Author of the book the case for nationalism. You write that almost everyone has an opinion of nationalism without knowing what it is. A lot of people think patriotism is the appropriate word for everything good about National Feeling or National Loyalty and nationalism is the word for everything bad about it. That is not the correct way to look at it or the correct definition if you want to get technical. Comes from a latin word, same as patriarchy. Loyalty to your own. Nationally is a more specific doctrine that the same People United by common history and a ammon language should govern distinct territory. In a nutshell, that is nationalism. That we should be independent and selfgoverning. Of the that the root American Revolution, the insight that we have our own rights and claims and should be a part of our own british empire. Runs throughout exam al is in a hamilton, fdr, and reagan as well. A couple key projects. One is that we should have a strong capable National Government. Hamilton in washington believe the National Government will collapse and discredit the whole american project at the outset unless it is stronger and more capable. Limited is a well as well. We should have a strong military, especially a navy, during important hamiltonian projects. We should extend territorial assimilate should immigrants into our culture and in the 20th century, a major nationalist project that was a threat to poor and policy, republicans and democrats, that we should support the creation of the International System that respects the sovereignty of other hopefully democratic nations abroad. Host who gets to decide what is in that definition . You named several specific projects. Guest this is the hamiltonian tradition. You can have an argument about what should and should not be in and out. Are very important and we should protect them. Policy istest for any that, does it serve the interests of our nation and our people that they mean more to us than nations around the world. Host you make a distinction between american and civic nationalism, ethnic nationalism. What do those terms mean . Is usedivic nationalism for another word for patriotism, quality of citizenship and things of that nature. Ethnic natural nationalism is the belief that a certain race over andshould govern. Bove any other ethnicities american nationalism Ministry Just civicper than nationalism. Though that is a key part of the american project. Higher and above ethnic nationalism. White nationalism is a contradiction in terms. The beauty of the nation is it represents a loyalty up and or sect or religion or partisanship. Rich lowry, author of the book the case for nationalism. It is our topic of conversation in our final installment of washington journal. Epublicans 202 7488001 democrats 202 7488000. Independents 202 7488002. Thent to talk about what criteria for citizenship in this country has to say about how we see ourselves. The criterion for citizenship in the United States is not an ,ttachment to a set of ideas this standard enlightened by some standards but also speaks to a deep belief, such that it confers extraordinary privileges to those born here. Implies the nation does not choose us and we do not choose it. Guest this is a key insight of nationalism, that we all have a sense of belonging that most of us do not choose. A lot of People Choose to come here but most of us do not and we are born here. We are loyal to the country as a deep and abiding connection that goes above and beyond choice. It goes to me how important buture is in this country goes back to the bible, where we get the idea we are a chosen people or almost chosen people, as lincoln put it more modestly. And that the first covenant in american history, every town and Church Founded on this continent thereafter is the product of a covenant. Is the u. S. Ortant constitution. Host what are other covenants we should look back to . Guest the basic idea comes from the old testament. It is interesting because it limit on god, of that if you fulfill your obligations to him, he has obligations to you. In the this reflected constitution which does not just create national power, but also limits national power. Host joe is up first out of connecticut, a republican. The book is the case for nationalism. Rich lowry is here. Caller i just want to say i stally support rich lowry idea in his book and of course the biblical foundations and so on. , see so much in this country especially under the obama administration, and wanted to go contrary to that. Wanting to bring in a not other countries and their laws and so on. Whole concept of people, for example, islamic people who would like to bring lets say sharia law into the country. We have a history and it is sad about the American People in and especially students. I taught at a Community College and found so many students were andtitutionally ignorant biblically ignorant. I will give you one case and then i will let it go. Been on trial in this impeachment thing. That he took at and exposed them, talking about joe biden. The truth is when you look at the constitution and you look at the second article which governs and when you look at that third section of article two, you find out there is a take care clause and the forident is responsible making sure the laws of the land are upheld. This is nationalism. You brought up a lot of topics. Guest the basic premise of the is thatcon comments our laws should govern us and no laws should. This gets to the reason why empires have never been democratic. National the most natural form of organization to that we sense of unity all can live together under the same set of rules and laws. You have various peoples and nations and part of a larger correct collection. The culture will be dominant in the language will be dominant. Empire willin the like this. They will bristle against it. As long as there is enough course of power, it will hold of the together. Soviet empire in the 20 century fell apart, colonial empires reasonart all for this people want to govern themselves and they should govern themselves. Lower in the hierarchy of organization, you go to tribe or sect, but one with postcolonial states in the middle east and africa is that there was not a sense of National Feeling, a sense of social trust, a sense of lee we. That is when democracy is able to work. Organization is a nation. Caller this is a great segue for this question. You said american nationalism rises or somehow rises above ethnic nationalism. He knowledge tell the underlying structure of the country was changing. Is becoming a lot more brown and part of what our job was was to imbue people who came into the is this consistent with your view of nationalism and how you maintain a National Democracy as opposed to changing an empire. It has been important throughout history that we assimilate immigrants. I think people look at the cliche that we are a nation of immigrants and believe we always had a high level of immigration. That is not true. Immigration levels have gone up and down. Andbargain is you come here embrace our ideals and assimilate into the broader culture. That has been true throughout our history. This country can assimilate a lot of immigrants. I would like to sue the u. S. Adopted system that is more dressed to do more of it of his us on skills rather than legal immigrants we are taking. I also want to see a robust culture of the simulation. One thing is we had an enormous wave of immigration. You had every elite institution concerned about a simulating immigrants. Whether it was philanthropic organizations or schools. Historically high levels of immigration without that machinery or culture of the simulation, which worries me. Do you think american nationalism is what President Trump means when he says america first. . Guest i do. I think it is an instinctual expression of the belief that we put our interests first. I think trump, when he is on the teleprompter, it is unassailable. Some of the nationalistic statements he made the u. N. And the speech he gave, the best speech of his presidency, very nationalistic speech. All that is terrific. What should be the unifying potential an appeal of nationalism. Inre is a sense we are all in this together. Host a review of your book in the washington post. It seems part of a larger effort on the right to create an afterthefact framework for trumpism to contort the president s impulses into a coherent worldview that can outlast him. A sort of rescue mission for the conservative movement. Has ideals. Does President Trump give a damn . Guest on the right there has been a lot of backfilling since President Trump got elected. Usually when you have a major disruption in a political party, you see a Movement Building over time. When the new left took over the democrats in the 70s, this was a movement you could see on the streets and various dissident leaders. Trump comes out of nowhere. There has been an effort to andk through what he means what i attempted to do in the book, it is not a book about trump. It is a book occasioned by trump, where he has hit on an important factor in our politics and history that have been relatively neglected and often misunderstood. What i would like people to take away from my book is theres something to this nationalism that is deeper than trump and one trump is gone one way or the other, as the Republican Party should not turn its back on nationalism and it should be thoughtfully integrated into the Program Going forward. Chris, a republican, good morning. Caller thank you, you are one of our best defenders of the constitution. The birthrate thing being born means you are taught our history. Are still in the fight. We came in here fighting and are still fighting for our freedom. It is being taken from us now from the inside. I am amazed at it. The birthrate is, i am a citizen and i have the history of the country and my soul and heart and i went to vietnam and fought in vietnam. In 1971. I am a proud veteran and a patriot and it is killing me to see this thing going away from me by our own people. I would never turn on them but they are turning on us. I want my country back. That is with this is all about. Thank you for your service. Cosmopolitan, beginning in the 1960s and 1970s, this has seeped into the american elite. A d nationalizing elite, which the late great social scientist Samuel Hunton said is probably unprecedented in world because usually conservatives are building of the nation and we have an elite. Hat in some respects when it is taught, the idea that it is a tale of unrelieved repression and well woe. Since rave National Host what is an example . Focus it is important to on the history of slavery and jim crow in this country and i think conservatives have fallen down over the decades and wanted to look past and sugarcoat it. The lead essay in that series said the American Revolution was slavery andting that is completely untrue. It suggests the constitution protected property in man when actually, between the offices of james madison, the phrase was explicitly left out of the constitution which represented a but the idea was the constitution should not affirmatively defend slavery toward longterm goals. To ideals and eliminating slavery. You had a turning away of slavery in the north at the time of the revolution. Every state in the north of theg a loosening slave system in the south. We would not have had antislavery to them the civil if the revolution it is up securing that and you us purporting to teach truthful history. And Robert Wiseman talks about his report on how the Senate Impeachment trial should be conducted. They sure to watch cspans washington journal live this morning. Join the discussion. On the sunday news programs, the set trial against President Trump continued to be a central topic. Heres what three senators said what they would like to see in the proceedings. First of all, the senate has sole responsibility for the trial and we have responsibility to have a fair trial. We need to hear about those who have information about the president ss call with the ukraine about holding up the meeting, holding up aide. As witnesses need to be heard. Lets have those witnesses testify, along with the documents that would affect why the funds were held off, why a meeting was not allowed with the president of ukraine, and exactly the context of the july phone call. Thats a minimum for a fair trial. Isnt the reality that democrats had all the power in the house but very little in the senate . Just another example of how painful it is to be the Minority Party . And has, the president in the house, the president chose not to cooperate. But he told key witnesses not to testify before the congress. He refused to allow documents to be produced. Never before in an impeachment inquiry has that been done by the president. You have unusual circumstances in the house. The senate has its response ability. The center has the house has so responsibility. Senate to operate in a fair manner. I would start by giving each site a good amount of time to present their case. I would give the prosecution 24 hours. I would give the president 24 hours. Then i would allow plenty of time for senators to ask questions. We cant ask questions. We submit them in writing. They can object. At that juncture, we should step back and say have we heard enough . Do we want to go further . I suspect at that juncture somebody will make a motion to dismiss. Thats what happened in president clintons impeachment. The senate decided to hear three more witnesses. Its also possible im not recommending it, but its possible for the senate, through the presiding officer, the chief justice, to appoint a committee to hear additional evidence if the senate thinks its necessary. I dont know if well ever get the case. And i dont know why the speakers doing this. Maybe shes telling the truth, that she wants to dictate the policy, for the procedure rather, to the senate. If shes sincere in that, i think its unconstitutional. Maybe its a cynical political ploy. Maybe the actions indicate indecision. I dont know. You say there will be a trial. Speaker pelosi will send articles of impeachment, even if republicans do not agree to have witnesses. Look, ultimately Speaker Pelosi will make that decision, but i think shes been clear she will send over articles of impeachment. But were in this important period of time right now where people are going home, having to answer questions about a fair trial, whether a rigged trial or a fair trial. And again, everybody whos grown up watching trials, whether its on tv, whether its in the movies, everyone understands that requires witnesses in order to be fair. Are you expecting a trial to start in the beginning of january . I dont know exactly when the trial will start. I dont know. Twowe also heard from satyrs, one democrat senators, one democrat and one republican, who talked about a prayer group they both attend. Strenuous ly straining some of the hardships have worked hard to build, in such sharply divided politics. I have a number of friends i work really well with, but on certain issues, on certain topics, we can barely speak about it anymore. That just reflects whats happening in our home states, in our families. What we need to do in washington is model the idea to disagree with it other, but not be each other, but not be cruel or sharp or nasty to each other. We need to resolve disputes without resorting to violence so people who come from different states and frameworks and values can come together here and resolve things. We are underperforming in that area in congress. Washington, d. C. Is a mirror to the rest of the country. One of the key things we can do is just be who we are. There are people of faith scattered around the country. There are people who dont have faith. But we can show respect for each other and say go the veer faith. Whatever that faith chooses to be, im going to be mine. And find areas of common ground. I dont have to compromise my common values to find common ground. Journalns washington live every day with news and policy issues that impact you. Coming up this morning, National ReviewSenior EditorRichard Brooke kaiser discusses his aok, give me liberty history of americas exceptional idea. And Robert Wiseman talks about his recent report on how the Senate Impeachment trial should be conducted. Be sure to watch cspans washington journal live at 75 eastern on 7 00 eastern. Join the discussion. Speaker pelosi the house will be in order. For 40 years, cspan has been providing america unfiltered coverage of congress, the white house, the supreme court, and Public Policy events from washington, d. C. And around the country, so you can make up your own mind. Created by cable in 1979, cspan is brought to you by your local cable or satellite provider. Cspan, your unfiltered view of government. Campaign 2020. Live coverage and make up your own mind. Your unfiltered view of politics. Night, democratic president Pete Buttigieg spent time with voters in iowa at a town hall in west des moines. After some remarks, he took questions and spent some time greeting attendees and taking selfies. This is 45 minutes