Next stop on the cspan bus 50 capitals tour. Former new mexico governor Bill Richardson and former House Speaker brian egov will be all brian egolfn will be our guests on the bus on washington journal. Washington journal continues. Host were taking your calls. Republicans, 202 7488001. Democrats, 202 7488000. And independents, 202 7488002. Lets take a look at headlines. So floridas sun sentinel, deputies wait outside the school. The sheriff investigating claims that other deputies did not rush to enter the school when the shooting took place last week. Is Tampa Bay Times reporting that Governor Scott and the gop are proposing state law changes, including raising the age required to purchase a gun, and background checks on the mentally ill. Assisting the special counsel investigation into russian meddling, that come in yesterday and finally, the st. Louis anstdispatch, an uncertain future for governor brighton as a special committee is going to investigate the governor. The governors are meeting this week your in washington. Regis is on the line from philadelphia your on our independent line. What is on your mind today . Caller it is such a crooked society we live in. I tried to get in newsrooms and everywhere, everyone shunned me and asked me to leave the evidence i have. Ive taken in children, and i have never been paid for it, except for one child. Eric for two years, and now i am being billed for his medical bills. What kind of society we live in when out of the kindness of my heart, i have taken in so many children and have not did it for the money. I had a cousin who stole the families estate, forged signatures, and he is the biggest child molester, but because he is an educated fool, four years of College Posted be college, supposed to be a professor, and yes i have children by him, and he can be very violent when he wants to. Host ok, carl from North Carolina on the democratic line. Tell us what is on your mind. Caller i wanted to get in to talk to james okeefe. Butan, i love to watch you, let a big liar like this man come okies, in, i mean, it is just ridiculous. He has been sued for misrepresenting himself and he as been sued by a former a acorn worker for invasion of privacy. He has apologized and has agreed to pay 100,000. He broke into a landuse office in louisiana. This man is nothing but a crib, he is a product, a crook, he is a fraud, and he talks about fake news, he helped put the men in office known for fake news, known as donald j. Trump. Named nbc and msnbc, the gest News Organization republican propaganda channel is fox. The hill is reporting that the former rnc chairman is calling a cpac official comments painfully stupid. Saidpac official host howard is on the phone on the republican line from fort lauderdale. Good morning. Caller good morning, cspan, and thank you for having michael. My call. I was raised in the country, ok, before the age of 13, i was taught how to shoot a gun, ok. I was taught respect of that life,respect for human not to point at at anybody else get above all things, i had god in my life. I had god in school, ok. This is what was preached to us all day long, and we grew up good people, until they took god out of school, to discipline out of homes, now you have generations of thugs and people that are lost that really do not know the difference between right and wrong because they are no longer taught that in school. They are taught hatred and stuff. That is just the Second Amendment. It has to do with everything, ok. Second amendment right is not to protect me from you, not to if itt us from a bear were to crash into the studio that you are in right now, it is to protect us, we did people, man, woman, and child, to protect us from the a terroristic government. Nobody wants to say that. That is the reason we need protection. That is the reason why the Second Amendment was given to us. There wasnt no other reason. It is not matter that we had muskets in the 1800s and machine guns now it does not matter, because at one time if you take away all these guns, on thetake awa every gun planet, they are going to pick up rocks. Evil is going to exist. You cannot change the our next call from illinois on the independent line. Good morning. Caller good morning. Thank you for cspan. Thank you for taking my cauldron i also had a comment about the recent gun debates. Call. O raised i also had a comment about the recent gun debates. I was raised in a home with a firearm. Ike the previous gentlemen, was raised what to do and what not to do with it. Butas for self o defense i also believe the Second Amendment was written to protect people from the government and also to allow the people to protect themselves from evil. I am reading the book 1776 by david mccullough, and it is pretty incitement to what our Founding Fathers thought your the guns they had were the same as the guns that the redcoats had. I believe they felt it was necessary to enshrine that, and i would also like to note that term limits were not applied on the president at the time should i believe that is because the Second Amendment was written so that if someone decided they wanted to not respect the votes of the people, that that could be checked. Host in some other headlines today, the New York Times writings that President Trump has imposed more sanctions on north korea. It says President Trump announced harsh new sanctions on friday against north korea, signaling a return to his aggressive attempts to put pressure on the government of olympicun after an games that had brought a brief lull in the tensions on the korean peninsula. Willie is on the line from louisiana, a democratic line, and what is on your mind today . , i am ayes maam 20year the it on bettering. Vietnam veteran. It takes a hell of a lot of training to train soldiers on assault weapons positions, and i it iszed, and unbelievable that he could buy an automatic weapon or a semi. Where was he at any vietnam era with his coward self . Call on the line from new york. How are you . Caller good morning. Host what is on your mind today . Can you mute your tv and listen through the phone . Let us know what is on your mind. Caller good morning. Thank you for cspan. I really think that the only way we are ever going to solve this gun problem is to not let these people into the schools, and the only way were is by having at method that we can keep them out, and that is by having a guard or somebody out there with an alarm or have them checked through a system that will let us know that they have a gun on them, and basically, we have the same thing the same problem with the passengers going on the aircraft now. Right here in albany, they had an occurrence where they found a gentleman with a handgun on, and it was not registered, and the only way they caught him was by checking him through the scanner. So that is the only way we are ever going to solve that problem, is by having our schools project with scanners outside and not let these people in. Because having one person in a school with a gun you know the size of these schools. There are so many entrances and exits. They have got to have a scanner at each door, and then this will not happen. Thank you very much. Host all right, and we have duane calling from new york on our independent line. Good morning. Caller good morning. Where can i start . First off, trump has literally taken this country in a different direction. You have a man that is supposed to heal this country and bring this country together. He has not done on. It is constant it is just this president 45 has destroyed this country. A lot of folks on here would not really say that because they love him because he is saying what they want to say, but that is not what we need right now. Right now, i would take any republican than trump at this time. Thank you. Host here is a recap of President Trumps remarks yesterday at cpac, recounting how he went off script in a way to avoid giving a boring speech. Donald trump gleefully went off script, declaring his prepared speech was a little boring. Host warning democrats want to take away the supporters money. President s the full remarks at cspan. Org. Lori is only democratic line from louisiana. Good morning, gloria. Gloria, are you there . Caller hello . Host go ahead, gloria, you are on. Caller it is not gloria, it is thdaria. I feel like the world is going a different direction. [indiscernible] peopleshildren taking money, and you cannot go to a doctor. And i love everybody, republicans, the democrats, but i feel like it is just not fair. I had a son died, he was in the army. I cannot even get his money. I am sorry, we cannot get it for your, you cannot even get it for his mama who birthed him . Caller thank you, cspan for you all are the antidote to a very biased media feed i used to be a daily reader of the New York Times, i listened to npr, but it is so biased now. We have lost objectivity. Where are the Walter Cronkites . They are on cspan now. This is a serious problem where our media is completely biased, and how journalists today are political activists. They are no activists journalis. Thank you, cspan. Senator grassley say the fbi did not contact google during the probe of the florida shooter. Threat was told of a nikolas cruz made last september, never contacted the company to contact the source. Chairman Chuck Grassley said someone reported the threat to the fbi, and the fbi opened a investigationsm but close to it on october 11, saying they never managed to a different person behind the coast. We are continuing to take your calls during the segment. Republicans can call 202 7488001. Democrats, 202 7488000. And independents, 202 7488002. Our next call is on the republican line from stuart, florida. Good morning. Caller good morning. Thank you, cspan. I would like to speak a little but about the gun issue. I really do not believe we have a gun issue, presage. We have a society problem. I am 77 years old. I have a carry permit and have had for years in multiple states. I have owned a rifle from age 13 years old. In fact, in our high school, in connecticut, if you can believe that, in connecticut, we had a rifle club. Rifles to take our school on the school bus. Something terrible has happened, and it is not the gun. About takingg action against age limits now, where you will have to be 21 to buy a gun. You know, at 18 years old, you can vote in elections. Maybe we should do that, too. I am not serious. But at 17 years old, you can join the military. Host you said something has changed, and it is not the guns. What do you think has changed . Caller . I dont know. I really dont know for sure. I think it might be religion. Never seenwe have things like this when i was growing up. And believe me, to take away guns if we covered of all the guns, there are other ways. I am not going to mention them. I know there are other ways that you can kill more people. So i do not know what we can do about this. I just cannot believe what actions are being discussed is going to work. Thank you for receiving my call. Host all right, carl on the democratic line from michigan. Good morning, carl. Caller good morning, kimberly. Thank you so much. I have some comments on Arming Teachers, and i will start with has thend amendment, words well regulated, so Arming Teachers is an example of , wild west,faire you are on your own mentality of the rightwing libertarians. Rifle operated by somebody probably wearing a tactical vests who would first shoot any adult because they may or may not be armed. People talk about banks and Jewelry Stores being secured or defended by armed guards, who are trained for that fact, those are private sector entities that value the content. We do not value the content of our schools. Oh, these are Public Sector entities. Apparently, we do not value their content he same way. Oh well. Publicsectors job or you are the teachers. Yeah, right. It is the Public Sector from it is the states responsibility to protect them, and they will spend tax money to do that. Oh, wait a minute, taxes will go up . We cant have that. Host what do you think can be done in the schools . Caller on the way to it, heavily. First, dan owning a manufacturer of the weapons commonly used in these shootings. All caps limited to 10 rounds. No one on psychotropic drugs can own guns. Security monitored continually as schools. Every inference and exit gained every entrance and exit guarded by a trained person. The kids affected by this are old enough to vote, so the state does not care. That is what the kids should be shouting from a mountain tops. You value your guns more than you value your children arn. Host speaking of protecting students, the wall street if hes talking about the students who have become activists has a piece talking about students who have become activists after the shooting. Host walkouts run the country this week by students protesting gun violence. Texas ons calling from our republican line. Good morning, barbara. Caller thank you for finally taking my call it i have been calling for two months. I think a lot of people are missing the point. When you all first cannot this morning and had your headline of there trump won storm teachers, trump does not want that. That is just one suggestion of one way could all of this goes back to what the federal government can. As a daytoday, that is the responsibility. There are a lot of things that were not put into the database. It was not given to the local police station. They have calls from this guy. But that is the federal governments role. The rest what trump was trying to do is say we need to protect our schools. Can you give me some ideas . What is going to have to happen is it goes back to your state and your State Government trying to figure out what is best for their state, and then it goes all the way down to your local community. What is best for that school . Because there was one guy in that meeting with President Trump from a school in washington, d. C. That said that their kids had to go through to getd to have an id income of their backpacks were checked, and they even said you have to make your cell phone out. Every situation and every school will be different. Real school in our community that you have to buzz in to get into that school. It is different ideas for different people. The federal government cannot come in and say you have to on your teachers. Host ok. Bill is calling from new york on our republican line. What are your thoughts . Caller thank you for taking my call and thank you for cspan. We appreciate it tremendously. Very nonbiased. I think a lot of people are missing the point that there are many people sitting on these interlocking boards of directors. Unfortunately, they are not letting the truth come out about these psychotropic drugs, which is one of the main problems. If you look back at all of these shooting incidents in the last 10 years, most of these young men have been on these psychotropic drugs. A mainould be a topic topic of discussion. Number two is the amount of violence these kids are gamessing via the video and all of the movies they are watching. And of course, hollywood will never take responsibility for it. They will talk about the violence and what they think it they areeanwhile, perpetuating it by having these very violent movies and video games that kids are watching. When you mix these violent games with psychotropic drugs, you are looking at a disaster. Host all right. Coming up, we will have our spotlight on the magazine series at anuing, taking a look recent political magazine on the automation of washington. Nancy scola will be here to discuss that. Later, we will turn our discussion to the pentagons troopson transgender with matt thorn of outservesldn. We will be back in just a moment. Join us today at 9 30 am eastern on American History tv on cspan3 at the American Civil War museum in richmond, virginia, for live coverage of the civil wars impact on americans. Speakers include peter carmichael, james robertson, and amy taylor. At 8 00 p. M. On lectures in history, from the Georgetown University law center, thomas thetalks about his book, political theory of the american founding. In a republican form of government based on consent, virtue is needed more than any other form of government because in a republic, the people themselves make the rules. Sunday at 4 00, the 1956 film about the Historic Supreme Court decision. Had delegates from all the high schools in st. Louis. School, know is at our some people just do not like colored people. I think it is the individual accounts. How are you going to get to know a person if you meet them . When the Supreme Court ruled segregation was illegal, these children were ready. At 6 00, we look at a politicalof popular cartoons from the early 20th century. Continued to draw for the washington evening star for the next 42 years. His cartoons appeared almost daily, usually on the front page, prominently placed. He had quite an illustrious career. Watch American History tv every weekend on cspan3. Washington journal continues. Host joining us now is nancy scola, Senior Technology reporter at political. She is here as part of the spotlight on magazine series to talk about her piece in the january february magazine on whether washington will be impacted by the rise of Artificial Intelligence. Thank you for joining us today. Why focus on this topic . What made you want to dive into the issue of automation, especially automation in washington . Guest when we discuss automation in washington, d. C. , we often talk about its impact on places like car factories in detroit and coal mines in kentucky. We rarely talk about the impact on the kind of jobs people do in washington, d. C. Weislators, journalists, talk about them in this piece. Part of the thinking behind the piece was it was a fun experiment, the part of the motivation was to spark more aroundtive conversation the topic in washington. Viewers can find a piece on politico. Com. For those who have not read it, what are they learning about lawmakers and the process . Explain how this project came about. Guest this is a Company Based in washington, d. C. It is a farm with about 160 is a company with about 160 people with funding. They take all the Information Available in the world about legislation, legislators, the media, that sort of thing, feed it into their advanced system and spit out a great understanding of lawmakers and legislation. The lawmaker we talk about in the piece is orrin hatch, the retiring senator from utah. He has been in congress for 40 years. He has a robust record, but he is a confusing guy. He is described as consistent in his inconsistency. Dedicated tobyists how orrin hatch thinks about lawmaking. Be feed this information into the machine and it spits out information on how he is on legislation. Even the predictions are made about the likelihood of bills he sponsored becoming law. Host i want to read an expert excerpt from your piece. Host is this putting these s we see around washington, is this going to put their jobs at risk . Guest they are the only ones in the business. They have been around about four years. There is a great deal of money spent on lobbying in washington. There is a figure from the First Quarter of last year that 850 million was spent by companies lobbying in washington. There is a lot of work to be done there. It is augmenting the work they do. It is not replacing them yet. We talk in the piece about when you give every lobbyist a bionic arm, you do not need as many over time so it could reduce their ranks. The we are talking about piece on the rise of automation and the impact of Artificial Intelligence on washington. Republicans can call this number, democrats, and independents. Not about the fact it is necessarily replacing all the congressional aides and lobbyists. But it could have an impact. Congressional aides earned anywhere from 30,000 to 172,000 a year. Think, even if incrementally, this will affect these industries over time . Guest i think one of the impacts it might have is on one of the jobs people dont think about people in washington doing. Federal agencies taken comments from the public on regulations they are considering passing. The federal Communications Committee offered up regulations around net neutrality. 22 million comments came in. There is no way a human can read 22 million comments from the public. They would contract these out, take a sample, and proceed from there. That is the sort of work people do not think of people in washington doing. That work withce fiscalnote or another Company Called forum. They Machine Learning use Machine Learning. Host the next caller is from flint, michigan. Caller i want to ask her guest if that is part of cloning. Do you have to have the mk ultra programming people . Do you have to go into the stem cell part of the whole thing . It has to do with cloning humans. Host i want to get nancy to explain what the use of this Artificial Intelligence is in this context. Guest Artificial Intelligence means technology designed to work in ways traditionally only human brains could work. That sounds ambiguous because it is. There is not a clear understanding of what that means in practice. It is also machines they get smarter over time. They learn from past expenses experiences and can input better as they go along. The think about artificial you think about Artificial Intelligence in a car factory with detroit. When we talk about Artificial Intelligence and automation with jobs in washington, that is just pieces of software on a computer. It will not be front and center in a movie anytime soon. It just looks like a computer program. Artificial intelligence is an eyecatching way of talking about it. Host we are not into black mirror episodes yet. Terry is calling from floor to florida on the republican line. Caller thank you for taking my call. My question is simple. Cannot Artificial Intelligence can that Artificial Intelligence be used in governing and the administration . The other question is, how can it come up with Artificial Intelligence to help be social illness in american that American Society is going through . Thank you for indulging me. Guest we did look into this question of whether Artificial Intelligence could replace lawmakers themselves anytime soon. That seems to be one of the jobs that still requires a good deal of judgment. Jobs that require judgment and creativity tend to be the most difficult to automate. When you talk about societys problems, i mentioned this idea that the federal government is supposed to listen to the American Public. The American Public is a lot of people. It is difficult to use that information in a meaningful way. To it outto it out lawmakers tend to tune it out. The idea is if they could use that information in a different way, they could operate in a different way. Host routine processing of huge amounts of data and automation is already at work. Host how much of this judgment can be left to machines . How much relies on human beings . Guest we are already seeing this in other fields. Loan application process and often augmented by Artificial Intelligence in the private sector. When it comes to federal agencies, i think there is a kneejerk reaction to the idea that a computer is deciding federal benefits. The idea is this is a tool humans would use to process applications more quickly. A lot of times, people have to wait a long time to get a response from the federal government. This would help humans make decisions initially, and then there would be some review process after that. When we talk about these tools, there is an emphasis on appeals process so there is a human you can complain to if you think the wrong judgment has been made. Host Artificial Intelligence is the subject of the machine article in politico by nancy scola. She previously worked at the Washington Post and worked on governor mark warners president ial run in 2008. Don is on the line from michigan on our independent line. Caller good morning. What i have to say does not have anything to do with this lady. I keep trying to call in. It is hard to get through. I do have a couple of things. 1998, december 16, the Clinton Administration fired missiles into iraq. Host as he is only here for a short time. If you have nancy is only here for a short time. If you have a question on Artificial Intelligence, you can ask it. Otherwise, we have to move on. Rick is on the democratic line. Caller i would like to ask your guest about how this technology could be used in the judicial system, considering the fact that there are a disproportionate number of African American males in the judicial system, it crying continues and Mass Shootings continue to happen. Guest absolutely. One way these tools have been introduced in the judicial system is judges making decisions about bail, letting people out pretrial and what to set bail at. The thinking in the past is that those decisions are made in arbitrary ways. There may be other factors like race, even how the judge is feeling that day, factoring into the decision to judges are making. The thinking is by feeding past person the about the bail decision is being made on and people like that person can help judges make better decisions about what to set bail at. Other way some of these tools are being used in the Justice System is people are trying to figure out how the Supreme Court is going to decide at any particular time. There is a Cottage Industry in d. C. They are getting pretty good at predicting how the court will come down. Host a lot of data on Justice Anthony kennedy, i can tell. Tell is calling from baltic, ohio, on our republican line is calling from baltic, ohio, on our republican line. Caller you look at how facebook is set up and how hightech it is. They can tell what 15yearolds are having phones. In parents or democrats and you take you have parents who are democrats and you put republican information on his phone, you change his mindset from being a democrat like his parents. All of a sudden, you have kids fighting against their parents. Change in ancan area because of how the kids are formed mentally. Does this fall under your ai thinking . Guest it gets to an interest in question. One thing that comes up in this conversation is transparency. The people making the tools making decisions on bail or whether you qualify for a federal program, experts say there should be some insight into how they are making those decisions. It is a similar conversation rick comes to facebook. People should have a better understanding of what is appearing on their newsfeed. Right now, that is to some extent a black box. Host there are also ethical issues involved in i want to read more excerpt from your piece that talks about that. Host talk about the ethical issues this presents. Guest people talk about what we are building with these tools is a digital firing squad. You dont know what is going into the decision being rendered about your life. That is one ethical consideration. If these rhythms are including builtin bias, that can be scaled up by a factor of thousands or millions. That is concerning. Thinking is lets spark more substantive conversations about the system. Host eric is calling from baltimore on our democratic line. Good morning. Caller good morning. I was calling to talk about ai. I think Machine Learning is mostly about processing large datasets. Processing isthis with ideas online and forums and things like that very possibly looking at the knot of money people get from some political pacs and other agencies and corporations. I am wondering if you are seeing the voting records of politicians like orrin hatch perhaps are influenced by those things. Thethey with or against people in their own district . And are they influenced by big money . Guest one of the things these tools are particularly good at is correlating things according to time. You could look at a theoretical senator who took a contribution and made a decision on legislation that was surprising in the weeks or months that followed. I dont know if it is entirely possible. I dont know if companies are working on that question. On the government side, these tools are used to look at government contracts and how those are playing out in terms of looking for examples of fraud and abuse. They did that after the recovery act a bunch of years ago. It could be used on the flipside looking for fraud and abuse on the other side as well. Host can this kind of automation be used in other fields like journalism . Is there a place like that . Guest there are some publications using these tools to produce simple stories about olympic results or sports scores. You can write a story using these tools. Some of the more exciting applications are publications using these tools. The a. P. Has the idea of using these tools looking for evidence of deforestation. It sends an alert to an environmental reporter at the publication saying there may be a story here to follow up on. Host randy is on our independent line from new port richey, florida. You are on with nancy scola. Caller good morning, america. My question is the accountability aspect of technology. Here where a problem florida did not get the and wereon in miami wondering what happens if technology slips up and does not give information out or any kind of scandal or anything that happens, who is accountable . Guest absolutely. A big part of this conversation is accountability. That has been the purview of computer scientists and scifi writers. The thinking would be if we shift this to something the whatc thinks about more, does transparency look like in the application of this tool . That might be a great conversation for the public to have early on before we are confronted with a crisis. Host how can this help the public become better informed . Not just transparency about how the process works, but can this aid the public getting information . Company,mentioned the quorum, people use that to know when legislation pops up around the world on whatever issue they are interested in. That is great if you are a lobbyist. It could have application for advocacy groups being able to track things they care about. Host will is calling on the republican line from florida. Caller good morning. Know there is a lot of waste, fraud, and abuse in the federal government. But there is also a lot of duplication of rules and regulations between different agencies. I am wondering if the ai could , even if they took it department by department and analyzed all the various rules and regulations, within a department simplify it and compare it department to department and do it that way. Guest i think that is a fascinating application. One of the great things these tools are particularly good at is understanding when one regulation talks about dairy farming and another talks about capital, that they are archly talking about the same subject. That is what Machine Learning is good at. I have not seen it yet, but that is an application we could see. Host how far has this gotten . How much is being used in washington now . What is the potential for growth beyond that . Guest one of the interesting things about reporting this piece is i went into it thinking it is only happening at the edges. It is a lot more examples than i thought it was. We are still in early days. Host what areas are we seeing it most . Is it particularly in analyzing legislation, looking at the records of lawmakers . Where are we really seeing this play out in its early days . Adoption ilobbyist dont think is widespread. Lobbyists certainly know that these tools exist. It is interesting to me when we talk about federal agencies that deal with so much information and so many complex topics. I think that is where we will see the application. Host mara is calling on the republican line from lakes park, georgia. Caller who feeds the information to the automatic receivers . Guest a lot of the information is already public data, for example, what legislation is moving through congress. They by thirdparty sources of data. They do not talk about that in much detail with reporters. Part of what they are constantly doing is looking for new sources of information. When i went to visit some of these companies, they had a boiler room of programmers trying to figure out where to get new information and feed it into the system. Host is there any potential for altering this information . How are these companies funded . Is there some concern an organization can be formed to feed data in a particular way to slant views in favor or against something . Guest at this point, there is a huge amount of trust in placed in these companies. There might need to be more of a public check on how they are making decisions about data and how secure it is. The two companies we profile in particular, fiscalnote is funded primarily from technology industries. About 28 million, a good amount of money. Part of her interest is in government part of their interest is in government. Host wilbur is on our independent line from brockton, massachusetts. Good morning. Caller good morning. Host can you mute your tv and just listen to your phone . You are on with nancy scola now. Caller good morning. I think [indiscernible] is a result of social disturbances. I think this is a result of the turning point of the shutdown of the [indiscernible] host we are talking about Artificial Intelligence and how it is being used in washington. Do you have a question for nancy scola about that . I think the most important things is to question the challenge of the individual. There is a kind of learning process for society. Host i think wilbur is talking about a different topic we were on earlier. Nancy scola, Senior Technology reporter for politico, you can find her piece on Artificial Intelligence and its impact on washington at politico. Com. You can find her on twitter nancyscola. Thank you for joining us. We will wrap up our morning talking about transgender troops recommendations for the white house by general mattis. Matt thorn will be here from outservesldn and walk us through what that means. We will be right back. Cancer. Uke the i can only see it from her perspective. I have had a lot of people rate for me similarly. As a christian, i believe christianity has a long tradition of divine healing so i do not think it is not possible for god to heal people. Sunday night, the Duke Divinity School professor and gospel scholar discusses her memoir, everything happens for a reason and other lies i have oned, in which she reflects being diagnosed with stage four cancer at the age of 35. It is really gone . There is no pain in your stomach . That is real. You can see how quickly he moved from praying for her as the anointed vessel of god and then his confidence in himself as that vehicle. There is the belief because she does not have pain in that moment that she is healed. His dramatic approach to faith healing is one that i often found to be somewhat manipulative. Sunday night at 8 00 eastern on cspans q a. Monday, we will look at the Supreme Court case that solidified the federal governments ability to take actions not explicitly mentioned in the constitution and restricted state action. We explore this case and the with lawts ruling professors. Cases liveark monday at 8 00 eastern on cspan, cspan. Org, or listen with the free cspan radio app. For background on each case, order the companion book. Resource,itional there is a link on our website to the National Constitution centers interactive constitution. Cspan, where history unfolds daily. 1970 nine, cspan was created as a Public Service by Cable Television companies. We continue to bring you unfiltered coverage of congress, the white house, the Supreme Court, and Public Policy events in washington and around the country. Cspan is brought to you by your cable or satellite provider. Washington journal continues. Host joining us now is matt thorn. He is president and c. E. O. Of outsource sldn [video clip] he is president and c. E. O. Of outservesldn. He is here to talk about policy on transgender troops. Explain to our viewers what outservesldn is. Guest it was two separate organizations. Sldn was started in 1993 in response to congress putting in dont ask, dont tell. We advocated and provided Legal Services for gays and lesbians eating discharged under that policy and advocating for repeal. 2004,ve was started in comprised of those actively guise and they were working within d. O. D. To work towards repealing dont ask, dont tell. The organizations merged in 2012 and we became outservesldn. We still provide Legal Services and advocacy today. Host are your clients only transgender troops . Guest we serve all lgbt Service Members and their families. Host getting to the news of the day, there was a new recommendation made by the pentagon to the white house about transgender troops serving. The policy was implemented by the Obama Administration to allow transgender people to openly serve. It was rescinded last year by President Trump in a tweet. The pentagon has been responding. What do we know about the recommendations from the pentagon . Publiclyat has been reported is secretary mattis has made the recommendation he will continue to move forward with the retention policy put in place in october of 2016. Trans Service Members currently and actively serving will continue to be allowed to do so. That has also not changed. When President Trump put in his guidance in august of last year, he asked the secretary to look at this issue. Advocated with other organizations with lawsuits in federal court that put injunctions in place so those Service Members have been serving. Our understanding is the secretary has made the recommendation he wants to continue with that policy. Host that recommendation was made in private according to the hill. The contents will remain private. Why keep Something Like that private . Why not disclose it publicly . In secretaryt mattis head. I dont know what those private conversations had. Your guess would be as good as private. Hy to keep it is a breakw if it with each other. Lastdent trump tweeted year he wanted to ban all trans people from serving in the military. The evidence does not line up with doing that. I cannot speak to why the secretary would keep it so low key. Expectederal mattis is to back allowing transgender troops to stay in the military. If the president will adopt mattis recommendations. He recommended the policy in place prior to june 2016 but left an opening for a change. What do you expect the white house to do . What impact do you think that will have on Service Members . Guest i would hope the white house would follow secretary mattis recommendation. 13 monthsn the last this administration has been in washington, it has been unpredictable. I dont know and cannot speak to how they would react. Pe they would follow the president has repeatedly talked about relying on his generals. If this is a recommendation of the pentagon, i hope you would follow through on that. How they react in the next couple of weeks as court cases work through their respective jurisdictions, your guess would be as good as mine at this point. The impact for transgender Service Members has been this cloud hovering. They are still working to try to do their jobs while this unknown is hanging out there. At this point, secretary mattis is trying to move forward and continue to operate the force needed to be ready and lethal. Host we are joined by matt ofrn, president and c. E. O. Outservesldn. He is talking about the recommendations issued by the pentagon to the white house yesterday. One line,s can call democrats, and independents. We also have a line for active and retired military to call. Mentioned legal challenges being mounted. Newsweek reported that your organization asked the federal court to permanently block President Trumps plan to prevent transgender troops from serving. The suit seeks a speedy resolution. That was last month. Tell us the current status of that legal challenge. Guest the trial phases are moving forward. We have received our trial date for late march, early april. We are still waiting for the judges decision on summary judgment. All of the other cases as well are moving to the trial phase. The Justice Department declined to appeal the injunctions further. December, they response to appealing those injunctions so those injunctions will stay in place as the court cases move through the circuit level. Host as of this point, how are those injunctions working . Are people able to enlist people able to enlist . Are those in the military able to continue to serve . What is the impact of the injunctions . Guest the injunctions hold the policy implemented in 2016 in place. That is good for all actively serving trans Service Members. That policy remains in place. The District Court mandated d. O. D. Had to move ahead with exceptions. We are at varying stages of that. Joining the military is a big decision for anybody. We have about 75 individuals who have expressed interest in joining the force. They are at varying stages of the process. D. O. D. Rolled out their admission policy in late december. So far, we have not had major issues. Host william is on our independent line from chicago. Good morning. Caller good morning. How are you doing . Guest good. How are you . Caller good, thank you. I have a couple of comments and questions. I will be very discreet. I served seven years in the navy. I have had the pleasure of serving with individuals who are transgender. They get the job done. Ofquestion is, because Donald Trumps push of trying to keep transgenders from joining what are the implications of this as far as midterm elections and elections in 2020 . I will hang up. Thank you. Guest that is a really good question. I think we have seen not just this issue but a number of issues that have become focal points for different elections. We have the most veterans running this cycle. The majority are in favor of trans Service Members serving in our armed forces. We even have lgbt veterans running. We have Gina Ortiz Jones in texas. Alexandra chandler in massachusetts is a trans woman running for congress in massachusetts. I think it will be a topic of conversation. I dont know if it would be like the top three issues people will be voting on or discussing, but i think it definitely has an impact on conversation for sure. Poll there is a recent that gauges public sentiment about this. I am sorry, the troops sentiment about this. More than half of active duty troops approve of President Trumps plan to reverse the obama era policy of allowing transgender individuals to serve. Nearly 53 say they supported trumps comments in july, stating the military should not allow transgender and vigils to serve in any capacity. Majority, just over 50 . Of theut the views troops, active and retired Service Members, on this issue . Snapshot is an audit d snapshotn od because we have not had that discussion. There has not been a lot of information inside the force. They are disclosing that in a poll, that is different. In terms of performance and doing the job the military needs to do, there have been no complaints. Since the policy was put in place, there are no public complaints we have been made aware of through our contacts at d. O. D. If anything, we have Service Members talking about the commanders being supported, their units being supportive of them. At the same time, the military is a microcosm of our country. We have more conservative leaning individuals in our country, and we have the same in the military. It is not wrong to have a healthy conversation and dialogue. When we were putting this policy in place, they spent over a year looking at it and having conversation with the joint chiefs and necessary military personnel to have their input the for the policy was put in place. Host becky is on our republican line from massachusetts. Caller i just want to say thank you for cspan. You give of violence to a lot of points of view and try to maintain that, as opposed to different organizations being onesided or on the other side. I do support the president. I may have misinformation. That is why i am calling in. From what i understood a while say mayd that is why i be misinformation, that people who were going in as transgender and i appreciate anyone that defends our country in the military any sort. I have heard many of them are going in, in order to get their surgery or medication and things like that through the military. Who wantsin as a male to become a female and then have surgery through the military. I would like to know your comments on that. Thank you. Guest thanks, becky. There is no evidentiary support that there is a higher increase of trans individuals who want to join or are in the military gainntly purposely to access to health care or surgery. Since the policy was put in place, there have only been two individuals who have pursued surgery. That is not a very accurate portrayal that tends to be put out there. There is no evidentiary support for that. Host one of the reasons the president proposed the ban, he cited the burden of the health care costs. Releasedcorporation data from its study on transgender military personnel. It found about 1300 total transgender active duty Service Members among the 1. 3 million active duty, less than 1 of the force. If allowed, only a small number would seek gender transitionrelated treatments. Health care costs would increase between 2. 4 million and 8. 4 million, 1 of the total d. O. D. Health care expenditures. Talk about that in terms of the impact. There is still a lot we do not know about transgender. Guest as we continue to move forward, more data will be available to us. I believe last year, we were not even hitting those numbers that rand has highlighted. 10 of the overall d. O. D. Budget. We provide health care for our actively serving military personnel. We spend 10 times that on the reptile dysfunction medication ectile reptile er dysfunction medication for those who need it because of injuries. My point is this is fundamental care required of Service Members. This is what we need to provide for transgender Service Members. As rand pointed out, this is a range. We dont know what all the health care aspects will be. We are joined by matt thorn, president and c. E. O. Of outservesldn. He is talking about the transgender troops policy and recommendations from the pentagon to the white house this week. Eob on the independent lin from maryland. Good morning. Caller good morning. Why would we want to allow sexual deviance into our military to lower our standards even more . What do they want to do to the enemy, give them all host where going to go to frank calling in from we are going to go to frank calling in from louisiana. Caller that is the problem these people are not in the military and they are complaining about it. I am not getting it. Host do you have a question for matt thorn . Caller yes, doesnt it cost more for viagra than a sex change lifetime . Guest the short answer is yes. The military spends roughly 60 million on viagra. I do want to leave that out lay that out for all the viewers today. Viagra Prescription Medication is a lot of times for servicemembers who need it. This is not an to this is not an extracurricular thing. This is for Service Members who need this medication to help in their personal lives, etc. It is not a frivolous expenditure by d. O. D. And is fundamental care care our Service Members require and need. D. O. D. Is fulfilling that role it has to play. Host is secretary mattis relation contrary to what the president called for, wanting to ban transgender troops from the military . Is there anything secretary mattis can do . Is he required by law to follow the president s direction . Guest the Court Injunctions will stay in place, so it is kind of a stalemate for the president i guess. If the president continues to push this, yes. If we did not have the injunctions in place, secretary mattis would be required to follow the president s order. That is the way the chain of command goes. Right now, the Court Injunctions, no matter what the president says unless he says we are going back threetweet the injunctions will hold the current policy. Host richard is on the line from virginia. People have trouble accepting transgender people. This is the time to learn to do it. Thank you. Host one of the questions on , our sex change operations performed in military hospitals . Where are they performed . Guest currently, they are not. Individuals who have pursued that have gone to outside medical facilities for that. They get a waiver from the Defense Health agency. However, the military has been looking at doing that type of itk themselves. They feel surgical skills for their physicians to have. They had been looking at that. Are a processs just like implementing this was a process. I think at some point, they will probably move in that direction. I think they are analyzing that. Right now for the individuals that have pursued it, it has been outside medical facilities. Host you talked about your organization challenging the policy in court. Do you do lobbying or other efforts in effort to affect policy . Guest we work closely with our allies in congress. We also have our Network Inside the pentagon that we work with to talk through and push for what we believe is the best policy for them to have, although that has changed a little bit. Given this administration, we dont have as many allies as we used to. We have worked on capitol hill with senator gillibrand in particular and representative jacky spear, who both introduced to block the ban and codify protections for trans Service Members. Host overall, what has been the kind the mesh reaction of congress overall, what has been the reaction of congress . Mccain, jonir john ernst, even orrin hatch who we ,ave worked with in the past Richard Shelby from alabama. It is a bipartisan issue. I think the problem with the tweets and where it is coming from is it undermines the force readiness. It was three tweets and nothing after that. We dont tweet federal policy in this country. Even the guidance that came not a few weeks later was not specific. From Congress Point of view, they are looking at what secretary mattis needs and how we can keep our force the most ready and available to do what it needs to do. This was just injecting chaos into the system. Is calling on our republican line from fairfax, california. Caller good morning. I hope this is an ok question. With things like Caitlyn Jenner and what we see in the media, it all seems so out there. I wonder if your guest can shine toe light on what it is like be a person like this and how hard that must be. Every individual is different. Whether you are trans, gay, lesbian, bisexual, is a personal process. Yes, it can be very difficult depending on the circumstances. We have stories that range from individuals who have not been able to come to terms with it themselves and those have turned out tragically. And those who have been fully embraced by those around them. I think it is a very personal process. For Caitlyn Jenner, that was very public. Individuals, they do not necessarily have that spotlight. But it is very personal. How one comes out i am trans, gay, bi, lesbian. It has gotten easier over the last 10 years. It is amazing to me to see so many kids who have such wonderful, supportive parents and School Systems that are creating an environment that is inclusive. That is important to feel that support system. It is a personal journey for every person. Host chris is calling on our democratic line from san diego. Good morning. Caller good morning. I want to say thank you for your standing for equality. I appreciate that. The cloud ofallow prejudice to blur your path. Do you think acceptance will prevail . I hope so. I seriously do. Thank you. Guest i think she said, acceptance will prevail . I think we have seen such a revolution in this country of that acceptance. We repealed dont ask, dont tell. We have marriage equality. We hear stories from trans Service Members whose commanders are so supportive of them and whose units have their backs. We had one trans servicemember last year when the tweets came out, their commander came up to them and said i got your back, we will not let you go anywhere. I think that is a reflection of how far we have traveled as a country toward inclusion and diversity. Host of what we know from ,eneral mattis recommendations those currently serving are expected to be able to continue to. Do we know what it will mean for recruitment while the Court Challenges are pending . Guest that is a good question. That is something they have been more cagey on. If ink secretary mattis i would feeloes, more leeway i can keep the Service Members i have. It is unknown to us what he actually recommended. If the president was trying to move to block individuals from joining our armed forces, those injunctions would keep those in place for now. If i was secretary mattis, i would say we are going to comply with what the courts have dictated. But they have been more cagey on that question than retention. Host robert is on our republican line from little rock, arkansas. Caller good morning. Host you are on with matt thorn. Go ahead. Caller hello, matt. I dont want to make it too long. Change . Rl have a sex i will look that up on the internet. Problem or having a what is the difference between you maybe you are not lgbt you did not mention it a minute ago. A gay guy and a guy that wants to look like a girl, what is the difference . Guest yes. For me, i am a gay man. Is aboutndividual gender identity. I am attracted to men. Gender identity is how you feel you are. Trans, the short answer is there is a difference. Host what should we expect next . Do we expect the courts to act . What should we expect in the months and years ahead . Guidancesed on the issued last year, the president gave himself until march 28 to release what his policy is going to be. That is when they are publicly going to say what they are going to do. The courts are moving forward and we are in the middle of discovery for a few of them. That process will continue. If the Justice Department continues to appeal, it could potentially reach the Supreme Court. Reach theink it will Supreme Court any sooner than the fall term of 2019, maybe the spring term. Host matt thorne, president and ceo of sldn. You can find matt on twitter at matt thorn. On the washington journal tomorrow, will be joined by the author who wrote the face of President Trump. We will also be joined by a student at Marjory Stoneman douglas high school. Yout now, cspan is taking to coverage of the National Governors association. State governors are meeting here in washington to see this weekend for their annual winter meeting. Throughout the day, the association will host panels to talk about jobs, the opioid crisis, as well as to talk about the future of agriculture. Coverage starts here on cspan. [background noise]