During coronavirus. We turn to Jarrett Dieterle from the r street institute, a Senior Research fellow joining us this morning. A tweet on this topic from the hill newspaper noted that liquor and alcohol laws are being liberalized faster than at any time since the end of prohibition. Would you agree . Guest yeah, i would. Thank you for having me on. I think that is an accurate assessment. Isce prohibition, there reluctance to update our alcohol laws despite prohibition having started over 100 years ago now. Crisis,of this current it is causing a lot of state and local government to rethink how they approach alcohol and creating more flexibility whether it is retailers or producers or breweries to allow them to either deliver or do curbside pickup. Two examples that is something that was not always the case. It has definitely created a push for more flexibility. Host what do you know about alcohol sales in recent weeks . Things from Grocery Stores, other traditional resource retailers has skyrocketed. People are stuck at home. A lot of people are stressed right now and want a beverage with dinner. Unsurprising, cap rooms, the local bar or restaurant, those have limited exponentially plummeted. It has been an interesting time in the alcohol landscape to have sales booming in one landscape and falling in another. It has helped producers who have flagship products to produce what they have a lot of out in stores, those are doing well. Producers that emphasized they are struggling right now. Host for our radio listeners, some of the numbers by the associated press, alcohol is up 55 , premixed cocktail sales rose 75 compared to last year. Whileales are up 626 beer sales rose 42 . The online alcohol sales are up to 43 . We are taking your questions 3 . S morning 24 eastern and Central United states, 202 7488000. Mountain and pacific regions, 202 7488001. Taking your calls about alcohol sales during the pandemic. How much debate has there been beer and wine stores essential and keeping them open . Guest it has been one of the predominant questions. Most states have made them essential. They realized that people are going to want to have readily available legal access to alcohol like they traditionally do. It looks different. But theybside pickup, still want the access. There has been a couple of outliers. Pennsylvania and nevada. Pennsylvania decided to close all of their state run alcohol stores. The government runs the wine and Liquor Stores. It created unintended consequences that led to pennsylvanians going across state lines to surrounding states. Those Liquor Stores in those states got overwhelmed that it made social distancing difficult and if anything, helped spread exposure to the virus instead of going in the other direction. Pennsylvania is trying to do online alcohol sales. They are only able to process a few orders a day. They only open the website at certain points of the day. The states that are not trying to function as close to normal as possible, are really struggling and creating unintended consequences that are not good for Public Health overall. That youtes realized can debate all day long is alcohol essential or not, the reality is that people will want avenues to get it and enjoy it responsibly. The recognition of that is appropriate. By and large, it has been done by most states. Host we will talk more about individual state responses. First, this is andi out of illinois. Good morning. Caller the lady asked if i had an opinion on this. Im concerned about local breweries because unlike restaurants, they cannot easily come back and they are capable of making disinfectant which is something we need now. I think the laws surrounding them need to be reupdated. I am surprised the surgeon theral is not above governors which are seemingly being arbitrary. My questions. Host thanks for the questions. Guest those are good questions. As far as the Surgeon General and the federal government having more authority, the reason that our alcohol legal regime is at the local level is the direct heritage of prohibition. After prohibition was repealed, there was little appetite to keep most alcohol regulation at the federal level. Y devolved that power to local government. They canide still ban alcohol, they can control sales directly. They can control what breweries do. That is why we have the structure we do. If things move from one state to another, that may in book eight the federal government. For the most part, it is local. During a national emergency, that can be frustrating. States are acting differently from each other. Is not true in illinois, true in virginia or georgia. That is why we have it where it is. Breweries and being concerned about them, i think that is fair. A lot of them have prioritized taproom offerings and the local community hub. Maybe they host bingo night or some other community events. Those are not happening right now and it really hurts those breweries. We can get into the Hand Sanitizer issue, but we have seen more producers trying to get into that and create disaffected to help fill that market gap. I dont know if that will be enough to sustain them throughout this, but it is something that they are doing. Miriam in texas, good morning. I dont drink, but i was is moreg why alcohol andntial than other stuff is there any probability that there is going to be a lot of or a lot of at home people drinking and stuff . Guest i think the reason alcohol has been deemed essential is just a reflection of learned experience on behalf of public policymakers. Have raised the barriers or tried to ban or at least prohibit alcohol sales, it has almost immediately triggered people to take riskier steps. You have seen it prolifically with the development of the black market. In our modern society, for example in pennsylvania, it has caused people to go across state lines and bring that alcohol back and perhaps they are selling it to friends and creating their own form of a black market. I think that is the reason, it is a reflection of reality, not getting bogged down over whether it should be essential or not, but what reality is. It is harmful for people at home with potential alcohol abuse disorders like you referenced. That is always a concern. We want alcohol to be enjoyed responsibly. In states that have closed their alcohol stores, what we have seen is that a lot of people would have an alcohol abuse disorder are all of a sudden out of access to alcohol but not in a way that can help them longterm. It is a sudden withdrawal and they are flooding hospitals and it has led groups like the Pennsylvania Family Council to come out and urge the state from a Public Health standpoint to reopen stores. It is a big concern. We need to address abuse issues. Doing it in the middle of a crisis is the wrong way and causes unintended negative effects. There are complex issues at play which is why you have to be very careful about how you go about it. Host when it comes to people underg delivery alcohol stayathome orders, why in some places will they deliver it without food and why do some places make you order food if they are going to deliver you alcohol . , for it is arbitrary sure. A lot of that has its lineage in prohibition and post prohibition landscape. Was concerned that people need to have some food when they are Drinking Alcohol or it will lead them to indulge drink too muchr alcohol was not enough food to balance it off. Obviously we want to drink alcohol responsibly. It is not a reflection of the situation right now. A lot of people are able to get their food from the Grocery Store but they maybe are not able to get their access to spirits that they are used to. I think it is a different situation with what those laws are intended to address. That is why it is a lineage that we carry with us from the prohibition mentality that probably does not make a lot of sense in a modern context. Host from richmond, virginia, this is andrew. Good morning. Guest good morning. I have a twopart question. The first is the relate of rate of change ive seen. Is there any risk or do you foresee that a lot of the loosening of rules will be revoked or unknown undone following the pandemic and the latter is more general, we have the a tremendous change in liquor and alcohol laws state to state. New york city just started allowing the delivery of liquor and cocktails. And medicine and healthcare researches have been loosened. Laws graduallyt change and progress is slowly accomplished or are we entering a new phase where Rapid Development of laws and progress is upon us . Guest those are both really good questions. To your first question of whether this change will be durable, that is the key question to be asking. I think there is evidence pointing both ways. On the one hand, some of this is pandemicdriven right now. Makingrs and mayors are quick decisions, signing executive orders, using their authority in the most robust way tosible to give flexibility alcohol licensees to do delivery and take out as you mentioned. Some of them have not, which is interesting. In virginia, for example, they are allowing distilleries to ship their products to customers, that is temporary. It also is giving them the permanent ability to either hand live in hand deliver themselves or use thirdparty contractors. That is a permanent change. It is caused by the covid crisis but it is going to last for the duration as announced by regulators. Hope thatere is some this will be durable and create more flexibility longterm. I think a lot of producers and restaurants are discovering that having some kind of delivery component to their business can make a lot of sense. There will probably be some place for that to continue into the future. Question about the weader landscape, i think certainly have reason to believe that these changes will be longterm and durable. To your point about them changing really quickly is very interesting. In alcohol policy and change can be really slow. What we are seeing is a harsh reflection of reality of people realizing the benefits of more flexibility. A lot of these things are longterm changes. At the same time, i do think it is unfortunate that we had to wait for a crisis to actually cause that quick movement. It is interesting. It is an area that has been occupied for a very long time changing quickly. Host has there been any push to change the drinking age . Overtime you occasionally see groups that call for that. Often times the context of a subgroup like in the military. You can go and be drafted at a younger age coming should be able to have alcohol at that age. Not beenrge, there has a large movement to change the drinking age. I do not see anything coming out of covid that directly relates to that. People are more focused on how to help users and consumers with access and flex ability. Host talking about alcohol sales amid the pandemic. Jarrett dieterle is our guest of the r street institute, a Senior Research fellow there. This is people out of michigan, good morning. A eva. Caller the state collects a lot of revenue from alcohol sales. Wont they make adjustments because they cannot afford to use the revenue at this point in time, i think revenue is very important. A lot of those are a reflection of reality. States make a substantial portion of revenue off of alcohol sales. Therefor they want those to continue in some form. Beyond a tax revenue, i think it is important to note how many jobs are created in the alcohol industry. These are not just whitecollar jobs. They are production line jobs, they are killed by people without degrees. The politicians talk about wanting to expand and grow. Policymakers want to keep that up. In recent years, the most growth we have seen in the Manufacturing Sector has been in the alcohol industry whether it distilleries, people in breweries or bottling wines at distilleries. That has revenue implications, it also has job creation applications. I think people want that to continue which is why we have seen some of those adjustments during this time. Host laura out of texas, good morning. Caller good morning. Have a comment i have personal experience with abuse, childpousal abuse. I do not appreciate that they will allow alcohol to be home where there is severe abuse. I think it is ironic that they will allow alcohol to be sold in crimeay when this type of is being risen. It is going skyhigh. There is not a sheriff, not a cop, no Law Enforcement officer in this country that will not tell you that women and children are locked up in a house with a man that wants to abuse them. Host we had a conversation with the head of International Association of chief of Police Yesterday and he talked specifically about that issue that you bring up that they are seeing rates of Domestic Violence calls go up in Police Department around the country. Youett dieterle, i will let take on the Alcohol Delivery component of that question. I have had members in my family that have suffered from alcohol abuse. I think it is very important in this situation not to conflate multiple patterns that are not related. Yes, there has been evidence that abuse rates are rising. There has not been any evidence that it is related to Alcohol Delivery. Probably a virtue of more people being stuck in the home, not necessarily alcohol being delivered there. Some of the highest abuse rates that we had in our country, a lot of people during the prohibition era were related to saluting and permits drinking ning. Men after work go to the saloon and then coming home and being abusive. I dont think delivery itself is exacerbating that issue whatsoever in a place there has not been any kind of documented rise that is related to it. It is definitely a Public Health concern and a criminal justice concern, an issue that we want to be aware of and make sure it does not rise. There has been no evidence that the cause or even made worse by Alcohol Delivery. Host jean in michigan, good morning. Caller good morning. The woman kind of hit on a point that i had myself. And the smoking that they have done all of these laws against and have raised all of these taxes, the alcohol industry has not had any taxes it. Nst it put against they are encouraging younger people to go out and drink constantly. All of the commercialization is toward. I believe Alcohol Companies touch just as many lives and hurt them as the tobacco does. These Alcohol Companies should be taxed harder and help pay for the pandemic. , thoughrrett dieterle ahead. Guest it is not true that alcohol producers are not being taxed. There was a recent part of the ago. Ill a couple of years that was the first time there had been a modest production. It is not the case, i would disagree with the notion that they are not paying taxes. Taxes,so pay state sometime local taxes as well. They can be very high. Is over 50 of the revenue that distilleries get from a bottle of alcohol by the time you add the state impose markup on it as well as at the federal level. Most producers understand like any business that they should be continued in taxes. Taxes. Ributing a lot of them put time and thought into alcohol abuse issues. It is something that deserves public attention and Public Health responses two. Doing that through Public Health education, counseling services, and addressing the cause is what is important and not conflating that with alcohol generally which is a product that has been enjoyed throughout Human History by a lot of people responsibly and in an appropriate way. Obviously like many goods and services in our economy, there are things you need to monitor but i think we should not be overbroad in our response to that. It creates a whole host of other very negative problems. Some of the highest crime rates we had were during prohibition where we had violent gang organized structures moving alcohol and potentially hurting people they get in their way. Everyone wants to find the right niche to help the most people. I think that actually points toward reform combined with resources versus going to the way and making the problem worse. Host the question about drinking age in this country spurred some discussion on our twitter page for those who follow along everyday. Steve said the drinking age to be 18 everywhere in the u. S. Thess the law changed for draft at age 21. When it comes to beer delivery, how do you ensure that somebody under 21 is not ordering the beer delivery and the incentive is there, you have driven the product out to somebodys home already. They areu make sure the right age to consume alcohol . Guest that is a good question. Im glad you brought that up. It is not much different. The delivery model has been going to the store, there is still id verification requirement. It is computerized in most cases like it often is at stores that you go to. Some of the places that have allowed delivery have actually found better compliance for the age requirement through delivery then they have sometimes at stores which sometimes dont even check ids. A lot of people have had that experience and are probably listening. They have been to a store and not necessarily had that id checked even though they are in that range where they probably should. People bring up that concern but given the way that technology has evolved, there is a readily available model to make sure that is not happening. Au are not giving ability to have alcohol delivered to their house. It is important that it continues because that is the law. Whether you think it should be or not, it is. It is something that is happening and the companies that are doing delivery are putting a lot of time and effort into compliance for that. Host time for one or two more phone calls. This is dug out of alaska. Good morning. G. Dou caller this is not exactly related to the virus problem but my friend and i would like to make beer and wine and enter a local competition. I wanted to enter in some of the contest in colorado or california or washington. Illegal told me it was because of federal or state laws. You know anything about that . I dont know exactly the situation of brewing beer in alaska and onto colorado. It would not surprise me. A lot of states have a lot of restrictions on bringing alcohol into the borders from outside. Very much to the vestige of prohibition. The homebrewing movement was triggered by president jimmy carter when he signed a law that allowed homebrewing. It was actually a federal restriction at the time. That combined with statelevel brewpubsnvolving created the craft beer revolution we have today that has led to all of this economic andth and jobs manufacturing jobs across the country. Homebrewing definitely has a rich history of being entrepreneurial. It does not surprise me if that is the case that there might be restrictions going from state to state. Host