Are you from new york . Originally a lot of people think of you mostly as a political conservative but in your book radical son where you talk about your life story, you reveal a side of herself that i would say a good writer, not just somebody with great ideas but you write well. In this book are probably not the first one to call it a beautiful tone and mortality, that is the title. When you decided to write this, why did you decide to write this book . If you read the book radical s son, maybe you would assume that your story. That was the story of my political transformation from a leftist somebody who described themselves as a revolutionary to conservative. At what point did you stop describing herself as a marxist revolutionary. Roughly 1974 when a woman that i recruited for the black Panther Party was murdered by the panthers and that really was the end of my career in the left when i realized i was among gangsters and people who supported gangsters. What really hit me, although my friend defended the panthers and blamed the death on the white power structure instead of what they do today, they blame on trump in the white supremacy. A lot of people dont remember that. But the violence of those years. It is interesting to me, if you dont mind, before we get into the new book which picks up your story, those who were not familiar with your story and your seminal book radical semi, i want to ask you if you dont mind, reprice that story for a bit to give us a running start. Rosa quite carrying communist. Literally . Our whole community wanted stalin to win the cold war and create a soviet america. Where were you raised and what was the community . I was raised in sunnyside in group and bliss street. In queens question works yes. Most people think of sunnyside or queens, the Upper West Side of manhattan, communist, but sunnyside. It was colonized by the communist party. I lived like a development of rural houses and Eleanor Roosevelt broke the ground there. And they were built like english rowhouses, the backyard had a commons and the interesting thing, when the fortyyear easement was lifted on the commons, everybody extended theibackyards into the center. Which is what the left is always fighting which is why they end up with a firing squad. You were raised among cardcarrying communists were rooting for stalin. How so . Thats a fascinating idea, its one thing to be leftist and one thing to be a democrat, you talk about something a little different. What was this group and who were your parents that you found yourself in this situation . When you get into that, people have the need first of all this book is not a political book and there is politics and it but its out of. A level. I think this might be the best book ive written and people who have read it certainly feel it in the writing and so forth. The writing is very beautiful. I have read parts of this book all the way through its a joke, i read parts of this book all the way through. It is very beautiful so youre right the mortality that were thrown into this world and people have a great need to think of their lives as meaningful, the idea that we are all going to disappear someday and be forgotten is very hard for people to take. So they develop various kinds of faiths. In their faith because you cannot know that god exists. You can know i quote stalin in this book and you can know through the heart but you cannot know with your intellect. Nobody can prove that god exists and that he does not exist or she. With interviewing you your man of religious faith but this is my perspective. So people develop the faith, it can be a communism, social justice is not on there. Or you can have a faith and a divinity and the way i described in the book, to believe in the divinity who will sort things out on the other side and for now we see it starkly as the new testament says and then only then facetoface. To me, that is a healthy faith but if you do not believe in the divinity, most people cannot face the meaninglessness of her life. Its dustin to win this. For those people, to get meaning in their lives, they get the crypto religious faith which was listed as leftism, social juste him, the world will be made into a kingdom of heaven on earth really. The interviewer would say how do you live without an eschaton. Is everybody looking for the same thing . Even misguided radical communist, leftist, were all looking for the same thing but we disagree on how to get there, what the nature of that thing is, what the nature of reality is but it does seem that people who maybe believe life has no meaning that they cannot stand the idea so they want to create many. The meaning is crated that you create the world, you act as god and you have a new deal and youll rearrange everything. And the only way to do that is through a authoritarian police and they say cant do it anyway so you just shoot a lot of people. Thats what the soviet union taught us in the last century. I dont think this is a book about ideas, theres a lot of narrative in my life lessons. You go through life and you have to deal with death, i had a daughter who had a birth defect that caused her to die in her 40s and they take lessons from these, i tried to deal with the infirmities of age as you know people dont talk about this too much, but people are living 10 y ever did because of science. But they do that because you have parts removed by surgeons and so forth. I put some of that in the book in each point, i try to give whatever wisdom i have for my life experience. You do some of what the book . I talk about i had prostate cancer, one that metastasize, ive had serious reengineering of my body. Is that your original head . Everything else is negotiable but the head at least so far we are going to a break but we will continue talking for as long as you will stay here, its an honor to have you, the new book is mortality and faith, reflections on a journey through time, stick around. [inaudible conversations] today we are coming to you on book tv as well im talking to David Horowitz about mortality. I have to ask you before we go further, how many books have you written . You have written a few books. Probably 20 that are worth reading. I wrote quite a few of the leftist. Its funny to think that you really were a radical, committed leftist until 1974. So you were not playing at this, you are very seriously involved. It is really the origins of the division and this book. To make our lives meaningful, we live inside stories that we tell ourselves. And they vary, you will create a dynasty is one, they are all designed to give you hope or you will become a famous athlete and be in the hall of fame in a thousand years. That is my story. It can happen. To design the story that i got from my parents and my community how we were going to change the world in my whole life was oriented around changing the world. Through communist revolution. Yes. That is what its supposed to do. And it ends racism, sexism, all these identify ob a, well be one big family, thats the division of progressives. United by this belief and redemption. And if you do not believe in that . If you do not believe in that and you get in the way well you know what happens, the progressives killed 100 Million People in the 20th century. So the progressive worldview that you are describing is with the american worldview we will call freedom or liberty. That is another story. That is the key problem. Again if you look at the Green New Deal that want to pay people who do not want to work, what is that thats an incentive to be lazy and live off other people. And if the other people resent them sooner rather than later than those people become problems, you identify them as racist or whatever you want to call them people dont want to work or marginalize its ridiculous. But its billions and billions of people who believe it and i would say ten or 15 of the 20 democrat candidates for the nomination also believe it. Let me ask you, when we live inside stories and create stories. We give her lives meaning and hope in the illusion that is going to go on forever. It is so easy to forget that you are going to die, its very easy thats the normal human denial. So this book, i talk a lot about the stories and for example there is a lot of literary. Julian barnes who wrote a number of postmodern novels, i cannot think of the one that he wrote the most famous one. Nothing to be afraid of which is when he was a little kid and he was afraid of death. His friend said its nothing to be afraid of in the whole book is about this and the fact that hes a famous writer and theres probably millions of people who read his books but he figures in a generation or two there will be nobody reading his books. Not only are people reading it, im sure most people dont remember it, it was a big book at the time and he sort of right about that that we are reading his book. He calls it scratching on the walls of the prison which is life and it does not have a religious faith. It is a great consolation and thats why people are so passionately committed to ideas that a been proven to be incredibly destructive like social justice and socialism and communism because it is such a consolation for the meanest of our lives. Do you believe that life is meaningless . Im in a gnostic which is why i think im a good witness on all these issues. When you say that, when were talking about communist radicalism, when you say its the odds with reality, is that we start . With human nature, when you say the odds with human nature is interesting the american view of selfgovernment and liberty and what i would say is a more conservative view is not at odds with human nature. Correct when we come back i want to ask you about that. Will talk about the palladian heresy. Coming up public t enter book b. We are coming to you on book tv talking with author, thinker, David Horowitz, his new book is mortality and faith in reflections through the journey in time. In this book were talking about the meaning of life. And what were talking about a moment ago, the idea that you are saying your previous you, the communist view, is at odds with human nature. The murder of my friend in the murder of 100 billion people in the 20th century and with that story that i lived inside was shattered, thats how i came to all these views, you only see a piece in the people who are in the planet and they get meaning out of that but you do not look outside, you live inside it because it gives your life meaning and if youre not saving the planet or the planet cannot be saved then it shatters your personal peace and it takes away your consolation. You have to have seen that event in 1974 and away as if severe mercy as if though it took something that horrible to wake you up to the idea i was clinically depressed for seven years. Seven years . At what point did you shift . How do you get out of that . Actually thats a subject of radical son, he put 1 foot in front of the other, you get involved, i had a writing partner and for some reason, hes a catholic so he had a faith and he would get interested in stories that we did together when we were journalist and i had no interest in but i would follow him and because i had to support my children, i did that and you put 1 foot in front of the other and after a while it turns out the good inside another story. The story now isnt going to save this country, i think this country is threatened by people who do not understand the founding, they dont understand where freedoms come from they have content for the people who created our freedoms based on this reading of history but i understand this is a story and it could be meaningless. It could be meaningless . But your banking history has no right side, is not moving anywhere. Why do you say that . It is a classical view, in this book itar about mark is h. Until you get to the western christian biblical everybody but the jews thats why the christians did that. A lot of christians actually worship do you might not realize that. Im always finding it out. You dont have to pointed out to me, all pointed out to you. Once the bible enters history and creates at least in part, the west and leads to what we have today in america, its at odds with the idea that history has no right side or the history is not going anywhere. Its what reagan said, were a generation away from losing all her freedom, we have to fight for in every generation and if the islamists when then theres no reason that they shouldnt, theyve infiltrated our societies, they have a barbaric view of the world the jew haters, i admit christians haters as well and if they win were going back to the dark ages and its all done. So no, everything is fraudulent that sense but not as fragile as they want to be an extremist on that, i think the dark has a lot of resilience. I cannot believe you just said that,. Is a fundamental divide in the judeochristian view is contained in genesis, the first chapters of genesis, the paradise is a better than the Green New Deal or socialism or communism. You can die of the fruit that fell from the tree, but theres one condition and that remains in the garden and you do not eat of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil in other words you do not want to do evil and adam and eve defied god and eight off the tree. Human beings enjoy doing evil, human beings we have inside of us, we have free will, that is the basic judeochristian idea, god could ease easily told jesus risen off the cross, you can come back today but god gave us free will which is the freedom to do evil as well as good and as human corruption is the problem and the source of social problems is no such thing as a collection of who we are as individuals we have bad tendencies that we fight all the time and weve created religion as one morality. You say this is inherent to your green with the biblical view. Yes i definitely do. But the question people on the left are followers of pelagius. Pelagius believed that sin is against human nature that human nature left to itself is good. According to pelagius. According to pelagius. To commit a send is to go against your nature you believe people are good christians and all they have to do is want to be good i hate to cut somebody off and discussing this but well be right back. Hello folks, David Hurwitz you were just talking about the pollution heresy, socalled, so continue please. If you understand that the source of our problems is us, its a corruption inside every human being, take this for example, and you can see in infants if you put two yearolds in a room with a lot of toys and leave for five minutes you hir here screams, wt you understand that and you understand that people in government are more dangerous than people who are not in government because they have more power, theyre the same people that caused the problem, we see this all around us today. The corruption is epidemic. And even worse someone i call the social redeemers, they think they can redeem the world, we will save the planet. Politics. Yorty have environmental radicals talk about putting people in prison and they dont believe in global warming. And when the legislative who are behind the green deal you ask them how they will do it and they say globalization, so will live under a military regime. Great. In the defense they say this is a much as a threat as the nazis. Of course they wanted to be a threat so they can get much power. And you end up with a tote hurry and state. How are you going to compensate 60 million gas cards in ten years if you dont institute a military dictatorship. This is what makes people conservative, your view of human nature. People on the left think that people are doing good in Society Makes them evil, corporations make them evil, the patriarch makes him evil and so forth. Cheney. [laughter] hes behind it all is using ivanka beneath the earth. This idea is something that you obviously disagree with but i want to go back in the 70s, yet the shattering experience of somebody you knew was murdered by the black panthers, how long did it take before you realized i was with the wrong story. It was almost instantaneous. First of all because my closest friends, when i told them that the panthers had murdered him, they said it was the white power structure. And you know we have this today were a big icon of the left on Race Relations said theres no such thing as black on black crime, its white people behind it. It is crazy stuff. It is fascinating, you are talking about fertility and faith and its about stories and we grab onto stories and people call narratives, and that is the question, we will not have time to get into it in the segment but when we come back i want to talk to you about whether there is an overarching narrative that is consonant with reality, i want to get into that. Were talking with David Horowitz, mentality and faith, reflections through time. Hi folks, i am talking to the author of a brandnew book, mortality and faith. David horowitz, faith in reflections through the journey through time. A lot of people i admire praise this book, dennis has said that he has never been so moved by davids writing as by this profound book, reading about it. And i to say david your writing is great. And we were talking earlier about your contention which i think i agree with, we have to grab onto stories or narratives and you are talking about when this momen woman was murdered i4 a lot of people could not get out of the narrative, rather than say i have missed something they say, no you missed something, she was murdered by the white power, the man did it. And isnt it like being brainwashed. At some point it seems that you are talking about taking your thinking in the line of what you are calling reality in human nature and saying people who are stuck on these narratives are not willing to do that. The whole world which is completely outside my worl world, that is the key to it all. So with my books probably 10000 books in the bookstore and when i realized it was just another story completely false as it turns out it was like being in a desert completely flat with no landscape. What do you mean quick sure in a bookstore in the seventies in berkeley. I realize it was idea of false because millions of people live off of these bad and unproven and stupid ideas so that i had to face my own mortality and nothingness that was difficult to think that you could possibly have to do. You talk about that in the new book mortality and faith but it seems you suggest you are going along for the ride but then you realized i was going in the wrong direction. Maybe i had written ten books at that time. I had devoted my life spending five years i devoted my life to this false idea and very destructive and evil idea so the first thing i wanted to do is against falling into the trap and the people who go through it they are still communist they were all brought up that way but they wanted to detach themselves from it. Host i just want to go back. Is there a brand narrative cracks it seems you are suggesting there might be but you dont know that there is fickle grand narrative that actually not only happens to be correct, but true at a deeper level. You are saying you spent the last decades working with another narrative but you are not entirely convinced it is true. Give me the book and i will read you the passage. I write about mozart and the incredible miracle with all of this beautiful music of the time he was six years old. And then he wrote a letter in his 31st year at 31 years old to his father and it said as death is the real purpose of our life for seven years i have been come closely acquainted with this friend so every image is not only more terrifying but something very soothing and comforting. So i think god for affording me in his grace for the opportunity to realize that he is the key to our real happiness. He meeting death or god. God. I wrote this and it is generous book for a miraculous soul i wish this great and gifted young man who was dead for years later after this letter i wish i could place my trust in the hands of our creator and look at my life in the lives of my children and all that i have loved to see them as a prelude to a better world. I cannot sway left to ponder the pointlessness of our strivings on the earth and to ask the possible questions and receive no answers. So thats what i do. Yes it is on religious faith and it is comforting to be a marxist for go its very comforting to be the environmental radical. But you say it is a false faith. But it strikes me. Science is very limited. With all of the knowledge that we double every ten years or whatever scientists have no idea how the universe began and they have no idea how life began. Host you dont. But our knowledge is so limited. So talk about other writers like saul bello and there was a character say we have three dimensional minds but we live in a four dimensional universe so now is the same thing. And that is wisdom in my view and goes to understand the limits of my knowledge. When adam and eve are in the garden, they were seduced by the servant and what the serpent said if you eat of that tree you shall be of god. They think that they are god and can rearrange the world and solve the problems in ten years if they have enough power they can do but that arrogance cause the death of 100 Million People in the 20th century. You identify. And these political figures there is no hesitation she has the answer to everything. Shes a bartender no humility. It is interesting that people on the left mock prayer but what does it do the first thing it does is humble you with the powers and the mysteries that are beyond you. They have to be given you will not find them. In many ways talk about a man of faith and you dont sound like someone who is a realist other than to accept the idea that life is meaningless and everything with that primordial soup that we all got here by accident but you can hardly fault anyone. So why shouldnt they do anything because there is no truth or right and wrong so we will come back with David Horowitz with his book mortality and faith. Here we are talking about David Horowitz his book mortality and faith. David, talking about the idea that you say some people latch onto a narrative like they are inside a dream and dont want to wake up but you woke up from the dream it seems thats why is there is a world outside the dreamworld that there is a real world that there is a reality you behave that way but you do point that out. I think maybe this is our legacy. So it is comparable for me to live that way. Thats what religious people do. I tried to be as good of a person as i can. Why . That is what we call a cheap dodge. [laughter] i will not let you get away with that. I would argue that you dont believe what you just said because you dont know the answers so you say i think it is because you are too thoughtful and have been through too much to dedicate your life to pointing out lies if you dont believe it is true. You are absolutely right but going to the church of marxism i see all churches as institutions and i am wary. Now youre in the church of weariness. Now youre in the church of weariness. Host now youre writing the weariness humility trained. I dont want to get too conceptual but i what i am saying is, there is no way out of that loop that when you say now i figured it out i was too radical now i will be more humble and less sure no matter what you do you are asserting something with the idea of humility, the idea of facts working against this narrative and doing what you are doing more genuinely been asserting the very idea to do things respectfully and gingerly as opposed to the idea we will grab the idea and ride it to the end. I think thats a little too generous i agree with everything except i have devoted my life to find the will to fight the evil i was born into of progressivism. I have a series of nine volumes called the american left so i fight that battle with conviction because i lived it. I went to prevent from other people like me who are fanaticals today going to the misery that i went through. But it is limited. And with deposition avenue agnosticism and then to be comfortable embracing the faith because of the divinity. Thats funny that god is devilishly at one dash tempting you but if you talk something about bigger than religion it is truth so it strikes me youre still trying to figure out what is truth and it seems that you put the idea that a humble attitude toward knowing is part of truth. No. I think it is the way that you approach other way you begin the search for truth. I was always uncomfortable with astronomy as a young man because the universe is so big and the theory as i say despite all of their advances they dont know the most answers to the most basic questions now compared to the religious view that god created the universe and god created life, but that is a virtue and i will be wary so without a divinity. That is the most destructive ideology in Human History for go thats a big enough battle for me. Do believe those battles were fighting clicks because more than the previous incarnations so i want to get back to your book because you tell a lot of stories in this book and it is really volume number two of your own biography so where do you pick up your story in this book . What year quick. It was published 1997. I will tell you where the book began it began after 9 11. Host we always want to pause on an interesting note. Well be right back to talk to David Horowitz about mortality and faith. Hello folks we are talking to David Horowitz about his book mortality and faith you were just telling us that it was around 9 11. 2001. One was 9 11 and america was insulated since the civil war and we felt very safe in america and they change that. And knowing that availability would cause you to think about final things. And i was diagnosed right after 9 11 with prostate cancer. So i figured i should write about my and times. I was interested that what were my feelings and what i have been to describe throughout the book as various illnesses and losses and in particular, my daughte daughter, i dont know it attracted me to write about that so a lot of people think i am dying all the time we are but thats how the book begins that we begin to die the day we are born that is a little bit pessimistic. Really the day we are conceived which is even more pessimistic. Its one thing to think about our own mortality a week to be flippant about the meaning of life and death when thinking about ourselves but loved ones, you mentioned your daughter dying young but when you love someone and they die typically young that usually facilitates much more strongly against the meaninglessness of life and the prospect of our own death. My daughter was an observant jew and believed believing in a carnation and reincarnation of the spirit. The spirit is inside me. I wrote a book about her called cracking of the heart in which idea with this and you are absolutely right it was horrifying. I write about it here a little bit my life entered a winter from which it can never recover. But like i say, i am not only satisfied with the book that i write but this one in particular because i think there is a lot of wisdom and consolation for people i put on his tombstone but there was a saying that life is a struggle. But he did get some things right. But the german workers struggle and they took a hit so thats hard to speak about that in the original german but there is something about love talk about your daughter dying, cracking of the heart , if you are looking for clues to the meaning of lif life, it seems that you have some clues that there is something about love and attachment to someone that says it does not seem possible. There is a whole passage about one morning my wife and i, my wife was looking at her laptop with pictures of my daughter after she died. She came to me and said lets go out so we went to like a jewish deli in california. And i was sitting at the table there was a stiff paper plate it flew off the table and hit me in the stomach. No wind totally unexplainable that my wife was convinced it was our daughter communicating. Host that described you as miraculous. I cannot explain it. Host but it was extremely strange but it was extremely strange. Thats where i leave it as the agnostic. Host you say that but i dont believe you you dont believe it was nothing but just because we hold things lightly or not sure radicals that does not mean that we cannot believe things and it seems to me although you are not willing to say so there are some beliefs that are not Worth Holding onto. I dont know i am fascinated by the seatbelt psychic he picks them up and drives the places. Of course you never know whats going on behind the camera but it is uncanny he knows about their loved ones. I just take the agnostic view. I am not at all prepared to dismiss it. I know there are psychics who are fakers but the same with my daughter. I wish it was true thats what i write is the book i wish that was a communication from my daughter. But when somebody dies it leaves all the conversations unfinished. And you think of all the things you should have said. So i leave it for what it is. Host we are going to another break youll be right back with David Horowitz. Talking to David Horowitz about mortality and faith are you a bg span line a bgs fan quick. Queen . This is a guy im sorry i get them mixed up but yes it is funny because you have chosen to settle in california after all these years for somebody who is a common archconservative politically , you are not in a place where most people share your worldview and people in the media tend to be radically on the left side. Why is that . No. In the fifties from when i was still a leftist but california is a serious place not like new york. In new york i cannot walk into a room without being assaulted verbally for what i believe. I have often thought of that. But in california is very easy to avoid. Now i cant go on the campus because now they shut down conservatives entirely and they have been purged from their faculties. It is very dangerous on people like you are on a college campus. I cannot go without a bodyguard in the administration is so supportive of these campus fascist they just turn my speech into a circus with all kinds of strange things. So i have obstructed. But people in california are interested in their bodies and their careers unless you are in San Francisco and i move from the bay area but yes all i talk about is relationships. [laughter] so living on the left coast with the views that you hav have, with this book mortality and faith, you make it sound that has the allegiant tone so do you see this like a final statement . You are not exactly on your deathbed. Actually i am inspiring people. I wrote it that way the end of the book is about a very wealthy man and a very generous man and he had cancer at the same time i did but he opted not to do the surgery. He was just a wonderful spirit throughout his life. And when he died people come out of the woodwork to talk about the things he did for them. So then you lose him again. I want to hear the rest of the story but we will have to end this hours so to hear the rest of this go to youtube if you want to watch this we will continue the story but that ends the sour. David. Thank you. Whether this is the david when taxes show or book tv the new book is mortality and faith. What but then he created for through the spectrum that when i was suffering i had this operation and then he insisted around the clock and then i didnt want to hurt his feelings. And to be in incredible pain. And then to tell the story when they did the memorial. But his last words which were excruciating to go close to his father to hear them. I want to thank the flyers for what they did to my family and im getting emotional but i felt ashamed by this guy because i wanted to be a person like that and all the flyers left because he was like a father to them. Even after 40 or 50 years, he was like a 12 yearold that his first game. And then he would always go down to the locker rooms even when they lost. Ed schneider from philadelphia. Its interesting because again we are looking for what is true and that seems to be what youre doing in your book mortality and faith to think about that more carefully, it strikes me that when you encounter someone like your friend ed, you know there is something there this is a clue as to what is true or meaningful but he seems to me as further evidence its not possible that life is meaningless and we just exist and there is nothing because a life like his. I respect that view. Host it is interesting to me that is how you respond but then again somebody who is really cynical but if they were they would say the only reason you respond that way is because evolution has inadvertently programmed. But there are people who believe that. And they will make an argument for that to say it is meaningless but somehow your evolution favored those who were predisposed to say life has meaning but it doesnt mean that it does so theres there is that to think about. That is a presumption. Host [laughter] yes but i dont agree with it. This is probably a legacy. But to me that seems a little cynical but we will let it go. Its not a bad idea. I understand that. They didnt know. I saw what it did to my father. Communism made him strong now this person and his father was very weak but his political faith he was very articulate and was a good teacher. He was a high school teacher. Was that before your conversion quick. No. No i was a disappointment the first book that we were together were rockefellers and was a friend of the sunday times and the there wasnt about the economic crisis. And you say why read about the rockefellers. It is boring. [laughter] pretty good. Talk about the nature of reality, if absolute power corrupts absolutely is a political conservative, both of us would say yes, because human nature is not good, we need to have checks and balances on power and any time it is a bad thing we do it we can do structurally to work against that but one thing the founders did not plan for was the kind of power we have today in corporations like google and something has happened. They have to break up google and regulated and that is a public conversation we cannot hand our National Destiny over to google but we are. Host Dennis Prager has an oped in todays wall street journal where he talks about this. So then that were tree endlessly effective. So that with google or facebook or twitter it does not solve that change from the Poverty Law Center but to be suppressed and destroy with those peoples conservatives the Progressive Left is a communist left which is no relation to the Democratic Left but i use democratic socialism as the oxymoron. We cannot take away the private sector and give all power to the government have a democracy. It is surprising that you know, for all but a single thing but first you have two things going on. First you have the heads of those hugely powerful corporations not only beating radical leftist but willing to use their power. That is democrats for american pluralism this is showing how the left has gotten worse and worse. In the sixties i always wanted to hear what our opponents were saying because i thought that would make me a better radical. They dont want to hear. So to me thats the first part but the second part that i think the founders didnt really foresee is the idea of social media. So to put aside the bias of the heads of google and other powerful organizations, there is something in the nature of social media as a cruel aggregation that works like a mob. In other words by having the Electoral College you can work against that structurally during the election but generally social media is a mob that if we do away with it and just the public on everything go to your computer every day and vote clearly the founders to. Then that puts them in the hands of the people but on the other hand they. We always want to and on an exciting note. Dont go away. Hey folks were talking to David Horowitzs new book mortality and faith you may be watching this on cspan book tv you can watch the whole interview on youtube wherever you can find my name. Speaking of whic which, youtube, google, the aggregation of power but the bigger issue of and then but what will help us work against. And also with the internet. Host that is the first part of the problem what Dennis Prager wrote about that if google is censoring people then yes they need to be a public utility. They are. Host but the larger issue now we have National Conversations that there is a different consciousness as a result of social media and the internet that did not exist 20 years ago where things move differently. The tech companies. That we have people and clearly and political we have organized. But hoping that the free market because of the existence of alternative media quick. It is helpful but this stupid statement not msnbc or cnn but 200 shootings but where do you have to go cracks google and there is where i found an article that something is happened in the culture. We have no libel law. Is that possible quick. The New York Times if you are a public figure as i am. Just calling trump a racist is an opinion protected by the First Amendment where it should be liable. Host why do we cease to have libel cracks. But yet New York Times versus sullivan now you cannot sue for libel it sounds like you are racist is an actual statement but it is an opinion so Chris Wallace and others on fox are one way. The problem is with the democracies it is open but with those standards. I assume you are in the believer the few working but i want you to invest in private companies and thats the ideology. I see the threats of facebook and google and twitter i see that all the time on twitter. But what my book covers on twitter they instituted an algorithm. Host it is so despicable just hearing this. So the southern property while on law center but come on. Host there are people out there and i think slowly they are waking up to this. But i agree but i voted for reagan but they were. Host talking to David Horowitz about his book mortality and faith but so do you think its moving more quickly than that do you think people are waking up with that inequity finally in america cracks in iniquity and an equity. Start with obama look at how radical these people were. Conservatives were uncomfortable talking about the left it is really malicious it will think nothing of destroying people. I am at the top hate mongers in america i have written books on the race issue that even a teenager reading them could understand that you judge people on the content of their character. Go back to the meaning of life so it seems to me you are suggesting that some type of hard left doesnt have that transcendent value doesnt think that lying to get in power. The ends justify the means. So their morals are differen different. And so to suggest that worldview was more a conservative worldview in those transcended values in the interview does not want also says theres only power. Thats true but also people on the right understand human beings live. But yet we have to fight that all the time is a natural tendency. And with those social situations so we have to fight it and understand actually there is a book. Host i didnt thank you may get to march in you will get to Julian Barnes so what do you touch upon quick. There is a passage from side bello about his mother dying of cancer i dont know if it is a true story but he goes to a sexual misadventure with a woman. He talks about life as a turntable but not moving in any direction and when he gets back it is embarrassing and humiliating. The classic the low stories. So he hopes that his father is mad at him when he opens the door because he was on the turntable so we are always progressing to the end. Host the centrifugal force of mortality. And one poignant figure and wonderful theological writing writings, because they understood our plate on plight in the book which has been collected. Host talk about that. I read up until very recently and i have never seen that. Spent there are some interesting insights with abraham and isaac and jacob but also talking about the dead in god that is free will and that something progressives dont understand is the fundamental judeochristian belief that god gave us free will. Whereas a leftist think we are prisoners that we dont choose what we do. Host there is a fatalism but especially the recent generation of leftist seems fatalistic. Those capitalist exploiting workers and stealing from them basically so that labor theory of value that was already discredited. You transfer that to what quick. Race and gender and sexual orientation. Same with the president. But if you put rings through your nose will that change the view of those people cracks come on ff. They can do that but do they have a firing squad as the alternative. Dont go away David Horowitz is my guest his book mortality and faith. The previous book dark agenda. We will be right back. Hey there folks talking to David Horowitz his book so for somebody who holds truth and meaning light leave you ever seem to be a warrior for what you believe is true and as with my son Dennis Prager who is but you are much better defender of christian values or thinking. Because. But if you are a believer then you believe jesus christ is our savior so you defend that you still want to apply that to any argument but i have a clear idea the way the country was created that what the leftists like to enjoy but we all enjoy the founders were christians 90 percent were protestant christians and those ideas and to understand where they come from is not to know where you get your freedoms. So i began and it occurred to me you cannot have the unalienable right with life liberty and the pursuit of happiness because it was given with the likes of beta will work or gillibrand they will take them away. So you have to come to terms with the fact of the judeochristian view of the world and that means all the good things in america. But it is pragmatic approach and it is effective. That was the incorrect but we will not get into that. So lets talk about your books how that what we have asked before but now a shallow question with the current crop of candidates on the democratic side, which one or two do you think might and up or being there not many nominee quick. I am appalled. Here is my theory they will continue to battle each other like the jackals will go after themselves they will be bloodied and the mandarins like Michael Moore is already talking if everybody is bloodied in the water nobody can beat trump out of the weeds to save america will come Hillary Clinton and she will pretend to be dragged to be the nominee but will be the nominee. Honestly is such a pleasure to have you. Thank you so much. I am the author of many books like outliers and coming soon my newest book talking to stranger strangers. You are watching the tv on cspan two. If i could dispel one question from the conversation it would be that question why did she stay cracks of course its always gendered like why they hitting them in the first place is a better question but people stay for soul all sorts of reasons and they also dont stay we just dont know what leaving looks like. There is a woman in the book for example her name was michelle her husband was named rocky neither saw physical evidence of violence against her and the decade they were together but he would do things like say to her your family hates me i dont want to spend holidays with them so out of loyalty she would go to his familys house and that is how it began then she would do something that upset him he would take the kids and go camping or go to a motel for the night and she would be frantic with worry. Eventually tore the end he would go up to an area on the outskirts of the city where they lived in montana and got a rattlesnake and brought it home and kept it in a cage and said i will put this in the bed with a shower with you if you get out of line. So where is someone like that supposed to go cracks a shelter is temporary she cannot raise her kids in a shelter. She could go out a statement at some point he will call the authorities and save my kids have been kidnapped. So where can she go cracks in her case she was leaving him and making very quiet secret steps. Number one she put the house and her name it was owned by her father so that they could get rocky out of their. She was in school to get a nursing degree because rocky would not let her work outside the home that would let her take classes as she was trying to take classes so she could be afford to raise her kids. So leaving is a long process. A few months ago but tv visited the free vines book club that takes place in the washington dc jail where the members are inmates they were reading bestselling novel about the vietnam war the things they carried. This has aired several times on the tv interview will air it again shortly but we wanted to show you some of the interviews that were not included in the original airing. First is the cofounder and we spoke with her about how and why she started the book club in a jail setting