What has it done to your thinking of history . Fan ofd i might be a john because he was a good old yankee. But i am not sure that being a northerner has affected me consciously, i do not like to think that i am letting the present influence my conception of the past. So i am not sure. But i am a new englander for sure. Brian can you remember when you first heard about john adams . Mr. Wood probably not until high school. I did not know much about him, not until college. Home not gotten to see his until after college. So it was a long time before i got to know him. Now, because they did three volumes on his writings, i got to know him. I know him better than i know most of my friends. He is really something. Brian you said in your book that he had a tyree and Thomas Jefferson did not. Why do think one did and the other didnt . Adams was a puritan in that sense. Tradition, of that they kept diaries. He needed to write out his emotions and feelings. He put everything in that diary. He said things about himself mostmost people would say, people would not say. He expressed himself and even talked about his vanity. Jefferson was reserved and would never write what adams did, even in his letters. He had a very different temperament. They could not differ more in temperament. Brian what other differences . Mr. Wood physically they were different. But most importantly, jefferson was a wealthy slaveholder. He was a leader of the slaveholding society. He inherited land and money from his father and fatherinlaw. Wealthy, heme very became a political leader. It was a consequence of his social status. Adams came out of a middling background and he did not inherit much from his father. He was not wealthy. He never became one of the richest men of massachusetts and he resented that. He suffered a little bit of contempt from some of the wealthy massachusetts men for that reason. If you are in the same you were in the same room with the two of them, what would you notice . Mr. Wood adams would be talking and was sarcastic. Jefferson was reserved and kept his arms folded in front of him when he talked. Ands said what he thought offended a lot of people. Jefferson was the opposite, obsessed by politeness and civility. He lectured his sons inlaws on that issue. He thought politeness was crucial and part of being enlightened. Civility was very important to jefferson. Adams you about this but just could not help it. He said he did not have the gift of silence. Brian what kind of an environment did they grow up and . Mr. Wood jefferson grew up in a slaveholding society. He became one of the wealthiest planters in the colony. With grew up in braintree very little connections. s mother was a randolph, one of the most prestigious families in virginia. Silvera silverstone sppooon. Adams did not. Relativelyts was a egalitarian state compared to virginia. There were a few slaves in massachusetts, but nothing comparable to the 40 of virginia that was enslaved. So the world they grew up in were different. They were both smart, bright students. Jefferson probably knew more about more things than any single man in north america. I include franklin in that, who would be his only rival. Everyone was impressed by jefferson, the extent of his knowledge. But he did not have the span. But he had some depth in history and law that jefferson did not have. Not because jefferson didnt couldnt, but because he was not as interested in the law. Although jefferson became a lawyer, he did not think of it as a career. He came to hate the law and hate lawyers. Adams loved the law, the mystery of the common law and he was a superb counsel. He was one of the best lawyers and certainly the busiest lawyer in massachusetts. Books upfront, how many have you written . Books you have published, and you got a lot of awards and medals, which of all of these books has been the biggest success . I dont know how you measure it, by sales . My Favorite Book is my first, the creation of the american republic, because it was my dissertation. But it is certainly not the best seller. Brian what led to your interest in that at the time and where did you do your dissertation . Mr. Wood i went to howard graduate school. Interest when i first went to graduate school. This was in the late 1950s. I worked with eight stevenson supporter who quickly shifted to kennedy. Andok a seminar with him some of the i said, this early american stuff is really interesting. I have never regretted that decision. Brian he is still alive . Mr. Wood he is. He is 95. We celebrated his jubilee last april. This is the 50th anniversary of his book. We had a meeting, celebrating the book. A number of us who knew him. He came and talked. Think, are going to published. He is fine. He is 95. It is nice to know that you can still be doing stuff at 95. Brian it makes you feel young. Mr. Wood right. Brian when did you start learning on this book and why . Prevolumesdid the of writing on john adams. He got three volumes. Gotklin got one, jefferson, one hamilton got one. Adams got more pages than anyone else. Coming out of that experience, i thought i would write a book on adams. He was fascinating to me. But my publisher suggested, why dont you do a comparison with jefferson . That intrigues me. I am glad he suggested that. I think i learned more about each of them by hitting them them againstting each other. So i originally was working on adams, but my publisher suggested comparing them, and it was marvelous. I Read Everything they wrote here and it is all available now. It is marvelous. I dedicate the book to the editors of the adams and jefferson papers because they have done all of this work presenting the material to us historians. They do not usually get the credit they deserve. At any rate, that is how it arose. Brian how do they differ in age . Adams was eight years older. When jefferson joined the congress, he saw adams as having already then there. I think jefferson saw him as his senior. Adams certainly sought jefferson as his protege. He took him under his wing. Eight years can be a big difference when you are young. Jefferson played that role, in other words listened to adams opinion and probably said the right thing. Jefferson was very aware of people. I think that is where the friendship started. He deferred to adams. Brian in your first chapter, you write, jefferson told the American People what they wanted to hear. How exceptional they were. Adams told them what they needed to know, truth about themselves that were difficult to bear. Over the centuries, americans have tended to avoid adams is words and prefer to hear jeffersons praise. Mr. Wood right. Adams was a realist. He did not believe every man was created equal. He did not believe in american centralism. We americans are no better or different from other nations, just as corrupt, just as vicious. These are things he is saying. That is not the american myth, the american dream. He took on every single dream or myth that americans live by. We could not live by adamss message, it would be too much to bear. Jefferson said what we needed to hear in some respects, because you cannot have a nation based on the notion that we are all unequal from birth. Adams did not, know about genetics or dna, but he believed that people are unequal from birth. Nature, not nurture. Jefferson is the opposite. He was into nurture. That is what i think most americans believe. Bornher words, we are all equal and are differences are due to different experiences and environments, and that is why education is so important to americans and to jefferson. Adams did not disparage education, but he said it will not make much difference. Jefferson, i went to a founding hospital in paris and i saw babies four days old, and already they were unequal. Some were smart, some were dumb, some were beautiful, some were ugly. Those differences were right there. That is not an american message. That is why we honor jefferson in the way we do. We tend to honor the two men very differently. Jefferson has a beautiful memorial on the title basin in washington right at the mall. There is nothing for adams. Site,ello is a heritage visited by hundreds of thousands across the world. I do not know how many people go to quincy, massachusetts. Adams home, a modest house. It is hard to get to. It gets a fraction of the visitors. . Why . He is not in the same league. Point, whent one they reconcile, the friendship broke up but they came back together in 1812 and exchanged 158 letters. Three to every one of jeffersons. Adams says to jefferson, how many letters do you get in a year how many do you receive . Jefferson said he gets 2000 something. Gets 200. He only jefferson felt obligated to answer them. Was corresponding with the czar of russia and with great people. Adams was not in that league at all. So adams said, i will write more than you, because i know you are busy answering other people. He had to answer over 2000 letters. So they are in a Different League then and they still are hearing there is no way adams could compete with jefferson. Jefferson stands for america. Unfortunately, he was a slaveholder and that has treated him badly in these days. Brian when did jefferson meet adams and what was he doing . Mr. Wood they were in the continental congress. Adams was in the first continental congress. Jefferson did not make that one. He had sent a long instructions that were printed as a pamphlet. Some review of the contest between britain and the colonies, which established his name in 1774. It was a radical pamphlet. King in histhe pamphlet. The declaration, because it goes through a series of things that the king and government were doing. That establishes his name, but he did not make the congress because he became ill. The Second Continental Congress already adams is serving on 20 committees, including the committee on war. So when the declaration of Independence Committee is formed and they are both on it, adams is happy to have this young guy take on the drafting of the declaration, because he is busy things, so little importantealize how that declaration would become. Later, of course im a adams becomes later, of course, adams becomes jealous of the same jefferson is getting. Jefferson was that minister to france and adams was the minister to london i think adams had a profound effect on the constitution, on the kind of government. He had written the massachusetts settitution in 1780 and forth a structure that gets copied by the federal government. A strong executive with a veto power. What adams wanted wasnt absolute veto over all legislation, but he had to bend to his colleagues and he gave a limited veto. That is the reason all of our governors have limited vetoes, including be president , it is because of adams. Those had vetof patter veto power. So he had an influence on the federal constitution. They are away and so they do not know about it until later. Adams loves it and it fits his own description of what a government should be. Jefferson is appalled by it. The power of the president is too great, he sees the president ,s a version of a polish king elected for life, serves for life, and then dies. Then the aristocrats would select a new king. That is he thought the president would be. Washington served only two terms, he could not wait to get back to mount vernon, otherwise he might have stayed in office until he died. He was not someone who loved power. He leaves after his second term but could have stayed on if he had wanted to. Jefferson thought the presidency would you both. Like a polish king, set for life. There are threads through your book, britain versus france, aristocracy versus commoners. Explain what an aristocrat is. Mr. Wood they talk about this in their correspondence in their retirement years. What is an aristocrat . Adams was assessed by oligarchy. Believed there would inevitably be oligarchs who attempt to run things. Aristocracy more than he feared a single roller. He was willing to give much more power to a president or governor then jefferson. Adams said jefferson fears the one and adams fears the few. He was obsessed by aristocracy, even though he is one of them. Notionion, jeffersons of aristocrat is talented and virtuous, like himself. He assumed that people, once educated, they will elect people like themselves. Jefferson was confident of the populace. People wouldar become demagogues. Adams was more fearful of democracy. He thought they would soon become corrupt and partisan and we would have to adopt lifetime ,enure for the president eventually making them her at a terry, following the english model. The question is, have we reached that point in our elections . He would certainly believe, i told you so. This is what happens when you have to much democracy. Jefferson had none of those fears. Brian you wrote although adams he neveron doubted that need society had for christianity. Mr. Wood jefferson had contempt for organized religion. He made a couple of mistakes publicly, one in his notes on virginia. , my neighbor had my neighbor believes 20 gods and it does not break my arm. That came back to haunt him. Most americans did not believe that. It got him into trouble. He was accused of being an atheist in 1800. He mocked christianity and thought the trinity was a joke. He would say in private to his friends, he did not really care much about organized religion at all i did not think it was important to people. Adams was the contrary. Although they were both unitarian, that is they did not believe in the divinity of jesus, adams had tremendous respect for religion. He thinks it is useful and necessary. He never mocked it or made fun of it. He was very different in that respect from jefferson. Brian why was so adams attached to britain and jefferson attached to france and the french revolution . Jefferson sees the french revolution as being influenced by hours. He sees a worldwide revolutionary wave beginning with us that will spread eventually and revolutionize of the world. World. Lutionize the is caught up in the french revolution. At one point, his successor as minister in france writes to him yourays, mr. Jefferson, friends are being guillotined by the thousands. Jefferson writes back, so be it, adams and beer left alive, at the end, it would be worth it. Iss makes it jefferson it very doubtful whether he would have behaved that way. Feeling he hade about this revolution. It was worth many deaths. Radical. A complete his ideas if he had written them out were no different than Thomas Paynes age of reason. He was a radical thinker but still an elected official. Adams is committed to the english constitution from the beginning. Finest in the world. He wants the republican government to be a republican model of the english constitution. He is completely taken with the english. Out,the revolution breaks england and france are in a titanic struggle over 10 years of war. Is with england and jefferson is with france. That is the source of their ultimate break. The two parties that emerged, the federalists are proenglish and the jeffersonian republicans are profrance. So the two men are caught as leaders of these two parties by the end of the 1790s. Sense that it make the conservative legal group in town called the Federalist Society is called that . Mr. Wood i think they think of it in terms of federalism, the separation between the state and federal government. Federalism. By thes the name chosen designers, the framers of the constitution. , becauserewd title they should have called themselves nationalists. That came out of the constitutional struggle of 1787. The Party Continues to call themselves federalists, even though they are pushing for a strong consolidated kind of national state. They get stuck with the name. I do not think the modern Federalist Society of attorneys is thinking in those terms. Theyre not trying to look at that, although it does not hurt them to have that identification, because they are conservative. Brian this is your writing. Adams also thought the Dynamic World of the early republic was going to hell in a handbasket. He hated all of the banks and the proliferating issues of paper money as much as jefferson. Mr. Wood right. Neither of these men understood banking. They did not know how the bank operated. Jefferson what said the bank has more money in paper than it has in gold and silver. That it is cheating. Obviously, no bank can make any money if it does not print more paper. They do not count on anyone everyone coming to the bank to get gold and silver, so they can issue more paper, promises to pay. That is always the problem. You get too far, as one bank in rhode island did in 1808, it had 6,000 in paper and it promises to pay with 86 of gold and silver. That was the first bankrupt bank in american history. Adams did not understand banking, neither did jefferson. Hamilton understood with the bank was, but he did not expect the polar proliferation of state banks. This is an important part of the making of the constitution. Madison is frightened of this paper money being issued by the states in the 1770s. One of the things he wants to is this negative that he wants to give the congress over having a veto all over legislation will be too impractical. It gets boiled down to article one section 10 of the constitution which prohibit states from doing certain things. They cant pass tax or print paper money. If that had been enforced strictly, it would have stifled the economy. The banks print the paper money, pretty soon you have hundreds of banks by the early decades of the 19th century issuing paper money. This is what jefferson and adams are appalled by. Most people work. All of these founders who lived into the 19th century are appalled by what they brought. Disappointed by the left by the revolution, they are scared. It is too wild, certainly, adams and jefferson both have second thoughts. Not that they want to reverse her, they just say this is not the well we wanted. Andn you taught at Brown University of rhode island for how long . Years. I havent taught for eight or 10 years now. Didhen you did this book, you learn anything new about Thomas Jefferson or john adams . I did, things got sharper. Seven and against each other, particularly on the issue of equality. I hadnt realized how much adams was committed to the inequality of people and i grip got a greater appreciation of what was meant by all men created equal. I think most people have taken that about equal rights. That is not what they meant, they meant it literally. All men are created equal, born with a blank slate, locking in the notion of a blank slate that gets etched by experience. Dont are due to experience this through the environment, that is a very different view from being born on equal right from the outset where you are already etched so you cant do so much about you will be the adult that you are. Wantis adamss point, you to overcome your birth. That is not an american message, most people accept it and i accepted thericans jeffersonian dear which is embodied in the declaration, we are equal at birth. That is why we put so much education. The jeffersonian message is our message, it is an american message. It is good we believe that. Even if it is not entirely true. It would be unbearable to take the opposite view. I think that would be impossible. Write, this is about john adams, he had more doubts about the rationality and the virtue of the American People than jefferson had. Where did that come from in his life . Jefferson never lost an election in his life, he had confidence in the people who always elected him. He was elected to the house of burgesses and to the state legislature and then he was elected by the legislature to and totinental congress the administer abroad and then he is elected Vice President because he comes in second through adams, adams, in that his experiment only three electoral votes, adams was appalled by that, he had been Vice President of washington and said i should be acclaimed and let washington, every single like tour boat, he got it. Adams,t the same with he squeaked in by three votes. If it had gone the other way, jefferson would have been the president and he would have been the Vice President. He said he would never serve under jefferson. He is not happy about that, he feels he has been humiliated by the close election. Is beyondnd that belief for him. The federalist of new england are frightened of democracy because they see it, it is in operation, people are not being elected, you go to virginia and you have all these labeling aristocrats who are the leaders of the Republican Party which is the more democratic party. Is a paradox but these people have confidence in democracy is none of the problems that the leaders are having in massachusetts, massachusetts is a more egalitarian society, the aristocrats are more vulnerable to challenge, it is easy to enter the aristocracy of new england and so they are much more friend of democracy even though they are more democratic in fact. It is that paradox that can make be made sense of. We have a Hierarchical Society of virginia. They have more limousine liberals if he will end jefferson was a prime example of a limousine liberal. Someone who is so confident of his own status and his position in society that he can afford to be democratic. Jeffersoniane Republican Democratic party. Split, if i remember correctly, john adams did not ride with Thomas Jefferson to the inauguration and he left at 4 00 in the morning. The only president in our history who was defeated who did to attend thed inauguration. How long was it but between that time and the time they got back together. That is 1800, 1801 is the inauguration of jefferson. It is 1812 and that only occurred because of dr. Benjamin rush or billy two years, he knew both of the new ad was much better and he felt that the nation needed to hear these two men talk to each other, the posterity required their correspondence and theyll use that argument over and over and he played beautifully because he would report back, jefferson would say to adams, jefferson said he loves you and then he would go to jefferson and say theysays he loves you so were set up, it took them two years. Andlly, they break through then was the correspondence goes, adams is much more blunt and he says things. He is sarcastic, he is facetious. Jefferson keeps the correspondence going because it could have easily broken off and at one point in 1815, napoleon is defeated, these are back in the throes of friend. Adam says mr. Jefferson, what do you think of the french . Evolution now should that was really sticking a dagger. He doesnt come back. That is how adams was. Digging, way that guys do. Friends,re really good it is jefferson that puts up with that. Into thet come back good thing, that is not in his nature, he is a joker, he likes to make digs and procedures remarks, pushing a little too much and a more sensitive so might have said enough is enough, im not putting up with that. Brian what would happen if these two men had to be on television today . I think adams would talk to much as he wasnt able to be silent and jefferson would say the right things, he would not make any mistakes. Probably put his foot in his mouth. You say that where jefferson was sincere, and ernest, adams was ironic and facetious. Visa jefferson was will of allusions and unprepared to actually and emotionally for the rapidly changing world of the early republic. As a jefferson had always been the ultimate optimist, his expectations always outran reality. There is such a lot of stuff coming at you and you read that. One was a slave owner, the other was not. Who had the higher morals . Jefferson is such a complicated man. It is sad because at the end of virtually a becomes fiery southerner. Earlier in his career, he is a courageous man, he speaks out against slavery and his peers put up with it. Even know they dont agree with them, they are not going to move against slavery. He wants to, he speaks out. He is caught up with in mind notions. He proposes all kind of reforms and punishment, the abolition of a religious establishment. He is weighing the web wang the vanguard in his own state and because he is so smart and knows so much and is so polite , theyvil, his colleagues dont agree with him, they dont pass this legislation but they dont agree with him. Somehow or other they put up with it. How advanceddinary he is but by the end of his life, it is sad because slavery has become a nightmare for him and he hasnt done anything about it. He doesnt know what to do about it. Adams realizes that. In the end, what kind of money did jefferson and adams have . Adams was never really wealthy but he was always shrewd. They kept their expenses within their income. He did not die in debt, jefferson dies totally in debt. That he couldnt free slaves if you want to because his creditors would have owned this saves. But he wase children an aristocrat, he doesnt think way amoney the way the yankee like abigail or john with think about money. He borrows money from the dutch to buy books, he doesnt borrow money from International Buy your expenses and consumer goods, he is out of touch with reality in terms of his income. Didnt have double booking, he kept records but he didnt balances four counts so he had no awareness, his son comes to jefferson, you. Apt to his monticello. Jefferson goes white, he hisdnt believe that, personal effects, maintaining his counts, what a mess. Why did it take a story and so want to deal with this as an issue . It appears it was covered up forever. Didnt take into account, there was no evidence and jefferson indirectly denies it, they took him at his word, he at one point is accused of two things. He said he put a make on mrs. Walker, a married woman when he was young and he sired children with sally hemmings, his slave and he says no, he admits to the walk with him but he doesnt admit the other. People took that at their word but the hemmings kids had reported about what their mother the 1990s, it took a net gordons rebook and the dna findings, nothing is definitive but im gordon reed makes a very powerful case in france where the two siblings could exchange. Jamess orders or he could have walked out and be free. You can train and others like to be a chef and i will for you. Sally, thes that an same deal is made with his cocky bind, sally. Concubine, sally. She doesnt want to be free, she wants her Children Free when their adult. That is what the children say later. Plausible, ily dont think there is a love relationship, jefferson is a cold fish toward his kids, he doesnt recognize them, he enters the birth of these children, presumably his children along with new heifers and pigs that are born. Had comehese planners they occasionally recognize the offspring with gifts at christmas or something, he shows no affection, no awareness of them so it is a very strange relationship. Brian i want to as the about academia. The book said nothing has changed in the last 50 years but here, you write this, he was the immature and right behavior of the students and his new university and the university of doing it and of course there was this deep faith in the french revolution that had gone awry, he was the pure american innocent. He had little understanding of mans capacity for evil and had no tragic sense whatsoever, he possessed no sense that the circumstances and pentagon and limiting human action, little or no appreciation of the point is a people struggling with the world, he scarcely understood it. That is america, we were like that. Brian but you said jefferson believed in exceptionalism and the positive and all of that, adams keeps telling us the real stuff. Jefferson, it is amazing that he doesnt seem to learn from all of his things going wrong. Just keep hoping against hope. John adams was Muslim American and jefferson. People say we lost our innocence in 1898 and then we lost our innocence in vietnam. We are the only country that keeps losing its innocence. We are very jeffersonian i think. We dont have a tragic sense. We dont think about how circumstances impinging on us, we dont want to have a tragic sense because if it is too deep, you dont do anything, it is the sense of restraint. It is james polk, the president that says were the only country in the world. Think about that, your ownat about family . It seems they are all academics. I have one daughter who is married to a teacher at the academy and she is caught up in academia. I have another daughter that she is really terrific and i have a son who is for 22 years and he so now we haveat two professors. My son works in our history. I want to ask you about a footnote, go to the back of your book and advanced praise and it is that they quote in their cup meant in this book by joseph ellis. You dont often see this, there is a footnote on page 481, you take joseph ellis on. This is something called the mecklenburg declaration. He just made a mistake, i wanted to point that out, polly may have picked up he made a mistake which can easily happen. He made a mistake and that was passed on how often have you had that as a historian . In this particular case i think it is important to cause it reflects on adams and a serious way. He said that adams didnt mean , this has to do with the mecklenburg declaration which was a bony declaration. Adams is initially very excited about this. There are copying the mecklenburg declaration. This is his sound declaration, it was in north carolina. Explain what it was, what did they do . Gordon they did not do it, this was discovered in 1819 and because the original records had burned and so on, it is a phony document but passed on as something authentic. Adams is excited because it means jefferson is that the genius that everyone is saying he is. He is actually excited to write jefferson. Jefferson right back and point out that we did not hear about this at the time. He poses all kinds of queries about it and he things it is fake news. It is contrived after the fact. Adams accepts that. Ellis read a letter so adamsmisread doesnt agree with jefferson. I think he is wrong about that. It was your largest footnote. Gordon it had to be explained looked the mix adams back, it makes him look like you was dishonest. Those that he was saying something to jefferson but Something Else to some of the house. Brian we better not leave the mecklenburg expedition without inspired with active. Gordon it participated almost word for word, some of the words that were in jeffersons there. Tion that was jefferson must have seen this and copied it. This makes jefferson the authenticity of his document brought into question. Atms kind of like that first. At this point you see jefferson is getting all of this, saying the declaration is made, jefferson had no idea that he would become famous. So, he is seen as the author of the declaration of independence well adams could say the author . This is just a draft. Ofis upset, he is jealous the fame coming to this man, writes to his soninlaw, look, the desk on which i wrote the declaration, this could be a relic, i am going to give it to you. This onzes and he wants his tombstone, three things, the first, the author of the declaration of independence, he doesnt mention the presidency. This is the creator of the university of virginia and the author of the bill of the bill abolishing established religion in virginia. Those are three things you want on his tombstone. But then there is the operation of independence. In 1776 he had no awareness that this was going to make him famous. He never mentions his presidency as one of his greater compass mix. Here is what you wrote, during the last decade, jeffersons life came to have increasing doubts that the future would work out as he expected and his correspondence was persuaded with lament over the rising generation of which i once had sanguine hopes. Youre basically saying that he gordon iverything called have a chapter the great reversal because in their correspondence, adams developed code of confidence and he feels that better about himself and about the country and jefferson is going to other way. Adamss on, john quincy becomes president in 1824, jefferson congratulates adams but deep down, he thinks that is a mistake, he is frightened to death of what john quincy is proposing. Quincy is coming in with an internal improvement and that is infrastructure if you will, lets build the federal government, it will build bridges, canals, all the kinds slaveholders are fed to death because of the federal government can do that, they can encroach and get involved in fiery, hed he becomes is concerned about the federal government power to do something about the nature of the institution. You are right, this is adams, he said the difference thewas no different. It was just as simple, just as vicious and other countries, do you believe that russian mark . Were the only democracy, we were the only republicans when he says the last best hope, he is talking in the aftermath of the failure of the 1888 revolution. We were exceptional in the 19th century and now there are democracies everywhere, we have a to biggest power in the world and we are the biggest democracy in the world with 330 million people, there is nothing like it but we are not exceptional in our democracy any longer. France, European Union nations are democratic as well. I think that kind of exceptionalism is gone. We are exceptional in the sense that we are larger, bigger, more powerful. For onee only have time more, this is Thomas Jefferson and you write that he was dismayed that the American People were not learning to love one another but were increasingly engaged in partisan , secretary and and sectional strife. Quite jefferson was an 18thcentury radical which was very different from a moderate believed in minimal government, government interfered with the natural social feeling that people had he wanted to eliminate and minimize government to allow the senselow of the social that exists in every human being, that is the radical position of the late 18th andury, it takes pain godwin and jefferson alike and they are radicals. For someone who has not read the book and is listening to this, what would you say your perspective is the number one takeaway . Gordon the difference between these two men and how they work and body different aspects of america, of us, i think both of them are important as part of what we are as a people. How long do take you to do this . Been working at the stuff for 50 years but probably four years. Brian of all the award you received over the years, what is the one that meant the most to you . Prize but ther other one is equally prestigious, it is not as wellknown. I have not really sorted that out but it obviously makes a big difference for anybody who gets one. You mentioned in our daily who taught you at harvard, who is your favorite . Balin is the best historian in america and the 20th century, there is nobody that comes close to his kind of insight. Brian why . He understands what history is about. He taught that you dont bring the present into the past, you try to understand the past as a foreign country where they do things differently. Our guest has been gordon s wood. The book is called friends john adams and Thomas Jefferson. Thank you so much. For free transcripts or to give us your comments about this rogram, visit us at q a. Org they are available as cspan podcasts as well. If you enjoyed this weeks q a interview with gordon wood, here are some other programs you might like. David stewart talking about his book, madisons gift. Book bob talking about his humility. And author james trop talking about his book John Quincy Adams militant spirit. You can search our entire Video Library at two spent. Org. Cspan. Org cspans washington journal, live, every day with the news and policy issues that impact you. Coming up monday morning, the talk about the week ahead in washington with a bloomberg congressional reporter and adjutant and sarah westwood. Americastate of race in and its implications for minority education with Robert Woodson of the Woodson Center and shelby steele, the senior at the hoover institution, cspans washington journal, live, beginning at 7 00 a. M. Eastern on monday morning, when the discussion. Join the discussion. British by mr. Theresa may takes questions from members of the house commons and then a discussion on the tax reform bill. And at 11 00, another test to see q a with gordon wood, talking about his book on the relationship between john adams and Thomas Jefferson. During question time on wednesday, the british Prime Minister theresa may answered questions on homelessness, brazen negotiations and the state of the british
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