Good afternoon. Welcome back to Washington Post. Ive im bob costa, National Political reporter here at the Washington Post. Joining the is Governor Gretchen Whitmer of michigan, a democrat. She was elected in 2018 after a long career in state politics, including serving in the state legislature. A few months ago, you may remember, it feels like a long time ago, she delivered the democratic response to President Trumps state of the union. Governor whitmer, welcome. Based on the data and whats happening in your state, are you thinking about extending the stayathome order in michigan beyond may 1 . Witmer theres no question we have to be slow and methodical and Pay Attention to medical experts and Public Health experts to know we are ready, and then what does it look like when we do begin to reengage . And be mindful there are different sectors of the economy , different regions of the state , for instance. We will be really data driven, we have a rigorous exercise we are going through to plan this work. The odds are everyone will arelife as normal r zero. It will be slow. For some, we will continue the posture we are doing. For others, we can slowly open up without risking reemergence of covid19. Some form of order will continue on. Our hope is we will slowly reengage sectors of the economy in a way that keeps employees and customers safe alike. Robert to follow up on that, what kind of sectors could be reopened in may, even if part of the stayathome order remains in place . Gov. Whitmer my order is one of the most aggressive in the nation. Look to itt we can other states have been doing where there are additional risks or not risks. We assess beyond the first wave, and now many waves of opening up variety sectors of the economy. It indoor ore, is outdoor . How closely is it interfacing with the public . Getting your nails done, like touching one another, or is it landscaping activity . Is it something that there are shared tools or machinery . These are all things that impact the risk associated with various business enterprise. These are just three out of many factors we are looking at to score and work with public and working with the university of michigan and experts around the state of michigan, so we are mindful of where the lowest risk is. We will try it out for a little while and watch the numbers and make sure we are still able to meet Health Care Needs in the regions of our state and then take the next step. We have to be nibbling enough to been aze where has growth of covid19, where we pull back, or perhaps where we take the next cautious step forward. We are going to be careful and Pay Attention to the science and protect people every step of the way. You look at the phase three opening in michigan. Phasedased real reopening in michigan. Do you support what the republicans offer or are there different plans . I think there are some things that would complement the work we are thinking about and the work we are planning to do. Certainly, we need to build alliances and i welcome all input no matter where it comes from. At the end of the day, the most important voices helping us phase this in safely are those of our health care experts. The work we are doing centers around the best science. Weve got to ramp up testing. Flattento continually and decline in terms of the curve and hospitalizations, so there are a lot of different vectors that go in. Im sure there are pieces of a variety of plans that i will take to fashion a plan for my state. When you say ramp up testing, are you speaking of something specific . What does michigan really need when it comes to testing . Swabs and reagents. It is really that simple. It is these tools that go into the tests that we are all competing for and trying to get. I know there was a comment by the white house that they would be moving forward and using the defense production act to produce swabs. I have not seen if that is going to become a reality or not, but i do know that is one piece of the test we dont have enough of. We could may do two or three times more testing than we are right now, but the fact of the matter is we need the swabs and reagents so we can process the tests. Youve recently started a task force to look at racial disparities. What will that group do . What do you hope it achieves in terms of policy, not just studying the issue . Michigan was one of the first states to start reporting data about the race of people testing positive for covid19 and people that have lost the battle with covid19. I think it was us and illinois. I know you were going to talk to my friend jb shortly. We need to prioritize this as a country. This is holding a mirror up to our country and the generational inequities that people of color have confronted. Good joblity to get a that has health care with it. The inability to Access Health care a meaningful way. There are a lot of different factors that go into this and this is why it is not good enough to have the data. Weve got to study it and put together a plan for how we attack the root problem here. 114 of our population is africanamerican and yet 40 of the deaths, there is no question that this has disproportionately impacted people of color and we have a duty to impact understand and address it. Is there anything the federal government could do . Gov. Whitmer a few weeks ago, when the data first started coming in before i think everyone was focused on it, we saw the difference. I raised it in a conversation with the Vice President , acknowledging that we think there is a racial component, a very serious one, and we would like the full weight of the federal government to help get all the data to coordinate. Ive been vocal in terms of my observation that we really need more of a national strategy. This is one of those as well. What is happening in michigan is we are seeing that it is happening in other parts of our country, as well. It really needs to be a National Issue with a federal solution as part of it. Do you feel like Vice President pence has been effective toward democratic governors like yourself as head of the task force . Gov. Whitmer i have found Vice President pence to be very cordial and accessible and i appreciate that. As a former governor, especially one from the midwest, we have been able to build a type of report and i know that is not unique to me. He has done that with a lot of governors across both sides of the aisle across the country. We need to make sure that governors have all the tools we moment toad in this protect lives and hopefully responsively ramp back up our economy. Partnershipcomplete from the federal government. I have found the Vice President to be very accessible and responsive. What was the first thing that went through your mind when you saw President Trump tweeted liberate michigan . Gov. Whitmer we had just come off a demonstration at the capital capitol and we had a lot of people show up who were not wearing masks, who were not staying six feet apart. I saw adults handing things to children barehanded and we know that this kind of activity flies in the face of all the best science, including the scientists standing up at the nightly briefing with the president , who have told us 30 ays, they have promulgated lot of the same best practices that we are encouraging people to undertake. I thinkee this play out was really unfortunate. And i worry that while i respect their right to dissent and to demonstrate as long they are doing it responsibly and they are not endangering themselves or other people, i respect that, but to see people come from across the state and converge to stay that close to one another and congregate and then go back into different parts of the state is very concerning. I know the purported rationale was they dont like the stayathome order. Yet, that activity might necessitate lengthening the stayathome order because if theyve brought covid19 into parts of the state where it was not prevalent before, thats going to be a problem to reengage at the earliest possible moment. Their said you respect First Amendment rights to protest, yet you do raise Public Health issues and concerns. If there are future protests, are you considering shutting down those protests or bringing in a Police Presence to try to enforce social distancing at some level . Gov. Whitmer i think that there are a lot of complications with that. We have a lot of First Responders who we have to protect their health as well. Throwing a number of people into thinks not a thing that i is a smart strategy when you are trying to stop the spread of what is a global pandemic. That is precisely why on the phone call with the governor yesterday, i did ask the Vice President for some assistance from the federal government to reiterate how important it is to observe these stayathome orders. I know weve all seen the pictures of the demonstrations, but the good news is the vast majority of people in these states that are having demonstrations, the vast majority are doing that. Out in the are numbers of how much people are traveling. We see that bear out in terms of a curve that continues to flatten. The vast majority of people are doing the right thing. If we could get some support out of the federal government to reiterate how important it is to stay the course, that is how we stop the spread and get to a place where we can safely start to reengage sectors of our economy. I know that is what everyone wants. When you watch those protesters and i know you are trying to work with the federal government and Vice President pence and President Trump, do you partly hold President Trump responsible for the unrest in your state . Gov. Whitmer i do think that a consistent, cohesive message from everyone who has a platform would go a long way toward quelling some of the anxiety people are feeling. I get it. People are feeling isolated, they are lonely, they are worried about their business reopening, they are worried about getting a job again. A lot of people are mourning the loss of loved ones. This is not easy. This is a know that finite period of time. We are asking people to take this action now for the betterment of everyone. Rightnot about taking a to assemble away, it is making sure that my fathers right to live is protected. That is the tradeoff here. We are not asking people to go into our factories and build bombers like we did in world war ii, we are asking people to stay home. That is what doing your part looks like in a war with an enemy that is a virus. We need to focus on that this is a short period of time and we have to do our best to educate people to quell the anxieties and encourage behaviors so we can get through this better with fewer lives lost and in a way that we can safely reengage the economy. I appreciate you having this conversation. One final question. Has Vice President biden or his campaign asked you for any vetting or personal information in recent weeks . Talked toer i have joe biden many times. He checks in relatively regularly to see what is going on. , think he is a wonderful guy he is a great candidate. Im happy to be one of his supporters. I trust him implicitly and at this point in time, im not spending any more energy in politics. All unfocused in his saving lives in michigan. Has he asked for documents or not . Gov. Whitmer no, not yet. [laughter] i wish you all the best in michigan, Governor Whitmer. Thank you for your time. Gov. Whitmer thank you. Stay with us if you are watching Washington Post live, governor jb pritzker of illinois will be with us momentarily. Go down in history as a profound failure of our national government. Shutey didnt advise us to down major events, sporting events, parades. We made those decisions on our own. We made the decisions to close schools on our own. Folks, this curve may not flatten. We dont up again, if adhere to the stayathome order. We need to stay the course for now for our efforts to truly remain effective. Welcome back, good afternoon. If you are just joining us, im the National Political reporter at the Washington Post co. Joining me right now is governor jb pritzker of illinois, a democrat elected in 2018. Before that, he spent years in business, philanthropy, and politics, often with a focus on chicago. Thanks for being with us. Gov. Pritzker glad to be here. Thanks so much. You spent a lot of days on medical supplies in recent days. You have ordered ppe from china, airlifting it back to illinois. What is the latest on that front . Gov. Pritzker well, we managed to get millions of items of ppe back to illinois. We have been working on this project for more than a month now, making sure we have the supply chain worked out so we to get the gowns and goggles get people protected. We need to acquire ventilators. That is a difficult endeavor. Now, it looks like we may need fewer ventilators than we did before, but we will still need an awful lot of ppe, especially as we move forward, thinking about how we are going to reopen aspects of the economy in the months ahead. We got a lot of questions from viewers and readers about what drove the decision to turn to china for these supplies rather than to the National Stockpile . Gov. Pritzker well, the National Stockpile has been depleted. The president in the federal government really have not distributed much of anything to the states, considering what we asked for. Wherever it is i could acquire it. It turns out most of the ppe thatcomes to hospitals and is needed in the United States is actually manufactured in china. So, we went to where the manufacturers were, acquired the ppe, and shipped it directly to the state of illinois. Can you shed a little light on the details . How much in terms of the supplies is in illinois right now . Gov. Pritzker weve acquired millions and millions of items of ppe. When we receive it, we distributed. We have 102 counties and Public Health departments across the state. So, we make sure they have what they need and then we back up the city of chicago and all the hospitals across the state, to make sure they get what they need. We are in the business of being the stockpile for everybody here in the state or at least the backup. Fortunately, we have been able to supply everybody with about 710 days on a consistent basis and then we know what the burn rate is that each of these places, so we can keep replenishing them. Has the federal government been frustrated with your effort . Have they tried to seize any of the equipment . Gov. Pritzker we are aware that across the country the federal government has seized items of ppe that have come in from outside of the country, so they have not managed to interrupt our supply or at least our direct supply efforts. To goed private aircraft pick up what we needed and have it delivered here. Those two flights we already arranged have arrived here and we have that ppe in our stockpile. It is coming from a different country and not going through the fda and other countries companies. How are you testing that equipment . Gov. Pritzker much of it is designed to meet fda specifications. When it arrives in the United States and in illinois, what we do is we take it to our warehouses and we open up the you cante sure look through every single mask but you take samples from the shipments that come over to make sure that we got what we paid for and also that it is effective and can be used where we need it. You are part of this whole National Debate of one to reopen certain states. What does the data show in illinois . We have notr peaked. One of the interesting things is, as you may know, we were the second state in the United States to put forward our stayathome rule. People have really been abiding by it for the most part. So, the result of that has been the pushing out of what had been anticipated to be a peeking in the middle or near the end of april. It has been pushed out now according to the models to maybe midmay, but at a lower level. So, we are inching toward that date. People are doing what they need to do in the state of illinois, staying indoors were staying at home. Wearing masks outside, as ive urged everybody to do. Making sure they are washing their hands and all the other things that weve asked people to do. The result is we have had many fewer deaths then were anticipated. Our hospitalization rate is somewhat stable. Climbing a little bit, but somewhat stabilizing. Our ventilator needs have gone down. Interestingly, partly because we have been to the curve, but also because the treatment, the way the doctors are treating the people who need to go on ventilators is no different than it used to be. They are trying to keep them off a ventilator and instead using their own therapies, turning people over, having them lay on their stomach or their back in order to oxygenate the entire lungs. So, we are fortunate that all that has developed over time and we are going to be able to keep more people alive. Governor, you said most people are following the rules, but i did take note of a protest in springfield at the state capitol. Is there a divide between those downstate and those in the chicago area when it comes to following your stayathome order . Gov. Pritzker those are two different things. The protest that occurred in springfield, about 20 protesters showed up, 10 counterprotesters showed up, some of them nurses in hospitals who understand why we need to have a stayathome order in place and are in the front lines risking their lives. Different question is the question of whether things are in river larios of our state remember, 75 of our landmass in the state is farmland. Is in thee population Northeast Corner of the state. When we look at all the counties, the 102 counties across the state, there really are different characteristics to each one. So, we have tried we put in stayathome orders that were really across the board very effective. Now we have looked up what the infection rate has been, different in cook county. Thanrent then it is there other counties across the state. Now i think we can make some adjustments based upon hospitalization rates, based upon icu bed availability, based upon infection rates as we look how can we begin to adjust things and work toward after the peak really reopening the economy . When you say some adjustments, is it fair to predict that in may, when you think about your emergency powers, you may keep the stayathome order for some counties, but allow other counties to open up . Gov. Pritzker we are certainly looking at the different characteristics of regions of our state. We are going to make adjustments based upon what we have learned and seen in the infection rates. Im doing all of that based upon the advice of the epidemiologists and the scientists and the data that weve got. What about the coalition of midwestern governors who are trying to decide together . Gov. Pritzker i saw that you had Governor Whitmer on before me and i have Great Respect for her. She has done a terrific job. What i will tell you is we all got together to talk about what are the common suppose that we have and how can we operate in a somewhat concerted fashion to share information . We are all doing it slightly differently. Our states are different characteristics and need, but we have the common principles of trying to keep people healthy, while understanding that our midwestern economies are ones that have a lot of other industries that are different and we the new york city have lots of agriculture in the midwest. We have common principles and i want to remind everybody that bipartisanon is a one. Kentucky,eshear in governor walz in minnesota, Governor Whitmer are in she again. About talking constantly what are you doing that we ought to do . How can we do these things together . Especially where we have common borders. Are you talking at all with President Trump . Gov. Pritzker ive talked to President Trump, more often with Vice President pence. Ive heard some comments Governor Whitmer made about the fact that Vice President pence was a former governor and understands a lot better what governors are going through and i will second that. He has been very communicative. Very cordial. I have to say, when i need to andh out to the white house he is most likely the first call i will make. President trump criticized you by name on monday, claiming you did not understand your states Testing Capacity. What is your response to that statement . Gov. Pritzker i dont watch those press conferences. I told you what he said. Gov. Pritzker i appreciate it. I try to base all of my opinions on facts. The truth of the matter is that the president does not seem to understand the difference between Testing Capacity and getting testing results. Testing capacity, what he is referring to is youve got enough machines in each of your states to run tests that will give you hundreds of thousands of results. Well, he may be right and he is right in illinois, but what he is not right about is we dont have the supplies to run the tests. You have the capacity because you got the machines, but remember you need everything from swabs to viral transport medium to rna extractor reagents. If you dont have all those and by the way there is a worldwide shortage of all of those things, then you cant run a test. Then add to that that in order to do what he is suggesting, you would have to run these machines 24 hours a day and seven days a week. Many of these machines are in private doctors offices, in private hospitals. In order for us to run any tests, you have to have an agreement with those doctors and hospitals, which weve tried to do across the state. Then you need Lab Technicians that can actually run the tests. Guess what . 24 7,er to run machines you need three shifts of Lab Technicians. The idea that we could actually do that without the supplies, without enough Lab Technicians is kind of crazy. What we needed was for the federal government still need the federal government to enact the defense production act to make it easier for us to obtain the swabs in the reagents that we need. None of that have been done at the federal government level. That is the mistake that has been made all along here. We could have organized this and lead this at a federal level. Everybody, including the libertarians, would tell you that the purpose of the federal government would be to manage a National Emergency. This is a National Emergency and it is not being managed well from the white house. Why would you want to see the defense production act used versus more appropriations from the federal government to provide you with the testing material . Gov. Pritzker providing us with dollars does not really do the trick. Worldwide market for these things. We need to make sure we are producing it and acquiring it as a nation for our states. Instead, what is happening as we are competing against each other. That has led to some innovation. We have had our universities working together to develop our own viral transport media. By our own developed laboratories and universities here. Manufactured by swab manufacturers. They are selling their swab to anybody who was already a customer, including other nations. That is great that they are in the forprofit business of selling their swabs, but we are in a National Emergency and we need them here in the United States and we need them distributed. The governor of michigan has a real problem in terms of the infection rate and hospitalization rate and she thes to know where outbreaks are coming next. If we are not supplying nations not supplying to where there is a hotspot, we are not doing it right. Governor cuomo, you hear about the javits center. Mccormick place in chicago. Have you been happy with how the federal government handle that . Gov. Pritzker so the army corps of engineers and our National Guard and our great trade unions worked together to build out the first tall at Mccormick Place in five days. These army corps of engineers folks and the folks that came to us from fema and hhs working together to get that spun up, truly amazing. Im grateful for the work they have done. There was a lot the federal government can provide to the states and this was one where Mccormick Place turned out to be a great place for Surge Capacity for our hospitals. Items,is on these other leading the entire nation by leading us into the stayathome which they didnt do, giving advice to everybody about how it should be done, and then providing with the defense production act the ability to acquire the supplies necessary for the testing, by the way we also need tracing and tracking that goes along with the testing. So you have people selfisolating if they have been exposed to somebody. Then you need the ppe necessary. If they had done all of that early on, we would be in a much better place. Having said that, we realized that when President Trump makes a promise, that often that does not get delivered upon, so we are out here working out on our own what is best for our state, getting what we need, and delivering what we need. And we are getting the job done. You detail your view of the federal response, but what about the president s rhetoric . This liberate phrase when it comes to states. Do you believe, as the governor of illinois, that President Trump is stoking civil unrest . Gov. Pritzker im very disappointed with the rhetoric and messaging coming from the president. We should be pulling people together right now. We are here in Illinois Democrats and republicans working together. Conversationst with the elected officials around my state not in my own party and we all share the common goal of opening our economy and getting people back to school and back to normal as fast as we can, but with the overriding concern for peoples safety and health. That does not seem to be the message coming out of the president when he tweets out liberate michigan or liberate minnesota or virginia. He is fomenting protest and i hate to say, that is fomenting some violence. Im very concerned about what that might mean for the country if he keeps doing things like that. We should be bringing people together, not dividing people now. What do you think it could mean down the line . Gov. Pritzker well, i know what hes trying to do. Its a political maneuver in the middle of a National Emergency. He should stop it. What could it mean . It could mean terrible things. You could end up with violence. You certainly are seeing that people are believing his rhetoric, even repeating the rhetoric that he had a month ago or so were he was calling this a hoax. And people are going out in public in large crowds, not in springfield where there were only 20, but i saw in michigan and other places, large crowds where they are frankly going to be giving each other coronavirus. And people unfortunately will get sick and some people may die as a result of the president s rhetoric that has brought them out to protest. That is all the time we have. Governor pritzker, really appreciate your time and wish you the best as you deal with this pandemic. Gov. Pritzker thanks so much. Thank you for joining us for another conversation on Washington Post live. We will be back many times this weekend in the coming weeks to have more conversations about this pandemic and how it is affecting your life. Make sure you watch these discussions at washingtonpost. Com postlive. You will find every thing you need to know. Tomorrow, wednesday, at 11 00 a. M. Eastern, watch my colleague have a conversation with former secretary of state john kerry and former Ohio Governor john kasich. We have a lot of midwesterners on Washington Post live. For now, thanks for joining us and stay safe. [captions Copyright National cable satellite corp. 2020] [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy. Visit ncicap. Org] cspan has aroundtheclock coverage of the federal response to the coronavirus pandemic and it is all available on demand at cspan total coronavirus cspan. Org coronavirus. Track the spread throughout the u. S. In the world with interactive maps. Watch on demand any time