Us, as well. Our condolences go out to the American People. Specifically, we are here to discuss the administration and femas response to the pandemic. While the entire nation has been certain states, such as new jersey have been hit particularly hard. Im grateful to the fema employees i know are working hard to help us get through this. However i think there is serious concerns about the leadership coming from the white house during this pandemic as well as a need for greater level of transparency around new initiatives of fema. Here today to discuss the , administrations response, my colleague from the Homeland Security committee, representative val demings. Representing florida and being a former First Responder herself, representative demings is no stranger to disaster. Additionally, we have a special guest online today, the former fema administrator under the obama administration, craig fugate. Before leaving fema, he headed the Florida Division of Emergency Management. Before that, he worked in the Emergency Management and the local level in florida. With experience at the federal, state, and local levels, there is not a better guest to discuss what is going on. As fema leads a response to the coronavirus. The information is important for the general public as well as us conducting oversight of the response which has been seen, which has seen fema involved in the largest Disaster Response of the agencys history. I look forward to hearing your thoughts on some of these developments as well as where congress should focus their efforts to help boost femas response, as well as provide proper oversight on the agencys activities. Now i will recognize representative demings so she can give opening remarks. Rep. Demings good morning. Thank you again, mr. Chairman, for bringing us together for this critical and important discussion. Also to my fellow floridian, craig fugate, thank you for being with us today to try to determine where we are or have a discussion about where we are and, more importantly, where we need to go from here. I want to thank you for your service to florida and to our country. You have, craig, on so many occasions, helped us prepare for the storms ahead and helped us to recover and restore after the disaster passed. We have a new storm that is big and deadly. Im extremely concerned about the administrations response. I am also concerned about local and state governments being able to get the help and resources that they need. We know that fema has a major role to play. The Vice President said fema would coordinate the outbreak response activities. I look forward to assessing where we are in our response with a focus on transparency, coordination and necessary oversight. Mr. Chairman, again, thank you for bringing us together. Craig fugate, thank you for joining us. I yield back. Rep. Payne thank you. Mr. Fugate, if you dont mind, i would like to jump in to questions. Actually, let me give you a few minutes to give an overview of the response the you have seen at fema during this pandemic. Fmr. Fema admin. Fugate well, as anybody has watched, when fema was placed in the job of helping coordinate all this, this goes back to the planning we did in the h1n1 pandemic, looking at sars and mers, and then ebola. Fema would be a support agency to the centers for Disease Control and health and human services. We would bring the resources of fema to support them, including logistics, things like the air bridge, which are things fema has done for other disasters. So, it was a bit different to see fema placed in the lead role, particularly since this was a primary health emergency. Femas job is, as the president directs, to coordinate crisis response. A lot of people thought fema would not be able to do this and Everything Else they are doing. I wont say it is easy but they are still responding to disasters. Theyre managing this. The key questions as we move through this are what has , worked, but also more importantly, what do we need to do differently next time . We have a second wave being forecasted with covid19. Hurricane season is not going to be postponed. So we need to get to the questions of what was working, and lets codify and make sure we dont lose that. Not so much what went wrong, the better question is, what do we need to do differently to prepare for the next pandemic, the next major disaster . Oer the next wave of covid19 . Rep. Payne all right. Thank you for the assessment. Let me ask you, what is your assessment of femas response to covid19 . And what is the Agency Getting right and what are the avenues they need to improve . Fmr. Fema admin. Fulgate that is hard to say when you are not there. My observation early on was there were a lot of tools they had in the toolbox. Some have been utilized, some were utilized late like the defense production act. Others are programs fema, at the direction of the president , they can address some of the shortfalls. Like i said, fema cant manage what they dont have. Starting out late in the game with the National Stockpiles limited in what they could do and having to start the whole process of getting ppe moving. If you are going to use fema, you need to make the decision to use fema early. That delay put fema in a difficult position. But it also put supporting our response in supporting governors behind where we could have been. You answered my followup question. I will yield the floor to representative demmings. Rep. Demings thank you so much, mr. Chairman. You said it, and we all know it, Hurricane Season regardless of what is going on, Hurricane Season has not been canceled. As you know in florida, how critical it is for us to be as prepared as possible and able to effectively manage and juggle limited resources and staff to do everything. Could you talk to us about as we move closer and closer, we are about a month out from the start of Hurricane Season, how do you femas role changing as they also coordinate the National Response to the pandemic to , ensure that we are ready . Fmr. Fema admin. Fulgate this is something Emergency Managers from the state and local are looking at. Covid19 is not going away. So how do we maintain social distancing . One of the powerful tools fema has, when we have a forecast is the hurricane declaration. In my administration, we were very reluctant to turn these on for just any storm. We look for significant impacts and usually limit the role of federal assistance. Covid19, i would encourage fema, and this will be the president s decision, to to support broader prelandfall declarations including direct federal assistance and training in in starting to turn on the shelter programs we normally turn on after hurricanes hit. A lot of that is putting people up in hotels and motels to get them out of public shelters. I think we need to look at that program particularly where we have a significant amount of hotels and motels available because they are not being utilized. The last part, we are not going to be able to move a lot of emergency workers around the country like we normally do. From volunteer agencies, to the private sector and such. We see some examples in feeding the public right now, that Many Organizations that are doing that are turning to local restaurants and hiring them to prepare meals. I think we need to look at all of our current unemployed workforce as our emergency workforce. And that fema can reimburse states and local governments who provideal residents to Disaster Relief and to help feed people in the event of a disaster. Things like Contact Tracing with covid19. As we go into Hurricane Season, we need to be on the front end much more aggressive and funding and encouraging programs to maintain social distancing also to put to work people on the impact and not rely entirely upon volunteers and which could be a challenge with responders from out of the area social distancing and covid19. You also talked earlier about the resiliency of states to deal with whatever challenges are ahead. What do what do you believe some of the things that they should be, if they cant focus on them now because covid19, states should be thinking about in terms of the resiliency moving forward, whether it is another pandemic or a Natural Disaster . What are those things to improve infrastructure or to make them more resilient . Fmr. Fema admin. Fulgate we know that Climate Change does not stop because of covid19. We are seeing more increasingly and the impacts of climate disruptions. Extreme rainfall event. Rapidlyhat intensify when it comes to hurricanes. Heat waves. One of the opportunities we may have is the nation, in terms of where we make investments, is to continue to invest more in building resilient infrastructure, and building for future rest. This will be one of the tools to help the economy is if we make investments in Construction Projects and put people back to work. We help the economy start back. But more importantly we take a , lot of aging infrastructure and start moving it to where we need to be to support communities and make it resilient to disasters. Rep. Payne thank you. Mr. Fugate, do think we will be able to continue the response to covid19 as the nation faces Natural Disasters . I think pretty much have answered that. But i think it is interesting what you say in reference to that. Another issue is staffing. That has been a challenge for fema, with the agency being short of its goals. Duringould fema be doing the pandemic to boost morale and retain staff and prevent burnout . Fmr. Fema admin fugate maintaining morale will always be a challenge in the federal government. I think fema is very much a missiondriven agency. People buy into that and those are therefore of the mission they will do a lot of work. , my biggest concern is not getting them breaks. Particularly Headquarters Staff and some of the regional staff that have been going almost nonstop with this, the same staff to coordinate on a large scale, any response to disasters. I am less concerned about the total workforce. Can pull people off of older disasters. If we did have a major earthquake or we have a big flood, and we needed more people, and this is what i had to do. You pull people off the older disasters. Pause permanent work, to go into the next disaster to get it stabilized. It is doable. If we pause permanent construction from older disasters for several months, that is less likely to cause disruption. People dont have enough to deploy. It is not easy but fema can do this. I think the other challenge is because all of the Training Centers have been shut down and capabilities to train the new workforce has also been impacted. Fema has been looking at doing training virtually. These are areas i would hope we would see support from congress to give fema more tools so we can hire and train people locally in areas after disaster and bring them up to speed in a lot of the program areas. It is doable, it is not easy but the biggest impact may be older disasters. We may have to hit pause to focus on the next disaster. Rep. Payne thank you. Just to follow up in terms of now to go for the upper level. The fema administrators the top , stops of fema that require top spots of fema that require confirmation as well as many spots at its Parent Department at dhs, what effect does that lack of leadership have on the response . Fmr. Fema admin. Fulgate it has to impacts. The career folks are very first, capable. I got to the point at the end of the obama administration, i was not asking for any new appointees. I liked my career staff doing the job day today. But it also has a negative. That is, if you do not have the political appointees, are you represented in the administration when decisions are being made . Internally the career folks are , outstanding and they are confident in what they do. There very competent in what they do. But if they are not at the table representing agency interest, of the policy level where decisions are being made, then fema gets left out. It is a heavy burden for the administrator to do by himself. Have that team working with dhs and the white house, i think it is critical. Folksou are appointing who are in those conversations. And we have seen where the career folks have been included but maybe not have the same weight the Senate Confirmed positions and political appointees have. Rep. Payne thank you. I yield to representative demings. Rep. Demings thank you, mr. Chairman. You mentioned the response to the h1n1 and ebola. You also, of course, pointed out that this is a Public Health crisis as those were. Fema has been given a leadership role in this response. What were some of the things that were in place during our response to those crises, if you will, that you believe worked and could be beneficial today, that we are not seeing . Rep. Demings the first one was scienceled policy. We were in lockstep with Health Officials who were making recommendations. So in that administration, the obama administration, we were very much following the lead of our experts. The second thing was, we early on identified protective equipment was going to be a key shortfall. The National Stockpiles were not designed for pandemics. They were designed for terrorism and very localized responses. In a pandemic they would serve as the initial push packages. The thing that will go out first. Bar health care protective equipment is now made overseas the defense production , act would be a tool that would have to be considered early to turn on. The challenges which we saw which i saw in this response as well, when you need to do this, you may not have a lot of cases. There is always a fear that if we disrupt everything, we will get a lot of stuff we dont need. The problem was, and as we saw with this event, by the time you saw the numbers that would have justified doing it, you have lost too much time and it is too late. W so this is where we need to go back and think about that act, which fema and the department of defense are the executive offices for. Turning on the Fence Production act early may create scenarios where we end up with too much stuff we wont need with that response, but not doing it creates the dynamics we dont, we cant catch up. Rep. Demings we have also talked about transparency and oversight. I believe in situations like this, we didnt plan covid19, but we sort of expect the American People to deal with it. The amerco people expect us to deal with that. To be strict and smart and strategic, to save as many lives as he can. Having been there during the administration of playing such a major and important role, how important is transparency, number one, how important is coordinated communication not not just among the administration, congress and other departments but also with , the American People . Fmr. Fema admin. Fulgate some of the challenges we faced was lack of information. We were going to have shortfalls. We needed to be talking with the governors and telling them what we had, what we did not have, what we knew and what we did not know. They may not always agree with our decisions, but they should know why we were making decisions and the challenges we faced. I found in those scenarios where we gave them the information and they understood why we were making the decisions, at least they understood. There has been a challenge in this event to do that. That may have led to some of the challenges we have had. I figured it was better to give people the bad news up front than to not address it and have it come up in another forum. Where now we are dealing with more challenges because we did not tell people the bad news on the front end. Rep. Demings if i could ask one more question, mr. Fugate, the Pandemic Response team, that was certainly part of the administration when you served, how important a role did they play in terms of coordinating our efforts and response . Fmr. Fema admin fugate it was a team approach. President obama was a big believer in the whole of government. That no one agency in these challenging situations would have all the answers. So using the National Security council as the coordinating hub, we worked together on plans. And the medical experts in the federal government would be leading the response. But it would incorporate all of the assets of Homeland Security and fema and the department of defense. And other elements in other agencies. Including now as we are seeing more and more usda playing a role in food supply security. You want experts leading the response but dont want them doing it by themselves. You bring the whole team together. Again, one of the things i was recognizing in the obama administration, we had crafted executive orders. It may be worthwhile looking at this tendency to think of fema as only dealing with earthquakes and fires, Homeland Security act has given fema the responsibility to plan and coordinate any major crisis at the direction of the president. And because this is femas court mission it might be worthwhile this,ook at how to codify so we are not just wedded to a stafford act declaration but bringing the tools fema can so hopefully next time they are brought in earlier, not after things are not working. It isnt to put fema in charge, but to have fema coordinate support for federal agency and then use tools, interagency relationships in all of the things we do responding to large , complex events to support the lead agency, in the crisis. Rep. Demings thank you. Rep. Payne thank you, representative demings. Fema has yet to activate most of its individual assistance programs, which provide direct services, aid to families, such as funeral assistance. What do you make of this . And what do you think is the hold up on approving this assistance . Fmr. Fema admin. Fulgate unfortunately, fema cant add categories of assistance. Has to be directed by the thishas to be directed by the president. Early on, prior to the cares act being passed, i thought fema should have looked at individual assistance disasters, for disaster unemployment, disaster supplemental nutritional or food stamps, crisis counseling. And disaster legal services. Once we saw the fatalities start andonce we saw the fatalities start to increase, knowing many families would not have resources, add other areas like funeral assistance. The cares act did create a bit of a challenge because there would be questions about duplication of benefits. Because femas programs are up in many cases and running and , ready to go, they could have been utilized to buy time for the cares act and then after it was passed, sort that out. That was not done. Butthat was not done. Again, i think there are aspects of that program, like funeral assistance that could be turned , on, but fema doesnt have independent authority to do that. It is something the administration would have to direct from the president. As to why not, i do not understand. It is a capability fema could execute. I dont think the funding would be a challenge for fema Given Congress has been supporting replenishing the Disaster Relief fund after major disasters and supported additional funds for fema for responding to covid19. Rep. Payne one final question. There are rumors that as the white house is trying, and now turning its focus to reopening economy, i have heard today on different news shows, that 21 states are loosening up their requirements. Fema is working to transition out of its role as the lead agency. Do you think that is right . The right timing for switch, or jumping the gun . Fmr. Fema admin. Fulgate i dont think it is jumping the gun. The timing issue would have to be internal to see where things are at. This is no different from being asked by the white house about to assist with unaccompanied children. Femas primary mission, think of fema as the acute response agency. We are not the solution for the chronic problem. We are the bridge between the crisis phase and the more Stable Recovery phase. As we are reaching that point, in covid19, it is not over and it will not be over for some time. Are we reaching the point, where the more traditional responsibilities of health and human services, can now be able to take over those roles and free fema up for other disasters . The timing will always be a question. But the idea that fema is a Crisis Agency gets to a point where it is more of a longterm response, and is appropriate to shift to another agency to have that primary response build a, that is a good thing. Timing is the question. Are we there yet . Prematurely and lose the progress fema has been making . If we can transfer without losing that progress the timing , is something to be looked at. Rep. Payne thank you, sir. I have one personal question. If a chief executive officer or president of the united states, in the future called on you to , serve again, would you entertain it . Fmr. Fema admin. Fulgate you will have to ask my wife. Rep. Payne [laughter] great answer. I understand that. Before we close, i want to give you a moment to offer any Closing Remarks or anything you think the public should know that we have not covered through our questions today. Fmr. Fema admin. Fulgate given everything that is being said, my only advice is listen to the medical experts and never for once think the fema people, the rank and file are not giving it their all trying to address this. This is new for all of us. Fema, like any other organization is learning. , there will be mistakes made. They will improve. Never think that they are not doing Everything Possible to get this done, as well as getting ready for the next disaster. Rep. Payne thank you for that, and thank you for taking the time to be with us to answer our questions. Congresswoman demings and i appreciate your involvement. You provided some very valuable insight to the committee and to general public. With that i will the general public. With that i will will use it as we move forward informing our policy. I will close todays forum. Thank you for being a part of it. Senate leader Mitch Mcconnell announced the senate will return from let us lead work this monday to vote on an executor of nomination and later in the week could work on coronavirus related legislation, addressing lawsuits. House majority leader steny hoyer said that after consulting with memos and the attending physician, the house will not return for legislator fork next week. Instead, they will continue to hold brief pro forma sessions every three days. 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