Transcripts For CSPAN2 Tears We Cannot Stop 20170930

Eric dyson who will offer his thoughts on Race Relations in the u. S. I hope that you all have had a wonderful day here at the baltimore book festival. If youre just joining us, welcome. Todays been a fabulous opening, and we have a wonderful guest this evening. A few announcements, first of all, the baltimore book festival is produced by the Baltimore Office of promotions and the arts which is a 501 c 3 Nonprofit Organization that serves as baltimore citys arts council, event center and film office. Wed like to thank a few select sponsors who help to keep the book festival and other events free to the public; the maryland state art council, the city of baltimore, housen university, the able foundation, the nora roberts foundation, cspan booktv and ford. Our guest for this evening is dr. Michael eric dyson whose latest book is tears we cannot stop a sermon to White America. Dr. Dyson is an awardwinning author, a Georgetown University sociology professor, a New York Times contributing opinion writer and a contributing editor of the new republic and of espns theundefeated. Com. He is the author of 19 books including four New York Times bestsellers. Our facilitator this evening is mr. Quincy gamble whos the executive director of one baltimore. Without further ado, please welcome our guests for the evening. [applause] how is everyone . [inaudible conversations] come on, a baltimore welcome. How is everyone . [cheers and applause] lets welcome professor dyson to baltimore. First of all, thank you for persevering. Had a little bit of car trouble, but were glad that youre here, and welcome back to baltimore. Its, obviously, a pleasure to have you here. And this book, incredible book. Thank you, sir. Your 20th one. Incredible book, right . Whos all read it . [applause] i was really intrigued by the notion of it being a sermon. Im the grandson of a South Carolina baptist minister, and when he would preach very challenging sermons, he would say its tight but its right. [laughter] and i think that fits this right. Its tight but its right. So as we start, you know, we sit here in the era of a Trump Presidency and Race Relations are at a fever pitch in this country right now. So it seems that you were either prophetic or incredibly lucky to write this book at this time. So give us a sense of sort of Race Relations in this country. Where do we stand and sort of how is your book fitting in to the times that were in right now . Well, thank you. First of all, its great to be here in bmore and to be with you, brother gamble, again and to this wonderful book festival. We are its wrong but its tight. [laughter] this country is in dire straits right now, and not just in terms of race, though that is true and that is the centerpiece of the fiasco that we confront. But its also witnessing the insistence on an adolescent attitude toward adult issues. And beyond that, the resurgence of a neofascist identity in quarters and segments of the culture have been amplified, echoed or at least not sturdily resisted by the top office in the land. And then when you have the false equivalences between fascism and antifascism and black lives matter and, you know, kkk organizations, its truly disheartening to see where we are. I think its a challenge to the rest of the nation to catch up to where people of color and other allies have been on the left for a while. I mean, donald trump is the manifestation of stuff weve been trying to say for a long time. Hes like, you know, bigotry for beginners in terms of trying to break it down. If you wanted to know what it was and it is, here it is. Not, and im not trying to get into whether donald trump himself is a bigot. Thats irrelevant at this stage, because what youre doing is amplifying it and intensifying it and reinforcing it. And i think that were living in a kind of orwellian age, because if youre a black woman on tv and you tweet that donald trump is surrounding himself with white supremacists, you got all kind of folk defending him, and the truth of the matter is White Supremacy is as White Supremacy does. And so i think thats where we are right now. [applause] and were in an age where, eye onically ironically enough, you know, i saw mel brooks the other day saying he couldnt make his films because of this Political Correctness that goes on now. Now, i love mel brooks, and i love his hes a straight genius. I love his films. You know, its true, its true, right in. [laughter] on blazing saddles. But heres the thing, and hes talking about the Political Correctness, because thats what people come at black people on and people of color, women, youre too sensitive, youre being politically correct. Then they asked him, are there some things you arent going to talk about . Oh, yeah. I aint going to talk about jews dying at the hand of nazis and children well, damn. Thats all we saying. Lets, lets not talk about that, lets not make fun of that, right . But in charlottesville there were neonazis talking about we will not be replaced by jews, but they had negroes in their scope too. How come we cant get the same recognition . Why is it that women in color, womens in general issues, women of color in particular, why our stuff got to be politically correct as opposed to off limits like you shouldnt be able to say that, like thats not something i should talk about . So even an ally like mel brooks, and youre going, like, you dont even get it. What it means to be black in this country is something deeply and profoundly troubling to so many people. I got a letter, for instance, the other day that was funny, it was addressed to me from al sharpton. Like, als my man. We text i dont know if he got to write me a letter, you know what im saying . [laughter] dont take a letter, maria, address it to my wife. Yall dont remember that. And i knew it wasnt al sharpton because it was a flowery envelope. I was like, this aint no al sharpton. It wasnt no, whats up, bra . I started laughing. I tell my assistant, this aint from al sharpton. And, of course, it was from somebody who was quoting me, dyson says that black people should be given reparations by white you know, just twisting my stuff out of term. It said bull crap i dont know if we can say it, i guess, on cspan. And then they start youre ridiculous, youre a nigger, and the best niggers a dead nigger. At this point im going, please call me dr. Nigger. [applause] worked hard for these credentials. I get a professor nigger up in here . Because that ph is real, right . [laughter] ph. D. Is real, right . I worked it harold. [laughter] so thats the kind of country were living in. And when you tell me im being sensitive and hypersensitive and students looking for safe spaces that theyre being hypersensitive, if youre white, the country is a safe space, right . Im talking about in general. We know there are exceptions. Im saying white folk aint scared to go to iowa. Not most of you. [laughter] idaho . I went to idaho one night, and a white man came up to me and said do you actually think you can say things like that and live . He wasnt even joking. I was like, hey, hey, i dont need to hear it but once, homey. [laughter] so thats the kind of country were living in. The left is tired of identity politics which means it adjoins them with the right. The lesson they learned from hillary and bernie was that there are no identity politics. Bernie said it too. Im saying, like, but youre a white man. Your identity is seen as dominant and, therefore, invisible and, therefore, implicit and, therefore, it doesnt have to be articulated as a specific racial formation in an ethnic enclave in american society. Because youre running stuff. And when you run stuff, your identity aint got to be announced, right . So when the bible says, slaves, obey your master, children, obey your father, women, obey your husband, if youre that same guy, youre the slavemaster, you are the husband and the father, you got it made. The bibles been written for you, the culture is supporting you. So it is, appears to me that when the left is tired of identity politics, thats really strange to me because in the same breath it goes, this is a referendum by the White Working Class. Get the contradiction . No identity politics, but youre celebrating the White Working Class. Because the black working class aint voted for trump, right . 54 of eligible white women did. 13 of black men did. So we have some really disaggregation of the data to do, and when i think about race not to overanswer it we in a tough position, and some of our allies have to be brought up to speed as to what it really means to be a person of color in america today. Great answer. Before we go, theres a person with a microphone, so if you have a question, raise your hand, and i want to mix this up. I dont want it to just be me talking to the professor here. But i want to talk about specifically about, specifically about the motivation for the book and sort of what was the process in arriving i know theres some intentionality around sermon. Right. You were a baptist minister for over 30 years, right . Uhhuh. So talk about sort of your process and how you arrived at the best, most courageous way to get your point across with the sermon. Yes, sir. Well, i know most people when they hear dont preach at me, i dont want no sermon. I get it, im a preacher, i know. And i dont like those kind of sermons either, when youre kind of thundering down and dog everybody and saying everybodys going to hell. I mean, i cant get with that. But this was more in the king tradition. Oh, yes, sir. Thats what i was about to say. Thank you for helping me to that point. [laughter] i was taking too long. [laughter] is so i dont like those kinds of sermons either, but i do like the kind of sermons where youre trying to orient the culture, the congregation, the crowd in such a way where youre saying this stuff were dealing with here is pretty serious, and it demands a kind of engagement with the social and moral fabric of the culture that has been stitched with the kind of inscribed by the kind of vitriol, the hatred, the ignorance, the disregard for issues of racial justice. And i knew we were living in a tough time and, look, to be honest, the book grew out of an oped that i wrote for the New York Times because i was, i had finished up my book on obama and race, i was writing another book. Im a rest rest writer, got to restless writer, got to get to the next project. Andalton sterling is killed alton sterling is killed in louisiana. Its on tape excuse me, im in an analog tradition, its digitally recorded. The man is accosted by two police, and hes on the ground. And they still shoot him. And then i think before that Philando Castile in minneapolis, you know . We know now from the dash cam video he tells the policeman, i have a gun, its a legal gun, its registered, i just want to let you know. Hes doing everything right. Seven seconds later, he gets shot. So i was, like, this is crazy. This is madness. This is lunatic stuff. So i wrote an oped basically from my heart to White America saying, youve got to stop this. So this book grows out of that. And unfortunately and tragically is evergreen, isnt it . Because black people who are unarmed are still dying at the hands of police. We saw a guy get off the other day, brother stockley . From a judge. We cant get justice with a jury, and we cant get justice with the judge. And the judge says, well, there was no you know, firstdegree murder, no intentionality. Let me see. A motherfuckers going to die tonight. I dont know about you or today, i think, thats intentionality. You aint got to be deconstructive practice or fuco in the insurrection of subjugated knowledge or ed man hirsh edwin hirsh to talk about authorial superiority or authority of the text. Its just like, dude the man in the car, before he stops the young man, says that an mf is going to die today. And when he gets out, he brings his personal ak47 and shoots the man. And so the judge says urban, when hes describing him, urban heroin dealer. Why . Wheres that . Whats that part of, right . So now the demonization, the stigmatization, the type of stereotypical representation of blackness meets a judge who just cant imagine holding this policeman accountable in the way that we would like to see done. Hands up, we get shot. Hands up, we get shot. Run, we get shot. Speak up, we get shot, dont speak up, we get shot. Its not what we do, its who we are. So i wanted to write a book to White America to say this wouldnt be acceptable if these were your kids. Like, number one. You wouldnt be going, well, thats the price of doing business, and statistically, its a small that aint what youre going to be saying, right . Because your child is your child. Aint no percentage in the world is going to remedy or redeem an unjust murder of your child, and it shouldnt. But we know that there are racial disparities. White folk on drugs, opioid addiction, lets help em. Black people, youre thugs, youre criminals, youre pathological, go to jail, right . And, look, across the board they sent out 350 people, half of whom white, half of whom black. I dont know how they divided that number up. Maybe i got the number wrong wrong. It was 300 and something. Same credentials trying to rent a house. White folk get the call back, black folk dont. Jobs, same thing. Same credentials, same excellent qualities. Shah anemic what dont get called back, sherry gets the call. So we look at the disproportionate concentration of black people in prison, i know a lot of white focus say, well, my god, if youre doing the crime, do the time. [laughter] hey, thats what most black people think too. Thats right. Except white kids aint doing the crime they aint doing the time, right . They end up victims of affluence. Affluenza . What the hell . How do i get that . [laughter] [applause] like damn, right. Where is the tylenol for that . I mean, thats literally an argument. White guy rapes a woman at stanford, hes out in four months. The judge does not want to ruin his life. Really though, but he ruined that young womans life, and you ruin black people and brown peoples lives and womens lives every day of the year. So i wanted to write a book to say to white people, i love you, i feel you, but we gotta stop. And youve got to be involved. And youve got to, youve got to sink this thing. Now, its tough for many white people to read because im not obama in the game, right . Im not, im not barack obama. And i love barack obama. This one style. Thats one style. It aint the only one, right . Yes, we can. [laughter] you know, you talk about his mama, hes just going to be nice to you. In public. Let me just say that. [laughter] yeah, he a brother now. He will break a person off privately. [laughter] so thats one style, but that aint the only style. And that anticipate good and the rest of us aint got bodyguards and living in Public Housing on 1600 pennsylvania avenue. It aint how we living. I think he did a Tremendous Service to the country but a disservice in terms of how he talked about race. He aint challenged white folk at all. Now, i know he gotta get elected. Then black people say, well, let him get reelected, then hell come out like gangbusters second term. Yeah, not really. Basically, thats who he is. So my point is i think that set up, right, my bible tells me if you put out a demon and you dont put nothing in the demons place, seven worse will come and occupy the house. Im not trying to say the president whos now president is a demon [laughter] im saying [laughter] right. Im simply saying that obama didnt necessarily challenge, right, White Authority and black people always in defense of him. I get it, because we aint got but one. Yall got now 44, and we only had half a president , right . 44 and a half than yalls half a brother than ours. We protecting that half brother all we can. [laughter] so black folks be like, mama, dont be talking about him now. Thats bay, i get that. Come on now. Some stuff he could have done he should have done, and some stuff he said to black people he should have never said in public, and let me tell you why. Because white people got the notion, hey, if obamas talking about how they need to not serve their children chicken in the morning now, i aint saying they should, but you act like those are the only people doing it. I understand gerunds and participles and so on, i understand that. You know, a lot of people doing that, and he went to morehouse colleging and said aint nobody trying to hear your excuses about racism, and you got to do what you got to do, and if you aint doing your work, nobody going to give you no slack. They graduated from college. This aint no detention center. [laughter] then he went to barnard. Womens school. Do you think he said, look, aint nobody trying to hear nothing about that sex schism and patriarchy, the male gaze . Were not trying to talk about all that stuff. He said, no, i feel for you. Now, i get it. When it aint your group, you can be more kind, kinder and gentler as bush would say than your own, but heres the thing, and ill be quiet. The thing is when youre jumping on your own, youve got to defend your own too. He aint defended us a lot. So i think thats set up. Im not blaming obama for trump. I am holding him accountable, however, for his failure to address race in a specific fashion, and donald trump said, oh, youre not going to talk about race . I got plenty for you. Ive got plenty of stuff to say. And he has misinterpreted and brought corrosive and cynical rhetoric to a place that obama had so much dignity and intelligence and really an incredible sophistication, and yet he didnt use his bully pulpit on that issue to the degree that he could have, and donald trump wastes no time in engaging in some of the most inflammatory racial rhetoric ever. Thats, i think, whats going on. Thats why i wrote the book, to try to get at those issues and to try to invite White Brothers and sisters to think about tough issues in a hard way with somebody whos black telling you the truth. Not the bullshit, not the candy coating, just the gentle yet firm insistence that common sense tells you stuff is messed up, and until we come together as a community of equal citizens, nothing is really going to be solved. Well, thats good stuff, thats good stuff. [applause] i know politics, so im going to since you went there, were going to go there, you know . So much of the times that were living in have been framed as a reaction to having the first black president. And so when you make your critique, one, you have a great deal of credibility. So i remember reading president obama saying that when Michael Eric Dyson speaks, everyone else is quiet. So i know he has a great deal of respect for you. As do i of him. Im aware of that. So ill ask you this. So were all aware of those moments where he maybe did not hit the note that you would like for him to say. So give me a key, give me your opinion of when he hit his best form as far as sure. Stepping up. I would say charleston, the funeral. Charleston was incredible. The 50th anniversary of selma, he was working it, man. He was doing an excellent job. [laughter] he were many were in mixed company. Yes, sir. [laughter] the hell, right . [laughter] thats, like, Martin Luther king jr. Was on the phone with robert kennedy, i mean, this is off the record, right . They were having one of them face to face, and dr. King was, now, im not going to tolerate that kind of you know, hes doing it, and kennedy was like, you know, look, lets be real. [laughter] he said, you know, that would go over he said if we hadnt helped you out, youd be dead as kelseys nuts. Dr. King, you could hear that silence. My god, what are kelseys nuts . [laughter] so were in mixed company, and i have to refrain from those inside language kiss courses. Discourses. Yeah, so the thing is he was great there, he was great, you know, at many of the last, i think, congressional black caucus, because he was also real bad. [laughter] oh, my god. The victory lap, he was pimping by then. You know, i dont know what you heard about me [laughter] okay, thats 50 cent, the rapper pimp is the name of the song. In obamas case, the president imbued with moral principles. So the thing is he was excellent on many of those issues when he talked about trayvon, could have been my son. And let me say the other side since if im asking him to be honest about the other side, ive got to be honest about the other side too as you brought up and you lovingly and gently but insistently criticized me for that. Youre right. The other side is, i mean, the man was getting hammered at every moment, right . Now again, black people say, well, you know if he speaks about race, hes going to get hammered. He got hammered just for existing. He got hammered for wearing a tan suit, right . Just everything, right . How he talked, how he walked down air force one. [laughter] you know, its like the nfl threw the flag. No celebration in football but you see how crazy it was, they brought it back. They brought it back, right . Let the brothers go. Let him celebrate. Let obama celebrate. If i was watching football, which i aint, you know what . Which i anticipate. Which i aint. [applause] you checking scores . Are you check the scores . Man, im trying to keep the score of justice, man . Whackass quarterbacks starting and playing, yall in baltimore, yall could have done the right thing, huh . [applause] yall could have done the right thing. And whats up with ray lewis . [inaudible conversations] i know youre bigger than me. Im scared. [laughter] but given im like, you . Mike vick . You . You done kill some dogs . That aint no equality between killing dogs, when i had my trouble you killed dogs homeboy did not kill anything but the reputation of an am news yak coacher that was addicted to forgetfulness and mad because all he doing is saying i dont want my people to be mistreated. Now, you got confederate flags out here that are permitted to fly. Those are secessionists, people. They hate your country. They were trying to leave it. We dont like you. Go away. Were taking our ball and going to our own country. But a guy who says i love this country enough to try to get it right is getting demonized. So, no, not keeping score in that sense at all. But keeping score in terms of what we do for justice. So i think that, what was i saying, when i look at what obama i mean, obama did some great stuff. Black people said, well, if he just talked about anything, if he just stood up and breathed, he was racially profiled president while black, right . Presiding while black. That was his sin, and that was his crime. And we know in part, you know, white folk dont want to face it, you know, and every time we say it there are always exceptions. Its amazing to me that people who tell black people not to make excuses, he making plenty of them. I dont mean all white folk, im talking about conservatives who are just like pull yourself up by your boot straps. You aint got no boot straps, you got Silver Lining guccis, you know . Not everybody, not all, but enough to make the point legitimate. So now, you know, we say pull yourself up by your bootstrap and so on and so forth, and the reality is that in this country when obama is doing what when he was doing what he was doing trying to make the arguments he was making, people hated him, and now we see that a lot of donald trump and the energy he receives derive from the fact that he didnt like the black man in charge. Now, you can come up with a lot of other excuses. Well, it was politics and it was ideology, and the White Working Class felt slighted, and we didnt trust hillary. Really . She wasnt trying to be your girlfriend, right . Oh, we dont know if hillary can be how about the dude you got now, can you trust him . Can you trust donald trump . Can you trust that guy . I mean, if obama had drank a black russian, theyd have put him out of office. Thank you for that, i appreciate that. Thank you, thank you. Im working hard up here. You better get with it. [laughter] i aint making Dave Chapelle money up in this beast. [laughter] dont make me go jackie mason on you. All right, so all right. So my point is that as a result of that, lets be honest about the real, tremendous tension of race that we have and the resentment of the black man in charge and what america did. Some americans got so mad at this black man running stuff that they were willing to do anything to erase his memory. And hillary clinton, im not saying she was perfect, but the sexism against her was astonishing. And not even spoken about as much as the rayism against obama racism against obama. But the sexism was remarkable. And even other women im not saying because youre a woman, youve got to like the other woman, im saying the stuff she came up with. Shes crying. Oh, my god, john boehner cries. What an exemplify case of masculinity. Hes so human. Hillary cried, theres no crying in baseball. Yall get that . League of our own. Get with me up in here. Jon lovitt and tom lanks, gina davis tom hanks, gina davis, madonna. Rosie odonnell. That hand orange look prevailing hillary clinton. That his reaction to obama. That is why we have what we have in this country today. [applause] more from our camera. Hello. I have been to many of your events but thank you for coming to baltimore. Here is morgan who said white folks should say the nword because you have a chapter about the nword, this is saying white girls cant say that just because kanye west did. Comment on that. If piers morgan were looking at me and i had an audience with him, here is the thing. Let me give you a small hint when white people can say it. Never dont care where you is, who your mama is, you cant do it, i am sorry. It is one of those privileges black people happen to have. I tell you what, if you are willing to trade the white world throughout europe and america with us i will let you say it for one day. You leave me all the dough in the world, all the accumulated capital of the white western world and for one day all right. In paris or in baltimore, here is the thing, chris rock was on oprah a few years back and said why are white men just feel like their lives cant be complete unless they can say that word . They run fortune 500 companies, head of everything, president and they get resentful, why can you say . Women can call themselves the b word and you cant. If you are a man, i have been a man hopefully all my life but i didnt make a change. Those who are, god bless you. I have been in the presence of women going did you see that . Yes, that is it. No no no no no. That is not even equivalent. As bad as bad where it is there something unique about the nword because it signified lynching, castration, murder, devastation, and white people, you are one of the white guys ejected from it. We did a driveby rhetorically, we snatched the word from you. We put the baby out the back seat with and took over the vehicles of language at that point to articulate a word to our liking. Some black people use it with affection, some black people use it with embrace, some with disregard. I talk about that in my book, but it is the privilege of black people to determine. That is not your right and your unconscious White Supremacy, your addiction to White Privilege, have blinded you to the fact that you are not a person, member of a group, who can say that. My own language is problematic. You cant see that we have a brilliant woman interpreting for us for those who cannot here. For us to stigmatize them by using their particular other ability as the basis for their deficiency is something i have to check myself on even with that metaphor. The fact his peers morgan cant even understand, wont even recognize his own privilege has in one sense prevented him from understanding the depth of the animosity associated with that term and the unmitigated gall, for you to act like you got permission to tell other white folks when they can use it, it is not your word, you cant determine when it is used and it has such lethal philosophy thrown at the vulnerable psyche of black people you need never again better that word from your mouth or the meds that white folks who are singing along with kanye cant sing it. He cant give permission. Dont let kanye get you hurt. You go to a rap concert thinking i can say it now. Harlem is still black but a lot of it is white. In dc, it has been gentrified. Go to the part that is still black and say that word. And if you live, you will, but if you get beat up, you might understand the material consequences of your rhetorical gesture. It is a great word for us, it is. You can do it in many ways. If you are happy i am happy. If you are surprised, if you are mad, you know what . If you want to congratulate, right . If you want to say that is for us and nobody else, so inflection, tone, voice, looks, suggestiveness, all of that, some black people, the naacp tried to bury the word. You cant bury the word. Three days later like jesus, came back, we thought we had burned you, i am with you always even to the end of the age, there you may be also. Sorry. Another question, we have another one up here too. Before we go too far, what i respect most about the book was the courage and you are careful to be prescriptive how we can move forward. I am reminded of the Young White Lady who walked up to brother malcolm and says what can i do to help the movement . He said nothing. As much as i respect brother malcolm we missed the point. Will you talk for a second about what you think people of color, black, brown people can work together, what are the organizations, the allegiance we can make to move forward . That is important. A great point and thank you for reminding me. A lot of white people rivet me about this, thanking me for that part but not going to rain on the parade but these are things that can be done but people say we dont want this analysis, we want to get analysis right, you go dear doctor i dont want analysis, just a prescription. What is wrong with you, you have cooties or do you have a cold . Or do you have cancer . Do you have diabetes . You have got to get the analysis and then the prescription, try to get the analysis first and give a prognosis and a prescription. At the end, i tried to say this White Brothers and sisters do like individual reparations, our sharpton, the house sharpton erosion. Why are you writing me letters like that, calling out my name like that. One thing i did say was look, i reparations is a morally defensible position. It is not going to happen. Many americans cant see it. What you think is going to happen with reparations . It doesnt mean it is not right. Kaepernick doesnt have a job. He deserves one but doesnt have one. So my thing is just because we cant get a political prescription, individual right brothers what i call individual preparation of accounts. Basically like helping out where you see help, i have been written by white people who said i read that chapter, he is right, i took 20 computers in our office that were not being used, we fixed them up and took them to local schools and their eyes lit up. I talk about things like that, individual things white people can do. What is gratifying to me is people get arrested on behalf of us. I like that. Thank you very much. You know what i am saying . Keep getting arrested, let us the elvis for a minute. But a hound dog, which means appropriate culture, that is all right. The thing is to see these white folks showing up and speaking out, god rest her soul, they are dying, in 1965 from detroit housewife, going down to selma, white people put their bodies on the front line, speaking up to the antifa movement, they are not committed to doctor kings nonviolent so it a different kind of thing. I think it is gratifying to see White Brothers and sisters speaking up. Even john mccain saying no. That is big. Is saving obamacare. What is interesting, just trying to work with what i got, the thing is when white folks do Something Like this, they cant get educated. Can i tell you something . For a lot of people writing to me about how dumb lack people are and then you are still stupid. Okay. Oj says i am not black, i am oj. I am dumb . Okay. You dont understand, i have big words, i am stupid, you are such an educated person, misleading all black people, sending me these notes about what i should do to clean up the black race because they are so derelict and the like, then hearing the blasphemous assault upon humanity of vulnerable black people. But the thing is i am thanks to White Brothers and sisters, can you read . It is not hard. The heisenberg uncertainty principle, can you read some race stuff . Web du bois . Can you read some black people, james baldwin, you know, can you read some feminist theory, black feminist theory, Patricia Hill collins, more recently the younger generation, jasmine griffin, or Britney Cooper has a new book called out eloquent rage. You read from your man from baltimore. You got to read. A lot of white folks feel they can spout out about stuff they dont know about. Let me tell you about that. Then they mess up. 6 my habeas corpus too. That is the wrong field. Look, how do you go see your doctor and all those terms and you are ignorant and dont know what youre talking about but come up to a black person on race, you havent thought about race, you see it from a warped perspective, trying to tell me how dare you criticize the confederates . It is not about hate, it is about heritage. You are right, your heritage is hate. I am sorry. Am i supposed to pretend that robert e lee was a hero . What was he doing there in the first place up there with jesus and them . If that is the case you should put mohammed ali up there. At least Martin Luther king jr. The greatest american ever in my book. I make distinctions. There is a difference between Thomas Jefferson and robert e lee. Thomas jefferson owned slaves, why would you say he had a child with Sally Hemmings . Dont know if you know this or not, most white men were having sex with black women against their will. She was 14. After you get mad at him you get mad at Thomas Jefferson. I know that is tough, i know that is tough, but i am just saying for real. Why is it we cant take serious criticism, a lot of white folks havent informed yourselves enough. A white guy wrote a book about when white folks get hooked up, no complaints then. The g. I. Bill enjoyed by white folks, created middleclass, gave you a seat in school, extra points on the test, and a job. That is the holy trinity. If we can get that, the average a lot of white people go i am not rich. When you talk about White Privilege let me tell you the greatest White Privilege area, one of them. You are walking down the street, run up on a cop, having interaction, you are not dead. You wont have a bunch of money, just the right color in the right place at the right time. Not saying white folks dont get assaulted by police. Im talking about the disproportionate number of people of color, black and brown in particular including many women who are victimized by White Supremacy. I just think what i do and that book was say read, study, have a black friend or two blues not just one, dont let ben carson be your only black friend. I am sorry. He can be one of them. If he ever opens his eyes to see you and he will, he is a great man. Ben carson, the man. Gifted hands, the man. This right here, i dont know. I dont know about that. Dont let ben carson or Clarence Thomas the only black friends. Even Antonin Scalia said that is too tough right there on black people. Your boy clarence, not hard enough. Some black folks you know what the black leader told me . Wont tell you his name. 25 years ago he said negroes going to wake up and discover they have more in common with white folks than they care to admit. What is the . They cant stand negroes. The internalized some women cant stand the women, hate on other women. The crumbs off the masculine table. Black folks, i am not black, i am oj. Hows that working for you . Here is a simple rule, lets be honest. If you get away with murder, go somewhere and sit down. Be humble, sit down, be humble, sit down. I am not saying oj got away with murder. I am saying i am not saying oj was innocent. I am just saying he wasnt guilty. That is different. There is no proof, no evidence. Lets be real, oj was like mountains of evidence, nothing. Oj, they could have had a film on oj, they said he was making the sign of the cross, made up himself. That is hard to hear, you dont want to hear is that. Wait a minute. This is not the first person to get away with murder. Byron what, 90 . He was out there bragging. Those men that killed, the woman just confessed, held her for ten years, tough. Then for ten years carolyn says he made that up. Even if he had done everything he said he did, shouldnt have died. My point, when we about these issues we ask White Brothers and sisters to think critically, so critically about race, learn something, have more than one black friend, talk to a lot of black people and white people who are enlightened, tell of white people black lives matter, please. Jiminy cricket, please. Give the drummer some. Remember james brown . Doesnt mean the bases dont need love but the saxophone they are playing, we heard them. The drummer has not been programmed. That doesnt mean you hate the band or you hate the piano player. The drummer hasnt got enough love. When you say black lives matter, white lives matter, already evident. Everything is geared toward and made for the dominant white culture. Black lives matter, give the drummer some. Can black folks be recognized for the human beings we are and the human beings we should be recognized as . Like saying if you are in the nfl, womens lives matter, someone says no but Football Players lives matter too. We get that. That is why rapists and murderers are playing but a guy protesting the flag cant. People charged with murder can play. Saying no names. Redemption but a man who bows his knee cant find redemption. I am just saying in this culture, you can do a lot of stuff. Childrens lives matter, adults matter too. We get that. That is why child labor laws had to be invented, they were working children like enslaved people. White brothers and sisters, when we say black lives matter we still love you. Can i tell you a secret i dont want anyone to say in public, very few people in this country love white folks more than black people. Sometimes it is a shame. We like white folks more than ourselves. What are we going to do . It is not my crib that is on fire, burn. Immigration we go how do we put the water on it, the radical person, burnett down. My point is this tense time, let us accentuate, highlight and underscore and when it comes to, i never been to know black church. The only funny money they dont want to change, they turn around and use the same bible that was used against you against gay people. In the bible it says, it says of a your master, ham was cursed. People tried to recruit me to religion but you say i am inferior. Then a revelation, now can get in. Ham was cursed, pork is cursed, what does that have to do with religion . Now you are demonizing ham and saying god is trying to justify that. Are you crazy . Now we turn around and use the same biblical theological approach against gay people, the same that was used against women. Women cant stand on the pulpit. Because you are a woman . If it wasnt for women you would not know about anything. People around the cross for women, women will stick with you, they will stay with you. Men, i will check you later. Dont know about jesus or that. I dont know jesus. Jesus used to live in the hood but he moved. My point is without the women we wouldnt know about jesus. You cant preach, god can save if you do not cry out, the rocks will cry out. What kind of failure of god to you anticipating your own reality. That is the kind of stuff that is important that i talk about in the book. One last question. That was only one question. My god. What in the hell . Next time i will call in a sermon. Good evening, everybody, Michael Eric Dyson, how are you . Where are you . There you are. I wish you would say you can. Lord have mercy. I cant see you, come on. Im sitting down. You are chocolate dynamite. Go ahead. I like. I am trying to get you love. It is not exactly a question. On the subject of the nword. I had conversations from my own observation and having conversations with persons who are not part of the colored community and i want to since we are in this place and having this discussion talking about your book, this is the feedback i have gotten from the nonblack community. It is a validated question. How do we expect other communities to understand us and let us move forward when they watch, not necessarily what is in the media but they observe for themselves how we treat ourselves, the names we call ourselves, it has roots of negativity. You said it is how you say it, your friends and all this other stuff, you throw it around like a ball, no concept of the true meaning of the word. How do we expect another community to understand us when we are sending the wrong message . I dont use the b word or the nword whether it is funny, humorous, with my Close Friends or whatever because my ancestors had a very nasty negative word. How are we supposed to move forward if we dont move forward with ourselves. Very negative word. You got it too. You are giving me that look, dont play with me, you know what . I am not playing. You are right. Let me say this. There is a distinction between n nigger and nigga. You made some powerful points but i dont penalize white people. Lets take a legitimate terms on merit. To do it because you think you are helping white people, the moment they call you someone that they have better balls. The moment they see you treat each other with respect wont deny your children access to higher education. As long as you dont say you are a nigger your child wont be kicked out of school early. Are you telling me the absence of the word nigbor would restore racial justice, bring us serious equality with white folks . If it would, i would say never say that again. It is not a magic wand. I am not denying but to come into your point i am not denying it is very complicated. When i said white people should be educated i spoke, i had to testify in pennsylvania. A young white boy was listening to rap music, said the nword, blamed it on rap music and they were trying to outlaw rap. If they had done that, my god. Big bill would have never come up. What would we have missed . Asserting his own particular breed. I said this is interesting to me. The predicate of the litmus test is this white kid, dont know the difference, i get that. You werent born when Thomas Jefferson was born. You dont know what in alienable rights are. You dont know, you got to study, got to think. I dont encourage white folks to be infantile about knowledge. You need to study and understand, they dont understand. That is a word you cant use, end of story. We could write 400 pages, we can die, swing from trees, the association of that word by white people is indeed problematic. There is no history of laws being created, black people to lynch other black people, the first thing many white people use, 93 of black people, 84 of white people care about white people, no discourse on white on white crime. This is what Rudy Giuliani told me, meet the press. And telling me about that, that is a minuscule much bigger, black people killing each other. Check this out. How many white people kill each other . A bunch. How many white people die from terrorism . 100 since 9 11. Giuliani at litmus test, 100 died. Billy bob, not mohammed killing the culture. And nothing like that, the truth telling folks about chicago, it is horrible and tragic. The answer is not gun manufacturers, the answer is we are addicted to guns, we think the second commandment, not the second amendment, we give religious fervor to it, worship the guns to our own peril. All i am telling you if i wont penalize white folks like they cant understand the word nigbor is not for them and black folks, i agree with you some black people hate it and will never say it, some black people will always see that. First time i heard the word it was not from the rap song but a pastor talking about his church. You can say you hate that but let me close and tell you another story. He was in memphis, 1968. His lieutenant had gone to try to fight an injunction against their march. They didnt have twitter back then and no cell phones. So he is gone all day. He is gone all day. Black people a form of the verb to be, we cut out the middleman, got right to the point. He can. He is gone. All day. And then, and then he gets to the hotel, motel. He was at the hyatt regency. Black motel is good enough for you . So he changes to the lorraine motel. You know where i am going . Martin luther king jr. Grabs a pillow and says where have you been . And continues all i am telling you, he didnt make it in the i have a dream speech, he did not do that and i understand but he did use the term as a term of endearment and love and hit him on the head and said it. Martin luther king jr. If he didnt love black people, if you tell me it prevented him from understanding the depth of our problem, if you tell me it prevented him from giving his life for black people, you like him or not you as an individual. I understand your point but white folks, not dumb, black folks, complicated and make messy mistakes, this word is a part of our heritage whether we want to or not so we got to figure out a way to deal with this, grab hold of it, in complex cultural fashion where people dont know so you have japanese people talking about you, slow down with that. In japan they dont know. I get your point, i am trying to reinforce your point. History and content are critical in British Culture where piers morgan tried to use that term, that is not something we can get away with even if we debate among ourselves whether it is legitimate or healthy or not. This has been a powerful evening, lets have a round of applause. [applause] turns your neighbor and say have a good evening. We will wrap up this way, in baltimore, maryland, one of the formative nurturing browns, i will ask you to give your most profound lee rick. Somebody wake me, i am dreaming, swimming upstream planted in the womb while screaming, on the top with my pop, my mama hollering stop from the single drop, this is what they got, not to disrespect my people but my papa was a loser, only playing he had for mama was used. Even as a seat i could see his plan for me stranded on welfare, another broken family. All right. Any closing words . Lets give it up for brother gamble. [applause] i am huffing and puffing. I want to thank the baltimore book festival, thank our interpreter. Her shoes are crazy. The ankle tied up in there. Just fine with the feet. Not just with the hands but i want to thank you for coming out, engaging and listening. Can we take up a position . If you sold the book i will plant it for you. Enjoy the rest of the festival. [inaudible conversations] booktv has covered many books about Race Relations in the us including ones by National Book Award Winners as well as msnbcs chris hayes. If this is a topic that interests you, go to our website at booktv. Org and in the search by typing racerelationsbook and you can find an archive offers and materials. These are available to watch online. Coverage of last weeks baltimore book festival, laura jacobs offers her thoughts on misconceptions about transgender and nonconforming people. Backup here again, much louder this time, the baltimore book festival, welcome to the radical book fair pavilion. This is an event we have been organizing for close to ten years and every year we bring the best to