Transcripts For CSPAN Archivist 20240703

Colleen shogan, you became the first female archivist of the United States. You recently hosted the first lady and chief Justice John Roberts in the National Archives rotunda for your ceremonial swearing in. You wore white. Tell us why i wore white. Because that was the color adopted by the suffragists when they were advocating for the 19th amendment. I was the vice chair of the womens Suffrage Centennial commission, so thats very meaningful to me. And i wanted to really invoke their spirit as i took the oath of office as the first woman to become archivist of the United States. What does it mean to you to be the first woman . It means a lot. I means, i think a lot for representation. I think its very important for kids, young girls and boys to see women in these roles. I think it also means a lot to those who work in this area in libraries and archives and museums, which is a profession and career track, which is dominated by women. But oftentimes, although its changing, oftentimes dont see women as in the leadership roles in those organizations. What perspective do you think you bring to this role as a woman, and how does it differ from your predecessors . Well, i think my predecessor was very supportive of of covering the full american story, which would include women in history and womens role in history. I think that i will bring some resources to bear to make sure that when we have researchers that come to the National Archives, that our facilities across the United States who are women that are historic and where theyre there are genealogists to make sure that they feel comfortable in our buildings. And then also we have experts on staff that are able to help them when theyre researching aspects of womens history. How do you explain your job as the archivist of the United States . Well, as the archivist of the United States, i am that the head of the National Archives. Its a 2600 person agency. So i have duties. I run a federal agency just like any secretary or other director of a federal agency would. But my unique opportunity is to preserve, protect and share the nations records. And how many are there . There are 13. 5 textual billion textual records in our possession here at the National Archives, but then theres also millions of photographs of films. 700,000 artifacts. So it is a vast collection. And why is it important to you to or how do you go about protecting these documents and also providing access to the American People, to these documents . Well, we have to protect the records so that generations of americans after us, when we are no longer here, are able to also consult those records. Thats important for a lot of different reasons. We, of course, want them to be able to do that and theyre in their rights as americans. And the citizens. But, you know, the interpretation of history change over time because we look at things with different lenses. So we need to be able to preserve those records. So were able to have different interpretations of history as we move on. And then the sharing of the records is something that im very much focused on because its important to to care take on the records and preserve them. But if were not sharing them with americans, then im not sure exactly what the point is. So that will be a focus of what im doing as archivist. What does it mean when . You see one of these rare documents describe what goes through your mind and why you want america, American People to see them. Right . You know, to find a connection with history, especially someone if youve studied American History or youre youre someone that likes to watch documentaries about American History, and then youre able to see the actual Decision Point of American History. It makes it actually come alive to you in a way that i just cant describe. You recently made the decision to have the emancipation proclamation in the rotunda, the National Archives. Why did you make that decision . And describe now what is the message that youre hoping people get when they walk through and see that document along with the others . I view the emancipation proclamation as one of our founding documents. It did was not signed in 1776 or 1789. It occurred later in American History. But its really what i view as the re founding of the United States. It really articulates the declaration, the principles of the declaration of independence, its a re articulation as Abraham Lincoln would describe it. It is not the end all be all of what we know to be the freedom for africanamericans and their full citizenship rights, particularly. But is the beginning to extend those rights to africanamericans . And thats incredibly important. What other changes will you make . Well, we are looking to make sure that we enhance our Visitor Experience at the National Archives. Right now, we do have our big exhibit. Besides the founding documents, which are always on display. Our our major exhibit is undergoing renovation. So we can be ready for 2025 moving into 2026. So were anxiously awaiting the opening of that, which will be very exciting. There will be more opportunity, i think, for kids to engage in interactive displays so we can attract more kids to come to the National Archives. So were just going to were going to open the doors and message to everyone is all americans are welcome to the National Archives. Please come and learn about our shared history. The National Archives agency has been in the news lately, most recently, the committees investigating the Hunter Bidens business have reached out to the National Archives and there are also been lawsuits requesting emails of thenVice President joe bidens correspondence with his son. What can you tell us about the emails in your possession at the National Archives . I cant tell anything about those emails in particular, but we are following the process thats outlined in the president ial records act of 1978. Very clearly lays out the process in which we are able to share those records. We call them special access requests, work with members of congress, chairmen of committees, and we are engaged in that process. I met with chairman colmer. We had a very good meeting in which we were able to outline that process, and he understands that we are following it and we will be following the law. So that those records can come to chairman colmer within the dictates that are allowed in the law. What does the law say about the timing of release of those emails . And he also said that many of that information was redacted and he wanted it unredacted. And explain why to the American People those emails would be redacted. Well, there are provisions within foi, i believe, that those emails were released under a previously under a foia request, and there were provisions of foia which would cause them to be redacted. It might be things like peoples personal names or information, but there are several provisions under fire under the law under the president ial records act, after the National Archives does a search and determines what records would be responsive to the specific request from, for example, chairman of the committee. Then we have to notify the president of Whose Administration those records come from, as well as the current president , the incumbent president. In this case, president obama. That would be for Vice President bidens records. And then, of course, President Biden himself is the incumbent president. And then there is at least a 30 day period in which they have time to review those records and then the end or a period in which we are able to hopefully provide access and request to chairman of the committee or whoever is asked for them under a special access request. And youre saying the agency is complying, and within that timeline, we are 100 complying. It is not our timeline to set. Remember the timeline is set by the incumbent president or the former president. And so we have to follow those timeline lines. And thats in the law. But we are getting them the records. So they can review them and be in compliance. Absolutely. Any concern that this is a personal correspondence between a father and a son is what consideration is given to that . Well, what the records that would be responsive under the president ial records act are president records, which would mean they are records in which any president is executing his or her duties constitutional duties. Their ceremony or duties. Personal records would not be responsive to a president ial records act request. The National Archives also came into the spotlight when classified documents were found at the residence, the mar a lago residence of former president donald trump. You were not the archivist at the time, but you were asked about it during your confirmation hearing. Explain to the American People what role the archives played in that. Ask for the documents and the corresponding investigation. Well, under the president ial records act, when a president s term concludes, usually on january 20th, at noon, then the possession of records that the president previously created or his staff created, president ial records then come into possession and custody of the National Archives. And so thats when the National Archives takes possession of those records. So that is the strong point in which theres a change and its worth reminding people that we are on the custodians of those records. But the records really belong to the American People. And how what kind of training does the agency do for the president s staff so that they understand what they are in the moment, is going to be archived later on . Sure. There is a White House Office of records management, and it is part of the white house. They were not nara employees, but they are part of the white house. And the general counsel usually the general counsels office in the white. We are we provide contact. And, you know, if they ask us questions, were able to provide them with information and consultation. But its worth to mention also that we they are not required to ask us for that information. We are here as a resource. And so we explain the process of getting all those documents. What does that look like . Well, i you know, havent i was not the archivist of the United States when there was a transition. But i know that at the archives we employ the use of the department of defense. They they assist us in the transportation of those records from the white house into a National Archives facility, which is where they would be located after the presidency concludes. There was also classified documents found at the home of current biden, also the former Vice President mike pence. Have any changes been made in your agency to address those type of documents making their way after president , Vice President leaves to their personal homes or offices . No, we havent made any changes because once again, when a president or Vice President is in office, it is is they are the custody of those records. It is their duty to caretaker those records. If they were classified information, working with those individuals in the white house, who would be responsible and assisting with classified information. And we are very focused on what happens to the records when they come into our custody in our possession. How do you find missing records . Well, the archivists, when they when they look through the records, when they would come into our custody there, they were doing a initial pass of the records, not an indepth pass, which will be done later in order to make the records available for the public and for for requests. So they take an initial pass and the records, and theyre looking for things sequentially. Theyre looking, in some cases, for high profile records that they know would be part that exception. That collection. And in doing so, they may notice that something is missing. And then what is the next step . The next step would be to then work with the former president. At that point in time and his or her representatives, they can designate records, represent lives to assist them with records and to be able to communicate with them about a possible missing record. How long do you wait for that record before you take additional steps . And what they. Well, i dont think that once again would be before my tenure, but i dont think that the National Archives has ever taken any additional steps about a missing record in that case and that instance, i continue to work with the with the president s representative in order to secure any records that if the archives thinks theyre not in their possession. Senators, during your confirmation hearing noted that most of the time this position is a sleepy confirmation process that is typically bipartisan. Yours was not. Can you tell us what it was like for you to be go through the confirmation process . Well, its interesting because i worked in the legislative branch most of my career was spent in the legislative branch. I worked in the United States Senate Earlier in my career. I worked at the Congressional Research service for eight years. And then at the library of congress as a Senior Executive for years after that. So i had a very particular legislative branch perspective. Im also a political scientist, so i studied congress and i myself was involved in nomination processes on the other side of the aisle, assisting a senator and obviously cross many senator was not just the one that i worked for. So was, you know, to switch perspective was like a 360 degree turn to be on the other side. But what i can say is i have a Great Respect for the process. I understand why senators need to do an indepth dive for nominees. They take responsibility very seriously. So now i can really say that i understand it from all different angles. Part of the controversy was because of the role the National Archives was playing in this Ongoing Investigation of missing documents from former President Trump, former then Vice President joe biden, and former Vice President mike pence. Now that you are archivists, looking back, would you have done anything differently . No, i wouldnt have done anything differently in the nomination process. I think i answered the questions as they to me. I felt like i was uniquely suited for the role, and i still feel that im wellsuited for the role. I have a very strong nonparty background as i said before, worked for many years, particularly at the library of congress, also at the White House Historical association. Just so happened that my tenure at White House Historical spanned two different president s. The part of my tenure was under President Trump and then subsequent leave President Biden and worked very effectively with both of those administrations in those functions. So im very confident coming into the role that i would be able to do that in a nonpartisan way. Looking back at how your predecessor handled the news and the agency being in the news, would you do anything differently if documents go missing . Classified documents and future transitions of power . What i will do, if there are any challenges like that in the future, is follow the law, and that is what i pledged to do in my nomination, that i would follow the law or consult with our attorneys. Am not an attorney, but consult with our attorneys. But also, quite frankly, i read the law too to remind myself the law and the regulations that go alongside that law to remind myself what my duties are. The senators said the agency has become politicized. Would you agree . No, absolutely not. We are not politicized. We are a nonpartisan partizan, an agency, and we will continue to do so as long as im at the helm. How do you help . Shape . Shape the view of your agency, given its position in the news cycle . Well, i think its also an opportunity, because now more people and more americans know about the National Archives than ever before. We are in the news and people are curious, i think, about what the National Archives does. And so presents me with a little bit higher of a profile where i am able to talk about the Larger Mission of the National Archives. You were asked at your confirmation hearing if you would be able to effectively communicate with the former president , former President Trump. What has your office and his office . What is the communication been like between your office and his office . Its been its been absolutely fine. He actually contacted me and congratulate me on my confirmation, my nomination and confirmation. And he had a couple items that he felt would be best to be in the National Archives, although they were not, he contended, not to be president ial records or or president ial gifts and asked if i would take those items in as part of President Trumps collection. And i that i would i wrote him back and said that absolutely i would. And those items have been delivered. So in addition to actual documents, can you talk about the collection, president ial gifts and other items that people might not know about . Right. So when president s receive items while they are on office and that might be from foreign heads of state, it might be from wellwishers, american citizens, and actually thousands of gifts to the president , which is really heartwarming when you think about it. Those gifts come into the president. And first lady and the first family can, if they choose, they can display those gifts while. They are in office while they are living in the white house. But afterwards, they become the property of the American People. They are indeed a different form of a record. And so for all president s, we take possession of those items and theyre really they really can tell the full story of a presidency. So for i was i visited the location outside of chicago where we are storing all of president obamas records, and its called for him in the states just a short drive outside of chicago. And i was to see a very diverse smattering of the gifts that were given to president obama and Michelle Obama while they were in office. And, you know, president obama was a big sports fan. So he got a lot of sports jerseys that were signed. I grew in pittsburgh, so it was really heartwarming to see that the Pittsburgh Steelers had signed a football for president obama, each of them, including coach tomlin. And i was able to see that gift. Have you traveled much around the country to see different sites . I have. I have been on the road a lot since taking office in may, and thats because a lot of people dont know this. But we have 42 facilities all across the United States, including the building that were sitting in here in washington, d. C. So i have been traveling to visit those facilities. Understand what they do, and also meet with the staff. You talked about in your confirmation hearing, veterans records and how that was going to be one of your top priorities. Can you explain the backlog, how it happened and where does it stand today . Yes, there was a large backlog that had accumulated during the pandemic because many of our requests for veterans records when veterans are looking for their benefits, might be a veterans family for burial arrangements. Many of those records are in still in paper format and theyre stored in our facility in saint louis. And because and so its an inperson business to be able to service those records that remain in paper format. And because of the pandemic, there were a backlog accumulated because of concerns about inperson and work. And at the height of the backlog, it was about 600,000 requests, which is a lot. Whenever i was the nominee, i talked a lot about that challenge. And so my first trip as archivist of the United States, which i was able to do, just two weeks after i assumed the role was to saint louis to meet with the leadership of our facility at saint louis, the National Personnel records center, and also meet with all the staff that work in saint louis and understand the process of what its like to respond to a records request when it comes in from one of our nations veterans. And im happy to report due to their hard work, a lot of efficiency and effectiveness practices that weve been able to put in place that now the backlog is down to just 150,000 requests. And that backlog should be completely cleared by end of this calendar year. So the end of. In december 2023 or january of 2024. You were also asked in your confirmation hearing about assisting with the civil rights cases where there are requests for cases under way dealing with abduction and other type of of incidences that have happened in the past. What can you say about the role that the National Archives plays . So we can play a very big role in things like this, in which there there would be a value for Historical Records to shed light on ongoing cases that maybe did not receive, as we know, the attention that they deserved in the time period in which we occurred. So its a great demonstration of the importance of federal records. Once again, preserving those records and then also a very unique case in which we would be sharing them in any cases that have come to light recently that can talk about that, they really demonstrate what youre talking about. I dont have a case to be able to share with you, but i do think that this is a continued importance for us. Absolutely. Talk about the rotunda here and what it means to you. How often do you go into that space, experience it . I go every day into the rotunda when i work in this building here in washington, d. C. As i said, sometimes im on the road all across the United States. We also have another facility in college park, maryland. And so sometimes im in at that location. But most of the time i am here in washington, d. C. , right on right off of the national mall, between concerts, union in pennsylvania avenue and i do i walk into the rotunda to visit the declaration, the constitution and bill of rights. Every day i either do it before i start my day. When the documents come out a little bit before all our visitors arrive. So sometimes when i want a moment of peace, then i go before my day starts. Other times i go at lunch time because i like to take a quick walk at lunchtime and i will go and see the visitors that are viewing these documents. Many people viewing them for the first time, and in most cases probably only time. They may see that these documents in their lifetime. And where i go sometimes, if i havent made it, then i will go. At the very end of the day before the documents are protected for the evening hours. Its very important to me. You describe it as visiting the documents and you try to go every day. Why . Because thats the reason why im here. And particularly the dock, the declaration of independence is outlines the principles of our nations government and the principles of democracy. We are towards those principles. We havent necessarily accomplished and met all of those promises yet. But we are in motion towards them in pursuit, in fulfillment of those principles. And i like to remind myself of that. Where does this affinity for documents come from . Well, i mean, i think those documents in particular, im a political scientist and im a political scientist. That special eyes in the history of ideas institutions. So i studied the declaration of of independence when i was in college as a great example of ideas and institutions. And thats where my fascination really originates from. You said that you havent quite met the principles that you were talking about. What are the challenges in this role in the and for this agency . Well, i mean, i think we need to we want to focus on opportunity and equality of access. Were working on that here at the National Archives, focusing on prioritization of digitizing records for previously underserved communities so that those records are available for those communities and they may be for understanding history. But it can also be very personal reasons. Understand genealogy and have access to those records for that. How big of a job is that to digitize all these records . Its a very big job. And as i said before, we have 13. 5 billion textual records in our possession. Weve digitized and have online in our catalog very close to 250 million, which is actually amazing when you think about it. So we will be moving to add, of course, to those numbers and also improving the experience that our digital users have in engaging with the catalog. Because when you start to have 250 million docu ments or records, a catalog, theres going to be challenges to finding the document or set of documents that you want to look for, for whatever reason youre searching. So were going to be investing in both that search function and also the addition, of course, of of more docu ments that will be digitized and available to all americans. What is the most requested item of the National Archives . Well, i think that historic oakley, the most requested item, is i understand it was was a photograph, elvis and Richard Nixon in his in the oval office, which is a really compelling and interesting photograph and actually, when i was at the White House Historical association and one of the historians that i worked alongside with, she wrote a terrific article you can find on the White House Historical Association Website about the history, that photograph and why elvis came to visit Richard Nixon. So you can check it out on our white house. White house, white house history. Its a fascinating story. Do you have a favorite document . I have a set of of favorite documents, obviously. To me, in my role in the womens Suffrage Centennial commission. I really love the 19th amendment. The 19th amendment is important, obviously, for women gaining the right to vote, the legal right to vote, but also for i should be for all americans, since it was the largest single enfranchise easement in American History. So when we talk about expansions of democracy, the 19th amendment is at the heart of expansions for democracy. And then i also was able to see my fathers military record when he served in the army. My uncle, who served in world war two, his Naval Service record. I was able to see that. And then as someone who studies the presidency, im a big fan of obviously Everybody Loves lincoln. Im a big fan of lincoln. Im also a big fan of grant. And i just happen to tend to display where they had brought out the document in which lincoln nominated grant to serve as general in 1864. And if you know anything about the relationship between lincoln and grant, what a pivotal Pivotal Moment in our nations when lincoln relies upon grant to really bring about the end of the civil war. So that was an amazing document for me to see. What havent you seen that you would like to see . Oh, what would i have . And i said, well, i havent been to all the facilities across the United States, so ive been to, i believe, four president ial libraries. And i have many more to go. So i really look forward to visiting those president ial libraries. And when i go to the to the president ial libraries, i havent visited, for example, of our most visited president ial libraries, jfk and reagan. And when i get to go to these facilities, they also bring out of course, you can see the exhibit where theres a terrific smattering of display of the documents, artifacts that they have in their collection. But they also always do a little special display for me. And i love that part of the day because then i get to see treasures from my study of the american presidency that are very meaningful to me. Co