Transcripts For CSPAN Senate Commerce Committee Hearing On Amtrak 20240714

Routes, 10 stations and more than 100,000 annual riders. Rail is vital to mississippi. I have been a tireless advocate for the restoration of the gulf coast Passenger Service. It was suspended in 2005 after hurricane katerina. With funding support from dot , amtrak in the states im , pleased to report that mississippi, louisiana and alabama are likely again to have this amtrak route and that will give mississippi a third amtrak route. Restoration of the service would support growing populations centers, connect tourist destinations, bring new jobs and improve the regions quality of life. This will make a positive difference for the communities and the people of the mississippi gulf coast. This hearing provides opportunity to examine the state of Passenger Rail and consider how to support existing routes like the southwest chief and restore gulf port gulf coast service. In i introduced along with 2015, senator booker the Railroad Reform enhancement and efficiency act which reauthorized amtrak when the bills provisions were included in the fixing americas surface transportation or fast act. It authorized funding levels for amtrak created new rail Grant Programs made improvements to existing rail financing programs and changed amtrak oversight and planning activities. The fast act and those rail provisions expire at the end of fy 2020. Its important for us to examine what aspects of this important legislation have worked and what should be improved. This hearing is an opportunity for witnesses to discuss the impact of amtrak reauthorization and the fast act and how congress can support it in the next reauthorization bill. The fast act led to the creation of the consolidated Rail Infrastructure and Safety Improvements Grant Program known as chrissy. This Program Provides grants to improve the rail network , strengthening innercity Passenger Rail and boosts Safety Initiatives. Among the Safety Initiatives for rail is the diplomate of positive rail control. Ptc designed to prevent tragic accidents such as the amtrak derailment in the state of washington. Timely implementation of ptc is also important that the committee will be holding a full Committee Hearing on this in the near future. In addition, earlier this week the ntsb issued its report on that particular accident. I hope our witness also discuss ways to support further capacity, enhance safety and other improvements for passenger and Freight Rail Service in the next amtrak reauthorization. One area that still needs improvement is on time performance of Passenger Rail. For amtrak to be successful its trains must be available to run on time. With only 43. 8 of Long Distance trains arriving at stations on schedule, amtraks on time performance lags behind comparable transit networks. I hope our witness also provide suggestions to improve amtraks on time performance while maintaining the overall fluidity of our nations rail network. I look forward to a robust discussion of passenger and Freight Rail Service. And again thank our witnesses for testifying this morning. And i now recognize my friend and Ranking Member, senator cantwell. Thank you, mr. Chairman and thank you for scheduling this important hearing on amtrak and the witnesses for being here today. I certainly consider myself a big supporter of amtrak funding and amtrak reauthorization. And also consider myself a big supporter of the chairmans initiative to make sure that that expansion or rework of Amtrak Sunset limited service to the gulf coast is reestablished. I know how important this is to the state of washington and having Amtrak Services. I hope that we can continue to make amtrak a priority within this committee. I want to thank the witnesses for being here today and to talk about Amtrak Services in an era when we an increasing pace of global commerce. More trains than ever before in my state. Our trade economy relies on these methods of transportation to our ports which the chairman is also a big supporter and appreciate his many years of leadership on Port Infrastructure financing. These issues are what plague us every day in the state of washington. We have communities that have Amtrak Services and yet we also have freight congestion and at grade crossings that make our challenges even more complex. One example of this is pine roads in spokane valley. 56 freight and two passenger trains pass through there creating three hours of rail related closures daily. That means the challenge of moving people and freight in our region as we are a gateway to the pacific is becoming more and more challenging. Three hours every day when traffic is interrupted, three hours every day when accidents between cars and trains are more likely, and three hours a day when emergency vehicles are blocked from getting where they need to go. This is a problem only getting more challenging as our trade economy continues to grow. In 2014, 121 million tons of refrain were shipped by washington railroads. By 2035, that number is expected to double. So at intersections like pine roads and train traffic will increase. Right now 56 trains pass through pine roads every day. But by 2035, that will grow to 114. This issue of making sure that we have strong federal support for amtrak and also funding for freight Rail Infrastructure which is instrumental in making sure that passenger and freight run very safely, more efficiently and reliable a big is a big priority. We need to build on the proven federal rail initiatives like chrissy which just provided a grant to kprof the pine street intersection, but we need to make sure in the next surface transportation act we consider other ways in which we can help communities with at grade crossings. Safety must remain a top priority. The need for safety was driven home by the 2017 amtrak crash near dupont in the stateupont in the state of washington. Im concerned we need to make sure that we are having Situational Awareness and the challenges that come from participating in a busy transportation corridor. I know that everybody is now trying to figure out how to get these people and products and services to places in a safety passion. But we need to make it safety a type property. Top property. Obviously positive train control which we know is being implemented is a key component. As we consider the number of freight trains coming through and the impacts on the daily lives we need to make sure that we learn the lessons from the dupont accident and everything that comes with it. So i hope my colleagues will continue to push the implementation of positive train control throughout the United States. I know where we are in the state of washington, which is getting that job done. But we need to make sure we are doing this on a National Basis as well. So thank you, mr. Chairman for this important hearing. Thank you, senator cantwell. I will now recognize senator gardner who would like to say a few special words about a constituent of his. Thank you mr. Chairman. Im parade to welcome this morning jim souby of denver, colorado. He is the chairman of the colorado Rail Passenger association. He is a member of the front range rail commission. Previously jim served as president of the park city policy center based in utah before realizing there is better snow in colorado as well as executive director of the western governors association. He has been a steadfast advocate of the southwest chief and colorado in our nations Passenger Rail service. Jim, thank you for being here. Its an honor to have colorados voice represented on the panel process. We begin our testimony with a fiveminute statement by each of our witnesses. Well begin down at this end of the table with mr. Anderson. You are recognized. Thank you, mr. Chairman. Thank you, Ranking Member. Its a privilege to be here today representing all the people at amtrak and all of our customers. Were probably in the best shape weve been in in our history. So if we look at where we are in safety, and i agree with senator cantwell, the most important thing is safety we have implemented ptc on the amtrak railroad. Were at 99 . We have a mile left in chicago. We have complied with the statute. Its been remarkable in terms of what its provided in terms of level of safety. Second, we are the First Railroad in america to implement an sms program, a Safety Management system program. Its modelled after the aviation programs that i was responsible for implementing at northwest and Delta Airlines when i was ceo. And actually have the chief Safety Officer from both of those airlines is now the chief Safety Officer at amtrak. And so were well down the road on those two points. Number two, on the customer surveys, our customer surveys on a scale of one to ten, we have high Customer Satisfaction at really record levels now. Weve cleaned our trains. We are running our trains on time in the corridor. We put Good Technology in place. Our customer attributes are in the high 80s in terms of a top seven box in the customer surveys. Financially we are at zero net debt. So we have conserved our capital paid down our debt. , paid down our debt in order to position the railroad to be able to pay for the asella and locomotives network and to replace our fleets. We will reach break even in the next 12 months. Probably most people thought that amtrak could get to a breakeven on an operating basis but on operating cash base we , will get to break even. Our grant from you will be used to invest in new cars and infrastructure and work on problems like the southwest chief. So all in all we feel good about where we are and how the company is moving forward. If we think about reauthorization, first principle, safety. We believe we have to have ptc or ptc equivalent on all our trips. There is still 1,400 miles of main line track exclusions. We need to close that gap. Thats mostly in rural areas. But the First Priority ought to be safety. Second, we need to clarify what our role is in the National Transportation system. If you look out over the next 40 years, population of in country is going to grow by 100 million. That 100 million is moving to dense corridors. Phoenix, tucson, houston, austin, dallas. The mississippi corridor from new orleans to mobil, florida, the upper midwest, and thats where all the population is moving in in country. And the highway system is not going to be able to support short haul transportation. Youre not going to be able to add enough lanes. Youre going to have more of what we have on the east coast with i95. We think we can play a really Important Role in a very efficient way in providing an alternative to what we have done so far as a country. Because millennials dont want to own cars. They want to take ride sharing. They want to live in inner city areas. They want to be able to use mass transit to get to their jobs. We have some good ideas about what to do. Third, we need to solve our Amtrak Host Railroad challenges that the chairman mentioned in his remarks. We cannot sustain a Long Distance system with 47 on time. Not in a system where the average speed is 45 miles an hour. If you are going to run at 45 Miles Per Hour and charge more than airlines charge, you got to run on time. If you dont run on time, were going to continue to see a degradation in ridership on Long Distance. Four, we need access to federal transportation programs and fundings and should provide sufficient funding levels to address the underlying policy initiatives that you direct us over time to undertake as part of a National Transportation policy. And lastly we want to strengthen our state partnerships. Thats really where amtrak does the most good. The cascades, the state partnerships. We are now the way to get from san diego to l. A. We are the way to get from milwaukee to chicago. And the northeast corridor carries 820,000 people a day. To and from their jobs and their homes. So we are playing an increasingly Important Role and we want to have stronger and stronger partnerships with the states who we partner with to provide short haul service. Thank you for the opportunity to serve amtrak and to serve the United States. Thank you very, very much. Mr. Jeffreys. Thank you. Chairman wicker, Ranking Member cantwell, members of the committee, thank you for the opportunity to be here today. The association of american railroads has a Diverse Membership of both large and small freight and Passenger Railroads. Our Freight Railroad members , including the seven large class one railroads and over 100 short line and regional railroads account for the overwhelming majority of our nations Freight Railroad activity. While amtrak and aars Commuter Railroad members account for more than 80 of annual u. S. Passenger railroad trips. Aars membership agrees america can and should have both safe fechkt Passenger Railroading and a safe productive freight rail system. Mutual success for both passenger and Freight Railroads requires collaboration and a recognition of challenges must in met to immediate our country as need to move people and goods safely and efficiently. Well into the 20th century railroads were the primary means to transport people and freight in the United States. That did not last. Following years of financial challenges due to the falling Passenger Rail demand. Congress passed the rail Service Passenger service act of 1970. The act which led to the creation of amtrak introduce a basic level of Passenger Rail service while relieving private railroads of obligation to provide Passenger Service. Freight railroads initially helped capitalize amtrak in cash, equipment and services and were prierd required to provide preference to many a track preference to amtrak trains. Today Freight Railroads provide the infrastructure for Passenger Rail. Approximately 97 of amtraks 22,000mile system consist of tracks owned and mained by Freight Railroads. The when looking at the project level, each project involving passenger and Freight Railroads should be evaluated on a case by case basis. These projects are more likely to succeed if certain overarching principles are followed. First and foremost, we all agree safety always comes first. Whether freight or passenger. Second, current and future capacity needs of both Freight Railroads and Passenger Railroads must be front of mind and properly addressed. Today, Freight Railroads carry twice the volume as they did when amtrak was formed. While Passenger Rail ridership increases as welcome. As well. To improve capacity and safety of the network, Freight Railroads spend on average 25 25 billion in private capital each year on maintenance and capital improvements. When freight and potential freight traffic levels are so high that there is no Spare Capacity for passenger trains, new infrastructure might be needed before passenger trains can reliable operate. This leads to the third principle, proper funding for amtrak is critical. Especially as it looks to change and expand service offerings. Policy makers should provide amtrak the level of funding necessary to address its Capital Needs and pay for expanded capacity when required. It is not reasonable to expect amtrak to effectively plan, build and maintain adequate infrastructure and service when there is excessive uncertainty regarding Capital Allocation from one year to the next. Fourth, all parties must recognize that preference of amtrak trains over freight trains does no not mean there will never be delays to amtrak trains. Any number of factors contribute to rail delays including bad weather, heavy Traffic Volume network , maintenance and other factors. While amtrak may be given preference, preference cannot mean a guarantee of zero delay. Ever since amtrak was created amtrak and the Freight Railroads have worked together to establish and implement rules and procedures governing interactions. Keeping both amtrak and freight rains running on time is a tremendously complex issue. Last week, Fra Administration before this committee laid out his framework for next steps on standards and metrics for on time performance, aars members, passenger and freight stand ready to constructively participate throughout this process. Having both safe, effective Passenger Rails railroads , excuse me, and a productive freight rail system should be a common goal of all of us because it is in americas best interests. Achieving this goal requires successful navigation and management of several complex challenges. But im confident that together Freight Railroads and amtrak and other Passenger Rail as well can find Common Ground that benefits all parties. Thank you for your time. Thank you very much. Thank you very much. Mr. Souby. You are welcome. Thank you, mr. Hairman. Im good night delighted to be delighted to be here and provide testimony on this extraordinarily important topic. First of all let me thank the committee for all you have done for amtrak to date through pria and all other efforts youve given the railroad. It is our passenger carrying line, and as was already mentioned it provides that service to over 80 of the Railroad Passengers that we the nation sees. You asked me to kind of relate the colorado experience with amtrak particularly with respect to the southwest chief. And i can tell you starting in 2011 and all the way through 2017, we had a tremendously positive relationship with the railroad. The ceo came out twice to our state. They sent the exhibit train out twice to test new routes within colorado. That was a train that amtrak ran up until just a couple of years ago. Together with amtrak, our local together with amtrak, our local together with amtrak, our local communities in kansas, new mexico and the bnsf railway we raised 75 million to help improve the route of the southwest chief and 3 tiger grants that was the most Successful Program and still remains the most successful tiger Grant Program ever initiated under that program. Unfortunately, in 2017 and then again starting in 2018, we ran into a big change of heart at amtrak. The match that they had provide for our tiger 9 grant, which was prompted by colfax county, new mexico, which would have repaired another 50 miles of track for the southwest chief, amtrak pledge a 3 million match to that grant. Then with little notice, in fact fact to our commission with no notice they withheld the 3 million grant which caused that project to be delayed. Now thanks to senators gardner, bennett, senator udall and senator heinrich, and im thinking of moran, senator moran and senator roberts, that decision was reversed. So amtrak did come in with the 3 million but at a tremendous cost and that cost was we missed the entire build grant cycle. Our partnership which had prepared a proposal for that grant was unable to submit it because we couldnt get the tiger grant 9 underway. We fell a year and a half behind. The next issue that arose was the bus substitution proposal from amtrak. Once again our commission in colorado was not notified of the proposal. We were told about it after it had been announced. And we of course had to respond that it was a poor idea. It would have essentially ended the southwest chief as a viable rail line through our three states and on from chicago on to l. A. So that change the whole tenor of our relationship with amtrak. And im pleased to say that because of the senators that i mentioned and because of this committee, amtrak has turned around, at least for this fiscal year their position on those items. But were not positive yet that amtrak will sustain the Long Distance system once the appropriation bill that was passed and put provisions in to maintain a National Routes and protect the routes once that expires we are concerned about what might happen at amtrak. One of our main recommendations to you on reauthorization is to take the language, language in the appropriations act that said we are going to maintain a National Network and the foundation for that network is going to be the very valuable Long Distance trains that exist, we want to see that language put into the reauthorization. So we have a fiveyear window a a fiveyear window to dress address conditions on the trains. I share amtraks position on on time performance. They need an enforceable stad to make sure the trains run on time its a problem for the Long Distance trains. Its not the only problem. I share amtraks position they need extensive funding to requip requip the Long Distance trains. But that has to be done within the policy framework where a National System is maintained and the underlying routes are going to be sustained. Thank you very much, mr. Chairman. Thank you very much. Ms. Homendy. Thank you. Good morning, chairman wicker Ranking Member cantwell and , members of the committee. Thank you for inviting the National Transportation safety board to testify today. Rail is one of the safest modes of transportation. However when an accident occurs, the consequences can be devastating. Particularly for those who have lost loved ones who or or who were injured. Recent accidents remind us of the need to be vigilant in improving safety. The board recently held a meeting to determine the probable cause of a 2017 amtrak derailment near dupont , washington which resulted in , three deaths and 57 injuries. In accident is one of several amtrak accidents that we have investigated over the past few years, including accidents in philadelphia, pennsylvania, chester, pennsylvania, bowey, maryland, and kasey, south carolina. On behalf of the ntsb, id like to take a moment to extend our deepeth sympathies to the families and friends of those who died in these accidents and wish the fullest recovery to those injured. There were multiple factors contributing to the dupont accident but the tragic fact is the deaths and injuries were preventible. Frustratingly this was another crash that could have been prevented with positive train control. Ptc is on the ntsbs most wanted list. This august, we will remember those who lost their lives 50 years ago in a collision of two penn Central Trains in dairy anne, connecticut, leading to the first recommending on ptc. Since then we have investigated more than 150 accidents that caused over 300 fatalities and 6,700 injuries. While the railroads are making progress toward implementing ptc much work remains. Full implementation must not be further delayed and exemptions should be eliminated, including exemptions on the 1,400 miles of freight owned track that amtrak will be operating on without ptc. Additionally, the ntsb has recommended that the fra prohibit the operation of passenger trains on new, refurbished or updated territories unless ptc is complemented. Dachshund limited. Is implemented. While ptc will greatly enhance safety on our nations railroads, a welltrained crew is vital to safe operations. Our investigation of the dupont accident found that there was inadequate Training Provided to the engineer. The amtrak Qualification Program did not effectively train and test crew members on the physical characteristics of the New Territory and did not provide sufficient training on the new locomotive. The training devzs were evident deficiencies were evident on the recordings examined by the ntsb. This investigation reinforced the safety benefit of inward and outward facing cameras. The fast act required that all Passenger Railroads install cameras but left it up to the secretary to determine whether they should include audio. The ntsb believes all railroads should be required to install cameras that is provide both audio and image capabilities. Finally i want to stress the importance of requiring all railroads, including amtrak to implement as are comprehensive Safety Management system. Modelled after the programs developed and implemented by commercial airlines. Had amtrak established an sms program, this accident and many others likely would never have occurred. The ntsb has long recommended the implementation of sms in all modes of transportation. We have recommended it before in our investigation of the 2016 amtrak collision in chester. Since then, with the exception of risk assessments for roadway workers, amtrak has made tremendous progress in implementing sms. While the program is in its infancy, amtrak is much further ahead of the other railroads. Congress has also recognized the importance of sms. The rail Safety Improvement act of 2008 required the secretary of transportation to issue a regulation requiring all railroads to implement a Risk Reduction program. More than a decade later, fra still hasnt implemented this mandate. A final rule was published in august 2016, but the fra delayed its implementation six times. Earlier this month, the fra issued an mprm seeking a final stay of the rule that would delay it for an unknown period of time. The absence of a sense of urgency by fra to implement our safety recommendation and the willingness to continue to jeopardize the safety of train crews and their passengers is unacceptable. Thank you again for the opportunity to testify today. Im happy to answer any questions. Thank all four of you for excellent testimony. And well now move to questions by members of the committee. Let me start with mr. Anderson. In a wall street journal article from february of this year amtrak indicated it would like to move away from Long Distance routes and promote more frequent service between pairs of cities. Does that accurately describe amtraks vision for the National Network . How will amtrak support and improve Long Distance and state supported routes over the next five to ten years . And do you plan to shrink any of the Long Distance routes to state supported . I dont think the wall street journal it had part of it right, part of it not right. On the state support network 209 or pria, thats the strongest part of amtrak. And that piece of amtrak is really where the future lies for passenger inner city Passenger Rail in short haul markets where freeways are jammed and you cant add more capacity. So id say under section 209 of pria, our state supported piece really separate from the Long Distance is performing very well. And we have great partnerships with over 20 states in the United States. That piece thats half of amtraks business and its growing. Here is the challenge on the Long Distance. Fy 13 to fy 18 our trips from miles over 600 miles. Passengers buying a ticket over 600 miles is down 30 . The train goes 45 miles an hour. The ticket is more than a low cost Discount Airline ticket in the same market. So we are working hard to try to get ridership up. But its just clear that trips over 600 miles are not where Consumers Want to use amtrak. In 85 of the Long Distance trips are short haul trip where people get on in chicago and get off in 100 or 200 miles. The challenge in Long Distance is the on time performance is a threat to the viability of that business. And number two, it needs billions of dollars of investment. What i want to do is have this dialogue with you and your professional staff as we go into reauthorization about how we tackle that challenge. I do think that there are historically important trains in the Long Distance network that we should always operate, like the builder, the zefer, the coast starlight. But because we spread our resource like peanut butter, we dont have the kind of investment you should have in making those a really special product experience. So we believe there is always a role for Long Distance. But on the margin we should be looking at breaking up some of the Long Distance trains and figuring out how we serve the American Consumer to provide high kault Quality Service in short haul markets where theyre using that service today. Lets look forward to having that dialogue between your team and our professional staffs. Let me quickly move to one other topic. Thats on time performance. Otb. There was a recent Supreme Court tp. O there was a recent Supreme Court decision. I assume you agree that that moved the issue along and that amtrak and fra must reformula and issue new otp metrics once they do, the Surface Transportation Board will be able to investigate situations where otp falls below 80 . At last weeks Senate Commerce testimony, ron batorre, the fra administrator testified about the administrations work to reissue on time performance metrics and standards. What do you envision as the time line and process for reissuing the metrics . We dont have a timeline. I dont think the statute contemplates any sort of commission. Its supposed to be done by the fra and amtrak. The work was done a decade ago before the litigation with the Host Railroads was undertaken. When the Supreme Court denied cert of case is put the validity of the statute on firm ground. We ought to get it down in 90 days. Theres already a template. In the department of 1987, transportation Consumer Affairs passed the same kinds of rules for airlines. And you all live under those rules today. Will you do this . Were going to have to close the record at some point but will you get back to senator cantwell and me and other members of the committee in about 90 days . And give us an update how thats going . Yes, sir. Because thats a very optimistic prediction and good news as far as im concerned. Thank you. Very good. Senator cantwell. Thank you, mr. Chairman. And again thank you to the witnesses for their testimony, and miss homendy, i think i think i want to start with you. Puget sound and certainly the dupont accident exhibit number one of the challenges we face and what we have to get right. That we have more congestion than ever. And that we have these exempted freight tracks that you mentioned that still arent coming into standard. So what the do you think we need to do to make sure that that happens here in washington, d. C. To get fra to implement that . As far as the exemptions, the law did not allow for exemptions from ptc. The law actually allowed in addition to main line track for the secretary to go beyond the requirements for Passenger Rail and for toxic by inhalation lines main lines. , that was done in the rule. The exceptions. We have 1,400 miles of exceptions granted for ptc for amtrak. And some of those, i believe its about 20 curves where there is a 20 miles an hour difference. So something similar to what occurred in dupont. And so there has to be without ptc, a Risk Mitigation. The amtrak and Freight Railroads are going to have to look at what can be put in place if there is not going to be ptc. Were on record as saying ptc should be everywhere. There shouldnt be exceptions. And we continue to believe that. We have had 153 accidents that were preventible. Well, i certainly believe it needs to be implement it. Im sure if i asked mr. Anderson, he is going to tell me it is implemented in washington. That doesnt give all our riders that ride outside the state of washington the security that the learning from the dupont accident that we need to implement this. And i think underlying this, mr. Jeffreys, is this increase in volume of freight traffic. And this is what is its causing so if were doubling i mentioned over in spokane valley, if you are going to have a doubling in the next 15, you know, years if you are going at 56 freight trains a day and its going to go to 114, its just congestion is the number one problem. So then looking at these other freight corridors which is what happened here in dupont. , people said we have so much congestion. How do we get around it . And then we didnt put in the place the system managements and Risk Reduction plans that go with that. We need to stop the next dupont from happening. So mr. Jeffreys, mr. Anderson, could you comment how we do that . Im im assuming you are for fra for positive train control to be implemented across the country, and that the exemption not be allowed by fra. Thank you for that. Right now railroads nationwide got 89 of our required ptc miles fully operational. Were working through that last bit on the lines that host amtrak trains. I think the number is 85 right now. Were working towards interoperability between the various railroads making sure everyones systems talk together seamlessly. The fra regulations are very clear about where ptc is required on the existing passenger trains. And then any new Passenger Service that might be stood up certainly, you know, we support those regulations. We abide by the regulations. Well continue to do so, you know, if there is an interest in reengaging on that. Certainly we will be at the table. Mr. Anderson. I agree with everything he said. I do not think we should operate a passenger train in the United States without ptc or ptc equivalent technology to give us that layer of safety, the southwest chief is the prime example. It doesnt have ptc along that route. And its a lower level of safety. And we shouldnt tolerate a lower level of safety. So where we could use help from you is we think that there are ptc solutions that dont require as much trackside implementation that involve putting pads and cabs of in locomotives where we use geofencesing and other technologies that you are used to in your car. We are up against the wall on fra about having a tablet available in the cabin of the locomotive. So, we think that there might be some ptc equivalent capabilities by using gps and geofencing to at least get speeds under control. Youre not against miss hannitys recommendation that there are cameras inside and absolutely . Absolutely. You need cameras inside and out. Our goal and our sms program, which is what we did when i was ceo at delta, every flight, every day, the data recorders downloaded into a database, and you find all the parameters where the operation was outside. We need to have the data on every single one of our operations in a flexible database so we can monitor what is going on and quickly react to any out of tolerance operation. My time is expired. Thank you. Senator blunt. Thank you chairman. Thank you for all of you for being here. Last week in front of this committee, the fra administrator stated that the agency was beginning the process of putting the new on time rule in place. At the risk of losing all my four minutes and 40 seconds here with this question, the mr. Jeffries and mr. Anderson, remember, i want the other one to respond to, what would you like to see included in that rule . Cases . And also, some discussion of the right to preference, richard, when it comes to you . Miss jeffries, do you want to start . Sure. Thank you senator bowen. I think the important thing for the aar and knowing that we have amtrak Commuter Railroads as members class ones and other , health Host Railroads as members, we were encouraged by the comments made last week. Laying out a process that is seeking input from all involved parties in order to achieve a fully sustainable solution that is going to work into the future. We think its important to take the input from an incorporated and incorporated input from all stakeholders involved. I understand, as my colleague mr. Anderson said that the law says that fra and amtrak shall develop. In my opinion, that doesnt come at the expense of seeking input and Stakeholder Involvement from some other involved parties. But, just having everybody at the table, taking a look at the data, and getting us to a truly sustainable longterm solution. I guess if everyone was on time right to preference wouldnt matter. But assuming everybody wont be on time all the time, do you have anything to say about the impact of an amtrak train being given the preference over other track users . So, in my opening statement, i made the point that given the train preference does not guarantee no delays in all instances. But, i think the important thing is that fra move forward. And its development of metrics and standards that can then be used to measure preference, and that the stb is the appropriate authority to evaluate and investigate the situations once the metrics and standards are in place. It is the expert that can take a National View and look at the impacts of what is going on in the network. So, i think mr. Patori laid out the first few steps in the right direction. The devil will be in the details. But, i think there is a path forward that i can be workable. Mr. Anderson, what would you like to see in that rule . That it would be gauged around the customer. So that it is customer on time. The number needs to be about 80 customer on time. We compete against railroads and buses and people in their cars. So, our statute says we have to be competitive with other modes of transportation and intercity travel. So, if you look at the d. O. T. Rules on airlines, the goal was to have arrivals within 14 statistics mimicked what passengers wanted to be able to see is consumers. Number 2 on the question of preference, preference was given in the statute in 1970, 1971. Then reinforced again when priya priya was passed in 2009. We litigated for 10 years over it. We won the litigation. Now, it is time to get on with putting a program in place that accommodates what ian talks about, which is we are going to have bridges washout. We are going to have hurricanes. We are going to have acts of god that are going to cause us to terminate service. We understand that. But, the daytoday operations from the eyes of the customers is whats key. Every member of congress thinks they are an expert in air travel. As i have talked to about you when youre in your other job. Politics and air travel are the two things that every member of congress thinks they know everything about. But, you know about what happens, too. You begin to get behind someplace in the day. What happens all over the rest of the system. How do you see that impacting, particularly the freight line that you use . And most of the line you use as you pointed out earlier, not lines you own, the lines you use that you dont own. The best way to answer that is the way i did it at an airline, which we ran the best airline in the United States by far. When the weather was good, you better run at 95. Because, there is going to be some days when weather is bad. The bottom line is when you use an average of customer ontime performance, that average of customer ontime performance has got to include a lot of days where you run on time, taking into account there will be sometimes when you have bridge washouts and the like. So, we were able to sort of consistently run in the mid80s, and on a good day, we were running in the mid 90s. Today, amtrak runs the northeast corridor up in the high 80s ontime performance. So, it is something that can be done. Thank you, chairman. Senator udall i understand , that you have said you are used to being skipped over. And that you are willing to go last today. Is that correct . Correct. That is not correct. Ok. [laughter] chair recognizes senator udall for fiveandahalf minutes. Thank you very much. As many of you are aware, its been great to have you here. Great testimony today. Many of you are aware, the southwest chief is vitally important to many of the senators on this dais and to the communities we represent. I am grateful for the work of my friends on this committee. Senators moran and gardner, as well as the worker senators heinrich, robertson, and bennett. This Bipartisan Coalition of senators proves that we can Work Together on issues of common interest to our constituents. As you may recall, nearly a year ago, the senate voted on my sense of the congress amendment. 926 to support the importance of the National Network for amtrak. And i dont think that support has diminished since. President anderson, thank you for our recent discussion over and for changing course for now. An action that is on discontinuing the southwest chief. An action that would be a disservice to amtrak customers, and hurt all communities on the line between dodge city, kansas, and albuquerque, new mexico. And i was very discouraged to hear you say that you are looking at breaking up Long Distance routes. That was not in your written testimony quite that strongly. I want to take a big disagreement with that. While progress has been made, i am confident that the threat is not over. I see that amtrak continues to blame congress and others for budgetary woes when its convenient. Yet when and tasked with engaging the stakeholders, you are slow to do so. Last year, when amtrak wasted resources proposing to disband the southwest chief, i repeatedly requested amtrak engage directly with our active stakeholders. But we dont seem to be there yet. According to mr. Subbys testimony, amtrak is not even responded to a written request for stakeholder engagement. When Congress Rejects amtraks corridor plan, it appears that amtrak will once again be left without a real vision for a National Network. That is deeply disappointing. Amtrak must develop a visionary and bold plan to preserve and improve Long Distance rail for the american public. First, thank you for your efforts to save southwest chief. Our present success staving off discontinuation of service what would have happened would not have happened without your efforts. Your testimony highlights the lack of transparency from amtraks leadership recognizing you continue to work with many dedicated amtrak employees. What is the evidence of the willingness of top management and amtrak to meaningfully engage with stakeholders . I hate to be speaking for that is we went to amtrak forons five years ago and asked them to tram inserve ski colorado. They met with the winter park executives, met with the service with great support as well as our governor. It is restored and had its most ever. Sful quarter is that effort. I will say one other thing that i extremely important and want to make sure the Committee Hears this and that is the way onrak handles this is based metrics related to passenger trips in the greatest diet is the economic and social benefits they bring. Rule communities will have as many passengers as you do in a heavy metropolitan area, but the interesting fact is in three states, the southwest socialthe economic and benefits total 180 million in service cost 60 million to run, so theres something wrong with that equation. Transportation and to return about 50 , but they are necessary because that is how people get to work so we provide public support and that never appears about the services on the as a minor item. I know you understand it in i know all the mayors and county commissioners understand. We just finished research and documented those values and that is where the 180 million amount comes from. I think it is subsidized for 50 million or 60 million per year, so we are talking about a huge public return on that investment and it needs to be part of that. If you just go on passenger boardings, going through small communities, communities that have 15,000, maybe 20,000 residents, you will not have ridership. That is why we supported and that is why most elected officials get that. We finally documented that working with the institute and documented how you can discover ande in published a report i share with the committee staff. Just thank him for that very powerful statement and i hope you were listening to that. To not asked to many questions and i only asked one. He appreciates that as he appreciates you on every occasion. Thank you for your leadership. Thank you for being here today and just for the record, the ski train has been an incredible success. It is still snowing in colorado, so you can go out and enjoy it. Thank you for the opportunity to hear from all of you. Can you talk about the Lessons Learned and how we can Work Together . Can you talk about maintaining a National Transportation network so it is not just the northeast corridor amtrak it is to the states that it runs through. Has impactednty our efforts in colorado. Working with a company yankee holidays to develop excursions off the southwest chief. It is a tremendous destination, or not destination, but a tremendous european vacation venue. And europeans come through the junta, go to they are thinking about the santa fe trail. So, we propose these excursions to yankee holidays. They said, this looks great. But it will take us 23 years to develop the marketing outreach and make these vacations happen. Then we estimate they will be very profitable and they will increase the ridership, of course, the train. Not referring to mr. Anderson when i say this. It was before his immediate time. But thats all this uncertainty arose over whether or not the train needed to be relocated down to the bnsf transcontinental line back in the early 2000s. So, what happened was, yankee holidays us, we cannot engage. We cannot get involved in developing these vacation packages because they are expensive. We have to market them internationally. We just cant do this unless we have certainty that the train is going to continue to run. So, we lost that opportunity. So, this uncertainty about what the future of the longdistance Train Services has a tremendous economic and social effect on our Community Center citizens. As we look at ways to increase ridership as we look at ways to help encourage people to join the southwest chief that uncertainty is the same uncertainty that prevents were people from enjoying it because a company like you just mentioned, cannot market to its customers to go on the southwest chief because as the planning year or more in advance on a big trip like that, it may not be in existence if that is the concern that they have. Think thats a really good point. So, we need to have a certainty. To the point of certainty, mr. Anderson, thank you for your leadership. I know its not an easy job. So i appreciate it, even if we disagree on some things. I appreciate your willingness to come and meet with us and talk to the senators about some of these issues and challenges. Hope we can continue to work on that. We just asked for a couple of things. The certainty front, a letter that several of us had sent on april 5 2019, amtrak responded on may 17, i believe it was. And this is what the letter said. Amtrak is not planning to truncate or substantially alter any longdistance routes, as we have been given clear direction by congress to maintain the status quo in 2019. We believe congress generally endorse continue operation of our current Route Network for the fiveyear period from fy 15 to fy 20. As a paragraph basically ends by saying, we plan on operating all of her longdistance routes from the trains for the remainder of the period while seeking to drive improved. Do you maintain that commitment . Sure. Signed the letter. I actually wrote that line. Very good. Thank you for that. Thank you. I look forward to working with you on this and beyond. And, mr. Anderson, if i could get your commitment to work with mr. Sufi in colorado and kansas and new mexico interest as well. To resolve these issues and make this work for the southwest chief and the states involved. That would be great. I am glad to hear that it is worth 180 million to the state so that they can get their matches up for us to be able to do the work that needs to be done to keep this operation underway. Mr. Sufi . That goes into the general economy of our rural communities. But that does raise an interesting point. It is positive train control, which we all support. But as was mentioned earlier, other Risk Mitigation might be necessary because not every single mile of the 1400 miles of nonptc track that amtrak runs on, should we pay to have ptc on, in my opinion pick at least not yet, until traffic increases. And i specifically want to mention the new mexico line, were amtrak is the only user of the line and runs one train one way and one train the other in 24 hours. That is about 230 miles. If, in fact, if in fact, it is 500,000 or so per mile to install positive train control, we are talking about 100 million for that 200 some odd my line. That is an extremely investment. Im sorry. Anyway, that is an extremely costly investment for two trains. Thank you. My time has expired. Thank you, mr. Chairman. Thank you, very much mr. Chester. Since senator udall asked one of your questions for you, will three minutes be all right . Thats fine. Im willing to work with you. Mr. Chairman, thank you very much. Thank you, mr. Cantwell. I want to thank you all for your testimony. Mr. Anderson, ive got to tell you incredible as it may, i was in northwestern fire before i was a delta flyer and you made the transition incredibly well. And you have a personality that, quite frankly, is hard to get mean with. And we have had some differences on decisions that were made. In your testimony about breaking even in the next 12 months, about the fact that we have a highway system that is overloaded in certain areas and you can be a solution to that. And play an increasing role in transportation, i think it is really, really good. And, something i dont think anybody in this committee would disagree with. My concern is, in montana and you know montana pretty well from your previous job, is that whether we are talking about amtrak transportation or whether we are talking about broad band and enclosing a digital when we are talking about making sure the Postal Service can deliver to Rural America and never changing the postal delivery standards, whether were talking about air travel, it is always a challenge. It is always a challenge. And, if we go off the numbers as mr. Survey said, and strictly go off the numbers, and i get it, man. I want amtrak to be able to run itself without any dollars from the federal government. But the truth is, i do think it is bigger than that. And, i know youre bored has given you a charge, probably to make this thing run with zero doll mac input from the taxpayer. But i will tell you, as i talk to folks and i have never rode a train in europe. Talks with mac talk this. He talked about the high screed, highspeed train being built in china. Everybody that has been in europe tells me those trains are absolutely incredible, and something that people gravitate to for the transportation needs. I just really hope that moving forward, that we really try to make amtrak all it can be moving forward. And you talked about the population areas, and i agree with you. Truthfully, you gotta go where the money is, right . But, we can forget about the rural areas either. So, where im going with this, you probably already know, is that in too little, small towns, that happen to be fairly close to where i live personally, there was a Ticket Office that was closed. No big deal. Except for the fact that in montana, we dont have broadband. 25 of the places in montana dont have broadband. So we cant buy tickets online. Except for the fact that there is no kiosk in these places, that there is a person there, but they can sell tickets. And the question becomes for me, if we are not going to leave Rural America out like the Postal Service, like the Postal Service guy, postmaster general tried to do a few years ago, like what happened with broadband. How do we make it so these folks in rural areas, quite frankly, would use the train, and have said, if they dont have train service, they are not going to use it. Talk too much which really ticks me off. The truth is, how do we make this work for all areas . I know your hearts in the right spot. But the truth is, that, mr. Survey is correct. There are economic and social benefits to this that we also need to include, include in the equation. Could you respond to that . I agree with your policy statement. I think that intercity Passenger Rail can play a really Important Role in connecting Rural America to urban america. There is no doubt about it. We see it across the network. And there is a permanent place for the longdistance network. I just dont think the longdistance Network Serves a lot of these communities very well. And that we could do a lot better job serving these communities. I have to say, that, you know, i have a secretary of transportation and administration that wants to basically cut our funding to a point where we would have massive layoffs. And i disagree with the secretary and i disagree with the omb. So, i would just say this. I dont know how we can get to the 21st century on railroads, but we are not there. Where not there. And it is not your fault. Quite frankly, it is congresss fault. And if we dont make the investment, were never going to get the dividend. So, i would just encourage you to keep pushing very, very hard to make sure that not only do we have good Passenger Service in the places a high population areas you talked about. I have written the northeastern line. It is handy. Dont take offense to this in your former topic it is actually easier to ride the rails and it is the finer point. I think its far better than flying in a fine. Thats affected by. And you should in your position. But the bottom line is, we need your advocacy, because you know this issue better than any others. To be able to push forward so we can make Smart Investments that work well for the american public. Thank you very much. Thank you, senator. Senator moran. Mr. Chairman, thank you. Thank you to our panel for being here. You have the joy of having three senators who care strongly about the southwest chief on this committee. So, people a focus. Im sorry the other two witnesses seemed to be on two other folks. Let me start with mr. Sohe. You mentioned an equation that doesnt take into account benefits to communities that are served by longdistance Passenger Rail service. What is that equation come from . Is that something that amtrak is developing on its own volition . Or is that statutory . No, no, no. The rails passengers association, which is a National Group served on the board until recently. On the National Representative now, did research. They went to the Trent Lott Institute because we worked on that for the gulf coast possible resumption of service. We went back to them because they do a very good job on this analysis. But they went out and looked. I recall, they looked at 11 or some odd. Make sure you understand my question is, you tell me amtrak is using this particular equation. Does not. I am recommending that they should. Be to correct. But whether they get the authority . Where do they make the decision to use that equation that the use . In the evaluation, particularly of a longdistance line. In other words, is that a legislative mandate on amtrak . I think it should be part of a policy framework, as i mentioned earlier, it should be, that policy framework should say, we are going to maintain a National System. We are going to maintain this underlying set of highly valued, Long Distance train service. We are going to grow the expansion of our National Rail network, based on that existing network. And, and when decisions are made about how to establish additional service, then we should take into account, not just passenger demand, but also, the benefits to communities. I understand fully your point and agree with that. Let me turn to mr. Anderson so i can turn my fire to somebody that i disagree with less than i thought they used to but still disagree with. Mr. Anderson, you set the stage for my skepticism about your view towards the southwest chief and longdistance Passenger Service. When we had a conversation with you and my colleagues, and you indicated in the planning stages, or at least thought process of amtrak, a replacement of longdistance or Passenger Service on the southwest chief from dodge city, kansas, to albuquerque using bus service. My reaction, i never intended when i met with you, i was annoyed by amtraks failure to pay the 3 million that i believe they committed to a grant process for the southwest chief. Thats what originated my outreach to you, but it was the bus comment that caught my attention and it stayed with me. And the idea that amtrak would think about replacing Passenger Service with the service for 400 miles, and believe that we would still have a longdistance Passenger Train Service is something i cant get over because it tells me your attitude toward that line, or maybe toward longdistance nonprofitable Passenger Service. So, i will say a few more things before the chairman determines my time has gone. But i am anxious for you to assure me that my perception about your belief in regard to this is erroneous. And in that regard, what i would add to my question or comment is, can you reassure me that you will follow the law . Can you assure me that if you follow the law, that longdistance are profitable Passenger Train Service would continue, and in the letter that senator gardner read you, that you claim credit for that paragraph, which is pretty appealing to me, is there anything in that letter that i should be concerned about that you are using hedge words or things that give you greater flexibility than i think you are conveying by what you are saying today . First of all, we brought the issue, youre my boss. Ok . So, congress decides what our funding is. You decide the policy. I keep a laminated copy of the policy with me at all times, because the best thing to do given how many of you are up here on the hill, is to just tell people that you follow the law. And the law is fairly straightforward in terms of what our mission is. So, what the lobby, allows you to do, what do i need to be worried about that you might do in regards to the reduction in service on the southwest chief . Look. You have been clear on the southwest chief. And we are headstrong, in terms of using the 50 million. We have leveraged the 50 million. Think i told you when we met, to 90 million. But it still has three big problems. And we shouldnt run from his problems. It needs to have ptc. I fundamentally disagree with him. And i dont think anybody should tell Rural America that they have a lower level of safety than urban america, and that their trains are not going to have the kind of technology that the northeast corridor has. That happened at aviation. We had a whole series of accidents, congress changed the law. So, i disagree with that. That the ntsb disagree with that. Thats number 1. You have got to bond what has to be funded to operate that railroad safely. And it needs 100 million of investment. We dont have that 100 million. I have an omb and the secretary of transportation that has a different view of my budget than i do. I agree with all of you that we need to invest in a National Railroad network. But, we have got to have the funding. We have got to fix ontime performance, because you cannot hope to sustain the service if the southwest chief with the continual deterioration of ontime performance. I take that you want to increase and improve the service but there are no hedge words in the paragraph. Thank you. Thank you, senator moran. Senator blumenthal. Thank you, mr. Chairman. And, welcome to all the participants. Mr. Anderson, last month, i sent you a letter, expressing my deep disappointment that amtrak has failed so far to reinstate its Discount Program for veterans and their immediate family members. Until march 2018, as you know, amtrak provided a 15 savings to veterans on tickets for nationwide travel, and for the express travel on weekends. In fact, under previous leadership, amtrak expanded this program. To include sameday travel and benefits to immediate family members. Last year, inexplicably, amtrak eliminated this program. I would like to as i did in the letter, when this Discount Program will be reinstated for veterans . First of all, we have always had a good Discount Program for active duty military. So, that program has continued unabated. And, we are in the process of implementing the 10 discount for retired military personnel. I had my staff get back to you on when it will be fully implemented. We are allotted Computer Programming that has to be done since most of our tickets are sold over the internet. Can you give me an approximate timeline . We should be pretty quick here. Days . I dont know. End of this fiscal year . End of september . Is it all programming . Is that it . Why does it take that long . You got to reprogram era. You want us to go faster. Well, actually, the veterans of america want you to go faster. I got it. Im glad you got it, i hope i got it. All due respect, that you will address the request you. On it. Thank you. This holiday i thank you for your commitment to positive train control a reminder that it was 50 years ago in gary on that a crash occurred that prompted the focus on positive train control, ptc, and it was actually included on the first of the most wanted lists of you saying your testimony back in 1990. We are not talking about a novel or technologically new process. I assume you agree that that 2020 deadline should not be waived or delayed or in any respect, aggregated . It should not be. The rest of the Panel Members agree . They are nodding. What should be done if they fail to meet that deadline . What do you recommend . You know, i know there has been a lot of discussion about Civil Penalties. I myself have looked at the penalties, and i do have some concerns about Commuter Railroads, because they are cash strapped. About charging them with Civil Penalties that , in the end, they could use that funding for implementation of ptc instead of putting that money in the treasury. But, i think the pressure needs to remain on. Not just for implementation of ptc by 2020, and i would urge swift implementation. You dont have to wait till 2020 to get that done. You do it immediately. But also, eliminating the exemptions to ptc. We just talked about an exemption on the southwest line. I just want to make sure that senators are aware, i am very supportive of our national Passenger Rail system and i spent many years defending the southwest chief and all the other longdistance routes. But when it comes to talking about numbers, the ntsb has investigated 153 ptc preventable accidents since 1969. Over 300 fatalities, over 6700 injuries. And that amount of time, we put a man on the moon. We could have a permit to ptc, but thankfully, congress required it back in 2008. And if we are going to talk about measures, where there are exemptions to ptc, and there should be no exemptions, those exemptions should be eliminated. They were not authorized in the law. An ipad in the locomotive cab will not stop a train if an engineer runs through a red signal. If there is an overspeed derailment, if there is a switch in the wrong position, or a roadway worker is on the track. So probably have to implement ptc and these exemptions need to go away. I am one more quick question mr. Anderson. You called the gateway project the most urgent Infrastructure Project in the nation. And then you said, we need to get this done and stop the unnecessary redtape. Period. I could not agree more. What can we do to cut through that redtape . The fra needs to approve, give the environmental approval for the hudson tunnel project. Number 2, we need to kick off all the funding is in place for new york and new jersey for the matches to go forward on the construction of the portal bridge. All of this northeast corridor is owned and operated by amtrak. We serve 820,000 people a day by either our operation, or hosting all the Commuter Railroads. The connecticut railroads. It is an essential part of the economy of the northeast corridor. And, the idea that we dont brace up and go make the kinds of investments that other countries around the world make all the time, is candidly discouraging. As a practical matter, commerce, transportation, rail transportation specifically, would be absolutely crippled and its cratered. You would crater , it would crater the north and, northeastern economy. We have that many people that rely upon the railroad to get to and from work every day, and to get in and out of manhattan, it would cripple the economy. Were talking about tunnels that have decayed, and are literally potential dangers to hurricane sandy. First of all, we have a lot of really good amtrak people in those tunnels. The bottom line is, they were ruined by hurricane sandy. We got our moneys worth. They were built in 1908. Thank you. Senator blumenthal. Senator duckworth. Thank you mr. Chairman. , thank you for holding todays on the implementation program. And, mr. Anderson, mr. Jeffries, i would like to start with you. Last week, i extended an invitation to the head of fra and fm csa, to meet with me to discuss their ideas and priorities for Service Presentation realization. I think it would also be helpful to discuss industry and quasigovernmental perspective. Would you come to my office in the coming weeks to discuss your specific priorities for the authorization . Absolutely. I would love to. Thank you. Mr. Jeffries, implementation a ppc continues to be my primary focus as it is so many of my colleagues for the rail industry. The december 2020, that line is right around the corner and while significant progress has been made, im still concerned about the interoperability components, specifically, and dynamic areas like northeastern illinois. Mr. Jeffries, are you still confident that the interoperability issues will be fully addressed before december 31, 2020 . I am. As you know, we briefed your office on a few occasions, and as issues come up, we have been able to work those through those. Chicago is the epicenter of interoperability and we have got Interoperability Working Group amongst us industry including all stakeholders. We are working through it and have full confidence. Mr. Anderson, are you equally optimistic . Yes. We have great relationships with the Freight Railroads. Our last mile of ptc implementation for amtrak owned tracks is a model, going into Chicago Union station. And, we are on schedule to have that completed on time. If i could, just not for the committee, the real challenge for ptc limitation by the deadline is going to be Commuter Railroads. Particularly in the northeast corridor. And bond vettori has actually done a very good job marshaling everybody. There is a big summit meeting in july at the fra to get the heads of all those railroads and amtrak together to make sure they are going to hit the deadline. Thank you. Mr. Jeffries, i assume aar supports raising funding levels for both the freight formula program, the infra Grant Program and eliminating non highway spending on both pogroms. Is a correct statement . Ar absolutely supports the federal Grant Funding programs multi metal programs. They have been enormously helpful to programs like create and or members have been active contributors of those projects. Yes. Thank you. Mr. Anderson, last week for whom i have the highest respect, highlighted that amtrak nationwide ontime performance a 77. 9 and on par with u. S. Airlines. Sounds pretty good. But as you have testified many times today, that is really not the true story. Let me give some figures. Franciscoo to san line is actually 48 , 48. 8 ontime. Southwest chief, 47 . Empire builder, 46. 2 . New orleans, 45. 1 . Capital limited, 41 . Texas eagle, 39 . And dead last, the salute the line from chicago down to Southern Illinois 35 ontime performance. I, myself, have been stuck on that train pick oftentimes for hours at a time. Hours at a time parked on the side track ergo reliability is the entire game, as you have mentioned for passenger and commuter rail. It doesnt matter if there is one train per day or 10 trains per day, if your customers cannot rely on that train to arrive on time as scheduled. As you have said, you might as well book a flight. It is that simple. Last week, i pressed administrative to be more engaged on the short shunting issue in particular, on the salute the line. I am confident that he will keep that commitment. I am curious if amtrak is experiencing the signal activation issue in other areas of the country . Has amtrak experienced short shunting issues outweighing the nation . We have experienced short shunting issues is on the line you have described. We did have some of the trouble, i think on the hoosier line. The state of indiana has discontinued the hoosier service. I think it has been principally there. Ron but tori has been really good about pressing the Host Railroad to come up with solutions. So, did you ever find a solution for the hoosier line . Are you never did . We have not found a solution. The solution that they told us is to put more cars on the train i just haul more empty cars. In the hope of closing the circuit, which seems goofy. But, its what we are doing. Ok. I am deeply concerned, i hope we can. Its been years. We have said that he will he has been good about it. He has been. But you really havent seen this anywhere else . No. I dont know. Stephens is in the jury on the Union Pacific a little bit. But perhaps you can supplement the record and check with staff on the. Yes. Thank you very much. Thank you, senator. Yes. Senator marquis. Thank you, mr. Chairman. In march 2017, a public works official was killed when his snowplow was struck by an amtrak train at a rail crossing in longmeadow, massachusetts. This tragic event marks the seventh collision in death in the locations is 9075. Making the longmeadow crossing the deadliest in massachusetts. Regrettably, 33 of railrelated fatalities occur at similar grade crossings nationwide. The area where the railway line intersects with the road apparently is a significant danger zone and we need to do more to prevent these kinds of tragedies. Mr. Anderson, what is amtrak doing to prevent fatal accidents that these crossings. We would like to hear that because in longmeadow, we are proud to help amtrak and the massachusetts State Government to come together on the state Funding Agreement for safety apartment at this particular crossing, including the installation of warning lights and gates. But, i also understand that we are currently waiting for work to be in in longmeadow. So, mr. Anderson, can you provide me with any information on amtraks expected timeline for the longmeadow project . I dont have the details on the longmeadow project. I did get your correspondence on the correspondence of the other officials. I remember writing on the topic of we need to go fix this. Crossings are, it is really incredible in this country, as wealthy up this country is, that we still have about 1800 people per year diet crossings. Thats a really big number. And, the fra has a good program. The Grant Program. And, it seems to me that you would just move radically take longmeadow in force rank the most dangerous intersections in the United States, and use an fra Grant Program, because there is a basic way to keep that from happening. And, we know what that technology is. It is just a matter of forcibly implementing a nationwide strategy to stop it from happening. We need, obviously, more work to be done. But, i need you to also commit to giving us the information of longmeadow as soon as possible. Ok, got it. Briefing for the community, so that they know that this whole thing has been brought to a conclusion. Got it. I ask you to make a commitment to do that and to do it in the very near future. And, the federal Railroad Administration recently with drew a proposed rule that would mandated trains, both passenger and freight, to have at least a twoperson crew. The fra also went a step further and created a regulatory blackhole by saying it would not allow individual states to control the size of a train crew. No matter their unique needs. I believe the fras decision represents an application of responsibility. It is another example of the trump administrations antisafety regulatory rollbacks. The fras goal, prior to the trumpet ministration, was to make sure that there was always at least 2 certified crew members. Conductor and an engineer on board, and ready to protect the train as well as People Living beside the track. In response to the fras patrol of the twoperson crew rule, introducing the safe freight act, the legislation will mandate twoperson crew Safety Standards on trains nationwide. Mr. Jeffries, i know that your organization disagrees with me about the need for a National Crew size rule and applauded the fras recent rollback. However, can you please explain whether you also believe that individual states should have zero power to protect the safety of local cargo passengers and citizens near railways. Shouldnt the state have the ability to guarantee a minimum crew size if it believes such a rule would be necessary for the unique circumstances in their states. Thank you for that, senator marquis. The fra was pretty clear in its reasoning and data or lack thereof. Justifying any federal crew size rule. We agreed with that. 17 review of accident showing there is no data showing that having two individuals in the cab reduces risk of accidents. Everyday, we have Single Person crews operating throughout the country. You are right. The aar does not agree that it makes sense to lock in a current operating practice in perpetuity. This has always been a matter of collective bargaining, and we believe that is where it should stay. The fra laid out its legal justification regarding its views on its action and the preemptive effects, at a higher level, i would say, is the epitome of interstate commerce. And, we feel strongly that we need operate under a uniform code of, rules and regulations. And the federal rail safety act lays that out as well. And it does state when the feds act, that it does have a preemptive effect. So, for our purposes, uniformity is certainly desirable. From my perspective, the obama fra reached a different conclusion. And, that is why recent legislation to proceed towards resolving the issue. Ok, i just think it is imperative. Thank you mr. Chairman. Thank you, senator marquis. This on monday, i am told ptc really is not designed to help with grade crossings. Is that correct . Thats correct. Is there the possibility that ptc could be upgraded for that purpose . I know that in the Rail Passenger Safety Improvement act of 2008, that congress required a study of technologies that and advancements that could be used after ptc is implemented for grade crossings, but i dont know the status of that. I believe that was for fra. Ok. Lets see. Mr. Anderson, senator tester mentioned these two little towns, where there is no Ticket Officer, and there is no ticket agent, and no kiosk. Can you discuss amtraks crew plan for updating his reservation ticket Payment Systems to improve the customer Ticket Experience . Increase efficiency, and reduce operating costs . I assume these little towns trade stops in the passenger can get on and buy a ticket on the train. Right. Could you discuss that . First of all, if you look across amtraks system, i think we have 517 places we stop. The vast majority of those have no one there. It is like the old days where you pull up at the train station, the conductor puts the little stool down. People get on and off, load the bags, and had on. About 90 , 93 of our tickets are sold electronically now and, in those two particular cities, i went back and looked. And, since we removed station agents which have an all in cost of about 150,000, minimum per year, we are still selling the same amount of tickets for people to get on and off trains in those two towns in montana. So, it has been something we have been doing overtime. And, as we deploy more technology, we want to be able to give our customers the capability to do 100 of all transactions on their phone. With amtrak. Ok. Ok, when you were with delta, what was your daily passenger count . Depending upon the day, but, we carried 186 million passengers per year. And how does that compare to amtrak . Well, amtrak carries about, amtrak carries about 32 million. But, if you look at the number of passengers we carry on the railroad we operate, the northeast corridor, it is 250 million probably. So, if you take our 30 million, but then we are the operator of the railroad, up and down the northeast corridor for all the commuter agencies. That number is, exceeds what delta did a year and passenger employments. Though if so if amtrak were an airline, where would it rank . It would probably, i dont know. It would rank pretty, if you count all the northeast corridor, it would rank at the top. But if you count the northeast corridor, it would rank at the top. Would you explain the distinction . Want to make sure. So, we own the northeast corridor. Amtrak owns and operates the northeast corridor and all the stations up and down the northeast corridor. And that is Union Station in dc, all the way up to springfield and boston. And, there are eight Commuter Railroads that operate that amtrak dispatches. We take care of the stations, we take care of the track. We run the railroad. And there is 2200 trips per day, 2100 trips per day on the northeast corridor. Amtrak itself has about, this year, we are going to grow at record numbers. We are going to add 900,000 riders. We have about 32 million writers on amtrak metal. And, we probably have about 200 and 50 million that operate somewhere, or we operate railroads for other operators. We operate the Commuter Railroad in la. We do maintenance for sound transit. We operate a railroad in florida. And then, we maintain the corridor. If you take all of that, it is probably 250 million of our. Thank you. Thats i think, very instructive but a testimony. Mr. Jeffries, in the fall of 2018, early 19, Union Pacific norfolk southern, kansas city southern, announced they would be in many precision scheduled railroading. Psr. This is an operating plan previously implemented at cfx, cn, cp, intended to create greater operational efficiencies. Concerns have been raised about the impact of psr. On the business and rail service. In 2019, the Surface Transportation Board held a hearing on changes to class ones accessorial charges in the context of psr implementation. Had easy class ones implementation a precision scheduled railroading affecting Passenger Service . Lets say in the next six months, this year . And how is implementation, precision scheduling, affecting shippers, and what our class ones doing to minimize the negative impacts . And improve service . Question,ou for that mr. Chairman. You are absolutely correct that several of the railroads the latter half of last fall announced operational changes or changes to the operational plans. I would say, each railroad is certainly unique in its network, and its operation. I wouldnt want to cast the blanket statement about what all of them are doing. But, i think some of the principles or tenants that you have seen discussed, and that is certainly not limited just to the folks that you listed, but is increased asset utilization increased in efficiency, increasing visibility, and to orders and shipments, and to Customer Knowledge of product delivery, i think first of all, that any Successful Company is will be always evaluating how it does its job and how it operates on looking for a better way to improve its products, do it service. And i think that is exactly what these railroads are doing. All of them. But, i think, you know, when you look at some of the goals , again, increasing efficiency, creating additional capacity, creating better visibility, more predictable schedules, and to delivery of product, i think that, you know, i would expect that would extend into the passenger product as well. The passenger customers as well. Richard, can certainly comment on amtraks points of view. But i think overall, if the goal is a more timely, predictable schedule on delivery of goods and services, including passenger, i think you would expect that to see a positive improvement. Let me just ask one more mr. Jeffriesou, and then perhaps we can stop. On page 4 of your testimony, you mentioned correctly, that to approve capacity and safety of the rail network, primarily owned Freight Railroads spend, on average, 25 billion each year on maintenance and capital improvements. And you point out that this ultimately benefits amtrak. Surrounding communities in the nation. You go on to say, existing or potential future freight traffic levels are so high, that there is no Spare Capacity, new infrastructure might be needed before passenger trains can be added to operate over a line. Does your association, or do you personally have a recommendation in that regard . As to how to supplement tell for the record, how the Freight Railroads, where this extra 25 billion each year comes from . So, the 25 billion private investment of year comes from the residence owned by the freight railways. Is that encouraged . I would say it is encouraged by the economic paradigm that we operate under. It is not encouraged by the class ones dont benefit from any specific tax credit. No. They had benefit from a balanced economic regulatory scheme. They benefit from a competitive economy. They benefit from customers who want to ship goods and in turn, they turned that, plow them back into the networks. And i think the point of benefiting the passenger customer is that because of all this investment, the freight rail and network is in the healthiest shape it has been in the history of the network. Alcohol users, whether it is freight, or passenger, benefit from the health of that network . The point i am trying to get you, is you are in of being able to speak for passengers and freight. Do you have a recommendation . Is there a need for more capacity than the average additional 25 million each and capitaltenance improvements . If so, do you have a recommendation . Depending on the particular project, we are talking about obviously both sides. They Work Together to identify. Lets see where things are going to be today. What are the potential constraints . If there are constraints, that absolutely there is a federal role to play there. Whether it is through the Grant Program. Those programs that our partners and do all finding. To bring a match for a contribution to creating the necessary capacity. To ensure longterm success. They are usually beneficial. Thank you all. Thank you all. I guess we will close it down at this point. You have been very helpful. Very informative. The record will remain open for two back weeks. The senate asked to submit any questions for the record. The witnesses are requested to submit the written answers to the committee as soon as possible, but no later than wednesday, july 24, 2019. Thank you very much. We appreciate that the members andof all witnesses. This hearing is now adjourned. Join us live later today former programming with 2020 president ial candidate kamala harris. You can watch it live starting at 6 35 here on cspan. Tomorrow, theres more with former Vice President joe biden and his wife joe biden. Live onsee that. Hursday beginning at 2 30 book to be has four days of programming this fourth of july program fourth of july weekend. They talk about the rankings of the chief executives. Wrecks John Quincy Adams is a person i think that a lot of people, hes not a easy person to like. He is hard and can be terrifying. Friday at 7 20 eason, a late historian on reports from the south on the lead up into the civil war in his book spying on the south. In the opening episode, i described a woman at a bar in West Virginia who sees right through me and says i get it. You are a yankee boy spying on us hillbillies. The title was a joke on myself. Alice Marie Johnson reflects on her time in prison before president trumps connotation on her sentence. I stayed there for 15 years. I was told i would only lead prison as a corpse and take my last dying breath in prison. The you think that was a recipe for help . Sunday, a professor will be our guest and at 9 00 p. M. Theern, and author examines rise in violence committed by young men throughout the world. Interviewed by a brooklyn law for brussel. Attacks,k about other the narrative goes back to rhetoric. We have politicians saying this and that is why someone hates immigrants and muslims. I think rhetoric is an important piece of the puzzle, so if that is the case, then a 1 billion industry that is built on black men talking about guns, is that not relevant to the homicide rate in this country . There has been discussion about an appearance before congress. Any testimony would not go beyond our report. It contains our findings and analysis and reasons for the decisions. Carefullyhose words and the words speak for themselves. Ie report is my testimony and would not provide information beyond that which is already public in any appearance before congress. Robert mueller is said to appear before two committees in. Ongress he gives testimony to the House Judiciary Committee and later will take questions from the house intelligence committee, both open sessions. His report into russian interference will air live on cspan. Org ore at listen with the free cspan radio app. Medical experts and trade Association Leaders testify about efforts to protect patients from surprise medical bills. Aboutentatives also talk their personal accounts with surprise medical bills. A Texas Democrat shares this hearing. It is about two hours. Well ask the room to come