Him graduate from high school or go to prom or go to college so i think he would have married 22 is fairly young but graduating from college. I think of all the good things we shared in those memories cannot be taken away from us. As parents you always want to see your children do something productive we would have been hoping for another College Graduate just to see his life progress to see him raise his own family those are the things we think about. So that question you got so many times who was trey von martin . Treyvon martin . We get Little Details so much has been written and said that your son but what did we miss when we were digging through the School Records . That is one of the reasons we wrote the book we wanted the parents point of view. A lot of times the books that were written they did not even know who treyvon was. We wanted a name with a person or the teenager. Treyvon was very affectionate. It could have been in the Grocery Store if you wanted a hug and a kiss he got one. He didnt mind the people that were around him like when we were little we would always kiss them but as he got older it did not faze him that people were around so he was very affectionate he wanted to do everything for me he was a good kid and was a good person to be around, kind of funny but really affectionate. Walking through what this experience must be those cases that have boiled up but having built relationships some of what that experience must be to be there that first day to get the phone call but if you tell the story what about a grieving parent . Not just those killed by police but i know in your book people were killed by street gun violence so to be the elder statesman what it is like for you with a unique experience. So the one thing you find yog people are. So it really does something to you emotionally. So we invested 17 years into treyvon and not to see that life progress any further is hurtful. But in conversation with other parents, i personally always tell them i know what you are going through but i dont understand your hurt because every parent has a different relationship with their child. Mike brown i understand what they go through but i dont understand their hurt because of that relationship. I know the relationship i had with treyvon and sabrina so i understand her hurt but it is a fraternity sort of speak nobody wants to be a part of. We did not sign up for this but it was thrust on us so we understand there is a Bigger Picture something more important than just the death of our son there are others that we try to impact so with that elder statesman we understand the rol role. What is fascinating going back and forth chronologically to tell the story with the story of his death but to be partners in raising children that were still functionally close so tell me the relationship to be the load speaks people for your seven with justice and the work with the foundation. To have this bond together as the parent. The common focus we have with the children even though our relationship did not work out we just a focus on being parents that made it easy for us to raise them because we got along he did not have a problem picking them up so it kind of worked out. People think it is strange we get along so well but i think we have always been civilized but for the most part we come together for the betterment and we managed to do that. You were still in miami and tracy were in sanford at the time. So the piece of the book where you arrive talks about an emotional moment not even necessarily wanting to go. And you can imagine any mother or my mother what she would think to be struck by the passage and for the first time in the community where my son was killed i saw something that shook me which was a memorial but it was a memorial for my son. With the letters of treyvon. That memorial touched me deeply a crime scene but the memorial was a gift. But they knew the body on the ground was a boy it was a human and a life. Was that the moment you realized so what did it feel like to see that memorial and that support that you start to gain. That was the first public sign that people were supporting us but it didnt give a gauge at how many people were in support i wasnt expecting that so just to pull in the gate to see the memorial that this is the area the surroundings he was in. But what really hit me hard at the 1,000,030 rally we actually saw the amount of people that came out to support. The memorial touched my heart that million 30 rally for how many other people this happened to and nobody heard about their name. To know who treyvon was that all black and brown boys and some girls that have been killed and nobody has been held accountable. To be an important part of the movement and i just have so much respect for people who supported it. With this inside view of what it might be like to see the players over time. The first conversation from these cases or if you were a casual reader knowing the name treyvon knowing the case loosel loosely, they dont necessarily see all the pieces that come into play. They see a rally they dont know who was involved. Can you talk about some of these people . They play the roles to turn the death of the young man to a name that still rings out across the nation. The majority of the recognition that treyvon received from a Family Member named Patricia Jones because without her we would not be in contact with an attorney that brings light to our case. So when i first talked to the attorney to tell me that when i explained the case that treyvon was killed walking home with a can of iced tea and skittles the first thing he said it would be an arrest and i continued to call and call and call and he finally answered the phone and i told him they didnt make an arrest yet. He stopped he was doing and started to put things into place. Kind of threw me for a minute and then the conversation began as we will do everything we can to assist you guys and he will be coming down and speaking with us. So jasmine played an important part and they still play a huge part in the things we do. Ryan played a huge part and with all of the opponents working together to. They are major components to our strategy to get justice and get an arrest. Host you almost have to campaign for justice and its easy to consolidate its now years later but we have seen in campaign after campaign starti starting. One of the first things you were pushing for publicly lets hear this interaction. The public hasnt heard of these yet in that moment you are trying to figure out some evidence that might help us figure out what happened to our son. What were you thinking the first few days. We automatically just went to the notion that there is a coverup if something going on because they are fighting so hard not to release the tapes. We have to file an injunction. Theres a fight to get the tapes released and we knew that there was something on the tapes that kind of characterized what happened that night. At the sanford city hall ascending to the tapes of the 911 callers who were witnesses to the altercation and you write about listening to ourselves. You heard these tapes and is that about what your relationship was with elected officials i think there is an assumption that there must be a full adversarial relationship and when you were calling for certain actions i was also struck by the moments of humanity people wouldnt necessarily assume he is an ally of yours. I think that a lot of people were torn between if they stand up for the community or support whats right with the mayor even though he seemed to be this strong governing body for sanford, hes still the father and he probably thought about him being his own son and so that touched him a great deal and not only him, but when we went to the trial there were also Court Deputies and Police Officers we want people to stand on the right side and we want people to see him as an unarmed 17yearold which are facts. He wasnt carrying a weapon even though they said that this is the weapon that he used. That is just simply ridiculous. With everything that went on it may make people want to choose a side if you look at the facts he wasnt paying attention to his surroundings. He was on his own and its clear the killer was told not to pursue him or follow him but you could hear he was clearly following him and at some point in time he even ran into this person ran after him so to me i would feel like im being stalked like why are you following me, what is it about me that you are following me. We know in hindsight that it was because of the color of his skin. Even though they couldnt bring it in in th and the trial we knt is clear that this would happen. It sends a bad message to our men and women on the street you dont know whether to walk fast or slow, whether you should speak or not to speak, there are so many things they have to go through and they dont feel safe in their own community or country. Host theres a moment where they say the hoodie is the problem. He could have taken it off but he couldnt have taken his skin off. I think that is one of the things that is compelling about the story and people identified with at the time. I remember sitting at my College Newspaper reading these columns or articles being written and thinking to myself i grew up in the suburbs thinking to myself how many times in the middle of the night was i going t like goe corner store always wearing a hoodie constantly and how this could have easily happened. Ive heard you talk about this as well, this idea that our children can do everything right and in this instance there may still be this person who is working and will be suspicious of them. You both talk about in the book the evolution of your thinking and how you say is this a race thing and how does it factor in the terms by the end i appreciate this because you walk us through as you are seeing the parts of the case come together you start to say what else could it have been. But what do you think that this played in the death of her son . Guest i think it played a major role in it goes back to the 911 tapes. They thought it was one thing that he said and it was another and they had the processiona pe. He said hes up to no good, how can you beat up to no good when you were just walkinyoure justm the store. We knew that race played a part. We want this to be a case where it was an unjust killing so they try to look at it from the dual lens to say maybe it didnt play a part when w but when we went n the trial, we saw it come out in the jury pool and some of the things the defense attorney was saying so by the end of the trial we knew that it was about race and that it played a huge part in our sons death and anybody thats a dividend play a part, didnt even watch the trial. Host ura blackfin as well and there is an experience when black men and women talk about their experiences and white people just dont understand, they dont know what its like to be followed around in a store or have people suspicious of you just by your presence. Had you had conversations about that and what were your feelings when you were watching him go through this thing even after his death being cast in certain ways and stereotyped what was your feeling . Guest it was hurtful. Just the thought of how people think of us and how they think that we are less than 100 human is crazy to know i work with you, i pay the same taxes that you pay, i shop at the same stores that your perception of me is that i am not good enough to stand in line with you so it is hurtful especially when you have a 17yearold unit you invested a lot in and you know youve taught him everything, the dos and donts in the laws of the land but to have a person that doesnt know him make comments about him and sort of demoralized him it was hurtful to the samsame time we know thes they were saying are not true because we knew who he was not only as our son that as an africanamerican young man we knew who he was. Host the second phase of is the first was his death and the push for the tapes after the tapes without now it is arrest George Zimmerman, hes killed your son and hes been allowed to go sleep in his own bed and be free with this ongoing question are they going to file charges, are they going to bring in a special prosecutor, can you walk through what that was in this idea here you are the parents of a young man killed essentially having to campaign for justice for your child. Guest the whole time as grieving parents that was our focus was to try to get justice. All of these obstacles placed in our path what parents do you know that has a 17yearold that if something happened to them if they wouldnt want answers so we were not asking for anything any otheother parents wouldnt have wanted for their own child but people dont see that. A lot of times people dont see things because they are not going through things. They would rather sit behind a computer screen and complain about something they dont know about. But i just feel like everything was a struggle. Getting the information about what happened, but there were only two people that were actually there and one of them is that so the other person is unbelievable and you cant believe what this person says because of course they want to stay out of jail so we had to challenge was getting answers from the Police Department and the medical examiners just to get the body released. We had to work with the state of florida to try to get them to pursue the case even higher once the special prosecutor was assigned to the case. It was a constant struggle. The arrest was a struggle. Everything weve gone through was a complete struggle and this is during the time that we were grieving because this happened fairly soon after he was shot and killed so while we were trying to get answers all of these things played a part, but i think the most important thing that places the fact that we had good legal representation that gave us the guidance that we need it because we didnt know anything about this or what to do next and the kin we kind of a guideline to show us what we needed to do and then some things we didnt listen to them on because we were so passionate about trying to get justice. Host what was the feeling when the charges were finally announced . Youve gone through this so quickly as you see when you find out about your son has been killed and the person hasnt been arrested, you get a special prosecutor and finally a press conference has been called a. Guest it felt good that there would be an arrest and at that particular time we still had faith in the florida judicial system because they did make an arrest. Had it not been for the special prosecutor i dont think that it would have been made a so when the announcement came a, an arrest was made in favor of a place that we were hopeful, but that was just an arrest and one part of the process but of course we were looking for a conviction. If he had been 18 and killed a white young men we know that there would have been an arrest without going through everything we went through. There would have been an arrest that night, that kid would have went to the morgue and our son would have went to someones prison. We know that for sure. That is just how the Justice System worked. Then its whats giv get the bet of the doubt to the killers with others killing minorities, so the charges, the announcement of the charges were huge for us and we are still hopeful. Host when did you lose some of that hope . One of the things in the book reading through to parents sitting in a trial every day i appreciate you sharing with us the notes you had and your reaction in realtime to the pieces of dialogue and the transcripts and you both present specific things when you said i wish they would have asked more specifically about this on the idea that you thought you could get charged with manslaughter and now hes not being pressed on that. The last young lady to speak with him before his death in this kinandthis kind of intervid crossexamination goes on for hours and you can see her getting frustrated. What was it like to be in that courtroom with both the person that killed your son and the ministry around you and that feeling and was there a moment where it feels like youve come so close to achieving justice because this person charged, was their momenthere a moment that w were felt he is not going to be convicted . Guest there were times. It was my first trial so im not familiar. I just dont have the process. There were times i listened and noticed when you have a private attorney they can say and do almost anything but the state of florida prosecuting the case they do things by the book. With me sitting there witnessing the whole thing it seemed they were able to do and say almost anything but the state of florida had a process. They have procedures that they have to follow. Like okaclick okay these are the parameters that they would stay and they wouldnt do anything outside of that and so i dont know if it has anything to do with how much money you have and who is prosecuting the case but i know that it seems so unfair just sitting there listening to everything and one of the things that has always brought out is they never brought in any character witnesses. Nobody got the chance to know who he really was. Well be listened to the painted picture of who this person was that was shot and killed, somebody that they never saw before or met and debated and no. Their job is to get their client off and that is what they did. By any means necessary. They didnt really care about who he was. They didnt really care about this. You have to be careful when you have your own children especially. Host one thing you talk about is the media focus. They have the School Records and all of a sudden theres questions was he on drugs. What did it feel like i can remember the time someone discovered his twitter page and so theres always questions. I was a College Student with two younger brothers and i knew what their pages look like. What did it feel like with him as it seemed sometimes on trial with a public grappling was he a thug or was he an angel, what did you like to have your son go through this publicly in all anl these people that do not know him talking about him in this way . Guest we never proclaimed him to be an angel until after his death. He was an average teenager and they have their ups and downs, they have good days and bad days, times they are hanging with a bad crowd and times they are hanging with their family. The stories that we heard were kind of hit and miss. Some were a little true in some were not true at all. There were pictures going around that were not keeping him. It is upsetting to have to go through that as a parent and hear all these negative things people say. But the reason all of that was said is to try to justify why somebody shot and killed an unarmed teenager. You cant justify that. I dont care what he did or if he stole something out of a store, if he smoked weed or whatever. I dont care if he was suspended from school. He was my son and i loved him dearly and he didnt deserve to die. He did not deserve to die and that is what people do not understand regardless of his ups and downs and mistakes. We all make them. Nobody is perfect. Its easy for someone to sit there and say he did this, he got suspended from school so because you get suspended from school, you should be shot and killed . No. Thats because this country takes death and shootings and killings so nonchalantly. We have to be more mindful and how many people that may affect because of this senseless act because it didnt have to happ happen. Host do we know how the trial turned out and that there is no conviction. Youve been containin campaignir justice for your son and it felt like a fight every step of the way. What is the feeling you write about where he wasnt even there anymore when the announcement comes. What was going through your head and what were you thinking in those moments while you may have suspected this would happen, now you knew that this part o was ps closed. Guest we knew once we left the courtroom that there wasnt going to be a conviction so we put our minds together and said even though there will not be a conviction we will not let it define who our son was so they didnt want everybody to remember and how he died. We wanted him to be remembered as he was. So once we left the courtroom we knew for a fact we have an uphill battle and in order for us to stay in the battle we would have to work harder than we ever had to keep his name in the forefront and pull the cover off of some of the injustices that are played out in the communities. We knew we had our work cut out for us and he vowed to continue to fight for justice. I think that we left with a sense of we knew we were discouraged but in order to navigate through, we knew we had to stay strong and focused on its not just being about trayvon but it made us realize you cant put all of your eggs in one basket. The basket was a conviction basket and once it was emptied out and there was no conviction then thats what do we do now so like i said we gather our thoughts, came back home and said this is our next move. Host in a second i want to talk about the time since the trial which is the focus of the book you kind of walk us through that before i moved them are presentday, one thing that is not in the book that is absent very often these the name of the man who killed your son, George Zimmerman often referred to as the killer of our son. Hes been in and out of the news in the intervening years. Had there ever beehave there evt between you all and zimmerman and do you have any feelings toward him still . We know hes kind of made public statements and has done various things. You are linked to him forever in this way for better or for worse obviously the death of your son. Are there any feelings toward him still . Guest im still at the place i was february, 2012, im still at that place that i have anger in me. I would be less than a man if i told you my position has chang changed. There is a lot of anger because hes taken something we cannot get back. The only thing that would detach that is if our son were here. I think there is a love of resentment and hurt and pain inside of me. What i ever want to sit down and a dialogudialogue within . Absolutely not. I am a man first and foremost and there are plenty of emotions that are still running deep in me and that is being a protector of your child i dont think i will ever get to a space in my life that i will be able to sit down and ask why did you do this. He had the chance to explain why he did it so this was his chance to explain why hed take taken r son away from us and so i am still at the same point. Host at one point in the book hes accounting an interview today with reverend al sharpton and this is when the trial was still campaigning to get George Zimmerman arrested and the reverend turns to you. Are you determined to hang in there no matter what and your response to him was until the day i die. Im a mother and i want justice for my son and i wont stop until i receive it. What does justice look like for you years after the trial and the fight for justice for trayvon as well as all these other people have been killed . Guest justice for me is probably different than other people. Justice for me would be trayvon back here and if i couldnt get him back, certainly a life should be given so tha that is t justice looks like for me and i didnt receive that. I know a lot of people feel like the person will get what is coming to them and i believe that that the same time it still hurts a great deal we have so many evil people in this world that will shoot and kill somebody unarmed and then not be honest about what happened. So it bothers me a great deal but i try to put my best foot forward and i try not to think so much about who the person was that killed my son. My focus is on so many Different Things and i think that is just a distraction when i take my focus off what i need to be doing for my son. Host one thing that was interesting is that there were almost two separate or distinct moments in the movement, the initial idea of the rally and the marches and then what became clear around the time of the lack of the conviction which is the same kind jordan daviss trial is happening and we see this moving forward in cleveland and baltimore and kind of the beginning and conception of the black live why this matter movet more broadly. So i want to talk about those two Different Things because i think looking at a specific case of your son help to show us a lot of what happened in the years following. One of the things i want to talk about is the initial things people were engaged in were stand your ground balls and this idea that you had these empowered him to take someones life and power tend to not be arrested that night and also do cannot be convicted later on and i think that issue has fallen off of the main conversation that would seem like a tough battle and it isnt clear what the status of those are. A few years removed what do you think the status is of the stand your ground law and that they are still on the books in so many states . Guest we focus in the jordan davis case sitting in the vehicle and the individual who took his life vote they are playing loud music with me just shoot the car up so to speak and he had no explanation as to why he did it only he thought they had a gun in the car so his defense was he was going to try to use stand your ground. Just the notion that this is the mindset of individuals they can shoot and kill young black and brown boys without any witnesses and get away with it just thinking they can get away from it is something we have to take a look at. What would the momentum of that be if you had africanamerican men going out and shooting young white man and saying i was standing my ground i was fearful of my life . There would be a change. So lets change this law. It is a bad law. We have to look at it from different perspectives. Guest it was very discouraging. And how many casein how many cak at and say this was an africanamerican man that used it. It ray or even with Police Brutality you dont see black officers brutalizing young man, you dont see it and so definitely they have to be revision or repealed or something with these laws. Host another thing that was interesting is that there te pastors that tina an that cae in to provide support for people who were not activists and heard the name and the story and said im dedicating my time and life to that. That is similar to what we saw the following years where you had people do for School Activists but a lot of young people said that could have been me so im going to be in the streets. What does that say about the moment we are in coming together to seek justice . Guest i think a lot of people have always realized we havent been treated fairly it is just more obvious now that everybody with camera phones in videotapes and everything people are more aware and so now you have Police Officers that are being charged and better on a grand jury so it is definitely a move that is just a slow move. When you see a man being shot in the back and nobody is being held accountable and we can see he was running away, i dont understand what threat he could have posed. I dont understand a lot of the things going on but it definitely brings an the young and older people together united so we can make a change. When we go out and speak to the young men and women they say all the time they dont feel safe in their own community, they dont feel safe in their own country and i remember growing up i always felt safe. I never went outside to play and didnt feel safe. Kids can feel safe in the country so there is a lot about the direction that we are going in as far as safety and protection and all of that concern it says a lot about this country. When our own children cannot stay safe in their own communi community. Host when we look back at the last decade eight or ten years we see the rise of the black lives Matter Movement and most people point to the death of your son as one of the catalyscountless reasons this mt was born. You couldnt have imagined at the time you were beginning to first call the support youve received for your own case much less now that its a staying factor and i forget whose chapter is that it refers to the death of emmett till and the fight to get justice for her son and how it became one of the spikes of the Civil Rights Movement. What do you think of the life and death and activism because of its . You look at the dream defenders and black lives matter written in response to the failure to convict George Zimmerman. When you think about that, what comes to mind . Guest we definitely think of trayvon as a young man who galvanized the country. He brought many different cultures together for one cause, fighting for justice and so just to know that his name had structure to do with the resurgence for being a spark for the new Civil Rights Movement means a great deal. When you speak of the civil rights it certainly has been an abundance of people that have come before us and put their lives on the line for us so to see the movement with the young people getting involved it certainly has a different meaning to it because we know that young people are involved and are not afraid to go out on the streets and protest and to voice their opinion. This isnt the 50s and 60s where we have to be afraid of our jobs. We have a voice now and so to see all of the people intertwined we know that all lives matter that when we look at it in the context its a life that is getting choked up in new york or it is a life that has its hands up getting shot at the street, it is a life getting his hands up killed in front of his daughter that is why we say black lives matter. Those lights do matte lines do o its not any other culture that is happening to so yes all lives matter that when will the country start to realize that black lives matter so just to know that he is the spark to the modernday civil rights is an honor to be his parent and know that we are a part of the new movement. Host in addition to serving with the elder statesmen and women of the parents of people that have been told, you do a lot of work in the foundation beginning with his legacy and mentorship. Can you talk a little bit about what the foundation does the work that you are continuing to do . One of the things we are very proud of is we do connect with other families, other mothers and fathers that are victims of senseless gun violence and have we created as a circle of mothers and fathers. Its not so much about tracy and i but its a bonding with the families so we can heal togeth together. We love talking to the young people because we know their minds are still shape. Sometimes they get older and dont want to change their way but they listen and absorb the information and so we just enjoy talking to people because of it and know that they are our future but its also about trying to make a difference in your community. A lot of people want to help the foundation and loved the support but again the need to basically work in their own community so they can try to make a difference in their Community Whether it be a Nonprofit Organization so they can do to makcould makea difference in thn community. Host you have been so generous with your time today and your thoughts in the story. In closing, what should the families out there watching today, what should they learnedn from the lesson of your family and the story that you share . Guest one of the takeaways is as a family coming to me to come togetheneed tocome togethed with adversity and learn how to navigate. Its very therapeutic and informative. We tell the story how he isnt perfect and so just having a glance at how we look at everything as the boo what the s all about. Its a great read and we hope that people can get it. Host the book is the end during the life of trayvo trayvk in a parents story of love, injustice and the birth of a movement. Thank you for sharing your time with us today and your story with everybody. Guest thank you. Journalisdiscusses his book s exploring freespeech issues and interviewed by the president and publisher of regnery. Host milo, great to have you with us today wonderful to have the chance to talk with you. I am wonderful, thank you very much. I wiha
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