Joining us from his home is the author, howard means. Thank you for being with us. What happened and why did four students die and nine others were injured . Thats a big question. In the ultimate large sense of this, all the toxic orders of together atlowed Kent State University and the first weekend of may in 1970 it was an age of hate. Was an age of distrust. It was a generational divide. Right now, the museum laura davis was talking about, does a wonderful job of capturing all of this. Is a gem of the museum. That has a wonderful walk you can take, narrated and if you are anywhere near kent, stop and do it. In the more immediate sense, you nixons speech to that thursday, in which he announced the extension of the war into cambodia, after saying he was going to bring 150,000 troops and that was a time bomb waiting to opt, which it did the next evening in the bars offcampus. There were windows broken and trash cans set on fire. The real problem with that demonstration was it convinced the mayor of kent that outside agitators had taken over the campus. And the whole thrust of the dog whistling from the white house under Richard Nixon and from the governor mansion under jim rhodes, was outside agitators, outside agitators. 1130 11 30 call me to the governors office, asking for help and that is how the guard ended up there. And the guard change the whole equation and changed what the demonstrations were about. Did governor james rhodes issue any shoot to kill by the National Guard . Was that a directive from the state capital . Where did that come from . I do not think there was ever a directive. The guard, however, consisted of a bunch of untrained guys, many of them about the same age as the students and the people fighting in vietnam. One sniperarrying m rifles, lethal to a thousand feet, to do crowd control. M1, witness the wound. Anybody hit the next day in a vulnerable spot was dead. There is no question when that kind of gun hits you. You had untrained people carrying guns they had never used. Armed guns. Novi on campus they were carrying live ammunition. That president nobody on campus knew they were carrying live ammunition. The president never asked and nobody asked. There was never a shoot to kill order that i know of. There is a lot of debate about that. About what happened in the heat of things right before shots were fired. Jim rhodes called the guard and the guard happened to be in akron helping to control things during a teamster strike. So was easy for them to get there. It also met the guard was tired. They had been doing for five days in akron. There was ared, running protest. The guard took over the campus without asking the administration if they could take over the campus. The Administration Never protected the campus as they should have. They never protected their students as they should have. It is a combination of volatile circumstances happening at once. The students had no leadership to take particularly. The University Leadership went awol at the moment they were needed the most. The guard was terribly directed, by general canterbury. And the governors office, while not having issued a shoot to kill order, was pressing very hard, to make this a cracked on outside agitators and crime. Because jim rhodes was running for governor for the senate at the time. He had used up his terms as governor. He was in a contention, the twostate the day after the shooting was the republican primary. Robertan contention with taft junior, the son of mr. Ojai republican, and a long time senator taft. Mr. Ohio republican. Before all this began, the day nixon made his speech, paul had a poll had taft winning by 60,000 votes in the primary. Rhodes hit the dog whistle. He needed southern ohio to come on strong for him, more conservative part of the state. On the tuesday, that he after the shootings, he lost by 5000 votes. It almost worked for him. At the end of the day, four students died. Tell us about those four students. Wasriting the book heartbreaking for all sorts of reasons. None of it was more heartbreaking than the four who died. And Jeffrey Miller were two who were active in the demonstrations that weekend. Jeffrey miller was fairly near the guard when this happened. He happened to be shooting them the bird at the moment he was shot so you have to assume he was targeted specifically. Alison krauss is further back but she had been prominent within that weekend demonstrations. She was also very easy to pick out in the crowd. She was a very attractive, tall women. She was beautiful in a 1970s way. Certain she had to of been targeted. Bill schroeder had just transferred. Year atnsfer from one Colorado School of mines and he was in the rotc and on the bask about team he transferred. He has books in his arms and he had stopped by because he was curious. He was not a demonstrator. He was hit. An m1 bullet and the person next to him were members seeing him picked off the ground and thrown back. The most heartbreaking was sandy ueur, she was passing between classes, a therapy major. She is doing what students were supposed to do. On a campus that probably should not have been open. But rhodes did not want the campus to close down. That would been buckling to the demonstrators. She is standing next to a guy named ellis burns who says get down. The shooting only last 13 seconds. She falls to the ground. He looks over and she has a hole in her throat and she is bleeding out almost immediately. Those are heartbreaking. That people wounded are heartbreaking. Dean kaler is not radical at all. , heust happened to be there called his teachers to tell them he would not be in class, because he was that kind of guy. He is hit in the spine and has been without the use of his legs ever since. We want to thank Kent State University for providing us many of the pictures you are seeing to take a look back at exactly what happened 50 years ago, on the campus of Kent State University, may 4, 1970. Four students were killed and nine others were injured. Howard means is joining us from his home. We have a line set aside for those who remember what was happening. If you are in college in the late 1960s are the early 1970s, please give us a call. 2027488002. The other question is, why did they have live ammunition . Great question. Terrible judgment. The metagetting fact for the guard is they have to get, they get the armaments the mitigating factor for the guard is they have to get the armaments from the. Everything else was in use by the military. Things would have been so much better if they wouldve had shotguns loaded with buckshot, birdshot, it wouldve been so much better. The israelis began oozing rubber bullets at that time using rubber bullets at that time. Instead, they have world war ii sniper rifles with live ammunition. The other thing, they try to do crowd control with tear gas. They fired a lot of teargas, but they misjudged their stock of teargas. So on monday, after the demonstration moves out over this hill, and the guard is pursuing them and hurting them on the other the hill, firing teargas, the guard runs out of teargas. Herding them. As they come back up the hill, before they turned to do the shooting, they have no teargas left. And they are getting hit with a certain amount of debris. Stones, pieces of wood. Initially, the guard had pushed them down over the hill into a construction site. Back. Rry, i take this the guard had marched themselves downhill into a culdesac next to a construction site, a practice field. The students are there and they have all the stuff they can pick up and throw so theres a certain amount of debris. But nobody is injured badly enough to justify this, in any way shape or form. It is interesting to look at the depositions of the guardsmen the next day. They were deposed quickly and they answered exact whether commanders told him to say. They are deposed again in 1973 in a court action. And again in 1975. As you read these depositions, one after the other, from the same guardsmen, you can see how they are rearranging events and their minds to justify their actions in a way. These are the guardsmen who actually shot rifles. They do not necessarily hit anybody but they shot the rifles. The debriefing gets more and more lethal and they are seeing the world from under a gas mask. And it is a different way to see the world when youre under gas mask. You have to have 74 the guard because they were terribly led. Theou have to have 74 guard, because they were terribly led. Was anyone charged in the National Guard for these killings . No. A number of students were charged and had to appear in the local court. No guardsmen were charged. There was cybill axman taken against there was civil action taken against the guard. Was 40 million and the settlement was 650,000, and half of that went to dean kaler, the one most severely injured. Amongst was just riveted the other was disturbing it was distributed among the other, it worked out to around 50,000 a person, all paid by the taxpayers of ohio. This is the headline in one of the iconic photographs from may of 1970, from the cleveland plain dealer. How big a story was this nationally, in 1970 . It was absolutely huge. And the story unfolded in a complicated way. Because the first accounts have the guardsmen being shot, not the students being shot. It was chaotic the way information flowed. Theres one will seen in my book there is a wonderful scene in my book where people are sitting in the backyard in kent and someone is working on the roof and he shouts to them and he is listening to the radio. He said they shot the guardsmen. They shot the guardsmen. The parentst of guardsmen were as, more terrified initially, than the parents of students. Then, once it came through that students had been shot. The photo you are looking at, of marianne and yvette you, is one vecchio, of marianne is one of the iconic photos of the antiwar movement. Of domestic american photos it may be the most powerful one. She was not a student. Runaway fromeuros florida who happened to be there at that moment at that time, standing next to. She was a 14yearold runaway from florida standing next to Jeffrey Miller when he was hit. That frozen moment. She is there. Tellse woman next to her about this in her oral history and said she put her arms around her to try to comfort her. She said she was like a block of ice, frozen and bone cold. An emotional book to work on. The book by our guest, howard means, 57 shots, kent state and the end of american innocence. Your phone calls. Mark is first up, from orlando, florida. Good morning and thank you for taking my call. I was a freshman at the university of missouri income lobbying missouri in columbia, missouri. 1970, ipring of remarried those unfortunate days i remember those unfortunate days. My understanding is cooler heads did not prevail on either side. Had the students not continued with demonstrations, things may have been different . And the story was, there was a professor who helped to get students out of the line of fire. Because of his efforts, many students did live. That was the story. Thank you and treat up you. Thank you. You are right on on all the subjects. Cooler heads did not prevail. Nobody had a plan b. They were all heading toward this disaster. The students did not have particularly good leadership this is ironic in a way the students for a democratic society, the most radical element on campus, had been banned the Previous Year because of actions in 1969. They knew how to run demonstrations. A guy makes this point very powerfully, they knew how to run demonstrations. The students were in a sense lead her list and reacting in a sense leaderless. The University Leadership did not do what they should have done. Everybody knew there was going to be a demonstration at noon on monday there was no question about it. The administration said they were not sure about it so they sent the president and all of the top people were all starting derbye lunch at the brown restaurant while students and the guard were there. That was a failure of leadership, a failure of cooler heads, no doubt about it. The guard had no alternative, and what they did from a Strategic Point of view was stupid, to march themselves over a hill and into a culdesac. To your third point, the guy you are talking about is glenn frank, he is a geology professor, he was the hero of the story. After the shootings, the students go back to the other side of this hill. Several thousand students were over there by then. The guard is back at the far end of the comments. They have regrouped, they have rearmed. Insane with are anger, testosterone. X onof them are painting their chest and talking about charging the guard. If they have charged, hundreds would have died, they would have been mowed down. Three teachers, including glenn frank, try to talk them back. Glenn frank becomes deeply emotional and his speech to the students glenn frank wasnt excimer. He has a flat top glenn frank was an ex marine. Just pleads, he is crying, you are going to be slaughtered wholesale. The students finally back off. That bursts the bubble. Experience his son agreed it broke glenn frank. He was never the same again. A mystery whybeen there was no statue of glenn frank on the kent state campus. Host we have a photo of what looks like with the students fleeing the area where they were being shots fired. Davis, who was a student at kent state as she reflected 10 years ago. [video clip] i looked out over this scene dozens what seemed like of clusters of people standing in groups, looking down at the ground. Seeing in what i was this huge scene was people standing over bodies on the ground. Over tople did was go the slope and stage a sitin. It was like being in a class. People were sitting in rows. What made it more like a class for me was my geology instructor, glenn frank, was pacing back and forth in front the rows of people and he as he did on the stage in cartwright hall, when i was taking his geology class. But, the difference was this time he was crying, he was pleading with us to leave because he was convinced, and he convinced the students who were staging the sitin that if we did not leave, the guard would engage in further violence against the students, so we did what he asked us to do and we followed him to the other side of the commons. The people i was sitting with, we made a plan and we decided we would follow glenn frank across the commons, but when we got to the other side, we each chose a weection we would run in and figured that if we ran in different directions, that if the guard started shooting again, they would not be able to kill everybody and somebody would be alive to tell the story. Host laura davis was a freshman in 1970 and that oral history was put together by Kent State University. Nancy is on the phone from california. Good morning. Caller good morning and thank you so much mr. Means. I was 12. My brother was in college at the university of texas. My parents were against the war. What laura davis said when her father walked in and saw her and said they should have killed , because i just gasped i thought she was going to say that her father would say, thank god you were all right. I feel so fortunate my parents were against the war. Question to mr. Means is, maybe you cover this already, did this turn the country against the war even more . Host thank you, nancy. Guest it is a very good question. I think laura davis made the point earlier that it had. There is another side to that. Think the war was winding down, and nixon would have liked to have brought the troop some, but he did not know how to do it. Tet offensive, things started sliding backward. Itinitely polarized further polarized a polarized nation. Do, i think it had a lot to with 18yearolds finally getting to vote. Energized a fading movement in a way. Radicalized the Democratic Party so much that in 1972, they nominated george mcgovern, who did not have a snowballs chance of winning, when they could have nominated someone who could have actually given nixon a run for his money. In a way, they almost guaranteed a second term for nixon. Of course, he blew the opportunity. It is a twosided thing. Time was a High School Teacher in washington, d. C. Students were juniors and seniors. One of the reasons it affected me so strongly then was it could have been my students. They were one year removed from the students i was teaching. I was not all that far removed. The story that laura told was repeated time and again. Students going home from kent, being told someone wished they had shot them all. There, talked about a student coming back the campus was cleared. About two days later, this student shows up and sits down in his living room and he is crying. The teacher said what is wrong . This student had gone home as laura did, he knocked on the door and the front door was locked. He knocked harder and the mail slot pushes open and he hears his parents voices saying, we never want to hear you again. That broke my heart. Stephanie is on the phone from long beach, california. Thank you for waiting. Good morning. Caller good morning. Me ins very painful to many ways. So many disappointments. There was so much hope at the same time. The injustice of sending boys off to war who could not vote was something that was clearly i was 20 years old back then. I was at school at nyu. Authorities, the whoever they are, was willing to fortheir own children die protesting a war that in so many ways was unjust. This came after the assassinations. There was so much hope to change the world for the better and then all of these things just crushed that hope. Lying and resigning before he could be impeached and then pardon, that was the end of hope in a way for so many of us. Pigr that, i retreated to a farm and decided i would go back to nature because the politics i was so active in were so crushing. It was so emotional at the time. Emotions likehose a 20yearold. It was just crushing. Host thank you. Let me add to her point. Parentsrations of the with world war ii and the korean conflict, the assassination of president kennedy and dr. Martin luther king, how did all of this envelop into 1970 . The mood of the country, students and parents . This toxice was all flow from out of the 1960s that happen to come together. In a way, it is important. Kent state is part of the story here. If these events had happened at berkeley or at columbia, at the university of wisconsin, where there was entrenched student leadership, and where the university had some experience with serious protest, i think the result would have been different. A 21,000 person i dont mean this as an insult the students were naive, a lot of them. A lot of them were studying to be High School Teachers, that is originally why kent state came to exist. As a 25yearold teacher then myself, i had a sense of how naive teachers were. Believedhe students that the guardsmen, at least initially, the guardsmen were there to help them, protect them. They could not imagine for the life of them that the guard would actually shoot them. I think students at a place like 1970, wouldmay 4, not have that naivety. That plays into this. The combination of diameter, horrible forces the toxication of naivety, forces, there was a time bomb that was going to explode somewhere and it exploded, unfortunately, at kent and killed four students that should never have been killed. Host jerry lewis was a member of the faculty and he reflected what he saw. [video clip] we were worried about the bayonets on the rifles. We had no inclination the guns were loaded, which of course they were. As we were beginning to walk down the hill from taylor hall to where the activists were, the National Guard started coming across the comments and began to tear gas the demonstrators, the observers. Hall, up past taylor turned left and went into the parking lot. As i got to the parking lot, i saw a student some distance off laying on the ground. It turned out to be a blind student who had been teargas. I gave him some first aid. I was standing there. Theame up the hill guardsmen fired. I had been in the army so i knew those were real bullets. Sound,ravels faster than so i dove for cover behind a bush and was on the ground quick enough and the guard finish their firing and 13 seconds. I stood up and remembered saying to myself, what should i do . Blankent said, those are s, were they . Was one of the four students that were killed. Here are their photographs. Michigan, good morning. Caller good morning, gentlemen. I was a 20yearold soldier in vietnam when kent state happen. I was an antiwar activist i joined the military to work against the war in vietnam. When that happened, i was receiving antiwar literature. Vietnam up and i joined veterans against the war. A short time later, after the airbase,e incident on there was an incident i cant say if it was revenge or had any incident to the kent state massacre. From my talking to the soldiers at that time that is what i would do, talk to soldiers and get their opinions of what is going on, and most of them did not care or they were kind of glad it happened. 25 years later, Vietnam Veterans against the war did go to kent state to participate in a memorial service. You had a question earlier, professor, in which someone asked if there were any other incidents like this, in my recollection, in south carolina, 10 black students were massacred for protesting the war on their campus. Can you give me more information on that, sir . Host howard means, how you answer that . Guest three things. Number one, jerry lewis just jerryy, i remember asking about, you have any sense this was live ammunition . He told me he had been a guard at fort knox when he was in the army, protecting the nations gold supply, carried a rifle and it never had live ammunition in it. Open my book with americanss of the 24 who died in vietnam on may 4, 1970. Half of them were 20 years or younger. You have to keep that in perspective. Four dead there, 24 dead there. Third, the event you were talking about was jackson State University in mississippi. Later, the 10 days 14th of may. Two killed, 10 wounded. The students had started a protest because there was a rumor that someone had been murdered. Troopersssippi state showed up and sprayed the dormitory with gunfire. 150 rounds fired in 28 seconds. That story just disappeared. It disappeared in the Scranton Commission report. Book, kentn the bites dog story. Civilians being killed by american soldiers. Unfortunately, jacks estate was a dog bites man story. Blacktroopers firing on students in 1970 in mississippi was not unheard of. Host pennsylvania, you are next. Caller thank you. Junior atventh term penn State University when we situation. The what made me more unique was the fact i was a vietnam veteran, i was a medic. I spent most of my time at the dispensary. Have widespread writing on the campus. There were a number we had widespread rioting on the campus, there were fires that were set. Even though there were no National Guard troops on the campus, we had a large detachment of Pennsylvania State troopers. This is the thing i will always remember. As i was walking up rutledge road, i noticed there was a state trooper who was injured by flying debris. My instinct, having been a medic, was to run over to him and render assistance, but i had long hair. If i had moved toward the comrades, his other there were three or four other state troopers that came to his aid, probably would have clubbed me, so i kept on moving. I really wanted to render aid to the state trooper. Advice thatme good i was given while i was in vietnam. He said keep your head down and be good. Of few i added, be a man words. Thank you for your book. I am going to read it, because that is an important part of my life and history. Host thank you for the call from pennsylvania. Report by thethe former governor of pennsylvania. This is what the cover looks like from the 1970s. Your response to that caller . Guest that is a sad story when you cant render help and you have to fight your instincts. It just goes to show you how the nation was. An absence of trust. The next weekend, there is a huge demonstration in washington the next weekend. I remember walking down to that. Wisconsin andr of massachusetts avenue nw, you had to go through two circles to get to the mall. A jeep with four soldiers i think they were army all of them was semi automatics just staring at you through their sunglasses. It was scary. At the white house that we can, they had done what they do other buses andhey took surrounded the white house to make a wall. They brought the 82nd airborne thend they were staying at executive office building. The white house was an armed encampment at that point. That was the famous moment when Richard Nixon at 3 30 in the theing to show his valet washington monument. They get up, they get dressed and go down to the mall with secret Service People with them. There are tens of thousands of people sleeping in the mall and nixon starts waking them up so he can talk to them. There is a famous photo of nixon, he is neatly dressed. People aree looking looking at him. Just a very, very strange moment. Point, in a way, nixons chief of staff argued afterward that in a way, kent state broke nixon. It was the end of his presidency in this regard he had charged J Edgar Hoover with finding him proof that kent state was started by outside agitators. It was not caused by outside agitators, it was students at the school. Hoover could not when was unable to produce this evidence, nixon lost his faith in the fbi informed his own unit. They broke into the Democratic National headquarters and watergate followed. I think it is a legitimate point. Host if you travel to the campus of Kent State University, there is a memorial that reflects on exactly what happened on may 4, 1970, 50 years ago. We will listen to gary here in washington, d. C. Good morning. Gary, are you with us . Caller yes i am. Good morning and thank you, mr. Means. This is wonderful. Mr. Nixons speech was incendiary to those of us on the left in those years and at that moment. It was complaining about students destroying civilization, the universities. People on the left i was on the left did not believe him. I was teaching at Western Michigan University at the time and we knew kent state very well. Kent state could have happened anywhere because these demonstrations across the country were spontaneous. Young men did not want to fight in this war and that probably was a very critical factor. I agree with the caller from penn state, you could tell in those years which side you were on by how you dressed. This is the question i want to ask is the country more divided today or then . My own view is it is more divided today because you cant tell who people are by the way they dress. The absence of a credible news media. People retreat into their own holes, they go to the left or the right, and i think the division is deeper. What do you think . Host let me add the fact we had a draft in the 1970s. Question i is a spent a lot of time thinking about lately, especially with the anniversary. I dont know the answer. Dividedin 1970, it was more by age. In our own time, it is divided horizontally. Obviously, on the republican side, it is an older and whiter audience. Dont have at we credible news media, i do think we have a credible news media, but you can hibernate with any news view you want. Kent state was reported by three networks and a handful of magazines that you trusted time, newsweek, life. Cronkite and one other person huntley brinkley. You could not cocoon in your own news world. You can cocoon in your own news world now, which gives you a support system for whatever you want to believe. It was much harder to do that in 1970. A good point that there was a draft in 1970. Obviously, the vietnam war was the end of the draft. We can argue if National Service should be reinstated. History, thisoral one from 2013 from a student from kent state, what he saw, heard and remembered. [video clip] why are they firing . We were not posing a threat. And that i thought to myself, i am sure they are not firing live ammunition, they are firing blanks as a way to try to disperse the crowd. After four or five seconds of firing, i realized, even if they are firing blanks, i am close enough i could be injured. It was at that point i dove to the ground and they continue to fire another seven or eight seconds. Firing is whened i stood up, looked around, and saw clearly the hidden firing live ammunition because there were students injured around me. Base of that sculpture. Cleary was the first person i saw who was not getting up when the rest of us were. Shirt and saw he had a bullet wound in his chest. Host reflecting on what happened 50 years ago. Lets get back to your phone calls. Waynesboro, pennsylvania. Good morning. Caller good morning. In 1970, i was 19 years old. I was a student at the university of maryland in college park. I wanted to read a paragraph i wrote about the kent state killings. I wrote this several years ago. Background, in 1969, 1970, 1971, they were huge demonstrations against the vietnam war in washington, d. C. One of the demonstrations, the Washington Post estimated there were more than one Million People there. Were justnstrations getting larger and larger. Maryland,versity of and many other colleges, there were demonstrations across the country. At the university of maryland, the National Guard was called in and i was covering some of those demonstrations for the student newspaper, as was the entire staff of the newspaper at that time. So that is just some background. Here is what i wrote about kent state. Students 1970, four were shot dead by ohio National Guards men at ohios Kent State University. I remember that day vividly. Prior to that day, it was a heavy time for young people and students. It seemed like older people and some politicians were paying attention to the protests and their messages. But when i heard about the four students who were killed, it was chilling. I was stunned. It stopped me cold. I remember thinking, this is a war and the guns are aimed at us. Host thank you for the call from pennsylvania. I am going to add to that because we have another student on the phone. Betty is joining us from austin, texas. What do you remember . Lunch, i was having was at lake hall, it had a view of the hillside. I saw the puff of smoke after the shots were not. Something may be go to the doors of the hall and opened the doors and it was a good thing, because there were stampeding students who were trying to get away from the shots and the danger. T is nice to see mr. Means research of what he has done. It is accurate. There were so many things that were so inaccurate for so many years. Robert mitchum wrote a bestseller that was totally inaccurate, saying he was there. He totally was not there. His descriptions were 180 degrees different from what actually transpired. I happen to have known about 9 10 of the people he interviewed for the book and they gave different recollections from which they were quoted. Mr. Means being accurate, it changed many peoples lives, including my own. I moved to texas. Mom and dad were not paying for school anymore after that. Go, asefore we let you that day unfolded and you had a chance to reflect on what you saw, having been on campus at Kent State University, can you recall what you were thinking later in the day and into the evening . Caller we all had hair standing up on the back of our next. We were horrified and had adrenaline more than ever before. More than we had ever experienced in our young lives. We did not know how to take anything. Vieward all the points of and they were all consistent and accurate. Meansnice to hear mr. Saying accurate things about what went on. Afterwards, the whole point of view was inaccurate. I did something something very bizarre, i went to the site where the killings took place and i picked up some of the bullet shows. I dont know why i did, but i just did. The bullet shells were still hot, they burned my hands and i dropped them. There was a controversy about who it was doing the shooting was it the students or the guardsmen . I wanted to get the word out. Kent paper, i called the kent police, i called the fbi, i called the cleveland police, i called the cleveland dealer, i called to let people know that i could describe the shells and nobody ever took my statement. Youth against the establishment. That was our point of view at the time. Call,thank you for the now living in austin, texas. In 1970. At kent state your thoughts . Guest they are wonderful stories. It just reminded me, when i started this book, i did not know there were 125 oral histories sitting in the library at Kent State University. I dove into those and read every one of them. Everyone one of them tells a story and half of them are heartbreaking stories. Cache ofamazing documentation. The university is to be congratulated of the care they have taken. Initially, they wanted to obliterate the memory of what happened, but laura davis and some other people, jerry lewis, have convinced them to do this the right way. Histories are a treasure and a heartbreak. It is emotional to read them. Host the book is titled 67 shots kent state and the end of american innocence. How did itestion end our innocence . Sense,the most immediate it ended our innocence in thinking the guard would always protect us, that the military would not fire on american citizens. I think it had a profound effect on antiwar movement, generally. The innocence of the 1960s, you could smoke all of the pot you wanted what you were protesting. Grownups were afraid of you. I think this is reasserting the is reassuring authority over citizens in an unattractive way. Host howard means joining us from his home in virginia. We thank you for being with us on the 50th cspans washington journal live every day with news and policy issues that impact you. Monday morning we talk with eleanor republican representative rodney davis, Illinois Republican representative. About operations during the pandemic. And then a discussion of congressional response to the pandemic with the director of the Wilson Centers congressional relations, erin jones. And look at changes in how the Supreme Court functions with the National Constitution center. Why cspans washington journal live at 7 00 a. M. Eastern on monday. Join the discussion and watch a saturday at 8 00 a. M. Eastern when we take calls from High Schoolers across the country preparing to take the advanced basement u. S. History exam advanced placement is history exam. Tonight on q a, how south sudanese video game valid per is bringing peace and how a south sudanese video game developer is bringing peace and conflict resolution. Much of the population is under the age of 30. These young people were born in war and raised in war. They think about war. When i was playing grand theft auto, i thought how about if these young people from south sudan Start Playing a videogame, not because it is so violent. A videogame is the same as what is happening in my country, killing people. And it would feel like this is how things are done. And i thought, how about creating a video game for peace and conflict resolution . Watch tonight at 8 00 p. M. Eastern on cspans q a. House waysorum with and Means Committee chairman richard neal and mayors talking about the Financial Impact of the coronavirus eidetic on cities. Desk run virus pandemic