Are my own and not to be attributed to the trustees. Of the census accuracy is deeper and more complex than the latest chapter on anomalies. These are problems yet to be found reveal the consequences and risks. To help illustrate the challenges of 2020 census accuracy, i start with Research Conducted by Diana Elliott and i last year to explore 2020 census outcomes. This was precovid. We chose three risk scenarios and used Census Bureau research to simulate 2020 counts. The most optimistic scenario mimicked the performance of the 2010 census, which came in 0001 of population estimate. When we overlaid that performance over the 2020 projection, we discovered a net undercount of the population of 3 . Stated differently, had the pandemic never happened, people of color are historically undercounted, and our wonderful nation, have become more racially and ethnically diverse over the past 10 years. While this 2010 census was accurate for the total u. S. Population, it came at the expense of fairness. Counted by was over 0. 8 percent, conveniently making up for net undercount of people of color. For instance, nonhispanic blacks had a net undercount of 0. 8 . Latinx, 1. 5 . It is unfair to over count one sector while undercounting another to achieve overall accuracy. It reinforces in equities in political representation, federal funding, and economic and Public Health opportunities for the next 10 years. Why does this matter now . Consider the ongoing pandemic. We see high ratio ethnic disparities in rates of job loss, hunger, housing, instability, and health. Days of life for peoples of color often meets daily needs. That leads us to the basic quality indicator, the self Response Rate. Self response occurs when you complete your own census form. Research shows lower self Response Rates increase the rate of a net undercount. Now, our national 2020 Response Rate was 67 , higher than that of 2010. But in innercity neighborhoods, self Response Rates were lower, 60 or under. These disparities varied more in 2020 than 2010. Riskss just one of many endured. 2020 census besides the overarching pandemic, others included this citizenship, the scheduling disruptions, natural disasters, that of course a shortened Data Processing period. Or each poses their own threat to census accuracy. The collection is done, so whats next . We need transparency. A Census Bureau should release data needed to assess the quality by adopting the recommendations of the American Statistical Association and the Census Bureaus own Scientific Advisory committee. In closing, i commend the Census Bureaus career staff for their dedication, scientific integrity, and old to uphold oath to uphold the constitution. Theyre esteemed and should be allowed to do their jobs unfettered, with due diligence. Thank you again and i look forward to your questions. Thank you. Mr. Szabo, you are now recognized. Good morning, chair maloney, and members of the committee. On behalf of the mayor and the nearly 8. 5 Million People in the city of new york, i thank you for having me here today. As new york citys chief demographer, my message today is twofold. One, scheduled for the census must provide the census professional staff with enough time to do their jobs well and in accordance with the rigorous statistical standards we expect. The Census Bureau, too, must be transparent by releasing key indicators and giving americans confidence in the census. The census has been presented with challenges in the past. Few have been as formidable as those posed by the 2020 census. Among the challenges we have faced, the most pressing has been the toxic mix of fear among immigrants and their families, combined with the devastating pandemic. Plus, the challenge of overcoming this fear in many communities has been hampered by the absence of physical outreach that has been shown to encourage response, especially self response. In an effort to cope with these extort nary circumstances, sec. Of commerce and Census Bureau leadership wisely reset the schedule for the 2020 census last april. This provided more time for the allimportant nonresponse followup, or as demographers erfu. To it, n when sensors knock on the door. Unfortunately, this schedule was upended this past summer, greatly abbreviating the time the bureau had in the field and the time to process the data on the backend. Why should we be concerned . First, the very definition was becauseffended for many of movement during the pandemic. Many were not at their usual residence as of april 1, 2020. Students andtions, others in temporary locations, with family members or friends, or in second homes. For those whose usual residence was in new york city, the Census Bureau needs time on the back and to adjust their backend to adjust their resume. Moreover, such confusion over where they were supposed to be enumerated in the middle of a pandemic is a virtual guarantee that largescale duplication of responses will occur. Using data on forms that sometimes lack important basic information, such as persons name, is laborious with the time required for successful completion of the process. Second, to increase response, it allowed respondents to write in their addresses without a census 80. Census id. This is fine for those that can be easily linked to the master address file, but not for those who have regular addresses, where apartment numbers do not formally exist. The department of city planning worked more than two years identifying these addresses by assigning them designated and getting them on the bureaus address books. But without a census 80, the bureau needs census id, the match toeeds to conduct their address file, with less time in the field, it is very likely many of these cases need to be resolved by the bureau as part of backend processing, which, as we all know, has been truncated. A seriousre is concern about how the Census Bureau, in the midst of a pandemic, achieve a 99 plus Completion Rate in parts of new york city, or self response over a period of five months was less than 50 . Given this shortened timeframe. The answer is that completed, resolved, does not necessarily mean, and i quote, enumerated by a household member. But what does it mean . It could mean the determining unit does not exist. It could mean the unit was deemed to be vacant. The cases could have been resolved by contact with a respondent, such as tax returns. The final determination could be an outright refute or no determination could be made for what was believed to be an occupied unit. The Census Bureau needs to assess these cases to evaluate and administer records or known to exist using a procedure. Torics need to be produced determine how the census was completed. For example, the level of deed duplication. How many people need to be reassigned to their april 1 residence . To conclude, one, scheduled for the census must provide the Census Bureau confessional staff with enough time to process, correct what we are suspect would be an increased volume of problems with this census due to the pandemic. In second, the Census Bureau must be transparent by releasing key indicators endorsed by the Census QualityIndicators Task force of the American Statistical Association. Moreover, these metrics have to be provided for small geographic areas, substate geographic areas. Census tracts, the Building Blocks of new york city neighborhoods. This will not only provide data users with confidence and quality in the data, but will allow them to maintain its i think youit and i look forward to questions. Thank you. Mr. Landry, you are now recognized. Esther landry . Mr. Landry . Thank you. Privilege to be with you here today. Be productive today would be for every member of the committee to stipulate they are in full support of legal immigration. It would be a great place to start. If we could start from that, that all of us support legal immigration, then we can proceed to deal with immigrants that for whatever reason, are in here illegally. For now, we would move to what the definition of a citizen is. To have a nation, we must have citizens. To be a citizen means to be bestowed with all of the rights, privileges, and protections of that sovereign. For theng eligible draft, serving in the military, standing on a jury, voting, contributing to social security. And other safety net programs. Having the elitist to our country. Special take special interest in this issue. This committee is aware the constitution requires account of persons living in the United States every 10 years for the purpose of representative reapportionment. And it places the responsibility of congress to direct the cap followup. To that end, congress, you, gave the secretary of Congress Broad discretion to determine the contents of each census. Similarlyly it charged those two congress. The broad of discretion can be seen in apportionment of overseas Service Members depending on several characteristics of their service, they are counted either at their usual place of residence or at their military installation. Tourists, andals, corporate entities are excluded from the count and apportionment, even though they are technically persons under the law. From alterations come policy directions of the secretary, and they are consistent with the language of the constitution and the goal of promoting equality. They ensure an accurate census and a fair apportionment as the law requires. This was president trumps goal when issuing his memorandum to the commerce secretary. The president s memorandum relies on the powers granted to the executive branch of government by you all, by congress, and the constitution. Restore are simple, to equality and voting power by excluding Illegal Immigrants from the reapportionment base. Fix,is not a difficult certainly not as drastic as say, adding another state to the union. The fate of three seats does not append the balance of power. We should always seek to assure the balance of power and recognize that an Illegal Immigrants presence should not give one state power over voters in another state. By counting Illegal Immigrants in the reapportionment base, the federal system incentivizes states to work against that system, and against each other. Sanctuary policies that entice illegal entry and shield wrongdoers from justice undermine Community Safety and the rule of law. But those states implementing these policies see increased power, thus disenfranchising other states. Illegal immigrants are expected to grow in california and ohio, while minnesota would lose congressional representation. Unlawfullye, people in this country are causing longstanding changes in our democracy by simply being counted. As the Supreme Court has recognized, few interests are more vital to a state than the extent of its representation in the house. Allowing illegal immigration to distort congressional apportionment. Illegal immigrants must be excluded from the reapportionment. Otherwise, they disenfranchise other states by unfairly distorting the apportionment of house seats in favor of state states with higher concentration of Illegal Immigrants. With determining the appropriate balance of power amongst those that wield it, the constitution demands that all votes be given equal weight. We cannot achieve that precise balance until we adopt policies laid out by the president. For thishe Committee Time and am happy to answer any questions. [no audio] thank you. Were having some connection issues with mr. Landrys presentation. He was wrapping up his presentation, so i feel that i now recognize myself for five minutes. Id like to begin by asking about the new internal documents obtained by the committee. These documents describe at least 15 different problems that career professionals at the Census Bureau identified in the data. They also show that career staff of the Trump Administration that complete and accurate data will not be ready until late january or early february. As i explained earlier, the Trump Administration did not want us to see these documents. But we were able to obtain them, nevertheless. I understand that our witnesses have now had the opportunity to review these documents, so id like to start with a simple question, which i hope you can answer with a yes or no. Disregardsnistration these data problems and rush to submit census data before these problems are fixed, would you have a high level of confidence that the data is complete and accurate as required by the constitution . Mr. Salvo, yes or no . I cant hear him. No. Ok. Mr. Santos, yes or no . No. Yes or no . Not until theyre fixed. No, maam. Ok. Id like to ask about a specific problem described in document one. Number one, this document career staff identified a data error that could result in skipping records for people who recounted in group orders, such as college dorms, nursing facilities, and military barracks. Career staff warned that this impacts more than 16,000 records. And if not corrected, may result in undercounted persons. Why is it a problem to undercount people in Group Quarters . What is this about . Well, Group Quarters represent individuals in situations like nursing homes, college dorms, homeless shelters, and the sort. Its important to count them because they are residents of the United States, and the constitution requires the Census Bureau to count individuals who are residents. Notwith that, its surprising that the Census Bureau has encountered a problem with reporters since the Group Quarters enumeration was disrupted during the pandemic. So, i am not surprised at all that roughly, perhaps half of the list of problems that had been revealed thus far are related to Group Quarters. Undercounting results in underrepresentation. It results in fewer federal fund allocations. It results in an ill bitterly an inability to properly plan. In urban areas so recently cant let that happen and i encourage that the Census Bureau, as i said, the allowed enough time to sort all the bestut and to do job you can too, with the most with the to come up most accurate counts. Career officials identified another error, affecting about 46,000 records from people who filled out paper questionnaires in nine states. The career staff wrote, if this error isnt corrected, Demographic Data from persons will be missed, and may impact the final population count. Mr. Salvo, what could the impact be if final state population count and Demographic Data are not accurate . My main point would be mr. Salvo . The Census Bureau in those maybents talked about how the problems that they were discussing affected maybe. 7 of the population. The important point to make is that that was not evenly distributed over the geographic areas of the country, and that there are some areas that would be more greatly affected than others. Anything that compromises the census of the senses will be felt more in some areas than other areas. And its important to note that. And if i may, chairwoman maloney, comment on that please . [indiscernible] ok. The Census Bureau, because of inuncation, they spot the facilities that would be included in the senses. Thats the first in the census. Thats the first point. There are some with large numbers of gqs that define who they are. And its in distribution that affects some areas much more than others. Goes,uestion on contact we are very concerned that the truncation of the schedule, less time in the field to get those answers, is caused the Census Bureau to push enumerators to a point where they compromise the data themselves. And thats with the metrics the American Statistical Association has promoted. Thats what it gets that. And thats not in the memo, ok . Thats not in the memo. We need to go beyond the memo. The quality of the data. Thank you. Thank you. Let me ask about the last page of document number one, where it lists considerations and risks. In the final bullet, the career staff set forth a stark warning. They explained that they are working on a comprehensive patch with more than a dozen individual patches, to address all these problems. But then they say this and i quote, if the sequencing of patch deployment isnt executed properly, it may result in other data anomalies. In other words, if they try to rush this, they could aggravate the process and result in even more problems. Is that right . Yes, maam. Concernstwo actually we have that are shared by the Census Bureau. One is the rushing, as you mentioned. The patches have to be put in place. They have to be tested. And you have to see whether or not to do the comprehensive fix to see where they work together. Were still talking about the first stage in the Data Processing. Theres other stages yet to come. The bureau is certainly going to be looking at that. We know from history, they can expect there will be additional anomalies that show up there, the expectation based on history is that they will be fewer and less significant. But we are not certain of that. And if there was something keeping the bureau up at night to process it, that is probably it. What is the second round, if any, of anomalies . Will they be more than historically inspected . Could that lead to less accurate data and even more delays . Correct . A could certainly lead to more delays. It could certainly lead to more delays. The important thing, as a number of people have pointed out, we are dealing with relatively small numbers in a country of 330 million, 340 Million People. The small numbers is what turns the last congressional seat. In 2000, the last seat was determined on a population difference of less than a thousand people. In 2010, it was less than 16,000 people. I dont want to imply that all these problems are that concentrated that theyre going to turn one seat. But small numbers do have a big impact at this point in the census. Thank you. Clearly, a lot of errors in these internal documents are significant and widespread, affecting all 50 states. They must be fully addressed by career experts and our committee must be given the documents we requested in order to verify that these errors have been fully addressed. I think all of the witnesses and thank all of the witnesses and i would like to now count on mr. Massi. Thank you, madam chairwoman. Id like to add to attorney general landry, if he could go through again for us how the counting or the senses counting of Illegal Immigrants census counting of Illegal Immigrants unfairly biases representation in congress, and he can explain to us how thats going to affect apportionment coming up in the next cycle. I believe youre on speaker. Sorry. [laughter] thank you. Sure. So if you take states such as rural states with larger populations, your citizens, for citizens with large operations of africanamericans or poorer states, those estates should be apportioned equally, and they are all citizens of the country should be counted. Those states such as california, the embrace sanctuary city policies and basically attract Illegal Immigrants to those cities are then unevenly waited, ed, and so weight those citizens are therefore disenfranchised when we reapportioned the seats in congress. And so thats exactly what the president was recognizing. He wanted to make sure that all citizens were represented equally in the country, in the u. S. House of representatives. If california gets an extra seat or two extra seats because of this, were counting illegal aliens in california. There are only 435 seats in congress. That means some states, or states summer, are going to lose representation somewhere, are going to lose representation. Is that correct . Thats correct. What were seeing is that minnesota, ohio, and alabama may be losing a congressional seat. So therefore, africanamericans in minnesota, alabama, and ohio, Senior Citizens in those particular states, are therefore going to be disenfranchised at the expense of illegal aliens in california. And then this sets up a perverse incentive for states to, if they want to get another representative in congress to incentivize illegal immigration into their states, doesnt it . Thats correct. Its going to create, basically, a competition between states to try to attract Illegal Immigrants in their states rather than, what Ronald Reagan always said, that people can vote with their feet by basically going into states, citizens moving from one state to another based on Economic Needs or opportunities. It was interesting that we heard from one of the witnesses when he talked about the amount of resources that could be restricted, to say minority communities are Senior Citizens. Again, counting illegals in that, basically take resources away from minority communities in other states, like minnesota, alabama, and ohio. Thank you, attorney general. You know, im glad we had a chance to discuss this issue in is hearing because a lot of my constituents are incredulous when they find out the census actually counts illegal aliens who are in this country, and that apportionment is therefore based on that. They dont even believe that thats actually happening, but it is happening. So i think its good that we had the hearing for that reason. But there are other hearings we should be having that were not having. For instance, this stimulus bill we passed, those 1200 checks, we just found out a billion of them 1 billion worth of billionm sorry 1 went to deceased individuals. And the check says deceased on it. Id like to have a hearing on why are we sending 1200 checks to deceased people . Npr, it just came out in an article that the irs admits that they are sending 1200 stimulus checks overseas to nonamericans. Why are we sending when we have americans in need, why are sending 2500 stimulus checks to nonamericans overseas . I had a norwegian who sent me a copy of his fathers check. The mans lived in oslo since the 1970s. Hes a norwegian citizen, not a dual citizen. Can we please have a hearing . Not to scratch the surface thats gone on with this program. I know hundreds of my constituents, many of them in the military, who still havent received their 1200 checks, i think is an insult to our soldiers overseas. I know its hard to get people to respond to a sensor sometimes, but we know census sometimes, but we know every member of the military, what to eat, where to go, and we can find them to send them their check . I think this is an abomination. With that, i yield back. I thank the gentleman for his questions. They did do a report on checks going to deceased persons and pointed out ways to stop that. There is legislation before congress right now that would stop that process from going forward. We will have a hearing on and follow up on it. And i now recognize misses norton mrs. , congresswoman norton. Thank you very much, madam chair. I thank you for this hearing. I think its very important we get at least the surface, and this hearing is doing that. I have a particular question even continued to serve, that is to teach one course at the law school after coming to congress. So im particularly interested recognizes because i they present a major challenge. After all, they often have what amounted to [indiscernible] at home, and offcampus. Theyre supposed to be counted for dormoffcampus housing. Covid male comp tickets that. Mail complicates that. And many of them have been forced to go back home. Concerned about having these students, particularly since even before the virus, the department of justice the department of commerce said the Census Bureau has been undercounting all campus students households. I guess thats before we got into the president s altercation. They said that the bureaus up ofs to connect made university administrators. Here im quoting them, [indiscernible] because the bureau has not does not have a final plan in place to use of. Campus students made have you considered complications of the virus that really concerns me, mr. Millman. Are you concerned that College Students who live on offcampus will be undercounted, and what do you think we should be doing about it, especially given what the Census Bureau had to say about this matter that this report was issued on august when he seven . August 27 . Maam, your concern is very, very wellfounded. Historically, College Students living at school have been among the most over counted the population over counted population, that is double counted. They find that their family will also count them back at home. So its typically been the other direction. The Census Bureau did work very hard with universities to try and build an accurate count of the students both in the dorms that was an easier lift [indiscernible] the much more difficult one, as youre pointing out, his with students living on offcampus facilities. In some cases, the university had the information and share it. In many, they didnt have that information. In some cases, they were reluctant to share that information with the Census Bureau. The basic procedures the Census Bureau would use are consistent with what to enumerate other units, using proxy data, other administrative data when they could. Your question, concern is very wellfounded, maam. Yes. Many students, according to information i have, what i heard them say, that many universities provided data to campus housing. And what i dont understand is they have not cooperated with requests to help count students who were offcampus. Why werent they cooperating with these requests . Yes. In cases where they did have that data and not willing to share it with the Census Bureau, maam, frankly its not clear why. Or at least i dont have a good explanation on that. Theit would certainly be in best interest of the university in the local community, ensure that there is an accurate count in that community. Im going to ask the chair to whatinto the matter of congress can do to make sure do, in fact,ties cooperate in the future. Because i dont see any reason for that. I dont see has my time expired . Yes, it has, and thank you for raising it, and we will look into it. I now recognize mr. Gosar. You are now recognized for your question. Youre still muted. Youre still muted. Can you hear me now . Yes, now we can hear you. Thank you. I dont know how many times i have to say it. Its groundhog day. How many times can replace waste american taxpayers dollars to listen to democrats conspiracy theories . But here we go again. The majority has been happy to undermine the Postal Service. Well keep that in mind. In the Census Bureau to score cheap political points, only to turn around and critique the republican colleagues for requesting hearings regarding the integrity because of preelection censorship and irregularities in vote count. But apparently, even ensuring integrity in the peoples government has become a partisan issue. But lets address these problems. Thank you for appearing before this committee, and the several reports your team has issued. In september, i asked you about this unprecedented census, and how technology fieldwork overcame challenges posted by covid. In your teams december gao report, is it true you confirmed the Census Bureau accounted for 99. 9 of all households in america . Yes, sir. It is a pleasure to see you again, sir. Yes, of the households, overall, theyve done very well. Your report raises concerns about the amount of time it has to complete and accurate census. Im sure it would have helped if the sensors were allowed to collect data on some temer 30th. On september 30 like it was supposed to. But it halted the ending of the senses by 15 days. There seems to be excuse after excuse to move the goalpost, whether covid, lawsuits, or even whether. Or even weather. Thank you for you and your teams work, and thank you for your technical support, which has allowed for unprecedented Response Rate and tabulation, which means to ensure American People are counted accurately and in a timely fashion. In aney general landry, democratic society, one person equals one vote is a fundamental notion. Inclusion of illegal aliens in apportionment count loses principle. However, because it grants states more seats in the body than they have legal voters. In the fallout of this election ensuring that each is counted, is there something we must ensure . It starts with granting americans equal votes in the congress. Take [indiscernible] hundreds of americans leave states like new york, illinois, california [inaudible] [no audio] i cant hear anything. Were having some connection issues. Were going to go to representative conley and then back to mr. Gosar if he needs more to complete his question. Mr. Conley, represented of conley, you are now recognized. Thank you, madam chairwoman. Can you hear me . Yes, we can. Thank you. Weve been stalwart on the whole issue of the senses and the lose census and the elusive manners. You, madam chairwoman, for that. Internal documents obtained by the committee explains that the bureau will, in fact, not finish fixing the anomalies its identified in verifying the final census count until late january, or even possibly early february. How important is this that the bureau corrects these data anomalies before moving onto the next step in Data Processing and completing the census count . Mr. Connelly, the bureau believes its absolutely vital they be corrected. What the bureau has referred to as the critical anomalies and critical isnt a function of size. Its those directly centered on the apportionment count. It can be small. Some are quite large. They need to be fixed before you move onto second stages. Thats in the bureaus view. We would share their view with the bureau. Thank you. According to the internal documents again, the time needed to correct, which you say is essential for corporate proceeding, includes the need for preparation, development, testing, and implementation. Would you agree that theres just no plausible way to rush or shortcut that correction process without further compromising the quality of the data itself . Well, certainly sir, rushing or shortcutting would be an enormous lead risky situation. Thats what were focused on with the bureau. We asked them for quite a bit of documentation. We havent received it yet. Its being reviewed by the department of congress and general counsel over there. We want to see, what is the Critical Path . What is the timeline thats going to get them to delivering the apportionment count . Weve heard, has many elders have, we dont have a firm date. Theyre looking to get it in january at some point. I think its important to remember, in respect to apportionment, this is really life or death for many communities, whether estate a state loses a represented, or could have gained one, or the lack of accurate data does not, let alone the allocation of federal resources. The stakes are high for communities all over the country. We need to take the time to make sure we get it right. Mr. Santos, president elect of the statistical association, which seeks to promote, practice statistics, a really engaging process. Do you believe outside experts should have the opportunity to review the census data before apportionment count is finalized . And if so, why . Absolutely. I am actually a big believer in Community Engaged research. Folks and, programmers running diagnostics to find errors dont realize that theyve missed something thats crucial. And the only way that that can be uncovered is by becoming transparent and allowing researchers outside of the datas Bureau Access to the so they can see if it passes the test in their local community. Ive heard instances of where prisons ended up having zero population because they were allocated by the state to the county nextdoor. Those types of small changes may not affect a state count, but they certainly will affect federal funding and planning and so forth within a state. And im very concerned about within state population accuracy. Final question, and maybe to again, but there are states that have statewide elections next year. Many of us focus on the other fortysomething states that have elections coming up in 2022. Datarankly, this census has been available early to virginia and new jersey and kentucky, i believe, but certainly new jersey and virginia because we have gubernatorial and statehouse elections next year. So, weve got to have the reapportionment data to be able to be a portion in time for our to reapportionment in time for our next election in november, less than 12 months away. Documents, with respect to the census, internal census deliberations, and the possible delay of that data until january or february, how might that affect states to have early elections and are desperately in need of early census data in order to do their reapportionment before the other states . Well, mr. Connelly, as a fellow virginia resident, im well aware of what youre referring to. The biggest risk will probably be the knock on effect for redistricting data. As you know, that comes a few months after the apportionment data. And if the Census Bureau runs into challenges wit further challenges that delay the apportionment data, and then have a knock on effect for redistricting data, and take the into the later spring, my understanding is that, from all that weve seen, that could put some pressure on the states that do need to redistrict for races this fall. Hashe gentlemans time expired and mr. Gosar is still not ready to complete his questioning, or we are having difficulties connecting with them. Mr. Heise, you are now recognized for questions. Can you hear me . Yes, we can. Ok. Thank you very much, madam chair. Just going back and looking at some stats from the past. In the 2000 census, under republican control two years before the 2000 census, there were 18 hearings. The 2010 census, democraticcontrolled house two years prior before the 2010 census were 11 hearings. E priorrs four and thre to this census, we had nine hearings regarding the census. Another two years prior to this one, we have had only five period. And i must admit, the biggest book of the five hearing bulk of the five hearings weve had have been simply hearings to bash the president and the administration, not that there were not some legitimate questions on the census. There were. But by and large, were attacking citizenship questions and attacking secretary ross and so forth. But we only had five hearings. And now today, we dont even have representatives from the senses here with us again. Again. Us here with is the census is counting everyone in this country, which they are required to do, but the president is right in insisting that only those who are here legally be included in the process by which we as a nation determine our government. And yet, here again, democrats are intent on ensuring they tie up this process in order to get a desired outcome, which in essence, is to make sure that states with the largest number of Illegal Immigrants are actually rewarded with extra representation that they dont deserve. So, mr. Landry, thank you for being here. Id like to ask you, as i get started here, regarding the temporary restraining order and then the preliminary injunction from judge co. , that ignores the secretarys obligation, by law, to meet the december 31 deadline to send a report to the president. Do you agree with that . Yes. Ok, so was that then, in essence, compelling the secretary to ignore or perhaps even break the law . Yes. Yes, it was. Isk, the whole topic here that california was basically hoarding resources of the Census Bureau when those resources were needed in other states in order to complete the census count on time. Experience,in your for judges to order illegal action, is that a common practice by judges . In the federal courts, in the liberal courts, yes it is, unfortunately. But it shouldnt be. The judges should be bound to apply the law and the facts. So, you described in two different amicus briefs how the residence of your state standard have the right to equal representation diminished by these two really perverse legal efforts, one compelling the law to be broken, the other counting illegal aliens in the apportionment, which actually rewards breaking the law. Is that thats correct. I got a little confused in those two cases. We filed an intervention in california in one case. And then the new york case that you may have been talking about earlier was where the president was trying to basically ensure that we did not count illegals for reapportionment in order to reapportion the house districts. Right, and both of those standard have a negative impact on your state. I go back and i just think of democrats in this committee, i go back to april. In this committee, with covid as ofwas at that time course, april was a very insecure time. No one knew what was going on. But in this committee, the ce nsus stated they would need a fourmonth delay. I would also remind everyone it was a poll that the Postal Service was going to be insolvent by september. Of course, that did not happen. There was a lot of uncertainty going on in april, as was brought up here a little while ago. In august met with us this year saying that they were going to be able to meet the december deadline. So, things that were predicted, that were cleared simply never happened. Mihm, what was the enumeration rate in the 2010 census . Do you remember . Enumeration rate, sorry sir. Do you mean the undercount from the 2010 census . The enumeration rate. You said a while ago the one this year, 99. 98 . Sorry, is. Its a little bit of apples and oranges. But when the census is all done, they do a major coverage measure to assess the quality. The 2010 census continued to pattern an improvement and had a net over count of about. 01 . As was mentioned earlier by mr. Santos, that was different by democratic groups. He did have a net undercount of nonhispanic blacks and hispanics and American Indians living on reservations. A. 01 overall, with over count. The gentlemans time has expired but the gentleman may answer the question. He did answer the question, maam. Id just like to conclude by saying i would love to be able to ask some of these questions to census, but obviously i cant because they were not even invited to be here today. Hopefully we will be able to speak to them in person. I yield back. Thank you. Well, i do want to say that some of my colleagues have complained that officials from the Census Bureau or the Congress Department are not here today. Let me just say that nothing is off the table going forward. We can invite them. This hearing was called because the Trump Administration refused, repeatedly, to share information that the Oversight Committee requested over and over with our committee. We had to learn about major problems not from the Census Bureau, but from the press. And then finally, we got more information from alternative sources that brought the information to us and felt that we should have it. Have wethat we ask for information from secretary ross and from director billingham, and they refused to give us the information. Thats why we are now discussing we havermation that gotten from an alternative source. We can certainly have director billingham and mr. Ross back to another hearing next week if you would like to request it. We would certain the grant that to you. Exceeds me. This excuse me. The current status is we wrote to secretary ross yesterday and we gave him one week to complete a complete amount of documents that are unredacted, a set of documents we requested last month. And if he does not, he could very well face a subpoena. And i will also consider whether we need to hold another hearing to hear directly from him and secretary ross. And if you requested, we will certainly do if you requested, we will certainly do it. I have to announce we have to take a brief recess because we have a vote. I have a caucus meeting right now and i want to give all its membth