The jewish right to be a tenenbaum from a lot of different days who is the director of the Washington Office at pepperdine as well as a number of pepperdine in. We are excited to have you here tonight. Also delighted to have ejb here tonight. Some of you might know in the far back we had to shut down registration, have a full house. If he wanted to have friends here who wanted to come and couldnt, well be recording tonight and posting the video to our side and www. Tts. Org or you can add your comment as well as check out based the page and twitter feed for video photographs and comments as well. For those of you who are familiar with the Trinity Forum we were to provide space and resources for the discussion of lifes greatest questions in the context of faith. We do this by providing ratings and publications which draw upon the classic works of literature and letters to connect the timeless wisdom with 10 issues of the day appeared as well as programs such as the one tonight to connect leading thinkers which a few meters in engaging the they questions of life and ultimately coming to better know the author of the answers. We also hold socratic forms around the world including annual forum at roadhouse for roads and scholars to equip leaders to grapple with questions, to live and lead more wisely and connect the timeless truth with those issues that confront us. This year which marks the 100th anniversary of one of the most pivotal moments in history world war i or the great war as it was called at the time of extraordinary upheaval and uncertainty was permanently altered the political and Cultural Landscape of the west. Over the course of the next few years after the start of the great war the sense of optimism and growing space in progress and technology they characterized with him to be prepaid and lost. At the end of the great war over 16 million dead worldwide. Over 10 million soldiers and 6 million civilians. Of course the members of the wounded were far greater. Advances in science and technology that offers so much promise for a healthier come about here better life for so many more have been instead use to kill more efficiently and destroyed more completely. The extent of the carnage in the slaughter prompted a widespread and bitter questioning of traditional already in belief including faith in the notion of divine goodness or justice. A century later, we face new and certainty new threat to new tragedies come up with the koppel many similar questions. Is there a good god who can be it . How do we understand and resist extraordinary evils of our age and admits disillusionment from the cynicism, fear and despair how do we discern the good, understand our times and work to redeem them. Our speaker tonight will grapple with such weighty question through offering a case study of the life, work and friendship of two extraordinary j. R. R. Tolkien ck lewis. Both survived the trenches and use the hearings of the conflict to ignite their imagination and issue a permit of good and the beautiful. Out of utter desolation, tolkien and lewis breathed new life and vigor into a literary tradition that affirmed the concepts of heroism, sacrifice friendship and divine grace. It is a remarkable and gripping story and hard to imagine someone who can have that more eloquently enthusiastically or energetically. Chosen associate professor in new york city where she teaches western civilization have been previously served as a distinguished visiting professor at the Pepperdine School for Public Policy. Also a senior fellow at the ethics and Public Policy center as well as the Heritage Foundation where he served and last but certainly not least served as a distinguished senior fellow for the Trinity Forum. Its written for the new york times, washington journal, new republic Weekly Standard in npr is so thick you International Credit for hes a regular contributor to the londonbased magazine standpoint as well as italys left on by. Finally, books now includes searchers, the quest for faith in the valley of out light tone part luck and liberty as well as the cheerful end of the lucian religious leaders confront hitlers storm. Finally, the book with us to come talk about tonight trained to a hobbit, a wardrobe and a great war. Joe, welcome. [applause] before i start offering thank you, i should agree with the people. I am here to announce my campaign for president of the United States of america. [laughter] [applause] theres room for one more. Come on. I could do as good as you come up in all. I have a campaign slogan. I was last in naples and i find myself in the midst of an italian Election Campaign and a farcical candidate, the picture in slogan plastered all over naples. I will do nothing but i will do it very well. [laughter] that is my winning slogan. But thank you so much. Theres an Organization Im prouder to be a part of the Trinity Forum. No other organization like it with the cultural renewal work they are doing so vital. Many qualities. Loyalty and generosity. Thank you or the amazing event. Pete peterson getting to know in lovely malibu and whether pete is campaigning for high office in california are serving as interim dean at pepperdine, hes a man with a child. Thank you for being here. I want to thank all of you for coming. Im astonished by the turnout. Thank you so much for coming. Its a testimony to the enduring attraction of tolkien and lewis. The journey of the family has taken to cater to the National Press club with a mom my dad and grandparents who had to endure the catastrophe of the First World War by my maternal grandfather who left italy in 1921 when he was 17 years old one year before mussolini and the fascist left into power. And my paternal grandfather was living in the United States when war broke out in the italian army wanted to draft them. Americans have located this option. Fight for us and will make you a u. S. Citizen. Not a hard choice. Because to the western brow, serves the floors. Ninetyfirst edition charlie company. He mustve seen a good deal of it but his 91st as part of the final assault that really brought the germans to their needs. I wonder what they would be thinking if they were here right now what might they say . I think they would Say Something like this. Joey, what are you doing here . Catastrophe mama mia. Lets get into it. The last soldier to die in the great war was the american Henry Guenther private with the Expeditionary Force killed in 10 59 a. M. November 11 19181 minute before the armistice went into effect. 23 years old. Gunther had encountered a roadblock of german machine guns near the village and against the orders of his sergeant to charge the guns with bayonets. German soldiers aware try to wave them off the guenther kept coming. He was gunned down and died instantly. Divisional record they almost as if the gunfire died away and appalling science prevailed. Despite the parties and parades marking the end of the First World War, a brutal and appalling science fell over much of the world. Was the stillness of soul ambushed and bewildered by the carnage of the mouse to start a for the world had ever seen. Paul johnson is called the conflict the primal charge to a modern world civilization. The main reason the 20th century turn into a disaster suffix for men time. Winston churchill described it this way. Injuries were brought to the structure of Human Society which is century will not face and conceivably prove fatal to the present civilization. They called it the war to make the world safe for democracy. The war to end all wars and assuring the kingdom in heaven. Instead grape were laid waste to destroy the hopes of massive generation before before it was all over come in nearly every family was grieving the loss of a Family Member or helping others to pray for caring for he wanted soldiers struggling to adjust civilian life. The First World War permanently damage the mental outlook of european society. It ushered in a season of cynicism and agnosticism toward the values and ideals of the web for a generation of men and women are had brought the infant in a sense and faith. And yet are two extraordinary authors and friends j. R. R. Tolkien and cs lewis the great word deepened their spiritual crust. Both were thrown into the slaughter of the western front and experienced the richest literary imagination. One of the most influential books. The series of childrens books could be argued could be argued tales of love and sorrows and triumphs of lord would never have been written had the authors not been flowing into the furnace. Listen to with churchill. Not all someone by slaughter and maneuver. The greater the general public or he contributes to maneuver and lessen the demand of slaughter. The general. The generals of the word demanded much of slaughter by the time the armistice with 10 million soldiers to commit millions more wounded on average about 6046 men killed every day of the war. Every day of the war that left 1566 days. Tolkien and lewis might have been above that number. They spent many days and nights under fire on the western front. He thought at one of the fiercest concentrations of killing in the history of human conflict. What has indeed come under the shadow of four to feel the full oppression. By 1914 was no less hideous experience in 1939. All but one of our Close Friends were dead. It was sent immediately to the the front arriving on his 19th birthday. And a 19yearold out of curiosity . Experience six of trench warfare, a vortex of suffering in death remained throughout his life. Memories of the last war haunted my dreams for years. Lewis lost most of his friends in the conflict. Tolkien and lewis both arrived at Oxford University or they take its locations in me for the first time in 1826 when a bond of friendship is established that will transform their lives and careers. Token plays a crucial role in the conversion from atheism to christianity while lewis persuades token to persuade his story about how the entrance of lord of the rings. Given the massive and lots of their works it is hard to think of a more consequential friendship in the 20th century. Try to appreciate how out of step these authors were with their times. Both men right at the tail. The mythic worlds torn apart by struggle between good and evil. The backdrop of a global conflict by a crucible for moral and spiritual growth. These are not the kinds of stories people write in the postwar years. Many veterans propose fiercely antiwar novels, poetry, large cohort of educated men and women become moral cynics. They sneer at the idea of heroism or virtue in the years after conflict the cruelty senselessness of war for any and become the dominant motifs of a generation. Think of the works of robert grays memoirs of an infantry officer, Ernest Hemingway t. S. Eliot all of the western front. The watchword is disillusionment. A fierce cynicism about liberal democracy, christianity and achievements of western civilization. The show shop veterans wandering europe in the postwar years, becomes a walking metaphor for most or much of postwar europe. The main character who expects to return to civilian life weary, broken, burnt out, ruthless and without hope. The mood is acute among the writers, artists, public intellectuals that affects middleclass europeans as well. Listen to a story in his book the twilight years. Dismay with the mainstream comes turn for the generation living after the end of the First World War the prospect of ending a crisis new dark age became a habitual way of looking at the world. Although his catholic faith remains intact, j. R. R. Tolkien remains the collapse of all my world that began with his deployment to the western front. Well, trench fever takes tolkien out of the war. July 16, 19 night teeth moves back with his infant son john. As early academic success can not use the heartache of war the experience of the time of sorrow and mental suffering loss of so many friends to the war is lifelong sadness. Cs lewis went into the war as an atheist and became an atheist. He wrote a warp home with these lines for all her hopes, do good instead. That is cursed god. That is loose in the 17 of 1918. Lewis was sent to a hospital bed in bristol where he writes i could attend outcry over the whole business. All my friends in the battalion are gone. He returns january 19192 recent studies a few years later records in his diary a conversation with a fellow soldier who has love was a war veteran. Kind of a shellshocked war veteran. Heres what he wrote. I dont know how but we talked about that and the other horrors hanging over one. If you couldnt endure the world for an hour i left and walked home. While many postwar thinkers and writers are unwilling to endure the world in its current form and a spiritual vertigo takes hold, a frantic search for solutions to the human predicament. For it is psychology spiritualism socialism, other ideologies attempted to solve or explain away the horrors that seemed to be hanging over the human race. These ideas are getting around in europe and the United States. The profound sense of spiritual crisis is the hallmark of the decade. It affected laborers, large landowners, industrial factory workers shop clerks, urban intellectuals. Having said all that the facts make literary aims all the more remarkable because they reject the moral agnosticism and ambivalence that in fact be out at a bare area. Critics accuse the men of nostalgia and medieval escapism. These authors wrap their tail and fantasy and myth in order to convey hard truths about the human condition. Its darkness and futility as well as virtues and ability. Nsa whole pitted against the universe have we seen him at all until he sees like a hero in a fairytale. Tolkien and lewis are attracted to mcenroe meant not because they escape the world better than the real world as they mythic and her of quality. The setting for great conflicts and class. As well as deep compassion and tolerance sacrifice. Frustrated when packed their vision a bit. First lets start of impact this level of water. Tolkien and lewis are utterly realistic. The corrupting influence of power, desire for power to dominate others often disguised by appeals to religion or morals is a recurring theme in their works. Virtually no character in their stories is immune to the temptation. Officially a soldier in the fight for narnia turns traitor when asked one fails to come to their aid when that call in. Mix the opponents of josh and his comrades and must the help of the wave which. You may drop out of the reckoning he says. We want power to move on to on our site. We learned the wizard originally committed has fallen under the sway of the ring of power. Prudence he argues demands a compromise. We combine our time and keep our thoughts and our hearts. He was stunned by the way of proving the high ultimate purpose. Sounds Like Washington d. C. , doesnt it . Despite an ipo none of the nations resisted using the most terrific weapon available against the enemy. Mortars machine guns tanks frame throwers, starvation. When it was all over torture and cannibalism were the only two expedients symbolized scientific christians dates have been able to deny themselves in these very doubtful utility. I wish i could write that god. Communism, fascism, not via some companies are revolutions and ideologies in the exhaustion of the democracies of europe all in the name of the dancing the human race ill begin by promising liberation and all became instruments of totalitarian control. Tolkien and lewis are aware and react against them in their writing. No illusions about the corrosive influence of unchecked power. Tolkien and lewis uncovered hair with them and age of moral cynicism. Heroism and nature of moral cynicism. The heroism is not defined by a single act of bravery. Here is the project of a well formed character. Think about it. Figure emerges because of a series of choices that other people ahead of his or her own desires. The industrialized slaughter of the war had damaged the very idea of choice of moral agency of free will. After all millions of men flung into the heart of the conflict by brock said of their humanity. They were mutilated, aunts, they admitted, gas incinerated, obliterated without mercy the utter helplessness is a recurring theme of postwar literature in the spirit of fatalism begins to extend society at large. Both times from the 1920s and 1930s. 1920 and of the world. 1921 social decay degeneration. 1923 decay of capitalist decentralization. 1927 spenglers decline of the west. Also in 27 will civilization crash. 1920 eight the day after that tomorrow. 1931 the problem of decadence in 1933 that being said that. How about that for a book club title. Bring your own black child, friend. Enough about me. Tolkien and lewis reject the mental outlook fatalism and insist every person is caught up in a great moral contest and choices in the contest matter and they matter supremely. Member the scene of the chronicles of narnia when shasta held by the talking horses race across two more narnia bedtime destruction and before reaching their goal they are attacked by a lion. Moments from being cut down by the beast that shasta has a choice to make. Stop fellow shasta must go back, must help you shasta at the speed of the stirrups with his legs over the last that, hesitated for one hideous hundredth of a second and john. It hurt horribly and went in. Before he knew he was staggering back to help. Seems like this wouldve been familiar to many combatants in the great war and the image of the soldier throwing themselves into harms way to rescue the fallen comrade. Think of the scene in lord of the rings when they got there before her and she fixes her eyes on each of them and delivers the warning and the request ends up on the edge of the knife from a stray little in a field to the ruin of all. What did they do . Each of them is faced with the appalling clarity of the choice laid before them to continue with the quest into certain danger in deprivation or take the safe and easy way to turn back. Listen to tolkien. They reinvent this quest for the modern mind. In an era that exalted cynicism and irony they seek to reclaim this older tradition of the epic hero. The epic hero. Why . Why . Why do these two authors ignore the most powerful trends in their culture embark on this . Welcome part of the answer i think, allies and the battlefields of france. It was a better as young soldiers that encountered these virtues in the officers and privates and the medics at the western front. It was there that the inspiration for his most beloved and mythic character occurred. Where did he get his ideas for the hobbit in the first place . After he became a professor at oxford, saving and grading student papers, any teachers in the audience . How many of you like a grading teachers . 90 very much, thank you. Is just beside himself with his papers. He finds a blank sheet of paper. And he scrawls these worked on the blank sheet of paper and hole in the ground. And help in the ground lived a hobbit. It is wrote those words. Didnt know why he wrote them. Later on reflecting he says eventually i thought i better find out what hobbits were like. We now know what hobbits are like it, dont we. From trenches own account of the character is a reflection of the ordinary soldier steadfast in his duties while suffering into jury hole in the ground of the frontline trench. Many other members of the British Expedition force were citizen soldiers and even during the most intensive campaigns along the western front the british army showed a remarkable resilience according to one historian relative to other armies. They didnt break and run. They didnt suffer breakdown in morality or mutiny. A change in character that comes over in the lord of the rings is not unlike that transformation that tolkien must avoid is on his fellow soldiers in battle. Listen to tolkien. Even as hope died in sampler seem to die it was turned to a new strength. Sams plain hobbit face grew stern almost grim as it will hardened any. As if he was turning into some creature of stone and steel that neither despair nor weariness nor endless barren miles could subdue. One of the most beloved ibook figures in modern literature is based on tolkiens firsthand knowledge of the virtues of the men in the trenches in the great war. Listen to tolkien on this. I had only been oppressed that we are here surviving because of the indomitable courage of quite small people against impossible odds. My sam he says is in deep reflection of the english soldier, private that a new in 1914 war and recognized as so far superior to myself. The same could be said in an of characters in loose stores for children. Its often the humblest or smallest. As soldiers, tolkien and lewis lived among these small people, witness their courage under fire, joked with them, more with them and watched them die because that is the most destructive war, the world has ever seen they cannot, this is worth emphasizing, they cannot glorify its violence or its anguish, but neither can accept the fatalism and pessimism that has become so prevalent. Wilford and owens raging anthem against war you it cant be the final word, not for them. We have this concept of heroism reinvigorated and reinterpreted for the bottom line. Friendship in a common struggle against evil to the heroic quest is not a solitary endeavor. Historian Stephen Ambrose reminded us of his truth with this book band of brothers. Band of brothers, a story of the minute the company, 101st airborne in the Second World War. Listen to Stephen Ambrose. With an easy company to make the best friends they ever had or would ever have. This type of experience of combat was as relevant for the soldiers who went off to fight in 1914 as it was for the in 19391941. Our tolkien and lewis their personal knowledge of the fellowship of men under fire it must rank as one of the defining experience for their literary lives. Lewis versus dodge friendship like these with his brother also a soldier in the british Expeditionary Force who he called his dearest and closest friend who understood the anxieties of combat. And a guy named lawrence johnson. Lawrence johnson performed alongside loose on the western front and shared his love for literature and for philosophy of reflecting lewis declared this guy johnson quote he wouldve been a lifelong friend if he had not been contiguous moving toward season and went endless arguments on that and every other topic whenever we were out on the line. You get the picture . Theyre arguing theology, these guys. The theme of friendship pulses through each of the stories. Its like a force of nature. It might even be said that friendship replaces romance as agreement expression of love in lewis story. It flourish is between the children and the nobles and all who serve and love and obedience. This is a loose drink experience of war to explain what distinguished the love him on friends from all other earthly loves . He said this, you will not find the warrior apollo, gloss over or the christian by staring into his eyes as if they were his mistress but as to fight beside him, read with him, argue them, pray with them. Its the same for tolkien was devoted to his inner circle of friends as at the king of Edward School in birmingham. In 1960 to help the own more meeting in london, the council of london. At that meeting they shared their deepest hopes and dreams for the future tolkien reflected a letter saying this is what a sense of vocation was quick and with those men in that room on that day. Is it a coincidence, ladies and gentlemen, that the concept of friendship amid the suffering of war is one of the great things of the lord of the rings . Its called the fellowship of the ring. The fellowship of the ring. Before setting out into the old forced to become to leave on his own. You want to expose his companions to the perils that lie ahead and get married and have been in sampler wise to his plans and the confronted before he can slip away. Thinks his country with them. He protests but it doesnt seem like i can trust you and. Mary is unflappable. It all depends on what you want to you can trust us to stick to you to the bitter end and you can trust us to keep a secret of yours closer than you keep yourself but you cannot trust us to let you faced trouble alone and to go off without a word where your friends. Well get you about the ring. We are horribly afraid but we are coming with you. We are following you like hounds. Theres a question force. Do we have a few friends following us like hounds . Well, a bond of friendship between sam gamgee and frodo as one of the moral triumphs of the work. Member when there is a threshold never end of the quest, they are weak from the first and exhaustion, nearly overwhelmed by the desolation of the landscape, the lack of another living thing. The black skies, noxious fumes the pashtun that burned stone and the smell of death. It is a scene not unlike what tolkien experienced at the battle of his own to a staggered, frodo weekend began to crawl on his hands. Sam looked at him and wept in his heart but no tears came to his drive and stinging eyes. I said i would carry him if it broke my back, and i will. No, decried. I cant carry it for you but i can carry you in it as well. Of uk. No on. Sam looked to be a right. Just tell them where to go and he will go. I suspect, ladies and gentlemen, that only individuals who knew friendship of this kind to experienced it in the field of combat would write passages of such great and encourage and nobility. After the war tolkien and lewis sought to recapture some point intends comradeship assisting him during the crisis years of 19141918. At oxford they launched the inklings, those who gavel in ink. A group of friends and fellow scholars who meet weekly to read and to discuss their work to the point or two or three. Tolkien helps lewis find a publisher for his first sciencefiction novel by connecting 30. Most importantly it was tolkiens conversation with a loose on the night of september 19 1931 they talked into qam about the nature of myths and devout christian to as a true myth. It was at this conversation that lewis himself described as the immediate human caused by this conversion into christina. For his part of those becomes to tolkien his great advocate for pursuing his hobbit tree. As tolkien describe it loses a gift was his sheer encouragement over many years to keep on. Listen to tolkien. For long my only obvious long my only obvious to all of him dedicate it to myself to be more than a private hobby but force interest in unceasing eagerness for more i should never have brought the lord of the rings to a conclusion. Well, when lewis learns part of the rings is accepted for publication he writes a letter to tolkien describing his sheer pleasure of looking forward to having the book to read and reread. And then he revealed the importance of the book with these lines. So much of your whole life, so much of our joint life so much of the war so much that seem to be slipping away into the past is now in a sort make permanent. Do you catch what he is saying . In this trilogy tolkien smo captured something of the essence of their life to get in a mistress we. Here is a clinch of what friendship can look like when it reaches for a high purpose and is watered by the stream the sacrifice and loyalty and love. All of this is part of the achievement i think accomplished something else. We cannot overstate how profoundly subversive, subversive and countercultural the works of tolkien and lewis were in their own day and remained so in our own. The soldier of the First World War lived through endless days of mud, stench, slaughter and death. Nothing like it had a record and history of the world. It shook the very foundations of civilized life. Listen to torture all the horrors of all the pages were brought together and not only armies, but whole populations were thrust into the mix of their t. S. Eliots on the postwar world as a wasteland of human awareness. I think were in that alley where the dead men lost their bones. After returning from this work tolkien and lewis might easily have joined the ranks of the ruthless and the disbelieving. Instead, instead they face the problem of war and suffering with realism. Realism but not resignation. For them there is no shortcut to the land for peace. Know primrose path to the mansions of the blessed. First, tears and suffering, heartless, files and stable feel, and horror and death. Their stories insist that we do live in a moral universe. War is a symptom of the ruin in the wreckage of human life but it can inspire noble, sacrifice for healing purposes. More would sometimes be necessary, they concluded, to preserve human freedom. Remember the words of cashing in lord of the rings, war must be while we defend our allies against the destroyer who would devour all but i do not love the bright sword for its sharpness nor the arrow for its witness nor the warrior for its corporate i love her that only for which they defend the these giants of literature created mythic and heroic figures who nevertheless make a claim upon our concrete and ordinary lives. They challenge us to join with them in their struggle against the dark forces of this world, and it is a desperate struggle. This leads to the most surprising element of their achievement. In the world grid by tolkien and lewis, the struggle against evil is only possible because theres a source of grace and goodness outside of ourselves. We can only struggle against evil because theres a source of grace and good is outside of ourselves. Although the accusations, tolkien and lewis come closer to capturing the tragedy of the human condition and in postmodern cynic. By the end of the quest frodo the ringbearer has given up the thought of ultimate success or even survival. Hope fails. And then comes, we have only a little time to wait no. We are lost and wrote in downfall and theres no escape. The climax of his journey at the fires of mount doom, despite all of his courage and strength frodo fails in his quest. He fails. He chooses not to destroy the ring but instead it comes to this bottom places at once again on distinct. I do not choose to do what i can to do. The ring is my. Tolkien explained the scene this way. One must face the fact the power of evil in the world is not finally resistible by a incarnate creatures, however good they may be. Heres where tolkien and lewis departs most radically i think from the spirit of the age. Think about our modern tales of virtue and everson. Academy of the superheroes, super cops, super spies. We have a protagonist who always saves the day by his or her natural intelligence strength of will, good looks, usually firepower and the america Second Amendment baby, right . I believe in the Second Amendment. Dont panic out of there. [laughter] thats the modern hero right . Well, the moral vision in the works of tolkien and lewis is fundamentally different your they hero cannot, let me underscore, the hero cannot buy his own effort prevail in the struggle against evil. The forces against them as well as the weakness within make victory impossible. The tragic nature of his quest begins to oppress them until the moment when a final failure seems inevitable. And now the mystic dimension of their stories reaches its zenith, like the best fairy tale they provide the consolation of a happy ending what tolkien called the sudden joyous turn toward rescue and retention to its the reversal of a catastrophe. What tolkien called the decisive act of grace which promises to overcome our guilt, restore whats been lost and set things right. Frodos defeat which is our defeat is overturned by a power stronger than our weakness. Tolkien identifies this power as quote that one ever present person who was never absent and never named. So it is driven by is lost to dominate. The ring is destroyed but not by frodo. Not by the fellowship but by sudden and miraculous grace. In those childrens stories the crowning moment of grace the covers in the last battle as again, the children, fateful fight the wicked into to the stable, the last battle. Sport alert. We are led to believe inside the stable is certain death stronghold on all powerful evil i feel in my bones that we shall all one by one past the dark door before morning. I can think of 100 deaths i would rather have died. As the company is forced inside its doors all hope seems lost and he again comes to joyous turn. The great lie in has invaded the stable, cast out and turn the stable into a portal. The children watched as it is destroyed a new world nearly more beautiful than the hearts candor is called into being. Listen to lewis. As the old narnia, all the dear creatures have been drawn into the real narnia through the door. And the character of lucy, lucy captures the soviet powerful symbolism of the stable in the gospel accounts its the birthplace of the messiah, the lion of the tribe of judah jesus in bethlehem. In our world, lucy says, a stable once has something inside it was bigger than our whole world. These epic tales of rescued and sacrifice are strangely similar to us, arent they . Because we have heard them or rumors of them before. For these to judge the literature there was only one truth, one singular event that could end the long war against evil and undo the tragedy of the human condition and bring lasting peace. The return of the king. The return of the king. In narnia is king of course it is the great lion. Only he knows the way to the classroom that lies beyond the sea. The light as was growing stronger rights and lewis in the last battle. Lucy saw a great series of mini cliffs like of it for them like a Giant Staircase and then she forgot Everything Else because he was coming. Leaping from clip to clip like a living cataract of power and beauty. This king comes in power and, indeed, as the voice of conscience and a source of consolation of the lion and the lamb. Is the union of tenderness and severity as lewis put it of care and comfort intertwined. In tolkien story this king is the chief epicure of the lord of the rings, erica the kingship, his life was devoted to the work. But his true stature is made known only after the defeat when he finally assumes his throne. Listen to tolkien. Win era gone arose all that the health and taste in suffered seemed to them that he was revealed to them to for the first time. Tall as the sea kings of old is above all that were near. Ancient of days the same and yet in the flower of manhood. Wisdom sat upon his brow and strength and healing were in his hands and a life was about in behold the king. Here is a vision of human life as the once terrifying and sublime. Here is a world our world in which every soul is caught up in an epic struggle against evil, story of sacrifice and courage and clashing armies. The return of the king. This is the day ladies and gentlemen, when every heart will be laid bare come a day when we will know, we will know with an expressible joy of unspeakable sorrow whether we have chosen light or darkness. It is in these imaginative works of fiction, these mythic tales of heroism and sacrifice and redemption that we find a clue to the meaning of our earthly journey. Is everything sad going to come untrue, as the sandbox for the created of narnia and middle earth this is the deepest source of hope for the human story, the belief that god and goodness are the ultimate realities and that the shadow of sin and suffering will finally and forever be lifted from our lives. The great war will be won. This king who brings strength and healing in his hands will make everything sad come untrue to thank you for listening. [applause] thank you. Thank you. Thank you. And i think weve got a little time. How much time for q a . 10, 15 minutes of q a. Wait for the mic and if you could structure question in the form of question. That would be lovely. First of all then you joe leconte. How did you get in your . [laughter] youllyou get a question one second that you words make me cry. And i dont like you that well. [laughter] that you could make me cry. When Charles Colson died everybody at if youve got a lapel pin. It said remain at your posts do your duty. I remember that. How would you think that tolkien and lewis would tell us today what is her post, what is our duty . To rip the question, john thank you for that. You know they felt their own particular sense of calling invocation was in writing and literature. Thats the genre, the field that they wanted to be successful in the as part of the reason they devoted themselves to meet together into inklings to help each other become the best at the craft. Crowds. I mean, imagine those settings with these great writers sitting around for a few hours critiquing each others work. Tolkien said he read every chapter, virtually every chapter of the lord of the rings out loud to see us lose, even the settings of the inklings or one on one. Every single chapter because lewis had a particular gift for criticism, constructive brilliant criticism when her things right outside. Tolkien did anyone at the. This commitment was so crucial and so the net for i think 16 years more or less every week ma every thursday, also i think on tuesdays right into the Second World War, right to the chaos of the Second World War these guys are meeting because theyre so devoted to helping each other become best at the crack of i think thats initial thing i was is we have to make some commitment as we understand our own individual callings to say before god i want to be a person of integrity and excellence in this craft because i know at the end of the day thats could have ripple effects i cannot anticipate. They never could have anticipated the influence that the writings had but they were devoted to other things, excellence integrity. Thank you, john. Yes, over here and please tell me your name. [inaudible] first of all, thank you for coming up talking to tonight. I enjoyed your speech. I like to read a quote from a fellow englishman to these guys compress a generation or so earlier and i was wondering if you could talk to us about what they may think about this quote. Wort is an ugly thing but not the ugliest of things. Patriotic feeling which thinks nothing is worth more is worth were. The first book nothing for which is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety is a magical creature indeed and has no chance of being free unless better men than himself. Thank you for the cougar a great question because there was in the postwar years in the 1920s, one of the benefits i get the country teach americas Foreign Policy in history. I say thank gods students come in with blank slates. They dont know what i dont know. Anxious of mercy protect us. But you do to get something about those postwar years. The reaction against the First World War was a kind of mood of pessimism and withdrawal and an unwilling is to face unpleasant reality to neither tolkien or lewis went into the war as holy warriors. There was rhetoric from the ministers. Thats a much in the in the trenches though. But they did not come out of the were as passives even though they cannot sobered by the. Lewis wrote in 1941 42 the second war is on he says we know from experience of the last 20 years, meaning 19181938, we know from experience that an angry and fearful pacifism is one of the road that leads to war. Hes reflecting on a decade of appeasement in the 1930s that allowed a system to rise and challenge. Part of the response would be war is horrible, just about the worst thing that can happen to human beings. And yet there are some things that are even worse and you see this in both of their works. What i love about these heroic figures is that are reluctant warriors so often. That are filled with selfdoubt and struggle and do not try influence even when they win. Their surprise they won the battle. They win the battle and they are stunned that they won so theres a realism i think about combat and what that experience that they fuse into their stories to also do not give up on the idea of a just war, a great war for decent and human and noble purposes. Maybe somebody over here in the shadow cabinet over there. If dont have a hand, question. You guys are in the bleachers. [inaudible] you are part of the shadow cabinet, john. Go ahead. Thank you. I would say that one utah was full of hope and there is firing and i appreciate that. And with humor. We obviously take this dog in light of contemporary of the society of the world we are living in today and would you have any, we are talking are in washington, d. C. What would you say are some insight you had in researching this book that may be helpful for some for National Readers . Thats a great question, john. Thank you for the. What stands out one of the great things in this book, you get into the writing, the journals from the letters of these men which they never intended to publish and your admiration for them grows, it deepens. Part of what these guys are able to do which is a manifest industry is to avoid these two extremes the became so popular in the day. They avoided the extreme attitude kind of militarism utopianism on the one hand. We can change the world, make it in her own image whether they were or some ideology, to some revolution. They also avoid cynicism. And navigated between the two emotional psychological extremes and they did that through their lives and through the writing. I just do sometimes wonder if we could use a little bit more of that at all kinds of levels. It doesnt mean their stories are not filled with these gripping tales of good versus evil. Those elements are there but theres an awareness about the tragedy of the human condition and it comes out of their christian understanding of the human person to and yet with the grace of god, Amazing Things can happen to with the grace of god but with the cooperation of the individual, individual wills matter. They avoid cynicism they avoid fatalism. They placed emphasis on individual decisionmaking throughout the stores. Its shocking almost the first page to the last page of both their works people at choices to make whether its an animal or human form. Youve got choices to make for good or for evil. That is a scene for a. I think this awareness of the fundamental dignity, individual voices as another hugely important a thing. Yes. How about the young lady in the back. Tell me your name. My name is emily. I really like your comments about how friendship is emphasized more than romance in narnia and in lord of the rings as well. I was wondering if you could talk about why our culture today seems to value romance more than friendship . Terrific question which is way above my pay grade and experience. Its a terrific question. Let me see if i can scratch the surface of that when. Why has friendship taken this sort of backseat to romance . Look, heres one possible answer. I dont know how helpful is going to be bubbly think about the friendships that these been formed, they were friendships about, not for the own sake but friendships for the sake of a great cause, great and noble cause. Thats where the friendships are forged. It seems to me one of the dangers weve gone problems our colleges with this idea but friendships that is usually have century precious promises and theres no great cause to attach ourselves to. Theres the crucible of conflict no challenge to which we dedicate ourselves in friendship. If you dont believe that our great causes worth being a part of great moral truths to attach herself to come that is going to weaken french by thing undermine french. Its the belief in great moral truths, great challenges, a force of evil in the world. Thats what animates the friendships and both are great epic tales. Take away the moral landscape, take with the idea of good and evil and great transcendent truths that are worth fighting and dying for and you dont have, theres no friendship. Theres no point to the friendship rydquist whats the friendship going to be about . I think thats part of the reason. The weakening of the plate in these great truths animating truths, the weakening of friendship but what fills the vacuum most easily, its romance. Dirges. Thats a partial answer. Thank you for that question. Cant do it justice though. Who else . Right here. [inaudible] my question is you briefly alluded to the world war ii in the writings but how much of an effect and in what way did it have on the outlook on the world and the writings themselves speak what you are talking world war ii. Terrific question. Tolkien was actually, this and when the lord of the rings came out in the 1950s that it was an allegory, warning against a comic power. The ring was a great allegorical symbol. Tolkien says specifically in the letter he says of course its not about atomic power. About power and the desire to dominate. Thats what he says the books are about. Thats what he says the books are about the desire for power the desire to dominate. In the chronicles of narnia of course for the children, the whole children playing london. Tolkien acknowledges, says he began writing its in pieces of this epic trilogy while he was in the dugout under fire, bits and pieces of fragments is writing 1916, 1970. Hes beginning to forge this mythology that he wants to give to his beloved england 1917. This new mythology. I was filtering my study through that site think at the end of the day look, they both have a lot to say youre going to the writings during that period, 1940 41 42. They are so often harken back to the First World War and what it meant. Tolkien writes a letter to his son christopher serving in the Royal Air Force and his son is anxious about the work of whats going on and tolkien writes to him and says i know what its like to feel like you are the toad, it is dangerous, dangerous place but he says remember that your insight a very great story trying to encourage his son. He also says in a letter it was during that time when used in a place in the First World War you begin to use his writing as a way to somehow express in a constructive way struggle and the great answer he was experiencing to give it a constructive outlet the im really not getting after question but 1948 war 1939 40 to 41 more innocent as a confirmation i think of the narrative power of their star store but i think its part of the reason a rejuvenation of tolkien and lewis after the war. Their story of the human tragedy, the tragedy of human condition now seems be going out again in the Second World War. Two more questions. Okay. This gentleman over and then come back over. Tell us your name would you . I am [inaudible] my question is how you would think lewis and tolkien would answer the question of how to know the world and still love it . They obviously knew the pains and evils of the world in a very specific way having gone through world war i. And they odyssey produced books true and goodness in the world. Your thoughts on that . Thats a terrific question. Im thinking here of the lewis and what so characterizes the journey to the offensive characterized his life and been through a lot just like tolkien, lost his mother at a young age First World War the he is caring for an older woman for much of his life all kinds of struggle and hardship but the experience of joy that lewis learned to make part of his life the building the capacity to stop and to appreciate beauty physical beauty or moral duty to develop that capacity and i think thats a learned trigger a measure comes naturally to us but i think we have to decide whether to stop in to pressure. So, for example, is still an agnostic is moving towards theism and ill try to put us close as it can, hes on a train to give been injured in three plays of the immortals often interested in three places takes it out of the war. Is on a train to recover at a hospital in england and he is causing this beautiful english countryside and he writes a letter to his friend as he arrives at the hospital, you cant imagine how beautiful the train ride was. The site of the seat which id missed for so long and the site of the puppies. The gold and appeals to anthony says im beginning to think that there is some source of beauty beyond his Natural World but i dont know what it is. It begins to capture the experience of joy and beauty. I think developing that capacity, developing that spiritual muscle if you will i think is probably a crucial part of the answer that we all have abutted of it could have a natural and theres so much that trounce it out and discourage us from exercising the muscle. Doesnt help a bit . What else . We had somebody over here. Go ahead. My name is mark charles. I just moved here from the navajo reservation in arizona. Welcome spent thank you. I appreciate your, today. Is a huge fan of c. S. Lewis i was not aware of his experienced with the war and how he was using his books to make people aware of the horrors of the war and write about it or bring some of those things and that help the audience rose with those things. As a native american living in the United States, one of the things that we suffer, that we wrestle with is our history thats been marginalized dehumanized. And so how do you think thats what im trying to think out of this phrase this question. Tolkien and lewis brought a dialogue regarding the horrors of war to the audiences are as a nation we tend to celebrate our exceptionalism and yet we dont know how to talk about the fact that 30 lines below the statement all men are created equal in our declaration of independence it refers to native as merciless indian savages. How do you think what they did with the war can and should be done today to our society deal with its own horrors of its own History Speaks yes, great question. Thank you for that. One of the things i do in my western civilization class i teach at the kings college. Thanks for coming. Came back for more punishment. Good to see. I still start those classes with a film clip from a Clint Eastwood classic the good, the bad, and the ugly. That great spaghetti western. The point there is to introduce my students to the idea that western civilization and the american expression of it has the good, the bad, and the ugly. What we will try to do in the class but i think we should do their own respected seers is going to this with her eyes open and avoid the extremes of cynicism and utopianism. It seems to me that another acquired sort of discipline mental discipline which will is like to suggest a turkish as well at the end of the day they post an update between those two. When you think about lewis and tolkien in the writings, again i dont think these guys are glorifying war. I dont think theyre trying to glorify their countrys role in war at all. Part of the reason i say that think about the characters and their stories almost all of them are prone to great temptation and a full picture all vulnerable to the law of the lust for power. Theres almost no one and into that but on the other hand, is almost no creatures beyond redemption. So even remember the lion . About this creature may have a part to play yet in all this. Frodo want to get this creature and kill them. And no mercy. He may have a role to play. So holding out hope and even frodo begins to adopt a posture. Maybe this creature this wicked seemingly creature to be redeemed. I think its that perspective of realism yes, but not cynicism, not utopianism and not fatalism will help us as we value our history and to grips with it. I think thats the best tonic at the end of the day. Thank you for that. We are out of time for questions. Thank you so much for coming. Thank you