Transcripts For CSPAN Washington Journal 08092020 20240712

Please leave your name and the city you are calling from. Also, social media, cspanwj is our twitter handle. Com giving thell. Basic contours of what happened yesterday. On saturday President Donald Trump signed a series of executive actions intended to extend and expand covid19 relief, including extending payroll tax collection and boosting unemployment benefits. It is not clear the Legal Authority under which the president was acting, which came at a News Conference in his in new jersey at his country club in host those are the basics. We will get to the details in a moment. From the president yesterday at this event in new jersey on why he did this. [video clip] democrats are actively blocking the things we want and what we want is good for people. Support for k12 schools so that they can open. Inc. Of that. The, direct payments at 3400 for a family of or bang. Ofs, funding for family four. Plus, funding for Mental Health care and you need that when you have so much of a lockdown. Rental assistance. Support for Community Banks and Credit Unions to help them divide 100 billion in loans to the hardest hit communities, including Rural Communities and farmers. They dont want anyone to get that. Democrats are obstructing all of it. Therefore we are going to provide relief to the american. Orkers host to the details from the Washington Post. They say that one of the measures he signed aims to provide 400 in weekly unemployment aid for millions of americans. 25 host another document signed by trump on saturday looks to defer payroll tax for people who earn less than 100,000 per year. The impact of this measure would depend on whether companies decide to comply. They could be responsible for withdrawing the money from paychecks when those are due. One more passage here in the post, host first, your reaction. Robert is on the line. Independent caller, good morning, what do you think of the president s actions . I think his actions are more of a show. He has no power to implement anything. I think its all for show. He doesnt really have a plan. Juliet is on the line from rockport, massachusetts. Hey, juliet. Donald trump is brilliant as usual, circumventing congress, taking the message directly to the American People. Strategic, and how can democrats reject this platform . Yes, perhaps he has taken it upon himself to act executive ly and itexecutive may not be able to pass, but the message goes to the people who see how Obstructionist Congress is being and there is just no one that will come through in a fashion that is going to see that if this fails the American People, this is a big win for President Trump and i think that strategic this allencompassing strategy, its going to work, painting them into a corner, im afraid it is going to fail. Thank you for taking my call. On the democrats line. Marvin, the sick the president signed a series of executive actions yesterday to were,eople afloat, as it during this pandemic. Will it work . Iat do you think . Caller think it is a ploy, to put it in , to say that. I was listening to the cholera couple of minutes ago, it aint going to work. Nowhey give him that power, he can sign executive orders for everything. Congress are the ones that hold the purse, you know . They delegate the money. Untilt wont past november. The only thing it will do is cause confusion. Telling the congress and the senate to stay in session until something gets signed, this is a political tour and i dont think it is going to work. Its causing indecisiveness in this country. We have to be reunited on all fronts. Republicans and democrats. This is the first stop where we have been divided and it is causing the problem. These are the messages that are coming through, putting people on one plane. Lots more of your calls coming in, but reaction from the hill, here is Speaker Pelosi and Chuck Schumer in the senate today. Todays meager announcement shows president does not comprehend the seriousness or the emergency of the health and economic crisis facing working families and these announcements do nothing to increase testing, reopen schools, put food on the table for hungry families, prevent heroes host that is from the Democratic Leaders in congress. Heres a republican caller from geneva, north carolina. Whats the name of your town . Caller [indiscernible] host whats your reaction to the president s announcement yesterday . Im strongly concerned about what happens to the people renting when the people that rent dont feel they have to pay rent, because they have paid. The Small Business person at great risk of going payr because they cannot their insurance, their taxes, and their mortgage. Need help. Andrew, your thoughts on the president s actions . Will they help . Will they make a difference . Caller im not really sure. I dont think its going to make a lot of difference. What i believe is in the federal tax cut. Those taxes are the lifeblood of Social Security and medicare. Maybe not today, but in a short time its going to start affecting seniors, people with disabilities. Life blood of those programs. Trump when he was running for president said he would never mess with them. Thats it, thats all she gets. It accounts for so much of their income. Reelected, he might keep it in place . You know what hes doing, hes just trying to do what he always wanted. Get rid of Social Security, get rid of medicare. What about the seniors, the gig workers . That 1200at loved it helped the economy. People were able to help the economy and pay down their debt. Theres no 1200 anymore for the people that really, really that was important to them. What do you make of the fact that congress has not been able to make a deal on a new bill and say that they will come back if something is reached, what do you think of that . I think that mark meadows, being such a tea party there is absolutely not going to be more than 1 trillion, whatever. Orders. Executive 20 republicans dont want anything. Plenty of them absolutely dont want to do anything. Mitch mcconnell, with the stunt know, thats you what hes trying to stay away from this. Nancy pelosi, i could say there is something in there, but they are ready to go down and go below 2 trillion as long as money gets to the state. Not the states paying 25 of peoples unemployment that he has lowered to 400. You know, the schools, thats 13 billion for schools. Thats not going to cut it. Let me tell you host andrew, you made a lot of points there, let me get some other people in. Here is joe bidens response to other president did yesterday. More therefrom biden, the executive orders that were signed. Payroll taxes partially fund Social Security. Heres Mitch Mcconnell, on the executive order. Host here is the headline from wall street journal, trump extends unemployment benefit at 400 a week. Heres more from the president , yesterday. [video clip] Congressional Democrats have stonewalled our efforts to they evens relief and oppose measures that would give bonuses to workers returning to the job. They were totally opposed to that. Im taking action to provide additional or extra 400 per week and expanded benefits. 400, ok . Want toenerous, but we take care of our people. It wasnt their fault, it was chinas fault. States will be asked to cover 25 of the costs using existing funding, like the tens of billions of dollars available to them under the Coronavirus Relief fund. The federal government will cover 75 of the costs. We are all set up. Its 400 per week. We are doing that without the democrats. We should have been able to do it easily, but they want all of these additional things that have nothing to do with helping people. Jersey,dminster, new yesterday. Larry, florida, your reaction to the president s actions yesterday . Caller yeah, good morning, cspan. Good morning. I just wanted to voice my opinion. I never heard nothing about the stimulus package. Know, us people here, i dont think thats going to fly. Because a lot of people ate going to go back to work when you can make more money setting home. I hope you dont cut me off, i got the call one other time before and your partner there pedro cut me off. Point,d to make a something for people to think about out there, i think a lot of these calls that are coming in our plants. Most people cant right now i cant hardly say everything that i want to say because you dont have time, but these people that go on for 10 minutes and dont even take a breath, they got everything wrote down what they going to say and i truly believe that a lot of these are professional callers. Host we do understand the point, but this is your chance to speak now about the policy, so why dont you go ahead . Caller i get that. You are missing my point, changing the subject, you dont want to believe what im saying. Host actually, larry, i will give you one more chance. I do understand the point, i did say that, but the point right now is the question we are asking about the president s actions. Do you want to talk about that . Caller yes, i do. I just want to say that trump is a gift from god and thank you very much, i knew you was going to cut my off me off. Have a good day. Host well, larry finishes call without getting cut off, just for the record. Carolyn, good morning. Whats your reaction to the president . Caller i very much resent how trump,ney that president back in february, when he should have been taking care of these things, he was playing golf. Still playing golf. He is lazy and doesnt give a me,that people like elderly people like me who depend upon medicare, who depend upon the money i have already ,orked for and am entitled to all of that. If hes playing golf . Hes all of that. And hes playing golf . Hes playing golf. How much of this is his fault from february when he didnt observe the warnings of covid, he was playing golf. Hes still and he is lazy. He does not do his homework. He is directly affecting my welfare and wellbeing. Carolyn, thank you for calling. Bernie is calling. Why you are defending yourself, i dont understand. When someone rants and lanes that you are not being fair, its so obvious hes offbase. Dont defend yourself, let him rant. As far as the president is concerned, its transparent. The country has to understand, or should understand if you are looking, there is only one thing that this man wants. Its for himself. Hes not willing to sacrifice for the country. Its donald trump. Its all about donald trump. Its a good thing that hes not as smart as mussolini. Because if he was, we would really have a problem. We do. We still have a problem. This is about donald trump. Congress at a stalemate, they point out here that it was not clear the authority that mr. Trump had to act on his own on the measures or what immediate effect if any it would have, but his decision assign the measures billed relief for student borrowers and 400 a week, with the unemployed ebony is calling now. Plattsburgh, new york. Hello. I just wanted to know, does the executive order last . There never was a date on there. How long it is supposed to last or anything. On variouspends provisions. Just going back to the New York Times story. There were different dates floating around. Tell us more about what you think about what the president did. Caller i feel like he took things into his own hands to try to come up with a mutual deal for people to be able to collect unemployment, but they are still like, you know, able to like go to work. , i just feel like it is definitely going to help, especially since im a black, im an africanamerican, and black, that does, like, im unable to operate a business or do anything. Feel like a sense of , because iittle bit would have been able to receive it. But other than that, the other stuff, like for the people who are older age, i feel like [indiscernible] do [indiscernible] relief. Host to ebonys question on the , theloyment relief president plans to provide unemployment relief to millions of americans. States,ld come from the fema funds would be a host so, thats what he had to say there about that lets go back to the president , yesterday, where he was asked about the states, the governors, kicking in 25 of the benefits. [video clip] which governors have said they would sign on . Dont, if theyy dont, they dont. The states have the money, its sitting there. Host we will see how that plays out with the states and we will see many governors reacting today. Of theresley, Chairman Senate finance committee reacting to this. Strategycratic jeopardizes certainty, the American People need to pay their bills host more reaction from congress, there. Rocky is calling clearwater. Caller trump is trying his best, you know . If he signs a bill to get people to open, you are not giving him enough credit. The guy is doing everything he can. That guy, biden, they try to make him look all good. He cant even speak right, if you ever heard him talk. Like on those commercials, 25, 35 before he gets it right. Thats what he doesnt want to have a thing with trump where he goes back and forth. Trump is doing a great job. Me, in florida, people like they are coming from new york and buying these homes left and right, all around, where i live. The prices are going up. You know, some places are maybe doing bad. They are not giving him enough credit. Making him look like the baddest guy in the world. And trying the best he can all of these democrats are putting him there to try to make eye look like make biden look like hes great. The guy doesnt even know how to speak right. Trump, trump is going to make him look like a fool, i know he is. A lot of people think the same way. Host thanks. Will is calling on the republican line. Good morning, will. This action was necessary because of the partisan gridlock that is currently freezing everything going on in washington. I would like to put out a misnomer about the unemployment benefits. The cares act expired on july 31, the benefits actually ceased on the previous saturday, july 25, because unemployment weeks go sunday to saturday. It expired on a friday. The whole week vanished. We are entering now our third week of people receiving benefits and this money is going directly back into the economy. These people are not making investments or going on vacation. They are surviving on the money. Florida depends on the service and hospitality industries. I know of hotels running at only 30 when historically they run at 90 . I had a dinner out last week for a birthday at a National Chain restaurant that served 14 covers the entire evening. Herecans are not traveling because of spite. Florida depends on tourism money. I cant speak for the rest of the country, but you know, the point ofdia missed the when the benefits expired and now it is desperate again about when they will pick back up. You forll, thank calling. Back to the earlier question about dates, the wall street journal talking about these extra jobless benefits. They say the added benefits will be paid from the Disaster Relief fund, like we talked about. Sets asides actions 45 billion in the fund host so, more precisely, december 6 what we are reading in the wall street journal. Jason is calling from lynn, massachusetts. Thank you for waiting, independent caller. Caller pelosi didnt want to give the president when. The enhanced unemployment benefit had to be reduced. Thats something that had to be done because we are hearing, and i know you are hearing it, people are having a hard time with people at home making more on unemployment than they would on their regular job. The enhanced benefit had to be reduced and it was only reduced by a third. The second point is, if, we could be sitting here right now talking about expired benefits and the unemployed in turmoil and upside down next week. The talks broke down, President Trump acted. Thats the bottom line. Whether he can do certain things in his relief package by executive order is still not clear, but hes trying to give money to the people in trying to incentivize to get back to work because doors are opening. We are not shut down like florida. Theres no reason that an employer who needs people where jobs are available should have to fight for the extra money to say that i cant staff right now. It makes us stagnant. I think the president did something thats a step in the right direction. They want to come back to the table . At least there is money flowing to the people that need it right now. Massachusetts,om there. Much has been made so far over the last 24 hours in which the president did this. Why 400 instead of 600 . Heres what he had to say about it yesterday. [video clip] this is the money they need, the money they want, giving them a great incentive to go back to work. The 600 was a number that was there and as you know, there was difficulty with the 600 number because it really was a disincentive. Sharon, inglewood, california, on the line for democrats, thank you for calling. Caller im calling because im a senior and President Trump, im appalled by this. Hes going into the Medicare Part of our insurance and taking money from that fund. I worked my whole life and im very upset by the fact that this man decided to go in here and do this. Seniors cannot afford medicare test for cannot afford venison, housing, food. For him to do Something Like this to the people is abhorrent. He needs to be ashamed of himself. Host anything else, sharon . Done, ifm pretty much i say anything else, i will probably be off the air. Im very livid. T understood, sherilyn sharon. Chuck, the president s plan, with a work and will it withstand legal muster . I really think its time that leaders need to look out for the people and move forward. Its one issue. We have thousands of issues and they are going to take all this time on one issue when it really ought to be just moving on to the next of whats needed for the people. Think about the people first and not their personal agenda. Thank you for calling. Host thanks. Whereco. Com is this story they pull together reactions from members of congress. Lamar alexander, chiding democrats for holding up the bill and not supporting the president host not strictly a partisan affair, here. Lee, calling from South Portland , now, democratic caller, good morning. Im just wondering about this tax cut trump is going to give all these workers. It wont help the people that arent working and the people that are, what happens next year when they file their income taxes and they money. Money they will have to pay. Think hes a real idiot, thats what i think. Go to jerry, elizabethtown, good morning. That donaldmazes me president. Iling as a its because of his incompetence , his negligence, about the coronavirus in the beginning, when it was first discussed. He made jokes about it. He made a political. He captive political. And people have died. Have become sick. And now he thinks he can make it , because he is hising in the polls and use ink pen to buy votes. Its disgusting. Let me ask you, one of the points that he made is that hes doing this because congress cannot get their act together to come up with a brandnew bill. What do you make of the failure of congress to come up with a new bill . Caller i really do believe congress is looking out for the best interests of the American People. He doesnt care. He doesnt understand what congress is trying to, they are trying to give the people an extra 200 a week and that makes a huge difference for families. It, it, it doesnt matter to him. He doesnt care. Order isn executive strictly to buy votes. As ase hes failing president and hes failing in the polls and i think its terrible. More calls in a couple of minutes here. To the caller asking more about the payroll tax, the wall this ournal has host a little bit more from the president on that piece of his action yesterday. [video clip] first of all, im providing a payroll tax holiday to americans learning less than 100,000 per year and i will sign an instructive allowing the department to allow employers to defer payment of the employee portion of certain payroll taxes from september 1. We are actually going to be making that, we just got word, getting word from a lot of people, we didnt think we would have to do this. We thought the democrats would be reasonable. Not only have they been unreasonable, they been ridiculous. August 1, most likely. We will let you know the exact date. Looking at like august 1. August 1 through the end of 2020, it will mean bigger paychecks for working families as we race to produce a vaccine and eradicate the china virus once and for all. We are doing very good with the numbers. Its going down in arizona substantially and rapidly. Going down in texas, florida. Other areas are propping up, but we are watching them closely. We understand the disease and are watching the mostly, especially the Senior Citizens residence. If im victorious i plan to forgive these taxes and make permanent cuts to the payroll tax. Im going to make them all permanent. Joe biden and the democrats may not that. They dont want that, they are adding 3 trillion in taxes. So, they will have the option of raising the taxes and taking this away. But if i win, i may extend and terminate. In other words i will extend it beyond the end of the year and terminate the tax. Host watch that whole event therefrom the president , out of new jersey at his golf course. You can watch the whole thing on cspan. Org, all of it against the backdrop of the u. S. Reaching 5 million coronavirus cases in the last several hours. Two it is calling from South Carolina. Republican caller, good morning. Dewitt is calling from South Carolina. Republican caller, good morning. What would you like to say about the president s action . Guest caller [indiscernible] security. I cant work now, im 79 years old. [indiscernible] i dont understand this. What would you like to see congress do at this point . We have been talking about the president s action, but what are you looking for from congress . Caller take care of the older people, you know . Anything else . Caller thats all. Lets move on to david in liverpool, new york. Caller i see this as nothing but a ploy. The republicans were not going to do anything the beginning. Toy waited until two weeks put out a meaningless bill that did nothing to help the states. I mean all the states are putting out money to battle the covid19. How are they going to open schools . How are these people going to open schools . I live in new york. We have a. 5 rate. You know . You go down to florida and you got 10 . How are they going to open their schools . We are tentative about opening our schools. We stealingtax, from Social Security and medicare for. The republicans have come up with nothing. As usual. Nothing. I just dont understand what is going on. And if you are an older person, how are you going to vote for trump . I dont understand. James thank you. James, good morning. Caller just before me, this is what i was calling in about. Socials arity. Im 64 years old. I retired a few years ago. Ive been working since i was about 14. I grew up in new york. Cuttings talked about the payroll tax. I heard his speech yesterday and he said that if he if it works out, he might make it permanent. When he first got elected, he said that he was going to try to [inaudible] right . I said to myself how can you say that without realizing that so many depend on Social Security . They have worked their whole lives. Support. And have some so they dont go through poverty. Disruptays he wants to that as well as medicare. I just dont understand how people are not listening. Americans are not listening. White americans, black americans, spanish americans, yellow americans, it doesnt matter. They are all wealthy up there, they dont need Social Security and if they get it, its a bonus check in their pocket. But for us that depend on it . That was the plan. Work your life, pay into the system. It would help if you could be a millionaire, getting 50,000 year, 40,000 year, 20,000 a year. Whatever, i just dont understand how people, even the Trump Supporters who vote for him in the rural areas, i dont understand how they are not even listening to what this guy is saying. Hes trying to disrupt the Social Security and medicare programs. It just doesnt make any sense. Bobby writes this on twitter host more from that story, with the reaction from joe biden to all of this, it is in thehill. Com. The Presumptive Democratic nominee said that unlike the 2012 payroll tax plan put forward by the obama in this ration Obama Administration host this story points out that one of the biden tax proposals would increase the payroll tax rate for people making over 400,000. Manchester, New Hampshire on the line now. Good morning. All, trump isof not a gift from god. Hes from the exact opposite. To me its a campaign ploy, once again. The republicans are all behind it who support him. Its not all republicans supporting him. It is my understanding that one of his white house advisors was in that meeting thats been going on with republicans and democrats over the stimulus package. The one thing i have not heard from anybody, other than all of these people who are making more money than anything, you know, who are out working. Nobody has said anything about the people who arent even making what they used to make. They are making more than what they are getting now in unemployment and nobody says anything about it. So, its like what about those to make tons of money and now they are getting little unemployment checks . They should have just kept it at 600. Set up forbody was that at now they have to have a complicated thing for some states to produce it. Thats the other thing. I havent heard anything, i didnt hear anything about the states getting any support from the government in that package. Thanks for your thoughts, susan. More about the number of coronavirus cases in the country. The New York Times had a piece on this. Host here is randy, from georgia. Good morning. Good morning cap caller good morning, cspan. Can you hear me . Host yes, go ahead. The executive orders from President Trump will no doubt help many americans. No doubt about that. But my other point was i recall how ecstatic the democrats were when i think this first at ative order came up state of the union when president obama said it and i recall democrats and people like maxine waters, like screaming. That was when the pandoras box got opened. If any democrat would like to respond, i would love to hear it. Thank you, randy. Part of the president s actions yesterday dealt with evictions. Heres what he had to say about what he signed. [video clip] forinancial assistance struggling renters, lenders, homeowners, helping to keep americans safely in their homes. We dont want people being evicted. The actor that im signing will solve that problem largely, hopefully completely. Host and from the Washington Post right up on all of this this, on all of host that is what is in the order according to the reporting. Steve, you are in l. A. Your reaction to all of this and will it help . Caller first of all, i have been a republican, but im switching to democrat for the upcoming election first of all, this is all for votes, all for the camera. He has had two days at his country club, golfing, to do this little press conference in between, which is just a campaign stop. Im on unemployment and the 600, plus what i was getting from the state, really helps. I have to tell you, the 400 is a sham. Its 400 but its really 300 because already the governors are saying they dont have any money. They have to use it for other things. They are not now going to give 100 to each person in addition to the regular unemployment they are giving out. They said they dont want any part of it. Most governors have already reacted. Anyway, 20 republicans, we are not for this. That has to be mentioned. Every time trump talks, every word is bashing the democrats. I dont really care, but make sense and tell the truth. He never does, he just lies. Been onw long have you unemployment . Guest since it caller since april . Host how have you been getting by . Caller theres nothing happening. Im in the entertainment business. Concerts. This bill, the democrats were working with the republicans on it, it has been on Mitch Mcconnells task for two months. Why does he wait until the end, like the end of when its going to expire . For them to finally talk about it . Why wasnt it talked about a month and a half ago eschenbach host you said you were a month and a half ago . Host you said you were switching parties. Did you vote for President Trump . Caller no, i didnt. Pointwas there a certain where a certain time, point, or event that made you say that this is it, im switching . Caller the lying. Our people just stupid . You literally add lives. In our business, i work with seniors, its something called as living. Adlibbing. Hes great at that but he doesnt remember half the stuff that he makes up. Like i said, this has been on the desta Mitch Mcconnell for two months. Why bring it up at the end . They wanted a oneweek reprieve, remember, the republicans . The democrats said no. They want to deal with it now and get it done for many months. To do bandaids for shortterm situations. If they had gotten a week, we would have still done at the same place because look, week later, still no results. What was that going to accomplish . Feel hes not a gift from god, hes more like satan. Thanks for calling. A couple of more comments as we wrap up the top of the hour. The trump stimulus orders dont seem to be feasible or legal based on legal experts. The president did acknowledge that there might be some legal action against what he did yesterday. He doesnt feel those people would win. We will see what happens. Liz, calling from. , pennsylvania. Rie, pennsylvania. Caller the optics for whatever it was called yesterdays totally wrong. Heres the president spending a weekend at his own golf course on the dime of the taxpayer. Whatever hes doing with people who can pay 300 and 50,000 to be a member, i dont know, but i think he needs to get into a food line, talk to the people , whore really unemployed need the 600 dollars rather than 400 or 300 and then go from there. If our legislature cannot get it together, we need to start reducing their salaries. We need people who are going to work for the American People. Not democrats, not republicans, not red state, not blue state, but the American People. Its ridiculous now how things in washington with this president. Host you may have heard of klaus yesterday at the president s News Conference. Also the one that he held friday evening. Reuters tried to capture some of this in a photo so that you can visualize what was going on there. This photo published in the post, members at the President Trump private golf club in the back here, listening in during this impromptu News Conference. You could see them looking this way, the president in the opposite direction. ,e told the trump gathered defying state guidelines in new jersey, that the coronavirus would disappear, but focused little on the health crisis. Much has been made on the talk shows so far about the president mixing members of his private golf club at his club and what was supposed to be a News Conference in the same place. Im sure a lot more will be spoken about that in the coming days. Tennessee. Bristol, go ahead. Forer thank you very much taking my call and being a saint and listening to all of these people with different dialects. Host its our job. Caller right now you get the east coast, they are awake. [laughter] everyone is hearing the same thing. They are all hearing the words coming out of his mouth. They are looking to find out if its true or not. He keeps saying the election is going to be stolen. Saying the press is phony. I guess that would include you guys. Even fox, he doesnt like anymore. Who does he really like anymore . I dont know. They should be easy to disprove. You complaint them off one by one. All you have to do is show what he said the day before and then today he says he didnt say it. It happens every day, it seems. So, thats just one thing. I dont think people understand that the 6 reprieve they are getting, on a good paycheck, 1000 a week, thats 60 bucks. 60, that doesnt even put a dent in your grocery bill for a single person. Im single, i just finished my chemotherapy. Im barely getting by. Im getting bills that are for more than i made it a decade. If it wasnt for the government medicare, out with my because im on disability because of the cancer, i dont know what i would do. The one thing i really want to know about is that if we each, each one of us, whoever got the actuallyw much of that gets applied return . You know, like some people say it helps the economy. Well, does it really . And if so, why dont they keep it up . How much of that actually keeps us going and gets recycled, in a way, i guess . Like a percentage. Out of that 1200, we each went out and did our groceries and bought a garden hose or whatever the heck we needed to do, to get through that week, you know . A loaf of bread . Crazy glue, whatever the heck it is, i guess people are just buying necessities. But you know, necessities mean somebody who makes crazy glue, not a necessity, hes going to have a tough time at his job. How much of this actually gets host thank you for calling from bristol, tennessee. Good luck to you with your treatments, kenny from bristol. Thank you to everybody who called in in the past hour. We will take a short break. When we come back on washington journal, we will talk with aaron thees, editor of large of 19th news. A new organization aimed at women, discussing the role of women in campaign 2020. Well talk about the 75th anniversary of the dropping of the atomic bomb on the japanese city of nagasaki, which came three days after hiroshima. We will be right back in a couple of minutes. Manhattan on q a, Institute President ryan examines the question on whether another exodus is ahead for u. S. Cities, due to the coronavirus pandemic and civil unrest. My fear is you will see a period from 1980 to 2020 when you saw this tremendous prosperity in a number of major urban centers. And that 2020 and beyond, if we dont approach this in a thoughtful, careful way, could represent a reversal in which that economic activity, that talent that flooded into our cities, starts to flood out of our cities. Tonight at 8 00 eastern on cspans q a. Hasspan is covered covered every minute of every Political Convention since 1984 and we are not stopping now. This months Political Conventions will be like none other in history. ,ith the coronavirus pandemic plans for both gatherings are being altered. The democrats will nominate joe biden as their president ial candidate the week of august 17. President trumbull except his partys nomination the following week. Watch cspan for live coverage of the Democratic Convention starting on monday, august 17th. And the republican Convention Starting monday on august 24. Live streaming and ondemand at cspan. Org or listen with the three cspan radio app. Cspan, your unfiltered view of politics. Washington journal continues. Host joining us now is aaron thes, editor at large of 19th. 19th news. Org is the upside. A first time guest, welcome to washington journal. Guest thank you so much for having me. I am so happy to be here. Host thank you for watching. We look forward to hearing about your new organization. Tell us about the 19th. How did it get started . What is the mission . Just the 19th began before the iowa caucuses. The idea was born about four years ago right after the 2016 elections. Had anraham shaw election where we saw in juice issues of gender on full display. Nomination and yet the narrative around gender was with that election were the same as they have been for so many cycles. Questions around electability, likability. Four years later, we started to see, even with six women and a certain number of women running for president , the same narratives and tropes again. Factoring their way into the election cycle. Emily felt an urgent need to create a newsroom where women were discussed, not just as a special Interest Group but as the majority of the electorate and as a growing number of the folks who are represented in our government. So, she and our publisher, amanda, launched on trying to make this vision well real. A year later, here we are. Host how are you folks funded and how many people are working with you . Guest in the midst of a pandemic, our newsroom has grown so much since january. We officially launched one week ago today. With a staff of nearly two dozen. We have a mix of funders. Whoave private donors support us. We are a nonprofit business model. Donate have members who as little as 19, who are very much a part of our support. We also have corporate sponsorship. Put the phone numbers on the bottom of the screen for our guest and we look forward to hearing from you. Tell us a little bit about your background. Where were you and what were you doing before the 19th . Guest actually, i have been in journalism. For a couple of decades. At a training program, actually. With the Tribune Company of the los angeles times. I was a minority training fellow. That was when i began to write about issues of race. I did that as an intern at a small black paper in atlanta, which is my hometown, the atlanta daily world. For much of my career, i have been focused on issues of race. An area ofing interest i have had for the entire time i have been a journalist. In atlanta, a lot of that was reflecting on the legacy of the civil rights movement. The gains of that era. I focus on the lack electorate and historically black colleges, the professional black middle class. And then i started covering politics in 2008 with the historic election of barack obama. I covered the georgia legislature, the Virginia Legislature for the Washington Post. I came to philadelphia about five years ago, which is my new adopted hometown which i love so much. Hello to everybody out there who islls philadelphia home or from philadelphia. Ira about urban affairs in philadelphia as well and then i wrote about urban affairs in philadelphia as well and then got the job i wanted. I became a National Writer on race in america. A huge platform, tremendously humbling. The covered everything from emerging black lives Matter Movement to, you know, the socalled Postracial America to the hyper racial moment in this country i think we now find ourselves. I did that until january, which i like to tell people is my new dream job. I get to lean fully into my experience as a black woman and bring that to the journalism are i am doing, where we building the culture that frankly a lot of us wish we had had a lot earlier in our careers. Host our guest is editor at large of the 19th. Errin haines, we noticed 19 news. Org, the number 19 has an actually asked an asterisk. What is the purpose of that . Guest as we prepare to celebrate the centennial of woman suffrage, which is august 18, we are very excited about that anniversary. We have a newsroom that his named for the 19th amendment, which ratified suffrage for some women but not all women. The asterisk is an acknowledgment of the black women who were frankly excluded from full access and had to fight trice twice as hard for their rights. Before we get to calls for theguest at the 19th, outsized importance of joe bidens Vice President ial pick, appease here says there is a feeling that this woman has to be the woman that gets it across the finish line. Otherwise, the story is that a woman could not get it done again. Tell us why you wrote this. Went into 2020we feeling like this was going to be the most consequential election that we have ever covered. And yet that has taken on a greater sense of urgency with , coronavirus and racism. The vice presidency is a role we have seen expanding in recent cycles, and given the challenges the country faces, feels like a role that is going to be even more important than it usually is. People paying more attention, and not just those of us in the media class. Certainly a lot of voters i talked to, especially women that i talked to, as a became apparent that none of the six women running for president were going to be nominee, they set their sights on a number two thought and wanting a woman to be a nominee. Joe biden said he would put a woman on the ticket as his running mate which is fueled so much of the speculation we have seen over the past few months. He is expected to make a decision. That could happen as soon as this week. A decision and an announcement are not necessarily happening at the same time. Two things are happening this year. Joe biden is running for president of the third time. For the third time, it will be a as vice the ticket president. As much as we make of the fact that there has never been a woman president , there has never been a woman Vice President either. There has never been a woman of color nominated for Vice President. This is a really consequential moment that prevented presents both the opportunity to make history and defeat President Trump, which is a lot of what a lot of democratic voters, especially women were telling me on the campaign trail. Host a look at the electorate, forall 54 of women voted Hillary Clinton, 41 for donald trump. White women with a college degree, 51 clinton, 44 trump. White women with no college degree, 34 percent for clinton. 61 for trump. Black women with a college degree, 92 for clinton, and black women with no college degree, 95 for clinton. Clearly black females voting largely for Hillary Clinton. Take us to 2020. Do you see those numbers changing much during the cycle . Guest i think it is an open question for white women. I will tell you the black women i have spoken to on the campaign trail, particularly in South Carolina and other Southern States are absolutely galvanized with the idea that they want donald trump out of office. Just said, did not support him in 2016 and do not plan to support him in any large numbers in 2020. I think that we can expect to see that. This is what black women do in elections. They turn out in huge numbers. They are the Democratic Partys most loyal and consistent voters. They are the ones who, frankly, were responsible for joe biden becoming the presumptive nominee weeks ahead of schedule. Showing up in record numbers in some of these primaries that were happening in the midst of a pandemic. We at the 19th news are reporting on white women, especially the conservative women who support President Trump in 2020, to see if they plan on reupping that support in 2020. We are hearing from some that they are still committed to this president. Despite some of the frederick around rhetoric around race and some of the other issues that have been divisive, they are still with him. They believe the economy will maybe turn around as he says in the midst of the pandemic and are trying to kind of wrestle with a lot of what they have seen over the past four years. President trump came into office in 2016, a lot of people were taking a waitandsee approach. It that they have seen that is something of concern to some white women voters, especially suburban women voters. I think particularly amid this National Reckoning on race where i think a lot of americans, particularly white americans are asking themselves who and what it means to be a citizen right now in this country. Host first call for our guest, errin haines at the 19th. We have calvin from clearfield, pennsylvania. Democratic caller. Good morning, calvin. Caller good morning. Guest hi, calvin. Caller i have a question for you. People think joe biden, as far as running for buys preston, Vice President , how many will he put on Vice President for the democrat at baller for the november election . Women for Vice President , would he take maybe three to four women or will it be five . Be about hime odds picking more than three women for Vice President on the democratic ballot for the election . If im hearing youre right, i think youre asking about the Vice President , who he is going to pick to be his Vice President. Which is, again, a decision that we could get as soon as this week. The Democratic National Convention Starts next week. The expectation was that there will be a Vice President ial nominee by then. It is still, it seems to be up in the air in terms of who that woman will be. There are several women of color, several black women on that list. And the core has gotten louder, which is why i mentioned for a black woman to be on the ticket with joe biden, the Party Feeling diversity is important, especially during the National Reckoning on race. But also because coronavirus is disproportionately affecting communities of color. In thinking about somebody who would be ready to govern on day one, a lot of people are telling me that they believe a black ofan, both because experience and because of the impeccable resumes of so many would be this list, the best thing joe biden could do, not just from a governing standpoint but also to galvanize black women in the way that he would need to defeat President Trump in november. Host is there a stand out among those women in your view . I should have asked, does the 19th have an editorial . I dont editorialize. We dont do that. We prefer to appeal to our membership with the facts. Host got it. Lets hear from janice omma democratic caller, good morning. Janice, democratic caller. Good morning. 60 nine euros black woman. This is what trump wants. Theou put a black woman on ballot with joe biden, we are going to lose. We need someone who is qualified. Elizabeth warren is qualified to take on the task if anything happens to biden. Think about it. People,h warren has the ople tornie sanders pe help joe biden. We need a person that is qualified. A woman, yes. Warren fitsrman that ticket. I see the black women up there but they are not as qualified as Elizabeth Warren. Me ask you, what would Elizabeth Warren bring to the ticket that Kamala Harris would not or susan rice would not . Perhaps val demings or karen bass, some of the names of africanamerican women out there, what can you see particularly different about her and them . Caller are you asking me . Host yes. Caller this is what i am seeing. Deep in our heart, Elizabeth Warren is a fighter. She is a fighter for all races. She is a fighter for the underdog. She has been there. Those women that you just named, he just named, i love them all but they are not qualified. We need someone on that ticket that is going to bring all races together. She is the one qualified. Host thank you for calling. Errin haines, strong for Lisbeth Warren. Guest listen, paul. Let me tell you. Janice is something articulate and something i have heard from black women voters. Polling has indicated that while there is not necessarily consensus around which black woman, for those who say they want a black woman, the range varies as far as which black woman they would want. In terms of the white woman that black women voters would become to what with, resoundingly that woman is Lisbeth Warren. On the campaign trail, i heard over and over again from black women voters who were open to a Lisbeth Warren from a heart Elizabeth Warren from a heart standpoint as opposed to a head standpoint. They felt like joe biden was in the best position to defeat donald trump but Elizabeth Warren had ideas that resonated with them. They hurt her on the campaign trail, talking about systemic heard her on the campaign trail, talking about systemic racism. So, this is somebody who, despite being a white woman, they feel like she is somebody who would use her privilege to govern on behalf of black women. Host errin haines, i meant to do what do you make or what you think is next following the s signing of the executive orders dealing with covid19 relief. . What do you think is next . Caller i will look for how guest i will look for how this pandemic continues to affect people of color. We saw racial and gender disparities laid bare, even from the beginning of this pandemic, both from a Public Health standpoint and an economic standpoint. I think the same is true as the country is beginning to reopen, in terms of who can go back to school. Who can go back to work and who is unemployed. Whois housing insecure and is food insecure. I think that we do have to keep all of those things on the radar. What i am hearing from voters is that the pandemic is absolutely political. Whichf the ways in peoples elected officials from the federal government down are responding to this pandemic is going to have an impact on the ballot box, i believe. Host lets hear from barbara in michigan, on the republican line. Guest hey, barbara. Caller hi. I almost want to vote democratic. My first statement is the coronavirus information changes day by day because of the science. Day, uponnge every discovery. There was someone who called and said i am a black woman and i cant own a business and i cant do this. I mean, you look pretty profitable to me. You have 2000 workers from the. Hole Coronavirus Campaign i do agree with janice. Actually k they it actually has to be a black woman. That is the racist thing i have ever seen black people do. Want to gete dont the 400, how many black women do you think will not ask for it . Nd take it or black or white men or white women that wont take the money and apply for it . They know the system. They know how to work it. I saw you smile. Matter . , black lives Television Black , not antifag stores , just a black woman Looting Stores for purses . Tit probably wont even fit them. Barbara, calling there. Errin haines, she left a lot on the table to respond to. Why dont you go ahead . Guest what i would first say is to remind people that the unrest you have seen in cities across the country has been overwhelmingly peaceful as people are trying to raise awareness about the very real issues of Racial Disparity and policing in communities of color. That have been put back on the radar, even in the midst of the pandemic, around the death of george floyd, Breonna Taylor and ahmaud arbery. There lootings and destruction of property . Yes, there was some of that. Overwhelmingly, in cities across this country, we have seen the largest peaceful protest in the history of america and sustained over this summer, as people are withy just kind of dealing the open scar that has been new in the midst of this pandemic. That is the first thing i would say. Thinkly, you know, i um, folks folks who, who are wondering why a black woman on the Vice President ial , certainly the people ive talked to on the Democratic Party have been for quite some time. What they say to me is that they have long been the architects of progress in this country, using their vote to move the country forward, not just for themselves or their community or their race but for everyone. And that they often dont get the same return on their investment, if you will. So, really, joe biden choosing a black woman as his running mate would be a signal that he recognizes the contribution of black women and that he values not just their output but their input. Host errin haines, let me show missouri cori bush in on the night of her victory, discussing the view of change needed in washington, d. C. Incumbented longtime lacy clay. Here is a look. As we face down unprecedented crises from covid19 to Police Brutality to auto patrol Climate Change and we have decided how to move forward. Well, tonight, Missouri First has decided that its incremental approach is not going to work any longer. We decided that we were not going to wait any longer for change that is not actually coming. So, we decided that we the people have the answers and we would lead from the front lines. So i say thank you for standing with me. Host errin haines, first tell us more about cori bush. We know she is an activist. Tell us more about her as she springs onto the scene and what is the significance of her victory in missouri . Sig. Gives. A few cori bush is a pastor and a nurse who was an activist in 2014 in ferguson and has continued that activism work and which,tory on tuesday, given the way the lines are then, makes her representative from missouri is the latest victory for the black lives Matter Movement from a politics standpoint. That movementen kind of evolved from protests to talking politics and policy. Especially in missouri. Ferguson just got its first black woman mayor ever this year, this cycle. So, i think that what she represents is part of that evolution. We have seen prosecutors across with antry being elected black lives matter agenda in mind in places like philadelphia, where i now live. In chicago, they got rid of a prosecutor who was involved in andlaquan mcdonald case subsequent coverup. Message hasow, my gone the mayor of ferguson. This is the first time it is going from the streets of protest to the halls of congress. After she she ousted a 10 term congressman who comes from a dynasty in that state. It is a huge deal in that state but also in black politics and also the black lives Matter Movement. Host we have brenda on the line from georgia, independent color. Hey, brenda. Caller how are you doing and thank you for having me . I want to address the last caller, what she was saying about the black women looting the stores and all of that. No, yes, some of that is true. I have seen white people running out of the stores too, white women and they are outsiders. Let me address the black woman on the ticket. I am up black woman. Heart,ing honest from my because black women sitting back are holding back and they dont want to tell the truth. If we want to get donald trump be af office, it shouldnt black woman on there, i am not saying the black woman he has are qualified because they are. But lets tell the truth. The white men arent going to vote for them. They will sit back. Arewhite suburbans, they thinking. They will probably stay at home. We have to get trump out of office. I am not looking at well, it is a black woman or white woman whether it is a black woman or a white woman on the ticket. Praying biden sticks through it all the way eight years. We have to be realistic, also. Cuomo from new york would make a better Vice President for us to be donald trump. Ok . They could put a black woman as secretary of state and all the other cabinet positions. Lets be honest. I am telling you, people are nervous. If he puts up black woman on the ticket right now, ok, he is nervous. People are nervous. We need to get trump out of office. That is period. Office,n get him out of get them out of office. Lets be honest. I just dont think were going to beat him if he has a black woman on the ticket. Host thank you for calling. Guest thank you for that. That questionsnk of electability are resurfacing, frankly with the veep conversation and race and gender factor into those questions of electability. Our premise at the 19th is what makes somebody electable is if they get elected. Sayblack women i hear from to me that they plan to vote for joe biden, regardless of who is on the ticket, frankly because they want donald trump out of office. But a Vice President ial running mate who can galvanize the electorate is also something that is important to them and a lot of them do see that person as being a black woman. Biden also say that joe did commit to picking a woman, miss brenda. So, whoever is running mate is, i dont think andrew cuomo qualifies or is going to be on the ticket with him when he announces whoever he announces. Host errin haines, i wanted to get your take on joe biden having to backtrack a comment made in recent days added in pr interview. He was contrasting diversely between the black and latino communities, suggesting africanamerican communities the africanamerican committee is not diverse compared to hispanics. What was he saying or trying to say here . And what is the followup, if any to all of this . Out, if any to all of this . During the came National Association of black to the National Association of hispanic journalist convocation. That happened this week. The in a bj is celebrating its abjs cell running its 45th celebrating its 45th. What joe biden was trying to say is latinos in this country, whether we are talking about cubans or folks from central south america, what have you,aying they are different isinos is an umbrella that married geographically that varies geographically. As opposed to African Americans many of whom feel that they have a shared cultural experience, and also tend to vote overwhelmingly democratic. Voted intinos 2016 for donald trump. He was trying to make that contrast, did not do the best job of it and got some backlash on social media and the Campaign Circle back and he had to say he was not trying to imply that the black community is not diverse because it certainly is. We certainly say in our that black voters are not a monolith. He took the point, responded to it. It was certainly a moment that raised some eyebrows. News. Org, a 19th story with Kamala Harris, black women insist that biden write us into history. Interviews with adoption a dozen strategists revealed that voters believe selecting a black woman to be Vice President is a requirement and not a recommendation. Contrast that to some of the callers we got in the last 10 to 15 minutes. Guest thank you for giving me my bow to fix. I missed the campaign so much. Hearing from folks who are voters or potential voters are in the or are not process is so critical. This has been part of an evolving conversation i have been watching unfold. From the time joe biden said he was going to pick a woman, i was hearing from folks in the activist community, saying he should pick a woman of color. He should pick a black woman. And then the list emerged of who some of those people were on the list. He haswere saying well, several black women who have the that fit thee role, why not pick a black woman is where they are now. The demographics of our country and with the demographics of our party being where they are, that you would have an allwhite or allmale ticket does not reflect the contributions of the base of the Democratic Party. Black women in particular. So, i think that that really is how you have so many of the folks that i have talked to kind of saying that this is no longer a maybe for them. This is a must for them. Happent if this does not , while they still plan on voting for joe biden, black women never go to the polls alone. They take their church, their summer already, their salon ity, their salon, so many institutions that are the cornerstone of the black amenity. Black women are able to galvanize in their election cycle. For them to put this election on their back in the way that they could and have done in previous cycles, i think that they are looking to see something different. They are looking for him to potentially make history and at a black woman to the ticket. Host a little more than 20 minutes left with our guest, patty from harrisburg, pennsylvania on the line. Caller how are you doing . Host good. Caller i am registered democrat because i have to vote for one or the other. I support biden. I wish he had specified who the Vice President would be. And the fall efficiency is qualifications he is looking for. Trump has done so much damage to this country. [indiscernible] i think she would have been a great Vice President. For patty, thank you calling. It is interesting. I think because joe biden became the presumptive nominee as early as he did, we had a lot of time to think about this whole question about who should be the Vice President. A lot of people wanted him to name somebody fairly quickly after he became it became obvious he was going to become the nominee. That heere surprised said as early as he did that he was going to pick a woman. Usually, yes, candidates say that kind of thing as a surprise in the announcements. Was a think for him, it recommendation of the majority of the electorate. The other thing is, i would say that as it became apparent that it would be a contest between two white men in their 70s, that was not something that was very appetizing to a lot of the base of the Democratic Party, despite having a historic six women running for president this cycle and the most diverse field of Democratic Candidates that the party has ever seen. Host betty, calling from virginia beach. Betty you are on the line with errin haines. Good morning to you. Caller good morning. I see you all the time on morning show. I would not normally say my race but i am white and i am saying it for a reason. If i am wrong, you can correct me, a black woman called in and she stated that she was black and that she was for Elizabeth Warren. I cannot stand it was with warren. I want Kamala Harris, hands down. And i am hoping and praying that that is who he is going to pick. I like susan rice but susan rice, i think there will be times that they bring up benghazi. I would love to see Kamala Harris. If i am mispronouncing her name, i apologize for that. Susan rice can be secretary of state or secretary of defense. I hope he does pick her for one of those. Kamala harris, maybe it should not be like this, has a lot of things i call a plus. First of all, she is so sharp. Racepresident obama, mixed , not black and white but black and asian. Also, she happens to be married to a jewish man. I am jewish too. Im not religious. That is not even why i want Kamala Harris. Reasons,ll of those all of those are positives. I dont know if anybody cares who she is married to. There is so much antisemitism out here to nibble. I dont know out here too. I dont know if people would go against her because she happens to be married to a jewish man. Hopefully not. She is so sharp. I have hurt her so many times. I listened to the cavanaugh hearings. She was so sharp on questioning him. She was sharp unquestioning bill barr. Trump, it get rid of will have a nervous breakdown. Her faxd she have right, first of all on the senators background . Guest yes. Ofala harris is the daughter a jamaican american and an Indian American mother. Turnley ks, she certainly talked about the influence her mom had on her life. On the campaign trail, she was the only black woman running for president this cycle. And really was somebody who was presumed to be a front runner when she announced her campaign about a little more than 1. 5 years ago now. That came with a lot of the baggage and not many of the benefits that come with the front runner status. A lot of that did have to do with her race and her gender. Senator harris is also somebody who really has either been at or list,he top of the depending on where your reporting is. The reporting i have been doing has shown her at the top of the list for most of the time the conversation has been happening. As we get in the home stretch, that remains to be true. Susan rice, somebody who emerged at the midway point of this her foreign, for policy credentials but also starting to talk about the idea of racism as a homeland security. Ssue that is something she would have some knowledge of. Even if she has never run for office, she is somebody who could bring governing experience that joe biden might need in a partner. Karen bass, also somebody who has come up very recently as a who could workdy well with the Vice President , they have a relationship obviously from their time in congress. Of thethe chair congressional black caucus. She is also somebody who is seen as being pie partisan, bipartisan, who can work with republicans. Joe biden as indicated before that bipartisanship is something that matters to him. Thaty looking for relationship he is talking about, the kind of dynamic not reppo the dynamic with obama but replicating the dynamic with obama looking for a true partner. Trying to find out which of these women might have that dynamic with is where he is owing into the home stretch. Haines is the editor at large of the 19th. 77 of women hold jobs that require close personal contact. Those jobs account for positions that cannot be easily done remotely like food service, health care, personal service, speak to that particular these but more broadly about your approach at the 19th to coronavirus coverage. How are you looking at this pandemic from a news standpoint . Guest you know how the , among the things it the campaign trail, which vanished beneath our feet by midmarch. And while this was not necessarily the start we thought we would have as a newsroom, that was focused on this huge election this year, i think we realized fairly quickly that women were being disproportionately impacted by the pandemic. In almost every area except death. Line are your front workers in sony cases. So many of the essential workers that we in so many cases. So many of the essential workers we think of our women. The front lines of the sandwich generation, taking care of children while trying to navigate issues of taking care of maybe elderly loved ones, trying to figure that out. The work from home, especially with children challenge is something we hear from women over and over again. As women are being called back into the workplace, trying to figure out how to do that, their Childs School district is not ready to reopen or it is only open in a hybrid situation. Most peoples jobs are not hybrid. How do you straddle that . Women,health issues for who we know are feeling a disproportionate impact of that. Domestic violence being on the rise for women in the midst of a pandemic. Over and over again, we saw that there was a need for us to report on these issues as a newsroom that cares about women in policy. Not just that but that these issues are affecting the majority of the electorate. In the middle of a pandemic, we are still seeing so many women headed to the polls. We also feel an obligation to make sure that those women are informed about how they can safely participate in this democracy in the middle of a pandemic as well. Host does the 19th have a correspondent in washington, d. C. . A women inave Congress Reporter and a woman in Health Care Reporter in washington. Host lets go to wanita. Caller hello and thank you for taking my call. Something that has been on my because i think , who did notlin appear to be qualified to take over the presidency, i think she cost john mccain the election. Her candidacy cost john mccain the election. Therefore, i think we need someone who is really strong. It was with warren, Kamala Harris i believe are strong women. Elizabeth warren and Kamala Harris, i believe are strong women. We need someone who could take over running the country on short notice. I mentioned this because our friend of mine who saw joe biden on Television Last week said he appears to her to have become more frail, especially in his cognitive abilities. Age, 77, weis definitely need someone who is Strong Enough to take over the presidency at a moments notice. I believe that that is the kind of person that will help joe biden win the election. Host thank you for calling, errin haines. Guest she does articulate really is known but is not always acknowledged publicly. That is the fact that joe bidens age is a concern for some voters. And it also factors into who those voters would like to see as a running mate. They are thinking maybe somebody who is younger should join him on the ticket, because that might be a person who will need to take over or should be prepared to take over on day one, given the reality of joe bidens age. I will also say that recent polling has shown a plurality of support for a black woman vp that also includes white women who are open to this prospect. Which i think is really interesting and i dont know how that is factoring into the Vice President s decision. Pick whodont get to he will pick as his Vice President. Voters dont get to pick that person. That is joe bidens decision alone. Say that that is something that voters seem to be open to when polled about that question in particular. Host you mentioned white women at the 19th news. Org. Amanda beckett has the story at your website. Our white women finally waking up . Amid nationwide protests, white women are reckoned isnt reckoning with racism. Guest Amanda Becker has been why identityork on and how that is affecting the politics of white women. This is a newsroom where we are centering women. That does not mean we are celebrating women. We are interrogating what it means to be a woman in this democracy and how all women are engaging or not engaging in our politics. Reckoning on race, what has been so interesting about this moment and what has made people think we might be in a different moment in terms of talking about race in america is the fact that you do see so many white people on the streets in solidarity with black folks around the issue of black lives matter. So, you have white folks, including white women, again, thinking about what it means to be a white person in america. Some of those people thinking about that question for the first time. Amandas excellent reporting in kind of lures them at the beginning of that journey. That, at the start of especially for many white folks who are becoming aware or more of systemic issues racism that frankly black americans have been trying to raise for a long time in this country. Tina, ins hear from alexandria, virginia, just outside of the sea republican, welcome. D. C. , republican, welcome. Caller i just called to say that we are in a high peak racist climate. Clearly this country is not ready for a person of color to be our Vice President because the president has promoted and still does promote racism. Really i want understand, i am africanamerican myself and i support all of the others who said and i to double believe Elizabeth Warren is the best candidate. The country is not ready for an africanamerican vp. It is not because i dont promote my race of people, it is not that. You have to look at the facts. The truth. The truth is this country is not ready for a woman of color, whether she is africanamerican, black or whoever she is. Host let me jump in. I think you have said ready three or four times. What do you mean by ready and tot makes a country ready elect an africanamerican for Vice President . Caller the president has promoted so much racism in our country. He has put to double much racism too much racism in our system and the country is not ready for it. Host errin haines, and a to that . Guest what tina says is so interesting. So, we know that Hillary Clinton in 2016 was a democrat who had the secondhighest number of votes that any president ial candidate has gotten in that party behind barack obama. The question of whether a woman can win, yes, we know she did not win the electoral college, she won the popular vote. , as an answer question. What i was hearing over and over again was that its not that i wouldnt vote for a woman, its that i dont know if my neighbor would. I would support it but i dont think the country is ready. That is the conversation coming up again around race, when we are talking about this, is the country ready for a black woman to be on the ticket as Vice President . It is something that is interesting to see as we head into november, what voters attitudes are about that. I think we need to hear from voters about joe bidens pick, whenever it happens, to see if it is something that motivates them, turns them off or if they are in different to the person who is the number two on that ticket. Usually the role of the Vice President on the campaign is to do no harm. What some folks are saying is that it could potentially be harmful, not because that woman is not qualified or capable but because of the Racial Climate that we find ourselves in, woulding if that person be somebody that could be seen as a liability, although the nominee,idential really is the reason a candidate loses. If they win, the Vice President ial candidate gets none of the credit, if they lose, they get all of the blame. Host lets get one more collar, david from georgia. Caller i have three quick points. These will be things you have never heard in a sentence before. Guest [laughter] caller the conservatives, we know they just live. Trump has fly. Lie. Trump has over 30,000 lies. Abortion, if you look at sb 12017, you will get the broke Back Mountain boys doing nothing but attacking women. On abortion, the question is who causes abortion . I will let you answer that. This Rupert Murdoch style of conservative government coming is extreme news and they are selling it here. They took the guns away from australia. That is the most conservative party there is in a democracy and twice they have taken the guns away from their people. On the third, next time you are on in mess nbc msnbc, talk with george reed about joy id. Mccain bought it from steel when trump started running for office and just lay there and he found out about it. These are the three biggest lies that have run up and down our party. Address those three things. Host thanks for calling. We are down to about 30 seconds or so. You can respond to anything you want to say or talk about what the 19th will be reporting on or looking on beyond the Vice President ial picks, looking toward the general election. Guest we will have and i the ongoing pandemic and especially with women how they are responding to coronavirus, the economy and racism. I would encourage everybody watching, our Virtual Summit is kicking off tomorrow. We have a stellar lineup of people, Hillary Clinton to Melinda Gates to Kamala Harris, Meghan Markle will interview our ceo. We will be tackling issues of celebrating the suffered centennial. You can go to summit. 19 news. Org. Register for all five days on that site. Our news, journalism is at 19th news. Org. We encourage you to go there, read the journalism, signup for our newsletter. Host errin haines is editor at large of the 19th. Firsttime visitor. Guest hopefully not the last call. Host we hope you will come back for sure. We appreciate your time. Guest thank you so much. Host we will take another short timeout. When we come back, author and military historian Richard Frank will talk about the 75th anniversary of the u. S. Atomic bombings on hiroshima and nagasaki. At 8 15 japanese time, and Army Air Force between nine dropped bomb number two on hiroshima, japans second seventh largest city. An area of considerable importance. [explosion] stuns universe learned man had a new women weapon. Bordering on the absolute. In the blast, thousands died instantly. Killed ore listed as missing. 140,000 were injured. Of these, 43,000 were badly hurt. The city was crushed. Of its 90,000 buildings, over 60,000 were demolished. Were described as ashes. Knowledge,wfound fashioned an instrument of annihilation. What did you think of the bomb we dropped on the japs . It was terrible, all of those people killed. Three days later, another b29 dropped and improved bomb the seaport of nagasaki. An industrialized city boasting the best natural harbor an extensive naval facilities. [explosion] this bomb exploding over the north frederick factory district destroyed 39 of all the buildings standing in nagasaki before the landing. The japanese describe the mutilated city as a graveyard with not a tombstone standing. These two terrifying blows were struck at japan only after profound consideration of all the human and military fact involve. The atomic bombs were dropped to end the war quickly. And they did and the war quickly. Into the war quickly. Host Richard Frank is the author of downfall the end of imperial japan. Welcome. We just heard, it said pretty definitively the atomic bombs wordwrap to end the war quickly and they did and the war quickly. Was this the correct decision to make . Did they end the war . The short answer is yes and yes. The ware dropped to end quickly, to save lives, both american and japanese. What we have to get right at the start is to understand the context. There are two basic principles. We have to count the dead and we have to treat the dead as having a common humanity and that means the japanese as well. The asiapacific war resulted in the death of 19 million noncombatants. And all of that number, the number of japanese noncombatants died was maybe one million, 1. 2 million. More than that were due to the soviet invasion in 1945. That tells you immediately that for every japanese noncombatants who died in the whole war between 17 and 18 other noncombatants died. There were other agents and about 12 million of them are chinese. And most of those noncombatants who were not japanese were already dead and they were dying at a rate between eight and 14,000 day. Context in which all of this takes place. Important that we understand the total context. Where the deaths are taking place. They are primarily not japanese. Joiningchard frank is us looking back at the 75th anniversary of the bombing of the regime a and not a sake. We will put the phone numbers on the screen now. And central m in the eastern and central time 7488000. 2 we have separate lines for veterans and their families. 7488002. And for japaneseamericans, 202 7488003. Frank, how widespread was support for president truman . Has that changed over time . Guest we have seen numbers punching up about 80 . It has changed because the narratives have changed. One of the things that really is there is the question, should we talk about this . Place. Nversation takes what is conspicuous about the may never talk about what the cost of the alternatives are. When you start getting down to the cost of the alternatives you understand why mr. Truman did not make a good choice. He was from awful to horrific and he chose what these secretary of war stimson called choice inbhorrent terms of these events. Host this is the seventh of anniversary of the second bombing. August 6, hiroshima being the first. What was the difference between those two days and what the Truman Administration was looking at . What made them just tied to drop the second bomb three days later . Guest there is no specific decision about the second bomb. Mr. Truman there is no further check back. Another aspect about this controversy that people, i think, dont understand. The problem with the notion that one bomb would have done it is this. You have to look at the japanese side. Their reaction was aced on the fact that they had our Atomic Bomb Program which is not produced a bomb but it had educated the top levels of japanese leadership. And it was stupendously difficult. When news of hiroshima came and mr. Trumans announcement was atomic bomb, the imperial bomb not knowy we will that they have one bomb until we have an investigation. Have onesaid, they bomb, but there cant be that many, they can be that powerful. Basically what the japanese leadership was looking at was not fear of one bomb. It was that the u. S. Had an arsenal of powerful nuclear weapons. That is exactly what the nagasaki bomb did. It convinced the top leadership that the u. S. Did not have a bomb. We had an arsenal. The second most powerful man in japan had been adamant in continuing the war. Nagasaki bomb, he stopped going around to the leadership. He said the next target will be tokyo. That is an amazing argument to make. Host how far along was the u. S. In planning an invasion of japan, the main island of japan . Thats a good question. There was a plan to start invading japan on august 11. Mr. Truman had approved that. At the time he was quite reluctant. There was a scenario where we were going to have overwhelming superiority going into q shoe kyushu. American casualties were going to be unpleasant, but acceptable. And the japanese had anticipated this huge buildup of ground forces. 700,000 troops. 780,000 troops would be facing the japanese. Officer had never wanted to invade japan and he was biting his time. By the ninth of august, he was prepared to bring on this and only the japanese surrender put that off before it reached the level of mr. Truman having another review. You are on with Richard Frank. Were talking about the sympathetic anniversary. Good morning, tom. Morning. Ood i am age 60 and i remember the howard then lectures of my history isrs of how being rewritten so much by people with agendas. I am hearing on talk radio the y reason we bombed progressive talk radio that is, the only reason we bombed japan was because they were not europeans. In other words, they were people of color, which is nonsense because we bombed dresden. That was a purpose of demoralizing the german people, for them to surrender. It is unfortunate, what happened with the dropping of the two bombs. Open a pandoras box. But it saved millions of japanese lives who would have been caught in the crossfire, as well as american lives and casualties. Am i wrong on that, professor . Basically, you have to bear in mind, right up until the and, it was assumed the bombs would be used against germany as soon as they were available. They did not have bombs ready to use against germany. The first bomb, which was a test bomb, was detonated in 1945. Let me come back to a really basic point. Its not that the argument im advancing says we dont care about the japanese. What i have going over this for many years now, the fact is our narratives we have been using on this talk about japanese deaths, the fact that they were asians. Our American People at that time, they were reading day by day and they were well aware of how horrific it was in asia and we have completely blotted that out and that is why those narratives are so powerful because people do not realize how horrific the asiapacific war wise . How is the war and pacific portrayed in textbooks . Is that changed over time . The whole area of world war ii was not forthrightly discussed. I can understand this. There was a tendency in japan to view themselves as the greatest victims of the war and if you have been dealing with historians and people from other asia nations, you get a flavor of how infuriating infuriated that makes people in china and elsewhere. I was sitting at a conference once and a presentation was made very much along the typical lines and sitting there, i see him going from that moment to fear he as he realizes this narrative entirely omits it does not count chinese, indonesians, koreans sharing common humanity with the japanese. When the soviet union enters the 1. 6 they capture between and 1. 7 japanese nationals and when the repatriation process is , they fall at 1. 2 million, they dieds you that in soviet captivity. We know about 61,000 japanese soldier spirit that tells you between three to 40000 and 440,000 japanese noncombatants soviet captivity. Those are higher numbers than died during the atomic bomb attacks. Rick andwill go to encino. Caller good morning. I want to add my voice. My father, who barely survived the war, was prepared to be transported to japan. , it would have been criminal, when you have everything up there it would have been criminal for truman just thatp that bomb, there were hundreds of thousands of japanese massacred in a horrible way. There was the russian threat that would have taken japanese territory and greatly complicated the postwar era. There are so many reasons truman had to do that. They were going to blockade japan until they gave up . What . And you address those points if you havent yet . Host thank you, rick. Richard frank . Guest on the american side there was an unstable compromise between the army and the navy on a strategy to end the war and critical issue was time. They advocated invasion because they believe that would be the swiftest way to end the war. War withhad studied japan for decades literally and one of the premises was invading the japanese islands would produce politically unacceptable casualties. The navys alternative was blockade. What does not get mentioned in these discussions, as it should, and this was basically the policy, all of the navy lined up behind it and talked about it as bomb. Native to the it was aimed at starving to death millions of noncombatants. In view of the limited power of atomic weapons compared to what we have today, a blockade was ruthlessthe most strategy and that was the direction were going in august, ushu once the invasion of ky is off. And we do try to kill millions of japanese noncombatants. By the way those agents asians who are not japanese have their deaths on top of the death. Mindboggling. From westave lynn virginia. Hello. Caller hello. Im in okinawa veteran and was trained to go to japan in the invasion. Worse, i never had to go because there was instability. For those who criticize truman, go to the families of people, american g. I. s you were saved from invading japan and certain death and tell them that truman did the wrong thing. I know you dont have the guts to do that. Thank you, mr. Frank, for your book. Its very informative. Host mr. Frank, mr. History been fair to truman . In his decisions in this . Guest in my view, no. He famously said he did not sleep on the decision and comments like that. If you go through everything he , heally said, in his mind had the area in two compartments. One was, did i make the best decision and he always believed if you really understood all the alternatives, he made what secretary stimson called the least abhorrent choice. The alternatives were worse. But truman was never in different indifferent to the depths of the japanese his order had caused. Shortly after your shema, we shortly after hiroshima, we intercept this message. And mr. Truman was clearly talking about this and he says, the hiroshima bomb killed 100,000 people. He has all of these comments. This is horrendous. The decision may have been right , but the consequences were horrendous and he recognized it and felt it very deeply. Once again, when you deal with people from other asia and nations other asian and american say, were bonds necessary . Isommon comment from them why only two. The death rate is so incomparable between a japanese in these other peoples, they find the american struggle with this to be baffling. Richard, your shema happens hiroshima apposite august 6. On august 6. Six days go by. And for here you tell announces japanese the japanese unconditional surrender. Walk us through those days that gets the emperor to the point of surrender . A little context here. Someone with legitimate authority had to decide and then japans armed forces had to comply with the surrender. Thethe emperor makes critical decision. He makes it august 8 when he talks to the foreign minister and says the war must end now. There were other factors on his , including his loss of faith in the strategy, the concern about the japanese people reaching a revolutionary state in the fall. Inannounces that decision the Early Morning hours of august 10. And we have the diary entry of the number two man in the army. One of the other officer says i cannot think the overseas commanders will comply even with an order from the emperor. And right on cue they send a message saying, we will not comply with a surrender order even from the emperor. And theres even more. It has this language that says the prerogatives would not be compromised with a surrender. An American State Department thisials realize that demand would make the emperor supreme, so he has a veto over the occupation. Of course, we send the message back saying, clearly, the emperor will be subordinate. Whether they would have agreed without the emperor, i dont know. Aboutis the question whether they will get all of the Japanese Armed forces to surrender. Inner members say the roughest days that he spent were four or five days wondering whether the armed forces would comply with the order. In anotherribed this context as a miraculous theverance that he got government and the armed forces in japan to surrender. Good morning, steve. I would like to ask the professor if he reads japanese and i would like to ask if he has read the numerous comments after the war by japanese generals that were not between Nuclear Attacks into hiroshima and nagasaki. But there was the soviets entrance into the war and they and threatening hokkaido that decision to surrender was based on that much more than the two Nuclear Attacks. Thank you. Host thank you, steve. Guest let me unpack that at several levels. First of all, in terms of the impact of the soviet intervention, the chief of staff of the Imperial Army tells the emperor in a classic understatement, the soviet intervention is unfortunate. If you go through all of these other statements, yes, the notion that all of these officers are talking only about soviet intervention in the key reason, its simply not true. The soviet intervention does play an important part. It is very important in terms of getting compliance of all of the Japanese Armed forces, particularly those on the age consonant. So, soviet intervention is important in getting compliance of all the Japanese Armed forces, but it does not move the thedecisionmakers to move government and eventually japan to surrender. Barbara, go ahead. Caller yes, im very interested. Im australian. The japanese had been coming down through the islands and we were terrified. Ready to evacuate. But i always say, i want to thank america for saving australia. Population. A small we were fighting in other areas. That is about all i want to say, except it is being an armchair quarterback. All these years later, they do not remember how it was, how intense the fighting was. Bob, thank you. Richard frank . Overlook thed to us trillions. The other thing about the australians was, the australian of the warhe part where they are fighting against numbered about 17,000. About 8000 died as prisoners of war of the japanese. They were mostly captured in singapore. That is just one part of the. Hole thing with japan harold hicks points out that a thing to the war, they have killed at least 3 million military personnel. They turn over 56 individuals. Of thets just one part savagery of the war, driven by the terms on which the japanese insisted the war be fought upon. Frank, thank you for your time, for your insight. We appreciate your time. Guest thank you. Next host next on washington journal, we discussed the 75th anniversary of the dropping of the u. S. Bomb on nagasaki, but first, we have an x or from a film created by japanese film crews documenting the aftermath of the bombing for scientific purposes. Lets take a look. [video clip] narrator the date is august 9, 19 45. Hot summer should summer sun shone upon the city. , but for two and a half hours, they continue to avail. And then two super forces appeared over the city from a northeasterly direction. Plane dropped an object. It took about 40 seconds. And then a blinding flash, followed by an explosion and a blaze. The destruction was the greatest ever wrought by man. The bomb missed the center of the city and detonated over a canyon to the north. Let us now view the general devastation of the hills to the east of the city. Hills,other side of the the brakes that intercepted the atomic blast and prevented the destruction from extending to the harbor section. , the reinforced now it is flattened pebbles andes only broken towels that remain. Host our guest now is the director of the Nuclear Studies institute at the american university. Thank you for joining us. As we look back at the 75th anniversary of the atomic bombing, did harry truman make the right decision . No. T he made the absolute wrong decision. He defended it through the rest of his life. And hehe had no mores made the absolute wrong decision. The United States in the official mythology, the official narrative is the United States dropped the bombs because that was the only way to force japan austria surrender without an American Invasion and if the u. S. Invaded, truman said in his boysr, a halfmillion would have been killed in the invasion. Years later, they add to that the fact that many japanese, millions of japanese would also have been killed. The reality is there are two the main obstacle to japanese surrender was the u. S. Demand for unconditional theender, which means execution of the emperor to them would be like the crucifixion of rist to us. That understanding was pervasive about the advisors around truman. Secretary of war stimson. Almost all of truman is close advisers urged him. The main impediment was jimmy burns. Truman relied on burns more than anyone else. From the day he becomes president to his first day in the time that burns is secretary of state he is relying on burns for device and burns told him you will be politically crucified if you let the japanese keep the emperor. Stimson and the others were doing everything they could to convince him. And admiral leahy said, maybe no one will get the japanese to surrender if we demand unconditional surrender. How did we know that . Weve broken their code. We intercepted their telegrams. Tokyo torams were from moscow. Thehe middle of may, japanese decided the best way to get better surrender terms was to get the soviets interested in their behalf. Amp work,jesty, the the present war brings greater evil and sacrifice on the people. Mayesires from his art it be quickly terminated. Unconditional surrender is the only obstacle to peace. Truman refers to the intercepted telegram as the telegram from ap emperor asking for peace. Those are trumans words. That thetant rights president , admiral leahy, and earns burns agreed that the japs were looking for peace. We got those cables, not only truman, but also far install, mccoy, others agreed with that assessment. The japanese know they are defeated. They knew that they were defeated since the battle of 1944. In and the threetime former prime thester sent a memo to emperor i regret to inform you, but defeat is inevitable. The japanese knew that and the americans knew that. The second way to enforce the surrender was to wait for the soviet invasion. Harbor, day after pearl they had been urging the russians to commit to the pacific war. But the russians were fighting the nazis. Facing 10 german divisions. They have a handful. But atta, stalin celtic, stalin agrees to enter the pacific war. What did american intelligence say. The joint Intelligence Committee reported on april 11, if at any time the ussr should enter the war, all japanese will realize. Hat absolute the is inevitable i could give you more cases, july 6, a lot of these reports from the pot stem meeting make the same point over and over that once the soviets enter, the japanese are finished. What did truman understand . Truman said he went to pot stem in midjuly. He had lunch with stalin. Afterward, he wrote in his diary, stalin will be in the war by august 15. He writes home to his wife the next day, the russians are coming in. We will end the war a year sooner now. Think about all the kids who will not be killed. When is it necessary . You have the hundreds of thousands who will suffer for the rest of their lives, but truman do he was beginning a process that ultimately could end life on the planet. He gets his first real briefing on april 13 from burns and truman writes his memoir burns said this was a weapon great enough to destroy the whole world. Briefing aboutr then thatnd rights within four months we will have a weapon that could destroy the entire city. He says it could determine the future of human civilization. , let me jumpuznick in and take a phone call. We have plenty of callers waiting to talk to you. Jeff for Peter Kuznick. Though ahead. Caller thank you for taking my call. Agreeznick, i totally with every thing he said. I anticipated answering the last presenter austrias question, but theres also a moral depravity that should be spoken about with the use of an atomic weapon. Its not just a new weapon. Goodness toertain the way the decision was made. Its not only that this is a problem with nuclear war, but it was thought at the time it could cause a Chain Reaction in the atmosphere of the world and destroy the world with just the one weapon that was a little more powerful than the one they had tested in the desert in new york state. To take that type of chance without knowing, it really how can people rationally make a decision about using a weapon like this if you are taking the chance to destroy the earth . Not to mention that going , they give the license to everyone to develop such a weapon. It is just astounding they could do such a thing. Host jeff, thank you. Wast that is the point i starting to make. When he goes to pot stem, and pot stem, he knows this is not just another weapon. He said this might be the final no. Ruction prophesied by he says this on a number of occasions. He was not the only one. Oppenheimer briefly entered the committee on may 31 of military, political leaders and warned them within three years they will likely have weapons between 700 and 7000 times as powerful as the hiroshima bomb. Wondering about this. You have to remember that seven of americas 85 star admirals eight fivestar admirals and generals said that morally reprehensible. The most outspoken was admiral william leahy. He was truman is personal chief of staff. He wrote, the japanese are ready to surrender. The use of this barbarous weapon will have no material assistance in our war against japan and being the first to use it, we the standard of the barbarians of the dark ages. We have similar comments from eisenhower, macarthur, hayden. They all knew it was not necessary and some of them recognized the significance of using it because you are saying they knew that there is no secret to the bomb and other countries would be developing them. Thescientists would but soviets would take three to five years to catch up. We are studying this example and the other thing about that, the soviets knew the bomb was unnecessary. They were trying to get them to intercede to get better surrender terms. Metarly may, the ambassador malik, and hewith writes back to the kremlin that the japanese are desperate to surrender. The soviets knew better than anybody there was no military reason to do it and they interpreted it exactly the way that some of the scientists warned they would. They were the real target, not the japanese and that was the reaction of stalin and shook off zhukov and others in the kremlin. Host you are on with richard kuznick. This is all finding good. I was about eight years old when they dropped the bomb. I remember the attitude in the united dates in school and everywhere. We had a gentleman who was in that the tan death march, you know . To death they dropped that bomb and stop the war. They told us they stop the war and we were happy that they did. The attitude of the American People is, the pilots and all of this, we have seen all of that and nothing was too bad to do to the japanese at the time. , but you know, i think , he was in aually war himself. I think macarthur at one time wanted to drop the bomb in korea. The bomb is an awful thing. But if we did not have bombs, would there be more wars now . We know that everybody has got a bomb and we are all playing chicken with it. Maybe it will stop some more by having bombs. I dont know. Host Peter Kuznick . Guest the American Public was was exactly what richard saying. Susan rice, likely the next Vice President , wrote an oped that truman saved her father is life, that dropping the atomic forced the japanese surrender. Obama basically said the same thing. Said that world war ii reached its brutal end. 85 of the American People according to a gallup pole supported dropping the atomic bomb. They said that 22. 7 of the American People wish the japanese had not surrendered so quickly. 30 in the southwest. That was the attitude. With it, there was racism. That might have factored in a little bit. This does not get known in the u. S. Until 44. Did was japanese horrific. That is not a debate. We are not debating about that. We are debating whether the dropping of the bomb was the right thing and what the consequences were, because as scientists warned, it did lead to an uncontrollable arms race and we are lucky to have survived since then. , these sort of don mcleans has been hanging humanity. F truman is not evil. He went into this with his eyes wide open, knowing he was beginning this process and knowing the way that we did it would trigger this exact response from the soviet union that was predicted at the time. The soviets test their bomb in august of 1949 and in 1952 the americans trade test this bomb. And they move the hands of the Doomsday Clock to two minutes before midnight. Now it is at 100 seconds before midnight. The closest it has ever been. We are in a very dangerous situation and there have been many instances where we have theived, including during cuban missile crisis. Host what has changed about the japanese perspective about the bombings . Guest we get to see the bomb the war through the american eyes and is always a lot of other agents on the trip. So they have a very different perspective than the japanese and we go to the commemorative event. We go to the bcm. We go to the peace parks. We also go to the japanese were in the subject. And theres the museum and nagasaki and that is that is entirely dedicated to japanese atrocities. Somewhat to americans, but mostly to other agents. The japanese were victims, but they were also victimizers. While American Students did not participate, and they had to deal with their gills, the japanese have to deal with their guilt and sense of neither thety and American Government nor the japanese government has the well with their history. The one country that has taken responsibility for their past in a much more comfortable way is germany. The japanese of not done it, especially not under shinzo abe, and the United States is not done it. We have seen what happened when thatoviets tried to have historical exhibit in 1965. Host ryan. Good morning. Caller good morning. Thanks for letting me speak. I have a question for your guest about some of the personalities. I am wondering if they made the decision to drop it at you all to or was it still in the planning stage, and with stalin of austria spies in the manhattan project, did he know exactly what was going on . And what about the generals and the admirals who are closer to the front lines . For example, in the pacific. Were they briefed on what was going to happen before the bombs were dropped . Go ahead. Finish up. Aller did oppenheimer have chance to talk to truman about what was going to go on it they dropped this bomb . Thank you, brian. When was the decision made to drop that bomb . On may 5,a meeting they decided japan would be the target and not japan. Made and afters ,he splitting of the adam physicists were very alarmed about the possibility the om,itting of the at physicists were very alarmed about the possibility of hitler getting to work. They were to eisenstein. Project really gets off the ground very slowly. It does not really get momentum until 19 to. The admirals and the generals, some of them were briefed about the use of the atomic bomb. But even someone like arsenaler, americas increases threefold. Bombs. Ve almost 30,000 they were going to drop the bomb. Eisenhower said, they told me they are going to drop it on the japanese. But the war was over in europe and it was not up to me i am getting more and more depressed, just thinking about it. He asked for my opinion. E said, im against it he said, i am i hate to see our country be the first to use such a weapon. , in an exchange with former president hoover, macarthur says, if truman had followed your wise advice, the japanese would have surrendered and happily and that would have been as early as may. The possibility if we told the japanese they could keep the emperor. We told them we had a horrible new weapon. We could have ended the war possibly a month or two earlier and saved more lives. American left, japanese life, we droppedes, but the bomb on august 6 in order to prevent an invasion that was november 1, anin invasion, which many of the military leaders did not want to see happen at all. The logic escapes me. Did stalin know . According to the last caller was his question . Guest yes. There were two were more giving intelligence to the soviets. Knew the americans were developing a bomb. He did not know exactly he knew it was going to be tested. He did not know the results. Told him at what stem the United States had a terrible new weapon. Stalin was pokerfaced. Truman thought he did not get it. Stalin knew exactly what that meant. Marvin, calling from tuscaloosa, alabama. I think you have played fast and loose with the facts. It was germany, japan, and italy, they were dictators who started the war. I think you have ignored the fact that all of the atrocities committed by the japanese you mentioned them, but we dont hear a lot about that. Those atrocities were proven at the tokyo war trials. You mentioned the backhand death march. The rape of nanking, the killing, the slaughter and torture of american pows. I think you have played fast and loose with the facts because truman had the facts and he made a reasonable decision. Im not going to go into all that kind of detail, but i think thewe it to americans on 75th anniversary of the end of world war ii to just say to the americans and the families that died, including my two uncles that on her and glory, to all of those people, all of those families, i feel fair and are not putting this in context and i definitely disagree with your statement that, we have atrocities just like the japanese. That is three history and that that is, sir . Destroying history and that is wrong, sir. Host marvin, lets get a response from Peter Kuznick. You are notn, listening very closely. Was ak that world war ii necessary war. I think that world war ii was on the side of the angels. Downplayly do not japanese atrocities or german atrocities. The issue is very different. The entire history of the cold war and the Nuclear Arms Race is not something that we can ignore. The bomb drop was instrumental in starting the cold war. There are so many people we should be quoting. Example, said for i was unable to see any justification for an invasion of an already thoroughly defeated japan. So, you are saying we should have dropped the bomb to get revenge on the japanese thats a different question. That is one that truman, in his statement, thats not the argument made. The argument is whether the bomb war. Ecessary to end the brought them down to an and we did notr need to do it and we knew we did not need to do it. We use them as an experiment for two. Atomic bombs. Why would we do that . The United States is not in a moral country. General groves said there was never any illusion on my part that russia was an enemy and the project was conducted on that basis. In march of 1944, overgenerous, he said, you realize the main purpose is to defeat the russians . Top adviser said the same thing when they met in spartanburg, South Carolina. He said, this is our way to make the russians more manageable in europe. If you think that is justifiable reason for killing hundreds of thousands of people theres almost no limit to what you can justify. You can justify using atomic bombs today. Fortunately, that is not the world is adopted. But they are developing two more usable weapons and the world is in a very precarious situation now. As we wrap up, what is the legacy of the bombings . The legacy. I think it undermines americas claims toward exceptionalism. We like to think of ourselves as different from other countries, as more moral, more just. We want to spread freedom and democracy. At the heart of that this that should begins with the cold war. It begins with our victory in world war ii. Work,war ii was a good the closest we have ever come to a good war. There is no such thing as a good war, really. The use of the bomb certainly compromises our moral position around the world. We have to look honestly at our past because if we do not study the past honestly we are going to commit the same mistakes or new mistakes going forward. The world is too dangerous for us to have that luxury. Thanks for your host thanks for your time and insight this morning. Guest thank you. Host if you missed any of our conversation this morning with author Richard Frank and american universities peter because nick, they reair at 7 00 p. M. Span3 at 11 00 p. M. Eastern time. Part of a sunday night light up on American History tv. The enda, nagasaki and of world war ii. If you would like to learn more, starting now in cspan3 is an inter an interview with Stephen Mitchell on a film documenting the aftermath of the bombing hidden from the public for years. That is coming up right about now. In the meantime, enjoy the rest of your day. We will see you back here tomorrow at 7 00 for another edition of washington journal. Tonight on u. N. Day, the question on whether another exit this is ahead for u. S. Cities do the coronavirus and civil unrest. My fear is that you are going to kiev. From 1980 youre going to see a period from 1980 where you saw this tremendous prosperity in major urban centers. 2020 beyond, if we dont approach this in a thoughtful, careful way could represent a reversal in which that economic activity, that talent that flooded into our studies start to flood out. At 8 00r tonight eastern on q and