A. M. Eastern. Members will debate an over 3 trillion Coronavirus Relief package which includes money for state and local governments to fund First Responders and Health Workers. Now back to the house hearing. If thats happening, thats from where else. Im only selling them a million a month. Theyre getting lots and lots, millions. Anything we get in missouri, we tried so hard for a listening time to get a hold of them. I have a little bitty contract. One of the two largest hospitals in my district ordered masks and im not even im sure they were n95s they ordered theark paid eight times the going rate precorona outbreak. Masks in heir n95 great shape, they were fine but they were counterfeit. Thats one of the reasons, if people are stealing your website its obvious where some of the counterfeit masks at eight times the going rate are coming from. I got a little off subject. Let me ask you my question before i get too far out on a limb. Its my understanding you were able to get connected with the white house economic advisor, Peter Navarro, in march. I guess it was march. Nbc news reported after you connected with Peter Navarro that dr. Bright wrote oto his deputy asking him to explore if they could divert money reserved for vaccines and other defense measures to buy masks. According to nbc news this was an example of how trump and his top aides played favorites in awarding contracts and allocating scarce resources. Your companys deal with fema is wnl on of two identified that explicitly says it was directed y the white house. Mymy question, what is your response to these allegations . I ask because dr. Brights allegations allege cronyism. Im glad you brought that up. Nbc that article was only one article of two that were critical about us. And both of those articles were written by people who didnt talk to me and got the article wrong. If youd like i can tell you that that all came about. Certainly. I was on either np rmbing or bbc. One of Steve Bannons producers heard me on the show and asked me to be on their show. And they called me. And i producer, a guy named george, said would you be on Steve Bannons show. I dont know a lot about steve bannon, i know hes a lot farther to the right than i am, i said, well in all fairness, i have to tell you im not a trump supporter. He said, i dont care. So i i just want to get that out i dont want to be on the show if they think im a trump supporter. He said, i dont care. So then the show went real well. I was invited back. And i enjoyed talking to steve bannon. That was fine. Steve got it. He got the cause. And he said im going to tell a friend of mine, dr. Hatfield, dr. Navarro about you guys. I said who is dr. Navarro . He told me, i said great. So then dr. Somebody from dr. Navarros office called me and i ent through the same shpiel. I want to be sure Everybody Knows everything. So somebody from dr. Navarros office call and asked me about my company. I said yeah, i make masks. In all fairness, i need to tell you im not a trump supporter. In fact i did an article in the Dallas Morning News two years ago that was very critical and thats going to come out and he said i dont care. And then to make matters, beat a dead horse, when dr. Navarro called me i did the same thing. I said f. Y. I. , give mea contract this carl is going to come out, this might embarrass you, just to let you know. He laughed. I remember he laughed at me. And he said send me the article. I did. So i told my friends recently, that article should have been titled, Trump Administration gets mask contract gives mask contract to biden supporter. Thats real deal. It was not cronyism, sir. It was not creenyism at all. And let me tell you too, Peter Navarro was a gentleman, acted in good faith. He was concerned about the mask supply. So was i. And thats what we talked about. No cronyism. If you want to take that fema contract away from me please do. I can make a lot more money selling those masks somewhere else. I got a pure heart, sir, i do. Trumps advisors and close people, see him at the press conference, several of those people are not Trump Supporters either but the president picked them because theyre the best in the business because i think thats good. That was the farthest from i tried to talk myself out of that thats probably why mr. Navarro said i was difficult to work with. I dont know. The gentlemans time has expired. Its a pleasure to recognize the gentleman from new mexico, mr. Lujan, for his five minutes of questioning. Mr. Lujan thank you, madam chair. Mr. Bowen, thank you for being with us. As you outlined in your testimony you have been raising the alarm about the National Security risk from the loss of domestic mask production for some time. Does the United States need to change that and dramatically increase the manufacturing of medical supplies . Well, theres a shortterm issue and a longterm issue. Right now theres a lot of masks needed. And there are a lot of people going into the business, unfortunately, a lot of them dont know what theyre doing and were making masks out of fabric and other things that dont work. What i call it is making a life jacket out of lead. I can make life jacket out of lead and paint it orange but dont go in the pool. Some of these maffings being made are worthless. So im sorry, i got i lost i think you answered the question. Yes, the United States should take this seriously. And up manufacturing. But we need to do it the right way. I dont think we need to up manufacturing that much. I think we need to have it be in the United States society cant get cut off like a lot of the chinese supply was cut off. Appreciate that, sir. On january 22, you emailed officials at h. H. S. And offered to reactivate four of your companys unused production lines for n95s reprettyors. Yes, sir. What was the response to your offer . Well, dr. Bright was kind of all over it. He really thought this was an important thing. So he said im going to forward you to laura wolf, shes in charge of infrastructure. And my attitude was its this is too little, too late but weve got four machine, we can at least protect some people, maybe our infrastructure. So they asked me to get with her and tell her what we could do. I did. Sent a big, long email that said heres what we can do. Then there wasnt a lot of response after that. And again, i wasnt looking for a contract. Im just trying to be helpful at this point. And again, i think that the travesty here isnt what happened in january and that time. Laura wolf is no more responsible than all these other thousands of people that i told. Hospitals and everybody i told. So to look at her and or look at them and go they didnt listen and you were right, i might not have been right. Theyre all making decisions in a battlefield situation im not going to be too hard on those folks. I think the real issue is that, look at the h. H. S. Presentation from 13 years ago. They said here it is, were going to have a problem. That day, thats why i said when brenda haden gave us that presentation, she brenda, youre preaching to the choir, we cant believe this, this is wonderful. She go, but were not allowed to fix it. I said you got to be kidding. Thats why i latched onto brta, they were the only ones who believed it. I kept think, ill tell you how bad it was, how the responsibility of this goes far and wide, is all three of those directors believed in and knew it was going to happen and tried to work with me. Dr. Robinson got on a plane and went and talked to a Hospital Group in houston because i asked him to. And because of that m. D. Anderson Cancer Center today has enough masks and theyre the only Hospital System in texas, sorry, in houston, who does. Because he got on a plane. Just because of my time limit, in that communication its my understanding that you shared how many masks you could make. And what i was led to believe was 1. Million masks we are peek or seven million per month. Thats correct if we ran 247. And the price was 79 cents . Back then there was no talk of price. I said the machines are available. I just said this is here. Remember this . This is here, dont forget. Earlier in testimony, i think you said the pice was 79 cents. Since then we have priced them at 9 cents. Appreciate that, sir. When the government timely acted on the need for masks and entered into contracts with less experienced manufacturers they ended up paying as much as 5. 50 per mask . I just know what i read in the paper. I read that as well. Sounds like price gouging to me. Dr. Bright testified theres a shortage of p. Perform e. There should be no question to everyone in this hearing that theres a shortage of p. P. E. Including masks. Instead of the Trump Administration accepting responsibility and ensuring critical p. P. E. Is manufactured at the level needed and loy uh stating to dist them where needed, they pitted the states against one another. Jared kushner said at a press conference, the notion of a federal stockpile is its supposed to be our stockpile not the states stockpile they then use. The day after he was on that press conference the website was changed to reflect his remarks. Madam chair i want to submit into the record an article from u. S. News world report, states competing in global jungle for p. P. E. So ordered. Thank you, madam chair. The gentleman yields back. Pleasure to recognize the gentleman from illinois, dr. Bucshon, for his five minutes of questions. Thank you, madam chairwoman, thank you for being here. Its just you and 3m that makes these type of mask masks in the u. S. . Predating the pandemic . Predate dating the pandemic. Theres not much competition. Oan large scale. Not on a large scale. Were all small. Members of the secure mask supply organization i started in 2014, theres four of us and a few others, small, but we make probably less than 10 of the supply. This has been a long standing issue. Your testimony has shown us that, its an issue that probably should have been addressed in congress. You know, congress can tell agencies what to do. And how to act. And you know, Government Contracting rules, agency rules and regulations, i mean, this is my 10th year in congress, its always amazed me about how not very prescriptive we are in congress. We its more broad on what we say. I mean the ren cent stuff weve done is an example. For the most part its turned out ok. But we do give agencies a lot of leeway to set rules, regulations and other things. And its clear youve interacted with these agencies for years and even though maybe we knew up here and talked about it, we had to fix this problem, it was really never fixed unless Congress Tells them to do it, their probably not going. To the other thing is, the private sector marketplace, i know you talked about that. How hospitals get products from buy Cheaper Products not made in the eyes. For your products, say for an n95 mask, the f. D. A. Has to approve those products to be used in the United States . Yes, sir. Well, i think just now, i think thats changed. I believe but there is a federal agency that has to certify this is something yes, sir. Right. So, and so i mean, we do have some control over what, in a certain respect, about the quality of the masks we import into the United States. Clearly theres been, you know, some counterfeits. But probably also some products brought from china and other places that maybe dont go through did go through the same certification process that you do . Theyre supposed to. But i know for instance, every once in a while, chinese respirator. Theyll take masks out of the market, theyll go buy masks and test them. If they fail you can lose your registration. And they do that for the chinese made masks too. Chinese masks a lot of those have gotten lost their registration. And for the national stockpile, i mean it seems to me were going to have to really consider changing how we deal with that. You have a stockpile of something. You buy all the stuff. Then it outdates. Then you buy it all again. Whats the outdate on say just an n95 mask. How long are those certified to be used sitting on a shelf, you pull it off there. For how long . Theyre all different. 5, 10, 15 years, theyre all different. But i never thought stockpiling was the way to go zphsm this mask here might be, you know if it sat on a shell inform a closed becomes it might say on there 10 years. It might be fine. It might be fine. Or the elastic could rot. Which has happened. Ive had pem at hospitals tell me they pulled masks off the shelf and the elastic popped. I dont think stockpiling. What do you think we should do . For example in the stockpile if they were outdated, start to outdate should we be able to sell that stuff before it jut dates . What would be the length of time before an outdate that youd feel comfortable selling a product . I dont believe in stockpiling sir because of the pobs we have already identified. I think what we should do is come up with a new kind of mask that can be made extremely fast, hundreds of millions a week. So innovation. Absolutely. Then ramp up. I presented a program, an idea called hyper surge to c. D. C. Several years ago. Thats what i said. They said it was the best presentation of the meeting. Then we never did it because i couldnt figure out a way to make it profitable to go and build a machine thats not going to be used. Im not in that business. I was a heart surgeon before. We used to, when i first started 25 years ago, we would have a stockpile of heart valves of all sizes. Hospital bought them. They sat there they had outdays on them. Over the years, ultimately, we got to a point where they dont stockpile those anymore at the hospital. Because things would outdate and theyd have to get rid of them. So now basically things rotate through. When youre going to do a heart surgery case, you know, you can get the products will come through, and youll its consignment. You dont buy them anymore. So thats the thats kind of what youre saying as a stockpile. You dont stockpile this stuff. But off way of quickly getting things a stockpile will work in some situations. For instance the government does buy masks. V. A. And d. O. D. Buy millions of masks. So that can rotate through. So they need a coherent plan and thats what i tried to present. Weve got four machines, lets use one for your peacetime use, well rotate that stock for you. That was the plan. The u. S. Government could help create a consistent marketplace for u. S. Made masks. Yes. It could be part of the solution. It can be done for health care work, to do it for the whole United States for something ha happens every 100 years to protect all americans is probably not practical. Understood. But protecting Americas Health care workers is possible. Fair enough. I yield back. The gentleman from oregon, mr. Schrader for his five minutes of questions. Welcome. Were doing a lot of things these days that arent real practical but were being forced into them. Its surreal. Yeah. To some of the communications with dr. Bright, one of the references he made was to a department of Homeland Security request or communication with you back in mid january to procure some masks and could you talk about that a little bit . What was the nature of that . What i would classify, some sort of purchasing agent kind of person. Not a high ranking official, called and said they were looking for masks i believe for screeners. And i said i dont have any. Were sold out. And then i just asked him what do you think, is this real . And he i said give me your honest opinion . He said i think its going to be bad, i said yeah, i do too. So to pick up the phone and call rick bright. These folks to me were brothers in arms. I called them for 15 years, 13 years. Every time Something Like this would happen id pick up the this phone and say, is this it, can i help you . Its interesting that while h. H. S. Was not receiving this information or productive manner, d. H. S. , at least some folks in d. H. S. Were very aware kind of situation. I dont know. We were never age to sell the government masks. Government was never a customer of ours. Until the h1n1 pandemic. They bought masks from us in an emergency and never bought again. If i may, id like to get at that. Before we do, on february 3, there was communication between a comment wolf and wright i think dr. Referred to this if were not responding now our masks would forever be under foreign control. Do you remember that comment . I dont know. But i was curious what you meant by i said that . Yeah. Oh, yeah. Im glad was if you asked the question. What i meant was if we dont fix the u. S. Mask supply now, while everybody is thinking about it, while people are dying, well do xactly what dewe did after h1n1, during h1n1 i was on the news just like now. We were vindicated. We couldnt believe it went right back. And things are worse now than they were before h1n1. So getting back to earlier comments and a bit of what dr. Bucshon was talking about its clear we need to make some of this stuff in america. The question is i have a tiny or had a very small Veterinary Practice and we use masks. The question i was always worried about the dollar. My job here is also to protect the taxpayer dollar. 5 a box, 1 a box, you got to think about it at least a little bit. Whats the right mix there . How do we protect the taxpayer dollar but make sure we protect made in america so we can react . What im going to say is going to make no accounting sense. What im going to say is that 1 is not real. It should be ignored. Theyre not making a profit. Just because some country can sell a mask and lose money on it to us, does that mean we taught buy that and think thats viable . Its not. Its not. We ought to buy everything that has to do with critical products like a mask in the United States. Masks cost less now, my masks cost less now than masks cost 30 years ago. You can buy two class2 medical device, surgical masks, for less than a gumball. The fact that china can make them for two cents or sell them for two cents, lets ignore that its not real. And its a threat to National Security. Last question, if i may, and youve alluded to this again. Nice to have a stockpile, but stockpile is not the total answer for what you and larry were just talking about. What role does the federal government in setting up maybe platform that businesses could use when times are tough . In other words its not worth your while to set up this platform prork deuce for a couple of months an then try to shut it down, unemployee people. What role could the federal government have, we face this with drugs. The chairwoman is in very adamant concern that all our active ingredients are made in china or india. Thats not a healthy situation either, especially right now. What is the role, whats the Publicprivate Partnership to stand up a platform that could be activated and we bear some of the costs and you guys can too . Start by pearing down the tearing down the wall tweens the f. C. C. And d. O. D. And all the departments. They can rotate a stockpile. That can justify having machines sitting here ready to be used. It needs to be there needs to be a coordinated plan between the all these organizations and then there needs to be, again, the government needs the government cant tell hospitals to buy American Made masks. But they can sure put them on notice that if you dont, youre probably going to get sued at some point. I told my wife the other day, im probably going to spend the last 10 years of my career being a paid witness. Because i think these i think all these people who cant protech their employees are going to say hey. Why dont you cothis stuff . And let me say one more thing too. I dealt with this thing for so long, its been so ill lomb call, i tried to figure it out, who is at fault . People ask me that, whos to blame . Its human nature, its all of us, i couldnt convince doctors. I couldnt listen to. This i had three directors at barta say mike if you get somebody to call me i will verify that what youre saying is true. Ill tell them its true. I couldnt get them to call. I couldnt get hospitals to make that call. I dont think they wanted to hear it. Theyre programmed to save money. Theyre not programmed to say i want to make sure my masks will be here. It didnt compute. I was speak greek to everyone. To look to look at this story, look back and blame everybody, im not going to do. This im looking at this pandemic, theres a Silver Lining and that is it telling everybody theres a big problem. We can fix this problem and never go through this again. Thank you so much. Thank you. The gentleman yields back. Its a pleasure to recognize the gentlewoman from indiana, mrs. Brooks. Mrs. Brooks thanks, madam chairwoman. Thank you, mr. Bowen, for being here. Its so interesting to hear and i want to thank you, actually, for not blaming and trying to educate all of us as to what you have been telling america and government officials for a very, very long time. In fact, the chairwoman and i have been a part of, and i entered into the record, a few arings ago, a group called cfis, strengthening americas Public Health security. The title of this big report a bunch of professionals caming to, a bunch of medical professionals came together, the title of the report is ending the cycle of crisis and complacency in u. S. Global health security. Geberding, julie senator kelly ayotte who had been in the senate, it was all focused on it came out in november of 2019. Of great a lot of great recommendations that i hope we talked about it we always go into the cycle of dealing with something and then we become complacent and we lose focus once again. And we have done it, you have said since 9 11. President george w. Bush. Had a focus on it. Tried to bring attention to the mask problem. And others. And then we lost it. During the Obama Administration. And you wrote lots of letters. And we didnt ramp up. But i have to tell you that during all of that time, participating in that commission, i dont we talked about therapeutics. We talked about vaccines. We talked about diagnostic testing. I dont recall anyone ever talking about masks. Ok. They didnt talk about p. P. E. And these were all professionals. Who were sitting around the table. Im glad chairwoman eshoo is agreeing with me. We didnt have that discussion. And now we are all suffering, our medical professionals really and our Law Enforcement and fire who are truly on the front lines are the ones now stuffering the consequences. And now we have this huge issue. I want to talk briefly about the stockpile since you dont believe stockpile is the way to go. Most of america didnt know there was a stockpile until this happened. Most of america didnt know anything about all these type of things until this pandemic hit. But so we have to have some supply. I come from indiana, manufacturing state. We have to have a supply chain. We have to be able to ramp up production. Barta is all about partnering with the private sector. Many barta directors didnt get the job done. Based on what you said. Not just dr. Bright. Dr. Hatchet and dr. Robinson. Hey couldnt get the job done. Were going to welcome your comments later on as a manufacturer. If we done have a stockpile if we dont have dramatic need for. Perform e. , and lets, god fored by we dont, forbid, we dont, but we might, what is the magic formula about ramping up production when we need it ersus when we dont need it . This is just my opinion my opinion is to have a small stockpile that can be rotated through americas Hospital System. But as far as the general the bulk of the masks, i think we could come up with a different kind of mask that could be made so fast that you wouldnt need to stockpile. The problem isnt isnt the problem is how do you get masks to the right how do you get masks to people . How do you get million os masks to people . You can d it two ways. Either have them in a stockpile or they could rot, or you learn to make them faster. With a concerted effort, with a group like i was talking about where you get people, some smart people, in a room, hey, make it lucrative. Tell the american mask industry heres what we want to do. Figure out how to make a Million Masks a day on one machine. Would that be a government contract . Or would that be turning on the spigot so that the private sector can call those maskmakers, hospitals can call the maskmakers because thats whats happening right now . I think it could be both. I think the government should use the v. A. And d. O. D. s business as a carrot. D. O. D. And v. A. Are buying millions an millions of dollars worth of mask. Id love to have that business. What im saying is, me or another american mask make ore combination gets that business, and builds the machine or whatever, you know, i cant think through the whole thing but there are ways to do that we can use your counsel. While i have a few colleagues here, the chairwoman and i have a bill, h. R. 5517 which is all about modernization of the stockpile inventory and it is about making sure that we can move out expiring products like expiring masks before they expire so that they dont get shipped to states which i do think is happening, that some expired products are going to states. But i would encourage everyone were trying to modernize the stockpile, improve the stockpile, and we welcome your ideas and thoughts. And certainly wish that america had listened more to you starting in 2007 when you said the whole h. H. S. Information came to light. Thank you. My pleasure. The gentlewoman yields back. The chair recognizes the ntleman from california, mr. Cardinass, for his five minutes of question mr. Cardena, for his five minutes of questions. Im going to label you as someone who cares. It sounds like you care about employees. I care about them, i care about the country. I was going to crescendo into loving our country. And i think you love people beyond our country. Were such an amazing example to the world when we do things to our level of capability . I agree. On this issue, i think you know, as well as anybody, we are the way we r part can show the world thousand do things right. How do to the do things for the right reasons. It sounds to me that you have 13 years of trying to get many people, including the federal government, to understand that something is wrong. But its not going to take genius nor is it going to take more money than we could put together to do it. It just means that people need to listen. Pay attention. And then implement. Is that yes. I always said it didnt take a lot of money, just some change, to do things differently. Ive never been accused of being a genius. Are you a genius, sir . I am not a genius and im not stable, sometimes. Youre normal. Im normal. Thank you. I figured that. I describe myself as a goober with a conscious. Conscience. Im just a normal guy. When you hear the term National Security, the issue were talking about today, just what doesmasks, it have spg to do with National Security . 80,000 people have died and not that every single one of them could have been saved, but 80,000 people have died in this pandemic in america. I personally believe that number didnt have to be that high. Had we done more things better. Including getting p. P. E. s or personal protective equipment, specifically masks. The right kind, by the way. I agree with you. I do appreciate you very much. And your willingness to come and speak to the American People. You know youre speaking to congress but youre speaking to the American People. This is live. Thank god some people are atching. You said something about stockpiling. I used to own a little business. I know what its like to care about your employees, to know that if you have to shutter your doors shut down part of your factory, you know families are going to suffer. People youre close to. People you depended on. So i understand. Im getting that from you that you do care about a lot of things including the people if youre going to put them to work you dont want to lay them off later for no good reason. Correct. So the issue of stockpile so the issue of stockpiles, where we allow these kinds of things, for rubber bands to break or what have you that happens, what i envisioned is, you may have alluded to and i may be wrong, a rotation of some sort, cooperation of some sort between a big entity like the v. A. To actually get a synergy of orders and then also rotate that stuff legally and appropriately and safely and properly to other users before those items pirkse expire so we maximize not only production but we minimize waste and we actually get those products where they need to be when they need to be there. If you got everyone involved, ll of the big three hospital distributors, liked meline and cardinal, involved and the government would only have to, im thinking thru this, it wouldnt cost as much as government stockpile. If these people and us all the people in the mask industry, if we all carried more inventory and the government subsidized just that part of it. They wouldnt have to buy i dont know. The thing we could do that. The thing that conservative taxpayers and conservative elected officials dont like is when you talk about subsidizing. But in reality, what does the the example you just gave. The brief example you just gave in the long run the taxpayers would end up spending less. The government would end up spending less. Everybody would end up spending less if we just tried to figure out how to fill that gap properly. Right. Thats what youre talking about, right . Right. What id like to invite you do to, you may have done it, call my office, tony cardenas, ill work with any of my colleagues to introduce a bill to actually enlist and require that activity from the federal government of the United States, lenen enlisting voluntary and required by the government side, so the government should require itself, to do that once and for all. I believe that this would be an example about masks but were going to be able to cross pollinate that amazing, costsave, lifesaving example in other areas of responsibility. The one thing that would be mandatory for that to happen is for americas hospitals to be willing to pay a little more for a mask. Because nobody can match the prices. I know some of my colleagues dont like the word mandate but we could mandate that in a way theyd welcome it. Not with a stick but truly a carrot. But like you said they have to understand how it will work to their benefit. I dont know what the solution is but its preble a government and private industry partnership. The medical industry is full of people who care. Ou guys are people who care. The gentleman yields back. An interesting line of questions. I would just place something on the table here. The empty table. And that is that its one thing for foreign country, china, you know, to make sneakers and tshirts and whatever. But were talking about commodities that truly are part of our National Security. And if anything has laid that bare it is this pandemic. So this is another category and we have to treat it as such. The chair is pleased to recognize the gentleman from georgia, mr. Carter, for his five minutes. Thank you, madam chair. Mr. Bowen, very quickly, ive been in and out. Im a little confused. Help me clear up. I owe my friend the chairlady two minutes so ill give those back to her. Im confused about your current capabilities. You said youve got four lines that are just sitting dormant. Sitting empty right now. Is that correct . Yes, four idle respirator manufacturing lines. And theyre just theyre not being used right now . Yes. But yes, they are not being used . Correct. So you said youve already got the machines for those lines. You dont have to procure them. The only thing youre going to have to do is get staff in order to use those. Theres three things. We need to hire 100 people. We need to train 100 people, we need to get all the materials for that and we need to get niox approval. We bought the systems from a defunct vermont mask Company Seven years ago. We really dont even know how to use those machines. Theyre coined of a last resort. If youll go back and look at my email to dr. Bright, i said this would be basically a pain to do. But theyre here and if we need this for infrastructure lets talk about it. But what weve done in the meantime is weve gone from making 75,000 respirators a month, 75,000. To two million. And then in another 40 days well be at four million. From 75,000. So thats thousands and thousands of but you said you bought those you bought them for a purpose, you bought them to use them . No. Thank you for asking that question. No they came as part of an accusation. We bought a defunct medical company and it just those machines came as part of the accusation. Ok. Did you say earlier that your phone was ringing off the hook . Got orders coming out the yazoo. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But i cant go on as mission. I cant ramp up, hire all these people for something i dont know how its going to end or how long its going to last. And we did this, youve got to remember we almost went out of business doing this before. We ramped up and we spent money and built a bigger factry, hired 150 people, bill more machines and then one day the business not only went away it went smaller than it was and we had to raise 1 million, we had to take pay cuts an had to fire 150 people. We you know so what youre saying is im not trying to put words in your mouth. Youre not going to use them, not going to fire them up unless you get a longterm contract from the government . Im not going ton a suicide mission, absolutely. So thats yes. Youre not going to use them unless you get a longterm contract. Unless i get a customer who is going to use commit to use those machines, so yf to fire 100 people. So that means that youd have to have a longterm contract from the government in order do it. Yeah. Listen weve gone from one sthoist three. 80 people to 200. Were making four times the products we made. Were making over a Million Masks a day. Dont you look at me and act like im sitting on my ass and not firing up four machines. Its not like just turning on a switch. Its putting peoples lives, its going tissue i understand. Im a businessman too. I understand i sat and watched my Business Partner cry when he had to lay those people off. Were not doing that again. So in order its going to have to be a longterm contract from the government though. Thats my point. From somebody. And i get it, from somebody. But why i cant hire 100 people based on a maybe. Based on a when is this going to end . Who knows. None of us can. Whether were in the private sector or public sector. We can be the do that i understand that. Youre not risking your livelihood. I risk my livelihood for 30 years as an independent retail pharmacist. I never had i had contracts. Why dont you buy my machines and you can hire 100 people. Ill give you the machines if i hire 100 people. Youre saying i wont do it unless i get a longterm contract from the government. No, no, no. Go back to the context. The context of that was, in those emails, hey, heres four machines, lets theyre here. I cant turn them on unless its a longterm deal. Im not going to just flip them on and have you flip them off and leave me hanging like last time. Let me tell you what happened last time. The government sits around, doesnt buy American Made products, comes to me in a pandemic, buys millions of masks in 2010, they stored those for 10 years and then they auctioned them to some knucklehead who put them on ebay and sold them for 10 times what they were worth. Not only did i have had i not seen the government in 10 years, i got to compete with my own masks and i got to have thousands of phone calls to me from people who bought that 10yearold mask of mine on ebay for 10 10 times the price, yelling at me. I had nothing do with it. Its because the government waited and sold this stuff. Ive been hit from every side on this thing. We have bled for this country. We have created jobs. We put our factory in texas, when everybody else had already left the country. So dont sit here and judge me for four machines that arent running that id have to hire and fire 100 people for im not going to do it. Not unless you have a longterm government contract. The gentlemans time has expired. I now the chair recognizes the gentleman from california, dr. Ruiz, for his five minutes of questions. Mr. Ruiz thank you, mr. Bowen, for your testimony today. Thank you for trying to sound the alarm on the issues of mask shortage and reliance on foreign manufacturing for over a decade now before anyone had ever heard of covid19. You stated in written testimony, relying so heavily on imported masks is a National Security risk. Unfortunately the last few months have shown us how vulnerable it leaves us during a pandemic. You of course already knew that and tried to do something about it. Unfortunately, those efforts were stifled. If your warnings had been heeded, we would not be in this situation now where doctors and nurses cannot find the personal protective equipment that they need to protect themselves and do their job safely. We all have heard the stories. Doctors, reusing masks that are meant for single use. Nurses wearing garbage bags because theyre out of gowns. This is unacceptable. This is the United States of america and our Frontline Health workers dont even have access to these basic supplies. That is why i introduced the commission on americas medical security act which would direct the National Academies of sciences, engineering and medicine to assess the United States dependence on foreign manufacturing for drugs and medical devices. That bill was included in the cares act which was signed into law in march. Of course the ultimate goal is a system that doesnt put our own access to critical supplies and equipment at risk because we are at the mercy of other countries during a pandemic when they need those supplies for their own populations. It is a health Security Risk that puts american lives on the line and therefore it is a National Security risk. Mr. Bowen, when we get past this crisis and analyze the mistakes that were made in order to not repeat them in the future, how do we restructure a system that so that we arent caught in another preventable mask of or other p. P. E. Shortage in future pandemics . Im not sure. I think we should put together a group of people that includes some of you all and the maskmakers and the mask distributors, the v. A. And d. O. D. , and come up with a plan. Its not rocket science. Its just logistics. And the military is really good at logistics. Great. And also i think too, just to be fair, again, i want to be fair with this. We couldnt this is an extraordinary situation. I make masks for m. D. Anderson Cancer Center. D the Texas Health Resources hospitals in fort worth. And cook childrens hospital. Those are my three biggest accounts. And theyre using, my goodness, theyre using so many more masks. Its not just 10 , 20 . Its hundreds of percent. So could we have made sure everybody had masks . Probably not. But it would have been a lot better than it is now. If we would have heeded the warnings decades ago and created them and ramped up our ability to produce them i believe we could have. There have been reports regarding the safety issue of some of the mask that was been imported. In the past week. And also reports about the f. D. A. Pulling approval for over 60 manufacturers in china for n95 masks after tests showed that they did not meet quality standards. N95 masks filter out 95 of particle, hence their name, but some tests showed many mask pross deuced by chinese manufacturers were, according to one c. D. C. Official, grossly under that number. One of the companies who had their approval removed filtered out only 24 to 35 of particles. As a doctor, who was in the emergency department, emergency physician, during the h1n1, the prospect of this is horrible. It leaves those in the frontlines taking the highest risk with a false sense of security and even higher vulnerability. And while i acknowledge that the f. D. A. Eventually pulled their approvals, it wasnt done before these masks were already in circulation here in the u. S. Can you comment on this development and outline steps we can take to protect our Health Care Workers against substandard masks in the future. Thats not an area of my expertise, i dont know how masks get in the country. I dont know what foreign i dont know how that works. So i dont have a solution for that but it is definitely a problem. Ok. Lets say the president fully and comprehensively used the defense production act and worked with multiple companies and multiple industries to massively produce masks and all the ingredients needed and created a supply chain and also created a Rapid Response team of all the c. E. O. s from those different companies. Would you be willing to participate in that Rapid Response team to handal surge . Im open to any reasonable type of thing. Im not sure if thank you. The government doesnt do real welling moring a lot of different things. Im not sure that would help. Thats why the c. E. O. s as Rapid ResponseAdvisory Team would be helpful. Thank you. The gentleman yields back. Pleasure to be recognize the gentlewoman from michigan, mrs. Dingell, for her five minutes of questions. Mrs. Dingell thank you, madam chair. I want to say i want to start out thanking our chairwoman eshoo and representative susan brooks for their leadership on understanding the stockpile and the need for the country to to be producing these. I think we really need to be talking about the medical supply chain. I am also going to tell you, im a car girl, a manufacturing girl, i think we need to be making a lot more in america. I think that these times have changed us. I dont think people understood supply chain when we used to talk about it. I also think theres going to be Customer Base for respirator i used to call them ventilators, respirator, but the n95 masks that were talking about. I think theres going to be a permanent need in this country. I think we have to talk about the stockpile. As we go forward. Not a new issue. Mr. Bowen, as you have and my colleagues have highlighted, and thats why were all talking about the bills that we have got in and ive got a good, strong ipartisan bill with my colleague, congresswoman jackie walorski, about the medical supplies from pandemics act that would reform the stratenalic national stockpile. I still think we need it, to strengthen Domestic Production of p. P. E. Im also going to say that now, youre just talking about a need for frontline doctors and nurses but as people are going back to work, theres even a broader need for p. P. E. Equipment. Were reopening factories. And the community and Car Manufacturers are putting stringent production, new protocols into place and theyre going to have a need as well. So i think were going to have to talk about what is supply and demand in this country and how do we make sure theres enough and its not only in times of crisis. I think theres going to be a market will. Ford motor is producing n95 masks in my district in michigan. You were going to Say Something . General motors was kind enough to send consultants to us. They worked with us for the last 30 days. So the companies are stepping p. Ford has, without any federal Government Order has produced i cant read this number but theyve been producing a lot of these masks so far. O there is a market out there. Do you have any sense of how many more masks would be on the market if the federal government has taken you on up on your offer in january . And can we will be ate ll short because i dont have a lot of time. Seven million a month. And the medical supplies for pandemics act would increase supply for elastties elasticity. And produce more emergency for emergencies. And this situation underscores the need for future investment in the area. You talked about ramping up supply. You described this decision as a mistake. Why . You dont think you could keep the no, because people stopped buying my products after the andemic. My biggest customer didnt order for seven months because of a glut in the marketplace. But you kept the equipment, the Capital Equipment that you had. I guess im trying to figure out how do we keep production in america . I had three Hospital Systems that spent just 1 million, 1 million on the plane from china to the u. S. To get these n95 masks in paid quadruple the price of what they normally paid to get the masks here. If they would pay 15 or 20 more in peacetime they wouldnt have to do that. What theyve done is, the hospitals created this problem. By trying to save money. And chasing these products to china. I think were going to bring the supply chain back to this country period so we dont have to chase them and weve got to figure out but whats funny is i see hospitals now in the middle of this saying yeah, were going to switch back to american but only 25 or 30 . They still want to buy chinese products. Its not going to all come back. People arent going to pay for t. Thank you. The gentlewoman yields back. Now id like to there isnt anyone on the minority side, right . All right. The gentlewoman from New Hampshire. Ms. Kuster, for her five minutes of questions is recognized. Thank you, mr. Bowen, thank you for being with us. We appreciate it. This here is a homemade mask which is what people in state is what people many any in my state of New Hampshire has had to to because we couldnt get the mask we have tried in a ipartisan way. We have a federal delegation thats democrat, we we have a governor thats republican, we all scrambled behind the scenes. Eventually we were told because we werent a hot spot, were a small state, a rural state, we have plenty of covid19s. You may know dean who took two flights to china and came back with the equipment, the supply, the masks. And so we need to understand how we got here and why nobody was listening to you. About the production of mask heres in america. I want to revisit we do that in the department of defense all the time. Do many tank manufacturers you expect make a tank not knowing whether the government it, right . O buy i mean, thats where we are, right . Protect our product to our people, to protect the American People. And my colleague, mrs. Dingell, correct. Tely yes, its the frontline workers. Every night, in thinking of sleepless nights of people exposedme who have been all day long and theyre going home to their children because hey didnt have the equipment that they needed. They didnt have we wouldnt harms way,ops into and we are sending our health way. Providers into harms o just walk me through, if you will, what is it when you warned shortage, what did the u. S. You said mask supply is at imminent risk. That hrough what convey . U are trying to mr. Bowen what i was trying to convey to dr. Bright was that china was in the process of mask supply and that china supplies about half of the mask supply. Was already ly tight so imagine half of it going away. Now, heres what i didnt say. Other half. The if mexico gets in really big might not get that supply too. Ad china not been able to get their supply or their disease under control and mexico had trouble, the entire u. S. Ask supply would have been cut off. We dodged a bullet by just having part of it cut off. Ms. Kuster are you familiar in the department of defense with why we in america and do that . Trump a i sent mr. To er in 2017, i sent it everybody on his staff and it said, please i can give you letter. It said, please, make the d. O. D. Use. A. Make the d. O. D. The amendment, masks are covered berry amendment. We spent thousands and thousands an attorney that masks should be under the berry amendment because its clothing berry amendment handles military clothing and they shot it down. Any response from the Trump Administration. But i also wrote the obama 20 letters and they sent me a form letter back. Know, this is everybody. This is everybody. I am not throwing any bus. Istration under the this is everybody. Process in the mr. Bowen no. Ms. Kuster you are trying to help the American People. Mr. Bowen i get really mad about this and i tend to pop off and im sorry. This. t used to be like let me say this frustrated. Youre mr. Bowen i didnt used to swear before. Kuster i have let loose a few words that my mother would be shocked by because people are hurting, right . We cant protect ourselves. Fundamental are you a parent . Mr. Bowen i have five children, living. My oldest son my oldest son same thing mr. Of and i have d 16 children. Ms. Kuster and every night you go to bed, youd do everything protect them and thats the position we are in. Were trying to protect the American People. Protect our own families. I wish youd been listened to. Say this. Let me im getting 500 to 1,000 emails a day. Emails from people, not businesses. I am getting emails from moms. Emails from old people. Please, send me masks. I ms. Cus h a product you make that helps people. Mr. Bowen i cant make the product to help people. Email i sent all these people and i said for years, you cant wait we cant wait until the pandemic we do something about it. And its time to fix it. We had 13 freaking years to fix it. Thats the travesty. Couldnt thing i figure out why nobody hardly would listen. Universal. Like s. Kuster well, ill close by saying this, note to self, dont eliminate the office of pandemic preparedness. Thank you for being here with us today and i yield back. Pleasure. My ms. Eshoo the gentlewoman yields back. Concludes our second panel. Want to thank you, again, mr. For coming here today, flying across the country, all the complications of that. Part so many flights canceled. You on the phone nd urged you to actually come why, hington, you said, and i said, because i think patriot. Youve been on this for more decade. And i think youve more than proven that today. Every Single Member thats here. Tenacity and your about a commodity that is a part National Security, i wish listened to. But now its our job to listen make sure that essentially can come to an end. You shouldnt have to spend years knocking on doors. So your testimony, i think, has the needle. And you should i hope you gratified. E feeling youll be totally satisfied when we really get this done. Your testimony has been youre a truth teller. Unvarnished. And refreshing, i might say. A lot of witnesses here, and there are all kinds of that, but yours is truthis a special form of telling. Its refreshing. And its filled with the kind of content for us to not only take it d but that we and we run with it. I started out the hearing today saying, i never thought that hearing its really so sad. Of all of this re 80,000 souls that have been lost that we a lost, that we of the ing the needs American People in this crisis. Hen it comes to what you make, were not we cant even keep make sure that doctors, nurses, health care have the supplies, the critical supplies that they need. Its shameful in our country. Very grateful to you for coming. Mr. Bowen thank you. You to o where we want stay healthy. We need you. Able to rs will be submit they all know they can submit questions and pursuant to the Committee Rules they have 10 usiness days to submit additional questions for the record be to answered by the yourself. N this case, and also, again, we ask you to promptly to any such request. Again. K you, i have just a little bit of here. Eeping i request unanimous consent to following documents into the record excuse me chair, unless its absolutely required, ill waive the reading of the list, if and its my ght, understanding that we had documents we had a hard time they g to you and we ask the record to without objection, as well. Ms. Eshoo i reserve the right for the majority to review them done so, then place them in the record. Appreciate the gentleman agreeing or waiving the consent request. Could i ask for the record in a mr. Bowen that e referenced be entered in the record. Ms. Eshoo what letter is that . Referenced a u letter you sent to the administration about the making of masks. Yes. Owen sent tond the letters i both the Obama Administration and the ms. Eshoo if you can get that bowen and both sides can review and with the approval, of both sides, we can place them in the record. Mr. Bowen yes, maam. Like the letters i sent to secretary mattis and to others . Ms. Eshoo yes. Mr. Griffith i know it was probably said in frustration but indicated to you i had a number of companies that got back in the business and one of integrated textile solutions that theyll take the machines if you really want to rid of them. Just let me know. Mr. Bowen well work something out. Griffith ill put you together. Ms. Eshoo on behalf of all the members, we want to thank the Committee Staff on both sides. Is this is our new way operating. And as everyone makes the adjustments, youre doing the so that we can make thatdjustment to make sure directives of the capitol out. Cians office has put i cant thank you enough. I mean, youve been ive been you. Ing i even said to mike, you dont have gloves on. All of you, to salute you. You. , mr. Bowen, thank to the rest of the guests in the room, thank you. Maybe some of us are going to go have breakfast and lunch combined, Something Like that. Think we kind of earned our keep today with four six time on wellspent behalf of the people of our country. The house t, subcommittee is adjourned. Mr. Bowen thank you for the invitation. [captions Copyright National cable satellite corp. 2020] [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy. Visit ncicap. Org] has unfiltered coverage of the federal response to the coronavirus pandemic with white house briefings, updates from governors and congress, and program callin washington journal, hearing your thoughts about the coronavirus crisis. Any of our issed live coverage, watch anytime on demand at cspan. Org coronavirus. The u. S. House returns friday a. M. Eastern for legislative business to dedebate debate and vote on a Coronavirus Relief package. The bill provides over 3 state and lief to local governments, funding for First Responders and Health Workers and money for families. S and the house is also expected to debate and vote on house rules allow for proxy voting on the house floor during he Public Health emergency period. Fridays house session is expected to last late into the distancing to social guidelines. Watch live coverage on cspan, cspan. Org, or listen with the free cspan radio app. Briefly spoke to reporters before departing the white house earlier today to medical Equipment Distribution Center in pennsylvania. The president , along with health and Human Services secretary alex azar, reacted to testimony by rickol hill