As a multitudeed of rational beings united by the common objects of their love. I want to repeat that because it is a complicated thought, but it is the best definition of a nation ive come across. A multitude of rational beings, driven by reason, react to facts, united by the common objects of their love. We love enough to sacrifice one for another. Weve had a lot of conversations wartime, thiss is is like pearl harbor and september 11. Actually it is not. There is a National Feeling that is analogous, but this is something the closest thing i can think of as an analogy is, this is as if we were all english men and women in london in 1940 during the blitz or when hitlers was firing rockets at london. And weall combatants didnt choose to be a combatant. My hope for the country is that. E learn from this pain as dr. King used to say, theres a way to bring good out of people. Hopefully what we learned is that we are all vulnerable, we are all human, and we need to find ways to be rational, let our public life be shaped by reason and facts, not by ideology and superstition, not let this tribalism that has afflicted us for too long, where you find something happens and you dont think about it and figure out which Political Team might accord with your view something happens and you interpret it because you are already on a Political Team. The virus knows no partisanship. It is not paying attention to party registration. My hope is that this is a painful and tragic but ultimately redemptive wakeup call for us that what holds us together is larger, should be larger than what drives us apart. Discussn the book, you sacrifices that americans made. Certainly the sacrifices in world war ii. The long lines, the rationing. Im wondering, based on what youve seen and what we can expect, have americans stepped up . John i think so. You hate seeing people at the beach. You hate seeing the images that drive the governors crazy. But the past wasnt as perfect as we like to think either. Era is ae sins of our reflexiveness to nostalgia as if the past was always better. To some extent, that lets us off the hook. If the past is better, if they didnt have the problems we have, what do we have to learn . Quite the opposite. Ii,oning during world war the sacrifices of the depression. Actuallyhe depression is, besides the blitz, a fascinating analogy. Speaking in a parallel moment in 1933, a couple months in to the roosevelt administration, more than 25 of the country was out of work. The banks were closed. Fdr was turning from scratch in many ways on saving capitalism and democracy. Because of this cataclysmic event. That, wee got out of decided that we would not let fear govern us. Things, one of the most insightful things ive ever read was an observation by edmund burke, the angloirish statesman, who said no passion is as unreasoning as fear. Afraid, if youre fear you are on a precipice, you are not going to act rationally. And at our best, in the depression, largely during world war ii, many sacrifices during the cold war, americans have managed to reach out, as opposed to simply keep their hands in their pockets. Steve you have a new book. How many books have you written . John eight. Steve in the hope of glory, one review said, the book does not preach, but it does have the power to teach. What is the message . John that is nice. Was that a relative . [laughter] the origin of the book comes directly to the season we are in and what you are talking about with his eminence. It was holy week. We lived in new york. We were parishioners at st. Thomas fifth avenue. Beautiful episcopal church. Aboutrector asked me seven or eight years ago to do the three hour service on good friday where you preach on each of the last seven sentences that the church agreed jesus spoke from the cross. It is a debilitating thing to do. It is a longwinded task. In it is a way of focusing on what that moment meant. What did the passion need . Beginn christians will commemorating that on thursday ,vening with the last supper the arrest in the garden, the trial, the sentencing, the crucifixion, and the burial. Fascinating, im episcopalian. Entirelycated almost by the church. Alsoe to it naturally, but intellectually, which sounds grand. But i do approach it as a critic. I approach it with a sense of reason and balance. And as a historian. Trying to figure out what in the gospels makes sense. What in the gospels seems like history as opposed to theology. The gospels were written to convince. That was not an Associated Press report. There were not cspan cameras. Story fortelling the a particular purpose. And they admitted it. St. John said, this is written that ye might believe. What i tried to do in the book is look at the narrative in the and see where it stacks , howstorically, but also can it inform what we do now . Weve never improved on the sermon on the mount in terms of philosophy. Blessed are the meek. Messageundamentally the was about, do unto the least of these and youve done it unto me. Charityul message of based on leviticus. It is the story of israel. Echoes,he christian what happens on friday, good friday, is the most compelling and unimaginable sacrifice one could conceive of, the sacrifice of a father for a son. Whyit had to be that way, bad things happen, i dont know. More about the origin and destiny of life than it is about explaining the world we live in. Steve lets get to phone calls. Annie is first up in north carolina. Caller good evening. Be first. Hall how many times ive heard that from my mother. Shes going to be 90 years old in july. I cant believe im speaking to john meacham. Im used to seeing you on book tv. My mother raised eight children. My father was a civics teacher in a catholic school. Hes deceased now. 5,000 in, he made 1965 as a high school teacher. Do, which hasmake helped me my whole life. I just turned 65 about two weeks ago. In some ofhelped me this catastrophe we are in. Im just so grateful that my mother taught us. She was born in 1930. She was so poor, she and her older brother had to live with family in missouri. My mother is first generation american. With mya picture of me siblings and my grandfather is holding one of my siblings and hes 64 years old but he looks 84. Anyway, thank you so much. John thank you. That story is so quintessentially american. Andany lives in the 20s 30s. You had these networks. Really the beginning of modernity is more 1920 than almost anything else. The was the first year census found that more americans lived in urban areas than farms. It was the rise of radio. You had the postwar boom. You had waves of immigration. And almost immediately, the rise of the second klan and the reaction to that immigration. This was all after the 1918 pandemic where the incumbent party lost in 1920. There was a young guy, the Vice President ial nominee of the democratic party, franklin d roosevelt. But your story is wonderfully american and is all about people taking care of each other. It sounds sentimental. And things are sentimental until they are absolutely essential and relevant. That is what we are seeing now. Steve amy is next. Good evening. Caller thank you. I have a question about the urgent need to ramp up production of ppe for healthcare workers. We are in kentucky and our hospitals are desperately short of ppe, as our hospitals across the country. Dieealth care worker should for lack of ppe. Im just not sure why that is being ramped up. Historically speaking, we did this as a nation when we went to war. Your comment on what we can do to protect our health care workers. John Franklin Roosevelt built an air force out of nothing. I think the number was 50,000. He said he wanted 50,000 planes in said, how did you come to that number . He said, i just made it up. There is a spirit that we can draw on. Hope that weve begun to clear up the supply chain issues. If we havent, and if these terrible stories continue, i think governors, mayors need to step up. Make as much noise as possible. One of the things we know about this administration is, the squeaky wheel gets a lot of grease. The best way to reach the president is to go on cable news. I hate to say that, but i think it is pretty true. So there are ways to do this, god willing. And we have the legislative means to do it. Sense, if you are on the front lines of this, if you are in these charitable hotspots and people who arent in them be careful. If we dont do the right thing, if we dont follow these guidelines, we could very well be one. This is an incredibly important moment. While it is difficult to reach out and help people in the way we traditionally do everybodys better angels tell them to get in a car and deliver meals. We had a tornado not long ago. Everybodys instinct was to go and help. In a way, the most important thing we can do is apply the political pressure to get the kind of equipment the caller mentioned, and to follow these guidelines, because the sooner we flatten this curve, the sooner we can see what the economic and cultural world is going to look like. Sent to letter that you president elect Ronald Reagan when you were a teenager, what did you write to him . John that has been slightly misreported. I suspect you have a similar story. In the fall of 1979, i was 10 years old. Minutes minutes interview with Ronald Reagan, who had Just Announced his challenge to carter. We thought 69 was really old. Now you would be the youngest major party candidate. I was just enraptured. I thought he was a fascinating figure. Id always been interested in politics and ragan nationalized that for me. I used to stuff envelopes for him. I got an invitation to the inauguration in 1981. And prevailed upon my grandmother to take me up there. I was standing there on the capital lawn. At that point i was done. So there is a direct line between that story an hour talking this evening. For joining us. Good evening. Caller how are you doing, john . John im in one piece, how about you . Caller im 30 years old and im not yet. Im happy that i have not caught this yet, the coronavirus. Ive got no symptoms from it. Im 30 years old and they say there are people that are young that have died from it. And theres young people out there and the death total has gone crazy, going up every day when do we think we can get back to normal life with sports, just in general, for people going back to work, doing what we had in front of us before this came to us with the coronavirus . This is never going to go away. The coronavirus is with us forever. Steve we will get a response. Thank you. John im basing this on the same information you have. Guidelines, ihese suspect they will be in place a little bit longer. I saw an interesting story. Major League Baseball is thinking about socially distancing by going out to phoenix. I dont know if this has developed more. And having all the teams sequestered there. And there are stadiums and they would play without fans. So that is the cultural side. The work side is important. From what i can tell, we are looking at early summer. And i think the critical thing, the thing to watch very closely is, when is the mass testing available, where you can find ,ut, if you are asymptomatic you can find out if it is safe to get on an airplane even though you are 30, im 50, im ok so far, but for all i know i am asymptomatic and i can give it to somebody. So we have to follow these guidelines and stay apart from each other physically, not emotionally, not culturally, because here we are talking, but it seems to me we are looking at the economy beginning to reopen early in the summer. I dont think theres any way to know exactly what the impact is. The Financial Guys i talked to say that basically in financial terms the Second Quarter is just gone. It is a big zero if not a negative number. Thirdquarter weefully begin to get back. The question has to be, to what extent can we be around each other without creating more of these devastating hotspots . Steve alan, you are next. Caller thank you, good evening. I want to be as brief as possible. I would like to say, if this man, donald trump, is reelected, we deserve everything we get. He is so profoundly unfit, morally, personality wise, educationally, to be president. This with my about dentist. I would like to ask mr. Meacham, who i enjoy immensely on television, if this is true. He told me that after the Founding Fathers wrote all the stuff, that Benjamin Franklin had a reservation about democracy and, basically said he was worried that the average person doesnt have the powers of discernment and intelligence to pick the right candidate. Voting, i only voted twice in the president ial mcgovern gotn trounced by nixon i said to myself, the wrong person is probably going to win most of the time. In the second time i voted was the trump reelection. ,ecause the things he said mexico is going to pay for the we are to take the oil from the middle east, it sounded to me like a mob boss. So i voted against him. And i just want to know how you feel about that. Steve thank you. Was the dentist right about Benjamin Franklin . John it was a consuming concern of the founders. I thought the question was going to be about the great story. Speaker pelosi made it famous during impeachment. Franklin leaves independence hall, the Pennsylvania State and a philadelphia woman said to him, what do we have, a republic or a monarchy . Madam,said, a republic, if you can keep it. This has been the drama of america since that moment. Since 1789 when George Washington became the first president. Can we make this work . This is really hard, what we have undertaken. It is a pluralistic, complicated, continent wide experiment in popular government, in federalism, in a way that most other countries have never even thought about attempting it at this scale. Parenthetically, i have a theory that, no wonder we are having so many problems. Theres this big debate about, were we found it in 1619 or 1776 . Isave a third nominee, which 1965. Today, didnt are come into being fully until the Voting Rights act, the civil rights act, and the immigration act of 1965. 20 million africanamericans were systematically excluded from the political life of the country. So as we become more demographically diverse, and they are rightly fully part of the experiment and the journey to a more perfect union, it makes historical sense that there would be these pressures. I am not an admirer of president trump. I believe that the presidency has in no way changed him. The question is whether he has changed the presidency going forward. And we simply wont know that until his successor comes along. Steve among the books, the hope of glory, soul of america. Our final call is from new york. Marie, about a minute or two left with john meacham. Caller good evening. You spoke about it is so wonderful to speak to you. Withour book has to do faith. You talked before about common sense. Where is the common sense of the governors that are not closing down and the people still walk around and keeping the church is and all . I understand people want to go to church. I am catholic. But unfortunately, with this situation, the right thing to do is stay home and protect your loved ones and people that are with you. And i also was thinking about, for the two weeks that we are going to reach the apex line, why cant we have martial law . Bring the soldiers in and make sure everybody has to stay in. Because if everybody stays in, the chances of the highrisk spreading, and then they dont have to worry about the ventilators and things that nurses need more. I have a dear friend that was a nurse, negative, thank god, but shes going back in to take care of people. And that is what it is about. But i truly believe that the president is saying we are going to get through it unless we all truly work together, everybody, all the politicians, it is going to be a little more difficult. Steve thank you for the call. John the three most important words from the american founding our, we the people. It is in our hands. Im not a fan of sending troops into the streets. I dont think we are there yet. On the question of going to or ah, being a christian congregant of any faith, a religious value is not the right to be willfully stupid. , and now willfully stupid it works against the godgiven gift of reason to go put yourself in harms way. The lord is everywhere. I know this is difficult for sacramento folks. But the best thing that christians can do in holy week and our jewish friends can do for passover is celebrate the sacraments with their families, pray intently, but do so in private. And i promise you, if there is a lord out there listening, he will hear those prayers. Steve in light of this moment and this pandemic, the soul of america tonight is what . John the soul of america is troubled but hopeful. It is not all good. It is not all good and not all bad. It is a battle between our better angels and perennial instincts. Right now, the common foe is a clinical virus that respects no borders and respects no class or creed. What we need to do is we the people need to follow these instructions, try to stay healthy, support those who are helping the sick, pray for the dining, and hope for a better day. The two most recent books by our guest, jon meacham, cspans washington journal live every day with news and policy issues that impact you. Coming up monday morning, the response of u. S. Health Insurance Companies to the coronavirus. And how washington is addressing job losses amid the coronavirus pandemic with the Economic Policy director of the bipartisan policy center. Sure to watch cspans washington journal live at 7 00 a. M. Eastern monday. Sure to watch washington journal monday primetime. Will beony fauci our guest live starting at 8 00 p. M. Eastern taking your phone calls and questions on the coronavirus pandemic. Cspan has roundtheclock coverage of the federal response to the coronavirus pandemic and it is all available on demand at cspan. Org coronavirus. Watch white house briefings, updates from governors and state officials, track the spread throughout the u. S. And the world. Watch on demand any time unfiltered at cspan. Org coronavirus. President trump receives an easter blessing at the white house with bishop harry jackson. The president gave easter greetings and asked americans to pray for the nation, First Responders in people battling the coronavirus. Responders and people battling the coronavirus. Thank you very muc