woman on a metro car as to be careful here in d. C. That guys are going to move up against them and try to touch them or walk down the street and get catcalls from workers on his side. There are not jobs all over the place and youre going to find them in an institution ought also. There are going to be times when the in misbehave very inappropriately to our female staff. Our female staff need to stand up and address that. The problem with these Sexual Harassment issues that were raised that were made a gravely is when the female staff did not feel the male staff or male counterparts were coming to their insistence in aid. Thats where we drop the ball and we cant always control the behavior of inmates because what do they have to lose if you write the report, new have them in special housing for a while may come back. The part of this that angered me tremendously when the female staff went with the male staff were not stepping up to help them. That is where our attention is educating all of our staff out there and we all our colleagues and need to be treated professionally and its never okay to allow anyone to disrespect our other colleagues. So that is our action and weve had some reports with various inmates and held the staff accountable. Let me ask you this question. Today, do managers separate a female correctional staff officer from a senior officer who made sexual comments and propositions . Yes, whenever we are aware of his situation with a threat assessment and we determine whether or not those two individuals were investigated and whether they continue to Work Together in the same environment. If theres any concern and they are separated. What exactly has been done to remedy that situation . As i said, we increased have you separated and what to be done . I dont have the numbers with me i can get those for you but we have increased the penalties on inmates that behave that way and educated our staff in terms of that being Inappropriate Conduct to not support your colleagues and fines female or male Staff Members who will do the same thing and we will take action on those in investigating to take appropriate action. I would like to see the documentation on what you have done in that regard and so i requested now and in my past i served six years on the california womens term of parole and had sentences with parole and ran the womens prison. I know a little bit about prisons. And ive been in a large number and everyone in california as a matter of fact. So, i am concerned about this on a federal level. I think it is a vague and imprecise. I would like to know exactly what has happened and what has been done to remedy the situation. If you could buy that up to me i would be very grateful for it. I share your concern senator and ill get the information. Thank you very much. Youre very welcome. Before i ask questions, im not going to ask these groups to stand but i want to thank people that support the First Step Act for coming here for this hearing and due process against families against mandatory minimums and of local prison locals. Before i get to some questions about the First Step Act. I want to comment because some critics of the First Step Act will have the case of jewel francisco, a prisoner in new jersey who was lit released on a crack cocaine sentence which was calculated and making the sentences closer to those imposed for powdered cocaine and october, francisco was arrested for first degree murder. Question, francisco would have gotten out of prison even without the First Step Act. Is that a correct . Eventually, yes or. The First Step Act will help prevent the crimes like this in the future by steering more prisoners away from future criminal conduct . I would hope so sir. Now, in regards to the first stepped act enforcement. I want to complement the people at the prison or senator urban and i visited a couple of months ago for what i get from them as a real good faith effort to carry out. My question is, since the First Step Act seeks to reduce sentences among them offenders, Congress Passes this law with the presence that develop a risk and Assessment Tool to make sure prisoners risk of recidivism is a program that they should be and rolled into reduce citizens. Which was released in july of the Justice Department has knowledge that the job is only have done because the prisms toolss quote was not included successfully in this component. Question. When can we expect borough prisms to comply with the first effect with implementing these tools a segment tools . Senator, weve been working closely with the department of the development of the Risk Assessment and the pattern that is actually based on our own system thats rich citizen based and we improved its which is the Risk Assessment. We have a Needs Assessment that weve been using for years and it doesnt quite me the stringent for the first step to pack but were not required to have it completely finish until the end of next year with the timeframe thats laid out. We will be initiating the Risk Assessment come january 15th which is on the First Step Act and our Needs Assessment at the same time to assess those needs. We will continue to tweak our Assessment Program to make sure its very explicit and precise on evaluating the needs that is involved psychological evaluations in terms of needs, educational in terms of needs, health care needs, all of those are identified right now with our existing Needs Assessment. But we set a high bar with his First Step Act so we will continue to tweak and improve on these assessment processes throughout the implemented during his first year to get it as accurate and high standards that can possibly be served. In doing this evidence based program, it has a way of reducing risks it is system with the borough of making sure that it is opportunity for a bit of faith based groups and prison . Our programs are very critical to our operations editor. We have religious Services Programs that every institution with faith based groups represented. We rely on tremendous volunteers in the community from all the different faith groups that, provide the needs of our inmates and we have 11,000 volunteers in our institution right now in the vast majority of those are faithbased groups. Its hard to hard to say faith based groups who have a broader programs and were advising them on how you can enter dole program in this evaluation that stirred the department of justice outside evaluating which one truly has evidence and if they do receive received recidivism we would love to have a common institution and is very critical to the overall operation. I will have to submit a lot of questions because i have more questions on the subject. Thank you mister chairman. Thank you mister chairman. Id like to say that you are here and you came out of retirement to take on this was once ability and we look forward to working with you. I want to acknowledge the rule by our colleagues and senator white house and the First Step Act and they were leaders on this and i want to acknowledge that. The First Step Act aims to improve Public Safety and strengthen the presence to rehabilitate and to do this the first step that requires the department of justice to restoring system and risk of recidivism. We the program and the needs in the scoring system on where you start out makes all the difference in the world. If youre viewed as a high risk inmate, then you have many programs ahead of you before you can be considered released on a particular treatment when it comes to the issue of debris citizen. Well thats why the department of justice is here today and its critical that this system that theyre putting together be transparent, accurate and unbiased. But im concerned that the system of the department of justice has created falls well short. I have a posters i want to show you here. We talked about this in my office. At this moment in our nations history, when the clash of race and injustice graphic the confronts us every single day, the foundation of the scoring system is so stark, so sobering and so fundamentally unfair that we cannot stand without change. The department of justice itself forecasts that the Risk Assessment to result in stunning Racial Disparities in security classification, is a test run of the tool thats demonstrated here over half, 53 of the African American men in the senate were designated high risk compared to only 29 of white men. 30 of white men were classified as a minimum risk compared to only 7 of African American men. Part of the problem is the tool doesnt distinguish between a graphics traffic stop at a murder conviction. It has the risk that someone will be arrested or return to the federal system. Arrest is not a crime, it conviction is a new crime. Whether youre arrested as often as many times with skin color and youre predisposition to commit another crime. Doctor soy or, will you commit the department of justice assessment be revised to remove reviled recidivism or other changes with a stunning Racial Disparities . I want to clarify a point that is confusing and we talked the other day. We are not they are using arrest interesting Risk Assessment and apply for each inmate. We have this commission and that is only convictions and thats what you and i were talking about coming in with these arrests. With you and my staff are got really interested in is on the back end to evaluate recidivism. That is only used on the back and and went in and make gets out or returns to custody we are convicted and that adds to the validation of appraisal of the Risk Assessment. When you and i are concerned about was coming out on the front end and they wont be utilizing that. I understand this distinction but were backing the evaluation and arrest is not a conviction. Were talking about driving while black and while this and that. Lets be very honest and candid what we face in this country today at the notion that the African American man arrest under circumstances that we described is still too prevalent. We have a long way ago. Do you agree . We count an arrest as a recitizen of joe smith it wont affect joe smith. It affects the overall and its the research flaw in terms of the problem is most everyone in the country to finds recidivism but i assure you senator the Risk Assessment where we checked the validation every year and theres outside group thats coming in every five years at the validation and will do that the stark Racial Disparity and if you dont get that right nothing is right about the system. I just have a few seconds and part of bringing these inmates is less restate it is from at its putting the services in front and will make a difference. It department of justice reported that theres 222,000 former prisoners which is 49 of any kind of programming and 82 received no Technical Qualification and 92 was in unique or. Some completed no drug treatment and when senator grassley was in the my state and proud to have it thank you it was the second most restrictive federal resolutely in colorado. What do you have in place, they are still waiting and its very early in the game, i get it but theres nothing to indicate that the resources to make sure these inmates have a fighting chance to turn their lives around and to be released on their circumstances were citizen doesnt take place. You agree we need more resources. I would invite all the members of this committee to visit our institution and youll find every one of our institutions other than the ones light your new thompson, we have Education Programs and 86 residential drug free programs in the borough of prisms. We have vocational trading, educational training and the problem i mentioned earlier is the inmates choose not to get involved because it doesnt benefit them. We cannot force by court of law we cannot force an inmate into a Treatment Program. My hope with this new step act is that it will occur for the inmates to see some benefit and federal prism industry when i was here before as director, we had 28,000 inmates and we now have 11,000 because weve been cut so badly and terms of our authorities by the people on the hill in the house in the senate because there was so much concerned we might take a job away from the private citizen. I shared that concern and we made 80 different product lines and cant hurt any industry very much at all. Weve been cut from 20,000 to 11,000 inmates in this industry. I assure you senator, the only limitation a providing programs for these and mates will be the sources. As long of we have some resources we will have resources to provide all the programs from all the inmates. Im hoping that will change now since you all support the First Step Act and the resources will come along with that to ensure that we have these programs available. As you know, we have a difficult time in Training Staff we. Have so many requests and advertising for jobs as psychologist, Treatment Specialist that we need to run some of these programs and mr. Thompson or not getting takers. We will plug away and we will get them filled its just taken us a while. Doctor soy or, can you tell us about any incidents that has caused as much crisis from public trust as it has here . I can only speak since 1976, i dont know prior to that but i would say its gotten the most public attention. Lots of taxpayers and citizens never thought about being the hardworking foes and when were talking about the public trust in general in terms of your workforce this happened in the middle of august and it is thanksgiving and her to testify and youre not allowed to speak about this incident i think thats crazy. Can you distinguish among the types of investigations for us come aware that these epstein investigations have a whole bunch of women who were raped by this guy. This is a sex trafficking ring in the United States, this guy had evidence, hes not coconspirators and victims out there who want to know where the evidence has gone. Pin you tell us a little bit more about the different investigations. I know there is one that you are not told to speak about but there are three investigations in your path. There are two investigations that are ongoing. One is the fbi investigation and the others the Inspector General. But there is a third one outside which what epstein was in your institution to begin with. That is completely out of my theres a lot here that be open he has failed in this room and its in your job because you come here today and say he cant testify about it but the reason youre director is because alaska i got fired. I cant tell you what i dont know. I received no information from the fbi or no information from the Inspector General. Once those go into the reference we are forbidden from talking to anybody in the institution. We can send in the team and look at the security flaw, we are not allowed to talk to anybody in our institutions about anything that happen with epstein. With all due respect, you have an obligation to speak to the girls were raped by this guy today. You may not have to speak about every particular of the guards that were arrested last night. But the fact that there is an ongoing attempt by the United States government to find out if there is still any evidence about the coconspirators. You do have an obligation to speak to those girls were raped today. It may not speak about the specific charges against their specifics of the charges to those who guards this, morning that were taken into custody. But more broadly, you should be able to unpack if we change any prostheses about cases like this and is more than 90 days that youre quote was we treat amy every and made the same. In america any individual has every inmate as equal value for future criminal investigations. Jeffrey epstein was the testifying case. Someone whos already been convicted on suicide watch as lots of good reasons to not want that guy to kill himself this, is different. This isnt just about the individual inmate who wants to kill themselves. Its about that guy was unable to testify against his other coconspirators. It is wrong as a management matter for you to say we treat everyone the same. We should be treating people who are yet to testify against other felons or against other rapists who, have a lot more priority for your institution to, obey . Senator, all of our inmates under any in our jail facilities are pretrial. Theyre yet to testify, to be involved and share information on cases. I dont know what evidence are asking me. Was there any evidence in his room where his possession . That would be compensated. His brain and in the cameras and the tapes and the public well understands that it did not to beer up to be urgent enough. Its very urgent for the department of justice its all been confiscated by the fbi and the investigation. Thats why its not shared with the borough of prisons and the investigations are completed. Was there completed id be very happy to talk to anyone a view that want to hear everything about those investigations. But until they have that information theres nothing i can tell you. If i dont have the information i cannot share anything with you. How widespread is the problem of this on the job . There are lots of people in the public who thinks this is a very convenient excuse. Tell us, is that a systemwide problem . Do people fall sleep on the job winner sparse to be guarding federal inmates . We have a few. Weve been monitoring the cameras with everyone in our institutions that determine how well and how effective our Staff Members are during the rounds. The counts in the institutions but we have found that a couple of other instances where we referred those Inspector Generals Offices and if we people just chose not to do their job, were hoping the u. S. Attorneys office pick up those cases and prosecute them for us because we dont want those people here and there day just everybody. The inmates and the staff. We are zealously going around determining which employees are good employees and do their job and that is the vast majority of the prison staff. We do have some that i know out there who obviously choose not to follow the law and policy and do not to do their job and we want them gone. I do not want them in my institution and we have told that very carefully that we have determined them and if its a training problem and they didnt know what their is will to do than thats our problem and as management problem. We have to do a better job of training our staff. But if someone chooses not to do their job then we want them gone. I assure you of that. Amount of time so i just gave you a preview of something alaska for the record after the event. We made a really important statement about a few kinds of contraband and tear institutions and thats one problem thats a gets which we have to play defense but those who appear to do to see what your Long Term Strategy and i think something a lot of us would like to hear more about. Because epsteins hallway should have still been monitored by cameras if the guards were asleep in that information on whether there were adequate cameras and to understand where Technology Knowledge came from. Senator blumenthal is next. Would there be an ig report . There should be. Usually after the Inspector Generals Office investigated do offer a report. Any criminal charges were not there for your case but if theres an idea report we will get fully briefed by the committee here. Senator blumenthal. Thank you mister chairman. Thank you for your service i share the sense of outrage and urgency about this issue. Not because of any special caring about mr. Epstein but the source of evidence to hold accountable other criminals who are as coconspirators and exploiting in the suicide deprives them. And justice and accountability. Id like to suggest that we have an oversight hearing and specifically and this problem relating to mr. Epstein and more broadly about the problems of proper surveillance and proper oversight. I think it ought to be bipartisan and suggests that year is equally troubled about this this issue and i would like to ask for your cooperation and that you will cooperate with the oversight. Absolutely sir. When will the Inspector General report . We never know that. They keep telling us soon but we dont know that means. They take the amount of time we need to do an investigation and i never know. I am going to write a letter and i hope that others will join me and in encouraging the Inspector General to finish this report as expeditiously as possible. There is no more time to interview and review documents fee documents that were falsified which are not numerous with tons of written documents but i think that Inspector General report is due next week and im going to be writing the Inspector General and i hope my colleagues will join me in that letter. Have you reviewed the documents that were falsified . No. Ive not been allowed to see anything. Once the fbi and i steps in, we cant interview people or do anything. So we dont in any way have any bias in the investigation. I have not seen any of it. Were rates of suicide in prison higher than the general population . They are. But our system the really not. If you talk about jail facilities around the country the, average rate of suicide in a jail facility around the country is 50 per hundred thousand. If you look at our numbers and our facilities in the last year, we had to. Unfortunately one, of those was an extraordinary high profile case which makes everyone paint the bureau with a brush in the system. We have lost two inmates to suicide energy Oil Facilities where the norm is 100 inmates per 100,000 and 100,000 in our rate thats 13 per hundred thousand. If the state systems are there we have about 20 something. Theyre in specific changes in policy and practices as a result of the epstein suicide . Policy is minimal because our policies are sound and the problem is, when we grew so dramatically when i was director went from 50 to 60,000 inmates 280. Went from 50,000 staff to 30,000. That is tremendous and we were getting there but once i left we had to grow by 47,000 more inmates would only 7000 new staff. We only had only seven Staff Members for every 1000 inmates with the borough of prisons. And when youre alone, we were required ten new institutions and 3000 less than we had the year before. Thats a 6000 drop in coverage that we had across our borough. When we stretched so thin the staff at to make it work. We cant control our population. We dont control who comes into our institutions and when they leave. We have to keep taking them and taking them. And we grew so big, with so few staff that we stretch to our limits. Im going to interrupt to the policies were sound and staff dont always fall them cause a restrictions. Thank you. On a separate issue. A report by the department of Justice Office of Inspector General in office found that private prisons had Serious Problems and more frequent will ports of violence that could cause deaths of inmates that are reporting on 14 private prisons and public prisons between 2011, 2014 and found more safety and security per capita in the private facility and the borough of prisons and a memo in 2018 with the isis director indicated that the use would in fact be increasing. Do you have the plan of increasing private prisons . We dont have plans but your problems is exactly that we have these inmates in private prisons i will not put medium and high security inmates because they are not adequate in dealing with very serious offenders. It was in our private citizens because they do not pose the risk and the private prisons or a boon boom for us but they were doing it so dramatically and were asked to take the inmates coming our way. The private prisons gave us a buffer for those inmates. Were down to having 16,000 have 177,000 inmates and our private institutions. Those keep coming down down and i think there will be a phase with another huge increase in population where we will no longer bullied private citizens. I will stop here because my time is expired. I do have a few more questions but i put them in the record. One of them that you mentioned is a faithbased program with the denial of opportunities to muslim prisoners in the fc eye which is the subject of a lawsuit and id like to know the explanation to why. Thank you. Very good sir. Thank you ranking member. I appreciate the testimony today and i like to go back to talk a bit about the faith based programs that we discussed earlier. Can you talk a bit about those programs and are you a equaling of equal time with demand and a number of volunteers which are equally offering those programs. We are required by law to do that and the faithbased followers and different faith groups we have sweat lodges and institutions where we have folks from the religious groups that most of us ive never heard of and we are providing the witness an atheist and religious freedom act we are required to meet the demands of every inmate that comes our way and we try to make those and when you have huge numbers of one fate group and one or two another, i can tell you we get exactly the same number because of the volunteers because we can use multiple different groups to address kristen innovator example or jewish inmates. The number of volunteers you can bring in for your native americans or whatever it might be. Our goal is to be equitable. Thats good and thats the way its supposed to be and how supposed to run. Do we have a limit then on the volunteers that are coming in for those programs and its open ended. At one time how many come in at one time because our chaplains are the ones that oversee those programs and are careful for security and may use some extra officers to cover those. I would assume they have limits on how you can come in on a particular time but were open to new volunteers and programs all the time. As part of that volunteer process, what would a volunteer have to do . Are there any regulations with the volunteers or they supervised . How does that work . Security requirements that we have to go through with a minimal background check to make sure they are not going to pose any Security Threat. We also have them with a test in writing where they have no animosity with the pushing ideology that is counter to our country. And then we do have security in the institution that were not bringing in any contraband or any items that we should not be bringing in and theres always a staff member present in the area of whether thats a chaplain to guard and untoward is during that program. Thank you for that. Outside of those that are religiously affiliated there the First Step Act is expected that they would expand as an internal program. Can you talk a little bit about the partnerships that have been developed with non profits and various groups. And what theyre expected to contribute on the First Step Act . We have a number of mentors coming in and they talked about bringing in younger offenders and are preparing for reentry. They come into work with our government with the 11,000 inmates and veterans because we have a very good relationship. Number one, we help screen that they planned to be veterans and then we offer programs of three institutions with these Housing Units and they band together in a very strong way to support each other. Any Veterans Affairs program we have into those institutions and help them with free entry and those kinds of things. We have a lot of folks in education areas and groups will come in and work with their inmates and with the kinds of classes for him and offer support and guidance. We will take an anyone whos willing to meet the requirements to provide to the inmates. That helps us increase our staff levels. When you have nowhere near enough staff and all the things we try to provide the volunteers and outside groups of tremendous resources for us to do a whole lot more than we have available. I appreciate that. The First Step Act and the questioning is to dwell on the fact that the First Step Act we have a lot of different partners to make that transition much easier for these inmates and allow them to really thrive and do well and once they enter their civilian life. Thank you very much, appreciate it. Thank you. Dr. Sawyer before the committee you testified that they target all of our it made to go through a Residential Program because of the step back which is 75 of our inmates releasing go through the Halfway Houses. But on the chart that senator put up there was 75 which was a high percent were inmates going through the process. As that may, have way houses to suffice which are more important. We want to know why september 30th 2019, that the only Residential Reentry Center in the entire state of hawaii made up as you probably know, closed up providing services for 29 years. That meant that they made a huge impact with the facility like this closes because the person named robin has a non profit that trains people into programs who wanted to have a prison that would be eligible to go through and what even have a job lined up by a non profit that he ran and couldnt do it. Who thought that this particular one was a part of a lack of money but he did ask for bids. Clearly, once a facility like this closes its not easy to get another one up and running but these are really relevant to people. So will you commit to reopening them in a way . Senator, we are just as concerned as you are and as i know, you are aware our staff was there just recently and the building at the Halfway House ended up being sold. I understand the circumstances. They were pulled away from it. We advertised three times renew Halfway House and we got no takers. The provider has to be Cost Effective for them. We cannot commit more numbers of inmates that we have released into the state. Let me finish. We have this within a month that we believe were going to get acceptable better but weve added a couple of things on to the Halfway House, the home confinement oversight and the reporting center which is on steroids with the oversight. That will expand the workload that were asking for so it should be more costeffective cause more inmates will be paying for it. Are optimistic as we want the Halfway House and were very optimistic will get better on this. It sounds like a guest. Its as close as a as i can possibly provide. Your timeline is within the next month. It soon. Id like to have regular updates of as to how things are going so we can have one residential center. The thing that happened with this facility is congress in the appropriation of measure that they would notify us with these significant changes involving our closures. Matt beyond the closure of the facility from the residents and not but are you requiring those elements . In that case the provider is on us and we got the word a little bit late at all double checked that to make sure because its all responsibility to make sure that if we dropped the ball on that i do apologize. I think you noted that you work with nonprofits and one of my colleagues at the State Government work through the challenging issues that has zoning was trick shuns and this is where you take a position well. Its very difficult and we watched our inmates close to home in their communities so we dont want them to close. We dont want anyone to accept the Halfway House. You testified that you are very committed to implementing the first step of legislation and there was a recent article in the Washington Post that the Justice Department under attorney general barr undermined the implementation of the First Step Act by implementing the people eligible from earlier and with current officials have stated that barr has had concerns that it would drive up in crime numbers and that is this kind of a sentiment that the attorney general has expressed to you . Its not what i heard the attorney general say. Hes been very supportive and implementing this First Step Act. I have never heard those words coming out of his mouth. People who are currently on your staff when it with officials have heard that and so that would be a major concern. To me. You are asked questions about what happens to your female employees and im sure that there is a relatively small percentage of the employees that you have and i would encourage you to commit to making sure that the training you provide for male staff who do not come to the aid that new do everything you can to change the culture of this kind of behavior. I yield. Thank you senator. Senator kennedy. Thank you madam chairman. Chairwoman i thank you madam director and we have a federal correctional facility in oak day which is a familiar and we are having huge staffing problems which doesnt make sense on why those states have an unemployment wait. What do you mind if i contacted your staff to talk about that and see what we can get . The problem is bureaucracy . Sure. The staff is at 94 and 94. 8 and theyre down 30 positions eye of a thought to raise this and about half of that is Correctional Officers and the problem in the position is that one i indicated on our sizing. I want to stop you. I want to have a long meeting with you about it. Ill give you lots of information. I have a couple of other questions. What is in your opinion justice . Thats a heavy question. I would assume that people are treated fairly and fair and equitable consequences occur if one violates the rights and we should be able to anticipate that and expect that. When somebody to me, justice is when someone gets what they deserve. Though uyghurs in china deserve liberty and its not right to in terms of crime and punishment, a wrongful act, do you think we should do that as a sickness that should be cured, or a consequence or wrongful act, the consequence of which deserves punishment . I think the latter is true. The former statement in terms of pedophiles and sex offenders and some of those whose behavior was deemed by the Psychiatric Association to be at the root of that as a psychiatric or Mental Health issue it needs to be looked at, but either way the consequences should match the effect. Tell me the best procedure in your judgment and you have a lot of experience, i can tell you from your testimony. You know what you are talking about. I think most people agree justice sometimes need to be tempered with mercy. I agree. In the federal prison system, how best do we do that and who should do it . Senator, as i mentioned earlier, we have no control over who comes into our institutions and when they get out. You are queen for a day but within our institution we all have a responsibility to treat our inmates with mercy and compassion. As i said earlier, the journey begins our time is so limited. I am talking in terms of determining whether somebody should get out early. We dont have control im asking who should based on your considerable experience. The individuals who have been elected or appointed to the top ranks of criminal justice and law system have the responsibility to make those decisions. But we dont. Congress didnt in the First Step Act. We turned it over to you folks and we turned it over to the Justice Department. You gave us authority, you gave us ability. You exercised the judgment. That is right but that judgment is driven by specific parameters. They are fake. Im not sure i can answer this in an accessible manner to you because let me hit one last thing on jerry epstein. How can i put this . Christmas ornaments, drywall and jerry epstein. Name three things that dont hang themselves. That is what the American People think. That is what the American People think and they deserve some answers and i know that you are not in charge of these investigations but you talk to the people who are. I need you to take a very respectful message today. Tell the American People what happened. And dont rush the investigation, you and i both know that they make this a top priority and get it done more quickly than they normally would. They need to do that and i would like to live with that message. I agree with you but i can pass along the message but the fbi and Inspector Generals Office work on their own time frame but i will definitely do that. I want the investigation completed as soon as possible. I have a feeling you know how to be firm. Thank you. Senator coons. Thank you for your service and your testimony today and your leadership for the bureau of prisons. I have 5 questions i will try to get through. The First Step Act expect the bureau of prisons will expand its internal program and senator durbin demonstrated graphically ways in which many of the recently released prisoners did not have access to the kind of programming the First Step Act imagined. We have in wilmington something call the Wilmington Hope Commission that provides terrific Reentry Services and the partnerships i hope will be expanding will deliver evidencebased Reentry Services whether it is training or treatment or preparation for reentry to the community, reduction and recidivism. Can you tell me what you really need in terms of funding and what Partnership Agreements with outside organizations you may have started with local nonprofits which allow you to deliver those services in a positive way or with faithbased organizations that can help to reduce the operating costs. Your mention of your program in delaware, one of the things that is difficult for us to obtain are the Community Programs going to welcome these inmates with jobs, housing, allow them to live in their neighborhood so the Community Piece is a 3legged stool. The inmate, we have to provide opportunity for change and the community has to embrace them when they come out again. A lot of our work needs to be on the side of the community that we get Halfway Houses. We tried is really to get to them but nobody wants them in their neighborhood where no one wants them near them and programs to assist those inmates when they come back to the community are critical piece of the operation. Yesterday in wilmington something called Second Chance farm had its grand opening, it is very close to nearby prison, urban farming for those who have just been released in a supervised setting that i think is an inspiring model. Initially, 75 million was provided for the programs that first stepped back and imagined. You testified recently you may require double that, sort of 400 million for their programs, with a letter in april, we want your active feedback to fund and engage with you in delivering these services so the First Step Act can be effective. The only thing that will impede our ability to provide all the Services Inmates need our resources. We are hoping for more than 75 million this coming year but with the markups that are there, there will be 75 million again and this last year, did not come from congress. We had to eat that out of our bureau of prisons budget. If we dont get the resources we need to make this happen, at the end of the day, the reality is if we dont have the resources we sent that letter to especially ask your input to us about how much more you may well need. Let me move to solitary confinement, the Justice Department and many history criminal justice conclude solitary confinement causes serious and longlasting harm and should only be used as necessary not as a default disciplinary tool. The First Step Act ended the use of solitary confinement in juvenile settings. Given the demonstrated harm why do we still have 10,000 inmates, 7 in restricted housing given it is a more expensive or is it the last option . We are working diligently i swear since we got back to get those numbers where they need to be. Inmates have been bad actors and in their for their punishment period, 60 days in lockup and that is only 3000 to 10,000. The remaining ones are in there for protective custody reasons. They chose the lockup, they are in there because so many Security Threat groups and gangs that they will kill each other or fight each other and so we are working differently to come up with other alternatives. We have integration Housing Units, senator durbins new institution, 10 of them, we have ten new ones, four already operational, transition units, they are trying i welcome more input from you on that. A solitary confinement reform act, we would love to hear more about that. If i might, mister chairman, two quick concluding questions. I am cochair of the Law Enforcement caucus. You have significant vacancy and staffing shortages that have led to folks who are not appropriately trained being required to serve as Prison Guards which have contributed or may have contributed to something about which you have been asked at great length here. How many facilities use augmentation which is the word for pushing people who are not Corrections Officers into that role and our employees temporarily serving in guard positions expected to continue to perform their regular jobs on an ongoing basis and what is the impact on Mental Health and suicide risk for those who are performing these corrections functions that are very stressful and demanding. I know a lot of interested been reined in our i went asian process. Augmentation is a wonderful thing as we train all our staff has pressure workers first. When i was a psychologist i dont have officers in my therapy groups. We dont have officers in teachers classrooms, we dont have officers in kitchens where food people are cooking food, we dont have officers Walking Around the farmers and electricians the teacher inmates, we are all trained to be correctional workers first. We all have that responsibility. When i came up to the system had i not augmented, when i became an associate ward i would have been ill prepared to take on those responsibilities. I sat in a seat of Correctional Officers numerous times during my growth in the bureau and you get insight you wouldnt have otherwise. Augmentation is very bad when you do it too much and that has been happening more recently. There are a number of vacancies that we have been having too often and what we have is the staff know how to do the job, they are trained to do the job but the work from the other job is getting limited in terms of what they can accomplish so that is when i said earlier we put such huge strains on the bureau of prisons trying to accomplish its mission with the growth we had in the budget cuts and staffing shortages. It has been incredible to me that the bureau was able to function in the last 60 years i have been gone, a high level in most respects they have been functioning with severe strain in the system. Augmentation is a good thing, dont take it away from us but we have to get staff positions field so we dont have to augment as often as we do now. Four lost more Law Enforcement officers to suicide than line of duty deaths. Im concerned about what we are doing to provide appropriate support training and staffing because we are really pushing folks beyond their ability. Thank you for being here. Thank you for your willingness to serve in a part of government that is not easy. A part of government that is so essential for the safety of our country, and often thankless path. I want to talk to you about the First Step Act about implementation about what we can do to make sure it is helping to make americans safe. I want to talk for a moment about the Jeffrey Epstein case. There are a lot of indications, a lot of people expressed concern, Jeffrey Epstein didnt kill himself, it was initially reported that he had died by suicide but according to a lot of news reports a private psychologist, am sorry, a private path knowledge is to took a look at the case said that Mister Epstein experienced a number of injuries that are, as he put it, quote, extremely unusual, in suicidal hangings and occur more commonly in homicidal strangulation. Are you familiar with that statement . I have seen that in the media, yes. According to news reports Security Cameras that were in the hallway watching Mister Epsteins cell just happened to malfunction the night his life ended. Can you tell me how frequently do Prison Guards, do prison guarding Security Cameras malfunction and one of the protocols to check on them and make sure that doesnt happen . We are very behind in terms of moneys for improvements for our institutions. I mentioned in my Opening Statement our institutions are very old and faulty. In the last year, we redo all camera systems and institutions. It is not completed yet but we got funding to replace camera systems, we upgraded them from analog to digital and we have a lot more cameras in the institutions than there used to be because they had a lot of blind spots and adequate cameras. Fcc new york is one of those, part way through the camera and reinstallation. By this time next year, all our institutions should be complete we upgraded in terms of cameras. When they are faulty they break down sometimes. When they break down you cant see it. Even if the Security Camera has now function that i can we be sure he didnt kill himself . Sometimes you can see some. The visibility in an old analog camera is grainy and that is usually the problem. You see what is going on, you something on old cameras. Is the thing going on in this case . I dont know, i was not allowed to see the cameras after it occurred. The Inspector General and the fbi were the ones investigating and we were not allowed to touch anything, and the fbi and Inspector Generals Office comes in we are not allowed to talk to staff. And the investigation any idea how long that will be . We keep hearing soon. Dont know how long soon is. It is my understanding at the time of staff, the security housing unit, one that was supposed to be checked every 30 minutes and from what i am told it appears hours went by, three hours or so went by without anyone checking on him. Would that represent a lapse of protocol . Protocol, policy, following lots of very negative things, not doing their rounds. In the high security Housing Units and the failure to make checks on inmates according to the bureau of prisons protocol. As i indicated earlier the average death in a jail facility like these higher security pretrial facilities the average in the country and jails across the country, 50 or 100,000 inmates. We had two in a jail facility in the past year, two which suggest in the vast majority of institutions we are doing things correctly and making a check. In our special housing unit and other institutions we have had a couple instances where we went back and look at the cameras after something on toward occurred. It was not always clear officers had done specifically what we were asking to do by policy and each case when that occurs we call in the Inspector Generals Office, we have investigations on and if it appears to be any type of criminal act occurring we call in the training office, to prosecute if they are not doing their jobs. My time just expired. I have one short question on the step back of implementation. I will take that as a yes. No objection. What efforts has the bureau made to ensure inmates are receiving incentives under the First Step Act for the programming in which they were participating. They are built into the program and identified in the First Step Act. If you complete x number of hours and programs then there is a correlation of how many credits you are supposed to get orderly release. There are some things you ineligible for, your violent offenders, sex offenders and some were excluded, and an incentive to those individuals too that will encourage good behavior. To call home, and get extra benefit in the trust fund program to purchase some items and incentivize all the inmates because it is beneficial to us on one hand because it makes for better behavior by the in mates but the main focus is on the ones trying to work their way out of the prison system and as long as they dont get involved in the program the credits are an automatic addition. Make the public saver in the primary. If we illuminate our numbers dramatically we would be very happy. I appreciate your willingness to implement saver. Welcome, director. Senator cornyn and i were authors of the reentry part of the First Step Act so we have a very keen interest in the implementation and success. I will relate to you my experience that during the battle for that bill your organization was something less than a champion for our piece of it. But we ended up passing the bill with huge bipartisan majorities. I will tell you the reentry piece was easier and stronger and more bipartisan than the sentencing part. We sent a strong bipartisan signal that we want to get this done. There was a meeting afterwords senator cornyn was unable to attend but was able to send a staff person with mister kushner, the Deputy Attorney general, senior people at the bureau of prisons, people from the white house who had been involved and working on this bill to send a message that we want to see this implemented. I hope we are in pretty good shape and certainly your comments today show seriousness about it. People within the bureau who may not have been champions of this bill are trying to interfere with the implementation down in the ranks and the most obvious ways to not ask for additional funding and blame lack of additional funding for not going forward, there was a recent survey done of 280,000 of your inmates as part of developing the new Assessment Tool and the report was 49 were not completing any programs before they were released. 82 had not participated in technical or vocational courses and 57 who needed drug treatment had not received it. There is obviously a huge opportunity here to improve on those numbers and you said in your testimony today the First Step Act provides us with the opportunity to add new programs to enhance and expand existing programs. I am all for that. In staff level briefing, they currently have no plans to expand their program offerings. I dont know where we are here, when your testimony says we want to do now programs to implement the new bill, when you see this need and your own survey and we hear from your staff that you have no plans to do any programs it is hard to figure out what is going on here. I know of no staff in the bureau of prisons who say we dont want to increase our programs. If i can get the names of those people i would love to hear about them. That is not where we are in the bureau of prisons. I know my step well enough to know about those things. We will not be increasing until we do the funding to do it. We are prepared to increase but numbers mystify me that senator durbin in terms of the ones who have never been involved in programs i know we get a lot of lower security in mates in such a short period of time they dont have time to get involved in programs and a lot of whitecollar offenders who are successful in their businesses, they chose to go the illegal route for a while and they dont need the programs. They are not going to need a good job. We have lots of programs, education, vocational training, therapeutic programs, we dont have enough. The resources to offer programs. Your budget you are requesting aligned with those priorities because it doesnt help us with a budget that does not support the additional resources, it is a setback. And bad recommendations and administration. It is respect to a piece of this, the medication treatment, and the professional leader in getting medication assisted treatment to prisoners, dramatically reduce death by overdose in that population. We use the whole array of approved medical interventions. We understand it offers one drug called vividtroll. You are trying to extend the assisted Treatment Program but only additional no additional staff. To expand availability of medication assisted treatment in the 2020 budget. This is the kind of example, to have you say we really want to do this, it makes sense, we know it works, we have seen the cases where it save lives and approves peoples recidivism. When the rubber hits the road, you undercut your self with a budget request that doesnt accomplish the goals you state you wish to achieve. Part of the limitations in terms of other drugs you provide inmates coming into the institution, we dont have the authority to provide those. Hhs and dea have strict restrictions and im sure your state has managed to get those authorities. We are working diligently with hhs and dea because it is a matter of moving these drugs across state lines because institutions are everywhere and inmates release everywhere and they come from everywhere so we are working diligently to get proper licensure and procedures, we are still insuring in mates get the medicine and with outside doctors, we take him down town where there is a subscriber who can prescribe the medication for us. Part of what we need to move forward on this is a licensure agreement for our own staff. Can Congress Help you in this regard . I think i thought we were going to come up with a lot of modification of the law but we are close to getting the final approval from hhs and dea with methadone. If that doesnt work i will come and talk with you. Lets make sure there is no little counterinsurgency going on in your administration. If there is and i find it they will be working somewhere else. Senator blackburn. I want to introduce into the Record Council of prison locals 33 Western Region letter, okay . Go ahead. Thank you so much. We appreciate that you are there and wanted you to come out of retirement and come back. Jeffrey epstein has come up a lot. It does concern us because we do have victims, women, young girls that are never going to see justice fully because of the staff and you mentioned all your high profile inmates are treated the same. I want to pivot to the staff and senator coons had started on some of this and for staff, for handling the suicidal inmates, and it was Standard Operating Procedure even if youre augmenting staff. Everybody knows this is how it is done. Is that in existence . Any secure units, every staff member is expected to read that every time they come on post, regular training with the staff but those that are augmenting on a daily basis, should remind them of requirements on those posts. What the expectation is, thank you. So staffing shortages, how is that affecting your ability and staffing shortages that you have what are you doing to alleviate that, have you changed recruiting practices . Since i have been back for 3 months that has been my highest brody getting our position filled. Prior to that, we had good people doing good things but acting directors just dont have the power or the authority to make things happen the way of food director can. I managed to get them from the department of justice, to to get direct hiring authorities, directly hire people from the streets, we dont have that authority now and advance us greatly. We had a 20 new staff in our staffing processes. A lot of those will be retirees because we can bring them back from retirement, and let them go back to retirement. I have experience with that and going back to work. We know we will have retirement coming in the next year in our staffing offices and we are doing that, we are advancing our recruitment strategies. We hired a company to do a nationwide online recruiting program. That is where young people go looking for jobs. We have something on line but not as flashy as we need to have to to attract the young folks to work with us. We are trying to speed up recruitment process and hiring process. One of the things that is hurting us, we hired 15,000 in that 10year period, those staff are eligible to retire. We are trying to hire new staff so we hire 5 new staff and three retire. It is hard to catch up. We have 25,000 employees which should be a lot but when you have a fair number out the back through retirement or whatever the reason it has been very difficult for us to catch up. As you hire these staff, what is the link of training that youre given before they are put on the job . We have two hours, two weeks of institution familiarization training, some increase that to 3 weeks, we have 3 weeks of training federal Law Enforcement Training Center in georgia so that is 6 weeks. The ideal, what we used to be able to do is link a probationary employee to a seasoned employee that they can follow and shadow them for a while and learn the job thoroughly. With our staffing shortages we are not able to do that in all our instances but as we staff our institutions we would be able to return to that and we have annual training every year that every staff member has to go through. It is on the basis of correction and the same thing you need for requirements and incidental training throughout the year or in mental training throughout the year. It is one of the most acute issues you came in facing. When budgets got cut dramatically, one of the first things to go you cut your training budget. We are having trouble feeling positions, we have a lot of new employees, and they are on their job and may not know everything they need to do to the job effectively. Those are the areas i am stressing dramatically to get caught up. The question on contraband and submitted to writing. You have el chapo or martin should really who is running his business out of prison or a drone dropping cell phones. This is something we should help you saw that i will cement that for written response. Let me join my colleagues in thanking you for returning to public service. The importance of faithbased programming, and you are engaged in faithbased exercise here. John mccain used to remind us your reward would not be on earth. 10 years from now i remember meeting a number of pastors in the dallas area and africanamerican pastors, what is the single guest problem in the congregation since young men, convicted felons. They cant get a job and find a place to live. It occurred to me if you cant get a job and find a place to live your choices are extraordinarily limited. Looking at some of the work done at the state level, senator whitehouse and i and other colleagues, it was almost unanimous join together and pass the First Step Act. This is an aspirational goal of making sure people once they leave prison which almost everybody will, that is another factoid that many people overlook, people will leave prison but are they better prepared than when they went in. We cant save everybody, but we can save some and the numbers look pretty encouraging from the state experience. One of the things i want to ask you about coming in my state, in texas for example, we not only looked at what happens in prison but we look at what happened after people got out of prison and this is a part i want to make sure we dont prop it all on congress, your responsibility end once they leave the premises but there were followon services. If they go back in the same neighborhood or subject to the same temptations and they are back in your custody. Do you agree with me to support for congress not to pat ourselves on the back and say we passed the First Step Act, to provide followon services for this population . Looking at a 3legged still we can provide programs for inmates to better themselves, the made have to choose to do that but the third stool is the community they are going back into and if there is not a welcoming community that deals with housing issues and job issues and all those things then the stool will follow over because the in mates cannot succeed if they are going back to the same drug ridden or whatever it might be neighborhood, they dont have a place to live, they are not allowed to live in public housing. And when they left us, very optimistic with skills in hand, education in hand, what they hope for. In the run up to passage in the First Step Act, made an important point. With the ultimate goal is and keep our eye on the primary. The crime rate was coming down. We were making some progress. If it was going up, something obviously was going wrong. Do you agree with that focus . That is something to look at very closely. Doctor sawyer, senator whitehouse and i are the odd couple on prison reform. Like senator leahy and i are on freedom of information issues. I will leave it to others to judge. We are introducing additional legislation to promote successful reintegration and rehabilitation of prisoners by introducing something we call the reenter actor. We are trying to provide federal judges the discretion, we are not requiring it but providing discretion to issue their own certificates of realization, and eligible offenders finish their sentences and demonstrated their commitment to a lawabiding future. We are looking at the state experience, a third of the states have a Similar Program and i am glad just like the First Step Act, seems to enjoy broad bipartisan support, grassley, durbin, tillis, portman, blumenthal have joined us in the introduction of this bill. Do you see the usefulness of giving federal judges this discretion as additional indicator that the individual tried to turn their lives, turning taking advantage of the programming to be welcomed back into the Community Pulling out. I look forward to it, catching up with a lot of news stuff that happened in the last 16 years. Anything to improve the process and make us Work Together, to do the right things for offenders who are coming back to the community. I applaud your efforts at all of our efforts to make that successful. Thank you, mister chairman. Thank you for being here in your service. How would you describe the morale of folks right now . It is kind of mixed. Talk to our management staff around the bureau and it is next. The mixture of staff who are tired because of trying to work extra hours and work so hard and so long. Staff and i interact, the driven bureau of prisons people who wants to do a good job. They do we are in a profession come we dont get any glory. They all get glory. Prison people only get noticed, you never read an article about us, usually in local papers. Would you rate the vast majority of them . Weve got to screen up and doubleheader but the vast majority of our staff are tired because they are stretched and we have been stretched for many years. I want to make sure you are watching your testimony. I would like as a followup, what senator durbin put forward, it would be helpful as a response for the record to look at the data and decompose into the root causes behind it. Is as stark as it appears to be . Are there other mitigating factors because if it is and that is something we need to look at if there are other mitigating factors, it would be helpful for the committee. What is your attrition rate . Get rid of retirement, what kind of attrition are you dealing with outside of this current course and speed . I dont have those numbers but most staff can retire at 50. Most of them stick around to 54 so they dont run out the door. There are new incentives to encourage, Pay Incentives for those who stick around once they reach retirement eligibility to get to this a little longer. A lot of issues, to give us one more euro 2 or 3 to stick around a little longer because we need their experience to help tie this over and so we get the other positions filled. I will submit some specific questions for the record around reentry centers, and recently closed, it was a combination of funding and a drop in prisoner reductions, sounded like the mechanics you were working through and answered senator hironos questions. Im prepared to answer that. That facility closed, we didnt know they were going to close, they defaulted on their contract and a lot was financial. We had a cap of a maximum number that could hold 75 and we guaranteed a lower number and they wanted to get to 75 but we cant control where inmates will come from. We didnt have those numbers to give them so they defaulted on their contract and left us so we now in the focus of trying to do statewide contracts so that we have the same deliverer in multiple sites so if they shift around. A more diverse portfolio. That should be coming out soon. It is closing soon. We believe we have the vendors going to step up and build on that. In charlotte we have a Halfway House 20 miles from charlotte so the inmates from the charlotte area are going to those two facilities but we want to close this last contract and cover. It has to do with communication and probation officers, they feel they are getting a transfer without adequate notice or communication and we will follow up specifics reported by my staff. I know you are new to the job so this is something i ask you to look at. The First Step Act im supporting additional efforts but senator cornyn and others, it would be helpful, you mentioned accenture working in the hiring practices. It would be helpful for you to assess the first act that are imposed on you which current funding streams are, where the objectives of the First Step Act could be challenged unless you get additional authorities to resources. It is one thing to have that trajectory and another to execute it. With the likelihood of coming before the committee, to what extent, to further act, we look for that and put together a letter on what im looking at. Thank you for your years of service. Thank you for being here. Let me continue to ask about staffing issues. You experienced medical staffing shortages in recent years including at the federal prison facility in springfield, missouri, my home state. What measures has bop implemented to avoid staffing shortages . If you want to know where staffing shortages came from, i mentioned earlier are you rapid growth or expansion of institutions . We had positions cut dramatically over the years. We had opened ten institutions with 3000 less positions than the year before and we had 5000 positions removed from our numbers and in the last few years, the vacancies we had, we had uncertain budget years and get significant cuts again. We are wary of too much so we didnt want to risk a lot of people in the budget year came out, our budget had been cut dramatically. Add to that the attrition with staff, we hired 15,000 inmates, employees during the 10 years i was director from 2003, they are eligible to retire and a lot of those are going out the door. We are trying to build up the front end and that is how we ended up where we are today. Since i have been here and prior to my arrival we added lots of incentives for locations, financial incentives. I increased our staffing numbers, that does most of the screening for new hires, we increased that by 20 former retirees who come in for a short time, your two or three to get caught up. New staff to get it up, new recruitment activities going on. We are using accenture to develop a splashy online recruitment package to tap young people. We are hiring contractors to help with staffing levels. We are doing everything we can think of, new authorities from the department of justice, by bringing me and is director the attorney general assured me i would have the full support of the of justice to get the bureau of prisons back on solid ground, new authorities, and 2500 new staff in the past year and we trimmed out other staff. As we are hiring a new ones we are losing others and it is hard for us to catch up. We will get there but it is taking us a little. The federal hiring process, it took 6 months to a year from the time you recruit someone or identify someone to get them on board and into your operation. By the time you train them and get them to work and it is longer. Let me ask about the springfield, missouri facility because i am worried the Medical Center for federal prisoners, can you speak to your progress there in staffing on medical and dental staff with doctors, nurses and psychologists . I dont have specific numbers on springfield, one of the most difficult areas as health services, doctors, nurses, dental to a certain extent, it stretched pretty thin across the country and no one is able to find as many as they need, rural entities losing medical providers and we are competing and dont pay as much. Let me talk about the numbers a moment ago. And they are actively seeking 3000 vacancies, at staffing levels. And staff programs, for that authorization. The 5000 positions we lost were separate. They took positions away from us. 3000 positions, the freeze affected that and the shutdown affected that. We are afraid to staff up to turn around and rift in the next year. We have to get those positions and the new positions, to meet the requirements of the first act. We are doing as many things as we can think of to get these positions filled. And one of the things we are looking to is the online programs, Educational Programs that are inmates are involved in in terms that are not staff intensive but using other sources to provide the training and education so youre not relying solely on Staff Members being present at the time to do that. We are looking at everything we can do to get positions filled up and get programs to the inmates and the only thing that will impede us is resources. As long as we get adequate resources we will be fine. Thank you, mister chairman. Curtis . Thank you, mister chairman. Doctor sawyer, welcome. You started in your position at dop nine days after the death of Jeffrey Epstein. What happened with Jeffrey Epstein was an enormous black eye to the bop and the department of justice. It was disgraceful. Jeffrey epstein was a pedophile, a sexual predator who targeted and preyed on young girls and yet he died in federal custody. He died in federal custody before he had a chance to testify about his crimes, about his wrongdoing and about the other powerful men who were complicit in that sexual abuse. That was a moment that shocked this country, powerful men wanted Jeffrey Epstein silenced. As i see it there are two and only two possibilities for what happened with Jeffrey Epstein. Number one, there was gross negligence and a total failure of bop to do its job with a prisoner on suicide watch that led to epsteins committing suicide or number 2, something far worse happened, that he was not suicide but rather homicide carried out by a person or persons who wanted epstein silenced. Either one of those is completely on acceptable. Both of those are profound indictments of bop and our federal incarceration system. I understand there is an Inspector General investigation, the permit of justice is looking at this but you came into an agency right after this happened and as far as im concerned, when you came in, that was an agency crisis. Lets take the more damning scenario. Based on the evidence of which you are aware is there any indication Jeffrey Epsteins death was a homicide . Based on the evidence i am aware, no but here as i told the committee, it is still being investigated by the fbi and Inspector Generals Office. Once they initiate the investigation we are required to remove ourselves completely from it, not allowed to talk to any staff numbers involved and so i am not aware of what is going on with the epstein investigation until it is completed there is no indication from anything i know that it was anything but suicide. As i understand it, two Prison Guards were recently indicted for falling asleep when they were supposed to be on watch, for failing to engage in the periodic every 30 minute check on suicide watch on Jeffrey Epstein and then falsifying their records to claim that they had in fact done their job when the allegation is they are now asleep. Is that right . That is what i heard on the media today. I have got no official reporting of that yes at all. Other than those two individuals, has anybody at bop been disciplined or terminated for their conduct that led to the Jeffrey Epstein death . We are waiting for the conclusion of the investigation. We cant act on that until we have information but i assure you if there is any misconduct or if these individuals were indicted we dont want people like that working in the bureau of prisons, they dont represent the vast majority of the 35,000 employees across the bureau of prisons. Most of our staff are highquality good people doing the right thing and you are right, this incident was a black eye on the bureau of prisons and unfortunately everyone takes a singular incident and paint a broad brush across the entire organization and assumes the entire organization is dysfunctional and incompetent and that is absolutely not the case. We have some bad staff, we want rid of those bad staff who dont do their jobs. We want them gone one way or the other either by prosecution or termination. The good staff are doing extraordinary work every day managing 177,000 inmates. You never hear anything about those people because they are doing their job and things are running well. The only time we get noticed is when something bad happens. Let me say given what occurred here, there is reason for a great deal of concern. I understand the sentiment that you want to have the back of your team and i understand those sentiments entirely but we have two Prison Guards that have just been indicted for literally falling asleep on the job and lying about it and my question to you is what have you done leading this organization to determine how many other Prison Guards have fallen asleep on the job, have lied about it. How many other video cameras installed to ensure safety and security, and videos were in operative, what are you doing proactively . To make sure this doesnt happen again . I did a video, telling them very clearly we dont know for sure what happened in the epstein case because i dont have information but if any Staff Members are not doing the rounds effectively, if they are not doing their cow effectively and doing things they are not doing, it is a violation of the law and we will prosecute if necessary. I made that clear to all 36,000 employees out there. In terms of the camera issue, we were right in the midst this past year and next year, going from analog to digital and increasing the cameras of our institutions. We know our cameras were faulty, we are picking up what happens, it is a grainy analog, we are replacing our cameras and institutions and that should be completed the next coming year and the management staff has been clear, i sent a letter to the wardens telling them specifically in response to their staff they need to tell their staff and reminding them and making sure the post orders and requirements are very clear and evident, what their responsibilities are and if they, if we have a training issue, we have to train those, and they choose not to do their job i want them gone. They not only make inmates unsafe but our employees and safe, and is unacceptable situation. I will conclude hearing, thank you for serving the country, youre the right person at the right time. [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] cspans student can competition is in full swing all across the country, middle and High School Students hard at work creating documentaries on issues they most would like the president ial candidates to address in their campaigns and would love to see your progress. Take us behind the scenes and share your photos using hashtag student cam 2022 in additional cash prizes. Still working on an idea . Have resources on our website to help outcome our Getting Started page at student can guide you through the process of making a documentary. Season will board 100,000 in cash prizes. All eligible entries will be uploaded and received by midnight. My reaction is not to take your issues seriously. Your never too young to have an opinion so let your voice be heard. Go to our website, studentcan. Org. Our bus team is traveling across the country asking voters what issues should president of candidates address . One of the most unaddressed