His article and what it means. Robbie, good morning. Guest great to be with you. Att your recent article reason magazine, the media had four years to figure out trump voters, they blew it. Explain to us, first of all, why you wrote this article. Tell us who you are talking about when you say the media. Guest the media is a broad category. I am talking about the posters, the people who loudly assured us that biden was going to win in a massive blow up. The votes are still being counted. And, when joe biden does to my mind look likely to win and eke out a narrow win in several states. If you have been following the experts, they predicted florida, they predicted a democratic senate. They predicted all sorts of things that have not come true. I think, in part, because they have struggled. They got this wrong last time. Which is why i said they had four years to improve. They have struggled to identify, talk to and speak with the trump voters, the Republican Voters out there. Many of whom are not they say it is all white voters. This time, we know trump did much better with latinos particularly. Possibly other minority groups. Failure togreat actually comprehend what is going through the minds of people who cast their ballot for trump. This a failure in polling or is this a failure in what you call the media . Guest i think it is a failure on many fronts. The data begins with the pollsters. Your assumptions proceed poorly from there. Again, just to explain how poorly the whole thing was, i think there is not a single poll taken that showed Susan Collins ahead of her challenger. Many polls showed her behind by 6, 7, 8, 12 points. She easily won. The senate races went much better than expected. Republicans. The polling is bad. There is a narrative about who trump voters are that does not fit the reality of what we are seeing. Host explained to me what you see as the narrative and what the Mainstream Media is getting wrong about the Trump Supporters. Guest there has been a lot of talk about how it is all about race. The republican party, the Trump Coalition is the party of white people. You have minority voters. If you have more turnout among minority voters, democrats would do better. I think that there has long been an idea that republicans are antidemocracy in the media. If we could turn out more voters and get more people in the polls, you would have democrats do much better. To be clear, it is clear that joe biden will win the popular vote. But it looks like trump has also gotten more votes than he got last time. From some categories of people, even racial groups for whom voting for trump is not supposed to have been a reasonable possibility. What it looks like is trump has assembled there is a class divide going on. Therking class versus highly educated and the wealthier voters, who are moving increasingly in the Democratic Partys direction. That is probably what is actually going on. It is not a preferred narrative by people in the media and many who are liberal by political orientation or progressive. For whom, race is the interesting category. Class is not as interesting to a new generation of progressive thinkers. Class looks to me like the more salient factor. Host explained what you mean by working class. Guest people often think workingclass means lower class or low income. They are there are, of course, working class people who make a lot of money. More money than i do. It is for positions that do not require the same amount of necessarily College Degrees or you dont have do you are dont you have manager status. Runs the people who do not the company but people who work for the company. Host it sounds like you are talking about a High School Graduation split with the College Graduation split. More than actual money. Look at that, that will probably be the statistic that would best capture a massive split between trump and biden. Host one of the things you wrote is that it is unfortunate that many in the media, including and especially the continue toaders get things so wrong. Massive polling errors are bad for cultivating a wellinformed citizenry. Explain what you meant by that. Many many politicians, policy advocates, people who ,ork in the business of ideas it matters to them what people think and what they think, which ideas are popular with the voters. The american citizenry. Information,hat liberal policies, are more popular than the cotenant have, alternative, they are more likely to be voted on and approved by legislators. What the American People have said resoundingly in their confusing ways is they want divided government. There is no mandate to do much of anything. There would be no ability to do much of anything. It is not confirmed that georgia might go to a runoff. A massivelyon divided government. I dont think there has been a democrat to take office with a senate for i think the last time was the 1880s. I guess that is what the American People wanted. That is something more people should try to understand. Viewers takeet our part in the conversation very we will use the same lines from the previous hours. If you support joe biden and Kamala Harris, your number is 202 7488000. If you support President TrumpVice President pence, your number is 202 7488001. If you supported another ticket or you did not vote, we want to hear from you at 202 7488002. Keep in mind, you can always text us at 202 7488003. We are always reading on social media, twitter and cspan wj and on facebook at facebook. Com cspan. Like you said a few seconds ago, the senate race and control of the senate has not yet been determined. With a possible runoff for the two georgia seats later on this year. Senate,rats do take the does joe biden claim he has a mandate and be believed . I think he can claim the more important thing is he will actually be able to do something with his power. Having taken office. Whereas, if the republicans has the have that majority, Senate Majority leader mitch mcconnell, mcconnell can make his like a nightmare from the get go. It matters for whether the democrats i dont know that biden wants to do this but many immigrants want to do these big structural changes, like packing the courts. Something that will actually give them more of an institutional advantage. The perception among democrats is that it is stacked against them because of the senate and representation and how it works. They need to change the institutions so that they could have a majority and protect the majority. They have to get a majority first before they can do that. Host i want to talk to you about something that surprised a lot of people on thursday. President trump came out for his press conference at the white house. But, several of the Television Networks cut away while trump was talking. The Washington Post ro about it. I want to get your reaction to it. In a striking editorial decision, the countrys three leading Television Networks cut away from President Trumps misinformation heavy address of the white house. Cbs had 22 Million Viewers during their evening news broadcast. All initially on the white house before cutting away. Msnbc did so too. Cnn and fox carried the entire thing. Robbie, what do you think about the networks deciding to pull away from President Trump during his press conference . Not a i would say i am fan of this very the networks are private companies and can make the editorial decisions they want. They are not obligated to air the president s speech or anything else. I find it annoying found it annoying when they did this. They did this periodically during the convention. Saying that they would like to fact him as it is fact check him as it is going on. That seems like heavyhanded gatekeeping. I would let the people see what the president is saying. If they want to explain it afterward, that is fine. Of course, they could should do that. President trump has said things that are not based in fact or wellfounded. No, i have no issues with him being corrected. There seems to be an idea in the media that we cannot we have to so protect people from disinformation. Way the word disinformation has been west weaponized concerns me. Offle springs will not turn because they hear something that isnt true. They will not become infected by the idea and incapable of learning the truth. Host lets let our viewers take part in the conversation. Speaking on that exact same topic, not the exact same topic but something close. One of our social media do yours wants to know, think that Mainstream Media polls are purposely putting a to suppresslowout the gop voter turnout . This is what you are talking about. Our polls affecting the people who vote . Polls affecting the people who vote . Guest i dont think it is malicious or intentional but it is an error and a mistake. Polls are conducted by phone for they have a problem if people do not answer their phone as much. There is an idea. I hear this from voters. They say they dont answer their phones. They are older americans. Think that they are prank calls or spam calls. Certainly, some people are trump voters are reluctant to tell anyone, let alone posters, that they are voting for trump. Whatever the reasoning, it is obelisk that there is a problem because the polls have, twice in a row, and this time worse than last time, underestimated trumps vote totals. Host lets go to our phone lines and talk to don, who is linton,m maryland north dakota. Don says she didnt vote. Good morning. I got tohe only thing say is there is no color. We are all the same color. It is time to set my people free. That has been said for thousands and thousands of years. Host go ahead and respond, robbie. Guest i think there definitely is obviously that is an admirable sentiment. Too think there is a desire a preference for talking about issues in a racial lens in the media that i have noticed. It is liberal, left of center, Mainstream Media. Race, sex,e for gender, those kinds of categories of oppression and how that affects the president ial race and politics and stuff like that. When there is a class divide onng onto some degree and to some degree and to a greater extent. I find that interesting. Host lets talk to judy, who is calling from miami, florida. Julie judy supports President Trump. Good morning. Caller good morning. I wanted to ask a question. How do you think it is expected for a president that cannot speak how do you expect him to rule this world that is america . That the idea, to get harris involved . Clarify me on that. Half of the time i have seen him, the guy is babbling his words. Host i guess she was trying to ask about what you think about joe bidens speech patterns. Guest right. It is known that joe biden has a speech impediment. It sometimes makes his words sound more jumbled than they are in his head. The most reasonable way of saying that is that both candidates, the president and challenger are very old. Even among people who run for president , among past president s we have had. So, it is reasonable to be somewhat concerned about their health and perhaps their mental fitness. I say this about both of the candidates. It is so weaponized against one or the other. People say there is something wrong with biden and the way he speaks. That the fact that both of them trip over their words does not necessarily mean that their thinking is not all the way there. Isis that public speaking difficult and sometimes you mess things up. I am not overly concerned about that. There are people within the Progressive Coalition who wanted anybody but joe biden. Of theas the last choice farleft. Kamala harris is greatly preferred. I dont think there will be effort to cut bidens time in the white house short but certainly she will be next in line and maybe sooner rather than later if progressives get their way. Host we were talking about the Mainstream Media earlier and how it deals with and covers Trump Supporters. Fox news has gotten a lot of criticism from Trump Supporters over the last two days, especially behind its call of arizona. How has fox news played out during this election season . Guest i have been watching coverage from all of the networks, which includes fox, cnn, nbc, etc. All of the coverage from the networks has been responsible and wellinformed. Look, elections are very fraught times. We are and evenly divided country. About half the country once democrats, joe biden, etc. About half one trump, republicans, etc. There is a lot at stake. It is really better. I can understand peoples anger at losing. There is a sentiment, obviously, among trump people that it is being stolen from them. It isnt. It is the nature of the mailin ballots coming in later. Disproportionately, votes for trump were cast earlier and will be tabulated earlier. I am sure it is frustrating, watching the very slow, gradual reversal take place. As fox and other networks have pointed out to their viewers, we are not seeing widespread evidence of voter fraud. Even if we were, that voter fraud goes so far in one it would nott change the outcome. You will find cases where ballots were wrongly cast. That does not prove it was illegitimate. You would have to have it happening so much and 90 of those were holding hurting trump, rather than biden, rather statistical even or relatively even split. Has been educating trump support is about that and should continue to do so. Host the theme of your article is that the Mainstream Media does not understand Trump Supporters. Does fox news understand Trump Supporters . Guest i think fox news understands them better than mainstream outlets. Certainly, they give much more attention, they allow, they showcase people who are protrump. They have people who work there to give opinion programs and articulate their views of people in that way. Ifow, if you were people were to switch back and of thes i do between all Different Networks and redifferent newspapers and read mainstream newspapers and also read conservative opinion journals, if you were to do all of it, maybe you would get a good sense. Too many people go to their preferred partisan source for news so you are always only getting one perspective. Host i am like you. I spent Election Night switching between all of the different channels. Especially knowing fox news was using the exact same numbers as the associated press. Two to patrick, who is calling from chicago, illinois. Patrick supports joe biden. Patrick, good morning. Caller good morning morning, gentlemen. Have a question. I would like to make a statement first. It is that trump voters, the thing that is so difficult to address with them is that trump tells so many lies. The individuals believe it. It is almost like you are living in a fantasy land. When you try to address it in the real world, in the united states, you cannot address it. Because it is alive. My question is how can we what is the true disenfranchisement of trump voters . The truth in reality, not in the lies that trumps trump tells. You cannot address the lie because it is alive. I want to know what the true disenfranchisement of the trump voters is. Also, the fact that people are ing it is not true. The thing going on in pennsylvania, why the votes are delayed is because the legislature in pennsylvania stated that those votes could not be counted early. They had to be counted the day of the election. What pennsylvania did was they counted the in person votes first and then the mail in votes now. They should have done it like florida did. I think what republicans are doing, they try to market the water so that people feel like they are disenfranchised when it is not true, when it is alive. Host go ahead and respond. Guest the caller makes good points. I agree with them. Here is an issue. The media makes it sound like trump is the first politician to Say Something that isnt true. Thats not true. Politicians get things wrong. Sometimes accidentally, sometimes on purpose, all the time. I think a lot of people who support trump, they think he is treated unfairly or he gets disproportionately called out or attacked by the media. I do think i think there is some truth to this some of the time. During the debate, i heard trump say a lot of things that were not accurate. I heard biden say things that were inaccurate too, in his speeches. Not just that he misspoke or he lost track of what he was saying. But actually has made policy calls that are wrong. Call that out. Ia i think there is a perception that matches reality, somewhat, that the Mainstream Media does it to trump more. They portray trump as someone a uniqueiquely spreader of disinformation. It is not to say he does not say things that are wrong. Tootally agree that efforts pave this election as illegitimate or fraudulent are totally wrong. There is no evidence for it. You have to present evidence for first. If you want to Say Something is fishy, say what it is. Every legal option to be should be available to you. The people saying that are presenting a shred of evidence. Host you have given the narrowness of bidens presumed victory, it seems unlikely that trumpism has been given anything resembling a death blow. A couple of questions. If biden wins arizona, pennsylvania, nevada and georgia, he will have more than 300 Electoral College votes. Does that still count as a narrow victory . You seedefine what trumpism as the . Guest sure. It gets into semantics a little bit. It will not be close in the Electoral College it they all go that way. But it might be the margin in those states is very small so it is closer than it looks. The pollster says they thought florida was going to go for biden. None of this would have mattered. We would have known that immediately. Then i would have said yes, that is a huge blow and a stinging rebuke of trunk. Trump. That did not really happen. I think trump had to lose really, really, really badly for the gop and conservative voters to say he is a failure. We are done with trump, we have to look elsewhere. I think that at this level of votes closeness, it could look less close as we wrap things up, i think as it is now, trump did not lose badly enough for the faithful to abandon him. Trumpism without trump is something that the intellectual conservatives who support him talk about. Trumpism is this new workingclass coalition that he has assembled that breaks from conservative orthodoxy or previous conservative orthodoxy on issues like trade. Libertarian,e less which is my view. It is more anticorporate and antibig business, speaking to the concerns of the little guy. And deeply concerned about immigration. That kind of ideology and conservative is what the intellectuals of trumpism want. Bably they think they are they think there are people who can better deliver the message than trump himself. Trump is more of a character than someone with deeply held ideological views. The question becomes, without , and this group of ideas, would they be so successful on their own if there were someone other than trump who is the avatar of them . That has not been demonstrated yet. It could be true. We may not have to find out because trump is not going away. Host excluding President Trump, still, win the election, but who would be an inheritor to trumpism . Would it be his sons or his daughter . Is there another politician who seems to be ready to pick up the trumpism mantle . Guest you would think and i would think that someone in the is someone whose last name is also trump. It could be someone in his family. The election is not done yet and we are talking about what could go on in the next one. It is a pundits curse. I certainly think that maybe don or if not a member of the chum family, mike pence, for having name recognition, would be wellpositioned to make a go of it. On the other side, so many tensesdiscounted bidens chances in the primary to begin with. So many people pronounced his campaign dead in the water and i thought it was crazy. He is a popular Vice President , he has better name recognition that elizabeth warren, Kamala Harris or cory booker. If that dynamic played out again on the other side where josh hawley, tom cotton, nikki haley, all of these interesting republican names you hear a lot, i would like mike pences chances or another member of the chum family, probably more than many pendants would say. Roxanne, whoalk to is calling from pennsylvania. She supports President Trump. Good morning. Caller good morning. Thank you for taking my call. I appreciate it. I am for mr. Trump. I believe he has been treated very unfairly in all of the years he has been in there. He has done a lot for our country. Mr. Biden supports socialism. I am not for socialism. I dont want the government telling me what to do every day. I dont want the country shut down again. And i think you should have a revote with no mailins. Host go ahead and respond. I disagreebiden with a lot of joe bidens policies on the economy, on everything, really. I would not call him a socialist. Certainly, there are actual socialists who would like him to go in that direction. There are members of the Democratic Party who are more adjacent to socialism. Aoc type people. Pieceism, i wrote another after the one we are discussing, i think this election was a huge rebuke of socialism. Actually, the latino vote, the cuban vote in florida, which trump did so well with, helped him carry the state. Part of it was messaging that was suggesting that biden and it is not totally unfair because there are elements of the Democratic Party that are wanting toore implement policies that are adjacent to powell socialism. Willid minority voters vote for progressives and leftists and liberal policies. It was not true. They have no fondness for socialism. There was a Democratic Congress call and a moderate democratic person said i almost lost my race because we were being described with socialism. No one should use the word socialist again. This is a loser for us. I think that will be that will be the take away Many Democrats will have in this election. To which i say, good riddance. Host define what you mean as socialism. You have some a people defining it so many different ways to read some people say Social Security is socialism. Some people say medicare is socialism. To find what you mean as socialism. Guest socialism is a political structure where the workers own the means of production. Usually, visavis the government. The government essentially owns control and direct large swaths of the economy. That contrasts with the free market where you have Competition Among private entities. Socialism often sounds nice in theory. Because the government is not good at running everything, it is not really good at running anything, it leads to a bad economic situation. Food shortages, etc. It has been associated with horrible political repression in latin america, in Eastern Europe china and elsewhere, because Eastern Europe, china, and elsewhere. It seems in practice, you need to deprive people of their civil rights and Political Liberties in order to stay in a socialist regime. People are totally reasonable to be fearful of it. It is Something LikeSocial Security socialist . Having a massive Government Program without competition is it will always be sort of socialist. If you have minimal government involvement or one thing the government does, you would not see say the whole program is socialist in that way. Areuld not say that we socialist in our current iteration. Our what about one of social media followers once to follow up on the discussion we were having earlier about the abouton we were having the working class and the high school educated or college educated. They want to know what about the division between rural and metro areas in politics. Guest certainly. There is that division. The democrats have a lot of concern that rural voters have to double a much political power because of the way the Electoral College works and the way the senate works. Small States States with people haveewer two senate votes and three Electoral College boats at least, votes, at least, by default. That is a concern the democrats have about how the split breaks down. On the others, i think conservative republicans are disproportionately likely to live in rural places. They feel like their issues have not been represented and they have been crowded out. America,ems in rural talking about the opioid crisis, manufacturing jobs moving overseas and other things like that, i think there is a perception that they are not being heard out. Nothing is being done to help them. They have some very real problems. Lets go to david who is calling from los angeles, california. David supports joe biden. Morning. Good morning. Caller good morning. I think what the person from the magazine is manifesting in his interpretation of socialism, a mainstream notion of the ruling elites conception of socialism. And here is my point. I submit to you that the socalled mainstream, as well as donald Trump Supporters or fox people or socalled conservatives, they both are manipulated by the ruling elite. Millionaires and billionaires control fox news. Mainstream,alled msnbc, cnn, are also controlled by the ruling elite. Is that safe to say . Yes, these are companies that are owned by wealthy people and they are forprofit companies trying to make money. Are, dont yes there and there are wealthy people who give money to democratic causes or republican causes. There is a ton of money in politics. To there is an attempt influence people. This is often portrayed as more nefarious than it is. This is the way things work. You are allowed to spend money to try to get your will and the political results you want. Certainly, there is money and there is power behind everything. But that is the reality of the way it is. Host you wrote a book called panic attack, young radicals in the age of trump. Tell us what that book is about. Guest sure. My book was following a subject that i think has become of greater interest with the kind of campus freespeech battles that probably many viewers are familiar with. Some of them, being the of speakershutdowns an and harassing of professors, often conservative but sometimes liberal by intolerant students who did not want another perspective to be allowed to exist on the campus. Occasionally, even provoking violence in places like middlebury college, yale, evergreen, etc. I interviewed a lot of students for why they preferred those tactics. Most of them were leftist students who did not want to have a Free Exchange of ideas on the campus. I think their ideas have spread from the campus to the broader society. It is something we see with the term cancel culture. Saying thea mobs for wrong thing or something that offends a group of progressives. It is on social media and it is also in the Mainstream Media. A lot of newsrooms are grappling with this. The new york times, earlier this summer, they fired they got rid of the opinion editor because he ran an opinion piece by tom cotton that was offensive to many people on staff. I think it is concerning that you would not be able to express an opinion that half of the country probably agrees with because it is offensive to a small number of elite liberal arts graduates. Host one of the things we have not had a chance to talk about is the political power of the Young Conservatives and the political power of the young voter. I am tonguetied this morning. Trump university released this information after the elections. Overall, apparently, Tufts University released this information after the elections. Overall, a barely, young people under the apparently, young people under the age of 30 supported biden, six he 6 . Young black people, 76 . Asians, 69 . Latino, 51 . What does that tell us about young voters and what does that tell us about the power of young conservative voters . Guest young voters tend to be more liberal and move to the right overtime, when they start paying taxes. They moved to the right. Those are interesting numbers. I am struck by the last one that it was an even split according to that data for the latino vote. I think that progressives have shot themselves in the foot with latinos is what we are saying. I have actually followed this with my book. The young, radical, left waiting leftleaning activist thai people have insisted that even the term latino is offensive because it is gendered. They have put forth this alternative term, latinx because it does not have gender. I think that is offensive to a lot of latino people. You would not know this if you were only talking to elite liberal arts college graduates. But, latino people do not like this term. According to a study i wrote about, only 2 actually wanted to use latinx. If you are talking to voters in this academic jargon sort of way, it is going to turn off minority voters. To some extent, that is happening with the latino vote. With the young vote. It is an interesting phenomenon. Host lets talk to michael who is calling from stamford, connecticut. Michael supports joe biden. Good morning. Caller good morning, jesse. Good morning. I support joe biden. He looks like he is really going to win the election that is coming up, that has happened. These people who are backing trump, i dont get how you can just keep on saying he won and everything is rigged. Everything has been rigged, rigged, rigged, with the witchhunt, it is made up, it is a hoax. Have you heard any of those words out of obama or any other president . Those people, they are nuts. They want to have a new election . What are they thinking about . Really . Nothing. Done they all say he has done so much, why has he really done . Tax cut forg billionaires. He has not really done anything. What . Host go ahead and respond. Guest i think there is a persecution complex among trump where, trump republicans , thisre was a lot of perception that the cia or the deep state was out to get trump. They were spying on him or there was surveillance. I am a libertarian. I have long been concerned about the surveillance of american citizens by the government and by the National Security apparatus. I think it is a bad thing and something to be worried about. I wish more republicans had taken those kinds of concerns seriously when these things were being implement it during the bush years, the patriot act. Now, many of them were like this is a problem. They only say it is a problem because it is being done to trump himself. I am concerned about the administrationty there callous way of handling our civil liberties. Maybe that happened to trump too. It happens to regular american citizens. Lets not personalize this problem to just being about trump himself. Host lets talk to jim who is california. Jim supports President Trump. Caller hello. Good morning. I have two points to make. I have never seen anything like this election. Like this presidency in my 70 years. Reason you seehe a 50 split down the country, when this president has been attacked from day one, the day they went down the elevator, it 24 7,20 47, nonstop nonstop. Was there any evidence . Nobody asked where is the evidence. It was just an allegation. We can go through the ukrainian inquisition and so on and so forth. Then, when you have literally you have to be honest literally all of the media except for a couple of outlets bashing, bashing. That, to me, is voter suppression. What is it called when you cannot turn on the news and get the weather and it is rainy outside and they tell you it is 90 degrees . There is something wrong. People are really confused. If we cannot at least be honest with ourselves and say we are not getting proper information when we should, that is really the biggest problem. My last point, robby, is this. I think you are missing the point with what is going on with the election counting. There were some subtle changes made at the end where they were able to expand dates. They were able to ignore signatures. Ofy were able to dump a lot ballots. Host i will let you go ahead and respond before we run out of time. Guest i think the relentless politicization of all aspects of life is exhausting and part of the cause of what the caller was talking about. I do agree, that is the point of my peace, some criticisms of trump from the media were unfair or exaggerated. I think the russian inclusion stuff was one of them. I think there was not a lot of good evidence, at the end of the day, that there was significant or important russian efforts that mattered all that much. So, certainly, i see the callers point. I read about these things too. That said, i dont think the election is illegitimate. I think trump is, and has been, not because of the media, because of john, deeply unpopular with roughly half the country. Trump, deeply unpopular with roughly half the country. It looks like he is going to lose and that is just the way it is because we are a divided country. A lot of people like trump and a lot of people do not like him either. T we would like to think thank robby soave, author of the article the media watch cspan sunday morning and be sure to join the discussion with your phone calls and Facebook Comments and texts and tweets