Transcripts For CSPAN Senate Hearing On U.S. Postal Service 20240712

The bipartisan poster board of governors engaged the professional search firm that identified him as an outstanding candidate with the necessary background and skill set to tackle the enormous challenges facing the postal system. The bipartisan governors unanimously approved his appointment as postmaster general. Mr. Dejoy reports to the board, not the president. Another false narrative that has been a failure to provide another false narrative a failure to provide funding to the Postal Service will undermine the election. The Postal Service currently has 15. 1 billion in cash on hand, following a betterthanexpected Financial Performance during the pandemic. Rather than being down, the Postal Service revenue is actually 1. 5 billion higher this year than during the same period last year. The postal system would have funded its longterm and entire healthcare liabilities as they were incurred. Because they didnt, those unfunded liabilities now total 120 billion. Unfortunately, the 2006 postal reform bill did not ensure longterm financial liability. In its attempt to address the unfunded liability problem, it depleted the postal system of cash and arbitrarily turned longterm liabilities into shortterm liabilities on its balance sheet. At reform attempts have largely proposed a taxpayer bailout. The cost of these proposals are generally understated based on the tenured scoring requirement, which me seemingly characterized the 40. 8 billion bailout is only costing 10. 7 billion over 10 years. These proposals also lacked the full range of Structural Reforms required to ensure the longterm viability of the system. For years, the Inspector Generals reports have recommended reform that impressed have only been partially implemented. One of the most costly efficiencies repeatedly highlighted in these reports, in the use and payment of overtime. To its credit, this is the reform of the postmaster began implementing shortly after his appointment. According to an Inspector General report issued the day postmaster dejoy was sworn in, the post office spent 4 billion in fiscal year 2019, and Mail Processing and delivering overtime and penalty overtime costs. Those overtime costs represent 45 of the postal systems 8. 8 billion loss for last year. His commendable attempts to reduce those excess costs are now being cynically used to create this false political narrative. According to democrats, the postmaster is trying to sabotage the postal system to disenfranchise voters in the upcoming election. No were sent in before he was sworn in, warning officials to factor in normal capabilities and ballot deadlines being used as evidence of this conspiracy theory. And a willing media is once again happily playing along. On average, the postal system delivered a 2. 6 billion pieces of nonprofit mail per week in 2019. Because of covid, the firstclass weekly volume is down 17 this year to date. Even if every voter used mailin ballot in, there would be 150 million pieces of mail for less than 60 of weekly volume. As long as Election Officials factor in normal capabilities and a 70 decline in volume, the postal system has more than enough capacity to handle mailin ballot in. I want to thank the postmaster for his appearance today, service, and i look forward to your testimony. Senator peters. Thank you, mr. Chairman. Mr. Dejoy, i appreciate you joining us today. We have a lot of questions for you. We are in the middle of an unprecedented pandemic. We are experiencing one of the nations worst health and economic crises. Now we are facing a male crisis. We are weeks away from an election where we expect record numbers of americans to vote by mail. For many communities in michigan and across the country, the Postal Service has always been a lifeline. Especially for the communities where private carriers simply dont deliver. Whether folks are receiving important medications, financial documents, critical home supplies, or trying to stay in touch with loved ones, the Postal Service has always delivered. And i dont think you have. You have not delivered in this brief tenure so far. For more than two centuries, americans have been able to count on the Postal Service. In less than two months as postmaster general, you have undermined one of our nations most trusted institutions. Havoc on families, veterans, seniors, rural communities, and people all across our country. The operational changes you implemented without consulting with your customers, the public, have caused significant delays. Delays that have hurt people across the nation, that come at a time when people depend on Reliable Service now more than ever. It wasnt until i launched an investigation you admitted you directed these changes yourself. Requests, itple took more than one month to respond directly. And im still not satisfied with those explanations. You have brushed off these delays, calling them inevitable, a side effect of your vision for the Postal Service. Let me tell you about the people who are forced to bear the brunt of your decisions. Company that produces educational materials for healthcare workers. That Company Started seeing serious delivery problems and switched to overnight shipping, which was almost double the shipping cost. Between these delays and the pandemic, they had to lay off multiple employees to help absorb these costs. Mary from redford said her daughter has been getting her epilepsy medication through the mail. Usually in three to four days. Because of changes you ordered, the latest refill shut down the lie 20th, and it took nine days to be delivered. When marys daughter realize the medication wasnt going to arrive on time, she tried to ration what few pills she had left. As a result, she suffered seizures and was transported to a hospital. Few of myjust a constituents who shared their story as part of my investigation. I have received more than 7500 reports of delays from people across michigan and across the country in just two weeks. They had written about skipping doses of medication and Small Businesses losing customers having to lay off employees. All because of changes you directed. Enterairman, i move to into the hearing record an update on what my investigation is finding. Without objection. Mr. Dejoy, your decisions have cost americans their health, their time, their livelihoods, and their peace of mind. I believe you owe them an apology or the harm you have caused, and all of us some very clear answers today. The country is anxious about whether the damage you have inflicted can be reversed and what other plans you have in store which could further disrupt liability and Timely Delivery of the Postal Service. If you plan to continue pursuing these changes, i think my colleagues and many of our constituents will continue to question whether you are the right person to lead this indispensable institution. Thank you. It is the tradition of this committee to swear in witnesses. Mr. Dejoy, raise your right hand. Do you swear to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you god . Postmaster dejoy i do. He has served as postmaster general, and you spend more than 35 years developing and managing a successful nationwide Logistics Company as chairman and ceo of new breeze logistics. Beginning in 2014, mr. Dejoy served as the ceo of Xpo Logistics and after his retirement in 2015 he joined the companys board of directors where he served until 2018. Mr. Dejoy. Postmaster dejoy good morning chairman, Ranking Member pierce and members of the committee. Thank chairman johnson for calling this hearing. I am proud to be with you on behalf of the women and men of the United States Postal Service. On june 15 i became the 75th postmaster general. I did so because i believe the Postal Service placed plays a positive role in the lives of the American Public and lives of the nation. I also welcome the opportunity to lead this organization because i believe theres an opportunity for the Postal Service to better serve the American Public and also to operate in a financially sustainable manner. Congress established the Postal Service to fulfill a Public Service mission to provide prompt, reliable, and universal Postal Services in an efficient and financially sustainable fashion. Our ability to fulfill that mandate is that fundamental risk. Changes must be made to ensure our sustainability for the years and decades ahead. Our business model, established by congress, requires us to pay our bills through our own efforts. I view it as my personal obligation to put the organization in the position to fulfill that mandate. With action from congress, and our regulator, a significant effort by the Postal Service can achieve this goal. This year the Postal Service will likely report a loss of more than 9 billion. Without change our losses will increase in the years to come. It is vital that Congress Enact legislation that addresses the unaffordable retirement payments, most importantly Congress Must allow the Postal Service to integrate a retiring Health Benefits program with medicare, which is a common sense practice followed by all businesses that still offer Retiree Health care. It also must rationalize our Pension Funding payments. Legislative actions have been discussed and debated for years but no action has been taken. Irg congress to enact i urge congress to enact these reforms and the legislation that would require Financial Relief to account for the impacts of the covid19 pandemic on our financial condition. The Regulatory Commission began a mandated review about the Pricing System for years ago. It has been three years since the commission concluded our Current System is not working. We urgently require the prc to do its job in establishing more rational regulatory systems around male products. When the congress and p. R. C. Fulfills its obligation to the American Public im sure that much of our 80 billion in punitive losses could be avoided. And our operation will not be in such jeopardy. The Postal Service must also do its part, we must adapt to the reality of our marketplace, generate more revenue and control our costs. I believe that we can chart a path that accomplishes these goals. In our 67 days as postmaster general, i have had the chance to implement the many hidden strengths and have our Critical Mission to the American Public. Despite these longstanding financial problems there is a strong base to build on, and a tremendous desire of the public to succeed. As we head to the election season, i want to ensure this committee and the American Public that election mail can be delivered on time. The sacred duty is our number one priority. Mr. Chairman, women and men of the Postal Service have demonstrated extraordinary commitment through the covid19 pandemic. We continue to work to keep our employees and customers safe as we fulfill our essential role of delivering medications, benefit checks, and what the public depends on. Since the beginning of the pandemic there has been a public out ordering of support postal employees as they perform their essential service. This is a welldeserved testament to their dedication. Mr. Chairman, Ranking Member pierce, i look forward to working with you to restore the health of the Postal Service. I welcome any questions that you and the committee mask. Chairman johnson thank you for that Opening Statement. I want to go through and give you a chance to respond to the false narratives lets talk about the election notices sent out by the Postal Services general counsel one notice that began before you assumed your duties. Talk about what that notice was about, and how important it was that the Postal Service does inform Election Officials so that they can factor this into the deadlines . Postmaster dejoy thank you for the opportunity to about this. First, i would like to emphasize that there has been no changes in any policies with regard to election mail for the 2020 election. As you have stated, this letter was sent out before my arrival, simply to help educate state election boards, and eventually the American People to make this a broader statement, to the American People are aware of how to successfully vote. This letter, similar letter was sent out in the two thousand 16 election by the former deputy postmaster general. We recognize that during this pandemic, there was great concern about the increase in volume and we emphasized the interaction. We had over 50,000 contacts before my arrival with state election boards to help them understand the Mail Processing procedures of the Postal Service. Since my arrival, we have established and expanded a task force. We have put up a website, we are putting up a website, and we are working to ensure the American Public has a successful election. Chairman johnson in my Opening Statement i remarked that 150 million pieces of ballots, about 6 of weekly volume coming your written testimony, you said in what is expected, about 2 . Can you assure the American Public in this committee that the postal system has more than enough capacity to handle the number of ballots . Its really a matter of Election Officials understanding what delivery capabilities are . Postmaster dejoy we delivered 433 million pieces of mail a day. 150 million ballots, 160 million ballots over the course of the week is a very small amounts. We have adequate capacity and mail volume is down 14 this year. Plus, as identified earlier in the week, we will have Additional Resources on standby. If everybody complies with the mail process that we have been identifying, there will be absolutely no issue. There is slack in the system and additional processes in and around the election that will carry any deviations. The Postal Service stands ready and the board of directors stands ready with the expansion of the task force that i have identified earlier in the week. Yesterday, we made the decision to establish a broad bipartisan Board Committee to interact with us as we move forward. We are comfortable that we will achieve this mission. Chairman johnson something that i think has been blown out of proportion as the retirement of the blue boxes. Can you speak to how that is a normal procedure . First class mail has been down over the decades, the volume almost cut in half. Any time you have a business where your volume is declining that dramatically, you start to take out different capacities. Can you address the issue of the normal retirements and what the history of that has been not only of the blue boxes but the sorting machines . Postmaster dejoy thank you for the opportunity to speak about that. Today theres about 140,000 collection boxes in the United States. Over the last 10 years, it averaged about 3500 35,000 of them have been removed. Its a datadriven method, i have not reviewed it. Every year they look at utilization, where they place post offices and where communities grow. 35,000 over 10 years, since my arrival we have removed 700 collection boxes, of which i had no idea that that was the process. When i found out about it, i looked at my Leadership Team and we looked at the excitement it was creating so i decided to stop it and we will pick it up after the election. This is a normal process that has been around 50 years. In the last 10 years we have pulled back about 35,000. On the machines, mail volume is dropping. This is a process that i was unaware of, its been around for a couple of years and we evaluate the machine capacity. They run about 35 utilization, the mail volume is dropping very rapidly, especially during the covid crisis. And package volume is growing. When i spoke with the team and this got a lot of interplay, we are really moving these machines out. We have hundreds of these machines everywhere and its not any kind of drain on capacity. I was made aware and everyone else was made aware, it was not a critical issue within the Postal Service this has gone on in every Election Year and every year. Chairman johnson so this is not a devious plot. One final question, it will go over time, can you describe the operational changes to try to start curbing in these excess costs . 4 billion in overtime penalties, making sure that the system adheres to time deadlines and what that has on aerial on mail delivery. Postmaster dejoy thank you senator. When i arrived, i spent the first two weeks even before i joined here really studying the organization. Trying to get an understanding of how decisions are made, i spent hundreds of hours before i arrived, and when i got here, working with the management. One of the first things, the first big change was how do i get the organization, the Management Team, the structure to align with my analysis. I felt we had 600,000 people according to one person and other executives doing important but not integral work. So i worked with the Management Team collectively and individually to look at our functional lawn and together we reorganized the organization followers process, and, revenue, and cost. That was one change i worked on when i got here. And the day i was sworn and i received from the oig, that discussed late deliveries, late dispatch, extra trips, and all of the time and costs associated with this approximating at 4 billion. This was when we had 13 billion in cash and 12. 5 billion dollars of payments to make in the next nine months and no help in sight. We had no help in sight. I needed to look at a positive impact on cost saving that improve the business. The transportation schedule, we run about 40,000 trips a day. And 12 of those trips were late. We were running about 5000 extra trips. Everybody runs their trucks on time. That is what glues the network together. From a election process to delivery, that was not my schedule, that was the Postal Service schedule connected to all of the delivery points that we deliver to each day. That had to be on time. Its the glue that keeps everything together, and i worked with the team. We had all of the Vice President s involved with this change, and i submitted in my report this chart which shows how we went from 88 on time to 97 ontime delivery. All of that mail that was sitting on docs got advanced. And the late trips dropped from 3500 a day to 600 a day. Within one week we made that change. Unfortunately, some Mail Processing was not fully aligned with the established schedule. We did have some delays in the mail. And our Recovery Process should have been a few days and it turned into a few weeks. But the change i made was running through our transportation schedule. I believe we will get a billion dollars of savings that it and this is key connectivity to improving the service area once we get the mail on this truck, 90 of the mail that we move around the country will get to its destination point on time. That was not the case, it was actually less that. Those are two changes that i have made. Chairman johnson i think you should be commended for this type of initiative, not condemned. Senator peters. Senator peters thank you for being here today. I want to start off asking what and making clear, the men and women who work at the Postal Service to check in every day to do their jobs, do it with professionalism, and a passion to move the mail as quickly and efficiently as possible. I think the postal workers, the mail handlers, the letter carriers, they are doing a great job, and are essential workers each day. As we have gone through this issue, and ive spoken to many of those folks across my state, they have grown increasingly frustrated with policies which they say this is nothing they have seen in the past and they see mail piling up in ways that it should not. And it needs to be addressed. These are policy changes, its not the men and women on the front line doing this work every day. So postmaster general, you have heard my opening comments, talking about the fact that i have received over 7500 complaints from folks across michigan but really across the country, folks who have sent in their concerns to me. In my Opening Statement i shared some stories of hardships from folks, including beth and mary and their challenges in michigan. I think i heard this in the last answer. You acknowledge that some of the changes put in place have delayed the mail, and with the delay in mail, people can be hurt. Is that true . Postmaster dejoy first of all, i do recognize that the quality capability is one of the reasons im here, to help. Yes, i do recognize that there have been two changes, the organizational change i dont leave has any in fact on what we have done. The transportation change sen. Peter i will get into those issues because i want to elaborate further but you will recognize there have been delays and its clear what we are seeing. Mail has been delayed read i have spent a month asking you to provide some documentation as my oversight function here, how you made these decisions and what sort of analysis was put in place. Your staff has repeatedly not answered those questions. Certainly that transparency is unacceptable. What i have uncovered from what little data is made public is on time mail delivery. I have my charges here from the eastern division, this is what you give to your business customers when you look at this line its probably hard to see but there is a redline dipping dramatically, theres a flat line along the top of this chart, we start seeing a drop on july 18. Its a big drop in online mail delivery that we are seeing. I have asked Fourth Service change records, and what im hearing and what im seeing in the chart on your website is a significant drop of nail deliveries, mail deliveries but i dont get an answer. Will you commit to giving me these documents which are readily available to the Postal Service, can we get get get those documents . Postmaster dejoy i will meet with our staff and get documents in regard to this change. But the change was to adhere to the transportation schedule. Sen. Peter you have that documented and i would love to see the documents as to how that was done. Postmaster dejoy if i10 at, production was not meeting the schedule. And our employees are experiencing the pandemic also and we have significant issues with employee availability in many parts of the country. Sen. Peter let me turn to your recent announcement, you are suspending some of the changes that you had made over the last month, the statement is fairly vague and raises some additional questions. Just yes or no so that we know what was intended, are you suspending your policy on eliminating extra trips . Postmaster dejoy no, the policy was to mitigate extra trips. Sen. Peter we are told that you are limiting overtime and this could add to backlogs, are you limiting overtime or zapping suspended now and people work overtime if necessary to move mail . Postmaster dejoy we have never eliminated overtime. Sen. Peter i understand it has been significantly curtailed. Postmaster dejoy not by me or the Leadership Team. Sen. Peter its gone down. Its limited. Postmaster dejoy we spent 700 Million Dollars on overtime. It runs at a 13 rate now like it did when i got here. Sen. Peter if you can submit that i would appreciate it. There will be no post Office Closures or suspensions before november 3 . Postmaster dejoy post Office Closures was not affected by what i put in, there was another process went before i came in after the reaction i did suspend that until after the election. Sen. Peter will you be bringing back any mail sorting machines that have been removed since you have become postmaster general . Postmaster dejoy theres no intentions do that, they are not needed. Sen. Peter i have questions about independence and transparency. Did you discuss changes or their potential impacts the president or anyone at the white house . A reminder that you are under oath. Postmaster dejoy i have never spoken to the president about the Postal Service except for congratulations when i did the position. Sen. Peter did you discuss this with secretary mnuchin . Postmaster dejoy during the negotiation and russian and discussions i told him that i was working on land, but i never did ask the changes to improve service. No great detail. That was it. Sen. Peter prior to implementing the changes, did you just ask did you discuss them with any Trump Campaign officials . Postmaster dejoy no, these changes and our total analysis Going Forward, remember, i am one person in the organization with a structure around me with others involved in the decisions. We are moving forward, that this would have a negative impact on the election is an outrageous claim. Sen. Peter and did you ever discuss this with mark meadows postmaster dejoy i have not spoken to mark meadows up until maybe last week. Sen. Peter so you give us your word today under oath that you have not taken any action whatsoever in your past that he has his master general for any political reason or at this yes of any administration officials. Postmaster dejoy my first election mail meeting i instructed my team to have effort doubled down. I was greatly concerned about the political noise we were hearing, and i have had weekly reviews on this since before the excitement came out. We are very committed, very committed to having a successful election. And the insinuation is outrageous. Sen. Peter and as we get into the election there has been concern from state and local governments about firstclass mail. Do i have the word that you will mandate that states not send out ballots using the more expensive firstclass mail and will you consider the procedures that allow election mail to move as expeditiously as possible. Postmaster dejoy we will deploy processes and procedures to advance any election mail, in some cases ahead of firstclass mail. Sen. Peter and the process continues as it has been done in the past . Postmaster dejoy we are not going to change that. Sen. Peter thank you mr. Chairman for the extra time. I appreciate it. Chairman johnson both of us went a little over. We will give seven minutes to other members. Senator portman . Sen. Portman thank you, it is obviously timely. Lets give a shout out to david janet, our letter carrier, and all postal workers, during this pandemic they are more appreciated than ever. So the men and women you employ, mr. Dejoy, pass along our site our thanks area there has been a lot of misinformation and i like getting to the facts. One of the facts that i have learned this morning is that you started 67 days ago. Much of what you have talked about including blue boxes and sorting machines happened before you got there and it was part of a plan. The former postmaster general came up through the ranks and its helpful to know that that is what is going on. And you were appointed by a Bipartisan Group and we confirm those people it was a unanimous election. I guess it is based on your being a logistics expert. I can tell that you have a passion for the logistics side. I also know that the longterm financial picture for the Postal Service is not pretty. Thats been true for a long time. Thats not really something that a postmaster general can do much about. It hires legislation. Senator feinstein has a bill that requires some additional funding and Everybody Knows its in trouble. We have to deal with this issue. I will ask you some tough questions, but a lot of this comes back onto congress not doing its job in terms of the longerterm financial picture. The immediate need is to make sure that the elections work well and thats your top priority between now and the election, i appreciate that. Everyone of us wants to make sure that we have the ability to have an election that is wellrun where people have their votes counted. Many will be using the Postal Service. Do you support absentee voting and voting by mail generally . Postmaster dejoy [indiscernible] i have voted by mail for number of years. The Postal Service delivers and processes every ballot in time. Sen. Portman so you do support voting by mail. Postmaster dejoy i think the American Public should be able to vote by mail and the Postal Service will support it. So i guess thats yes. Sen. Portman its the states that will decide this, not the congress or the post office. Many states will do it. We have had absentee voting in ohio and you do not have to give a reason. It works well. I vote every year by absentee because i dont know where im going to be, in washington or ohio, based on our schedule. It has worked well. And in ohio we have a lot of ways for people to vote and its hard to cheat in ohio. Its an important thing. Theres a lot of News Coverage about the Postal Service sending letters to 46 states, including d. C. To let them know that they cannot guarantee that all ballots will arrive on time. Is this due to a lack of funding or state laws on voting and the time it takes to turn around receiving and delivering ballots . Postmaster dejoy this is not a change from anything we have done in previous years. It was more detailed with more emphasis put on it, partly because of the expected rise in vote by mail, but also the pandemic. What the team set out to do is make the election boards, and the American Public aware of what our processes were, and if you follow these process, theres no extra effort on our part to get the ballot in, which mitigates the risk of a potentially not getting there. Sen. Portman thats important to note, this has been a problem for years. I think the post office has to coordinate better with state election systems. I think state election systems have to coordinate better with the post office. In ohio, theres a difference between when you can cast your ballot and when it is postmarked, and to get that to the post office and back to you, this is very hard to do, logistically. You have to make sure that there is adequate xi adequate time adequate time. But yes, the balance was sent out the the ballot was sent times wes, there were got the ballots, ballots were sent out the day before the election. ,ts almost impossible for us for the voters to vote, for the ballot to get to the vote, and for it to get back in the election. Well thought very out effort to safeguard the election. Not to get in the way of safeguarding the processing of ballots, not to get in the way what advice would you give voters . This is an opportunity to speak to the voters of the country. Would you advise to wait until the last minute or at least a week . Vote early. I think thats really important to tell people. Ohios law and a lot of other laws, the timeframe is really close. If you request an absentee ballot you have to make sure that it will be delivered in time. I am concerned about the delays have seen in ohio and elsewhere. We have had a number of veterans contacting us who said they were unable to get medication and there were some heartbreaking stories. One is a 70yearold who served in vietnam, has copd, trouble breathing. The inhaler refill was sent to the Postal Service, but he ran out waiting for it to arrive. And they said they would not pay for another one because it had already been shipped. He cant afford to pay for another emergency refill personally. Let me ask you about that. The veterans medications shipped through the mail, are you focused on that issue . What can we do to correct that . Postmaster dejoy we are working here feverishly to get the system running at stability and to get more workers to handle the process. We all feel bad about the level of service. We serve 161 million people, we still deliver 99. 5 of the time. We have significant efforts to continue to improve on that process. And everybody is working feverishly to get that right. Sen. Portman i hope you will , and lets ensure these medications are delivered on time, and when the production doesnt meet the transportation schedule, that there are some efforts made to align those two. Because it is a lifeline for people. They are all over the country. Especially in rural areas. I thank you for your service, and the answers you have given today. Chairman johnson i want to remind our Committee Members to please keep your questioning and factor in the answer under seven minutes. Senator carper . Is the senator there . We will move on to senator langford. I think senator carper is there, i think they are queuing it now. I am on mute. I am unmuted. Thank you for scheduling this hearing. I urge you to do this three weeks ago, and thank you for finally returning my call. I called for three weeks to try to get the call. You might be wondering mr. Dejoy about the skepticism. We get constituent services reported every week, we have seen an increase in concerns about the Postal Service and its not just my office, its offices all over the country. Frankly, they coincided with the time you took over. Even this morning, i got a message from joe mansion from West Virginia at the charleston Distribution Center, they serve five states. It is all over the country. Maybe its a coincidence . Im not so sure. Heres where we are skeptical. We have a president who does not want to vote by mail, we have a president who would like to suppress the vote, a president who would like to see the Postal Service not do well. Trying to make sure we have a vibrant, meaningful, Postal Service. We had Voter Suppression in this country almost from the get go. Even our first postmaster general, benjamin franklin, said we are not going to do that. We will let everyone have the vote. It didnt go that way. Women did not get to vote, blacks did not get to vote. We still have Voter Suppression. How have how can people vote for candidates . Do you know how Many Democrats were elected out of 13 seats . Three. We have seen poll taxes and literacy tests, all of this. When i see what going on with the president , who wants to get rid of vote by mail, we should not be surprised when we see this sort of Degraded Service across the country. It was not that long ago that we had overnight mail service, coasttocoast mail delivery within three days, and we dont have that anymore. People seem skeptical and they have the right to be skeptical. After the public uproar we have seen about the delays as well as additional operation changes we we are going to need more information than that, especially given the reports that came out last night showing that you and your team are actually considering more extreme changes to those we have seen to date, including changes that will slow down the mail even further. Tosive Service Reductions alaska, hawaii, puerto rico, making it more expensive to u. S. Citizens living there, more than doubling the price ranges, doubling the cost of voting by will impacts that disproportionately impact Small Businesses that rely on the Postal Service. We need to be worried about this, and i am. I have asked a lot of yes or no questions. Yes or nome a simple answer. You will have an opportunity to respond in the record. I will ask you yes or no questions. Are you considering dramatic Service Changes that i have just outlined and that we have learned about in the last 48 hours . Are you considering those dramatic Service Changes . Is aaster dejoy there dramatic i am asking freight i am asking for yes or no answers. Postmaster dejoy we are considering dramatic changes to improve service to the American People. Yes. Sen carper [indiscernible] postmaster dejoy as i said, i did not direct that. I stopped it. Its insignificant, not material imnything that we do, and sticking with what where we are at right now. The president was caught redhanded when he admitted he didnt want the Postal Service to have resources, and when about thewhen asked necessary relief, the president said if we dont make a deal, that means they dont get the money. That means they dont get universal mailin voting. It just cant happen. No wonder we are so skeptical. My understanding is that you have never had more than a passing acquaintance with this president but you are a huge financial supporter, and you were involved in raising money in charlotte, north carolina. No wonder we are skeptical about this when we have the president talking down the Postal Service and vote by mail. Another yes or no, and you can expand on the record, will you remain independent of this administration . [indiscernible] will you remain independent of this administration . Postmaster dejoy yes i will remain independent. Sen carper thank you. During our call earlier this week, you said that you support additional assistance for the Postal Service, so do we. The Postal Service has 15 billion on hand and a new 10 billion line of credit comes with conditions dictated by the administration. There have been declines in first class mail. It is 15 below last year. But that package volume is higher. My guess is those will come down after the pandemic. This is to say the Postal Services 15 billion in cash balance quickly disappeared. The board of governors 15 billion darla request 15 billion request must try to cover the loss from covid19. Do you support the federal appropriation to the Postal Service to cover the covid related losses . Yes or no . Postmaster dejoy yes. The covid19 related losses i do support. Sen. Carper thank you. Mr. Postmaster general, my family has had military involvement throughout our lives. My mothers youngest brother died in a kamikaze attack in 1944 in the western pacific read he gave his life for this country. My father is a veteran. I am a veteran. We have generation after generation of americans who have been willing to risk their lives, so we will have the right to vote. We have people who are sick and afraid of going out and voting this year, because they are afraid to stand in lines and get a virus at that would take their lives. I urge you to work with us. Work with us as we build up a Postal Service we can all be proud of. Thank you. Thank you, chairman. Thank you for your service, postmaster dejoy. From what i have heard, apparently the post office never had any issues, there were never delays, never mail that was late, never financial problems, never any challenge to mailin voting, until 65 days ago when you arrived, and apparently all chaos has broken out in the post office in the last two months. Before that, there was no complaint about the post office, ever. I want to thank you for your service and thank the men and women that do a remarkable job every day across the country, those in the unions, those taking care of us and getting things out, getting medicine, taking care of the firstclass mail and all those things. I appreciate your service. I appreciate you are stepping up to lead an organization that desperately needs some help, that congress has for decades hounded on postmasters on why they are not doing reforms and why we have not found more efficiencies. You stepped into this role and it looks like you took the work from the Inspector General, the work from the Regulatory Commission, and you have said, lets implement these things. Now congress is shifting from beating up on postmasters for not doing work, to now beating up on you for doing the work. So i want to say thank you for taking the risk to actually take this on. I want to run through several questions, some of them have not been addressed yet. There were stories that came out and were trending on social media that you were locking up the post boxes in burbank to prevent people from voting. Were you locking up boxes in burbank to keep people from voting . Postmaster dejoy senator, the stories i have heard of my ability, and the places i am able to get to in the same day, theyre remarkable. No, i would have nothing to do with collection boxes. Senator langford you mentioned earlier that 35,000 of the blue boxes have been retired over the past 10 years. Apparently, any blue boxes that have been retired over the past 10 years are your responsibility over the last 65 days. You mentioned before about the blue boxes being retired. Will they be retired between now and the election, or in the future . Postmaster dejoy my commitment to the committee, leadership, and American People is we have stopped. We put out the statement, we directed everybody to stop, stop reducing the postal hours, stop bringing back collection boxes, stop shutting down machines. That is basically what we did. Sen. Lankford until the election. Will that pick back up after the election . One of the issues you brought up before was about the sorting machines. Some of these sorting machines are older. Some of them are not needed anymore. Will that stop forever . What im trying to figure out is are we going to try to build inefficiencies in the post office . This has been an issue to try and get us back in the balance. Now, ther dejoy right toislation is we deliver millions of addresses during the week. I am committed to that. Thats the strength of the Postal Service. And that we be self sustained. We are not self sustained. We have a 10 billion shortfall. And over the next 10 years, we will have a 245 billion shortfall. So, we need to the Management Team and of the board there is a path we are planning, ok, with the help of legislation, with some cost impacts, with new Revenue Strategies that will help and pricing freedom from the prc, we believe we can do that. One thing not in the plan is not doing anything until the election. This is an ambitious plan because we have 10 billion to bridge. The plan has not been finalized. We have initiatives that we are looking at, like the alaska bypass plan, that is on the table. There is an Unfunded Mandate that costs us 500 million a year. What i asked for is only the mandates. That is a way for us to get healthy. Pay something for the Unfunded Mandates. If we have 25 billion this year and we do not do anything, we will be back in two years. Maybe we should change the legislation and not make us be selfsustaining. But this is our mission, to be selfsustaining and deliver at a high level of precision. And i committed to both. Am they both can be done with a little help from congress and from the postal regulatory. Congress has been unwilling to act on this for a long time. It has been over a decade that congress has discussed reforms in the post office, but it always boils down to, will it change the distribution areas that may or may not be needed in a state i live in, or the structure i am familiar with. If it changes my area, i want to block it. So it has been a challenge. Ive heard from folks saying the post office is so severely cut now, they cannot meet the outcity to get the ballots for folks in urban areas, rural areas. And the senior letter, the same thing in 2016, they sent a letter out saying, you need to send things out early. Thank you for doing that. You should not be criticized for doing that. You should be encouraged. But my question is, folks who challenged me and said there will not be enough capacity for elections, do you have capacity now for christmas and mothers day, the biggest capacity times for firstclass mail . Postmaster dejoy yes, we have capacity for those days. I looked last year at the week of december 16, the post office delivered 2. 5 billion pieces of firstclass mail during that just one week of december 16, that is a remarkable feat. 2. 5 and pieces of firstclass mail delivered in one single week. So you know right now that you have enough capacity to handle the elections without slowing you down . Postmaster dejoy yes. It is more than that. Beside the capacity, the extra activities that the organization is going through, the postal union leaders, the board, the executive Management Team here, we are focused on besides just having the capacity to execute, to react to whatever, whatever conditions exist at that particular point in time. Up to and including the pandemic, which we will likely still see some impacts from. The American People can feel comfortable that the Postal Service will deliver on this election. Thank you. Senator hansen. And thankou mr. Chair you Ranking Member peters for having this hearing, and thank you mr. Dejoy for appearing before the committee today. My time is short. Because i am told you will not stay for a second round of questions, i would appreciate brief responses. I sent you a letter last week detailing stories from the granite staters about delays in their mail. Myill note a huge spike in office since july because of Postal Service delays. For so many of our Service Members, veterans, people who experience disabilities and rural americans, their local post office is their lifeline. The change in volume you are seeing, it does not change the need for Timely Delivery of the essential, necessary items the American Public relies on the post office for. For example, one manchester couple fills prescriptions through v. A. Benefits and wrote, there has been a noticeable slowdown in mail delivery. Mail delays have caused me to ration my medication. I started cutting back of my dosage or skipping days to make my medication last. Some of my pills are critical in crucial. They need to be on a strict protocol. Will you ensure that whatever changes you make will not delay access to medications and other necessities, yes or no . Postmaster dejoy yes and i look forward to working with you on legislation to help this type of service not reach into the future. Sen. Hassan thank you. I want to move to elections again. I am glad for some of the statements and actions you have taken. We know how important voting by mail is, and this year even more so. Some states are starting to mail out ballots on september 4, only two weeks from today. You and the Postal Service general counsel have sent letters where you talked about about your plans to deal with the election mail. You wrote last week that the Postal Service, will utilize Additional Resources and maximize our efforts during the 10 days prior to the election to ensure the processing and delivery of all election mail goes through our system. Through these letters that you sent to congress so far, to they contain the full plan for ensuring the processing and delivering of all election mail, or do you have a more detailed Operational Plan with Additional Resources that you alluded to . Postmaster dejoy the letter that was sent to the states from the general counsel speaks about , you know, the mail classifications. Sen. Hassan right, do you have a detailed plan on how you will ensure the kind of delivery that americans count on for voting by mail . Do you have a more detailed plan . Postmaster dejoy there are detailed processes that we are going through. We just expanded plans, we Just Announced at the expanded, um, the expanded committee the Election Committee within the operation. But there are detailed plans that we go through in every election. Shareassan can you those with congress by sunday night so we can see where they are . Postmaster dejoy i do not think i will have the complete plan by sunday night, we just put the committees together. But i can try to today is friday. I will have to check and get back to you. Sen. Hassan i would appreciate them by sunday night, if possible. By the end of next week, ballots will start to go out. Last year, the Inspector General interviewed managers at postal facilities about handling elections. He found facilities typically process political mail as firstclass mail, delivering more than 95 of election mail in 13 days. Yes or no, will you commit to the goal of delivering 95 of election mail within 13 days, the same as the Postal Service did in 2018 . Postmaster dejoy yes. Sen. Hassan thank you. I want to move on to the issues of the decommissioning of sorting machines. At the manchester processing and distribution facility in my state, four machines have been taken out of service. Three of them are sitting there. I am told one has been dismantled and sold to a company in pennsylvania for scrap metal. The manchester facility only has one other machine that can do the work of the machine that has been sold for scrap. If that machine fails, like it did yesterday when i spoke with postal workers in my state, sorting stops and mail is delayed until the machine can be fixed. Although you have suspended the removal of the sorting machines, the removed machines in manchester have yet to be brought back in service or replaced. You said it is not necessary to do that and there are no plans to do that. I understand the director of Maintenance Operations sent an email tuesday directing local maintenance managers not to reconnect the machines. Yes or no, is that true . Postmaster dejoy i have no idea about that. Those Maintenance Operations are still they are within the districts, the sole process was new to me last week. I am sure there is logic behind it. I can find out about that. Sen. Hassan you already said today it is not necessary but when we have only one machine that can do sorting in our Largest Distribution Center in the state of New Hampshire and it breaks and everything has to stop until it is fixed again, that is not efficient, it delays deliveries. What i would like to get from you is a plan to make sure that you will commit to making sure that postal workers can deliver every piece of mail that comes into the Distribution Center on the same day it gets there, which has been the practice in the past. By refusing to restart or replace the machines, you are sabotaging the Postal Services ability to sort mail efficiently and you are underlying the you are undermining postal workerss commitment to that everyday delivery. Will you commit to having your team look into this and get back to me in writing on the plan to get at least some of these decommissioned machines back up and running . Postmaster dejoy i do not agree with the premise, but i will comply with your request. Sen. Hassan thank you. It would be helpful to get a response by the end of the week. Finally, i am running out of time, so i will ask a question for the record, because there are growing concerns at that growing concerns that postal workers are being retaliated against when they speak to members of congress or the press about some of the shortages that they are seeing, or the delays they are seeing, some of the sabotage and undermining of the Timely Delivery they are seeing. I want to make sure that the postal workers who are speaking to protect the interest of the american but they serve with such diligence are not retaliated against for doing so. Can i have a commitment today that they will not be retaliated against . Postmaster dejoy yes. Sen. Hassan thank you. Senator scott. Sen. Scott thank you, chairman johnson, for holding the searing. Thank you postmaster dejoy for being here. We have had a vote by mail for a long time. It has worked really well. I think the post office in florida has done a good job in making sure it has worked. They have had three elections and they work hard to make it happen. Can you talk about why you are uniquely qualified and what background you bring to being postmaster general and why you were picked by the board of the Postal Service . Postmaster dejoy uh. Thank you, senator. I mean, there are two things you could look at. The two actions, the big actions i have taken. The board will have to speak to their evaluation of me, but i have done i think one of the things they like is my experience with large logistical transformations. Back in the 1990s, i did and over 3 billion transformation of the Postal Network regarding mail transfer equipment. I have done big projects with disney,nd transformational projects for verizon. That type of experience, i think, and my commitment to Public Service, i think. I think that impressed them. My engagement in community. And in the nation. And when you look at the steps i did not come in here with a team or bring any consultants, i worked with the existing Management Team to create an organization that looks to move forward and give us selfhelp, and drive improvements, drive service. Grow revenues. That is something i have been i have done all my life. I built a big business from nothing. And people, there are accusations that this is not a business, but when you have a Delivery Service and you have to be sustainable, the operating model needs to cover costs. There is no other answer to that than that. We need to take actions to do that. And i have great experience at that. And part of why they like me is because i have a plan, i have a plan for the success of the Postal Service. We can sustain weekly deliveries, that is a strength in us. Now, our pieces for delivery are down under three now from years ago at six or seven. Our goal is to get that backup. If you look at the chart, and you look at where or what our reach is on a daily basis, it is impressive. We need to drive costs out of it and this is well known, but we have to drive our cost out of the network and be more efficient to get more pieces into our carriers hands. That is success. Along with legislative help, that will be the future success for the Postal Service as we face a new economy. Sen. Scott in your business life, did you help perform for your customer . Did you have to be on time . Were you able to do that . Postmaster dejoy our contracts had 99. 98 performance metrics on everything that we did, yes. And i think that there is i think that the attitude and energy is here at the Postal Service, and the design is here to do that. I think weve not had the alignment and expectation of that. Thats something i bring to the table. Sen. Scott are you personally committed to doing everything you can to make sure people get their mail, get their medicine and ballots, that they get them as quickly as they can under realistic expectations . Postmaster dejoy yes. Sen. Scott how does it make you feel when you have people that make these unsubstantiated claims that you personally have a goal to slow down the mail, so ballots do not get to the election offices on time . That you want to suppress the vote. That you personally are interested in damaging the ability of the post office to do their job . Postmaster dejoy that does not deter me at all. I am unbelievably proud and humbled by the number of positive comments i get from employees, the Management Team, and people from around america on my initiatives. Farce for me that we can sit here and do nothing. Sen. Scott do you need a bailout to deliver the mail on election day . Postmaster dejoy no, i do not need anything to deliver the mail on election night, but we do need legislative approval and we need freedom from the change in the p. R. C. Regulation. And we need to be reimbursed for our cost. When you look at during the pandemic, we still delivered to 99 of american homes. And with no revenue. The american postal worker was out there, the organization continued to perform, that is why we have high ratings. Our revenues were down. Other organizations would have stopped going to these rural areas. But we kept doing what we were supposed to do. At a significant cost impact. Get to a try to sustainable model, but in this case, i believe that we deserve some compensation for it. I think, if we are going to provide more funding for the post office, that we would like to work with you and others to find out the things we should do to make the changes necessary to make sure that you can do your job, so i appreciate any information you can provide that would allow us to do that. And i want to thank you for your commitment. I want to thank all of the people that work at the post office, they work hard. So, but, i appreciate your background and your commitment to excellence, and i hope you can do the same thing at the post office. Thank you. Chairman johnson senator rosen. Sen. Rosen thank you for holding the meeting. Thank you, mr. Dejoy, for making yourself available. Before i ask further questions, i want to ask the postmaster general this, we need transparency in the changes you are making and everything you have discussed. Will you commit to providing this committee with any and all transcripts or minutes of all closed, nonpublic board of governor meetings from this year by this sunday . Postmaster dejoy no. Sen. Rosen you will not commit . Postmaster dejoy i do not have the authority to do some of those things. That is something i would need to discuss with counsel so i could not to that. Sen. Rosen we will discuss that with you, but lets move on. I want to thank the dedicated postal workers, particularly in nevada. I spoke with many of them yesterday. The majority of them are veterans, veterans and their family. They have done years of dedicated service to this country and this nation, and they are concerned. Earlier this year, you acknowledged you made operational changes to the Postal Service. You removed sorting machines, you had a reduction and elimination of overtime and late trips. In las vegas, where they are expecting volume to ramp up, the postal workers i spoke with yesterday are reporting the removal of a sorting machine from the general mail facility, which is down the street from my house. As a former systems analyst, i have a strong appreciation for the data, so i want to talk about the data that you used to create these policies and what you may or may not have analyzed before you made the changes. During the pandemic, Health Officials directed Older Americans to stay at home for their own safety. That means for the seniors in our state and across the country, the Postal Service was the only way they would receive critical items like prescriptions, household supplies, Social Security checks. For veterans, my colleagues already mentioned this, a lifeline, 80 of a veterans prescriptions are filled by the u. S. Postal service. I have 225,000 veterans in nevada, many of them are relying on this for their Timely Delivery of lifesaving medication. And in small towns across nevada, from one with the population of 269 to a Tribal Community with 658 people, some of my larger rural communities, that is all they get, the Postal Service. So please, would you answer yes or no. Before developing and implementing policy changes, did you conduct any specific analysis on how your changes would impact seniors . Yes or no . Postmaster dejoy the policy changes that i sen. Rosen yes or no . Postmaster dejoy the policy changes i embarked upon were not the ones you identified. Sen. Rosen you did not do analysis to see how the seniors would be impacted. Lets move on. Did you do an analysis to see how veterans might be impacted, knowing that so many of our postal workers are veterans, we employ so many veterans that , they are getting their medication, and they rely on 80 did you do analysis to see how the veterans would be impacted . Postmaster dejoy the only change i made was that the trucks leave on time. Theoretically, everyone should have gotten their mail faster. Sen. Rosen can you look me in the eye, all the seniors and veterans in the eye, and tell us you will not continue with policies in the future you know will harm my seniors and veterans in nevada, and all across this nation . Can you commit to being sure that they have ontime delivery . Postmaster dejoy i am working toward ontime delivery, yes. I can commit to that. Sen. Rosen thank you. Did you do any analysis about the fees if mail is late . On utilities and rent the impact that the charges and fees would have all working families . Is there an analysis about the impact of late delivery by you on that, yes or no . Postmaster dejoy the analysis we did was if we moved the mail on schedule, that late deliveries would have been improved. Sen. Rosen obviously, that is not the case. We need to continue. Postmaster dejoy for a variety of reasons. Sen. Rosen our deployed Service Members routinely cast their ballots by mail. Did you analyze how your policy changes would impact our servicemen and women across this country and across the globe, how changes would impact them . Postmaster dejoy senator, the announcements this week is that we would improve service for every constituent. Sen. Rosen that is great. Can you provide me by this sunday, if i understand you correctly, you have analysis that will show this should have improved it, although we are finding out through thousands of contacts to our office, to our connections, that this is not the case. This is frankly unacceptable and i would like to see the analysis that this was based on to our office by this sunday. Can you commit to that . Postmaster dejoy no. Sen. Rosen can you commit to providing it at all . Postmaster dejoy i will get back to you on that. Sen. Rosen you cannot commit to providing the American People the analysis that you based your decisions on about their important medications, Social Security checks, and all the other things, you will not commit the American People to be transparent . Postmaster dejoy senator, i will go back and get the truck schedule, the analysis that sen. Rosen can you commit to transparency . Postmaster dejoy yes. Sen. Rosen that means you would provide analysis. If you are transparent, ergo you would provide the data that you used to base these important decisions on that impact peoples lives. I want you to look in the camera, millions are watching who are impacted every day by what you do. Please understand that. I want you to commit to the American People, to transparency, and provide the data that has been used to create these decisions. Postmaster dejoy i do not accept the premise and i will provide you with a transportation schedule that i directed the organization to adhere to. Yes, i will do that. Sen. Rosen we appreciate that. I look forward to seeing that and having future discussions with you. My time is up. Chairperson johnson is the senator available . Sen. Paul do you have me . Chairperson johnson yes. Sen. Paul thank you for your testimony. And thank you for taking a thankless job. Thank you for bringing your business acumen to do something in my opinion is almost an impossible problem, short of legislative reform, and even with legislative reform i see it almost an impossibility how we would balance annual operating losses. 8 9 billion a year is in a n enormous loss. I have been of the opinion that we should not give you more money unless it is attached to reform, that is the only leverage we have. We should attach things to legislation that the post office does not want to usually do. Less employees. That is where the legacy costs are. We have to go to less employees overtime. We also need to look at the easiest way to continue Personalized Service to each person individually at their house, but do it less frequently. Frankly, people who live 20 miles down the road, if you told them you would get the mail only a couple times a week instead of six times a week, they would live with it. I grew up in the town of 13,000 people and i still live in a small town and i think that people could live with that. But people should be told about the problem of continuing to run mass deficits, not just with the post office, but throughout government. And we should not pass money out it is candy it should be , attached to reforms. You are a businessman. If you came in as a venture capitalist here at the post office and named you ceo, what would you do that you are unable to do because it is a Government Entity . What are the legal restraints that prevent you from fixing the 8 9 billion annual loss the post office has . Postmaster dejoy thank you for the opportunity to address that. Im more optimistic than you in terms of our ability to get to a point of breaking even. Number one, the legislative reform i would ask, as i said in my written testimony, the integration of medicaid and pension reform. I would like to be kind of liberated on pricing. It is a competitive market now and i would like more pricing freedom. That would help us. I would like some of our Unfunded Mandates addressed. And within the organization, i would be able without much fanfare to do a simple thing, like, adhering to the schedules. If we adhere to schedules, that will improve performance. In transition, there should be or there would be an issue, but we are seeing everything right now and once we get packages moving at 97 with trucks running at 97 on time, driving cost out of the system by doing that, that is what i would do in my own business. I would drive new business revenuegenerating ideas, which we have, which will bring contributions to serving the American People. In the beginning, we have a plan. Im an optimist trying to pull this off. Sen. Paul i will not talk to you about going from six days to five days, because that is the job of congress. That is estimated to save 1. 5 of the in dollars. Dollars 1. 5 billion. I think instead of assessing people more when they live down a dirt road, i would just have less delivery, and i think that would be tolerable. It would be personal service, but less frequent. I think that would make up a large shortfall if you could just do that with rural areas. It has been said that some of your competitors, you used the post office for the last mile of delivery, and we do not charge them an adequate amount. They are using the post office. Was that a problem . Do we charge competitors enough if they use the post office for the last mile . Is it competitive . Is that a problem and should we do anything to fix that . Postmaster dejoy senator, if i may, when i first came here and i got this assignment, that was an obvious thing to me, cutting back to four or five days, whatever. And as i have done my research, and studied the organization and sixday delivery in the connection the postal carrier has with the American People, that gives us this highly trusted brand and where the economy is going, that is probably our biggest strength to capitalize on. You talk about 1. 5 billion to take a day away, but i am sitting on a transportation change that could give us 3 billion and improve service. I will believe that when i see it. I do not doubt you, but i doubt the government. What about the last mile, are you getting a market rate from competitors . Postmaster dejoy we are studying it. My general view, i have been here for 60 days and i have looked at that we make broadbased deals across the country that deal with average rates. There are areas we could push them up. We are studying that. Its i do not believe that that on the surface, its not its reasonable business gaps that may exist, thats how i describe it. Sen. Paul thank you for trying to fix an unfixable problem. Hang in there. The partisan barbs, hopefully they will be portrayed for what they are, partisan barbs that are not trying to fix anything, but just attacking you as a way of politics. I wish you the best. Chairman johnson senator romney . Sen. Romney i am. Can you hear me . Chairman johnson loud and clear. Sen. Romney i want to express appreciation for the thousands of letter carriers. I also want to note the postal workers have made our vote by mail system very successful for the entire nation. Mr. Dejoy, im assuming that you have been truthful, so i can imagine how frustrating it is to be accused of political motives in your responsibility. At the same time, you can understand that there have been reasons for people to think that you and your colleagues are purposefully acting to suppress voting, or that you will try to prevent ballots from being counted. Any surprise at such concerns has to be tempered by the fact that the president has made repeated claims that mailin voting will be fraudulent, that he does not want to give money to the post office because without money, you cannot have universal mail in voting. Putting that aside, let me note that a great deal has been made of the fact that you contributed to President Trumps campaign, i would note you also contributed to my campaign. Some people would say you contributed to both sides. [laughter] let me note that like others today, i state the obvious when i say the reliable, valid voting is essential to democracy here and across the world. In particular with covid19, the mail is essential to our Voting System and therefore our democracy. Do you have a high degree of confidence that virtually all of the ballots that will be mailed , lets say seven days before the election, would actually be received and counted . If people vote within seven days of the election, are they highly confident or are you confident that those ballots would then be received . Postmaster dejoy extremely highly confident. We will scour every plan, each night leading up to election day. We are very confident. Sen. Romney i appreciate that. I hope that the American People, as they see reports of this hearing and others that will come into the house, will underscore the fact that if they get their ballots in at least seven days before the election, probably closer to the election than that, that the person running the post office is saying he is highly confident that those ballots will be received by the clerks in a timely way. That is key. And on a separate topic, you mentioned that there are delays in the system, that is to be expected. Are there greater delays in certain areas compared to others . Are delays greater in the rural areas than in the rest of the country . Postmaster dejoy senator, i think that more urban areas where the coronavirus the intimidation of the coronavirus, which scares our employees, the employee availability average has dropped. About 4 across the nation. When you go into those places i would say are hotspots, like philadelphia, detroit, there is as much as 25 . And we have routes, philadelphia has 750 routes, and we have days where we are short 200 carriers. This can go on for a while. So that is not the only contribution, but when the American People see two or three days where they have not seen their carrier, thats an issue. I would say, i think that there are at least 20 of those around with a descending level of consequence around the country. So. Sen. Romney thank you. I will say, like a number of my colleagues who have already expressed this point, i would very much look forward to seeing and i am not talking about by sunday but at some point i would like to see a plan from someone of your expertise in logistics for how we can get the post office to be more economically managed, but at the same time maintain a level of service, which is essential for a functioning economy. And that is a real challenge, but with someone who has done what you have done in your career, i expect you to be up to the task. Im anxious for there to be a recognition on the part of congress that for us to demand Certain Service levels, it may require us to make legislative changes. Please feel welcomed in our committee, or in the house, for letting us know what we need to do and to make sure that you can do the job. I appreciate your service. Postmaster dejoy thank you. Chairman johnson senator enzi. Sen. Enzi we appreciate you for holding this hearing, chairman johnson. And i especially appreciate the postmaster general coming to this hearing. Knowing what kind of target he will be. It has got to be difficult to only be in office in 60 days and be expected to solve all the problems of the Postal Service. It has been in crisis for many years. Senator collins used to head this committee when it was not called homeland security, it was government affairs, and she has worked on the post office all that time, and has a pretty good bill she has worked on with senator feinstein that i hope people will look at. I am not sure that anything can be done in a bipartisan way, particularly if one of the participants, susan collins, is up for election, because it might help her in her campaign. But she has been dedicated to this, it is not a new idea, it is something she has been working on and it has a lot of ideas of good ideas in it. I really appreciate postal workers. Particularly, they are doing an outstanding job in spite of the difficulties of the pandemic. My fatherinlaw was a postal worker. And he was before the mail sorting machines, and he was pleased he could memorize all the zip codes in a certain area and handle all the sorting. Of course now, the local mail is not postmarked locally. These are problems i did not realize that you personally deliver everything, that you personally fix the sorting machines. That was all news to me. Detailed analysis how much Detailed Analysis can you do in 60 days, particularly as i suspect that maybe people are not wanting to share information with you. I hope that those postal workers out there that are dedicated it will actually do something to help out on it. And of course, you have been accused of picking on veterans, seniors, and i have to admit that i have felt picked on, not by you, but by the Postal Service recently. And i was glad to hear your explanation that you are having some difficulty with people on delivering the mail in light of the pandemic. I dont think a lot of people understand that and i did not understand that, but i know we had a package that was being traced, and we paid extra to have it traced, and it sat at the d. C. Post office for 11 days before it was delivered. Inhave been dales days our mail was not act up. Up. Ot picked so i am glad to know that the reason behind that and to find out, this is the big surprise, that it was not you. I thought you caused all of that. Um, the mail sorting machines. In wyoming, i do not think that we sort mail anymore, it got moved to other centers. I thought it was being done efficiently in wyoming. I also learned when you move a sorting center, under the union requirements, if people do not want to move them, they do not have to and they still get paid. That will not save money. I asked for the analysis on these changes that have affected wyoming, and which were not done under you, it was done under previous administrations. And i know that they want to save money, but theyve got to do analysis that will actually save money. You used to be able to put in 11 an envelope a collection box for local delivery. They got it the next day. Now they put it in my community for local delivery. It goes to denver, gets sorted and comes back to jolette, sometimes postmarked in denver. That is not good management. As an accountant, i know that postmarks make a difference. I have a lot of concerns. I am only pointing these out because i know you have only had 60 days to work on them, and your plate was already full, but i am trying to fill it a bit more. And i appreciate that you are willing to take on, i guess you would have to call it an adventure, not a job, because it would be too tough as a job. I know you made sacrifices to get to this. I hope you will take a look at the urban areas. We have been picked on in the rural areas for a long time, but we have some efficient people here who are dealing with long distances, and doing it very well. But when i go to my post office in d. C. , i find there is only one person working at the counter. And if that person needs a box to mail it in, the boxes are not out where people can actually get them, so the person at the counter has to go get a box, and when they come back it must still be sealed and addressed. They do not move them to the side to see if they can wait on the next customer, everybody waits at social distancing. I have been to the post office during my lunch hour before, and i found that the postal workers decided that was their lunch hour as well. No business lets employees sit down and eat in front of customers during their lunch hour. Well, enough of my, i guess, trying to defend you here. Postmaster dejoy senator, thank you for the support. Date i take the seat, as with any other organization, the day you become a ceo, you are responsible for everything that goes on around and i have big enough shoulders to deal with that. More important about what you said about legislation, you know, not moving we, the organization, needs to move forward. We have to. Because without legislation, we will run out of money. Nine months, 12 months. We are talking about a 633,000 person organization, nine months of cash and everybody thinks we are ok. That is outrageous thinking. So, we need to that is the difference now. As i said in my opening remarks, we will do what we need to do to meet our operating objectives and get to a selfsustaining manner. Thank you. Sen. Enzi i think you for being here. I recognize and that you have to rely on postmasters across the u. S. Doing their job, to manage their own business. So thank you. Chairman johnson senator hawley. Sen. Hawley thank you for being here. Let me see if i can ask some questions to get started, maybe clearing out some of the misinformation that we have heard repeated over and over and over again in the media, some of it echoed today. Just to be clear, will the usps have enough cash on hand to support operating expenses through the november election . Postmaster dejoy yes. Awley has there been an increase in the most recently reported quarter relative to the last year . Postmaster dejoy yes, small. Has the Postal Service seen their cash on hand in creech increase since the start of the pandemic, to a level of 15 billion . Is that right . Postmaster dejoy between 14 billion and 15 billion, yes. What ive heard you say today, and what i have read from your testimony, is that the Postal Service has the wherewithal, has the resources, and has what it needs to deliver the mail safely and on time through the november election, just to be clear . Is that right . Postmaster dejoy yes. Two separate things, to deliver on the election and cash for the future. Those are two separate things, but we have plenty of cash to operate for the election. What is the amount of the additional assistance that you require as we look past the elections and into the years to come . Postmaster dejoy a, the biggest thing we need is legislative reform. And we need to get the p. R. C. To decide. I estimated about 10 billion. We estimated 10 billion cost on the covid19 expense side. And what i would like to see is the note we have negotiating with the treasury, to get longterm financing to purchase new vehicles. As you bring up the note to the treasury, the cares act authorized 10 billion in borrowing. I understand that the department came to an agreement late last month in principle, what that would look like. Can you give us a sense of when the 10 billion that was authorized, when it is likely to be made available to you . Give us an update on where that stands. Postmaster dejoy we have terms of agreement. When we request it, when i get a final document on it, but the terms have been agreed, and the issue with borrowing money is you need to know how to pay it back. And at this particular point, you know, we are evaluating that, but it is available to us pretty quickly. Sen. Hawley what do you anticipate using it for in the near term . Postmaster dejoy theres pretty specific limitations. I cannot use it for capital, but i can cover operating costs closely associated with covid19. We can identify that pretty easily. Sen. Hawley you said that you would like the Additional Authority to perhaps use the loan toward vehicles or collateral for vehicles, can you say more about that . Postmaster dejoy as you probably know, we have many 30yearold vehicles. We desperately need new vehicles. The loan is not for capital, i would like to see the term extended and used for an equipment loan to buy vehicles and other types of efforts that we have. A longer term than five years. There arey additional legislative reforms that you seek . Postmaster dejoy yes. It has already been passed in the committee a couple years ago, what we are looking for. Understood. Lets come back to the reforms you recently implemented. To what degree were the changes you implemented over the summer in response to the recent findings . Postmaster dejoy i considered the oigs recent findings, as we were doing our own or our own analytics, i thought it was for somebody new coming in, and i thought they were a remarkable gift in terms of just laying out two things like that. System was out of hounds out of bounds. The Transportation System, once you get below 90 , you cannot depend on anything, right . So, that was something. Then there was the cost. Both things when i started looking at where the organization was going financially and what was the thing i could balance around, getting the transportation in line, which we will do. And saving about 2 billion, which we can reach for, was a christmas present. Let me ask, i see that my time is almost expired, but let me ask as you probably know, my home state of missouri has a significant portion of our population in rural areas. Where i grew up, it is vital to me that any Postal Service reform Going Forward continue to preserve the network of rural Delivery Service, that it preserves the existing delivery and Po Box Services available throughout missouri. Are you committed to protecting rural delivery and post offices for people like the folks i represent in missouri and around the country . Postmaster dejoy we have an unbelievable asset in our letter carriers reaching every american, each day. And i commit to trying to strengthen that relationship across the country. Thank you very much. Chairman johnson based on one of the questions and the response from senator hawley, you talked about the Transportation System being out of sync. In your written testimony i want to make sure we are talking about the same thing. You said that your ontime trips went from 35,000 a day to 39,000 a day, which means a scheduled time of 89 improved to 97 . Is that what you are talking about, the trucks leaving on time to get on their routes . And is that part of the disruption as well, if the letters are not getting to the trucks on time, they are left for the next days delivery . Can you verify or explain that better . Postmaster dejoy there is a production schedule for mail that is set up to meet a dispatch schedule for trucks, that is tied it to a destination center, lets just say where the carriers go out in the morning and then come back to at night. This is an aligned schedule in theory on paper. There are lots of imbalances that we are finding as we went through the process. But the big thing to try to get everything aligned around is the transportation schedule. We have taken that up now. All that mail going on that truck was also late mail. Some of the mail coming off of the processing lands processing lines, we did a we found the imbalances and we did, not as great of a job recovering it, but we will. We are seeing improvements now. Once that comes together, the mail will be moving around 97 ontime. And i am committed to trying to do that. That enables us to balance the front end and the delivery end of the system, and it saves us all the money that you saw in the audit report. And it is in billions, not millions. Chairman johnson i realize if you do not have a good process, you do not have a good product. You identified some breakdowns and made dramatic improvement in terms of dispatch level in terms of the Transportation System, and you obviously have covid affecting the entire economy and the postal system as well. So basically the delivery delays are primarily caused by the issues related to covid, but the changes you made in terms of the process, certainly in theory, if they havent improved it already, you are certainly setting it up for improvement and cost reductions in the future. Postmaster dejoy a substantial portion of the delays are related to covid. I will not go as far as to not say that we had maybe a 4 hit on a Service Level for delay of all sorts of mail. Marketing mail, all sorts got stuck on the dock paid we are bringing that down. Once that is aligned, we should have a smooth running system at a much more High Performance rate. Chairman johnson so these are changes for improvement in the future. Postmaster dejoy they are very doable. Fedex and ups do it. Enator sinema sinema thank you chairman for holding this important hearing. The u. S. Postal service has always been a critical lifeline for communities across arizona. Over the past week my office has heard from over 18,000 people about the importance of the Postal Service. Arizonans want to make sure they can get their medications and support the right to vote. The Postal Service must act especially since we will see citizens voting i mail due to the pandemic. The hearing should not be just about election mail. My constituents have also shared stories about prescriptions that took so long to arrive they worried they were spoiled. Others are concerned their Small Business will go under without Reliable Service or the bill payments now take longer to reach their destination. Mr. Dejoy, i am pleased you are here to answer questions about the Operational Services the Postal Services making. It is critical that you and your team demonstrate commitment to protect the service and to successfully communicate to congress and stakeholders is a big part of that effort. My first question, in arizona we expect about 85 of the electorate to vote by mail this election, approximately 2. 4 million mail this general election. Given that significant volume unexpected challenges will , certainly arrive and adjustments will need to be made. Are you working with the secretary of States Office to ensure they and other local Election Officials get their questions answered so they can have Fair Elections . I will continue to review the range of questions my Office Receives from you and your team. Their top concern is the Timely Delivery of ballots. Will the local post office be authorized to make decisions and postemployees make extra trips or late trips, work overtime to deliver extra , ballots to ensure that offices do not fall behind with election mail . Postmaster dejoy yes, maam. Effective october 1, we will have resources and liberalization, and aggressive efforts to make sure everything is moving on time. Sen. Sinema i appreciate that. Can you tell me what steps your office is taking to communicate this stance to postal workers, Election Officials, and people in arizona so people feel confident citizens have access to voting by mail . Postmaster dejoy yes, maam. In general, i think we started in february. Contacts with,000 Election Officials around the country. As you know, weve sent a number of letters. We are making videos that will go online with the Union Leadership and myself, to communicate out our commitment. We continue to work with the state boards, and our board, we decided to put together a Bipartisan Committee to kind of oversee everything that we are going to be doing. We are emphasizing in fact, in september we are going to send a letter to every american with what our process is, going out. Im appreciate the question and i feel good about what the whole organization, from the board of directors to our letter carriers and plant personnel, im very, very proud of what were doing. We are going to deliver for the American People. Sen. Sinema thanks for that. I appreciate it. Postal Processing Plants are critical. They ensure every day mail arrives and that all the votes are counted. We want to make sure operations remain efficient. Earlier this week in your announcement you said you would not close any postal processing facilities before the election, but you did not rule out consolidation of Processing Plants. My question is is the postal , Service Planning to modify or reduce capacity at any postal processing facility before the election . And if so, what steps are you taking to ensure the postal can can continuevice to meet standards for both election and regular mail in communities served by those facilities . Postmaster dejoy senator, i promise you, we are not making any changes until after the election. Sen. Sinema i appreciate that. That was a precise and direct concise and direct answer. I love it. I recently wrote to you regarding the cherryville Processing Plant in tucson. It is very important, the mail Service Throughout arizona. If the Postal Service considers consolidation for closures and processing facilities for the future, would you require new area Mail Processing centers for any impacted facilities or other similar analysis before moving forward with a consolidation or a closure . Postmaster dejoy thank you, senator. I am not totally familiar with it, but there is a whole process, a pretty detailed process that we need to go through before we close a the facility. If that facility ever goes down, we will reach out to you in advance. I will let you know, there is a whole Public Awareness process, Detailed Analysis as to how the mail is going to be processed. It is not an easy thing to do, but we have it marked down and we will keep you posted if it ever gets on our list. Sen. Sinema i appreciate that. Just for your awareness, the original was done in 2011. Weyou are probably aware, had significant cancellations in arizona since. We want to make sure decisions are made. Important for arizona and very important for Southern Arizona in particular. Mr. Chairman, go ahead. Postmaster dejoy i look forward to speaking to you about it. Sen. Sinema i know my time is almost unpaired the last thing i will say, can you next consider operational changes i asked you to take into account the negative Customer Experiences folks have shared with us like spoiled medicine or missing rent checks. We have gotten more complaints about Service Getting worse in some of these most recent changes. We ask you would take into account the negative Customer Experiences in making decisions in the future. My team is happy to share those direct experiences with you. Sen. Sinema postmaster dejoy your guidance, maam. Sen. Sinema thank you for being with us today. Mr. Chairman, i yield back. Let me thank you, postmaster general, for appearing here on short notice and subjecting yourself to this hearing process. To quick summarize a few things we heard today. The postal system is every bit as affected by covid as the rest of this nation has been, economically devastating. For anybody to assume service would maintain a high level of standards in the midst of a pandemic is unrealistic. Changes youd, implemented are dying for longterm improvement, but created some destruction as well. Coming from a manufacturing background, i realize you have to have a good process. Things have to run on time. You recognize that as well. I am supportive of those efforts. It should be commended, not condemned. As i stated, there have been unusual delays. Covid has brought changes. As i checked with our constituent folks, they are finding the high volume of calls concerning postal complaints, the vast majority seem highly scripted. Like this could be a well organized effort, which does not surprise me in the slightest. There are fundraising emails from senate candidates, the Democratic Senatorial Committee dating back as far as april complaining about this postal issue. I have no doubt the democrats andtaking these issues problems up into something it is not. A very false narrative as i said, designed to extract a itical. Advantage political advantage. Mr. Postmaster general, i am sorry you are on the targeting end of this political hit piece. It is unfortunate, tragic. As someone pointed out, this is part of the problem, why we have not had postal reforms, how people take advantage of it. The desperate cases, i appreciate, a common sense, a number of different facts. You have only had the job 60 days, you have a great background. I appreciate your willingness to serve this role. We appreciate the hard work of the men and women of the u. S. Postal service, doing a good job delivering our mail. We need reforms moving forward. We might have an opportunity. There might be another covid relief package. It probably will include something for postal. There will be dollars allocated. What im asking you for is the information, data, and suggestions for true reforms. It has always been lacking. It is always a taxpayer bailout absent of the type of reforms we need to make legislatively. I look for your guidance, data. Another real shortcoming from my dealings with the u. S. Postal service, we do not get the data we really need to enact effective legislation. I would like to enact effective legislation. That will require cooperation with you and postal workers. Again, thank you for your service, thank you for stepping into this role. I apologize for the fact you have become a target in a political hit job. It is very unfortunate. [indiscernible] could you yield to me for a minute or so . Mr. Chairman absolutely. You may recall where i worked for years on major changes in the Postal Service, real reforms. We have done that. We can do that again. Among the things we have heard medicared interest in integration. There is an acknowledgment there needs to be investment in the postal fleet. The average age of a postal vehicle is 27 years old. There are investments that need to be made for additional modern processing equipment in our Distribution Centers across the country. The ability to come up with a bipartisan consensus on how to help the Postal Service not just get through a pandemic, but be efficient and vibrant in the years to come. Democracy we need compromise. With all due respect to our postmaster general, i want a bipartisan compromise. I reached out to you when you were initially selected by the postal board. Later on i tried to reach you again and again for weeks and could not get a call back. I was not the only one. You have to be willing to communicate. There are people in the administration who do a great job of that. Bob lighthizer is one. Mnuchin, treasury of secretary is one. [indiscernible] shared responsibility is not on the post office or the men and women that work at the Postal Service. It is not on the board of governors or you, the postmaster. Our country is counting on us. Franklin,back to ben first postmaster general. You know what he said . What if you created . A republic. The ability for people to vote. Democrat, republican. People who count cast their votes, they know they will be counted. We cannot undermine the Postal Service or vote by mail. Hopefully we can do better than that. For myself and some of my colleagues [indiscernible] mr. Chairman, if i can say a few comments. Senator peters. Peters thank you for appearing before us willingly and on short notice. I want to be clear on what i have been hearing and what you have been hearing from the members and counter what the chairman said. These are real concerns, these are not manufactured. These are people coming forward, talking about delays, talking about medicine not available for them. I shared a story with an because of ao, lack of medicine, skipped doses and was hospitalized. Those are very real. When i hear those kind of stories, we stand up. Everys my job, the job of senator here, to stand up for constituents at home being hurt to make sure their voices are heard. This is what this is about, making sure peoples voices are heard. This is what this hearing is about, to make sure the Postal Office has done what they done with professionalism for 200 years. We want to make sure that standard continues Going Forward. I fully appreciate covid has caused significant problems. But if you look at the chart, the service was there through a lot of the pandemic, it was just the middle of july where you see it dropping off dramatically. Covid has been with us since march. We have seen a dramatic drop in mid july, the time i got all those communications and my colleagues have been getting them. These are not manufactured, these are real people. Are. Ey certainly sen. Peters sen. Peters i just want to be clear about that. Postmaster joy, you answered our questions and i am happy for that. There are many questions unanswered. We look forward to seeing the documents we requested so we can do our oversight function. I appreciate your willingness to do that. I will continue my investigation of recent delays and Postal Service practices that have been put in place. I urge you and your staff to be fully forthcoming with additional requests. That kind of transparency is critically important in this job. I know you have a very hard job. Frankly, i think you made it harder on yourself because of the lack of transparency we have seen. In the coming weeks, Congress Must provide Postal Service with the resources and oversight you tod to reliably deliver mail the American People, but not just through this election. We have to make sure we get through the election, the pandemic, and put the Postal Service on sound financial footing to last another 245 years and beyond. Thank you, senator peters. I am not denying these complaints are genuine. We take these seriously to help our constituents. But there is no doubt a lot of this is being ginned up, a lot of it is scripted. [indiscernible] postmaster who has been in office less than 70 days. The first thing he needs to do is start the job, roll up his Shirt Sleeves and get to work trying to figure out what he needs to do to perform the process. Reform the process. I am looking forward to a transparent process. I want to separate the fact from fiction. There are a lot of false narratives being ginned up by democrats. Mr. Postmaster general, i am sure you will work with us in future. I want to give you the opportunity. There is a possibility for postal reform in the next covid relief package. Lets work in good faith. Ithank you for your service, thank the men and women of the United States postservice. This will remain open for 15 days to submit questions for the record. This hearing is adjourned. [captions Copyright National cable satellite corp. 2020] [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy. Visit ncicap. Org] this week it is the republicans turn. Starting monday and for four days, the Republican Convention. Hear their vision for the future and the next four years. Vice president pence and President Trump accepted their nomination. It begins monday at 9 00 p. M. Eastern as delegates meet to officially nominate President Trump and Vice President tens. At 8 30 p. M. Eastern the evening session kicks off. Watch live on cspan, Live Streaming and on demand at cspan. Org, or listen with the free cspan radio app. Before the conventions evening paston, watch for Convention Speeches by prominent politicians, howard baker, pat buchanan, former secretary of ll, and formerwe secretary of state condoleezza rice. The start of the Republican Convention monday. Only on cspan. Your unfiltered view of politics